Silly Season 2020

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28th October 2019, 20:00
Tarmop

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggg377

If you look at Mäkinen's statements since the Hyundai announcement it's clear he was in the dark. He literally said there is no plan B for Toyota at the moment. His attitude changed completely from Wales to Catalunya.

Probably has plan c also... come on, he has a developing contender who he can hire, Evans, Breen, Mikkelsen, Ostberg...
28th October 2019, 20:00
Andre Oliveira

I doubt Ogier goes to Toyota.
28th October 2019, 20:02
Oraamat

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggg377

If you look at Mäkinen's statements since the Hyundai announcement it's clear he was in the dark. He literally said there is no plan B for Toyota at the moment. His attitude changed completely from Wales to Catalunya.

Well if calis statements are correct and Ogier really is dealing with some legal stuff to move Toyota then its pretty clear plan b. I guess he just wasnt prepared for a rumour news during rally, so he just didnt know what to answer. And obviously there cant be any direct hint or anything before official announcement.
28th October 2019, 20:02
EstWRC

i have some serious questions about Tommis actions as a team manager

last year Lappi left, now Tänak....
28th October 2019, 20:07
Oraamat

Quote:

Originally Posted by EstWRC

i have some serious questions about Tommis actions as a team manager

last year Lappi left, now Tänak....

Yea, it seems like the fish rots from the head down.
28th October 2019, 20:12
Rally Power

Quote:

Originally Posted by cali

Ogier to Toyota (some legal stuff still to be solved)

The same was said about Neymar going to Barcelona as was his wish, but he’s still playing for PSG…(sorry for the OT).

Ogier will continue with Citroen next year, as planned.
28th October 2019, 20:13
T16

Quote:

Originally Posted by cali

I have info:
Tänak to Hyundai (deal done about a month ago)
Ogier to Toyota (some legal stuff still to be solved)

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

I think Mrs Ogier has already sorted out the legal stuff!
28th October 2019, 20:42
wrc2017

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oraamat

And Tommi isnt willing to change or do things differently then that leaving is only option?

Tanak is WRC Champ driving a Toyota. What needs changed?
28th October 2019, 20:51
Fast Eddie WRC

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rally Power

Ogier will continue with Citroen next year, as planned.

Toyota has made a big investment to enter and achieve what they have in the WRC.

I dont see how they would try to compete with Hyundai in 2020 without the only other elite driver (Ogier).

They need to be in the fight for both Titles and a team of second-string driver's isnt going to cut it.
28th October 2019, 20:59
RS

If we’re talking about guys breaking contracts now, Neuville in a Toyota would be interesting.
28th October 2019, 21:18
dnb

Quote:

Originally Posted by RS

If we’re talking about guys breaking contracts now, Neuville in a Toyota would be interesting.

If you're playing scramble, why not Adamo to Toyota? Things would happen.
28th October 2019, 21:29
Kielder

S-dv 9032; to v33681; vle 756x; in-nl 67; in-nz 9; 704 exc 75; 294 fpf 75; to-89095-h; k-am 5083; k-am 6983; l 555 bat; n6 mre; 206 ndp 75; x20 srt; s600 wrt; 23 ddm 92; wov vw 369; sp 1013...
28th October 2019, 21:33
mknight

I really hope Ogier doesn't go to Toyota as it might quarantee that Citroen leaves after 2020 or even sooner.

The things that are against it:
- he spend most of the year changing C3 and now when finally all the upgrades are coming he should change to a different car knowing he has no time to make it suit him?
- some of the reasons for Tanak leaving would also piss off Ogier a lot (reliability, people leaving etc.)
- travel to Finland when he lives in Germany with wife and kid takes quite a lot longer
- I think Ogier cares a lot about what French people think about him. Leaving Citroen now for Toyota just before ending career is not likely to be a popular move
- Being at Citroen and very much involved with testing the bigger C3 aero as well as the "wing affair", he also sees that with smaller wing Toyota is no longer massively faster than others

All this being said I am sure Toyota will do everything possible to try to get him (Japanese more than Tommi, even to the point of ordering Tommi to hire him)
28th October 2019, 21:42
Katvala

This silly season is something else. What's next, the old VW team reunited at Toyota? (Ogier, Latvala, Mikkelsen)

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk
28th October 2019, 21:45
mknight

Toywagen?
28th October 2019, 22:01
Rally Power

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC

Toyota has made a big investment to enter and achieve what they have in the WRC.
I dont see how they would try to compete with Hyundai in 2020 without the only other elite driver (Ogier).
They need to be in the fight for both Titles and a team of second-string driver's isnt going to cut it.

Come on Eddie, PSA is an independent manufacturer and Citroen is on the WRC by its own rigth and will. Ogier is under contract until the end of 2020 and he’s Citroen main asset; they hugely invest on him, not only financially but also in terms of sport strategy and even brand image, breaking their long partnership with Loeb. They simply can’t let him go.
28th October 2019, 22:14
er88

Was it a 2yr deal Ogier signed? I was sure it was a 1year plus a 1yr option to extend (ogier talks like it was), and you can bet your life that if that was the case, it wasn't Citroen putting in the "option" for another year. That would've been Ogier protecting his own ass from being tied to the C3 and Citroen if they cant get it right this year - even after the upgrades. A smart negotiator like Ogier could have something in the contract that allows him to walk regardless, even if it's a straight up 2year deal.

Maybe that's why Citroen ran the aero updates in a pre rally Spain test? Ogier will want to know now how the updates feel, because they've been testing and looking for aero evolutions for a whole year now at Citroen. Ogier simply can't wait any longer for Citroen to sort the car, he has to know going into 2020 and see proof.
28th October 2019, 22:16
cali

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rally Power

The same was said about Neymar going to Barcelona as was his wish, but he’s still playing for PSG…(sorry for the OT).

Ogier will continue with Citroen next year, as planned.

That's what I have heard now from multiple places. To make things easier we could make a bet ;)

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
28th October 2019, 22:47
Rally Power

Quote:

Originally Posted by er88

Was it a 2yr deal Ogier signed? I was sure it was a 1year plus a 1yr option to extend (ogier talks like it was) ...

Yep, that’s what I also recall, but options can be signed earlier and some time ago Mrs. Jackson and Budar confirmed Ogier in 2020.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cali

That's what I have heard now from multiple places. To make things easier we could make a bet ;)

It’d be hard to collect, unless you’re planning to 'spectate' Rally de Portugal next year ;)
28th October 2019, 22:55
cali

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rally Power

Yep, that’s what I also recall, but options can be signed earlier and some time ago Mrs. Jackson and Budar confirmed Ogier in 2020.

It’d be hard to collect, unless you’re planning to 'spectate' Rally de Portugal next year ;)

If that's an invitation I'm willing to consider it :)

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
28th October 2019, 23:03
T16

Quote:

Originally Posted by er88

Was it a 2yr deal Ogier signed? I was sure it was a 1year plus a 1yr option to extend (ogier talks like it was), and you can bet your life that if that was the case, it wasn't Citroen putting in the "option" for another year. That would've been Ogier protecting his own ass from being tied to the C3 and Citroen if they cant get it right this year - even after the upgrades. A smart negotiator like Ogier could have something in the contract that allows him to walk regardless, even if it's a straight up 2year deal.

Maybe that's why Citroen ran the aero updates in a pre rally Spain test? Ogier will want to know now how the updates feel, because they've been testing and looking for aero evolutions for a whole year now at Citroen. Ogier simply can't wait any longer for Citroen to sort the car, he has to know going into 2020 and see proof.

All of that makes a lot of sense.
28th October 2019, 23:06
T16

Toyota: Ogier Meeke Rovanpera
Hyundai: Tanak Neuville Sordo/ Loeb
M-Sport: Evans Lappi or Latvala
Citroen: Out
28th October 2019, 23:19
Rally Power

Quote:

Originally Posted by cali

If that's an invitation I'm willing to consider it :)

Good idea! Feel free to consider it, there’s always room in our RdP group ;)
29th October 2019, 04:38
mknight

I am quite sure Ogier confirmed 2020 with Citroen, just before Rally Finland.
Doesn't mean it's set in stone though.
29th October 2019, 05:08
EstWRC

Can’t wait you to post more later on then! Interesting info.

E: the post has been deleted who i was thanking, hmmm....
29th October 2019, 05:31
racerx1979

https://rallysportmag.com/wrc-withdr...stralia-entry/

Anyone know more about this? Maybe Ogier and...
29th October 2019, 05:36
Indreq

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcrown

Can also share what I heard couple of days ago from my source inside Toyota.

Reason for Ott's leaving is actually mainly about reliability and leadership, specially about Tommi and Mia and their ways of solving problems with Yaris and inside the TGR team (I can tell you more on that once the contract has been confirmed).
As one user said yesterday - the reasons why Toyota has failed (what we have seen on All Live) are just tip of the iceberg, and indeed alot of roadside repairs and so called praying-to-the-god is included.
New contract should be confirmed today or on Thursday.
Nothing I could confirm about Ogier to Toyota so far.
In the last 6 months 10+ people have left or let go from Toyota (middle managers, supervisors, mechanics).
The last one is mainly because of differences (Mia sacking everyone who doesn't like the way TGRWRC is operating) or because of the salary (Tommi pays average Finnish wage to most of the mechanics (unless you are his close friend) and is not willing to raise their salary even after all the success they have had).
Tanak might have burned his bridges with Toyota (more about that later on).
Akio and the Japanese supposedly came to an agreement with Tanak and his management (being first driver, having MM-motorsport to operate Yaris R5), but refused to take any action on Tommi's or Mia's leadership tactics.

// Lappi also left last year because of issues with Mia

Sounds like management style of your average finnish village team :D :D :D
N.O.T. might have hit bullseye (accidentally?) :P
29th October 2019, 05:46
skarderud

Quote:

Originally Posted by racerx1979

https://rallysportmag.com/wrc-withdr...stralia-entry/

Anyone know more about this? Maybe Ogier and...

Mads atleast, he would drive if Ogier still had the possibility to WDC. Some M-sport car?

Sent fra min SM-G950F via Tapatalk
29th October 2019, 05:57
mknight

Maybe there was a call from Korea to NZ about not interfering with the title fight? Anyway this belongs to Australia thread.
29th October 2019, 05:57
Sulland

Who is this Mia?
29th October 2019, 05:59
mknight

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sulland

Who is this Mia?

Mia Mäkinen wife of Tommi, formerly working for BMW Finland. Finnish people will have details.
29th October 2019, 06:16
Hartusvuori

Quote:

Originally Posted by mknight

Mia Mäkinen wife of Tommi, formerly working for BMW Finland. Finnish people will have details.

I'm not sure are they married, but a couple they are. And her name is Mia Miettinen. She is also the vice CEO of Tommi Mäkinen Racing.
29th October 2019, 06:37
Allez Andruet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sulland

Who is this Mia?

The former CEO of BMW Finland, currently some kind of EVP of Tommi Mäkinen Racing Oy and a board member of Tommi Mäkinen Racing Oü.

It's no secret they're a couple. For example when Finland celebrated 100 years of independence in December 2017, they were together in a party organized by the Finnish president: https://www.is.fi/linnanjuhlat/art-2000005480289.html
29th October 2019, 06:43
Allez Andruet

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcrown

The last one is mainly because of differences (Mia sacking everyone who doesn't like the way TGRWRC is operating) or because of the salary (Tommi pays average Finnish wage to most of the mechanics (unless you are his close friend) and is not willing to raise their salary even after all the success they have had).

Just out of curiosity, does anyone here know if the TGR mechanics and other staff are employees of Tommi Mäkinen Racing Oy or Oü?
29th October 2019, 07:01
eib1

https://creditreports.ee/tommi-makin...978.1529497493

OÜ has 65 employees, in II Quarter the number was 33 so i think he is moving them from OY to OÜ right now
29th October 2019, 07:06
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by racerx1979

https://rallysportmag.com/wrc-withdr...stralia-entry/

Anyone know more about this? Maybe Ogier and...

Tänak?

EDIT: Obviously Østberg will be withdrawn now, but still you can think of the conflict of interest with Tänak driving against his future employer
29th October 2019, 07:16
pantealex

Correct me if I am wrong. (Estonia people should now)

TGR (or TMR if you want) Estonia and MMM (Markko Märtin Motorsport) are in same location (same address)

Who owns that place ? Markko and Ott or Tommi and Mia ? (TMR Estonia is 50% owned by Tommi and Mia owns 50% also, and that´s big problem)

If Ott goes off from TGR, I just can´t see MMM and TGR/TMR working together...

TGR Finland and Estonia units are not working well together, carbon and other spareparts worth over 2Million € are missing from Estonia unit...
29th October 2019, 07:20
eib1

Quote:

Originally Posted by pantealex

TGR (or TMR if you want) Estonia and MMM (Markko Märtin Motorsport) are in same location (same address)

no, never been
29th October 2019, 07:22
Fredouye

https://www.rallye-sport.fr/neuville...constructeurs/

Neuville, about Tänak : "Anyway, as it seems he'll be with us in the team next year, [...]"
29th October 2019, 07:22
Allez Andruet

Quote:

Originally Posted by pantealex

Correct me if I am wrong. (Estonia people should now)

TGR (or TMR if you want) Estonia and MMM (Markko Märtin Motorsport) are in same location (same address)

Not according to the official records.

TMR OÜ: Reti tee 14 Peetri alevik, Rae vald Harjumaa 75312
Triple M OÜ (MM-Motorsport): Õlleköögi põik 2, Kurna küla Rae vald Harjumaa 75307

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