Just interrupted the NFL Playoff Pre-Game Show.
I have my money on a Tea Party loyalist who committed this crime.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/us...er=rss&emc=rss
Printable View
Just interrupted the NFL Playoff Pre-Game Show.
I have my money on a Tea Party loyalist who committed this crime.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/us...er=rss&emc=rss
Of course Gloomy when it isn't, you will of course apologize for taking the actions of one kook and thinking it is typical of all members in that movement?
Damn tragedy no matter what happened, but I think if a deranged Tea Party guy was going to attack a liberal, he would take a run at someone bigger than just an ordinary congresswoman....
It is. The story I read was a gunman just walked into some political town hall meeting with the public and opened up on her. Regardless of one's politics, this sort of attack is disturbing and isn't what 99.9% of the population wants....Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
reports now in that shes at the hospital in surgery, but if shot in the head, thats not a good sign :(
may we hope for the best, this was actually one politician trying to BETTER the USA
Reports say, that up to twelve people were shot.
From what I read though, most reports are guesses.
One article said she had proposed a five percent pay cut for members of Congress, rather than T.E.A. party people, I would say Democrats in Congress; they like to take more money, not less.
Oh gee, on CNN the first gun control bs, has been spewed forth.
------
The have one suspect and are looking for a second.
---------------
From Fox nineteen people shot, and five dead.
-------------
CNN still ranting about guns.
Fousto was online at that time, so it couldn't have been him.
In much the same way as you deserve to be with comments like those above. Will you ever learn?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
What, you would prefer I blamed the "Tea" party?Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
Yet you took time to comment, on me, rather than the topic.
Makes you look rathe obtuse now, does it not?
In much the same way as you took time to make a political point which I considered unnecessary. Nowhere, I might add, did I do so. Oh, and you must get over this misuse of the word 'obtuse'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
Terrible news. Just heard it on the radio - from latest reports it suggests she is alive.
Why your lack of sharpness is obvious.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
Again, is it the fact I did not blame the "Tea" party as the thread starter did what bothers you?
You made no comment on that with your standard dullard response, addressing me rather than anything about the topic.
CNN has just sad six dead, an eighteen wounded.
From reading on her, she does seem to be in the spectrum of politicians opposite of the Pelosi style.
What is there to address on the topic at this stage?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
It seems a federal Judge was also killed.
What a marvellous demonstration this is of the veracity of rolling news coverage. We neither want nor need to know a death toll before it is confirmed, yet apparently others think otherwise — rightly, given the apparent appetite for such instant, yet often inaccurate, information.
IF you do not like it, do not read it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
-------
Fox has been reading posts from the alleged shooters log, and it appears- poor grammar- was one of the reasons for the shooting.
I am always puzzled why the more dead, the more newsworthy the story....hence the need to get the death toll going....
one death of a person should be enough
So you believe the way in which the modern rolling news media strive amongst themselves to be the first to report a death toll, for instance, is entirely acceptable and appropriate, even when it leads to premature and incorrect reporting? A perfect example was Sky News' Kay Burley on 11 September 2001, stating: 'If you're just joining us, the entire eastern seaboard of the United States has been decimated by a terrorist attack'. Personally, I would prefer the truth to be known before it is reported, but perhaps I'm old-fashioned in this regard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
Well enough is know about this guy now that it can be safely said he is a deranged loon, just like a Mark David Chapman or any of the other names we have in our society who have killed for no rational reason someone who is "famous". His anti government nonsense on You Tube was not even identifiable as having a point, which says to me he wouldn't know where to buy Iced Tea, much less be a member of the Tea Party.
Lets just chalk this up to a mentally unstable man with a gun on the loose and taking advantage of an opportunty to make himself famous... This guy isn't left or right, just nuts...
Isn't every shooter a deranged loon? Normal people don't kill eachother.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
Enough is known about him now? How, with respect, can you say that? Were you there? Did you know him? Have you been interviewing him in the aftermath of his arrest? Are you privy to his innermost thoughts? Or have you merely watched a few hours' worth of news coverage and drawn your views from that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
Go watch his video's on You Tube. I don't have the link, but if that is any indication of where this guy's mind is at, you wont disagree.....Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
I would not presume to suggest I knew anything about anyone from watching some videos on YouTube.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
Normally I wouldn't either....but I think I can safely say from this, it is evidence the elevator didn't go to the top.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
The point is Ben, too many people have tried to pin this on the Tea Party movement, as if all anyone in the movement wanted to do was shoot liberal politicans. A New Jersey paper I saw online had a headline stating "is Palin responsible?" Seriously, a lot of people have to get in off the ledge and look at the guy and realize he is like many of the psycho's, an opportunist with a whacked agenda that on he gets.
Well, that seems to be the issue settled. Why bother with a trial when we can all come to a verdict just like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
I would agree wholeheartedly with what the BBC's North America editor Mark Mardell has had to say on the matter, in a very balanced piece indeed on the BBC website.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
'We do not, as I write, know what lies behind the shooting of a Democratic congresswoman and others in Arizona at a political meeting.
But it is an indication of the febrile, volatile nature of politics in America that, immediately the news broke, the internet was alive with anger, a dispute between the left and the right.
The congresswoman, Gabrielle Giffords, had been one of 20 names on a "hit list" issued by Sarah Palin, complete with graphics of a rifle-like telescopic sight. Ms Palin, of course, meant that she was to be targeted by voters in the mid-term elections.
But after the shooting, Ms Palin's Facebook site was filled with people blaming her for creating the atmosphere where this could happen. Equally, Twitter was full of right-wingers accusing the left of reacting before they knew the facts, or even blaming the left for the shooting.
Sarah Palin has issued a statement saying: "My sincere condolences are offered to the family of Rep Gabrielle Giffords and the other victims of today's tragic shooting in Arizona.
"On behalf of Todd and my family, we all pray for the victims and their families, and for peace and justice."
President Barack Obama has also put out a statement, calling the shooting an "unspeakable tragedy", adding: "We do not yet have all the answers. What we do know is that such a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society."
This shooting may or may not have anything at all to do with politics. But it has become part of the political story already.'
No- in this case- having switched between two sources, one made sure to repeatedly state nothing they said was absolute they were only going by what they were being told; the other, did no such thing, and repeatedly politicized the event from the get-go.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
One did it correctly, and the other showed an agenda.
I can only loathe to imagine, what MSNBC was doing.
I turned off the TV and turned on a radio station where a talk-show host was first on the liberal show that preceded hers, she is conservative, and then on her own, brought on another show-host.
She asked her audience, to call in over break, whether they wanted to continue with discussing the shooting or go to her preplanned subjects.
Obviously as she brought in the guest, they preferred to hear of the shooting.
She said to her guest that she did not want to politicize the shooting but her guest said it was too late that, that had already started and to pretend other wise was naive.
NOW- that this will be covered continually, to the point that other news, equally or more important, will ignored, that is disgusting.
-----------
I no longer have source to foreign, news outlets, at least in a breaking-news format but I am interested to hear how they will cover this; espcially the Financial Times.
----------------
Only in a convoluted, or in a deliberate manner with an agenda, could Sarah Palin, in any manner, be said to be linked to this even in even the slightest manner.
His web sight- is said to say- that he was a fan of the Communist Manifesto and Fascist Party literature.
Why did the BBC not mention that?
Can you honestly say that you would have posted all of the above had it been a Republican politician who had been shot? I ask that question entirely seriously.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
Absolutely.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
Although in a morbid speculation, it would be interesting to somehow know how it would have been handled had the victim been a conservative.
Good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
Well Ben, there has to be trial but when you are seen by a couple hundred witnesses and tackled by some while you are shooting into the crowd, I think the worst District Attorney in the US could still get a conviction.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
The BBC quote you had does sum up what is wrong with American politics right now. It is so heated and full of nonsense that when someone actually steps over the line and does something hideous like this, both sides have their people who try to say it is the fault of...well no, it isn't the fault of anyone but a sick man feeding off the negative energy of modern politics getting his mitts on a weapon and using it against someone who didn't deserve to be attacked in any way shape or form.
My point still remains, by trying to claim this guy is left motivated or right motivated, it clouds the reality. The guy was nuts.....that is my opinion yes Ben, but I think there is nothing I have read all day that tells me that his motives were anything but that of an anarchist, who oppose all order, left or right...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
That is a question I openly thought about when some loon film maker had the movie "the Assassination of George W. Bush" out there..and I thought...ya...what if someone actually does, and it turns out he was from the American left? Oh boy...there are more than few people on the radical fringe that would have a hard time spinning that one, and it is no different if this loon was a regular Tea party leader and ate dinner at Sarah Palin's house last week. The fact is, thank god he was neither. He was acting on his own little agenda.....and the ******* will rot in jail for a long time if they don't actually find a way to put the death penalty on him.
I can't say this question bothers me for one moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Riebe
All very well and good — after all, one thinks of incidents in other countries, such as the courthouse shooting in Switzerland a few years ago — but it's quite a convenient get-out clause if it turns out the man was in some respect politically motivated, no matter what his mental state might be. There are, I might add, individuals considered to be in the American political and media mainstream whose mental state I would quite genuinely question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark in Oshawa
Open-season on moderate Congressional representatives.
I bet some Arizonans aren't too disturbed that this happened.
Hell, I bet some of them even believe it was divine intervention.
Giffords may be the first of many.
Some day this country is going to have to wake up to it's ridiculous obsession with guns and the wholly outdated constitutional right to bear arms. Until then we have to stomach these dreadful crimes, and wait for the next shooting. Some will even justify the right because of such incidents. Madness.
I don't think that this really has to do with the 2nd Amendment. Most Americans are responsible gun owners. What concerns me more is that this type of behavior will become socially acceptable. A loud mouth armchair expert is going to tell a bunch of TV watching zombies that the death of a politician is appropriate towards achieving their goal of a new America. The United States is on a knife edge of rage, despair, and total indiscretion for the well-being of their neighbors who have ideological differences. The rift is just getting wider and this may get ugly...Quote:
Originally Posted by shazbot
Most Americans are responsible guns owners. Most, not all - and there's the rub. As long as there are responsible gun owners there will be also be the irresponsible, and dangerous owners. The right to bear arms is as old as the hills and I believe has its roots in the English constitution as far as the USA is concerned. I can't help but feel that in 2011 it's a somewhat outdated ideal in a civilized society. Of course there will always be a way to get a weapon however tight the law, but why make it so easy?
This is a horrible event and I am sad for those involved. This really has no bearing on the right to bear arms. The islams have proved you don't need a gun. This is about the kooks living among us. There was probably no way to intercept this idiot as freedom of speech would allow his websites. Quite frankly they were not that bad, I have probably said worse.
With respect to gun ownership I think we need to get the country on the same page. Some poor guy got a 7 year sentence for buying a gun legally. We have many many foolish laws on the the books and we really need to address these situations.
This horrible event will probably end up restricting public people even further from their loyal followers. I understand this congresswoman for some reason had received many threats prior to this incident. Therefore prudent actions would and should have dictated security.
Unfortunately the world is going to have these events on a daily basis. Look at the horrible bombings all over the world. It is sad and someday I guess we can expect some kook to pull the big pin.