The first 2011 Silly Season driver/team thread

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Originally Posted by TURN3

I liken Hornish to a Dan Wheldon (without the attitude). Great oval drivers and good at Indy, but otherwise they are pretty irrelevant.

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Being good at Indy (and winning Indy) trumps all the other Indy Car events about 10 fold.

Being good at Indy, doesn't make you irrelevent. Quite the opposite, actually. Like Danicker or not, but her star was made at Indy in 2005. Without her Indy 500 result, she is nothing.

Being good at St. Pete or Toronto (and finishing 18th at Indy), makes you irrelevent.

Sorry if some of you want to make the series into some 18 race, "every event is equally important" deal. And sorry if some of you want this utopian "our champion has to be great at everything and win on various courses". But the truth is, the sport only matters because of the 3 weeks every year in May at IMS. Without it, we have Star Mazda on steroids. A nice little series, with some nice little races. But irrelevent.

Well Scotty, you continue to put your own foot in your mouth. Just because Sam is your idea of the great American hope and you despise anything other than such, isn't going to get Sam back. Penske isn't getting rid of anybody on his current team for Sam. That is a fact, we all know it. Why would he? Briscoe has won ovals and contended for a championship...he's good on roadies. Castroneves has won on ovals, 3 time Indy champ, and is good on roadies. Power dominates roadies, and would've won this years championship if it weren't for 3 oval races he got screwed by his crew on. Sorry, I'm not buying the "Will Power can't race ovals" bit. The only oval mistake he made all year was at Homestead when it was go for it all time. Big deal. I'm sure Roger sits up at night wondering which one of those 3 championship contenders he gets rid of to make room for a guy that would likely finish around 10th.

With regard to Indy and its relevance, thank you for agreeing with me an supporting my earlier statements. That is why I think the only chance you'll see Hornish in an Indycar is a 1 off at Indy...he would be a good candidate for that. Or now that I think about it, maybe he can do the Ed Carpenter schedule next year and only run ovals.

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

...He has finished 2nd in the only race in Indy Cars that actually matters...

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

Being good at Indy (and winning Indy) trumps all the other Indy Car events about 10 fold...

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So why should we even bother to have any other races. Scotty?

Gary

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Originally Posted by TURN3

1. Just because Sam is your idea of the great American hope and you despise anything other than such, isn't going to get Sam back.

2. Penske isn't getting rid of anybody on his current team for Sam. That is a fact, we all know it.

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1. Yes, he'd be one of America's best hopes for a Indy Car driver. Him and Rice, are the only 2 American drivers to win the Indy 500 since 1998. He is the only American to win a Indy Car championship, in the last decade.

Who are the "American hopes"? Marco? Graham? Danicker? What the hell have they shown?

And I don't despise anything else. Just realize that there are really good reasons why .nothing ratings are the norm today and very few sponsors want to get involved. Losing guys like Sam and Rice, are 2 of the biggest reasons why.

2. IF Sam told Roger today he wanted to come back to Indy Cars, Briscoe would be gone. THAT is a fact. This is Sam's choice to race in NASCAR. Its what his family wanted (more specifically, his wife). He is making a great living, no matter how he does. Penske still loves him and will keep him in Nationwide, if Cup goes away. Penske would LOVE for him to come back to Indy Cars. Penske cares most about winning Indy. And 2 of his 3 drivers have never proven they can seal the deal at Indy. Sam has.

Those of you that think Sam would be a midpacker now, driving for Roger Penske, are delusional. And those that think that Penske wouldnt' want him back are really delusional.

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Originally Posted by garyshell

So why should we even bother to have any other races. Scotty?

Gary

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You are missing the point, Gar.


When someone says that Hornish or Wheldon would be "irrelevent" because of doing well at Indy, then they have no idea what they are talking about.

Sure, you need other races. And some are very good events. But without the Indy 500....this sport is absolutely nothing. It would be just another formula car series, that nobody cares about. The Indy 500 gives it relevence.

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

2. IF Sam told Roger today he wanted to come back to Indy Cars, Briscoe would be gone. THAT is a fact.

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In the fantasy world that is Scotty G's own little fiefdom, the line between speculation and fact is non existent.

via Dictionary.com:

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Fact  /fækt/ –noun
1. something that actually exists; reality; truth: Your fears have no basis in fact.

2. something known to exist or to have happened: Space travel is now a fact.

3. a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true: Scientists gather facts about plant growth.

4. something said to be true or supposed to have happened: The facts given by the witness are highly questionable.

5. Law . Often, facts. an actual or alleged event or circumstance, as distinguished from its legal effect or consequence.

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Gary

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

2. IF Sam told Roger today he wanted to come back to Indy Cars, Briscoe would be gone. THAT is a fact. This is Sam's choice to race in NASCAR. Its what his family wanted (more specifically, his wife). He is making a great living, no matter how he does. Penske still loves him and will keep him in Nationwide, if Cup goes away. Penske would LOVE for him to come back to Indy Cars. Penske cares most about winning Indy. And 2 of his 3 drivers have never proven they can seal the deal at Indy. Sam has.

Those of you that think Sam would be a midpacker now, driving for Roger Penske, are delusional. And those that think that Penske wouldnt' want him back are really delusional.

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I have to agree with Gary - how is this FACT?? You MAY be right - but too many people can come up with too many reasons either he wouldn't go back or Roger wouldn't take him back.... We cannot forget that the theoretical choice isn't between Sam and Ryan - it is between Sam and ALL other potential drivers.... I don't see how Sam gets the ride IF it were to be open..... It is not like Hornish was one of the great Penske drivers of all time and it is not like he has been that successful for Penske overall (especially relative to other drivers to whom Penske has shown GREAT loyalty...).

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

When someone says that Hornish or Wheldon would be "irrelevent" because of doing well at Indy, then they have no idea what they are talking about.

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And who said this? Where did this come from? I believe you're making a desparate attempt to hide the fact you're in left field by putting words in my mouth. I never said, "Hornish or Wheldon were irrelevant BECAUSE of doing well at Indy." To the contrary, specifically I mentioned that Hornish would be a good candidate for a 1 off at Indy. If Wheldon ends up without a ride next year I would think he would aso be a good candidate for a team looking to run just the 500. Other than that, they are both irrelevant.

And I'd also point out that even though Sam has been a great open wheel oval driver and won Indy, other than that year at Indy he has struggled there. If I were choosing between the two, I'd take Wheldon with a far better track record. An that's tough for me to say because I'd rather give him a reason for another new set of teeth.

I've always thought of Hornish as a very good IRL driver on ovals, but no more than a mid-pack driver on road/streets. As far as Penske making room for him on the IRL team, should he choose to give up his NASCAR dream, Penske has never indicated that AFAIK. All that Penske has said is that Hornish was free to pursue a seat with some other team, if he wanted to, since Mobil 1 dropped Hornish's ride in NASCAR. Why would Penske bounce someone like Briscoe to make room for Hornish? I could see him possibly bouncing Briscoe to get Tony Kanaan, because he's a more complete package. But why would he take Hornish over Briscoe? Since he's shown no sign of doing that, I'd say it's far from being a "fact".

There was an article about this about a month ago on That's Racing.com. It was part of the same article that put down speculation that Dodge might enter the IRL as an engine provider, running with Penske. Ralph Gilles shot that down (saying Dodge was focused on NASCAR) and Penske said then that Hornish was free to pursue other opportunities with other teams. What I took from that article was that if Hornish does return to the IRL, it will probably be with Panther.

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Originally Posted by Scotty G.

Those of you that think Sam would be a midpacker now, driving for Roger Penske, are delusional. And those that think that Penske wouldnt' want him back are really delusional.

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Talk about delusional...have you taken your meds lately? I guess since you're the only one I know of on this or any other forum with these thoughs of your boyfriend Sam, all of us fans are "delusional" and you're the normal one.