Long live cumbustion!
:D
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Long live cumbustion!
:D
Oh I wont write them off, but as I said Daniel, we have had batteries as part our lives for years. Making car batteries last to turn over motors at -40 C has pushed the technology forward, but as any Canadian who ever got up at 6am on a -30 or -40 day (I haven't seen but a few of those, but in western Canada or Northern Ontario and Quebec they see those) to go to work, the last thing you want to hear is your battery dying before the engine starts. We are VERY aware of the limitations of batteries in cold, so it probably colours my faith in the technology. Hey, if some car maker out there makes an electric car that WORKS, then hey, I am happy to be wrong, but that is the standard I am going to hold it to. It has to survive cold and long periods of it. Right now, It isn't even CLOSE.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Yep that is definitely a problem, probably the single biggest problem with hydrogen. I reckon its less of a problem with fuel cell merely because you can have a large battery to supply the motor if the hydrogen has run out to get you to the local supply station at least.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
I'm sure engineers could find a solution of sorts though, even if it is as inelegant as having a big battery on board or supplying a small hydrogen generator for the home for emergencies.
I've wondered about modular/swappable batteries and there's one big hitch. Essentially you're saying that there should be a one size fits all battery, fine in principle but that means that a large family car will by definition have a much shorter range than a low end but lighter two seater. I don't think the consumer will like that.
BTW Mark, Canada isn't the centre of the universe. I know a few people who own G-Wizs in London and who aren't environmentalists by any stretch of the imagination. That crude electric car certainly fulfils all their expectations already with few problems, and new ones in the pipeline will be better. Electric cars have a niche to fill and they fill it nicely.
http://www.dailytech.com/Hope+for+Hy...ticle17537.htmQuote:
Originally Posted by Dylan H
interesting :) Personally I think the fact that this not unsubstantial installation can only power 10-15 cars a day makes it unfeasible but still it's a start and it's interesting nonetheless
No...I can only say though we are not the only cold climate. Half of the US has similar weather to me, as does Russia, parts of China, Korea, Japan and Northern Europe. If the battery powered car wont work here in the soft part of Canada, it likely wont work in about 60% of the markets who are buying cars. It isn't a smart business plan to develop something that wont work half of the year in 60% of the car markets of the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan H
G-whiz's I am sure work great in congested London, but public transit there is so superior to most cars, I don't see any point in having a car to travel in the inner city of a metro location where there is an extensive subway and bus service. Where the electric car works in the same congested places cars are not as efficient to an extent as transit. Again, until that car is a CAR with all that entails and is an all weather solution, then it wont really sell to the masses. I don't care what country you are in, people buy cars usually because they want that personal convenience and the ability to carry a family possibly.
Yeah mass transit is definitely the way for day to day travel in big cities. When I was back in Oz I got a lift to the train station every day and then walked to work and then took the bus back and then walked home EVERY day. Only ever used a car once in just under 2 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
That doesn't really work as well as one would like in smaller centers like mine. We are a one car family right now and I am learning bus service once every 30 minutes sucks in the middle of winter...Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Ditto. Before we got the Fiat we were a one car family and shall we say every day past the ETA for the car we went Caroline was getting more and more pissed at that little car for not turning up....Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
I have to drive to Toronto 2 times a day right now if I want the car. Lucky for me, the boss works in the Eastern suburb of Scarborough and I can be there and back within the hour because she works a shift that starts after the morning rush and post the evening one. That said, I get another job, we will almost certainly need to put another car on the road.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
You raise some interesting examples there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
Lets take Northern Europe. In the UK, milk has been delivered to most urban homes for the past 40 years whatever the weather by electric milk floats. These things were crude way back when, now they look like museum pieces but you'll still find them working hard whatever the weather, whatever the temperature. So electric power works in cold weather.
Then you've got the Think which was one of the first properly usable electric cars on sale, designed in Norway where it is selling quite well. Norway is on a par with Canada when it comes to cold weather I believe. Of course there is the G-wiz which is selling well in London, still part of Northern Europe.
How about Denmark, I heard its pretty cold there too. They've got so little confidence in electric cars that they ran a pilot study with Better Place which found that lo and behold, electric cars do work in Denmark too and people are happy with them. Along with Israel, Denmark is investing 100s of millions of Euros to set up loads of electric charging points and battery swap stations and to lease thousands of electric cars.
How about China? Ever been there? Most Chinese can't be arsed to pedal their bicycles everywhere so they trade up to scooters as soon as they can afford them. Thing is noone buys petrol scooters if they can help it because electricity there is cheap as chips and petrol isn't. The roads there are already clogged up with electric powered scooters and bicycles.
Then you've got companies like BYD that build electric cars for the Chinese market and who are supposed to have more advanced technology than guys like GM and Toyota. Warren Buffett was so impressed by their chances that he invested $230 million into buying 10% of it. He's not often wrong.
I'm afraid events have already overtaken you to some extent Mark. In urban areas electric cars make sense. They may not work well in cold weather but that hasn't stopped them in the past and I don't think its going to stop them in the future.