Wilson should call Henning and give him a super deal on an ERC. He can match Citroen.
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Wilson should call Henning and give him a super deal on an ERC. He can match Citroen.
Sorry but I don't get it? Which Citroën are speaking about? The only Citroën driver which is expected in the series (aside 2WD) is Robert Kubica who will do only 4 events - 2 of them on asphalt where Henning has no chance against Robert...
Henning Solberg wouldnt stand a chance on tar or gravel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
Abarth must be talking about some other Henning......
Henning is not that bad on tarmac, remember he won the s2000 class in rally germany some years ago. He wasn't alone in the class :)
Well, that was with WRC-style tyres which are not yet introduced in the ERC. First event with them will be Sanremo or something in Saptember. Till then there are classic slicks and with them I wouldn't bet on Henning, sorry ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joF-uSt086g
And as I wrote already in Czech tread - Jan Sýkora shall be one of the first private drivers to have Fiesta R5.
Around 180k punds for Fiesta R5 from M-Sport, 25k for "small" spare parts package (national rallies), 100k for big spare parts package (complete transmission, etc)
úp cho ngÃ*y cu?i tu?n nÃ*o :D
About 180 000 £ (208 370 €) is imo a reasonable price. Is this the price for a complete car or the kit in boxes?
The Ford Fiesta S2000 is the most expensive S2000 so let’s see what the price of the Peugeot 208 T16 will be.
Well, there's strong rumours that the first two Fiesta R5's will be shipped to MM Motorsport and Karl Kruuda will be the guy behind the wheel. They use 2 cars for ease logistics - one will stay in Europe and one will be in overseas.
That's already several teams about which I heard they would be the first :D Let's see if the first is going to Estonia, Belgium, Czech republic or where :)
Ofcourse you'll never know but that's the rumour I have heard from several sources now. We'll see ....
Today Wilson Jr was testing the Fiesta R5 in Riudecanyes:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BFwAnRPCEAAx0jr.jpg:large
LOL what a beauty! It is like a completely different car. Tarmac setup RULES !
Very pretty. Tomorrow will continue to test, in the Coll de la Teixeta, also in Catalonia.
Hard to believe that a complete R5 car will cost under 250.000€. Selling R5 cars, like S2000 before, will be a very profitable exercise to manus, contributing to their rally departments survival. Either way, aren't MSport cars always built by themselves? And will Peugeot Sport continue to sell cars in boxes allowing costumeurs to finished them?Quote:
Originally Posted by OldF
The Fiesta looks great and doesn't sound worse than the WRCar either. I am really pleased that the FIA decided to retain the "visual drama" on this cheaper category.
The car doesn't really look fast to me in this video, but i suppose that has more to do with the driver than with the car itself? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Kielder
In my eyes it also seems that Kubica´s DS3 RRC (see pre-event tests for Rally Islas Canarias) is MUCH MORE better during accelerating from corners. But maybe it is really only in the driver. :D Anyway I am satisfied with whole this cathegory R5, good sound, good speed...it is real rally future.Quote:
Originally Posted by wwbroe
Looks plenty fast to me. Sounds great too.
I hope the people who run the BRC allow these cars in soon. Rather than the top category being the horrid little understeery Citroens and Fiesta R2s
As a side note, I remember when I first read about this category (when it was still referred to as R4T) and thought they were just going to be like R3Ts with four wheel drive underneath. Thank God they're nothing like that! Loud, fast and bulging at the wheel arches :D
Any news who ordered a 208 T16 since it's possible to do so(on ordering paper) :confused:
The sound is definitely interesting but overall I don't find the video impressive. Hard to judge how fast it is because on these roads even WRC cars look often slow and boring. Definitely it's nothing mind-blowing but that could have been hardly expected.
Difficult to say what final price will be. The base price of the Fiesta is 260 000 £ (303 900 €) and the Peugeot prices are for tarmac / gravel kits 264 000 € / 269 000 €.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arganil
Malcom said some time ago that the price would be between 200 000 £ - 250 000 £ (233 765 € - 292 205 €).
I think at least the price for the R5 engine will be a lot more affordable if the regulations are the same as for R3T. The gearbox could be cheaper (6 gear for S2000, 5 gear for R5) also. In general I think the Sadev gearbox and rear diff are cheaper than the Xtrac gearbox and rear diff.
The uprights will also be more affordable because they have to be machined instead S2000 welded ones. Brakes and suspension must be at least on same level (driveability) as for S2000 because they are both in the same class. Also the R5 steering column looks shorter in the pics. I can’t come up with any more major parts that could dramatically affect the price.
Malcom Wilson also said that 90% of the parts are different from the WRC car. Imo he should compare the S2000 and R5 instead because the S2000 and WRC don’t have many common parts as Christian Loriaux said here
Q. How many parts are common to both the S2000 and the RS WRC?
A. We obtained plenty of data from the S2000 which competed in the S-WRC and other championships last year. We re-evaluated every area and if we thought certain areas could be improved, we went ahead and did so. Apart from the roll cage and chassis there aren't too many parts that the Fiesta RS WRC shares with the S2000. Plenty of parts may look similar, but they have been modified to be lighter, stiffer or whatever we felt would bring an improvement.
Don't forget that both Fiesta WRC/RRC and S2000 are technically S2000 cars. Both is built under same regulations (there was an evolution to the 1.6T engine but the rule basis is still same). Sure the parts differ but that doesn't mean those are some fundamental differences rather than evolutions of same ideas. If we speak about "new" Fiesta S2000 which is called RRC and WRC than both is virtually same except few minor differences. The running cost of RRC and WRC must be almost same in my opinion (judging from engine rebuild price available on M-Sport webpage it's cca 3,5x more than for Fabia S2000!).
Full gallery of today test in Col de la Teixeta.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...5180346&type=1
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.n...91692274_n.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...63178297_n.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...13554679_n.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.n...30345919_n.jpg
Some details of Ford Fiesta R5.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...19107903_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...91980477_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...30851514_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...68865417_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...30722867_o.jpg
On gravel the car seems to be pretty spectacular, also nice sound. The gearbox seems to be really short due to the 5-speed limitation. How much the top speed in the video could be? 170km/h?
I watched the video yesterday on full screen and tried to get clear of the speedometer. The speedometer is so bright that’s difficult but imo I saw 179 km/h at some stage. I’m far from sure though.
I haven’t forgot that WRC/RRC are cars built based on S2000 regulations. In the case where I said the amount of different parts of R5 should be compared to the Fiesta S2000 I meant the Fiesta S2000 NA. As Loriaux said there aren’t many parts common between the Fiesta WRC and the Fiesta S2000 NA although they’re both built by the same regulations. Evolutions of parts as you said Mirek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
If FIA have strict price for costs maybe the developers can still squeeze some cost compared to the S2000 NA cars.
M-Sport confirms it is building a Ford Fiesta R5 car - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com
“The R5 will be based on the 1.6 turbo Fiesta ST road car and use a lot of the design knowledge and experience generated from the S2000 and the World Rally Car. At the same time, it will be a new car with new engine, transmission, roll cage, fuel tank, electronics, all complying with the strict FIA regulations on design and costs.”
Imo the best way to control the prices of cars and spare parts would be to obligate the companies to put the prices on their websites as it would be more transparent.
The new Fiesta front actually looks a lot like the Abarth Grande Punto!
No testing on the 208 T16 yet?
Its testing all the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sulland
They are just doing things a lot more privately than M-Sport
an interesting article about the 208 t16 ans the r5 category in general.
"the 208 t16 will be much faster then 207 s2000":
Google Übersetzer
"One of the main differences between R5 and Super 2000 is the fact that one has the R5 significantly less opportunity to homologate parts again. One can not bring annual Evostufe of the chassis or the engine, "says Peugeot Sport Director Bruno Famin. "The car has to be good from the start, and therefore we will wait with the homologation even until the last minute. And when we realize that it is better for the 1st to the Wait to January 2014, then we will not hesitate to move the appointment. The first shot has to sit really, because after the homologation you have to live with what you have. "
Does anybody here got an idea what is this supposed to mean? No updates at all; no updates on engine peripherals; no updates on engine block only?
That means the number of jokers is very much limited. I'm now on ski and have no will to search for exact rules but compared to the S2000 which were already quite a lot limited by rules the R5 will be much more tied to the original homologation. The idea is that it will help to keep cost down. I'm not convinced about that though.
Anyway I'm sure this topic was discussed several times here on forum.
As you remember (Rally car tech stuff) also the current RRC (S2000) / WRC cars, they have to use them for three years before any major new homologations. Maybe there are also more restrictions for R5 how often VO, ER homologations are allowed.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSon
Have FIA started to think like CIK, that are making 3 year cycluses on chassis and engines. So little or no change during a 3 year homologation periode.
Could be a way to do business in R5 as well. Homologation period 2014-2016 for instance?