The Crane and Lewis

Over on http://www.planetf1.com there is a comment that says that:

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It's also worth bearing in mind that the treatment he got was illegal under the FIA's sporting code, which not only states explicitly that the cranes and recovery vehicles are "for the removal and recovery of abandoned race cars", but also that they "should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue".

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Link: http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,1895...612235,00.html

I didn't read the whole rule book but if this person did it and found this than surely what happened was illegal.

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Now, you can all bleat on about this was wrong, that was wrong, was it a JCB, or a crane blah blah blah, but the prescedent has been set - at the same venue, by Schumi a while back, who also knew the rules, had the foresight to keep the engine running and got the help from the marshalls.

Get over it guys.

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MS's car being half on the track (2 wheels on, 2 off) IS in a dangerous position, LH being 30 meters or so off the track IS NOT in a dangerous position (defined as dangerous to other drivers on the track.) You can't use the excuse that other drivers were going off at the same spot - that's exactly why LH should have left his car immediately! If Speed's TR had hit LH and injured him, you'd all be saying that he was stupid to stay in the car!

Using the "logic" of some of the obviously biased LH and McLaren fans, then all cars should be "craned" back onto any track no matter where they have gone off as long as the engine is running.

I want to know what the official rule is!!

The rule seems to be defined by whatever the marshalls feel like doing.

Schumacher got a hand in 2003 at his home turf whilst Alonso in a similarly dangerous position at Monza in 2004 copped the back hand of the marshalls.

But I don't understand why Hamilton got lifted back onto the track in such dangerous conditions. That was just dumb.

To quote paragraph 6.1, Chapter III of appendix H from the FIA Formula One World Championship Regulations:


'If a car stops: If a car stops on the course, or leaves the track, the first duty of the course marshals in that sector is to take it to a place of safety.


'No driver has the right to refuse to allow his car to be taken off the track, he must do everything he can to help and obey the marshals' instructions. Once the car is in a place of safety the driver may, if the specific regulations of the event permit, work on it in order to re-start. In such cases other means, such as breakdown vehicles, cranes, etc. should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue. [P-F1's bolding] It is desirable that the driver stays near his vehicle until the end of the race or at least informs the post chief how his car may be lifted, or towed back to the pits.'

Chapter and verse. I just wonder now whether Hamilton's finish position will be erased, and the following drivers elevated one position.

Knowing the FIA's ineptitude, I would say "NO!"

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Originally Posted by wmcot

I want to know what the official rule is!!

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Try this:

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APPENDIX H TO THE INTERNATIONAL SPORTING CODE

CHAPTER III - EMERGENCY SERVICES

6.1 If a car stops

If a car stops on the course, or leaves the track, the first duty of the course marshals in that sector is to take it to a place of safety.

No driver has the right to refuse to allow his car to be taken off the track, he must do everything he can to help and obey the marshals’ instructions. Once the car is in a place of safety the driver may, if the specific regulations of the event permit, work on it in order to re-start. In such cases other means, such as breakdown vehicles, cranes, etc. should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue. It is desirable that the driver stays near his vehicle until the end of the race or at least informs the post chief how his car may be lifted, or towed back to the pits.

11. Other services

The following services should also be provided:

- Vehicles for the removal and recovery of abandoned race cars:

Immobilised cars in unsafe positions should be removed to places of safety, either manually or by means of cranes or vehicles suitably adapted for the purpose of lifting a car. No other means of lifting cars should be used unless specifically authorised by the FIA.

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http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...pendix_H_a.pdf

I like this phrase: "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue.

How could Lewis made it clear he will not continue (the only way for the crane to assist him), and then change his mind?

It doesn't smell good. In fact it stinks.

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'No driver has the right to refuse to allow his car to be taken off the track, he must do everything he can to help and obey the marshals' instructions.

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What have happened to Lewis was in accordance with this article. He didn't make any refusal against what Marshal threated him, he would obey the marshal instruction if the crane finally lift him up and put him in the paddock or out of the barrier. I'm sure he will not jump out of the car when the crane was bringing him out of the track for the protest he still want to continue the race.

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Once the car is in a place of safety the driver may, if the specific regulations of the event permit, work on it in order to re-start.

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Once the car is back at the track that is permitted by the marshal (crane) quite safe for him to make a re-start, he did it, again no refusal against marshal instruction.
But if he didn't have chance to unlap up to reasonable distance behind driver in front of him he would have been back in the paddock of McLaren and didn't continue the race.

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In such cases other means, such as breakdown vehicles, cranes, etc. should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue. [P-F1's bolding]

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That's also a strong clausal for the Marshal to bring the crane into action because Lewis was in the car which had no remarkable damage, and the engine was running, that means it was obvious Lewis was wanting to continue the race.

Hence, after reading this article, they actually have the rule and not solely interpreting something out of the rule. I don't think Lewiss will be rule out from his position because he didn't do anything wrong against the rule.

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Originally Posted by andreag

Try this:



http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...pendix_H_a.pdf

I like this phrase: "cranes should not be brought into action until the driver has made it clear that he will not continue.

How could Lewis made it clear he will not continue (the only way for the crane to assist him), and then change his mind?

It doesn't smell good. In fact it stinks.

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Those of us that think it was not correct to help LH back on the track using a crane are just a few of the fans, most of the fans were happy to see their new hero be back (legal or not), so the FIA did what was best for the show.

I for one I'm not his fan but I'm happy that he continued and drove a "monkey" race! :D

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Originally Posted by ioan

...I for one I'm not his fan but I'm happy that he continued and drove a "monkey" race! :D

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I enjoyed his "monkey" race as well :D

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Originally Posted by ioan

I for one I'm not his fan but I'm happy that he continued and drove a "monkey" race! :D

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I bet the young man regrets that comment now :laugh: He is still young though and will learn the hard way.

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Originally Posted by 555-04Q2

I bet the young man regrets that comment now :laugh: He is still young though and will learn the hard way.

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I suppose so! ;)