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Fair enough. But the thought that the salvation/future of CC is partially in his hands is frightful. he's done nothing to make me believe he has the best interest of the series at heart. Maybe his pockets (etc. Rusport deal, Tags, etc.), but not the series. Just sad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Starter
Another armchair quarterback theory Paul Gentilozzi bashing comment from the earl side? Please, give it a rest. If you can't agree there is a serious problem in the motor racing market then its pointless to discuss it.Quote:
Originally Posted by pvtjoker
And thus ChampCar has become nothing more than another blatantly undisguised and poorly promoted spec racing series without even a single manufacturer to foster it's existence. These guys could piss off the Pope.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
pits4me,
What do you think will happen next with Champ Car, particularly in 2008, given the difficulty in attracting sponsorship in the NAFTA markets?
I agree ,look at an update of the poll on autoracing1.comQuote:
Originally Posted by pits4me
"Which is the best top-level racing series?"
A1GP 1%
ALMS 6%
Champ Car 35%
F1 34%
Grand-AM 1%
IRL 9%
NASCAR 12%
V8 Supercars 3%
Gee, we all know that the above poll reflects reality. The truth is that AR1 and CCF are likely the only places such results would be seen. I have seen many neutral, real world, third party surveys and they look nothing like the results above.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Here is a graph from Alexa.com that compares the relative web traffic trends from NASCAR.com, Formula1.com, ChampCarWorldSeries.com, IndyCar.com and AmericanLeMans.com:
http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...url=nascar.com
These are the Alexa traffic ranks for each site shown in the Autoracing1.com poll (out of all sites on the worldwide web):
Site / Rank
Formula1.com: 1694
NASCAR.com: 3234
IndyCar.com: 52,076
ChampCarWorldSeries.com: 73,903
v8supercar.com.au: 111,304
AmericanLeMans.com: 178,493
A1GP.com: 194,852
Grand-Am.com: 247,168
Since F1 and NASCAR are so far out in front, it is also interesting to look at the traffic rank history for the other series without the two front runners:
http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...orldSeries.com
Last but not least, it is important to put Autoracing1.com in perspective. The Alexa ranking for the leading motorsports news sites (plus AR!.com) are:
Site / Rank
Autosport.com: 9,004
SpeedTV.com: 19,304
Crash.net: 22,131
Motorsport.com: 33,928
Autoracing1.com: 305,974
Lies, dammed lies and statistics, eh Sanguin?
Sanguin....it is AR1...a site that is dedicated to hard core racing fans, many of whom follow the politics of the sport and the machinations of the sport. The general public wouldn't pay to go on AR1. Hell, I wont pay for it and I am a hard core fan. No, let ESPN or some media site to a poll. The TV ratings world wide should tell you lots about where Champ Car sits.
This whole argument is indiciative of the delusional thinking that is involved by a few individuals. If Champ Car has so much TV quotient, so much attraction, how come there are not enough sponsors? How come there is no large company helping float large purses? How come there is only 17 cars? How come the series is buying TV time to make broadcasts on ESPN Guam ( am only slightly facetious here) and how come most of the other markets outside the US, the TV package is poor to non-existent? When you solve all of those issues, then you will maybe have a point. Until then, Champ Car is where it is because of mismanagement and a lack of marketing expertese and finances behind the marketing.
Name all the series that don't buy some tv time. Name all the series with great ratings. Name all the series with huge car counts that don't need more. Name a series that doesn't need more sponsorship.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
BTW, CC has Eurosport.
NASCARQuote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Jeff
exactly, thanks, but aren't their rating trending down for a second year in a row?Does that validate the high price ABC/ESPN paid for tv rights? aren't their teams combining to stay afloat? their drivers switching teams? Aren't they losing sponsors and had a hard time getting a title sponsor for their secondary series? Aren't they in a lawsuit with a track owner? I know they're successful so far, my point is they experience the same problems that other series do. There are things that need to be fixed in CC, can it be done? yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by cartpix
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Oh man, this is like shooting fish in a freakin' barrel, name a series that wouldn't LOVE to have these "problems".
Gary
every series has these problems,that's the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by garyshell
At least they have TV ratingsQuote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
But they GET paid for TVQuote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
At least they have teamsQuote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Yes, but they are the SAME drivers, year in & year out. Maybe a couple come & go each year, but not manyQuote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
They have plenty of sponsors to lose. NASCAR is a pretty expensive sponsorship deal. The sponsors they are losing, are the ones that can't keep up. How come CC can't scoop up ALL these sponsors, you think are falling by the wayside, by the dozens?Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
They are on the top, now. The only way they can go is down. NASCAR has a very long way to go, to get to the level that Champ Car is now. Don't try to make us believe that the 800 pound gorilla will fall, over night. We believe THAT, about as well as we believe ANYTHING you post.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
That really depends on whether they want to do what is needed to be done. Doing what they are doing now, won't get it done. They keep saying, wait until next year, it will be all better. I'm still waiting.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Jeff
But most series don't have as many or the kind of problems CC has. To paraphrase Gary, most series would love to have the kind of problems NASCAR has. That is, of course, that they have the successes, too.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Jeff
David Phillips nails it on SpeedTV.com today. D. Walker's quotes are on the money too. Both must be reading this thread. Here is the link:
http://www.speedtv.com/commentary/40891/?page=1
I also went back to Alexa.com and looked a little deeper at the stats available. Below is what I found about where the traffic comes from (shown as percentages).
It is very interesting on a number of levels, especially when one considers the commercial vitality of each series. F1 is an exception in that its highly ranked site attracts a diverse audience whereas most other series have a defined core audience in a single country or region.
I have only tried to show the top ten rankings for each and I was very surprised to see that France was only tied for 7th, with just 2.2% in the Champ Car chart given that Seb has is on his way to his fourth title and there are two of his countrymen in the series. It also looks like Champ Car is big in Russia and Venezuela. Maybe there should be a race in Red Square and Milka should jump ship.
I have put the series in the order of their traffic rank. I do think this information could help us in understanding what happens next.
Formula1.com users come from these countries:
1) United Kingdom: 5.6%
2) Spain: 5.5%
3) India: 5.4%
4) United States: 5.1%
5) Malaysia: 4.9%
6) Philippines: 3.7%
7) Singapore: 3.5%
8) Poland: 3.0%
9) Greece: 2.8%
10) Venezuela: 2.3%
Nascar.com users come from these countries:
1) United States: 82.6%
2) Canada: 5.4%
3) Colombia: 2.3%
4) Puerto Rico: 1.2%
5) France: 1.0%
6) Venezuela: 0.5%
7) Brazil: 0.4%; Germany: 0.4%
8) Philippines: 0.3%; Belgium: 0.3%; Norway: 0.3%; United Kingdom: 0.3%; Australia: 0.3%; Dominican Republic: 0.3%; Honduras: 0.3%
9) Mexico: 0.2%; Italy: 0.2%; Estonia: 0.2%; Austria: 0.2%; Chile: 0.2%; Hungary: 0.2%; India: 0.2%; Peru: 0.2%
10) Thailand: 0.1%; Netherlands: 0.1%
IndyCar.com users come from these countries:
1) United States: 45.2%
2) Canada: 5.0%
3) Brazil: 4.3%
4) United Kingdom: 4.0%; Colombia: 4.0%
5) Venezuela: 3.6%
6) Chile: 3.3%
7) Belgium: 3.0%
8) Singapore: 2.0%
9) Russia: 1.7%; Ukraine: 1.7%
10) New Zealand: 1.3%; Argentina: 1.3%; China: 1.3%
Champcarworldseries.com users come from these countries:
1) United States: 34.6%
2) Canada: 6.1%
3) Russia: 5.0%; Mexico: 5.0%
4) Venezuela: 4.5%
5) United Kingdom: 3.4%; Netherlands: 3.4%
6) Bulgaria: 2.8%; Croatia: 2.8%; Belgium: 2.8%
7) Colombia: 2.2%; Serbia and Montenegro: 2.2%; France: 2.2%;
8) Romania: 1.7%; Australia: 1.7%; Poland: 1.7%; Spain: 1.7%
9) Turkey: 1.1%; Brazil: 1.1%; Germany: 1.1%; Argentina: 1.1%; Lithuania: 1.1%; Qatar: 1.1%
10) Italy: 0.6%; Hungary: 0.6%
V8supercar.com.au users come from these countries:
1) Australia: 73.7%
2) New Zealand: 14.0%
3) United States: 4.7%
4) Croatia: 1.8%
5) United Kingdom: 0.7%; Japan: 0.7%; Hungary: 0.7%
6) Poland: 0.4%; Indonesia: 0.4%; Netherlands: 0.4%; Hong Kong: 0.4%; India: 0.4%; Panama: 0.4%; Philippines: 0.4%; Sweden: 0.4%; Singapore: 0.4%; Thailand: 0.4%
No other countries listed.
Americanlemans.com users come from these countries:
1) United States: 56.5%
2) Croatia: 5.9%; Venezuela: 5.9%
3) United Kingdom: 4.7%; Qatar: 4.7%
4) Netherlands: 3.5%
5) Brazil: 2.4%; Slovenia: 2.4%; France: 2.4%; Austria: 1.2%; Hungary: 1.2%; Bulgaria: 1.2%; Canada: 1.2%; Colombia 1.2%; Cyprus: 1.2%; Hong Kong: 1.2%; Mexico: 1.2%; Malaysia: 1.2%; Romania: 1.2%
No other countries listed.
A1gp.com users come from these countries:
1) Netherlands: 14.4%
2) India: 12.1%
3) United Kingdom: 11.3%
4) Czech Republic: 7.0%
5) Indonesia: 5.8%
6) Malaysia: 5.1%; New Zealand: 5.1%
7) Philippines: 4.7%; United States: 4.7%
8) Brazil: 3.5%; South Africa: 3.5%
9) Canada: 2.3%; Pakistan: 1.9%
10) Germany: 1.6%
Grand-Am.com users come from these countries:
1) United States: 73.2%
2) Qatar: 4.2%; Canada: 4.2%
3) Guatemala: 2.8%; Dominican Republic: 2.8%; United Kingdom: 2.8%
4) Croatia: 1.4%; Costa Rica: 1.4%; Bulgaria: 1.4%; Switzerland: 1.4%; France: 1.4%; Italy: 1.4%; Malaysia: 1.4%
No other countries listed.
It should be about time for you-know-who to fire his Spintron Torpedos and activate his Farce Fields. Uniphasers armed. Fire at will, Mr. Sanguin!
I need to get me some of those. The farce field looks particularly useful (and appropriate). The Uniphasers mostly attack the pocketbook.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaimWitz
When long time CC supporters like Walker and Phillips publically make such strong and pointed statements, someone should be listening, not "spinning" like he-who-will-not-be-named.
[quote="ChaimWitz"]
Thanks for the data, very interesting and is also shows a genuine international ChampCar viewing.
Also from ChaimWitz data provided:
Formula1.com: 1694
NASCAR.com: 3234
IndyCar.com: 52,076
ChampCarWorldSeries.com: 73,903
shows that KK etc have got an asset but they are loosing it all bt themselves....
Quote:
Originally Posted by seppefan
Huh? What are THOSE numbers?
Gary
I don't get it either, but Gary, don't know if you read the Phillips article and saw Derrick Walkers comments...with a stalwart like this making those kind of comments, do you think he's just angling for a formal position from the owners or is he really preparing his exit? I know Derrick fairly well and he's not made these comments in this way in the past, but I think, as most feel today, that the Amigos need to step into the spotlight and formally state their intentions...knowing KK, he's thinking he'll do it in his back yard, but don't you think something should go out now?Quote:
Originally Posted by garyshell
They're traffic ranking numbers of all the websites in the world. So the most visited website in the world (think it's google.com) is ranked 1, then other popular stuff like eBay, Facebook, MySpace, Yahoo, etc are all up there in the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by garyshell
So Formula1.com is the 1694th most visited website in the world, etc...
To help understand “what happen next” I thought it would helpful to provide even more third party perspective on the relative interest in the various forms of motorsports listed in the Autoracing1.com popularity poll.
After reading my post with the Alexa.com global site traffic rankings, a friend suggested a newer alternative: Quantcast.com, because this service provides insight into the USA traffic rankings along with estimates of the monthly unique users. These results can be “Quantified” by the individual site publishers submitting additional data such as Global traffic (only Champ car and ALMS have done this). Regardless, It is very interesting stuff:
Quantcast.com motorsports website US traffic rankings:
1) NASCAR.com
US Rank: 549
US Monthly Uniques: 2,800,000
2) IndyCar.com
US Rank: 17,392
US Monthly Uniques: 112,775
3) Formula1.com
US Rank: 23,893
US Monthly Uniques: 78,358
4) ChampCarWorldSeries.com (Quantified)
US Rank: 35,805
US Monthly Uniques: 49,684 (+50,985 Global Uniques = 100,639)
5) AmericanLeMans.com (Quantified)
US Rank: 39,417
US Monthly Uniques: 44,460 (+16,538 Global Uniques = 60,338)
6) Grand-Am.com
US Rank: 144,834
Monthly Uniques: 9484
7) V8Supercar.com.au
US Rank: 636,959
Monthly Uniques: < 2000 (1585)
8) A1GP.com
US Rank: 7,816,328
Monthly Uniques: < 2000 (376)
A number of things jump out at me:
* NASCAR is 2800 laps ahead. Only a mistake or a crash by the Frances can save American Open Wheel Racing from itself.
* IndyCar.com’s US traffic is twice that of Champ Car’s. No wonder it is hard for the Amigos to sell much meaningful US based sponsorship or attract media interest while the Indy Car Series still has a fair amount of both.
* Formula1.com has more traffic in the US than ChampCar's site and Formula1.com dwarfs ChampCarWorldSeries.com's tiny global traffic numbers. This is not encouraging for a series now claiming to be a 'world series" based in the USA.
* AmericanLeMans.com is nipping at the heels of ChampCarWorldSeries.com. How much longer before the ALMS’s web traffic passes CCWS's? BTW, the same thing is happening on TV in the USA.
* Very few people in the USA care about the NASCAR-style road racing represented by the Grand-Am.
* Virtually no one in the USA cares about A1GP or V8 Supercars.
Using the above information as predictor of “what happens next” leads me to the conclusion that Champ Car is now surrounded and marginalized by competitors on all sides. It has very little hope of escaping this fatal circumstance given its lack of a compelling brand identity and managment horespower.
Champ Car now looks decidedly third rate in the harsh light the digital age. There is simply no place left to hide. Uniphasers, Farce Shields and Spintron Torpedoes are useless against people who can see the objective truth... And the truth must be devastating to the Amigos during this year of renewal of the contract for “The Indy” at Surfers Paradise. One must now wonder what real commercial value the organizers think is left in Champ Car given the all the issues that the series has had since the last contract renewal.
One glance at the web traffic rankings from Alexa and Quantcast suggests that ChampCar brings precious little fan base with it wherever it goes – especially Australia. A1GP, GP2, Formula Nippon or the real “Indy” Car Series would probably do just as well there or better as a companion to V8 Supercars.
If Surfers goes… the question is again “what happens next?” If it doesn’t go, any reasonable person must then wonder about the terms of the deal.
The next few weeks should be interesting.
that's funny stuff. 300k at Surfer's and none of them are CC fans? right.
That's why CC has Aussie teams. Attendance at CC events is up this year 16%.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
The numbers given were U.S. based Sanquin. Why cant you look at all the facts, including the ones that are not in your favor?
If you are so impressed by the one race in Aus, maybe Champ Car can actually develope a business plan, and become an Aus based racing series. Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne, those are 3 more markets that you havent screwed up yet.
No-one said people at Sufer's don't enjoy CC - I'm willing to suggest that whilst quite a lot of people go to only watch CC, the majority will go to watch the V8s/have fun/get drunk/ogle women.
The Brands race in 2003 was tagged on with the BTCC - ask around on these forums what the BTCC regular crowd thought of that race when they went along to watch the tin-tops. I was there and it was rather dull, mainly due to the Brands Indy Course being far too short.
The point of course is that going to a country where CCWS/AN-Other series is not widely known will always involve what some might see as domestic "support races", when in reality these support races are really top of the bill for the natives. It's persuading these natives to watch on TV or return in future years to watch the non-domestic series that is the trick.....
I don't think CC has "screwed" up any markets. They have good venues at LB, Houston, Cleveland,RA and LS.I hope they keep LV. Canada has 3 events and the Euro tour went very well. There is no need for them to stay in one country or leave the US.IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by OWFan19
:laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
Your too funny. Denver, they lost a sponsor and couldnt get another. Phoenix, no sponsors. San Jose gone too. Almost lost Mexico, on a thread at the moment. Laguna, they barely got 20,000 fans to show up 3 years ago.
The reason why Champ Car continues to get negative Press is because you guys continue to deny any problems.
CC isn't the only OW series to have problems in Phoenix. Denver's promoter got into trouble and the sponsor went BK. That had nothing to do with the GP. The Democratic convention made it impossible to hold the race for 2007 and 2008. San Jose killed their own GP,we replaced it with LS,it may be much more successful than 3 years ago and better than Sonoma. Mexico was never almost lost. Link please.Quote:
Originally Posted by OWFan19
I did a little more online research at dictionary.com about the three words that keep coming to mind when I read certain posts in this thread and the positions they convey:
de·lu·sion
(dĭ-lōō'zhən)
- noun
1. a. The act or process of deluding.
b. The state of being deluded.
2. A false belief or opinion: labored under the delusion that success was at hand.
3. Psychiatry A false belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence, especially as a symptom of mental illness: delusions of persecution.
[Middle English delusioun, from Latin dēlūsiō, dēlūsiōn-, from dēlūsus, past participle of dēlūdere, to delude; see delude.]
de·lu'sion·al -adj.
(From the American Heritage Dictionary)
de·cep·tive
(di-'sep-tiv)
Function: adjective: tending or having capacity to deceive <deceptive trade practices> —compare FRAUDULENT, MISLEADING
(from Merriam-Webster's Dictionary of Law)
fa·nat·ic
(fuh-nat-ik)
–noun
1. a person with an extreme and uncritical enthusiasm or zeal, as in religion or politics.
–adjective
2. fanatical.
[Origin: 1515–25; < L fānāticus pertaining to a temple, inspired by orgiastic rites, frantic, equiv. to fān(um) temple + -āticus, equiv. to -āt(us) -ate1 + -icus -ic]
—Synonyms 1. enthusiast, zealot, bigot, hothead, militant. Fanatic, zealot, militant, devotee refer to persons showing more than ordinary support for, adherence to, or interest in a cause, point of view, or activity. Fanatic and zealot both suggest excessive or overweening devotion to a cause or belief. Fanatic further implies unbalanced or obsessive behavior: a wild-eyed fanatic. Zealot, only slightly less unfavorable in implication than fanatic, implies single-minded partisanship: a tireless zealot for tax reform. Militant stresses vigorous, aggressive support for or opposition to a plan or ideal and suggests a combative stance. Devotee is a milder term than any of the foregoing, suggesting enthusiasm but not to the exclusion of other interests or possible points of view: a jazz devotee.
Is it just me, or is the position of Champ Car now only supported or defended by those who fit all or some of the above definitions? I keep hoping the answer is "no" but after reading some of the foregoing posts and contrasting those with the astute writings of David Phillips this week and the objective posts of others on this forum, I think I have the sad answer.
Can somebody please prove me wrong and make a rational case for Champ Car's long term survival and prosperity?
Just one more completely incorrect post and absurd spin. The convention had ZERO to do with the cancellation of Denver, San Jose was much CCWS's fault as the promoter in KK's backyard, and Mexico was MOST DEFINITELY near gone as it would not have happened without the 11th hour driver switcheroo. And why don't we now also add Miami (can't to hear how you spin that one!) and Fontana to the screwed-up race list.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
In your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by heelntoe
wrong again, here's the real story-
http://www.denverpost.com/headlines/ci_5139799Quote:
Pepsi Center officials, however, informed Champ Car that the 2008 date needed to be changed because of the Democratic National Convention. Champ Car said there would be no Denver race in 2008.
"We were in the process of identifying existing Champ Car promoters to step in and run the event or work with someone else," Champ Car spokesman Eric Mauk wrote in an e-mail. "With the 2008 date unquestionably being taken away from us by the convention, it was proving difficult for someone to be enthusiastic to come in and do the race for one year.
The Mexico City race always had a contract and was never in trouble of being cancelled. The drivers were substituted to help the promoter and that is what he asked for. The promoter also said the race had a contract and makes a profit. This was posted by net-ranger on another forum. The promoter also said he is ready to continue this event with CC.
Unles you can come up with something more solid ,this is credible. IMO.
Oh well, you got me there! Only one problem...CCWS had every intention of running Denver for '07 but messed it up...there were also plans for an alternate site which dated back to '04 in the event there were convention problems (I was in those meetings!). As for Eric's comments, it was pr spin 100%...I have been in many many meetings with Eric, which you really should catch on by about now...I was there for a lot of the time these deals were formed or put down. Mexico was a contractual obligation and to say it's profitable is disingenouos as attendance has fallen steadily.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
And nowehere do you respond to screw-ups of Miami and Fontana...so?
So Eric and CC and the promoter of the Mexico City race are all lying .When it comes to anonymous sources on these forums ,I always ask who would I believe? What is said by credible links/persons now? Or a disgruntled ex-employee from 5 years ago that has an ax to grind?
As i have stated more times than i care to remember, I was NEVER an employee of CCWS and as I have established my credibility over a period of years as opposed to a less than two month internet "fan" poster who keeps changing his identity and can't accept the truth, I really don't care what you believe...I care about what credible posters with objective opinions or agenda opinions believe...as long as they can debate intelligently. Go back to pr 101 class if you actually believe what Eric and the CCWS PR machine has been throwing out there over the past 18 months.Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguin
And back to my question which you don't want to answer, what about Miami and Fontana?
It won't come from the pompom wavers. They drank the koolaid and think the CC world is wonderful. Don't worry, be happy. They don't have to make a case for the future because they just know it's going to be great, just because they say so. CC is on a wave upward! No facts, no answers to questions asked, no interest in a civil dialog, not even acknowledgment of anyone who doesn't agree with their delusion. Just the same silly cheerleading and forum bombardment over and over and over and over and over and .........Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaimWitz
Eventually they will learn a basic fact of life. Just wanting something to happen and making positive claims doesn't create a reality. It is just dreaming. Making dreams real takes a lot more. Results occur when people analyze the facts objectively, ask the hard questions, weight the pro's and con's, make accurate forecasts, get the right resources in place and ACT.
While the dreamers are quite literally flooding this forum with overly optimistic fantasy, the real CC just appears to be sitting. No response from anyone from CC about the recent articles and statements from the CC stalwarts like Walker and Wiggins, no announcements of future plans, no nothing. Why would anyone with a brain think this is a positive sign? Anyone who has ever had the misfortune to work for a failing company in its death throes can see the warning signs. When the bosses stop communicating, and the only future is the day after today because all of the effort is putting out today's bonfire, there is no long term future.
Unless something drastically changes, the question is not if, but when the end will come. What a sad legacy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachbum
Not the same koolaid!! I don't believe that Champcar is trying to fool all of us, (aside from all of the IRL fans who refuse to leave this forum) that the series doesn't have any isuues that need to be dealt with. However, I do think that if Champcar doesn't change the way in which they promote the series, and totally revamp the organization of advertising and funding into a department that is heavily focused on promoting for the life of the series (much like the NFL does) then the series certainly isn't going to advance into anything but what it is now!!!!
We all know the potential of this series, and that is exactly why I am a loyal follower of Champcar. I have seen their distant past, and hopefully will see the distant future. Champcar is exciting!
KK, put your money where your mouth is, and you will see the series reach out to where it belongs!
Been reading this thread since the beginning, very entertaining, and a lot of good info/thoughts...
This Sanguin character though...wow...he's brought people I've read for years, and know to be CC die hards, against him and his ridiculous assertions.
My .02cents for "what happens next": ChampCar folds this offseason or hangs on another year as a viable entity in the United States. After that they have to go international to survive, and with mostly U.S. based teams, this seems a stretch.
In my opinion the IRL's movement towards road and street course racing was the death nail for CC in the U.S. Regardless of CC's horrible mismanagement, ride buyers, oval abandonment, etc. This single factor, combined with the defections doomed them to the margins of the U.S. racing scene. They've lost touch with their history, they've lost their uniqueness, so...what do they have?
When you combine the Indy 500, the "names", and a true commitement to the U.S. market, how can CC hope to actually beat IndyCar's in the states? It just doesn't make sense.
Ideally, CC's death will see a return to even more historic road racing venues for AOWR. We won't see 1990's greatness again, but we can see something far better than the current mediocre state, with everyone fleeing to NASCAR, weak spec cars, and pathetic infighting.
I now smell burning Champ Car toast in Las Vegas (not surprising) and at one of the Canadian venues (surprising). I am hearing that the Amigo's toaster may be on fire in China (not surprising) and in Europe as well (surprising). If the latter is true, what happens next? Where does Champ Car go to find the sanction fees to stay alive?
Then there is the A1GP + Ferrari announcement. That development must complicate things for the Amigos and their faltering international strategy.
I also hear that RuSport is not the only team on the edge of oblivion. I think we should all get ready for some more bad news. For those who want links, we will all no doubt get them soon enough.
The fact that the final two races of the year are actually going to take place as scheduled can't be the only good news. In most professional series, that is a given. Where is the new series sponsor or the new teams or all the new venues for 2008? We should know soon if all these positive rumors where only phantoms at the end of a horrible nightmare or if they are indeed real, ensuring Champ Car's salvation (again). Sadly, the only Champ Car rumors that seem to come true these days are the negative ones.
I ask again: Can someone please make a rational case for Champ Car's long term survival and prosperity?
Been also following this stuff and while some are rumors, these days, bad rumors seem to play out. look to Rocketsports to say bye-bye. I wrote this morning that I thought the Ferrari announcement was a really bad bit of news for the Amigos...notwithstanding Bernie, who has no fond thoughts of KK, David Clare is no doubt gloating at A1 and is likely looking at other venues and schedules as we write...I told our new comedian Sanguin that the next 60 days will prove out a lot of this stuff...today, I think it may be sooner (though I'm sticking to my original prediction :) )Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaimWitz
WOW!!!
You guys are all soo important, I don't know who I should believe!!! :rolleyes: