Honda Indy Toronto

So JW manages to beat the fastest time from last year - big deal. The IRL has only raced at Toronto once before, in 2009.

It would be a bigger suprise if they weren't able to beat last years time.

Call me when they get close to the Champcar record.

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Originally Posted by FormerFF

As a person ages, there are certain physiological changes that affect his ability to be a racing driver. The field of vision narrows, acuity lessens, and moving objects are seen less clearly. I stayed in Formula Ford until I was 40, and at that time I could begin to notice the decline. I get the impression that as long as a driver is at speed frequently that the rate of decline is less, but if you're out of the car for an extended period of time that your visual acuity declines from that of a racing driver to what a non-driver experiences.

I've noticed that most open wheel drivers begin to lose pace at about age 35. I think that HCN is experiencing that right now. He's still plenty racy, but I think you'll see that he wins fewer races than he used to, and when he does win it will be from a combination of speed and racecraft.

PT is 41, and will be 42 in December. During the last years of ChampCar, he didn't have the ultimate pace of some of the other drivers. Since then, he's been mostly out of racing. Undoubtedly, much of his poor showing is due to less-than-topnotch equipment, but I'd suspect that age and his limited schedule are part of the issue.

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PT once was a force to contend, especially when he had good equipment. But even he has admitted in recent articles he was mostly a "feel" driver who just pushed to the limit (and often beyond), not a technical driver who had very precise lines, braking markers, etc. That made him fun to watch as he just hustled the car around a track, but age seems to have hurt him more than some others, especially since he has gotten so little seat time,

Some drivers managed to run very well at even older ages, but many, like Rick Mears were known as very precise drivers who used their experience to anticipate what the car would do and were prepared to react even before the car made a move. If their reflexes slowed a bit, it didn't hurt them very much. But if you are relying on quick reflexes to save the car rather than anticipating, slower reactions due to age could really hurt. That was also in an era where G-forces and the cars reactions were a bit slower.

Most drivers have mentioned how "edgy" most modern race cars have become as they have been honed to very fine degrees. It takes very quick and conditioned reactions to get the most out of them. In almost all series (even NASCAR), it is becoming more of a young person's game.

As we get older, it seems often the mind is willing, but the body just doesn't cooperate. ;)

Report from the track is attendance is up from last year but still light compared to earlier years. The ban on your own food and especially water is really annoying a lot of people.
Hot Dogs $4 and a Burger $5. Not really out of line there.
Trans Am field is pathetic. 8 cars and only 5 anywhere near competitive.
Be interesting to see the crowd today. There is a threat of thunderstorms but supposedly not until late afternoon. With the heat and humidity they can pop up anytime, especially near any of the Great Lakes.

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Originally Posted by beachbum

PT once was a force to contend, especially when he had good equipment. But even he has admitted in recent articles he was mostly a "feel" driver who just pushed to the limit (and often beyond), not a technical driver who had very precise lines, braking markers, etc. That made him fun to watch as he just hustled the car around a track, but age seems to have hurt him more than some others, especially since he has gotten so little seat time,

Some drivers managed to run very well at even older ages, but many, like Rick Mears were known as very precise drivers who used their experience to anticipate what the car would do and were prepared to react even before the car made a move. If their reflexes slowed a bit, it didn't hurt them very much. But if you are relying on quick reflexes to save the car rather than anticipating, slower reactions due to age could really hurt. That was also in an era where G-forces and the cars reactions were a bit slower.

Most drivers have mentioned how "edgy" most modern race cars have become as they have been honed to very fine degrees. It takes very quick and conditioned reactions to get the most out of them. In almost all series (even NASCAR), it is becoming more of a young person's game.

As we get older, it seems often the mind is willing, but the body just doesn't cooperate. ;)

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While nobody is going to aruge that PT isn't past his prime, and many statements you and FormerFF have made are absolutely true, I think PT even today is one of the top 8 or so best drivers on today's grid. No doubt, and best said, that lack of seat time and some less than stellar equipment are contributing here. Lets not forget that as a part time driver now for 3 years he has been competitive each and every race with some teams that aren't known to be toward the front. His drive at Edmonton under all the circumstances in '08 was spectacular and he was pretty much the best of the non-Ganassi and Penske cars from Toronto, Edmonton, and Mid-Ohio last year. I know his Toronot finish didn't show it last year but we all saw how he raced....my God the IRL hasn't seen that much passing on a street course in its history.

It sounds to me like PT is working on positive momentum to have himself a full-gig next year if you follow him and his associates on all the boards and Twitter. That could fall through but sounds positive at least. If he gets in a car for a full year and struggles week in and week out then it is time to hang it up but I don't see him struggling on a consistent basis like some other big name drivers today.

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Originally Posted by Easy Drifter

Report from the track is attendance is up from last year but still light compared to earlier years. The ban on your own food and especially water is really annoying a lot of people.
Hot Dogs $4 and a Burger $5. Not really out of line there.
Trans Am field is pathetic. 8 cars and only 5 anywhere near competitive.
Be interesting to see the crowd today. There is a threat of thunderstorms but supposedly not until late afternoon. With the heat and humidity they can pop up anytime, especially near any of the Great Lakes.

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ED, my GF and I were discussing this last night 9along with making fun of Bud Lime) as she's never been to the Toronto event. We were comparing it to Long Beach and she says she's had her water/Gatorade and stuff confiscated at least 2 of the past 3 years. I personally don't remember taking anything in, got tons and tons of stuff there that is a staple of going in the first place. Maybe it isn't as uncommon as we suspect.

Some posters have been full of praise for Randy's criticism of Milka's lack of pace--but jeez, what a pathetic display to say they'll evaluate it at the end of the season! It's like watching a shoplifter take something right in front of you and say you'll evaluate whether to go after them when the store closes... Someone should explain to him how to stand up on his hind legs and act like the leader of the Series.

Changing the subject radically-----Bud Light Lime--isn't that what you use to clean your car's wheels?

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Originally Posted by Tex

It's a series track record, not the official track record. The official track record is the 58.182 set by JW in a Champ Car.

Maybe once the new cars come out in a couple of years, they will be able to set 'a new track record'! ;)

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They beat that back in the 90's I believe....99 was a 57.143, GdF. 03 Was around a 58.90 PT.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by beachbum

PT once was a force to contend, especially when he had good equipment. But even he has admitted in recent articles he was mostly a "feel" driver who just pushed to the limit (and often beyond), not a technical driver who had very precise lines, braking markers, etc. That made him fun to watch as he just hustled the car around a track, but age seems to have hurt him more than some others, especially since he has gotten so little seat time,

Some drivers managed to run very well at even older ages, but many, like Rick Mears were known as very precise drivers who used their experience to anticipate what the car would do and were prepared to react even before the car made a move. If their reflexes slowed a bit, it didn't hurt them very much. But if you are relying on quick reflexes to save the car rather than anticipating, slower reactions due to age could really hurt. That was also in an era where G-forces and the cars reactions were a bit slower.

Most drivers have mentioned how "edgy" most modern race cars have become as they have been honed to very fine degrees. It takes very quick and conditioned reactions to get the most out of them. In almost all series (even NASCAR), it is becoming more of a young person's game.

As we get older, it seems often the mind is willing, but the body just doesn't cooperate. ;)

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Roberto Moreno? Won a race (or two) in his 40s, no?

Warm-Up

http://i30.tinypic.com/2uemjpg.jpg

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Originally Posted by TURN3

While nobody is going to aruge that PT isn't past his prime, and many statements you and FormerFF have made are absolutely true, I think PT even today is one of the top 8 or so best drivers on today's grid. No doubt, and best said, that lack of seat time and some less than stellar equipment are contributing here. Lets not forget that as a part time driver now for 3 years he has been competitive each and every race with some teams that aren't known to be toward the front. His drive at Edmonton under all the circumstances in '08 was spectacular and he was pretty much the best of the non-Ganassi and Penske cars from Toronto, Edmonton, and Mid-Ohio last year. I know his Toronot finish didn't show it last year but we all saw how he raced....my God the IRL hasn't seen that much passing on a street course in its history.

It sounds to me like PT is working on positive momentum to have himself a full-gig next year if you follow him and his associates on all the boards and Twitter. That could fall through but sounds positive at least. If he gets in a car for a full year and struggles week in and week out then it is time to hang it up but I don't see him struggling on a consistent basis like some other big name drivers today.

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Not saying PT isn't still one of the better drivers on track, he just isn't what he once was. With a very tight field, even being a "tick" off can be 10 spots. He is still a racer who may not have the ultimate speed, but knows how to get the most out of what he has. He is also always still fun the watch. I was never much of a PT fan when he was younger, but today I admire his dedication and that fact he still has the desire and drive to win.

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Originally Posted by drewdawg727

Roberto Moreno? Won a race (or two) in his 40s, no?

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That illustrates what I was saying. Moreno was a very skillful and precise driver, which is why he was a great test driver and a "super-sub". He was a thinking driver who could extend his career - and did. He was also very very good when he was younger.