FIA sends spy case to Court of Appeal

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Originally Posted by Bagwan

It is for that very reason that one must , as you have stated you do , agree with the FIA and Ferrari(and others) that it was not illegal in Melbourne .

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:up:

Ferrari clearly found a solution that was not covered by the rules, and therefore not illegal. Teams constantly push the boundaries of the rules, and the FIA are constantly asked for clarification on technical issues. It's normal practice.

The only difference here is in how information reached the FIA that led them to issue a clarification, which in turn meant that every team (not just Ferrari) had to make changes to their floor in order to confirm to the revised test.

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Originally Posted by icsunonove

I'm not aware that Ferrari have even presented material evidence that it was Stepney who sent the documents (and he is still denying it).

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Except RD STATED that the documents were given to Coughlan by Stepney at a meeting in Barcelona!! AND that he was aware of the flexible floor in Melbourne which could only have come from the technical documents (which was months before he said that McLaren was aware of the documents in July.)

So I guess, technically, Stepney didn't "send" them to Coughlan and Stepney then was the "unknown courier" that delivered them to Coughlan.

Can you not see the changes in McLaren's/Coughlan's/Dennis's story???? Open your eyes man!!!

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Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

Stepney has consistently denied sending the 780-page document to Coughlan. In the light of that it is reasonable to question 'if he didn't send it, who did and why?' Also, where has RD "confirmed" that Stepney wasn't set up? How does he know? Why do you chose to believe him in this instance?

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Read RD's statement that says Stepney met with Coughlan in Barcelona and Coughlan returned with the documents. Pretty clear wording from RD it seems to me. Why DON'T YOU believe him???

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Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

:up:

Ferrari clearly found a solution that was not covered by the rules, and therefore not illegal. Teams constantly push the boundaries of the rules, and the FIA are constantly asked for clarification on technical issues. It's normal practice.

The only difference here is in how information reached the FIA that led them to issue a clarification, which in turn meant that every team (not just Ferrari) had to make changes to their floor in order to confirm to the revised test.

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Agreed. And then we have Ron Dennis, who we should assume knows more about F1 than anyone of us, saying that Ferrari's car was illegal. I can only think of two possible explanations:

1) Ron Dennis is a liar;

2) Ron Dennis is an idiot.

Neither of the options do a lot for McLaren's credibility.

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Originally Posted by wmcot

How many times is this question going to be asked?

I'll answer it one more time (and hopefully some of you will read it or pay someone to read it to you if you're not capable.)

Should the victim of a crime receive the same sentence as the criminal? McLaren stood to gain from having Ferrari's data, Ferrari could only lose by having their confidential information stolen and used by someone else!

I chuckled a bit at your twisted thinking as to Stepney "giving them (the documents) away!" It's called stealing - theft occurs when you give something away that is not yours to give away!!!!

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Your blinked view didn't allow you to read the post properly, I am sure Ferrari over the last few weeks have been looking very closely at their security to stop this happening again.

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Originally Posted by wmcot

Except RD STATED that the documents were given to Coughlan by Stepney at a meeting in Barcelona!! AND that he was aware of the flexible floor in Melbourne which could only have come from the technical documents (which was months before he said that McLaren was aware of the documents in July.)

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Could it really only have come from those documents? Somehow, I doubt it.

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Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

So his detailed letter is not a response to the fact that Ferrari have refused to accept the FIA hearing verdict, despite being allowed to present their evidence and take part in the procedings, and have repeatedly made unproven allegations via the media without producing any new evidence to back them up?

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If you compare the most recent letter with his previous statements you can see changes in things like the timeline, the most recent "fact" that Stepney gave the documents to Coughlan at a meeting in Barcelona? The "fact" that he was aware of the flexible floor and wing separator at Melbourne BUT was not aware of the documents until July? It seems that all the "new evidence" is coming from Ron and much of it contradicts his "old evidence!"

As long as Ferrari keep the pressure on, Ron keeps digging his own grave.

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Originally Posted by BDunnell

Could it really only have come from those documents? Somehow, I doubt it.

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It would be an easy way to find out, unless Stepney told McLaren directly which would be a further example of espionage. It would be one of those things that's a bit difficult to detect by photography or simply viewing the car while in the pits.

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Originally Posted by tinchote

Agreed. And then we have Ron Dennis, who we should assume knows more about F1 than anyone of us, saying that Ferrari's car was illegal. I can only think of two possible explanations:

1) Ron Dennis is a liar;

2) Ron Dennis is an idiot.

Neither of the options do a lot for McLaren's credibility.

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RD is just trying to determine who is a true Maclarent fan who will always drink the Koolaid be it laced with cyanide or some other white powder, and be good like Hamie, do as they told, accept whatever he says as the ONLY truth known to man, and defend MacLarent to the bitter end. Very reasonable way to weed out the disloyal or fair weather fans and to confirm those like Hamie who "have McLaren in their blood.." as true believers
, .... :imubash:

I am still trying to figure out what he was doing in the shower with NS, putting that white powder in the pants pocket of NS..or maybe it was just :love: ??

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Originally Posted by Ian McC

Your blinked view didn't allow you to read the post properly, I am sure Ferrari over the last few weeks have been looking very closely at their security to stop this happening again.

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So which part of my "blinkered view" was wrong? You see no problem with an employee "giving away" confidential information? You feel that victims and criminals should get the same punishment? You feel that Ferrari profited from having their documents stolen? You feel that McLaren could not profit from Ferrari's documents?

Which point was I wrong in? Please point it out so I can correct my way of thinking.

BTW - I didn't mention anything about Ferrari improving their security (which I'm sure they have done.)