The Crane and Lewis

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25th July 2007, 17:46
Flat.tyres

Quote:

Originally Posted by andreag

Try this:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...pendix_H_a.pdf

I like this phrase: "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue.

How could Lewis made it clear he will not continue (the only way for the crane to assist him), and then change his mind?

It doesn't smell good. In fact it stinks.

I dont think it stinks.

on the face of it, it looked like Lewis had been very resourceful and kept his engine going to get assistance back on track. however, as you have pointed out, he should not have been craned back on track and allowed to continue.

I very much doubt that there was any intention to break the rules and the crane operator should have waited for Lewis to get out before moving him. also, the FIA should have black flagged him but I suppose with so much else going on, nobody knew what the hell was happening.

if Lewis had of scored a point, I am sure that the other teams would have had him (rightly) disqualified from the standings. as he didn't, its not worth bothering about apart from the FIA to notify Marshalls of the correct procedure in future.
25th July 2007, 18:51
ojciec dyrektor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

if Lewis had of scored a point, I am sure that the other teams would have had him (rightly) disqualified from the standings. as he didn't, its not worth bothering about apart from the FIA to notify Marshalls of the correct procedure in future.

If FIA created rules then every team and driver have to obey that rules. It doesn't matter it's Ferrari or Spyker, Hamilton or Winkelhock, race winner or last driver.
25th July 2007, 18:52
tinchote

Quote:

Originally Posted by andreag

Try this:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...pendix_H_a.pdf

I like this phrase: "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue.

How could Lewis made it clear he will not continue (the only way for the crane to assist him), and then change his mind?

It doesn't smell good. In fact it stinks.

Something that has always been obvious to me - written or not - is that you don't lift a car with the driver inside. It will be very interesting to see what happens some day if they are lifting the car with the driver inside, something goes wrong, and driver gets hurt :mark:
25th July 2007, 19:15
janneppi

Is it my limited English skills or does the wording "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue" leave a opening if the marshalls want to, they can come and help even if it's not recommended?
25th July 2007, 20:14
ioan

Quote:

Originally Posted by janneppi

Is it my limited English skills or does the wording "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue" leave a opening if the marshalls want to, they can come and help even if it's not recommended?

I think it's the former case! :p :
25th July 2007, 20:15
ioan

Quote:

Originally Posted by ojciec dyrektor

It doesn't matter it's Ferrari or Spyker, Hamilton or Winkelhock, race winner or last driver.

To be correct you should say "McLaren or Spyker" ! ;)
25th July 2007, 21:17
wmcot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

if Lewis had of scored a point, I am sure that the other teams would have had him (rightly) disqualified from the standings. as he didn't, its not worth bothering about apart from the FIA to notify Marshalls of the correct procedure in future.

But don't the positions outside the points figure into a constructor's ranking at the end of the season which, in turn, determines their share of FIA money?

Is there anyone who remembers any other driver being "craned" back onto the track from a position as far off the racing surface as LH was during a race under any circumstances? MS's "push" occurred while his car was still partially on the racing surface. I don't recall anyone being helped out of a deep gravel trap in the past.
25th July 2007, 21:29
andreag

I don't think any driver will ask, in the technical meeting with Martin Whitmarsh before Hungary GP, if its allowed to stay in the car with the engine running to be put back in the track, if they remember his last answer to a similar question.

Last year, after Michael had jumped the chicane at Hungaroring for three times to avoid being overtaken by de la Rosa, Pedro asked in the next meeting if this would be allowed, and Martin answer was "Not in the future".

So, it's better not asking anything to keep the door open.
25th July 2007, 23:31
Valve Bounce

Quote:

Originally Posted by janneppi

Is it my limited English skills or does the wording "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue" leave a opening if the marshalls want to, they can come and help even if it's not recommended?

In the preparation of specifications and regulations, the word shall (should is the past tense) is mandatory.
25th July 2007, 23:57
Valve Bounce

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinchote

Something that has always been obvious to me - written or not - is that you don't lift a car with the driver inside. It will be very interesting to see what happens some day if they are lifting the car with the driver inside, something goes wrong, and driver gets hurt :mark:

I am sure that most, if not all, industrial regulations and safety regulations prohibit the lifting of a car with the driver in it and the engine running.

I cannot imagine that German industrial and safety regulations permit this. It is very interesting the the FIA has been silent on this issue, even if it is for clarification purposes. Maybe Charlie Whiting is still trying to find out from Dave Taylor whether the JCB was being used as a crane or a telehandler or forklift, and what safety regulations apply and don't apply..

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