The Ferrari thread !

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Originally Posted by henners88

Sorry if this has been extensively discussed before couldn't find anything...

So can the wheel trim flying off Badoer's car be treated in the same way as the incident with Renault? Wondered at the time what the people slating the FIA's decision regarding Renault had a different one now a similar incident is related to Ferrari??


Any thoughts?

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I don't remember Ferrari sending him out on track knowing full well that the part was not well attached to the car.
Than there's a difference between a wheel and a wheel fairing.

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Originally Posted by ioan

I don't remember Ferrari sending him out on track knowing full well that the part was not well attached to the car.
Than there's a difference between a wheel and a wheel fairing.

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But that fairing could have flown off into the crowd and seriously hurt someone. Is that not a sufficient level of risk to justify the imposition of a ban on something or other?

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Originally Posted by BDunnell

But that fairing could have flown off into the crowd and seriously hurt someone. Is that not a sufficient level of risk to justify the imposition of a ban on something or other?

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Nobody said jack when Nakajima drove around Valencia with his rear tyre disentegrating.

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Originally Posted by tamburello

Nobody said jack when Nakajima drove around Valencia with his rear tyre disentegrating.

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Was there a risk the wheel would fall off?

There was a risk of shards of carbon fibre being scattered, but hey, if cars bump into each other there is just as much risk of that, isn't there? They still race don't they? Contact is still made, isn't it?

I do not think there is enough cotton wool in the world to make open seater racing safe beyond all doubt......

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Originally Posted by tamburello

Nobody said jack when Nakajima drove around Valencia with his rear tyre disentegrating.

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Not to mention that BDunnell has been vehemently posting in the thread about security that there should be no reaction to parts flying of the cars.

Talk about double measures.

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Was there a risk the wheel would fall off?

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There was a great big chunk of Bridgestone left in the road. Imagine what that could do to an unsighted driver.

True, things fall of race cars all the time, but if we are going to have the consistency that most people seem to want, then consistency should have been applied to Nakajima.

That nobody said anything does seem odd.

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

I do not think there is enough cotton wool in the world to make open seater racing safe beyond all doubt......

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You are underestimating the cotton wool production by a huge margin. ;)

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Originally Posted by henners88

Indeed this should be deemed dangerous too under recent circumstances. The sport certainly shows elements of paranoia. The one arguement could be that a desentegrated tyre is less aerodynamic so would lose velocity very quickly compared to a wheel fairing which would act like a frisbee. I'm not to judge however, but without pointing the finger, people were keen to call for the hangman when Renault were at fault but seem to side step the incident with Ferrari.. Strange indeed..

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Maybe open-wheel type of cars should be banned altogether since there is always a possibility of something falling of the car. Come on lads, this ain't going nowhere. FIA does what it does and we are stuck with it.

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Originally Posted by henners88

You didn't sense the element of sarcasm in my post then?
I was merely saying that the sport has now become paranoid about dangers on the track since the Surtees and Massa incidents. I was also suggesting that people on this forum will point the finger at one team and then by rotten luck, their favs do a similar thing and all of a sudden theres a reasonable answer.. Just laughing at the irony.. :)

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I read it too quickly :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by henners88

II'm not to judge however, but without pointing the finger, people were keen to call for the hangman when Renault were at fault but seem to side step the incident with Ferrari.. Strange indeed..

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No offence, but do you have a link to an article about Badoer's incident. I've not heard about it.

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Originally Posted by tamburello

No offence, but do you have a link to an article about Badoer's incident. I've not heard about it.

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Apparently, there is this great site called youtube....., or I am sure Auntie will have the full race still on Iplayer.

I want to ask you guys what names are hearing for replacing Badoer this time?
Our Ferrari must ends in 3rd place so we need some points from the 2nd Ferrari driver!
It seems ''iceman'' woke up and can take pondiums but alone can't make something goog...

Sir Jimmy Saville?

How's about that now then now then boys and girls.

I've fixed it for you, Stefano Dominicale.....

And, then you can take the whole race team on a roller coaster, while eating a packed lunch.

Sorry, as you were everyone!!! ;)

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Sir Jimmy Saville?

How's about that now then now then boys and girls.

I've fixed it for you, Stefano Dominicale.....

And, then you can take the whole race team on a roller coaster, while eating a packed lunch.

Sorry, as you were everyone!!! ;)

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What's that post means??

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Originally Posted by jimakos

What's that post means??

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Nothing buddy, I was poking fun in Ferrari's direction. Along the lines of 'you can not do any more damage than has already been done'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wwPeSDCCAs

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Nothing buddy, I was poking fun in Ferrari's direction. Along the lines of 'you can not do any more damage than has already been done'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wwPeSDCCAs

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Thanks for being such a swell guy helping someone who doesn't use English as a first language. :up:
And me thinkig you were a capo in the Anglo/Mafia :(

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Originally Posted by Tazio

And me thinkig you were a capo in the Anglo/Mafia :(

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Nah, I just make the tea.

(or should that be Espresso?)

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Nah, I just make the tea.

(or should that be Espresso?)

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No it's most definately tea. (as if you didn't know) Don't play coy with me mister.
There a war going on and I make it a point to know where wise guys sympathies lie.
So your an up and comer! Did Ron have you infiltrate this thred???
I Knew it. Certain types don't make it out of here alive :uhoh:




http://twoons.com/wp-content/uploads...hit-twoons.jpg

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Originally Posted by Tazio

No it's most definately tea. (as if you didn't know) Don't play coy with me mister.
There a war going on and I make it a point to know where wise guys sympathies lie.
So your an up and comer! Did Ron have you infiltrate this thred???
I Knew it. Certain types don't make it out of here alive :uhoh:




http://twoons.com/wp-content/uploads...hit-twoons.jpg

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Ssshhhhhh.

The bicycle is shining on my knee.

I was in Spa last weekend. And as a Ferrari fan, I didn't mind he took over the first place :D

I made a movie from it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co9oghHdI-k Sure Raikkonen is still populair

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Originally Posted by Corny

I was in Spa last weekend. And as a Ferrari fan, I didn't mind he took over the first place :D

I made a movie from it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co9oghHdI-k Sure Raikkonen is still populair

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Yea' babe :beer:
That Kimi is a "cold-blooded piece of work" :burnout:
Fisi got smoked on that pass! I almost forgot how badly Kimi punked him :laugh:

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Originally Posted by henners88

Hey Tamb, I've been abit of a sad case I'm afraid... Went home from work and put the quali on the sky+ box, and BANG 16 mins 20 secs in, it shows the Badoer incident... the driver behind was Timo Glock and the wheel fairing hit the air intake above his head.. It will probably be on Youtube over the next week once FOM have stopped blocking the latest videos.. ;)

I'll keep an eye out for links...

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Grazie.

Did Ferrari know it was lose, or was it like Barrichello's spring? If they knew it was loose, then they should have parked it,but if ot just broke in an instant there would be nothing they could do.

Unlike Nakajima's shredding tyre.

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Originally Posted by henners88

I don't get why people are now calling for the teams to be banned or fined now when this happens, or even parking the car just in case.

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I do, it's called 'jumping on the bandwagon'

I'm going to feel a bit empty inside knowing that Ferrari are not going to be competitive at Brazil. Over the past decade they've shown unparalleled prowess at Brazil and now they'll be fighting for scraps.

I hope next year is better. As long as Alonso doesn't throw a fit, it should be fine.

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Originally Posted by gloomyDAY

I'm going to feel a bit empty inside knowing that Ferrari are not going to be competitive at Brazil. Over the past decade they've shown unparalleled prowess at Brazil and now they'll be fighting for scraps.

I hope next year is better. As long as Alonso doesn't throw a fit, it should be fine.

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They didn't improve their cars for almost a couple of month, it was obvious that this would happen.

i don't get the "no development thing"

unless i'm mistaken the aero rules are pretty much the same for next year, the main change being a bigger fuel tank (and probably no Kers), so you'd expect if they are working hard on next years car, and really have written off this years, they'd still bring some of the new aero parts they are working on for next year to get some valuable track testing - even if they don't completely gel with the design philosophy of this years car the ought to be able to get some decent baselines ahead of winter testing of the new car?

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Originally Posted by Robinho

i don't get the "no development thing"

unless i'm mistaken the aero rules are pretty much the same for next year, the main change being a bigger fuel tank (and probably no Kers), so you'd expect if they are working hard on next years car, and really have written off this years, they'd still bring some of the new aero parts they are working on for next year to get some valuable track testing - even if they don't completely gel with the design philosophy of this years car the ought to be able to get some decent baselines ahead of winter testing of the new car?

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Obviously this year's car started on the wrong basis so next year's car will be a completely new concept.
Bolting on parts designed for a different car won't make the F60 any faster, au contraire it will most probably make it slower.
In order to be effective a F1 car's aerodynamics have to be 100% synchronized from the front wing to the rear wing, this means that a new front wing will prompt the use of a different nose cone, different sidepods, different engine cover and rear wing and maybe even a different difuser.

Ferrari simply decided that it's no use to lose valuable CFD and wind tunnel testing time on this year's car but rather use 100% of the already limited use of the aforementioned R&D tools to come up with the best car next season.
This is my view on their approach.

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Originally Posted by ioan

Obviously this year's car started on the wrong basis so next year's car will be a completely new concept.
Bolting on parts designed for a different car won't make the F60 any faster, au contraire it will most probably make it slower.
In order to be effective a F1 car's aerodynamics have to be 100% synchronized from the front wing to the rear wing, this means that a new front wing will prompt the use of a different nose cone, different sidepods, different engine cover and rear wing and maybe even a different difuser.

Ferrari simply decided that it's no use to lose valuable CFD and wind tunnel testing time on this year's car but rather use 100% of the already limited use of the aforementioned R&D tools to come up with the best car next season.
This is my view on their approach.

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which i think is a pretty reasonable view too, but this years car can't be that bad - its made the podium a few times and won a race. it seems to be a right old handful, but can be pretty quick. i'd have thought there must be some good things in this years car that will get carried over.

i take your point on parts not being correct for this car if designed with next year in mind, it can only indicate that they are starting next year from a completely blank sheet of paper - this is pretty risky IMO, given the amount of similarity for next years rules, other already quick cars which take the good bits and evolve next year could be even further ahead of a new car starting development from scratch, and that is assuming they get it right this time, which based on what we've seen this year is certainly not a given

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Originally Posted by Robinho

which i think is a pretty reasonable view too, but this years car can't be that bad - its made the podium a few times and won a race. it seems to be a right old handful, but can be pretty quick. i'd have thought there must be some good things in this years car that will get carried over.

i take your point on parts not being correct for this car if designed with next year in mind, it can only indicate that they are starting next year from a completely blank sheet of paper - this is pretty risky IMO, given the amount of similarity for next years rules, other already quick cars which take the good bits and evolve next year could be even further ahead of a new car starting development from scratch, and that is assuming they get it right this time, which based on what we've seen this year is certainly not a given

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For a start next year's cars will have a different weight distribution, given the minimum weight and fuel weight rule changes, and most probably a longer wheel base, which makes it a very different concept from what we have now.

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Originally Posted by ioan

For a start next year's cars will have a different weight distribution, given the minimum weight and fuel weight rule changes, and most probably a longer wheel base, which makes it a very different concept from what we have now.

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true, and some of the experience gained from carrying Kers might be useful to the team when accounting for extra fuel weight

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Originally Posted by Robinho

true, and some of the experience gained from carrying Kers might be useful to the team when accounting for extra fuel weight

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How?

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Originally Posted by Garry Walker

How?

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beacause they have managed the adverse effect of carrying the extra weight this year, and will undoubtedly have learned things about weight distribution management. dropping Kers, but having extra weight from fuel might mean that they are able to understand and manage that better than teams that didn't run Kers this year.

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Originally Posted by Robinho

beacause they have managed the adverse effect of carrying the extra weight this year, and will undoubtedly have learned things about weight distribution management. dropping Kers, but having extra weight from fuel might mean that they are able to understand and manage that better than teams that didn't run Kers this year.

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They didnt carry extra weight, they just had less ballast to play with.

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Originally Posted by Garry Walker

They didnt carry extra weight, they just had less ballast to play with.

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His point is still valid, Mr Pedantic.

Name calling aside looks like 3rd place in the constructors standings is lost now.

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Originally Posted by Dave Brockman

His point is still valid, Mr Pedantic.

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No, it is not, bronky.

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Originally Posted by Garry Walker

They didnt carry extra weight, they just had less ballast to play with.

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they carry the weight in a less advantageous position, the experience of which will be useful IMO

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Originally Posted by Robinho

they carry the weight in a less advantageous position, the experience of which will be useful IMO

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I fail to see how that will be the case.

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Originally Posted by Garry Walker

I fail to see how that will be the case.

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beacause with extra fuel weight the cars handling will be affected - from this seasons running with Kers they have experienced a bit about running with weight, other than ballast, where they don't really want it and where it affects cars handling. it might not make a massive amount of difference, but i think it will be useful to them as they've effectively been testing with extra weight in the middle of the car all year, sometimes without the benefit of the extra power when the device wasn't working.

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Originally Posted by Robinho

beacause with extra fuel weight the cars handling will be affected ...

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But the chassis will be different from this year's one, plus this year's car never really behaved great so the data is pretty much useless if you want to do a better car.
Also the tires will be different next season.