Your view on FIA impartiality

[janneppi]

Now here's a poll for the haters. :p :

In the light of what's been talked about over the last years and now the last months, in which pocket where do you think FIA's hand is?

[Sleeper]

Whichever pocket serves them at the moment.

[Ian McC]

A hell of a lot more impartial than this forum will ever be!

Shame on you Janneppi for starting this! :mad: :p :

[markabilly]

Now here's a poll for the haters. :p :

In the light of what's been talked about over the last years and now the last months, in which pocket where do you think FIA's hand is?


In which ever pocket they think the money is in----follow the money as they said in Watergate, and everything else falls into place,

so I suppose the big money is the answer that comes closest

and LH is only the golden boy because that is where the money is or will come from now that Schumi is gone, or so Bernie thinks.....same for ferrari, it ain't love for big red, it is the question of who is the better investment as they perceive it...the rest is just smoke and mirrors..... :vader:

they would sell out bernie in a heartbeat, if the nmony was good enough, so thanser about bernie is somewhat inocrrect---you need to add another that says "money" for me to vote

[Hondo]

Ferrari. Ferrari is F1 worldwide. Ferrari is big money. Ferrari is legend. Ferrari has always supported the FIA and stuck with them through all the break away threats. When Ferrari talks, people listen. When Spyker talks, people say "Who?". Ferrari is the jewel in the FIA crown.

Not bad for a company owned by Fiat.

[Flat.tyres]

My word, I thought Pino had forgotten about my request :laugh:

I have gone with Ferrari but that's because they have been an intrinsic part of F1 and the £££ (note to the yanks, not $$$) for a long time. It could be A or C.

[trumperZ06]

:p : FIA = Ferrari International Assistance.

:dozey: Mad Max and his cronies have favored Ferrari for the past few years. It's been in the FIA's interest to assure that Ferrari was the major team in F-1.

;) It's always about the MONEY!!! Due to Micheal Schumacher & Ferrari's World Wide reputation... they have been the cornerstone... drawing the casual fan's interest to watch Formula One.

:s mokin:

[ioan]

Ferrari. Ferrari is F1 worldwide. Ferrari is big money. Ferrari is legend. Ferrari has always supported the FIA and stuck with them through all the break away threats. When Ferrari talks, people listen. When Spyker talks, people say "Who?". Ferrari is the jewel in the FIA crown.

Not bad for a company owned by Fiat.

Than why had Ferrari to wait 21 years for a WDC title? Surely the FIA could have helped them if they love them that much! :p :

[trumperZ06]

Than why had Ferrari to wait 21 years for a WDC title? Surely the FIA could have helped them if they love them that much! :p :

;) Ferrari was lost... wandering in the Wilderness...

until MS and his associates moved over to the Italian Stallon.

When Schuey & his gang turned Ferrari around, the international rise in viewership, sent a Strong message to Bernie & Max.

It was far easier to bring in the casual... third World country's fan, if you gave them something to follow, that they reconignized.

:s mokin:

[Hondo]

Than why had Ferrari to wait 21 years for a WDC title? Surely the FIA could have helped them if they love them that much! :p :

I'm well aware of that. I suffered right along with them. There was nothing sarcastic in that post.

[BDunnell]

Than why had Ferrari to wait 21 years for a WDC title? Surely the FIA could have helped them if they love them that much! :p :

In my opinion, the accusations of FIA bias were wrong when everyone was going on about them constantly favouring Ferrari and they are wrong now. A lot of people are too fond of conspiracies.

[tinchote]

In my opinion, the accusations of FIA bias were wrong when everyone was going on about them constantly favouring Ferrari and they are wrong now. A lot of people are too fond of conspiracies.

:up:

[Ian McC]

:laugh:

My vote for 'the good of F1 as a sport, yeah right' is looking rather lonely indeed! :D

[Dazz9908]

Than why had Ferrari to wait 21 years for a WDC title? Surely the FIA could have helped them if they love them that much! :p :
That answers easy,
All things were kind of fair, then along came MAD Max Mosley!

HE and at the time Bernie, saw F1's only survival was with the success of Ferrari. Due to the demise of many a great team,such as Lotus, Brabham & Alfa Romeo :mad: (Parent Company being bought by Fiat, of all companies) [plus later Tyrrell {God Bless you uncle Ken, RIP :( }, and Ligier].

Max's FIA and Luca Cordero di Montezemolo's Ferrari Began tight bond which lasts to this day.

Having Saying that of Bernie, fearing the loss of McLaren has Moved more to the center of political fairness.

[ioan]

:laugh:

My vote for 'the good of F1 as a sport, yeah right' is looking rather lonely indeed! :D

I was wondering who did it! ;)

[CarlMetro]

I thought Moderators were supposed to be impartial?

:rolleyes:

Come back Andrea, all is forgiven.

[Mark]

I thought Moderators were supposed to be impartial?


Who told you that? :crazy: Lies! :p

[janneppi]

I thought Moderators were supposed to be impartial?

:rolleyes:

Come back Andrea, all is forgiven.
I try to be impartial towards the forum, but since this place isn't an official part of FIA why should I be impartial towards F1? :)

I do hope you understood the options given contained some humor in them.

[SGWilko]

The FIA is not impartial, period.

JMB - had a personal vendetta against Senna (because Senna beat Prost, and JMB is French)

Moseley - Ha s personal vendetta against RD/McLaren. He uses his legal background to make a mockery of his "drivers cannot be excluded bacause I say so" but in the second breath said they should be excluded.

Then there is the very abundantly clear Ferrari bias.....

[ioan]

The FIA is not impartial, period.

JMB - had a personal vendetta against Senna (because Senna beat Prost, and JMB is French)

Moseley - Ha s personal vendetta against RD/McLaren. He uses his legal background to make a mockery of his "drivers cannot be excluded bacause I say so" but in the second breath said they should be excluded.

Then there is the very abundantly clear Ferrari bias.....

Moseley's personal vendetta against RD must be because they beat Ferrari and because MM is English, I mean Italian, no wait... errr... got me lost there! :p :

[Flat.tyres]

Moseley's personal vendetta against RD must be because they beat Ferrari and because MM is English, I mean Italian, no wait... errr... got me lost there! :p :

MM and RD have had a ongoing battle for decades. nIt's well documented in the same way as Bernie is English (allegedly) and has a hate relationship with the British GP.

[SGWilko]

MM and RD have had a ongoing battle for decades. nIt's well documented in the same way as Bernie is English (allegedly) and has a hate relationship with the British GP.

I think the breaking of the Oxes back for MM, was at Indy '05, when RD threatened an immediate break away if any of the Michelin teams were fined for no shows.

Sorry, no link, but trawl through Autosport, its there somewhere, but you may need to be subscribed.

[ioan]

I think the breaking of the Oxes back for MM, was at Indy '05, when RD threatened an immediate break away if any of the Michelin teams were fined for no shows.

Might be. Interesting to know that RD tried to blackmail/blackmailed the FIA on that occasion!

[SGWilko]

Might be. Interesting to know that RD tried to blackmail/blackmailed the FIA on that occasion!

Well you gotta play mad Max at his own game every now and again......

[Flat.tyres]

Might be. Interesting to know that RD tried to blackmail/blackmailed the FIA on that occasion!

There is a difference between Blackmail and excerting pressure just as there is a difference between Brake Testing and keeping Tyres and Brakes up to temp.

One is illegal and one is not.

[ioan]

There is a difference between Blackmail and excerting pressure...

Than I guess the difference is the person who does it?! :p :

[raikk]

FIArarri

[ioan]

FIArarri

You put the "rr" to the wrong place! :p :

[Tazio]

:laugh:

My vote for 'the good of F1 as a sport, yeah right' is looking rather lonely indeed! :D
I voted with you!
They have shown they are partial to keeping the championships close by either penalizing a team in the lead Fred at Monaco '06 for hindering Massa in qualifying(grid penalty) or overlooking issues that would put a team behind even further behind towards end of season.

[Garry Walker]

Come back Andrea, all is forgiven.

Where did she disappear?


FIA, to be more exact, Bernie who has connections within FIA, is in love with The Golden Boy. That is bias for you.

[wmcot]

I also voted "for the good of the sport" but I have the understanding that the FIA have a very bizarre and changeable idea of what the "good" is!

I would say that this forum is split pretty evenly in their posts as to the FIA being pro-Ferrari, pro-McLaren/Hamilton, and pro-big money. My opinion is that it depends on in which mood Max wakes up in on any given day! :)

[raikk]

You put the "rr" to the wrong place! :p :

shhhhh jet lag does that to you :p :

[Roamy]

well the sad deal about this situation is that McLaren should be stripped of all points in all catagories ie. including drivers. Rak or Massa should be crowned champion. The proof is that McLaren cheated and were caught. FIA has again proven they are a disgusting Piece of Sh!t

[wmcot]

well the sad deal about this situation is that McLaren should be stripped of all points in all catagories ie. including drivers. Rak or Massa should be crowned champion. The proof is that McLaren cheated and were caught. FIA has again proven they are a disgusting Piece of Sh!t

Let's not get the McLaren fanatics in an uproar again - they were found guilty of violating section 151c and bringing the sport into disrepute which is much better than cheating! :)

[ArrowsFA1]

If the FIA rule against "your" team then clearly they're biased in favour of the opposition :p : If they rule in "your" team's favour then clearly they're upholding the rules of the sport in the correct manner :p :

[ioan]

Let's not get the McLaren fanatics in an uproar again - they were found guilty of violating section 151c and bringing the sport into disrepute which is much better than cheating! :)

No it isn't. Any braking of the rules is cheating.

[ioan]

If the FIA rule against "your" team then clearly they're biased in favour of the opposition :p : If they rule in "your" team's favour then clearly they're upholding the rules of the sport in the correct manner :p :

Depends on the evidence. :rolleyes:

[ioan]

well the sad deal about this situation is that McLaren should be stripped of all points in all catagories ie. including drivers. Rak or Massa should be crowned champion. The proof is that McLaren cheated and were caught. FIA has again proven they are a disgusting Piece of Sh!t

Wow, fousto agrees that Ferrari drivers are being done by Bernie and the FIA! Have the put another sign in the calendar. ;)

[Flat.tyres]

No it isn't. Any braking of the rules is cheating.

Remember moveable floors and the Wikipedia definition you posted earlier ;)

[SGWilko]

Remember moveable floors and the Wikipedia definition you posted earlier ;)

Ah yes, indeed. But lets just wait for Ioan to say it was legal, because it only circumvented the rules, it did not break them. At least not until Charlie Farley woke up and smelled the coffe and toughened the rules to better simulate the loading at racing speeds. ;)

[ioan]

Remember moveable floors and the Wikipedia definition you posted earlier ;)

The floor were not deemed to brake the rule, in fact the floors passed the scrutineering. One day you might understand it too! :p :

[SGWilko]

The floor were not deemed to brake the rule, in fact the floors passed the scrutineering. One day you might understand it too! :p :

Look, the floor was specifically designed to be able to bend in excess of the FIA tests at racing speeds, as it clearly reduced drag in this flexed state.

Ferrari knew that it flexed in excess of the test, but had designed it in a way as to pass the test.

Whichever way you look at it, at some point on the circuit during the Australian Grand Prix that floor will have flexed in excess of the permitted allowance. We know this, because at the next race it had to be changed, and because the evidence was presented to the FIA.

Can you agree with that. Yes, it passed the test, but, yes it also was able to flex in excess of the allowable maximum movement permitted.

[Flat.tyres]

The floor were not deemed to brake the rule, in fact the floors passed the scrutineering. One day you might understand it too! :p :

Well, in your definition of cheat there is this piece.


Another example of cheating frequently seen in sports is the use of non-regulation (vis-a-vis the rules) equipment.

Did the floor conform to the regulations (vis-a-vis Rules) or not?

NO

Dit it get passed by scruitineering?

YES

Were the Rules changed to outlaw this floor?

NO

Were the scruitineering procedures changed to stop the rule being violated?

YES

Was the floor changed to comply with the rules?

I think we know the answer to that one don't we so if the floor contravened the rules, using your definition, were Ferrari cheating?

Don't bother, we can argue about it all over again but the facts are the facts. All I was trying to point out is that people in glass houses should be a bit more carefull with their stone chucking.

[SGWilko]

In fact it was both legal and illegal, and only in the current FIA governed F1 can you have such a ridiculous scenario.

:beer:

Lets all drink to magnificent Max.

[ioan]

Look, the floor was specifically designed to be able to bend in excess of the FIA tests at racing speeds, as it clearly reduced drag in this flexed state.

Basic knowledge of solid mechanics says that any, and I mean any not brittle material will flex more when the load, that material is subjected to, is increased.

Manufacturing a part that won't flex more when subjected to higher loads, without breaking, is something that can't be done practically.

Question is why didn't the FIA technical delegate realized that the load they were using during scrutineering didn't come close to the loads experienced during racing at very high speeds?

[ioan]

Well, in your definition of cheat there is this piece.



Did the floor conform to the regulations (vis-a-vis Rules) or not?

NO

Dit it get passed by scruitineering?

YES

Were the Rules changed to outlaw this floor?

NO

Were the scruitineering procedures changed to stop the rule being violated?

YES

Was the floor changed to comply with the rules?

I think we know the answer to that one don't we so if the floor contravened the rules, using your definition, were Ferrari cheating?

Don't bother, we can argue about it all over again but the facts are the facts. All I was trying to point out is that people in glass houses should be a bit more carefull with their stone chucking.

Answering more than :rolleyes: , would be equal to thinking that we can survive jumping through the window from the top of the highest building on Earth without a parachute.

[SGWilko]

Answering more than :rolleyes: , would be equal to thinking that we can survive jumping through the window from the top of the highest building on Earth without a parachute.

I bet James Bond could though. :p :

[ioan]

I bet James Bond could though. :p :

You'll have to ask him! ;)

[Bagwan]

well the sad deal about this situation is that McLaren should be stripped of all points in all catagories ie. including drivers. Rak or Massa should be crowned champion. The proof is that McLaren cheated and were caught. FIA has again proven they are a disgusting Piece of Sh!t

You are right , cowboy .

The FIA doesn't always favour the reds , does it ?

[SGWilko]

You'll have to ask him! ;)

I just asked him, as he was dusting himself off having picked himself off the floor.

I said 'how do you feel'?

He replied - 'shaken, not stirred' :D

[BDunnell]

Of course the matter of the legality of the moveable floor is ridiculous. However, I would say two things. Firstly, 'clarification' being sought as to the legality of something is nothing new in F1. Secondly, it's not even worth discussing as a comeback to the McLaren espionage case, because the floor was not illegal at the time it was used, and only became so subsequently. It's absurd, but it's true.

[ioan]

I just asked him, as he was dusting himself off having picked himself off the floor.

I said 'how do you feel'?

He replied - 'shaken, not stirred' :D

:rotflmao:

[Flat.tyres]

Of course the matter of the legality of the moveable floor is ridiculous. However, I would say two things. Firstly, 'clarification' being sought as to the legality of something is nothing new in F1. Secondly, it's not even worth discussing as a comeback to the McLaren espionage case, because the floor was not illegal at the time it was used, and only became so subsequently. It's absurd, but it's true.

It is absurd but it was deemed legal at the time even though it did not adhere to the rules. This highlights the thread topic perfectly as I believe that if McLaren had of used such a system, they would have been penalised.

Lets look at the impartiality ( yeah right :rolleyes: ) of the FIA in more detail.

Remember the Ferrari Barge Boards that were deemed illegal and subsequently overturned.

The FIA knew they were illegal but said noting. In fact, Max said that if McLaren had of questioned the angle of them in court, then they would have won the case.

What sort of crap is that. the FIA keeping stum hoping that a team wouldn't ask a question that would lose Ferrari their appeal. Governing body my arse. Bent as a rubber boomerang.

[Mikeall]

Compared to any other organisation or group of people or individual, the FIA are the most impartial.

[SGWilko]

Compared to any other organisation or group of people or individual, the FIA are the most impartial.

.

[SGWilko]

Compared to any other organisation or group of people or individual, the FIA are the most impartial.

Sorry, was laughing so much in the previous post I could not type............ ;)

[wmcot]

You are right , cowboy .

The FIA doesn't always favour the reds , does it ?

Don't try to tell that to a McLaren fan! The FIA just hid their Ferrari favoritism well for 21 years! :)

[wmcot]

Remember the Ferrari Barge Boards that were deemed illegal and subsequently overturned.

The FIA knew they were illegal but said noting. In fact, Max said that if McLaren had of questioned the angle of them in court, then they would have won the case.


Then why didn't McLaren question the angle? Maybe they didn't have the manual from Stepney and couldn't figure it out on their own! ;)

[Flat.tyres]

Then why didn't McLaren question the angle? Maybe they didn't have the manual from Stepney and couldn't figure it out on their own! ;)

:laugh: Very good :laugh:

I don't know why they didn't but the fact is that Max said that had they, then they would have won.

Why didn't he then?