new engine rules

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Originally Posted by Redstorm

The engine spec needs to stay as open as possible. Let them run 4s 6s 8s 12s whatever they want. Put a maximum displacement on them and let's see who comes out to play. Don't use a rev limiter, if Mazda wants a 10,000 rpm rotary then let them. Chevy a 6,500 v-8 fine by me. The ALMS has it right with the air restrictors as I see it. But as someone else pointed out, the race motor needs more hp than the street version. The manufacturers need to be able to use their own DNA in the product. The F1 engine equality farce proves that where there is a will there is a way. By using a "frozen" rule all you get is someone building in the cracks of the rules. With a clearcut outline ( air restrictors) the development is allowed and encouraged. Only then it can be put towards "street car technology". If a turbo 4 can make 700 hp but use say 10 gallons less over a race, it has a weight advantage over the NA V-8. The rules work to keep it from a hp race towards more of a consumtion race. Racing is sport and I'm not a tree hugged greenie but the PR for corporations is all abou that. So set the rules to where it's more sponsor friendly if it doesn't hurt the end product.

Oh and hi everyone!

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Intake restrictors are rev. limiters.
An engine can only reach X rpm if it has a good enough fuel mixture.
When the mixture get too thin due to being strangled by a restrictor, the engine can rev no higher.
Minus restrictors, small-block push-rod V-8s can now easily get into the 10,000 rpm range.
Even very large big-blocks live easily now in the 9,000 range.

Special small port cylinder heads are the best way to cheat the effect of restrictors within the revolution range possible.
Just like the Chevy IMSA cylinder heads, they are worthless on the street as they are horribly inefficient needlessly strangling the street engine.

In effect air restrictors are rev limiters. But they are according to the limitations of the design of efficiency of a given motor. It is not some arbitrary number that the powers that be come up with. Even though the V-8 and the turbo 4 will be restricted to have very similar outputs, the way in which each engine ultimately gets to that power leads to differing power bands ect. Take the F1 saga for instance. Since all motors are of the same layout and displacement, the actual characteristics of the different manufacturers in powerband is quite similar overall. Yes, one is better at -A- vs -B-, but those differences are minute compared to how a 4 vs 8 or 6 vs 12 would look. That difference is where opportunity arises to overtake. With all engines basically the same they all hit the sweetspot together , hence not a big enough advantage to overcome aero ect....

IMO, they better pick whichever formula that will attract the most manufacturers. You might (big "might") find a formula that everyone here could agree on. But if Honda is the only one willing to build it, the IRL will be in the same spot in 3 years as they're in now. I'd say there are VERY few people who've decided to turn the Indy 500 off because they're running this type of engine, rather than some other type of engine.

Unless enough higher profile sponsors/manufacturers take this on, and activate that sponsorship, they could run the most exotic engines on the planet and still no one would know it. What does the market want? OK, just deliver that! Simple, right? :p

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Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior

Unless enough higher profile sponsors/manufacturers take this on, and activate that sponsorship, they could run the most exotic engines on the planet and still no one would know it. What does the market want? OK, just deliver that! Simple, right? :p

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But the print magazines that cover such tech. articles would, just a they did in the sixties to nineties.
That gets peoples attention, across the oceans.

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Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

But the print magazines that cover such tech. articles would, just a they did in the sixties to nineties.
That gets peoples attention, across the oceans.

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Print magazines? You said it. The 90's! Because to rely on print today is ridiculous.

Name me one Automotive print magazine that is increasing in circulation! Name me one that is even maintaining it's circulation at the key demo!

I only still get a few Automotive magazines and I get those because they are free.

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

Print magazines? You said it. The 90's! Because to rely on print today is ridiculous.

Name me one Automotive print magazine that is increasing in circulation! Name me one that is even maintaining it's circulation at the key demo!

I only still get a few Automotive magazines and I get those because they are free.

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Racecar Engineering. Although it is not exactly aimed at ordinary consumers.

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

Print magazines? You said it. The 90's! Because to rely on print today is ridiculous.

Name me one Automotive print magazine that is increasing in circulation! Name me one that is even maintaining it's circulation at the key demo!

I only still get a few Automotive magazines and I get those because they are free.

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That is you.

Hot Rod; Popular Hot Rodding; Car Craft; Autosport; Autoweek; Motorsport amongst others all had articles on the power plants of Indy cars in the past fifteen years.
All of these magazines are quite well.

There are others but if you do not read, you are simply not one of the people the tens of millions of dollars spent on advertising in thses magazines care about.

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Originally Posted by Redstorm

With all engines basically the same they all hit the sweetspot together , hence not a big enough advantage to overcome aero ect....

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Don't forget, since they seem to intend to have different H.P. outputs for road and ovals, then that's one mighty fine balancing act the series would have to pull off to keep everybody happy. Slide rules don't lie? Throw in electrical assist and you have the equivalent of juggling a bowling ball, a peanut, a kumquat and two raw eggs.

Green issues are hot! If they want Jack-a-root to awe people with his 60" LCD monitor in the pits then it needs to be something that is currently relevant. Turbos vs. big displacement vs. cylinder count is old. Some electric boost or assist systems and the difference of the systems and how effective they are would be pointer worthy.

Everybody on the planet makes a 1.8 to 2.5 litre 4 cylinder engine, or close to it, let's go with that and Krazy glue a turbo on it.

"Yes, ladies and gentleman, that Indy 500 winning engine is the same engine that powers your Ford Fusion to work every day!"

Kind of...

An electric boost you say? Go on the F1 forum and ask them about KERS. Everyone there loves to talk about KERS.

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Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

That is you.

Hot Rod; Popular Hot Rodding; Car Craft; Autosport; Autoweek; Motorsport amongst others all had articles on the power plants of Indy cars in the past fifteen years.
All of these magazines are quite well.

There are others but if you do not read, you are simply not one of the people the tens of millions of dollars spent on advertising in thses magazines care about.

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I think "quite well" is a huge overstatement.... Motorsport is an awesome magazine but it barely survived the Haymarket era... I suspect when Bill Boddy moves to the great typewriter in the sky the mag will have serious problems within 2-3 years.... Autoweek still does a decent job but it is now Auto-bi-week and they freely have mentioned several times how tough the print business is now....

Print media was suffering before the bad economy due to the internet. The economy has made it worse (I dropped Autoweek after 26 years and will not likely renew Motorsport (for $80+ per year!!) mostly due to economic concerns combined with loss of relevance for the product....

I have also noted that the trust factor of print media over internet media has faded dramatically - autoweek used to be a far more reliable source of info than the internet - now it is about the same and significantly slower.... Pretty much now you can cruise multiple sites for info and cross reference it with a known entity like Autosport and you can get pretty close to the "truth"...