If they promote Meeke to the full time testing role, they could try two young guys against each other on the same event.
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If they promote Meeke to the full time testing role, they could try two young guys against each other on the same event.
http://www.rallyargentina.com/wp-con...-List-RA14.pdf
40 entries for Argentina, but only 11 WRC
many many "spelling mistakes" at the list
thank to Chile and Paraguay to still run FIA homologated cars ...
I think they (spectators or crew) slowed him down there first loop because Evens off ..Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanvv
Then, Hyundai Test Days Video with Hayden Paddon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS6xMxVk-m4
Honestly, I don't think Citroën care too much about their WRC project at the moment. They had a massively good start to their WTCC campaign and there is honestly no reason for them to be in the WRC anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeakiwi
Crash Meeke is rubbish and should be replaced by Bouffier to try something new. I have a feeling that Argentina will be Meekes last event for the team. Østberg is doing quite well, but Citroën's main problem is that Ogier will dominate the sport for years to come and there are no drivers good enough to give him a run for his money, unless FIA once again try all their rule tricks like they did for M-Sport to make Hirvonen a "fake" contender with favorable road positions and almost equal points for 2nd and 1st place in the WRC events.
I think Citroën kind of thought that it would be okay to run in the WRC half-hearted as Abu Dhabi Tourism pay all the bills, but this half-hearted commitment is not good for their brand, and not good for the sport either. I hope they will leave the WRC at the end of the year because this isn't good for anybody.
Let the other PSA brand Peugeot give it a try now that PSA has secured a massive chinese investment. That has removed the companys fear of a collaps. Furthermore, Peugeot trditionally is less focussed on being "french" as their export markets are quite different from Citroëns, so they might be able to enter with a different philosophy and find a setup that can beat VW and Ogier.
I expect we will hear over the next month that Hyundai have ditched all their test drivers from last year finally. Bouffier is gone, Juho looks like he is out, and I am expecting Atko to also hear bad news.
Those WTCC races must have been the most boring races I've ever witnessed, the most exiting thing was watching Tom Coronel making a fool of himself blaming the other guy when he was the one that drove into him. Doubt Loeb will find it interesting very long.
While I agree Citroen's half heartened effort does not put them in a good light I disagree it would be better for the sport if they retired. The car is still competitive and being there means two more factory drives. If they retired the championship would be even more unbalanced toward VW. If getting podiums is enough for them then I definitely prefer guys like Ostberg having a decent drive. Citroen retiring would not automatically mean Peugeot coming in to replace them.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
Peugeot coming back with a stronger effort would be nice indeed, however there's not certain sign of that at the moment, it depends a lot on the new technical regulations probably, so far they're promoting their R5 and maybe if the new tech regs are similar to that then there's a better chance.
I think Peugeot will replace Citroen in the championship sooner than later. In the last couple of months we have seen an huge effort from Peugeot on offroad motorsport in general.
First they introduce the 208 R5, which looks competitive out of the box, and later they unveil their Dakar project, which leads me to believe that their motorsport budget is far from being small.
Maybe Peugeot left endurance circuit to focus entirely on rally and Dakar, and they will leave the circuits for Citroen.
To me Citroen cars were always the more "exclusive" side of PSA's technology, and circuits may suit their market's better. Peugeot was and still is in my heart that little crazy brother of Citroen, moche more extreme and rebelious. Peugeot is in my opinion much more suited for extreme sports such as rally and off-road.
I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
PS: It's Citroën that's the smaller company of the two, so they would be the "little brother".
But one thing that's important to notice is that Citroën wanted to enter WTCC because of the global exposure to the right markets. For PSA it's still an issue that WRC is so focused on low growth (or even recession) countries in Europe. Only 3 rallies are outside Europe where Australis is one of them ... but it has no relevance to PSA. Mexico is good for PSA but Argentina isn't. The country has been in recession for 15 years or so because the two corrupt Kirchner idiots have ruined any chance of growth. Instead they steal foreign companies and make them goverend by the state (ref. to Repsol).
It's quite insane that WRC doesn't have a single round in Asia IMO. That might prevent Peugeot from entering...
PS: Please also notice that according to very reliable sources then both KIA and Alfa Romeo will join WTCC next year. That will give the series 6 manufacturers...
The championship already had a round in Japan, and I remember hearing that China was also trying to host a candidate round. I also agree that there should be a rally thereaboutsQuote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
Other thing to take in consideration is that European markets will not be in recession forever, the periods after a big recession are always good for business. I am sure PSA will want to take advantage of that. Is Argentina not an importante market for Citroen? The fact that they took Loeb there last year might suggest otherwise.
We will see how things stand in the next couple of years. I agree that the biggest mistake in the calendar is the missing an Asia round, other than that I do not see any interest in taking the championship to any other place.
Im curious to see what studies have those brands entering WTCC read to conclude the championship is good for marketing, data I have seen suggest WTCC is far from being a marketing powerhouse.
Citroen chose to enter WTCC to keep hold of Loeb, and it was the only form of circuit racing they could realistically enter with their cars.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
Argentina is a massive market for both Citroen and Peugeot. It's a big 'tick' on the WRC for them.
OH, and WTCC only has 3 manufacturers in it at the moment - Lada, Honda and now Citroen.
Chevy and Seat are privately run operations, and i don't think BMW even has a new generation car available....
Africa is the next big thing ... the car market has a lof of potential, and nothing is done there. Moreover people are big fan of motorsport, and especially rally there. And it's the best place to promote rally car ... WRC should come back there.
+ Alfa Romeo and KIA that will join next year.Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
The 6 RML run Chevrolet's are TC1 spec and I didn't count BMW and SEAT as they are old non-factory backed spec in TC2.
No doubt it's one of their better markets, but it's not that massive, simply because there are 'only' 41 mio people living in Argentina ... there is 1.35 billion living in China. Citroën did say at the launch of their WTCC campaign that the fact that WTCC has 2 races in China (1 in mainland and 1 in Macau) were the most important thing for switching.Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
It's not Japan that they are interested in. The fact that they sell more diapers (Source: Unilever & P&G) to old people in Japan than to babies say all about how non-interesting that country is. It's China, South Korea, India, Vietnam, Laos, Malaysia, Myanmar etc. that are interesting from a marketing point of view. According to the OECD Asia as a region will grow economically the most over the next 20 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
This documentary - which I think is brilliant - tells you why it's Asia that's interesting and why WRC are in all the wrong places.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mz_kn45qIvI
Dong Feng are getting involved with PSA. I wonder if DF will get Peugeot Sport to make a Dakar race truck for them.
http://autonews.gasgoo.com/china-new...a-140415.shtml
I would expect World Rally cross to go (in the future) someplace like China(a stadium with controlled conditions) - where all the cars and equipment can be shifted with a one or two plane airlift.(like the aussie v8s have done to Texas or to the Middle East)
And here is a recent BBC article on PSA recovery plans for Citroen and Peugeot http://www.bbc.com/news/business-27020021
Not sure where you are getting your information from, but it's wrong. PSA are going hard trying to keep Renault from taking over the lead as the best selling French car in Australia. On the back of marketing from Mark Webber, Renault increased its market share by 37%, and is the second biggest Renault market in the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
PSA recognise their fleet has been 'on the nose' with Australians for years and are ramping up marketing to achieve a 25% growth.
Asia Pacific is a difficult region to do business in. The roads and weather are harsh. And the Asian car makers rule the roost.
No it isn't (It's my job and I have access to a lot more info about this than you do). You are just looking at the numbers the wrong way. Look at volume instead of percentages. Citroën sold app. 1600-1800 cars in Australia last year, and yes it's correct that it's a sales-increase in percentages, but what Citroën in targeting in yearly sales in China is 250.000 - 300.000. That should give you an indication how unimportant Australia are in terms of overall sales.Quote:
Originally Posted by litifeta
So it's good for Citroën that they have increased sales in Australia, but in terms of revenue it's not an important market compared with the market where Citroën have their future focus .... and in the end why they decided to focus on WTCC instead of WRC.
The company I work distributes PSA throughout Asia. I can promise you we look at our markets strategically, not individually or by brand. Sales in China and sales in Australia are both important to us. Australia serves as the base for the development of our processes, methods, and systems. Each country has something to offer. You might also like to check the location of PSA factories around the world, and see what PSA has from India through to Japan.
You may also be surprised to know that Australia gets lots of events, not because it is a great host, but because the wealthy Asian middle classes prefer to have the excuse to travel to Australia, rather than watch something on their own soil.
The Asia Pacific is nothing like Europe. Nothinng is what is seems on face value, and there are lots of mysterious relationships.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/113642
Ah, disaster averted....... for now.
I'm not totally sure if each side really knows what it wants - and if it is deliverable. With the formation of a FiA RallyX series, the WRC should be trying to make itself different from that sport. So longer, tougher events.
Rally Australia have announced details of the Hyundai Super Special Stage. It will be located adjacent to the Service Park. It will be the 3rd service park and 3rd special stage location in 3 editions of Rally Australia in Coffs Harbour.
It appears spectators will have much better viewing options than the 2011 "jetty" Super Special Stage when cars were out of sight more than they were in sight. The course looks like it will be much better challenge for drivers than 2013 "Brelsford Park Velodrome" Super special. The new SSS will include several jumps.
In a change from 2011 and 2013 when the rally opened with 2 x SSS's on Thursday night. Organisers are only talking about SSS being used Friday & Saturday night. It would seem 2014 Rally Oz will open with proper special stages on the Friday morning rather than SSS's as in previous years.
http://www.rallyaustralia.com.au/hyu...lenge-drivers/
No Novikov at Finland
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes...and/index.html
Oh dear... Capito and promoter still insist on final day shootout...
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/113703
The potential for a single-stage shoot-out to decide overall positions on World Rally Championship rounds is under discussion again, with a decision expected in September.
The plan to radically revise the format of WRC rounds, first talked about 12 months ago, was a centre point of the meeting between manufacturers and the WRC Promoter firm last week.
The need for change to the final day of rallies is one of the areas where the two parties are completely aligned.
"This is an open discussion at the moment," said WRC Promoter chief Oliver Ciesla, "but the intention is to increase the drama and increase the attractiveness of this decisive final moment of each rally - and to develop a media moment which leads us to a new level of audience.
"We are talking with all stakeholders in order to find out how that format will be developed to fulfill the needs of what the WRC is; the needs of the audience to create more drama and to make it fair in the eyes of the sporting participants."
Ciesla said change would not be coming before the start of next season.
"The intention is to change for next year," he said. "This is a creative process to find the solution. We are taking input from all sides and we then try to convert it and amalgamate it into the current format for implementation next year.
"We do not expect these changes to come before Monte Carlo 2015.
Archive opinion: Radical change is WRC's only hope
"All proposals have to be made for September's World Motor Sport Council meeting. After that meeting, we could be in a position to make some amendments public. And, for some of the rallies early in 2015, changes could come at too short notice, so there would be a transition period."
Volkswagen's Jost Capito was one of the original architects of the plan and remains committed to it.
"For the general public, we are still in favour of the proposal we put forward of two long days of the rally followed by a Sunday with a final shootout with the top 10 fighting out their positions on one stage - where they can win or lose only one position," he said.
"This could be put in a one-hour television programme, which everybody would understand and is exciting for everybody involved.
"It's also very important for the manufacturers that this kind of programme could be understood by those people who are not the hardcore rally fans - this would help to bring them into our sport."
Time to put on those T-shirts from last year again!!
It's time to wonder if RedBull actually understand the WRC......
Whats worse is the people who think its a good idea. Utterly ridiculous.
Fawking idiots.
The sad state of 4 paid drivers, only maybe 2 capable of winning, 30 car entry fields, spectators fleeing, almost all stems from people listening to Media Types...especially media types with megalomania and delusions of grandeur.
I am generally not an advocate of violence but not dogmatic in anything.
Somebody, somebody with an empty warehouse and some chains and special tools needs to get the Media Wh***s, chain them down and then beat them bloody and senseless---the old break them down then when they are physically and mentally jelly, then bring them back and say "Your job is to make a story of what is THERE, in this case rally---an event which combines speed with endurance and the need for teamwork, and flexibility---so spot thinking your promotional ideas can be over laid on everything.....or these "discussions" will continue...Go to America and advise them what to do with their "Globular Wally Closs", they have no idea what they're doing so they'll welcome your overblown-make-everything-for-the-ignorant-fawks-gawking-at-a-TV ideas.." Then WHAM! WHAM! a couple of blows to sharpen his concentration--"Do you understand endurance now?" WHAM! across the chops "Understand your role---promotion---not deciding direction."
Ahh in a perfect world.
In case you can't guess I am sick of stupid, moronic, air-headed advertising ass-wipes thinking they know what active motorsport people "need".
Fawkin morons.
Pathetic idea!! Hate it with a passion!
If cars driving past dosn't interest people, how the bloody hell is that going to make them suddenly watch?! I like the current cars, but Fiestas etc don't interest the casual fan, so maybe looking at changes to that would help make the WRC popular again?
And they can shove the idea for 2 day events up their arses too! If people can watch boring "sports" like cricket for 5 days, then 3 day events are more than fine!
I saw somebody post something on Twitter (it may have been RallyTravel); it's like deciding the 3 week Tour de France with a 100m sprint on the final day.
I've compared it to deciding Le Mans in the last 10 mins.... fastest lap wins, despite the 2nd car being 3 laps down.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyRAC
Agreed. This is fucking farcical. Why not just go all the way and make every rally only one stage long? Capito, shove it up your ass.
This guys know nothing about rally, only good menagers...
So is the plan to have all the cars at half speed for 20 ss, to save the car, and then go for it on the last one?
you can only fight for the spot ahead of you, so they wish that the 2 days of rallying will not be just cruising... i do not like the concept but it is not entirely flawed, definatelly different from what we are used to and contrary to the philosophy of rallying but the thing is that the final day will be full of action....Quote:
Originally Posted by Sulland