Hyundai i20 WRC

That's always been Codemasters' problem - they don't support the modding community. I get that studios aren't keen on gamers modifying their product, but Codemasters go out of their way to discourage it by coding those barriers into the product.

For me, the thing that killed Dirt 3 was the lack of variety in the stages. I did not mind the handling, but it felt like a bit of a rip-off when most of the events ran over the same pieces of the road - especially when Colin McRae Rally 2.0 had over eighty individual stages. Sure, some were run in reverse, but they were long enough and challenging enough that they felt original.

If it's really such an issue for Codemasters, all they have to do is make a hardcore option for dedicated gamers along with the more arcade-style handling, and then release a stage designer as DLC. The scenery might be generic, but it's the challenge of the design that matters. Perhaps there could be some way of submitting designs to Codemasters, which they could render properly, bundle them together and release them as DLC packages.

Though I've never played any of the Dirt games, I suspect that Codemasters have already decided what direction they want to go with this series. As I said before, there it is in the title - "Dirt". With a title like that, do any of us honestly believe that they're going to throw even the tiniest bone to true rally enthusiasts?

For this generation of young gamers, "rally" is all about drifting, driving through and throwing around dirt, those Ken Block Gymkhana videos on youtube, etc. This is especially true in the U.S., which is definitely the market Codemasters was looking to attract when it decided to change the game from "Colin McRae Rally" to "Dirt". The rally presence in the U.S. is essentially nil. And for many who do have an inkling of the term "rally", it's due in large part to the X-Games. Whereas in Europe and elsewhere in the world, rallies are seen as they are presented in the WRC and other rally championships, here in the U.S., rally racing is seen as a ToTaLLY EXTReMe SPoRT practiced by guys like Ken Block, Travis Pastrana, and other drivers who chug copious amounts of Monster energy drink.

The fact that it's an X-Games event means that winning and fast times are essentially meaningless because, well, who the hell even remembers the winners from any of the X-Games (besides maybe Shaun White, who seems to win every time at whatever event he's doing)? For fans of the X-Games, it's all about the spectacle (and chugging energy drinks), not the results. The same goes for the Dirt game series vs. what actual WRC rallies represent. For most American gamers who play Dirt, winning isn't about setting the fastest times or winning a championship, but rather bragging to your bro after you beat him by sending his car into the guardrail on the last turn.

They did release Dirt Showdown, which was made up mostly of the non-rally events like Gymkhana, and added in demolition derbies and so on. It appeared to be an attempt to bundle all of those game modes together and launch them as a spin-off franchise. The game appears to have been a critical and commercial failure, but I suspect it was an experiment to try and separate them out and explore the possibility of making Dirt 4 a rally-only game (possibly with Rallycross and Trailblazer events attached).

Meanwhile, it's less than 2 weeks until the cars competition debut. I can't wait to see the i20 in the flesh!

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Originally Posted by 306 Cosworth

Meanwhile, it's less than 2 weeks until the cars competition debut. I can't wait to see the i20 in the flesh!

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I'm curious to see how well it can perform with such a short testing period (especially by its number one driver).

It did seem that VW team took a rather "German" route* with how it developed the Polo WRC, since they didn't bring it to competition until they deemed it ready to match the other WRC cars. By contrast, the Hyundai team seems to be taking a "Korean" route with the i20 WRC by throwing it immediately into competition (even if it's still somewhat half-baked) and continuing to develop it as the season progresses. It's a route that Hyundai has taken with their normal cars, so it comes as no surprise to me that they would do this with their WRC cars as well.


* Perhaps it's also a "Japanese" route to development, since Toyota Team Europe (by orders from Toyota Japan) had shrouded the development and technical details of the ST165 Celica in secrecy, and kept it from competing too much before they deemed it ready to take down the dominant Lancia Delta Integrales. It was all about "keeping face" and "not bringing shame" to the parent company in Japan.

With that in mind, is it any wonder that Japan and Germany were allies in WWII, and that it's been said that the only people in the world who wouldn't dare walk across a deserted intersection in the middle of a night if they didn't have the green light signal are the citizens brought up in the respective cultures of both countries?

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Originally Posted by lewalcindor

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 306 Cosworth

Meanwhile, it's less than 2 weeks until the cars competition debut. I can't wait to see the i20 in the flesh!

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I'm curious to see how well it can perform with such a short testing period (especially by its number one driver).

It did seem that VW team took a rather "German" route* with how it developed the Polo WRC, since they didn't bring it to competition until they deemed it ready to match the other WRC cars. By contrast, the Hyundai team seems to be taking a "Korean" route with the i20 WRC by throwing it immediately into competition (even if it's still somewhat half-baked) and continuing to develop it as the season progresses. It's a route that Hyundai has taken with their normal cars, so it comes as no surprise to me that they would do this with their WRC cars as well.


* Perhaps it's also a "Japanese" route to development, since Toyota Team Europe (by orders from Toyota Japan) had shrouded the development and technical details of the ST165 Celica in secrecy, and kept it from competing too much before they deemed it ready to take down the dominant Lancia Delta Integrales. It was all about "keeping face" and "not bringing shame" to the parent company in Japan.

With that in mind, is it any wonder that Japan and Germany were allies in WWII, and that it's been said that the only people in the world who wouldn't dare walk across a deserted intersection in the middle of a night if they didn't have the green light signal are the citizens brought up in the respective cultures of both countries?

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I can't believe I'm reading this bollocks... Is it any wonder people still think like this.

@ThomasS - I think you meant 'It is a wonder that people still think like this' conveying your incredulity.
As it stands your statement says they've got justification for such outdated views ;)

But hey, when 70% of people polled in France see nothing wrong with reverse 'heil' salutes (quenelle) then it's clear most people learn nothing from history :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lewalcindor

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 306 Cosworth

Meanwhile, it's less than 2 weeks until the cars competition debut. I can't wait to see the i20 in the flesh!

---

I'm curious to see how well it can perform with such a short testing period (especially by its number one driver).

It did seem that VW team took a rather "German" route* with how it developed the Polo WRC, since they didn't bring it to competition until they deemed it ready to match the other WRC cars. By contrast, the Hyundai team seems to be taking a "Korean" route with the i20 WRC by throwing it immediately into competition (even if it's still somewhat half-baked) and continuing to develop it as the season progresses. It's a route that Hyundai has taken with their normal cars, so it comes as no surprise to me that they would do this with their WRC cars as well.


* Perhaps it's also a "Japanese" route to development, since Toyota Team Europe (by orders from Toyota Japan) had shrouded the development and technical details of the ST165 Celica in secrecy, and kept it from competing too much before they deemed it ready to take down the dominant Lancia Delta Integrales. It was all about "keeping face" and "not bringing shame" to the parent company in Japan.

With that in mind, is it any wonder that Japan and Germany were allies in WWII, and that it's been said that the only people in the world who wouldn't dare walk across a deserted intersection in the middle of a night if they didn't have the green light signal are the citizens brought up in the respective cultures of both countries?

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another "special" one... oh well...

I am concerend that they will end up like Suzuki, struggling as the car isnt fully developed and then pulling out as they arent getting the results they wanted...I really hope not though as they have a very good driver line up and adding a new spice to the WRC!

If you want to agree that today's modern world and globalized economy means that every country and culture is the same and that we're all no different from one another, then by all means, go ahead and believe that. But if you look at history (as some of you put it), then you can see that the Japanese and Korean do indeed go through different routes when it comes to releasing their cars to the general market or their racing cars through FIA racing series (which is scant, outside of the Accent WRC from a decade ago and whatever Rhys Millen does).

For example, look at the history of Honda in the U.S. Early American workers at Honda have stated that the first thing they did when they joined the company was not to build motorcycles from scratch, but to continuously disassemble and reassemble an already-built Japanese-built Honda motorcycle to learn the intricacies of the design, build, and quality behind Honda products. By contrast, Hyundai released its Excel to the U.S. in the 1980's by immediately chasing after the big dogs, having the gall to go after BMW with a sub $6k car in its commercials despite the fact that the Excel was one of the worst cars at that time. By contrast, American consumers started to move in large numbers towards Japanese cars during the 1970's gas prices because the comparable Japanese compact was so much more reliable and better than the comparable American compact.

And can we not agree that Hyundai remained in the marketplace despite the Excel, and continued to slowly and steadily improve its products in that marketplace instead of "saving face" by pulling all of their products and properly developing them behind closed doors before releasing them? Even nowadays, automotive journalists agree that while Hyundai and Kia products have come a long way since the Excel and Sephia days, they still lack some of the refinement of their Japanese competitors (mainly in steering feel and effort, structural stiffness, and suspension refinement and sophistication, the latter of which the i20 WRC may finally help to address).

So perhaps we can acknowledge that there are some differences between cultures which pertain to the manufacturers brought up in the respective cultures instead of immediately jumping on our high horses playing PC police here, no?