Villeuneuve being fastracked into Cup

[Robert Ryan]

Jacques Villeneuve is expected to make his NASCAR Nextel Cup debut at Talladega Superspeedway next weekend in the No. 27 Bill Davis Racing Toyota Camry.
The former Formula 1 and CART champ, will be one of three BDR entries in the UAW-Ford 500 on October 7. Slugger Labbe, who received his release from Ginn Racing last month, will serve as Villeneuve's crew chief. The race marks two milestones — the coming-out party for Villeneuve in the Cup, and the first Car of Tomorrow race on the 2.66-mile speedway (the biggest track to date for a COT race).
Villeneuve ran his first CTS race last Saturday at Las Vegas Motor Speedway. The 36-year-old native St. Jean-sur-Richelieu, Quebec, qualified seventh and finished 21st. The "rookie" participated in a successful test with Cup regulars on Sept. 10-11 at Talladega. By running a significant number of laps competitively in the draft with Cup regulars along with his performance at Vegas, NASCAR deemed that Villeneuve was ready to roll next weekend.

BDR is also expected to field Villeneuve in both the ARCA and Craftsman Truck races. BDR Rookie Michael Annett will also compete in the ARCA event on Friday.

[Sparky1329]

Whoa! Dega already? :eek:

[muggle not]

I sure hope "my drivers" are in front of him. Five will get you ten that he causes a big one. Actually, I would hope that Nascar disallows him racing at Dega. I would hate to see drivers in the chase taken out needlessly

[RaceFanStan]

Talk about being thrown into the fire ! :eek:

[ZzZzZz]

Trial by fire is right. That race could make or break his reputation in the paddock.

[Hoss Ghoul]

He won't be the only one making his Cup debut at Talladega, Sam Hornish Jr. will be attempting to qualify for that race as well.

I don't know about BDR and Villeneuve, if they have the speed to get in on time, but I'm sure Hornish in a Penske car will.

Anyone know if this is an impound race? If so, look for some teams to get into the show and be uncompetitive/blow up in the race do to gearing, trick fluids, etc...

[JasonD]

Sweet.

[jslone]

Lets just hope that his spotter well be a good one and not let him screw it up.Otherwise he well,I wont predict.

[Sparky1329]

He won't be the only one making his Cup debut at Talladega, Sam Hornish Jr. will be attempting to qualify for that race as well.

I don't know about BDR and Villeneuve, if they have the speed to get in on time, but I'm sure Hornish in a Penske car will.

Anyone know if this is an impound race? If so, look for some teams to get into the show and be uncompetitive/blow up in the race do to gearing, trick fluids, etc...

Hornish has a lot more seat time than JV does so my concern about him is somewhat tempered. JV is a whole other ballgame. One mediocre CTS race doesn't indicate a readiness for a Cup race at Dega. I don't care how well he did practicing at Dega. Practicing is not similar to all out racing.

[RaikkonenRules]

I think Villeneuve should not be making his debut at Talladega. Especially since he's only so far run 1 truck race. Wait for somewhere less dangerous to race I think, althouth I don't see him making the field in a 3rd BDR car. Not enougth hoursepower.

[Lee Roy]

Villeneuve is a great driver and champion. Hornish is a hack.

[ShiftingGears]

I hope JV can prove his worth.

[Robert Ryan]

Villeneuve is a great driver and champion. Hornish is a hack.
David Besnard won the USFF2000 championship in 1998, Sam Hornish was his team mate. David Besnard has struggled in V8Supercar from day one(hard to imagine why he is still there). He won the FF2000 championship convincinly(setting records), so how good would Hornish be in a NASCAR as David completely outclassed him as his team partner in the same series?

[rabf1]

"Villeneuve is a great driver and champion. Hornish is a hack."

The use of the perjorative term "hack" goes a little too far, but I generally agree that JV has something special and Hornish does not. I predict that JV is going to shock Nascar.

[Lee Roy]

"Villeneuve is a great driver and champion. Hornish is a hack."

The use of the perjorative term "hack" goes a little too far, but I generally agree that JV has something special and Hornish does not. I predict that JV is going to shock Nascar.

I've only had two drivers in my life that I can say that I've been a true "fan" of. One was David Pearson and the other was Jacques Villeneuve. I first saw JV in a CART race at Nazareth in 1995. He was having a furious dice with former 2 time world champ Emerson Fittipaldi. It was breathtaking what JV was doing with that car. Then, a month later JV won the last real Indy 500 after coming back from 2 laps down.

Hornish should stay where he is in the shallow end of the pool.

[Sparky1329]

Villeneuve is a great driver and champion. Hornish is a hack.

You won't get an argument from me on the Hornish comment. Throwing JV to the wolves at Dega doesn't seem like a good idea to me despite his being a great driver.
.

[Lee Roy]

You won't get an argument from me on the Hornish comment. Throwing JV to the wolves at Dega doesn't seem like a good idea to me despite his being a great driver.
.

Particularly since driving a Cup car at Daytona and especially Talladega is so completely different from anything he's ever done.

[RaikkonenRules]

I'm sure Hornish will have no trouble making Dega since qualifying there pretty much 99.9999999999999999999% down to horsepower. :p :

[Lee Roy]

I'm sure Hornish will have no trouble making Dega since qualifying there pretty much 99.9999999999999999999% down to horsepower. :p :

It's his best chance.

I hope they give JV a stout horse.

[harvick#1]

didn't last year, a few cup drivers said Dega is so smooth their mothers can drive the cars just fine.

I think all these OW drivers coming to nascar just sucks, they are way better off in OW racing. what was AJ thinking, he leaves a series that he could win and went to Nascar were he can't even get out of 35th. Sam was a proven winner in the IRL and jumps the ship and can't even qualify for one race. Now Speed wants to come over from F1 and hes gonna have the same problem with AJ.

Montoya was sort of an exemption, but he still drives like an idiot taking people out without warning (hmm, sort of like Hamlin)

Stewart and Robby Gordon sort of set the bar high for OW drivers to succeed

[JasonD]

JV might be stretching it a little by jumping into Talladega. I think he can handle the car just fine, its handling the car with the other 40 guys around him that will be the problem.

Will he win? No.
We he be in the top 10? No.
Top 20? err maybe.
Top 30? Safe bet.

The big problem I see JV facing is running with the other guys. If he starts to do well in the draft will he get a little bump and well thats IF they even let him in the draft and dont continually hang him out to dry.

Takes some mighty big balls to take on Talladega as your first cup race. Maybe thats why JV has such a baggy firesuit.

[muggle not]

Ok, here goes at the risk of offending all the O.W. fans now posting.

There are 12 drivers racing for the Nextel Cup Championship in the last 10 races of the year. The Championship is important to each one of them. JV is talented but inexperienced driving the Cup cars. Dega is a difficult track to drive for even the experienced guys. It is not right to throw an inexperienced guy in the mix who may cause "the big one" and take some of the drivers out of the race and probably cost them a good shot at the Championship. Not fair to the regular Cup guys AND not fair to JV.

[Lee Roy]

I think all these OW drivers coming to nascar just sucks, they are way better off in OW racing. what was AJ thinking, he leaves a series that he could win and went to Nascar were he can't even get out of 35th. Sam was a proven winner in the IRL and jumps the ship and can't even qualify for one race. Now Speed wants to come over from F1 and hes gonna have the same problem with AJ.


Money and competition is why they come. NASCAR may not be at the financial level of Formula One, but it is still a way for a good driver to make a number of millions a year.

The IRL and Champ Car are now just over-glorified club series. I seriously doubt if Champ Car will even exist next year. A number of the drivers the IRL and Champ Car have to bring money with them to fund the team's operations instead of actually getting paid for driving.

[djparky]

didn't last year, a few cup drivers said Dega is so smooth their mothers can drive the cars just fine.

I think all these OW drivers coming to nascar just sucks, they are way better off in OW racing. what was AJ thinking, he leaves a series that he could win and went to Nascar were he can't even get out of 35th. Sam was a proven winner in the IRL and jumps the ship and can't even qualify for one race. Now Speed wants to come over from F1 and hes gonna have the same problem with AJ.

Montoya was sort of an exemption, but he still drives like an idiot taking people out without warning (hmm, sort of like Hamlin)

Stewart and Robby Gordon sort of set the bar high for OW drivers to succeed

err I get the Tony Stewart reference- but Robby Gordon??? has he ever managed to win any NASCAR event other than on a road course?? he was always something of a liability in the old CART series, and he's still proving to be just as crash worthy as he was 15 years ago!

[RaceFanStan]

To cause a big crash you have to have a bunch of cars BEHIND you ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/orn/w2.gif
I don't think Villeneuve will be in that situation ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/orn/rs.gif


heck, I doubt he can make the race in a Bill Davis Racing Toyota. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/orn/00.gif

[tstran17_88]

but Robby Gordon??? has he ever managed to win any NASCAR event other than on a road course?? November 2001, New Hampshire Int'l Speedway...he had to rough up Jeff Gordon to get the win though. :D

[RaikkonenRules]

He won the Fall Busch race at Richmond in 2004.

[harvick#1]

November 2001, New Hampshire Int'l Speedway...he had to rough up Jeff Gordon to get the win though. :D

oh yeah, that was when Jeff went Cryin and for once got a penalty for smashing into the back of Robbys car under caution.

oh here comes Muggle or MD now on a great comeback for me :p :

[JasonD]

Ok, here goes at the risk of offending all the O.W. fans now posting.

There are 12 drivers racing for the Nextel Cup Championship in the last 10 races of the year. The Championship is important to each one of them. JV is talented but inexperienced driving the Cup cars. Dega is a difficult track to drive for even the experienced guys. It is not right to throw an inexperienced guy in the mix who may cause "the big one" and take some of the drivers out of the race and probably cost them a good shot at the Championship. Not fair to the regular Cup guys AND not fair to JV.

I dont think thats offensive but more a rather objective opinion. I dont think he'll be much of a threat though since he'll left alone without a drafting partner unless him and JPM have made up.



Are all the sponsors for JV lined up for next year? Could this be part of it and theyre trying to get some interest in the team?

[RaceFanStan]

Jeff Gordon made valid points about Villeneuve debuting in Nextel Cup @ Talladega ...
I must say that I do agree with him ! http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/thum/1ua.gif

http://www.nascar.com/2007/news/headlines/cup/09/28/jvilleneuve.talladega/index.html

[Lee Roy]

I say "get over it Jeffie". ;)

[muggle not]

Jeff Gordon made valid points about Villeneuve debuting in Nextel Cup @ Talladega ...
I must say that I do agree with him ! http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/thum/1ua.gif

http://www.nascar.com/2007/news/headlines/cup/09/28/jvilleneuve.talladega/index.html
Jeff must have read my post. Glad to see him speak out and I obviously agree with him 100%. Actually, it is stupid to put JV in the race at Dega, wth are they thinking.

[Breeze]

Agreed Lee Roy. While Jeff's concerns are valid to a point, all he needs to do is drive up front and Jacques won't pose a problem for him. Also, super speedway experince is no indicator or race performance. Last year, for instance, it was veterans who caused the few crashes they had, and that's usually the case.

What these drivers seem to forget is that JV HAS experience driving super speedways and using drafting techniques. Whats more, in open wheel racing if you even touch another car chances are its a disaster! Granted, its been a while, but he's been there and done that. Now he's got fenders.

Lastly, he's got to qualify first. There's no guarantee he'll even make the start. And if he does, count on ever front runner to hang him out to dry unless he's so fast they can't ignore him. Not much chance of that at Talledega.

[ZzZzZz]

He's there to learn, and finish, not take risks and go out early. He also knows he needs to earn the other drivers' respect. The only way he'd risk it is if he were somehow racing for the win, the lil Jeffy and the other points contenders shouldn't expect him to back down.

[Sparky1329]

JV will be in a BDR car. If he even makes the race it will be a big deal.

[tstran17_88]

What I don't get is that NASCAR will make a young driver run in the ARCA race at 'dega or Daytona before they approve them for a Nascar race.

Why doesn't JV have to do the same? He's approved after just running test laps?

If that's the new criteria to get into the cup race, I think I'll give it a whirl. :cheese:

[harvick#1]

Jeff Gordon made valid points about Villeneuve debuting in Nextel Cup @ Talladega ...
I must say that I do agree with him ! http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/thum/1ua.gif

http://www.nascar.com/2007/news/headlines/cup/09/28/jvilleneuve.talladega/index.html

I don't agree with anything Gordon says. He needs to learn to quit harsh blocking on Dega and Daytona to help Johnson win a race

[harvick#1]

If that's the new criteria to get into the cup race, I think I'll give it a whirl. :cheese:

I'll join ya, its seems easy enough :s mokin:

[Breeze]

What I don't get is that NASCAR will make a young driver run in the ARCA race at 'dega or Daytona before they approve them for a Nascar race.

Why doesn't JV have to do the same? He's approved after just running test laps?

If that's the new criteria to get into the cup race, I think I'll give it a whirl. :cheese:

Firstly, JV is NOT a young driver. Secondly, he'll be driving in the CTS race the day before. And then there's this, directly from NASCAR:


NASCAR believes Villeneuve is qualified. "Our resume committee has looked at Villeneuve, his history and his experience, and made the decision to approve him to race at Talladega," series spokeman Ramsey Poston said.

JV has spent his entire career racing cars in which the margin for error is a fraction what it is in stock car racing. Evidently that, and what he's shown in testing and CTS race is good enough for NASCAR.

[Lee Roy]

What I don't get is that NASCAR will make a young driver run in the ARCA race at 'dega or Daytona before they approve them for a Nascar race.

Why doesn't JV have to do the same? He's approved after just running test laps?

If that's the new criteria to get into the cup race, I think I'll give it a whirl. :cheese:

Villeneuve is a World Champion, CART Champion (back when it was a big deal) and he won the last real Indy 500 (coming back from 2 laps down). The previous Indy 500, he was the only driver to finish on the lead lap with a Penske Mercedes. (That's an average finish of 1.5).

[muggle not]

Villeneuve is a World Champion, CART Champion (back when it was a big deal) and he won the last real Indy 500 (coming back from 2 laps down). The previous Indy 500, he was the only driver to finish on the lead lap with a Penske Mercedes. (That's an average finish of 1.5).
So, does that mean that we can put Richard Petty in a F1 car with no previous experience in that type of racing and let him compete.

Come on LeeRoy, JV needs a little Nascar type experience.

[Breeze]

So, does that mean that we can put Richard Petty in a F1 car with no previous experience in that type of racing and let him compete.

Come on LeeRoy, JV needs a little Nascar type experience.

I would absolutely let King Richard into an F1 car (in his prime) with naught but some testing and a F3 race under his belt. The same with Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Jimmie Johnson and any number of other top NASCAR drivers. I wouldn't expect them to run up front, but I would certainly expect them to be able to keep it on the track and out of the front runners' way.

A top tier driver can handle it.

[Rollo]

Nigel Mansell? No previous Indycar experience won in his first season.
Lewis Hamilton? No previous F! experience and will win in his first season.

Newsflash people - JV has already won an Indycar championship. He knows how the US racing scene works and on top of that was an F1 Champion to boot.

Villeneuve is class. The question is whether he will have the machinery necessary to do the job with.

[F1boat]

I remember JV's class. He was good with a dominating Williams, with average or bad car, he wasn't special at all. I think that Hornish is better.
NASCAR guys will crush them both, though.

[Lee Roy]

I remember JV's class. He was good with a dominating Williams, with average or bad car, he wasn't special at all. I think that Hornish is better.
NASCAR guys will crush them both, though.

Hornish couldn't carry JV's helmet bag.

[RaceFanStan]

nascar.com did a survey regarding the Villeneuve debut @ Talladega ...
the result was 75% AGAINST him starting his 1st race @ Talladega !
(When I last looked, it was over 6,000 votes)

(Yes, I was part of the 75%) http://www.motorsportforum.com/forums/images/icons/tongue-anim.gif

[Lee Roy]

I remember JV's class. He was good with a dominating Williams, with average or bad car, he wasn't special at all.

The same thing could be said of nearly all other F1 drivers.

[tstran17_88]

I would absolutely let King Richard into an F1 car (in his prime) with naught but some testing and a F3 race under his belt. The same with Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Jimmie Johnson and any number of other top NASCAR drivers. I wouldn't expect them to run up front, but I would certainly expect them to be able to keep it on the track and out of the front runners' way.

A top tier driver can handle it.It's a good thing you don't own a F1 team. I sure as heck wouldn't let any Nascar driver into a F1 race with naught but some testing when these autos cost 1 million plus!

[ZzZzZz]

I remember JV's class. He was good with a dominating Williams, with average or bad car, he wasn't special at all. I think that Hornish is better.
NASCAR guys will crush them both, though.


You should then remember that it became dominant *after* the engineers began listening to, and working with, him on car set-up, strategy, technology, etc... He came to F1 as a rookie and taught them a few things.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Lets see, we have two camps. The, JV isn't good enough for Dega camp, and the JV is a former CART Champ, Indy 500 Champ, World Driving Champion and someone who has one on ovals before. Now most seem to belong to the first. Most of those people are dedicated NASCAR fans. Probably wouldn't know what driving an open wheeled race car on an oval is all about any more than than they think JV knows what driving at Talladega is all about.

Lets cut the BS right here and now. Sebastien Bourdais WON a IROC race on an oval did he not? Against about 9 NASCAR guys. Bourdais is not in JV's class, but is pretty decent. Yet he figured it out in one season. Of course, they didn't invite him back after that...cant be showing up the NASCAR boys in essentially their type of racing. IT ISNT ROCKET SCIENCE PEOPLE! Jacques dealt with a draft and NOT touching people at 230 plus at a place like Michigan. Did it at Indy and damn near won the first time he saw the place and finished 1st from two laps down in a race where I may remind you that they only give you enough fuel technically to run 201 laps. He basically ran 202 that time and won. The man knows what he is doing. If they told him NOT to run Dega, they would have be insulting the man, and he didn't deserve it. IT aint Harvick1 showing up with a helmet bag and a trip from Karting school coming to qualify.

Kyle Busch and Jeff Gordon can whine and moan all they want, but the point is, Jacques cant hear them. He has his Indy 500 ring stuck in one ear and his World Driving Champion's ring in the other.

For many drivers, much of the criticism or complaints might hold up. If a European came over and wanted to run Talladega straight out of f1 never having seen an oval before, I would agree, this isn't the place to start. JV though has WON on ovals, and ran two years at Michigan, where I may remind you the CART boys drafted like crazy and pushed the lap speeds along at around 230. He understands this oval stuff. JV has to learn the procedures in pit lane, the etiquette of a NASCAR draft, but his basic nature is to learn carefully. There is nothing in his racing history to suggest he is going to do anything stupid out there. He was never a rough or dirty driver so I think his biggest problem this weekend is getting a BDR Toyota into the field. His biggest handicap isn't his lack of experience, it is his lack of car under him.

OH ya, did anyone bitch and whine when Al Unser Jr. showed up to run Daytona one year? Nope....they didn't even mention he had no NASCAR experience yet he qualfied and run well. It is in the end, standing on the gas and not hitting people that we are talking about here. It is staying cool with a car running 35th at the back of a pack. JV can handle it....so just chill a little.....

[muggle not]

Obviously some "fans" don't know the difference between driving a Cup car and a F1 car.

[Sparky1329]

Obviously some "fans" don't know the difference between driving a Cup car and a F1 car.

Or an IROC car and a COT car.

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

Newsflash people - JV has already won an Indycar championship. He knows how the US racing scene works and on top of that was an F1 Champion to boot.



Experience in indycars doesnt give you the feel of a stock car.

And if experience is everything would JV have lapped the hole field in the truck race he ran and not finish up 21st.

Rookies struggle end of story. I put my money on him causing more wrecks than Montoya gets blammed for.

And as for Villeneuve being "special". I think hell end up hitting the wall so hard he may start dribbling a bit and acting a really "special". Well thats if he doesnt do it to someone else.

[rabf1]

If he qualifies he should race. We are talking about a guy who was one of the world's best race car drivers. He is now in the later stages of his career, but he is certainly competent to drive in any Nascar race. If they let the likes of Michael Waltrip and Kenny Schrader out there, JV is certainly entitled to a shot.

[tstran17_88]

Hornish couldn't carry JV's helmet bag.On a road course in an open wheel...agreed. On an oval in a stock car...the jury is still out IMO.

[tstran17_88]

If they let the likes of Michael Waltrip and Kenny Schrader out there, JV is certainly entitled to a shot.I don't think anybody disagrees with that JV is entitled to a shot...it's just his choice of tracks that has everyone up in arms.

[harvick#1]

I don't see why everyone is up and arms here.

ok if he qualifies for hte race, hes gonna spend most of the time in the back of the pack learning each lap on to keeping control in one line and learning the draft safely. There are alot more crazy and idiotic drivers out there right now (cough, cough Montoya)

[RaceFanStan]

Hey harv, do you think Montoya will "find" Villeneuve on the track raceday ? ;) :laugh:

[call_me_andrew]

So, does that mean that we can put Richard Petty in a F1 car with no previous experience in that type of racing and let him compete.

Come on LeeRoy, JV needs a little Nascar type experience.

Well that's not a fair comparison. At Richard Petty's age I'm not sure he's safe behind the wheel of a street car anymore let alone a race car.

But if I recall, we saw Jeff Gordon get into an F1 car set up for a shake down and run just 2 seconds off the pace.

[RaceFanStan]

The latest rumor is that this weekend Dario Franchitti will be trying to qualify an ARCA stockcar @ Talladega ... :eek:

[jslone]

I might be the only one who says this,but I think that Dega well be the perfect proving ground for JV.But also look at who he is racing for,his team is not exactly the best.

[harvick#1]

But if I recall, we saw Jeff Gordon get into an F1 car set up for a shake down and run just 2 seconds off the pace.

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps

[ShiftingGears]

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps

Bullsh!t.

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps

As much as i hate to admit it that isnt true. What is true is in formula one you can be a alright driver in a fanastic car and look like a genius. but that is true of most motorsports, just seems to happen more in F1.

[Lee Roy]

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps


It's official now. You're out of your $#%&*@$ mind.

[RaceFanStan]

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps
I can't help but believe that if "any fool" could do it, racing would be over-run with drivers ! :eek:

I believe it takes a special talent to be a top driver in any series ...
those top drivers aren't just "any fool", they are the best of the rest. http://www.motorsportforum.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif

a Saturday night racer may dream of being a top driver but without talent he/she will fail ...
in any racing series the drivers must learn the cars & use their talent to make them perform ...
"any fool" CAN'T do that & to state otherwise degrades the drivers who have the talent in the 1st place ! http://www.motorsportforum.com/forums/images/icons/tongue-anim.gif

[Breeze]

Well said Stan.

This topic is so hotly debated I'm gonna propose a little gentleman's wager. Of course ladies are welcome to participate, also.

I propose a signature bet such as was once done of the F1 forum with JV fans and detractors.

Assuming JV qualifies his car for the race, we'll have two sides to the bet.
On the one side, JV supporters say he doesn't cause any trouble.

On the other side, JV detractors say he is the cause of trouble.

The concept of the bet is, one forum poster steps up and offers his sig to the first taker. Whichever side wins the bet gets to decide what the loser's sig says for say, until the Nextel Cup series is finished for the year.

The ground rules of deciding what "cause any trouble" means is: JV's actions or mistakes are the direct and original cause of a wreck. This would let him off the hook if he gets involved in a wreck that somebody else starts unless they start it trying to avoid JV's blunder.

Make sense? Any body want to play?

[Roamy]

ok I am in
He will cause no trouble

[call_me_andrew]

those things are so technology advanced that any fool can get in and run some fast laps

If anyone could do it, they wouldn't pay the drivers so much money.

Damn it Harvick, look what you made me do! I'm forced to agree with Stan and Lee Roy!

[RaikkonenRules]

I'm in too. I also think he won't cause any trouble. But I don't see him making it in though.

[Lee Roy]

Damn it Harvick, look what you made me do! I'm forced to agree with Stan and Lee Roy!

Darn that Harvick!!!!! :) ;)

[Breeze]

Great fousto, RaikkonenRules. I'm in too, of course. On the side of JV and no trouble. Now all we need is some folks like haulin and harvick to take us up on it. Who's got the appendages?

[Sparky1329]

I'm betting he and his BDR car won't qualify.

[muggle not]

I'm betting he and his BDR car won't qualify.
I'm with Sparky. JV will be watching the race from the stands. :)

[RaceFanStan]

I also agree with Sparky, I doubt that JV will qualify for the Cup field. :eek:
(Bill Davis' regular drivers will be lucky IF they can make the race ...)
(Dave Blaney #22 has missed 3 races & Jeremy Mayfield #36 has missed 16 races THIS season)

(NOTE : There are only 36 trucks entered for a field of 36 for the CTS race ...)
(so JV will get a chance to cause a "BIG One" @ Talladega anyway ...) ;) :laugh:

[tstran17_88]

a Saturday night racer may dream of being a top driver but without talent he/she will fail ... [/IMG]It helps to get a few breaks along the way or if your dad has more money than he knows what to do with and can buy your way in (Paul Menard)!

[harvick#1]

Darn that Harvick!!!!! :) ;)

yeah, damn me, I should be banned :p : :D


but remember, its all car at Dega, if BDR has a powerful engine package, he will get in.

[Roamy]

I'm betting he and his BDR car won't qualify.

ok I am taking this bet toooo

[Breeze]

Well that's great fellas, but that's not the bet. You're probably right about him not getting in, but for the sake of the wager, lets assume he does. Any takers??

Then too, we could make a side bet on whether or not he makes the grid. If any one is up for that, I'll wager he has enough speed to make it. As of right now, he's on the bubble speed wise with some slower cars that could find it by qualifying.

C'mon folks, talk is cheap. Put your sig where your post is, to mutilate an old saw. :)

[harvick#1]

I'll take the bet that Johnson, Busch, or Jeff Gordon will cause the big one before JV does :p :

seems that crazy 48 likes to take out half the field to get a good finish for himself, remember the flat at the 600 and would'nt go low and took out half the field

[cobre]

if JV doesn't make the race, that means a veteran will cause the big one; as usual for dega: so why worry who starts it this time. it's going to happen.

[harvick#1]

JV is in, Toyota put up one heck of a quali package for the engine, all Toyota are in the top 15

[Erki]

Lowest Yota is Mayfield, 14th, all other 7 are in top 9...

A lot of people here have underrated Toyota.
Toyota has some major horsepower. I like it. ;) :up:

[Jonesi]

6 out of 8 Toyotas qualified. JV ended up 6th.
The only problem is it's an impound race. The first four rows start the race in qualifing trim, while all the others are/should be in race trim.

[gm99]

P6 for JV in qualiyfing on his Nextel Cup debut is pretty impressive, I think (even on a day where Toyota did very well). That's 0,9 sec/lap quicker than the guy who was most concerned about being impeded by Villeneuve (J. Gordon).

[ZzZzZz]

6 out of 8 Toyotas qualified. JV ended up 6th.
The only problem is it's an impound race. The first four rows start the race in qualifing trim, while all the others are/should be in race trim.

As far as I'm concerned, they all "qualified". Qualifying is run to prove you are worthy of being in the field. I think running 14th out of 51 meets that, don't you?

What the point of the top 35 system? One aspect is teams at the bottom end get freebies into the field, and then get points that help them stay in the top 35, while some teams that outqualified them get no points. That's a double penalty.

Drivers like Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart broke through NASCAR's protectionsim and proved that winners become stars. Stars that are much better for the series than the mediocre has-beens they replace. A wave of young guns has followed.

There is a real need for provisionals, but this top 35 thing is too much and needs fixing.

The slowest of the 8 cars that will DNS this weekend is faster than 14 cars that got freebies.

Is there a benefit in locking out these drivers?:

44 84 A.J. Allmendinger* Toyota Red Bull 187.596 51.046 -0.398
45 160 Boris Said Ford SOBE - No Fear 187.423 51.093 -0.445
46 10 Scott Riggs Dodge Valvoline / Stanley Tools 187.328 51.119 -0.471
47 06 Sam Hornish Jr. Dodge Mobil 1 187.262 51.137 -0.489
48 36 Jeremy Mayfield Toyota 360 OTC 187.130 51.173 -0.525
49 109 Sterling Marlin Chevrolet Miccosukee Resort & Gaming 186.696 51.292 -0.644
50 4 Ward Burton Chevrolet State Water Heaters / Miccosukee Resort 185.963 51.494 -0.846
51 37 Kevin Lepage Dodge Taco Bell 185.765 51.549 -0.901

These are all race winners.

[Hoss Ghoul]

Let's not get carried away with how Toyota qualified, Jonesi is right, this is an impound race and all things are not equal...

Toyota and the go-or-go-home drivers had to make the field, they're all running qualifying setups, meaning different gearing, engine packages, lubricants, etc...


I agree the top 35 rule needs adjusting, but don't think that the guys going home would all have made the field or out-qualified many of the regulars who weren't running qualifying setups.


Oh, and JV wrecked in the CTS race, for what that's worth.

[F1boat]

Respect, JV!

[muggle not]

JV turned right when he should have gone straight.

[Breeze]

Jonesi and Hoss Goul have it right on this subject. Sure JV qualified up front, but had he also qualified in "race trim", like the 35 did, he'd probably be on the tail end of the grid if he managed to make it at all.

No disrespect to JV, but the Toyota program just isn't up to speed yet, and the BDR team either.

As far as JV's wreck yesterday, some trucks in front of him were slowing down to make the pit lane entrance and he swerved to avoid them. JV caused that wreck.

But is it normal for cars/trucks at 'Dega to slow for a green flag pit stop while still on the racing line? I mean, the guys JV swerved to avoid were running slow in the bottom groove. Shouldn't they be down on the apron?

[BenRoethig]

I'm seeing Jeffie's point after the truck race. JV hasn't a clue how to drive in the draft. That's what the truck and ARCA race are for.


Respect, JV!

I will when he shows he can drive a stock car. So far he's shown that he's a rookie and really needs more time down in the minors before going to the big leagues. That WDC doesn't mean a thing right now.

[BenRoethig]

Jonesi and Hoss Goul have it right on this subject. Sure JV qualified up front, but had he also qualified in "race trim", like the 35 did, he'd probably be on the tail end of the grid if he managed to make it at all.

No disrespect to JV, but the Toyota program just isn't up to speed yet, and the BDR team either.

As far as JV's wreck yesterday, some trucks in front of him were slowing down to make the pit lane entrance and he swerved to avoid them. JV caused that wreck.

But is it normal for cars/trucks at 'Dega to slow for a green flag pit stop while still on the racing line? I mean, the guys JV swerved to avoid were running slow in the bottom groove. Shouldn't they be down on the apron?

The truck program is very up to speed.

[wedge]

I was expecting JV to do a JPM at Daytona, qualify in the top 40 and race at the tail of the field.

Great job from JV, but I'm worried he'll causes a wreck and takes out a host of Chase contenders.

[muggle not]

I'm seeing Jeffie's point after the truck race. JV hasn't a clue how to drive in the draft. That's what the truck and ARCA race are for.

I will when he shows he can drive a stock car. So far he's shown that he's a rookie and really needs more time down in the minors before going to the big leagues. That WDC doesn't mean a thing right now.
You pretty much hit the nail on the head.

[Sparky1329]

I was expecting JV to do a JPM at Daytona, qualify in the top 40 and race at the tail of the field.

Great job from JV, but I'm worried he'll causes a wreck and takes out a host of Chase contenders.

That's what the Chase contenders are worried about. If JV chooses to mix it up wth more experienced drivers in the draft today he will cause a wreck.

[Hoss Ghoul]

Smart move by JV and his team, moving to the end of the field before the race's start.

Later in the race JV hit/rubbed the wall by himself, apparently.

[Jonesi]

Smart move by JV and his team, moving to the end of the field before the race's start.

Later in the race JV hit/rubbed the wall by himself, apparently.

How many rookies get a Talladega strip and keep on going?

[muggle not]

How many rookies get a Talladega strip and keep on going?
Not many hit the wall with no help from others. I can't wait until he drives Darlington. :D

BTW, i thought that JPM drove a very good race until he got out-snookered in the last few laps.

[jslone]

Respect, JV!
1 race deos not warrant respect enough for Nascar.Did he do better then most thought and that includes me yes.I have respect for him as a open wheel driver,but lets see how he does on a full schedule,then I well say something else.

[SOD]

The pre-race spent a lot of time talking with Franchitti, Montoya, Villeneuve and then they started talking about Hornish etc coming over to Cup.

nice to see the #27 again ;)

[ms0362]

Now that the race is over, it looks like they handled the situation well. He was in a qualifying set-up to insure he made the show. He agreed to fall back to the rear because of everyone's concern and because of the unknowns on his car. Doesn't appear that he did anything stupid, just got some seat time. I've seen some veteran cup drivers do a lot worse.

[ZzZzZz]

http://www.journalnow.com/scripts/isapi_srun.dll/servlet/Satellite?pagename=WSJ%2FMGArticle%2FWSJ_BasicArti cle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173353034050&path=!sports!autoracing!&s=1037645509202

[djparky]

well i think JV did a good job, lets not forget that Johnson used to be a liability on these restrictor plate races, and the Robby Gordons of NASCAR are a liability pretty much everywhere- JV finished 21st on a day when alot of the more established stars had problems- good on him- JV's not a total oval novice though- he ran in the old PPG Cart Indy Car series (oh happy days) for a couple of years and did well on the ovals there

[Lee Roy]

JV did a great job.

Looking forward to seeing him do well at Martinsville.

[Mark in Oshawa]

JV did what I figured he would do, and that is LEARN. People who criticized him for wanting to do Talladega have not been paying attention to this man. In all of his years of racing, JV never had a rep for doing stupid things behind the wheel, and never once have I seen him drive in a manner that would make you doubt his sanity. Other than a rookie screw up at Phoenix in CART where he tagged Hiro Matu****a, I never can say that JV drove into anyone in any way shape or form, and may I remind all of you he ran Michigan twice in CART where there was a draft and 230mph was the speed at the back of the grid.

JV is getting to figure out what he has to do to compete, and the only way you learn at Dega is to sit at the back of the freight train and learn what it is to have your car sucked along at 195mph....

[electron]

Matu****a

looking nice ;) maybe we try mat-sushi-ta the next time LOL

Very well done JV. I agree with the above posts on his performance that day. coming through was a performance in itself.

actually, the Matsu****a *g* incident wasn't by far his worst. I remember him flying into the fence in Australia some 99 or so when one or two safety posts where killed. remember Krossnoff? So he may have lurked a little onto the others ide already. I also thought from the beginning in PPG him to be very cool headed and a driver who never had many crashes.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Matu****a

looking nice ;) maybe we try mat-sushi-ta the next time LOL

Very well done JV. I agree with the above posts on his performance that day. coming through was a performance in itself.

actually, the Matsu****a *g* incident wasn't by far his worst. I remember him flying into the fence in Australia some 99 or so when one or two safety posts where killed. remember Krossnoff? So he may have lurked a little onto the others ide already. I also thought from the beginning in PPG him to be very cool headed and a driver who never had many crashes.

Matsuwhatever, you know to whom and the incident in question.

As for that wreck in Melbourne, that was one of those touching wheels things that happen in OW and at the start of a GP. All bets are off in that sort of situation. It is hard to give out blame when everyone is looking for open pavement and clean air at the start of a GP.

My point has always been JV has always been a level headed guy and a clean racer. Some drivers Jeffy poo would have been right to question, but not Jacques....

[RaceFanStan]

Jeff Gordon used a good stradegy to WIN @ Talladega .....
race where Villeneuve WASN'T & at the end of the race that was up front ! http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/orn/00.gif

[EBP2K2]

never once have I seen him drive in a manner that would make you doubt his sanity. Other than a rookie screw up at Phoenix in CART where he tagged Hiro Matu****a, I never can say that JV drove into anyone in any way shape or form,

remember his last monte carlo race in Sauber? he took himself out along with his teammate diving into the first corner.

then again, every driver, when they have been driving for any long as JV has, has a brain cramp every now and then, lol.

[electron]

Hey Mark,

I wasn't wasn't making fun of you but the silly filterprogram here.

I definitely agree that JV is very level headed. Maybe he knows better than some others how dangerous this business is.
I also remember one other thing from the BAR days... he got radio from the pits like "Hey, Zonta (the temamate) is doing half a second quicker, pick uop the pace man". JV replies "yeah, but for how many laps will this guy last?" and yup, about ten laps later Zonta stalles, engine smoking. JV even picked up a point or something.

I also was among those to criticise JVs entry at Dega. not because of JV as a driver but because of the principle of not letting rookies into Dega. It turned out good this time but when you open this gate, sometime it will go very wrong. JV would have had no problem if they had told him hey, come again next week but NASCAR decided diffrent

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

He did a great job a dega, i thourght he would do the usual rookie stock car driver thing of over driving it.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I also was among those to criticise JVs entry at Dega. not because of JV as a driver but because of the principle of not letting rookies into Dega. It turned out good this time but when you open this gate, sometime it will go very wrong. JV would have had no problem if they had told him hey, come again next week but NASCAR decided diffrent

They couldn't say no to him because of his winning the Indy 500 and having oval experience and the fact he was a WDC. It isn't like he had never seen an oval before, and as I pointed out, he wasn't ever a wild man. He drove the race like a test session, and that is his right. He never saw a point in getting anyone's way out there and didn't want to mess up anyone's chances in the chase. He wanted seat time and the feel of being in that sort of situation. If BDR felt it was worth running him in this fashion, it is their business. NASCAR is right to evaluate every driver on their abilities to handle things, and I think they talked to Jacques about what was going down and he was very upfront in stating he wouldn't be getting in the mix of the others and would just drive very conservative. He didn't make any enemies...and when you look at people like Ernie Irvan and others who had people mad from the word go, it is clear to me that having stock car experience means nothing when you go to a superspeedway if you are an idiot......or drive like one.

[call_me_andrew]

He did a great job a dega, i thourght he would do the usual rookie stock car driver thing of over driving it.

I think Talladega is the one track where "over driviing it" is physically impossible.

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

i get your point but alot of rookies just end up ploughing through a couple of other cars before they hit the wall. more patience than actually over driving the car physically.

[electron]

well said mark.

call_me_andrew, I dare to differ here. Tally is a track where the 100% line is very thin and getting slighly above it may create havoc which we haven't seen in a long time... I don't want to go flip flopping at 200 mph down the backstetch because some hyped freak didn't get his bumpdrafting lessons right. You can overdrive here and most likely you won't be on your own and you will take someone with you.
That is the major danger here.

almost everywhere else you can crash out on your own one but seldom here.

[call_me_andrew]

I define over driving as cornering too fast. And considering the cars are at their limit of drag, rather than the limit of traction, I really don't think reach the point where you're too fast in the turns.

[electron]

if you reduce it to that you are right for sure.

for there is more than just this limit, which of course is miost important on most other tracks but as we saw, there is at least a way to go over the tire limit and in Tally there is also an aero limit.

[Jonesi]

http://flagworld.auto123.com/en/racing/news/index,view.spy?artid=90934

[muggle not]

Well, I guess that is one way to try to get a Nascar Cup ride. :)

[JasonD]

Quite possible since JV has probably around 100 million in the bank.

Could be dangerous with Pollock involved though.

[jslone]

I am not saying much on the article cus it does not say how much the team was bought for and such.Now JV should have the funds for it but until otherwise proven,I think its crap.

[Sparky1329]

Well, I guess that is one way to try to get a Nascar Cup ride. :)

A pretty good one too. That's what I call job security.

[jslone]

Look what happened to Micheal Waltrip,doh.

[Erki]

Good, BAR all over again? :\

Any bets when Jenson Button will want to go to NASCAR? :p

[muggle not]

JV denies buying BDR. He did not comment though on Pollock.

Who??? Jenson Button, sounds like a figure skater. :)

[Jonesi]

Good, BAR all over again? :\

Any bets when Jenson Button will want to go to NASCAR? :p

He's signed with Honda. When does Honda announce they're entering Nascar competition? ;-)

[ShiftingGears]

Good, BAR all over again? :\

Any bets when Jenson Button will want to go to NASCAR? :p

When NASCAR races in the rain! :D

[bovic]

I thought it's well written!

http://proxy.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?series=2&id=3065865