Robin Miller and his interpretation of TEAM program

[ChicagocrewIRL]

http://www.speedtv.com/commentary/40740/

RM seems to think the effect of the new revenue sharing program will be minimal

due to the equally minimal dollar amounts being offered to teams by the IRL. He

points out that even though money in CCWS is significantly smaller than in the

IRL, a lot of the teams in CCWS won't switch because the cost is still

substantially greater in the IRL and they would not be competitive with the

super teams. Even the "lesser" teams in Champ Car can run upfront once in a

while.

One thing I will credit CCWS drivers and teams with as that they are in it for

the love of the sport. Cuz, it certainly isn't for the money. Honestly, it is

admirable that the CCWS stalwarts keep plugging away. RM's article really

underscored this fact to me.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Miller's points are dead on though with the fact Champ Car teams below N/H/L have a better chance of winning over there. With Penske, Ganassi and AGR running their superteams, everyone else is just field fillers in the IRL. It in theory shouldn't be that way, but that is the reality.

Champ Car needs something, and they cant get it if they don't run one off's at Indy to get sponsors, but they refuse to do it. Just another symptom of the insanity of this situation.

There isn't enough money, fans or interest to support two series. Never has been, never will be, but the myth continues.

[indycool]

We're in the IRL's silly season, but not in the CC silly season yet, so we don't know what effect the new program will have as far as teams go. My guess is that, since the reality of it is that it costs about the same to run either series (IMO, CC being cheaper is a myth), some race teams from series other than CC might take a closer look....and once the season is over and/or a CC schedule is announced, the CC teams will line up at KK's wallet and say, "I need $1.2 million."

[Wraith]

Maybe I'm totally off my rocker, but I think the IRL could attract more teams if they allowed anyone to enter their own independent chassis and engines, so long as they run it themselves. The moment they sell it, it can't be to "fixed teams" like what happened in the late 80s, but to anyone who wants one. Also: allowing a lot more innovation would be the key to defeating the giants, but it seems no one upstairs believes this...or, possibly, gives a damn.

[CCFan]

Maybe I'm totally off my rocker, but I think the IRL could attract more teams if they allowed anyone to enter their own independent chassis and engines, so long as they run it themselves. The moment they sell it, it can't be to "fixed teams" like what happened in the late 80s, but to anyone who wants one. Also: allowing a lot more innovation would be the key to defeating the giants, but it seems no one upstairs believes this...or, possibly, gives a damn.


Money buys innovation. Unless you can come up with a new technology that no one else has thought of, you're not likely to get the edge without spending big.

Colin Chapman, IMO, was among the last of the great innovators, proven by his implementation of underbody tunnels for ground effects, before anyone else had thought of it.

There are probably few secrets anymore to going fast & who could likely outspend Honda on the way to implementing those secrets first?

[Jag_Warrior]

It's not the lack of chassis competition that's keeping teams out of the IRL, it's the lack of commercial value relative to costs.

George's idea is to provide funds to teams that are already struggling to make ends meet. Open up the chassis or engine rules and the rich will get richer (they can afford to do the development), and the poor will get poorer (it's all they can do now to lease sealed engines and set-up a relatively spec chassis).

[Wraith]

The rich are already getting richer in IRL. The three superteams have taken basically equal technology, where everyone has to buy the same thing, and made it work in ways that have given the little guys basically no chance to compete...which is basically how it's been for 80+ years. If I'm going to see dominance by a select elite (which always happens, apparently), I'd like to see some difference between their cars, for the novelty and ingenuity factor.

[Jag_Warrior]

As far as I know, the current rules in the IRL allow for more chassis modifications than in say, Champ Car. While I believe the Honda/Ilmor engines that are delivered to Penske, Ganassi or AGR are the same as those delivered to D&R or Foyt, their Dallaras don't necessarily have the same bits & pieces at every level. But yes, they do generally look the same.

I agree with the premise that a variety of chassis makes for a better viewing experience. And if that translates to increased returns, by way of increased TV viewership or attendance, it might be possible to cover the increases in R&D, engineering and production costs. But right now, the returns are not there. And I can't see why sponsors would pony up more money, for a series that already has issues delivering acceptable "exposure value" returns. Penske did an interview a couple of years ago where he spoke about the ease with which he could put together a fully sponsored four car NASCAR Nextel Cup operation. But he couldn't secure the sponsorship for even a three car IRL operation. Now, with ride-buyers or "celebrity" type drivers, I'm sure he could. But (to his credit), he doesn't play the game that way.

So yes, absolutely, I agree with having all sorts of different aero shapes and styles on the track at once. I just don't see who would pay for it in the current environment. AOWR is running in cost containment mode for a reason: neither series seems to know how to increase returns, sponsor value and revenue. So they are focusing (maybe too much?) on containing and reducing costs.

[indycool]

Well thought out, Jag. During this period, sponsor, driver, car owner, track owner and sanctioning body hafta level the playing field all the way around to make it work right.

[Wraith]

Although I agree with you in principle, except for that one thing: leveling the playing field has done nothing to limit the domination of the superteams. Therefore, the reason they dominate (despite official NASCARish attempts to enforce equality of every single kind) has to be deeper than just their equipment, but what they do with it once they have it. And I guess this is the fundamental difference in thinking between us, in this discussion: I don't see money as the be all and end all reason teams win. Goodyear did finish second in '92, after all.

Also, I don't believe the limits of the car have been tapped out at all. The potential always exists for a small glowing cube to someday power cars. If it's more environmentally friendly, goes faster, and makes the thing lighter, I am quite unlike the USACers who want to ban the thing from the tracks. But...that's me, and ironically I've loved USAC.

[mark123]

could it not be that the reason the to 3 teams are so much better then the rest is that they employ the best drivers and crew, whereas the lessor teams tend to exist from hand to mouth, using sponsorship money and drivers of lessor quality or experience. also, the big budget teams would strip the car down after every race and put new components on each corner whereas the lessor teams may try to get another race in to save money, and hence have more machanical failures.

guys, find me any series anywhere in the world where the low budget teams beat the big budget teams - thats motorsport.

[gofastandwynn]

First team to join thanks to TEAM. Roth Racing with 2 full time cars for Mart Roth and 2006 Indy Pro Champion Jay Howard.

[Wraith]

could it not be that the reason the to 3 teams are so much better then the rest is that they employ the best drivers and crew, whereas the lessor teams tend to exist from hand to mouth, using sponsorship money and drivers of lessor quality or experience. also, the big budget teams would strip the car down after every race and put new components on each corner whereas the lessor teams may try to get another race in to save money, and hence have more machanical failures.

guys, find me any series anywhere in the world where the low budget teams beat the big budget teams - thats motorsport.

With the new financial model, one would think that this reality would mean they could allow the high budget teams (strike that, ANY team at all) to experiment and innovate more...bringing this to small circle.