F1 2010: Testing sessions thread

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Originally Posted by henners88

That was also the point I was trying to make. I have no doubt it is the best car Fernando has driven but at this early stage, he like ourselves do not know how it will fair once in a proper race situation. Saying he is a double WDC to back up the fact that Alonso has made a claim is silly really. Schuey once said that he expected Liuzzi to be a WDC and a major force in F1 after he beat Schuey at a Karting event in 2001. Schuey also reckoned Button would be his toughest rival in the coming years prior to the 2004 season. F1 drivers have a better insight than any of us, but they can also make claims designed to get coverage going into a season like the one coming up.

Lots of fuss and claims have been thrown around about the lap times of the Ferrari, but it has not been the fastest overall in the 3 tests. The Mclaren has topped the time sheets twice, but we have no idea what fuel load and instructions were given to make this the case. I'm not getting my hopes up over a fast time when there are many factors to take into consideration this season regarding maintaining a lead throughout each race. One blog says its the Ferrari, another says its the Mclaren, Alonso is confident with his car, Hamilton is bigging up his. Its all banter until we know for sure, and the team best set up at the start will not necessarily be the best come the season close. :)

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And there is the usual double standard also - Alonso claims it is the best car and OMG!! watch out all!, similarly if Schumacher had set quickest time at Jerez it would have been heralded from the rooftops and "poor Nico" and the eigth title is on the way.

Instead Button sets the quickest time of the whole eight days at Jerez almost a second quicker, the Mclaren team reportedly try and contain their happiness and what happens?

Oh Mclaren were on low fuel and must have been time of day and so on. Button? Who? As usual.

Of course if precious little Lewis had set the time there would have been wakes held over Jenson's career at Mclaren.

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Originally Posted by Saint Devote

And there is the usual double standard also - Alonso claims it is the best car and OMG!! watch out all!, similarly if Schumacher had set quickest time at Jerez it would have been heralded from the rooftops and "poor Nico" and the eigth title is on the way.

Instead Button sets the quickest time of the whole eight days at Jerez almost a second quicker, the Mclaren team reportedly try and contain their happiness and what happens?

Oh Mclaren were on low fuel and must have been time of day and so on. Button? Who? As usual.

Of course if precious little Lewis had set the time there would have been wakes held over Jenson's career at Mclaren.

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Yes, this is true. But hopefully Jenson will prove his critics wrong. We have to remember that Hakkinen had only one gifted win prior to 1998 and in his time, when he was winning it was always the car and never the driver. But now he is considered to be a F1 legend and one of the fastest guys ever... On the other hand Damon, who was also a brilliant driver (I think that he has more wins than Hakkinen, BTW) is still underestimated.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

I disagree vehemently. Michael has faced Ayrton,

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Yep, wiping Ayrton out several times in one race, that had to be restarted as a result.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

Alain

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,

At the end of his career

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Originally Posted by F1boat

Nige

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, at the end of his career in F1.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

Damon, the impossibly fast Mika Hakkinen, the crazy Montoya, his own brother, who was no slouch, Kimi... he has no reason the fear a bunch of kids ;) Although I do admit that Alonso and Lewis are formidable rivals.

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These are better representatives.

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Originally Posted by Saint Devote

And there is the usual double standard also - Alonso claims it is the best car and OMG!! watch out all!, similarly if Schumacher had set quickest time at Jerez it would have been heralded from the rooftops and "poor Nico" and the eigth title is on the way.

Instead Button sets the quickest time of the whole eight days at Jerez almost a second quicker, the Mclaren team reportedly try and contain their happiness and what happens?

Oh Mclaren were on low fuel and must have been time of day and so on. Button? Who? As usual.

Of course if precious little Lewis had set the time there would have been wakes held over Jenson's career at Mclaren.

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You spend too much time thinking......

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

You is missing the point brother.

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Not really. The original point raised was that no one believed Fred that the F10 was proper quick. As you say, none of us norms know the answer to any of the questions you mentioned, however its a fair bet that Ferrari (and the other teams) have a pretty large amount of data allowing them to draw conclusions on their pace. For Fred to go from saying in the first test "Ok, we are fastest but I'm keeping my feet on the ground" to "OMG this car is freakin' awesome" after the latest test (ok so not his exact words) suggests to me he has every reason to believe what he is saying.

My point was that he is experienced enough to be believed and not have interweb hacks pretending they know more than him or the Ferrari team.

All that said I still expect McLaren, RBR and Merc to have a serious say in who takes home the silverware this year.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

Yes, this is true. But hopefully Jenson will prove his critics wrong. We have to remember that Hakkinen had only one gifted win prior to 1998 and in his time, when he was winning it was always the car and never the driver. But now he is considered to be a F1 legend and one of the fastest guys ever... On the other hand Damon, who was also a brilliant driver (I think that he has more wins than Hakkinen, BTW) is still underestimated.

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My sentiments exactly :D

But part of the whole configured Schumacher religion. I am a great defender of Damon's honor and his father would have been immensely proud of him.

Damon epitomizes character. In 1995 after Australia there was not a whine, a complaint an accusation or anything else that is common with too many these days. Just the Hill look and Graham was surely smiling in motor racing heaven that day!

One more win to Damon - ought to have been TWO - that brilliant drive at Hungaroring :s mokin:

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Originally Posted by henners88

Indeed there would, but I must be honest if Lewis had have set a quicker time in the wet conditions compared to Button's dry run, that would be wholely justified.. :p

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Top gear power board anyone? ;)

Jenson has always proved his critics wrong.

Anyone requiring "proof" bow in my view is an ass - Jenson should just ignore them.

He is world champion and Kimi's sentiments are appropriate here.

I am missing the Finn already and it remains a indictment of the people in F1 that he is NOT in one of the best cars this year.

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Originally Posted by Saint Devote

My sentiments exactly :D

But part of the whole configured Schumacher religion. I am a great defender of Damon's honor and his father would have been immensely proud of him.

Damon epitomizes character. In 1995 after Australia there was not a whine, a complaint an accusation or anything else that is common with too many these days. Just the Hill look and Graham was surely smiling in motor racing heaven that day!

One more win to Damon - ought to have been TWO - that brilliant drive at Hungaroring :s mokin:

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I agree about Hungary. It was an amazing drive. I have to say that part of my immense dislike to JV is probably that lucky win. And I agree that Damon was very, very fast, on his day unbeatable. And I really really can't understand the argument that he is bad, because he is slower than Michael. Michael is or at least was the best driver ever, in my opinion. There is nothing wrong to be slower than him. It is like to say - silver is not as precious as gold, so it is useless...

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Originally Posted by F1boat

And I really really can't understand the argument that he is bad, because he is slower than Michael. Michael is or at least was the best driver ever, in my opinion. There is nothing wrong to be slower than him. It is like to say - silver is not as precious as gold, so it is useless...

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Because Damon was impotent in 1995 and should've won WDC.

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Originally Posted by wedge

Damon was impotent in 1995.

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Oh dear, was he wearing his jeans too tight or sommat?

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Originally Posted by henners88

Oh god, don't open that can of worms buddy.. :p

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;)

Seriously though, Jenson can build a legacy for himself this season. If he can compete with pretty boy Lewy or even beat him reputation will be enhanced. Or he'll get his doors blow off and he'll be remembered as a driver who had the good fortune to sit in a good car when all of the best rivals got lumbered with dogs.

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Originally Posted by Sonic

;)

Seriously though, Jenson can build a legacy for himself this season. If he can compete with pretty boy Lewy or even beat him reputation will be enhanced. Or he'll get his doors blow off and he'll be remembered as a driver who had the good fortune to sit in a good car when all of the best rivals got lumbered with dogs.

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Best driver in the best car wins the WDC - I'd go with that.

Average driver in best car wins - he'd have a shot, but I dare guess he'd make too many mistakes.

Best driver in an average car wins - probably.

Now, turn to team mates.

Best two drivers in a team. Who wins the WDC?????

Only once has this scenario occured in my time watching F1 - 1988. Prost v Senna, both at the top of their game.

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Best driver in the best car wins the WDC - I'd go with that.

Average driver in best car wins - he'd have a shot, but I dare guess he'd make too many mistakes.

Best driver in an average car wins - probably.

Now, turn to team mates.

Best two drivers in a team. Who wins the WDC?????

Only once has this scenario occured in my time watching F1 - 1988. Prost v Senna, both at the top of their game.

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And we all know how that worked out ;)

Going to be a great season.

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Originally Posted by Sonic

And we all know how that worked out ;)

Going to be a great season.

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Well, it was all quite amicable up to that point. '89 is when it all went Pete Tong.

The point to my ditty of course is that, for the first time in I don't know how long, the outgoing and incoming WDC's are in the same team.

If you assume the WDC is the best driver, we are, as you suggest, in for a good'un

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Originally Posted by wedge

Because Damon was impotent in 1995 and should've won WDC.

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Benetton Renault was WCC champions as well, so I don't think that the advantage was only because of the driver. Don't get me wrong - I do rate Michael higher than Damon, but the 1995 Benetton was a very strong team. IMO it was to Williams like Ferrari to McLaren in 2000.

Not sure about that. DC (hardly a out and out speedster) had three poles on the trot early in the early races that year (from memory). It was a stonking car and Damon fluffed it.

I say this as a huge Damon fan and at the time I wouldn't hear a word against him, however hindsight is a magical thing and with it benefits I can see just how badly the Williams drivers performed in 1995.

Ok, I apologise but I have not been keeping up with F1. :) Could someone break down the testing times and list whos been fastest to slowest? :)

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Originally Posted by Kevincal

Ok, I apologise but I have not been keeping up with F1. :) Could someone break down the testing times and list whos been fastest to slowest? :)

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That still won't tell you who is actually fastest.

Mclaren and Ferrari and Red Bull have topped the times, but it is really the long-distance runs that would give a better indication of competitiveness.

In that department, it has been reported that Ferrari are looking very strong. Something Button concurs with.

Apparently, some Mclaren fans on here don't believe him, as they are better qualified.

Thank you Tamburello, exactly what I was looking for! ;)

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Originally Posted by tamburello

That still won't tell you who is actually fastest.

Mclaren and Ferrari and Red Bull have topped the times, but it is really the long-distance runs that would give a better indication of competitiveness.

In that department, it has been reported that Ferrari are looking very strong. Something Button concurs with.

Apparently, some Mclaren fans on here don't believe him, as they are better qualified.

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Well, we have an indication of race competitiveness from the long runs.

What we don't know of course, and is the subject of much debate, is out and out qualifying pace - for which you need a car that heats its tyres well.

Of course, a car that heats the tyres well, has the tendency to bugger them over a race stint.

What you need, is a happy medium.

Where are you moored today Tamb, Serpentine?

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Originally Posted by F1boat

I disagree vehemently. Michael has faced Ayrton, Alain, Nige, Damon, the impossibly fast Mika Hakkinen, the crazy Montoya, his own brother, who was no slouch, Kimi... he has no reason the fear a bunch of kids ;) Although I do admit that Alonso and Lewis are formidable rivals.

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add vettlel, massa, webber, button, and his own teammate rosberg to that list.

I think Schumi faces some stiff competition and even more some other cars that seem equally as good and potentially better than his own. But yeah, he has faced some really good competition in the past, Add Damon, Villeneuve, JPM, Hakkinnen, Alonso, Berger, Prost, etc

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Originally Posted by Kevincal

Ok, I apologise but I have not been keeping up with F1. :) Could someone break down the testing times and list whos been fastest to slowest? :)

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my friend, there are 30 pages to read ;)

get a good glass of wine and get caught up...or forget about everything so far and look at Barcelona this week as really the only true testing sessions with meaningful comparisons and analysis to be made

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Originally Posted by truefan72

add vettlel, massa, webber, button, and his own teammate rosberg to that list.

I think Schumi faces some stiff competition and even more some other cars that seem equally as good and potentially better than his own. But yeah, he has faced some really good competition in the past, Add Damon, Villeneuve, JPM, Hakkinnen, Alonso, Berger, Prost, etc

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My point is that I agree with him when he said that the era now is undoubtedly tough, but tougher than before - no? Maybe if he wasn't there with his dominant Ferrari Rubens and Montoya would have been champions, for example.

F1 2010 Pre-Season Testing, Barcelona: 25th February

Lineup:
McLaren – Jenson Button
Mercedes– Nico Rosberg
Red Bull – Mark Webber
Ferrari – Fernando Alonso
Williams – Nico Hülkenberg
BMW Sauber– Pedro de la Rosa
Renault– Vitaly Petrov
Force India– Vitantonio Liuzzi
Toro Rosso – Jaime Alguersuari
Virgin – TBA
Lotus – Fairuz Fauzy

Full up today then as all the Spaniards go to watch their idol Alonso,I also believe MS will have a hard year this year as the cars are more equal,and the yougsters will not be afraid of giving him a hard time.He needs to be as good as Hamilton ,Vettel ,Alonso,and maybe Rosberg

At least it's sunny and dry today, so we should get some proper running in.

Pretty uneventful so far: Fauzy and Alonso have both caused red flags, the former with hydraulic pressure problems, other than that nothing to write home about.

Lunch break. Times so far:


1 Webber Red Bull 1m21.487s
2 Rosberg Mercedes 1m22.514s +1.027
3 Hulkenberg Williams 1m22.684s +1.197
4 de la Rosa Sauber 1m23.321s +1.834
5 Alonso Ferrari 1m24.580s +3.093
6 Button McLaren 1m24.582s +3.095
7 Alguersuari Toro Rosso 1m24.869s +3.382
8 Liuzzi Force India 1m25.303s +3.816
9 Petrov Renault 1m26.208s +4.721
10 Di Grassi Virgin 1m27.057s +5.570
11 Fauzy Lotus 1m29.795s +8.308

No more running for di Grassi after he damaged his Virgin just before lunch and caused another red flag.

Alonso's earlier stoppage was down to an electrical failure, according to to @InsideFerrari.

Interesting. Nobody at the track has reported that, and blown engines are usually (but I accept not always) pretty obvious.

Don't know whether it was Ferrari, or perhaps it was the Alfa team, in the mid-80's, but they never had engine failures despite evidence of smoke and/or a trail of oil and/or engine bits being left on the track after an 'explosion'. It was always an "electrical" fault, or some other reason, which explained things :p

Yup, usually along the lines of a cable being damaged (forgetting to mention that it was caused by a piston going through it)!

A red flag with five minutes to go. Where've we heard that before? Oh yes, almost every session this month!

I wonder if they'll get restarted and if so who'll go for a low-fuel glory run...

Edit: no. Game over.


1 Webber Red Bull 1m21.487s
2 Hulkenberg Williams 1m22.407s +0.920
3 Rosberg Mercedes 1m22.514s +1.027
4 de la Rosa Sauber 1m23.144s +1.657
5 Button McLaren 1m23.452s +1.965
6 Liuzzi Force India 1m24.064s +2.577
7 Alonso Ferrari 1m24.170s +2.683
8 Petrov Renault 1m24.173s +2.686
9 Alguersuari Toro Rosso 1m24.869s +3.382
10 Di Grassi Virgin 1m27.057s +5.570
11 Fauzy Lotus 1m28.002s +6.515

RBR looking impressive IMO.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

RBR looking impressive IMO.

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http://scienceblogs.com/startswithab...arth-vader.jpg

Yeah Dave, I have to agree.
It's sort of frustrating that in every test session so far there's always some kind of problem at the end that prevents the drivers to try and get a single fast lap. Boring, isn't it?

I wonder how they will feel in Q1 in Bahrain, being the first time they really need to push for a time. Will we see the real car deficiencies there?

@GloomyDay: lol :D

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Originally Posted by henners88

The Ferrari wheel covers seem to have raised a few eyebrows. I wonder if they'll be present come Bahrain?

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I had a quick look at the new rules after I saw the picture of those... looks to me like they'll be clearly legal provided they're an integral part of the wheel (not a separate component) and are recessed at least 25mm in from the outer face of the wheel.

From the shape I would hazard a guess that they're more about brake cooling than drag... just a guess though, I'm no expert.

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Originally Posted by F1boat

RBR looking impressive IMO.

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A bit premature. McLaren & Ferrari have yet to show their hand against each other

Rules? Gary Anderson reckons that there is going to be a real mess when the teams all expose their diffusers to scrutiny.

The whiny babies of F1, Ferrari, already fired the first shot a few weeks ago with their dark mutterings.

Anderson thinks the fins are ugly and ought to be banned by the FIA. He says they are useful signboards.

But I wonder how a team like Ferrari will react if Red Bull and Mclaren do all the running at Sakhir?