Loeb started in 2001, not 98. Solberg has 142 rally starts compared to Loebs 118. Loeb has 52 wins compared to Solbergs 13. That tells the story right there.
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Loeb started in 2001, not 98. Solberg has 142 rally starts compared to Loebs 118. Loeb has 52 wins compared to Solbergs 13. That tells the story right there.
;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazza2541
Finally someone who understands
Actually, Loeb started doing rally´s I think around 1995, while Solberg debuted in 1996. WRC wise, 2001 is wrong, Loeb started in 1999 as serial jeff said and his first World Rally Car experience came in 2000, followed by a works seat the next year, while he was already in the Citroën project for some time, which for years is basically a team build around him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazza2541
Solberg might have been competing at high level longer, but he started out when WRC was in a more competitive state. He was a good match for Loeb from 2002-05, but 2006 onwards needs no explanation if you know the facts.
Anyway, statistics don´t say everything. But had Subaru stayed competitive, the numbers surely would have been tweaked a bit different.
Loeb first started rallying in 1995, Solberg first started in 1991. Loeb entered S1600 in 98 and WRC in 01. Solberg entered WRC in 98, hence the difference in WRC starts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josti
Petter didn't start rallying before in 1996. In 1992 - 96 he did rallycross, bangerracing and hillclimbing.
Well, the experience is pretty equal I would say, and if you consider all the rallies where Petter have been forced to quit due to mechanical problems I think Seb has driven more mileage than Petter!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazza2541
Also, there's no doubt that Seb is very, very fast and without a doubt the most consistent driver WRC has seen, but I don't think that he is so invincible that you are claiming. If you go back a few years, everyone knows that Petter won in 2003, but as many might not remember, he was clearly the fastest driver also in 2004, with 95 SS victories, while Seb had 65 (Marcus had 69 BTW). The reason why Petter didn't win overall, was due to the unreliability of the Impreza, amongst many problems, it was the year of the watersplash problems, where the car stopped when crossing water several times. Then from 2005 on, the Impreza got even worse.
Marcus has always been on par with Seb (on gravel that is) also, but the years in the 307 took away his chance for another win. In 2006, when he swapped to Ford, he was just as fast as Seb (123 SS wins, Seb 86 - Seb was out the last rallies that year). His last season, he lead most of the year and should have won, just the error with the thickness of the rear side windows in Portugal where he got 5 min. penalty and a stupid spin in Irland took away his title.
Another factor is of course also the car, there's no doubt that Seb has had the best car from 2004 and up to now, especially invincible on tarmac - which have been the decisive factor on the years where there have been close fights for the title.
Don't misunderstand me, Seb will go into history as the most winning driver ever and one of the greatest, but in my opinion there is a combination of several factors that has made his success, not only driving skills.
Partly correct. He did very little bangerracing (bilcross) in this period, no more than a handful of races. Petter debuted in hillclimb with a Ford Escort RS2000 MK2 in april 1993. He did a couple of seasons hillclimb and rallycross in this car, and then he advanced to a Supernational Volvo 242 for 1995.With the Volvo he won the Norwegian Rallycross and Hillclimb championships both in 95 and 96. (A couple of years ago he actually bought his Volvo back from another driver, and he has now restored it to mint condition.)Quote:
Originally Posted by bennizw
Petters first proper rally was Rally Hedmarken september 1996. For this rally he borrowed a Toyota Celica GT4 (ST165) from his brother Henning, and famously he managed to roll heavily and damage the car extensively. Btw. well documented by an inboard camera in his car.
He and Henning formed a team for 1997 with identical Celica 4WDs (ST185), but lost out to Birger Gundersen (Ford Escort Cosworth) in the championship. In 1998 Petter and Henning "upgraded" to the Celica GT4 (ST205), and Petter won the championship. This is actually his first and only Norwegian Rally Championship title to date. The rest of the story is well known, as he joined Ford M-Sport as their 3rd driver in Sweden 1999.
Yeah, but 2003 Märtin was clearly the fastest driver but struggled with the reliability of new Focus. In my opinion Petter scored certainly a lucky championship title to himself. Also Seb was very-very close to him on points, only backed off by Citroen team at the Wales GB rally to secure manu title. I know that norwegians are very proud and nice people, but i have been argueing about sports with many norwegian before and honestly - you guys never admit that some non-norwegians could be better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Halvis
But just by looking purely statistics, then Seb is in a class of his own. Most of all, he came to WRC as a tarmac specialist who got into grips with gravel in very short time. Petter has never managed to do that (never been good on tarmac, his only win came with the help of conditions and tyre strategy). Yes, Seb has been driving for only one very successful team and been there clear no. 1 driver with all the benefits. But nobody has dominated this sport like he has. Petter is just a good driver like Hirvonen, Märtin, Burns (too many to mention), but that's it.
Mr Loeb was gravel rally champion in France.....Quote:
Originally Posted by cali
But not very good in gravel compared to the old guys in WRCQuote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T