Rally Sweden 2013

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Originally Posted by tommeke_B

I was on that particular place from those photos. The fastest in that corner was Hirvonen, but he was too wide and was in the snowbank with the back, then the front went to the snowbank, and he lost a little bit of time there. And Latvala was defenetely faster than Ogier... But after that corner they had to brake for a hairpin immediately. In the exit of the hairpin JML was too much inside the hairpin and lost a lot of traction because he was too much in the snow. In that place it was not needed to push it to the maximum in the fast right corner, because they had to brake immediately after it for the hairpin (Ogier, Loeb and Ostberg took it easy). Rallying is not just about pushing it to the limit everywhere, it's also about being smart and seeing where you can gain a bit of time without risking too much and where to lift because you can not win anything. That's probably the main difference between Loeb, Ogier, Ostberg (I think he is driving smart too), and Latvala and Hirvonen, to give an example. :)

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definetely you can t have conclusions in one corner without knowing the sequence before and after the corner.

On this corner you see totally different approach between Ogier & Latvala, on other corners I've seen them exactly the same approach. Latvala spent this Rally trying to find his best setup, last day he really used Ogier's settings 1-1 and felt like he has to change his driving style to achieve better results with the Polo.

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Originally Posted by stefanvv

On this corner you see totally different approach between Ogier & Latvala, on other corners I've seen them exactly the same approach. Latvala spent this Rally trying to find his best setup, last day he really used Ogier's settings 1-1 and felt like he has to change his driving style to achieve better results with the Polo.

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Its interesting because I always thought Latvala was a similar diver to Ogier but it would seem not if Latvala has to change his style, I would be interested to know who sets the car up more for the corner (Latvala?), and who drivers around it more (Ogier?) im guessing

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Originally Posted by dimviii

definetely you can t have conclusions in one corner without knowing the sequence before and after the corner.

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Yes, Dimitrios, you and Tom understand what I meant above, even though the comment itself (being 1st or 4th) was kind of relevant for the rally, you never can tell out of a picture who´s fastest at that point...

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Originally Posted by Rallyper

Yes, Dimitrios, you and Tom understand what I meant above, even though the comment itself (being 1st or 4th) was kind of relevant for the rally, you never can tell out of a picture who´s fastest at that point...

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You're right, though the picture sums up what we saw in the streaming and the highlights during the whole weekend. Times don't lie.

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Originally Posted by COD

I just whish the rules would make the cars such that Latvala style would be faster. Not because I'd like him to win, but because it would make rallying so much more fun and exiting to watch again

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Although Tom already explained situation on the photo I would continue the discussion. Current S2000 based WRC cars are (at least for me) driven much more sideways than the last 2.0 cars with active center diff (for me the last exception was the S12B). Remember when the 1.6T came to Sweden two years a go how even some guys here on forum commented that it's a joke to have the cars driven almost back forward through corners and that it looked like they were RC cars? :) With the ongoing development it slightly changed but still I am sure that current cars without active center diff are sideways more than previous 2.0 cars. Of course I don't speak about old cars like Octavia which You must have driven sideways to make them turn :)

By the way Ogier is one of the most spectacular drivers in fast sections so I don't see any worrying development there ;)

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Originally Posted by Rallyper

Yes, Dimitrios, you and Tom understand what I meant above, even though the comment itself (being 1st or 4th) was kind of relevant for the rally, you never can tell out of a picture who´s fastest at that point...

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While watching the rally I was convinced that Latvala was quicker than Oiger at almost every location we watched at. However I think it is easy to confuse spectacular driving with speed with the modern cars. Although Latvala looked so much faster he was slower than the smooth controlled style of Oiger during the rally.

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Originally Posted by GritPics

While watching the rally I was convinced that Latvala was quicker than Oiger at almost every location we watched at. However I think it is easy to confuse spectacular driving with speed with the modern cars. Although Latvala looked so much faster he was slower than the smooth controlled style of Oiger during the rally.

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I had similar impressions, though while on stage it's impossible to say how one driver is faster than another unless you see over a long view. Especially on Saturday and Sunday, and in places over crests/jumps, Ogier looked like he was just taking it easy, not pushing it compared to his team mate- and then you see the stage time and he was "always" fastest. I think if one of the top cars would have notable louder sound than others, it'd feel faster than others, even if it makes no sense. The show effects just fool you while in forest

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Originally Posted by tommeke_B

I was on that particular place from those photos. The fastest in that corner was Hirvonen, but he was too wide and was in the snowbank with the back, then the front went to the snowbank, and he lost a little bit of time there. And Latvala was defenetely faster than Ogier... But after that corner they had to brake for a hairpin immediately. In the exit of the hairpin JML was too much inside the hairpin and lost a lot of traction because he was too much in the snow. In that place it was not needed to push it to the maximum in the fast right corner, because they had to brake immediately after it for the hairpin (Ogier, Loeb and Ostberg took it easy). Rallying is not just about pushing it to the limit everywhere, it's also about being smart and seeing where you can gain a bit of time without risking too much and where to lift because you can not win anything. That's probably the main difference between Loeb, Ogier, Ostberg (I think he is driving smart too), and Latvala and Hirvonen, to give an example. :)

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There was talk on Rally Radio of the snow banks being softer this year than usual.

Just wondering how much this affected Latvala & Hirvonen as it sounds perhaps they tried to rely too much on snow banks in the conditions. The Ogier clean style paid off big time. Not making any excuses, Ogier drove a perfect rally. I think though some of the reason Latvala & Hirvonen put in disappointing performance on a rally we might expect them to do well on, may have been snow bank conditions not suiting the more aggressive Finnish approach to Sweden. It shows though they should have adjusted, Ostberg seemed to be able to so I agree it comes down to driving smart rather than just relying on techniques that worked in the past.

I noticed too both Loeb & Ogier had moments in the banks which they powered through. I'm not sure if the banks had not been particularly soft they would have got away with it. Usually it would have meant being well and truly stuck or stopping to clear radiators.

Not withstanding though there is some point where trying to drive faster makes for slower times! Loeb & Ogier are the masters of finding the spot where perfect almost relaxed driving results in fastest times. JML doesn't seem to quite understand the concept and when Hirvonen applies it, he goes so slow not to matter much anymore! Spectating I always thought Ken Block looked faster than Loeb, says it all I guess!

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Originally Posted by tommeke_B

Nice to see my friend's video already linked on here. We had a great event, seen 11 stages, all were great places. Perhaps the most spectacular event I've ever seen... Also the organisation of the event was great, everyone was very friendly etc. :) My photos are to be online this afternoon/evening.

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How did you manage to see 11 stages? Maybe you can write a short story about your trip to Sweden? It was very interesting to read story of Hartusvuori. I will try to do that as well. Here is my story from the last year in Latvian news site: TVNET :: Motoru sports - Latvie

Not sure how Google Translator will cope with it. :)