Flexible aero - flexible cars.

[newf66]

Okay, are you ready for this one?

I was talking with a friend about F1 and we got into the discussion of flexible aerodynamics. He suggests that the car itself could be flexible.

So I'm thinking - why not? Engines at the back, gears & driveshaft are in the back. What's keeping them from engineering the car to flex behind the driver? Would this actually make a difference? (Do the 4,000 winglets they have now make a difference?) Could any body find out?

The car straightens in straitaways, flex/ bend (whatever) once is slows to a certain speed. Isn't that basically the principle of a moving wing? This is of course a very simplistic description but, what the heck?

We've seen some pretty strange things come from the minds in the F1 world of "lets blow some money on something".

[kalasend]

The car straightens in straitaways, flex/ bend (whatever) once is slows to a certain speed. Isn't that basically the principle of a moving wing? This is of course a very simplistic description but, what the heck?


I thought the purpose of flexible aero parts is the opposite: They stand strong in the relatively slow corners to obtain downforce. And when the car is running straight, when air pressure exceeds certain threshold, the parts flex to reduce drag.

But what's the purpose of a flexible chassis?

[Racehound]

Okay, are you ready for this one?

I was talking with a friend about F1 and we got into the discussion of flexible aerodynamics. He suggests that the car itself could be flexible.

So I'm thinking - why not? Engines at the back, gears & driveshaft are in the back. What's keeping them from engineering the car to flex behind the driver? Would this actually make a difference? (Do the 4,000 winglets they have now make a difference?) Could any body find out?

The car straightens in straitaways, flex/ bend (whatever) once is slows to a certain speed. Isn't that basically the principle of a moving wing? This is of course a very simplistic description but, what the heck?

We've seen some pretty strange things come from the minds in the F1 world of "lets blow some money on something".
very simplistic description but what the heck my a**e!!!!!....i think you know more than your letting on coz youve just described the exact flexing floor theorum that McL quizzed the fia(sco) about !!!!......ill write more if ya wanna know l8er

[call_me_andrew]

A flexible chassis would have poor mechanical grip. So when you're stuck behind someone, you're more subject to the effects of dirty air.

Though I'm sure teams would like to build something similar to Inspector Gadget's car.

[V12]

A flexible chassis would have poor mechanical grip. So when you're stuck behind someone, you're more subject to the effects of dirty air.

Though I'm sure teams would like to build something similar to Inspector Gadget's car.

Good point - the chassis is the main load bearing structure and basic automotive engineering principles dictate the stiffer the better. This may have been another application for Chapman's banned twin-chassis idea after ground effects had been banned.

The non-load bearing bodywork of a car is another thing altogether though...

EDIT: And yes I've probably oversimplified things a hell of a lot too! :)

[ioan]

Okay, are you ready for this one?

I was talking with a friend about F1 and we got into the discussion of flexible aerodynamics. He suggests that the car itself could be flexible.

So I'm thinking - why not? Engines at the back, gears & driveshaft are in the back. What's keeping them from engineering the car to flex behind the driver? Would this actually make a difference? (Do the 4,000 winglets they have now make a difference?) Could any body find out?

The car straightens in straitaways, flex/ bend (whatever) once is slows to a certain speed. Isn't that basically the principle of a moving wing? This is of course a very simplistic description but, what the heck?

We've seen some pretty strange things come from the minds in the F1 world of "lets blow some money on something".

Flexible chassis = last place on the grid because there would be no stability whatsoever under braking and when turning, and that's exactly where the difference comes between F1 cars and other overpowered cars.

[Mickey T]

Good response, Ioan.

Indeed, chassis flex is a killer, but it's rather more complicated than that. so here's the simplistic version.

Mechanical loads come from things like acceleration, braking, bump and lateral grip forces. The chassis also accepts the load from the aero aids, such as the wings and the bodywork.

the trouble with a flexible chassis is that it would have to be quite flexible to make any meaningful difference aerodynamically (the floor is not a component of the chassis).

what then happens is that suspension forces from, say, the right front corner put the Hertz on the chassis and effect the suspension geometry of every other corner of the car.

the benefits you'd pick up on the current standard formula of chassis (ie, the the gearbox housing bolts straight to the engine, which bolts direct in the carbon fibre tub, and these three components comprise the "chassis") by any flexibility would be far more offset by the reduction in mechanical grip.

Besides that, any flex would mean that for every slice of downforce you generated by conventional means, you'd lose a fair slice of it by the chassis flexing.

ever ridden a mountain bike with the damper in the frame, or twin dampers? when you're somewhere you don't need the suspension travel, you lose an awful lot of pedal power pushing the shafts up and down the tubes. Same thing here.

[Eyo]

I think it depends on what is the point to measure when they test the wing flexibility. If it measured against the solid ground, then it will flex no matter from where it is flexing. If it’s measured against the car it self, then it could be ok for the test, but would it work? If there is any chance for this to work they would figure it out.

[leopard]

Can't imagine what flexible chassis is being talked about?

I think the better suspension will accommodate this issue to gain to more flexible car, suspension and not the chassis.

And this has been applied in street cars as one of their superiority to give more safety to the driver and passengers when it has to make a hard brake.