Loeb will test Renault F1 car

[alleskids]

Sebastien Loeb will drive a Renault R27 Formula 1 car. Despite the fact that the French carmaker is a direct competitior to the also French Citroen. The test is organised, on 5 December, on the Paul Rchard circuit, by Total/Elf. In return Heikki Kovaleinen wil drive the Citroen C4 WRcar.

Kovailainen is no stranger to WRCars, he has had succes in the Race of Champion with different kind of cars, including the Citroen XCsara WRCar. I am curieus how Loeb will do in the F1 car.

[1LM1]

So do I.

And if I am not mistaken, Sordo will drive the Renault F1 too.

As far as Kovalainen, the last news I read states: "either Kovalainen or Fisichella will drive the C4 WRC". Maybe in case Kovalainen would join McLaren and would no more be a "Total/Elf" driver by then?

[Magnus]

Didnt Kovalainen beat Loeb in ROC in a Xsara?

[1LM1]

He did beat him in 2005 (don't remenber if it was with the Xsara or with the buggy though). Actually, Loeb was first to cross the finish line but was disqualified because of a slight contact with the fence.

[J4MIE]

but was disqualified because of a slight contact with the fence.

Never having shown an interest in the ROC before, I really doubt I will now :s

[1LM1]

Never having shown an interest in the ROC before, I really doubt I will now :s

Yes, strange rule for rally fans like us. In 2006, each contact led to 10 seconds penalty instead of disqualification but that was the same effect.

The organizer was too afraid the track would evolve too much with all these contacts, that's why this rule existed and will continue to exist this year at Wembley I suppose.

[Finni]

He did beat him in 2005 (don't remenber if it was with the Xsara or with the buggy though). Actually, Loeb was first to cross the finish line but was disqualified because of a slight contact with the fence.

You remember wrong. It was their second start with sport-cars were Loeb was disqualified due to hit to the wall. In the first start Kovalainen beated Loeb with Peugeot 307 wrc. Kovalainen's time was also better than all previous times set with 307 wrc (by Loeb other rally drivers).

[N.O.T]

well Loeb is no starnger to cuircuit racing so i think the test isn;t going to be something totally new.

[alleskids]

Loeb raced sport prototypes in Le Mans. A (2007) F1 car is just a bit lighter, power fuller and heavier on the brakes than a sports car. It differences like a 2006 Group N to a 2007 WRCar. And it is special that a Citroen man drives a Renault car. Normally it is quite sensetive I believe, just as Japanese carnmakers don';t like to see their drivers in other Japanese cars.

[1LM1]

You remember wrong. It was their second start with sport-cars were Loeb was disqualified due to hit to the wall. In the first start Kovalainen beated Loeb with Peugeot 307 wrc. Kovalainen's time was also better than all previous times set with 307 wrc (by Loeb other rally drivers).

Ok. Thanks for the full explanation. So Loeb was quicker one time out of two in his duel with Heikki. But Kovalainen won 2-0 due to Loeb disqualification. And Kovalainen was quicker with the 307 WRC, that's right. Now I remember.

And I remember also that the 307 WRC was quicker than the Xsara WRC on this track.

[1LM1]

Loeb raced sport prototypes in Le Mans. A (2007) F1 car is just a bit lighter, power fuller and heavier on the brakes than a sports car. It differences like a 2006 Group N to a 2007 WRCar. And it is special that a Citroen man drives a Renault car. Normally it is quite sensetive I believe, just as Japanese carnmakers don';t like to see their drivers in other Japanese cars.


Absolutely true! I was very surprised when I heard about this. It's the first time ever that works drivers from PSA and Renault will swap their seats in a official event like this.
I think it will stay an exception.

[MJW]

Its strange for Renault and PSA to allow this, historically there has been much rivalry between the two sides of French car manufacturing. Having said that I expect that Loeb's laptime will be stunning. Personally, if Citroen withdraw from rally I can see Loeb stopping rally and go racing - at a very high level and do well.

[Tom206wrc]

I would have had prefered Loeb to test the Peugeot 908 HDI Le Mans... :rolleyes:

[Brother John]

Its strange for Renault and PSA to allow this, historically there has been much rivalry between the two sides of French car manufacturing. Having said that I expect that Loeb's laptime will be stunning. Personally, if Citroen withdraw from rally I can see Loeb stopping rally and go racing - at a very high level and do well.

As I said already before, Loeb belongs in Le Mans and racing.

[janneppi]

Yeah, hes much too good a driver to be wasted on rallying. :p :

[jonkka]

Abhorring to get such a stain on oneself... :eek:

[ShiftingGears]

Yeah, hes much too good a driver to be wasted on rallying. :p :

LOL

[Roy]

Absolutely true! I was very surprised when I heard about this. It's the first time ever that works drivers from PSA and Renault will swap their seats in a official event like this.
I think it will stay an exception.

Total/Elf is a major partner of both carmakers. That is IMO why he can drive that F1 car. Good marketing idea by the petrol company.

Nice Kovailainen drives a WRCar. That gives media support on rally.

[Magnus]

As I said already before, Loeb belongs in Le Mans and racing.

I do not fancy this ongoing bashing of Loeb. Even if he isn´t a one-liner like Bosse or a hollywood-run-way as Solberg, he could be the most talented driver of all time, and seems to be a nice bloke at the same time. To ask of him to go to **** is the same as asking him to leave rallying for ** **** or ****** as a whole.

[alleskids]

Loeb has shown that he is exceptional on tarmac, either in a WRcar or a Sportscar, and now he can show his skills in a F1 car. But he has lost his "tarmac only-driver" tag, that gets sticked to all south European drivers in the beginning, and French drver especially. With halve of his WRC wins on gravel, he has become the most allround rally driver ever seen in (modern) autosport scene. So his debut in the Renault F1 car is just a reward for his skills, and not a sneaky move from the last members and their supporters of Finnisch Rally Mafia to get rid of Loeb from WRC :) .

[Magnus]

Sorry: couldn´t find a appropriate smiley for my post, so I had to express it in words instead. Oh these words...

[COD]

Nice Kovailainen drives a WRCar. That gives media support on rally.

Kovalainen is no stranger to WRC, he has been a co-driver in Arctic Rally twice in a WRC Focus. The second time he actually drove a couple of stages and made an impressive time on the last stage of the rally. He has also said that he would very much like to drive that rally one day.

[alleskids]

Kovalainen has teached Gronholm how to drive tarmac lines some time ago. In what type of car was it?
Anyway, a rally car is indeed no stranger for Heiki. So I hope Citroen will give him a propper test, so he can compare his times with Sebastien.

[Tomi]

Kovalainen is no stranger to WRC, he has been a co-driver in Arctic Rally twice in a WRC Focus. The second time he actually drove a couple of stages and made an impressive time on the last stage of the rally. He has also said that he would very much like to drive that rally one day.

True but the rest of the drivers was not trying anymore, sofar no rallydriver has not showed anything special in a F1 and same thing the other way around, My guess is that Loeb will do like the others before him.

[alleskids]

Colin McRae did a test in a Jordan in 1996, and he came within respectable time compared to the regular driver. Tommie Makinen did a kind of PR run in a Williams 1998, more for the show than for speed.
Although both drivers were good at tarmac in their time, Loeb is the real master of tarmas. So I rate Loeb higher and beter qualified to represent the rally scene in the F1 scene.

http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=YaLoBqHw2oM (McRae in the Jordan)

[alleskids]

I read somewere that the test will take 3 days? Can someone from the French members confirm or deny it?

[traxx]

Only 1 day (5 december) on Paul Ricard track

[koko0703]

It will be fun event for all of the motorsports fans. Just like everybody else, I'm curious about Loeb's lap time and how Kovalinen handles a rally car although I preferably wanted Raikkonen in a rally car than Kovalinen.

[alleskids]

Maybe if Gronholm becomes world championship, the two Finnisch championships can swap cars. Jean Todt, the boss of Ferrari sport would appreciate it as a former navigator.

[Sulland]

Loeb will surprise us with his times in the F1 car !!!

[Zes]

Tommie Makinen did a kind of PR run in a Williams 1998, more for the show than for speed.


Sure Tommi did have some speed. He went off when driving 252km/h...

[Micke_VOC]

I think a rally driver does a better time in a F1 then a F1 driver does in a WRC rallycar...
Have some weak memories of Toivonen tested on Spa on something in the 80´s and did a real respectable time... anyone remember that ?

[Brother John]

I think a rally driver does a better time in a F1 then a F1 driver does in a WRC rallycar...
Have some weak memories of Toivonen tested on Spa on something in the 80´s and did a real respectable time... anyone remember that ?

Yes I was there, i remember that! http://www.autosportforum.be/images/icons/icon14.gif

[Josti]

I think a rally driver does a better time in a F1 then a F1 driver does in a WRC rallycar...
Have some weak memories of Toivonen tested on Spa on something in the 80´s and did a real respectable time... anyone remember that ?

Well, he was just as a good racingdriver as a rallydriver :)

[alleskids]

With the Rally ireland scalp in his pocket, Loeb has won every tarmac rally of the (modern) WRC. The only other driver who has won the grand slam of the older tamrac rallies (Monte Carlo, Corsica, Sanremo and Catalunya) is Auriol. The other great champions of all terrains, Makinen, McRae and Sainz have only 3 out of 4. Too bad Loeb did not won Le Mans (so far), but he showed in his 2 appearence that he is close to the specialists. I can hardly waith to see him in a F1 car.

[Kamikaze]

Maybe Loeb should change to F1 complete ?

So he can drive the whole Season on Tarmac :D :D :D

[Brother John]

Maybe Loeb should change to F1 complete ?

So he can drive the whole Season on Tarmac :D :D :D

:up: I was thinking the same! :p :

[1LM1]

It will be interesting to compare his time with Sordo's.

Unfortunatetly, as it will only be a 1 day test, it won't be worth comparing his time with F1 drivers' times.

Even Hakkinen was more than 3 seconds off the pace earlier this year and it was a 3 days test! Moreover the guy is a former and still young F1 world champion.

You obviouly need to do many many kilometers before pushing and trying to find the limit with an F1 car.

I expect Seb to be quicker than Dani (due to Loeb's experience with proto at Le Mans and Loeb's talent on circuit) but at least 6/7 seconds off the pace on a normal length track and probably more (8/9 seconds off the pace). 6/7 seconds off the pace would be very impressive considering his lack of experience and the shortness of the test. I don't even know if it's realistic.

And there is another problem: will we be able to get a F1 benchmark in order to compare? The HTTT offers hundreds of configurations. Maybe the idea is to use a configuration not used by F1 cars. Bad idea if it's the case.

Not to mention that the difficulty for Loeb and Sordo will depend on how many fast curves the configuration will offer I suppose.

[Isthmus]

Is it today? Where can we see anything about?
It creates expectations, but lacks infos about it.

[Daniel]

It will be interesting to compare his time with Sordo's.

Unfortunatetly, as it will only be a 1 day test, it won't be worth comparing his time with F1 drivers' times.

Even Hakkinen was more than 3 seconds off the pace earlier this year and it was a 3 days test! Moreover the guy is a former and still young F1 world champion.

You obviouly need to do many many kilometers before pushing and trying to find the limit with an F1 car.

I expect Seb to be quicker than Dani (due to Loeb's experience with proto at Le Mans and Loeb's talent on circuit) but at least 6/7 seconds off the pace on a normal length track and probably more (8/9 seconds off the pace). 6/7 seconds off the pace would be very impressive considering his lack of experience and the shortness of the test. I don't even know if it's realistic.

And there is another problem: will we be able to get a F1 benchmark in order to compare? The HTTT offers hundreds of configurations. Maybe the idea is to use a configuration not used by F1 cars. Bad idea if it's the case.

Not to mention that the difficulty for Loeb and Sordo will depend on how many fast curves the configuration will offer I suppose.
I doubt he will be that far behind. Even lesser cars with lesser drivers can do times faster than that. In a proper car Seb will be faster than that.

[Daniel]

Someone PM'ed me saying that Loeb was 1 second behind Kovalainen in the test. Don't know how correct that is but it's about what I'd expect from Sebastien.

[kakus]

Someone PM'ed me saying that Loeb was 1 second behind Kovalainen in the test. Don't know how correct that is but it's about what I'd expect from Sebastien.


Loeb : 1'05"04

Kovalainen : 1'04"05


After 20 laps for Loeb.

[traxx]

A short video here :
http://wrc.is.free.fr/posts/2007/12/05/421-loeb-au-volant-de-la-renault-f1

[mdesign]

less than one second? wow I'm impressed

[Zico]

Anyone know if the Reno had TC?... Its still a amazing achievement if it did, but if not... its absolutely phenomenal !

[gloomyDAY]

Amazing! I was hoping for these results.

[ShiftingGears]

Loeb : 1'05"04

Kovalainen : 1'04"05


After 20 laps for Loeb.

Was that compared with Kovalainens lap time last year?

[santori]

On the AtlasF1 forum, the poster AFCA says that he set a time of 1'5"0, just four tenths behind Kovalainen.

[Finni]

If the difference was only 0.4 sec there must have been external factors. In that case Heikki probably drove only few laps at the start and sweeped the track from dust. Does anyone know what was Sordo's time? Did he same number of laps with Seb?

By the way Heikki is extremely talented in rallying. He has done only two proper stages in his life and he instantly was fast in difficult conditions (Tunturi rally in the evening). If I remember he lost only seven second to Kristian Sohlberg (tough Solberg was taking it easy as there was no more competition). Everyone knows that few years back Heikki won Seb clearly with Peugeot 307 wrc and set the fastest time of the day with that car (despite the fact that Seb had done many run with it).

[Daniel]

If the difference was only 0.4 sec there must have been external factors. In that case Heikki probably drove only few laps at the start and sweeped the track from dust. Does anyone know what was Sordo's time? Did he same number of laps with Seb?

By the way Heikki is extremely talented in rallying. He has done only two proper stages in his life and he instantly was fast in difficult conditions (Tunturi rally in the evening). If I remember he lost only seven second to Kristian Sohlberg (tough Solberg was taking it easy as there was no more competition). Everyone knows that few years back Heikki won Seb clearly with Peugeot 307 wrc and set the fastest time of the day with that car (despite the fact that Seb had done many run with it).
But at the end of the day it was only a SSS. Rallying is so much more than SSS's

[kakus]

Was that compared with Kovalainens lap time last year?

No ,

It was the same day and the same car.

[N.O.T]

A driving genius......

[Zico]

The car must have had TC...

[Simmi]

The car must have had TC...

It was an R26 in this test which is the 2006 car so it will have had traction control.

Very impressive if these times are true. Say what you want about his domination in the WRC. A lot of people don't like him but the stuff he does simply demands respect.

[AndyRAC]

Haven't seen much of it reported over here, which is no great surprise, especially as Hamilton was testing at Jerez. His time is no great surprise though, a fantastic talent driving a car, no matter what type, just look at Le Mans last year. Genius is often overused but this guy is one.

[MikeD]

Wow. That's really impressive. I wonder if Renault F1 would like to test him again ... e.g. on a long stint and a short stint, to see if he actually could switch from WRC to F1.

[Simmi]

I think the team will have bigger things on their plate depending on how todays hearing goes down. Should be fairly close to finding out what penalty the team will be handed.

[Finni]

According to french eurosport the difference to Heikki was one second.

Frequelin said that Kovalainen drove astonishingly well with C4. He doubt that Kovalainen has got some training from Marcus Grönholm as Heikki and Marcus are good friends.

[miksu]

According to french eurosport the difference to Heikki was one second.

Frequelin said that Kovalainen drove astonishingly well with C4. He doubt that Kovalainen has got some training from Marcus Grönholm as Heikki and Marcus are good friends.

yep, something like this according to MTV3

"Heikki was amazing with Citroen C4. I talked about it with Sebastian and Dani and he seemed to feel like at home behind the streering wheel of C4," said Frequelin.

"As i know, he is good friends with Marcus and i believe Marcus have given some instructions to him. We already wait Heikki to WRC," joked Frequelin.

"In some places Heikki was drifting little bit too much with the car, but as total he drove well. He was attacking everywhere. I noticed he has lots of self-confidense. He did with the car what ever he wanted to", Loeb said.

[traxx]

Another video :
http://wrc.is.free.fr/posts/2007/12/06/424-loeb-en-f1-kovaleinen-en-wrc-pour-un-jour-en-images

[SubaruNorway]

Kovalainen driving the C4 http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=1929371&ch=1929371&src=ukeurosport

[Micke_VOC]

impressing driving of both drivers !!!!

[A.F.F.]

Kovalainen driving the C4 http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=1929371&ch=1929371&src=ukeurosport

Biggest difference? There's no grip and no power :laugh: :up:

[1LM1]

Yes, very impressed by both drivers :up:
Amazing!

[1LM1]

http://www.eurosport.fr/rallye/saison/2007/mcplayervideo_vid58591.shtml

Interesting long interview with Loeb (but in French only) dated from yesterday evening after the F1 test.

He explains that the C4 was perfect all season long. He really enjoyed the battle with Marcus under these conditions. He says he was not confident before the season started because he had not entered a race for so long due to his accident and because the car was new. He reveals that a very different than usual set up which turned out not good played a part in the substandard performance in Finland.

Interesting. Maybe he can do better over there next year?

[Finni]

I think that Heikki wouldn't need many rallyes or many km's to beat Matt Wilson and likes.

[Finni]

http://www.eurosport.fr/rallye/saison/2007/mcplayervideo_vid58591.shtml
He reveals that a very different than usual set up which turned out not good played a part in the substandard performance in Finland.

This makes sense. I also wondered why Loeb was so slow (many stages as slow as Atkinson!) in Finland because one year back he gave good fight for Marcus. It was not all down to new Focus.

[Tomi]

sounds a little strange the setting thing, after all they have tested 2006 and 2007 in finland, and there is no rule that phrobid to change settings, but offcourse its possible.

[Isthmus]

Guy Frenquelin talked about that before NZ, that they used a wrong set-up in Finland , showed a few tests after and they would be a lot more competitive in NZ....and it was.