WRC Croatia Rally 2021

[Rallyper]

Line changing issue for Ogier...

[EstWRC]

Ogier road section

https://twitter.com/Burgrid7/status/1386210368591175682?s=20

almost off on SS1, 3 pucntures, accident on road section


nahh still P1 and taking the rally win

uneblievable...

[Portimao]

What is wrong with Tanak this weekend?

[meh]

nahh still P1 and taking the rally win

now Evans seems to take it

[Tauri_J]

Ogier slow now

[meh]

What is wrong with Tanak this weekend?

Things do not work for him, probably in some "scoring at least achievable points" mode now.

[PLuto]

What is wrong with Tanak this weekend?

He is slow.

[TypeR]

reg about doors

The centralised door locking systems may be rendered inoperative or may be removed. It must be possible to open all doors from outside (original handles) and the front doors from the inside. Controls for opening the rear doors from the inside may be removed. The removal of door soundproofing material, trims and side protection bars is allowed. The decorative strips may be removed.

[Mirek]

reg about doors

That's rules how to design the door.

[EstWRC]

What is wrong with Tanak this weekend?

i guess first time on PURE tarmac with this machine, plus he historically doesnt do well on this kind of ones, previously Corsica was his worst rally which he admitted himself and now it seems its this cause these has same kind of charateristics

but it seems he knows whats wrong but they cant solve it during the rally. (at least has left this kind impression to estonian media)

today he is just cruising, he has nothing to fight for

[Mirek]

Betting on Evans now.

[KKS]

What is wrong with Tanak this weekend?
He drove a Neuville based car

[Mirek]

Great drive by Suninen here.

[AnttiL]

i guess first time on PURE tarmac with this machine, plus he historically doesnt do well on this kind of ones, previously Corsica was his worst rally which he admitted himself and now it seems its this cause these has same kind of charateristics

but it seems he knows whats wrong but they cant solve it during the rally. (at least has left this kind impression to estonian media)

today he is just cruising, he has nothing to fight for

Tänak was fast in Catalunya and Corsica on the Yaris. And he won Germany three times (a rally with low/varying grip).

It's true that today he's just cruising and trying to secure manu points and maybe save tyres for power stage.

Ogier crash is freak.

[Pršljen]

Ogier road section

https://twitter.com/Burgrid7/status/1386210368591175682?s=20

What was Ogier thinking here, completely his fault.

[wwbroe]

Great time by Bulacia, but Mikkelsen on fire now

[KKS]

Mikkelsen faster than Tanak O_o

[wwbroe]

Mikkelsen preparing for power stage:)

[Mirek]

Mikkelsen is only fast when he is on TV :D

Great drive anyway!

[EstWRC]

Tänak was fast in Catalunya and Corsica on the Yaris. And he won Germany three times (a rally with low/varying grip).

It's true that today he's just cruising and trying to secure manu points and maybe save tyres for power stage.

Ogier crash is freak.

Yes fast but he was even struggling with the Toyota in Corsica, i especially remember 2018 friday, when he was as lost as this weekend basically and lost 44 seconds after friday.

Something does click for him on rally germany but if you look his record on other tarmac rallies he hasnt been as fast on those ones as on rally germany.

But i agree im also disappointed with him this weekend, didnt expect to win but fight for podium but it is what it is sometimes.

[wwbroe]

So, Suninen doesn't have a 10 sec penalty?

[er88]

Maybe silly question, but could Seb get time penalties for that road accident? Completely his fault by the looks of it

[EstWRC]

Maybe silly question, but could Seb get time penalties for that road accident? Completely his fault by the looks of it

i have the same question plus i think after the rally the car is controlled and if they do find something they can exclude him?

[AnttiL]

So, Suninen doesn't have a 10 sec penalty?

Yesterday he said it was organizer’s mistake

[PLuto]

So, Suninen doesn't have a 10 sec penalty?

It was removed yesterday...

[Tauri_J]

Maybe silly question, but could Seb get time penalties for that road accident? Completely his fault by the looks of it

Nope

[wwbroe]

Yesterday he said it was organizer’s mistake

Ok, thanks

[mknight]

Maybe silly question, but could Seb get time penalties for that road accident? Completely his fault by the looks of it

If anything he gets a fine. I remember he got a fine for taking a roundabout the wrong way in Poland 2017 for example.

[wwbroe]

It was removed yesterday...

Thanks, good for him

[meh]

In case this BMW was overspeeding, I think it's not Ogier's fault. In the moment he started line-change, it was clear road behind him on that line.

[AnttiL]

Yes fast but he was even struggling with the Toyota in Corsica, i especially remember 2018 friday, when he was as lost as this weekend basically and lost 44 seconds after friday.

Something does click for him on rally germany but if you look his record on other tarmac rallies he hasnt been as fast on those ones as on rally germany.

But i agree im also disappointed with him this weekend, didnt expect to win but fight for podium but it is what it is sometimes.

2018 Friday seemed to be about finding settings but in 2019 he would have won without that puncture

[wwbroe]

In case this BMW was overspeeding, I think it's not Ogier's fault. In the moment he started line-change, it was clear road behind him on that line.

I think he (Ogier) wanted to stop on that bus-stop, but the car was coming up at that moment.

[dimviii]

https://twitter.com/DirtFishRally/status/1386210871660191751

[wwbroe]

Very bad time for Ingram on this one, what happened to him?

[wwbroe]

Ingram: "stopped in stage, continu"

[petrolhead49]

In case this BMW was overspeeding, I think it's not Ogier's fault. In the moment he started line-change, it was clear road behind him on that line.

Really? Just because you are in a rally car that doesn’t mean road rules don’t apply. You are supposed to use blinkers and make sure the other lane is clear before doing that.


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[dimviii]

as it is now

Evans ............ 56 pts
Neuville .......... 50 pts
Ogier .............. 49 pts
Tanak ............. 39 pts
Rovanpera ...... 39 pts


if Ogier finish 3rd

Evans ........... 56 pts
Neuville ........ 53 pts
Ogier ............ 46 pts
Tanak ............ 39 pts
Rovanpera .... 39 pts

[Eli]

In case this BMW was over-speeding, I think it's not Ogier's fault. In the moment he started line-change, it was clear road behind him on that line.

I completely agree, I don't think it's Ogier's fault. Overtaking from the right (and this isn't UK-Australia,South Africa, Cyprus roads), don't know what that BMW was thinking but it denied Ogier any chance of taking the victory here.

[Pršljen]

Really? Just because you are in a rally car that doesn’t mean road rules don’t apply. You are supposed to use blinkers and make sure the other lane is clear before doing that.


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Of course. And BMW wasn't speeding, that was wide multilane avenue, not some small two way road.

[EstWRC]

I completely agree, I don't think it's Ogier's fault. Overtaking from the right (and this isn't UK-Australia,South Africa, Cyprus roads), don't know what that BMW was thinking but it denied Ogier any chance of taking the victory here.

I don’t agree at all.

Definitely Ogiers fault in my eyes

[Mirek]

I completely agree, I don't think it's Ogier's fault. Overtaking from the right (and this isn't UK-Australia,South Africa, Cyprus roads), don't know what that BMW was thinking but it denied Ogier any chance of taking the victory here.

Overtaking from the right is allowed in city driving in most countries (here for sure). It's not even called overtaking.

The other guy didn't drive 50 km/h, that's quite sure. Still Ogier's mistake.

[KKS]

Really? Just because you are in a rally car that doesn’t mean road rules don’t apply. You are supposed to use blinkers and make sure the other lane is clear before doing that.

road rules have a point that all drivers are stick to the rules and other will expect that. So if it clear to 50kph road- it's ok.

[Franky]

Think it's pointless to point fingers at anyone in that accident as both sides played a role that in the end caused the accident.

[Eli]

Overtaking from the right is allowed in city driving in most countries (here for sure). It's not even called overtaking.

The other guy didn't drive 50 km/h, that's quite sure. Still Ogier's mistake.

Ok, I didn't know that, here it's illegal to overtake from the right no matter if you're inside the city or outside. I accept that he didn't over-speed but he still did try to go faster than Ogier; Also we shouldn't forget, with all that Aero, Ogier has a lot of blind spots. The only thing Ogier did wrong was not indicating with his indicators. In any case, when you see a rally car on the road, you don't try to outmaneuver it. Not the first time this happens (probably isn't the last as well), reminds of before shakedown(?) back in Sweden 2005 with Petter Solberg.

[Mirek]

It's also very difficult to see something with the rearview mirrors they have...

[EstWRC]

as it is now

Evans ............ 56 pts
Neuville .......... 50 pts
Ogier .............. 49 pts
Tanak ............. 39 pts
Rovanpera ...... 39 pts


if Ogier finish 3rd

Evans ........... 56 pts
Neuville ........ 53 pts
Ogier ............ 46 pts
Tanak ............ 39 pts
Rovanpera .... 39 pts

The championship will be very very very tight this year until the end.

See how much the zero from Croatia costs for Kalle and the same goes for Ott with zero from Monte.


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[flat_right]

The way how I see it is that although the BWM guy was speeding, then Ogier can't change lanes and then turn directly to the bus stop pocket to do whatever. You can hear from the sound that Ogier accelerates, changes lanes and then stops. Even if BMW was doing normal speed, then this accident would happened. Had Ogier continued with normal speed, then BMW guy would have had time to decelerate but if you completely stop, then there is no chance.

[Mirek]

The only thing Ogier did wrong was not indicating with his indicators.

That's the basic thing of all and which makes me angry on the roads all the time. The very first thing of being safe in traffic is to be predictable. And that starts with clearly giving others in advance an idea what you are going to do.

Crossing over two lanes to the right is by default a potentially dangerous situation and you always have to be very careful when you do that. Especially if you don't see well behind...

[Eli]

It's also very difficult to see something with the rear-view mirrors they have...

Exactly and as a road-car you should consider that when trying to overtake or whatever that BMW was trying to do. Not taking away from the fact that Ogier didn't use his indicators, but as a road user you should always be alert, especially with rally cars running around.

[Eli]

That's the basic thing of all and which makes me angry on the roads all the time. The very first thing of being safe in traffic is to be predictable. And that starts with clearly giving others in advance an idea what you are going to do.

Crossing over two lanes to the right is by default a potentially dangerous situation and you always have to be very careful when you do that. Especially if you don't see well behind...

True, here they love overtaking from the right (although it's illegal) but that's what happens when the police is more worried about filling their pockets with speeding tickets (from speed cameras) than the actual safety of road users, I guess that's why people here hate indicating all the time, so you really have to guess what's a driver going to do next. But we're really off-topic here, in any case, that's Ogier's win, gone.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Very bad time for Ingram on this one, what happened to him?


Ingram: "stopped in stage, continu"

He's been driving with damaged steering since yesterday.

[wwbroe]

Anyhow, Ogier said at stop finish of this stage that there was not any problem whatever with his car and the fight wasn't over yet.

[rallyfiend]

He's been driving with damaged steering since yesterday.

Does he not have a service crew?!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

On Ogier, that BMW seemed to come fast and from nowhere and in the UK we woukd call that illegal 'undertaking'.

[Eli]

Does he not have a service crew?!

Nope, only refueling zone and that's it. No service on Sunday in Croatia.

[wwbroe]

JML talking about the accident now on alllive

[wwbroe]

Nope, only refueling zone and that's it. No service on Sunday in Croatia.

If it happened allready yesterday they had plenty of time to fix it?

[Mirek]

On Ogier, that BMW seemed to come fast and from nowhere and in the UK we woukd call that illegal 'undertaking'.

In the city? There is no overtaking or undertaking per law in city driving in most of the countries Croatia included.

EDIT: That means you can drive which lane you want. The law doesn't care.

[Rallyper]

JML very diplomatic and welltalking. Good representative for Toyota.

[Oliverk]

Damn impossible to drive in the city without overtaking :D You guys all drunk?

[meh]

I would not call it overtaking. If you do your line-change with close to max allowed speed and before that you don't see anyone from your tiny mirror, then it is questionable, if you get hit by some surprise rocket.

But the same clear is that there is no point to have argument here with some gentleman, SS19 is up and running, back to rally :)

[petrolhead49]

Both are at fault, clearly it was avoidable, thinking about defensive driving, when you come from behind you should be able to see something like that coming. As far as I know driving faster on another lane is not considered overtaking, even if it’s the right lane. Overtaking is when you change lanes and that is not permitted using the right hand side. On wider roads speed limits can be more that 50 km/h, we clearly don’t know all the details.

My problem is that rally drivers do that stuff all the time, not only in wrc. They should be better than regular drivers and have a predictible and respectful conduct. Also, we should note he was driving slow at first, then accelerated and braked - wrc cars on slicks have quite the stopping power.


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[dimviii]

Rally Warrior
@rally_warrior

Frustrating morning for Chris & Ross who had an off in SS18 (bent steering) and got stuck for a moment. They lost about 1 minute & are now down to P5. But Croatia Rally is not over, 2 more stages to go!
#RallyWarrior #WRC #WRC3 #CroatiaRally #itaintovertillitsover

[Fast Eddie WRC]

In the city? There is no overtaking or undertaking per law in city driving in most of the countries Croatia included.



In very slow heavy traffic jams its ok, but otherwise no.

[rallyfiend]

Any rational appraisal of that accident puts the blame 100% on Ogier's shoulders.

He tried to cut across the lane in to the bus stop without due care and attention and caused the accident. He was even under heavy breaking in a middle lane to make sure to make the bus stop.

If he had stuck to his chosen lane there would have been no accident.

[KKS]

In very slow heavy traffic jams its ok, but otherwise no.
overtaking - it's pass by opposite way lane. Pass at same direction only - "pass by"

[denkimi]

In the city? There is no overtaking or undertaking per law in city driving in most of the countries Croatia included.

EDIT: That means you can drive which lane you want. The law doesn't care.

i'm not sure about croatia, but in almost all european countries overtaking on the right is always forbidden.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Croatia:
73 road deaths per million inhabitants estimated in 2019, which is well above the EU average.

[Mirek]

overtaking - it's pass by opposite way lane. Pass at same direction only - "pass by"

No, on a motorway it's still overtaking per law.

It's different in cities where it's simply impossible to make it forbidden to pass from the right.


i'm not sure about croatia, but in almost all european countries overtaking on the right is always forbidden.

Overtaking yes but driving in the city doesn't recognize overtaking per law in Croatia (I am sure about it), here in CZ and in many other countries because it is simply impossible to force.


Croatia:
73 road deaths per million inhabitants estimated in 2019, which is well above the EU average.

Completely irrelevant information.

[Moriarty]

https://youtu.be/pFOE4PeLIfg

[Pršljen]

Croatia:
73 road deaths per million inhabitants estimated in 2019, which is well above the EU average.

Well yes, but we are also among the poorest EU countries and although we have good road infrastructure with lot of motorways, our cars are very old on average. But in 2020 there was giant decline in number of deceased, it's getting better.

This is the first accident caused by a WRC car :D

[meh]

https://youtu.be/pFOE4PeLIfg

This one has potential to develop...

[Rallyper]

This one has potential to develop...

uuujjj...!!!

[denkimi]

Overtaking yes but driving in the city doesn't recognize overtaking per law in Croatia (I am sure about it), here in CZ and in many other countries because it is simply impossible to force.

i'm not completely sure what that's supposed to mean. do the rules not apply in city's or what?

in belgium and the rest of western europe, the only exception to the "always drive on the right" rule are traffic jams and when you are on an exit that leads to a different destination. but neither of those things apply here.

but as i said, this could be different in croatia.

[KKS]

https://youtu.be/pFOE4PeLIfg
fcking hell

[Lead]

https://youtu.be/pFOE4PeLIfg
This doesnt look good for Ogier.

[flat_right]

I'm not against Ogier but if this doesn't develop into something, then this would be a potential case for others in the future.

[KKS]

No, on a motorway it's still overtaking per law.

Here in Ukraine we forbidden to overtake from right, but "overtake" it's only maneuver on opposite direction lane. It's allowed even in city when sign and lanes are allowed

[EstWRC]

knowing his luck, nothing will be done

[denkimi]

Here in Ukraine we forbidden to overtake from right, but "overtake" it's only maneuver on opposite direction lane. It's allowed even in city when sign and lanes are allowed
that doesn't make any sense.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Great push by Neuville.

[tpt010]

I'm not against Ogier but if this doesn't develop into something, then this would be a potential case for others in the future.

Probably a fine, but this should be it. There is rally ongoing and there is already team member (Jarmo Lehtinen) taking care of things. And in general... Mirek is totally right: overtaking on right lane is forbidden only on motorways, not in cities. Same applies in almost every European country.

[flat_right]

knowing his luck, nothing will be done

If the police made their job properly and made a report that Ogier made a hit-and-run, then there will be something.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Completely irrelevant information.

If they undertake on the inside, it explains a lot.

[flat_right]

Probably a fine, but this should be it. There is rally ongoing and there is already team member (Jarmo Lehtinen) taking care of things. And in general... Mirek is totally right: overtaking on right lane is forbidden only on motorways, not in cities. Same applies in almost every European country.

I was talking about the video where the police tried to stop Ogier from driving away.

[EstWRC]

incredible fight, awesome

[jonkka]

Stop pointless arguing and check the facts. Legislation varies but still most motorists don't seem to know what's what and what's allowed or not.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overtaking#Overtaking_on_the_inside

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Great push by Neuville.

Not enough though. Toyota battle for the win now.

[Rallyper]

Gryazin stopped

[Tauri_J]

Gryazin stopped

Ugh so usual for him

[meh]

Ostberg also stopped? No split4 and freezed on maps.

edit: stage time exists, wrc+ "features"

[Mirek]

If they undertake on the inside, it explains a lot.

So again. It is allowed in the city driving because it is not overtaking per law in Croatia. In a city traffic on multi-lane roads it is totally common that vehicles in different lanes pass each other in whatever order. I'm quite sure it is like that in major British cities as well.

An example. You have a left lane leading left or straight. Right lane leads only straight. Now a vehicle in the left lane is taking left turn and another vehicles behind it slow down. You come by the right lane with other cars in front and behind you. Will you now slow down not to overtake the slowly moving left lane? Of course not because you would simply block the traffic.

[Got Mail]

knowing his luck, nothing will be done

Stewards can't let this go. It's appalling behaviour.

Not a good fit for the ' FIA action for road safety' .....

[dimviii]

incredible fight, awesome

Νeuville could take the win if they didnt f@cked up the tyre choice.

question at Ogier at stage end.
Ingrassia wearing googles?
lol

[htr]

https://youtu.be/pFOE4PeLIfg

https://www.fia.com/fia-and-its-long-history-road-safety
:D

[denkimi]

So again. It is allowed in the city driving because it is not overtaking per law in Croatia. In a city traffic on multi-lane roads it is totally common that vehicles in different lanes pass each other in whatever order. I'm quite sure it is like that in major British cities as well.

An example. You have a left lane leading left or straight. Right lane leads only straight. Now a vehicle in the left lane is taking left turn and another vehicles behind it slow down. You come by the right lane with other cars in front and behind you. Will you now slow down not to overtake the slowly moving left lane? Of course not because you would simply block the traffic.
but this was not the case. here we have 3 lanes going to the same direction. there is no reason why anyone should be able to overtake on the right here.

[Mirek]

but this was not the case. here we have 3 lanes going to the same direction. there is no reason why anyone should be able to overtake on the right here.

Doesn't matter. It's legal to undertake in a city in Croatia. Same here in CZ.

The example was to give an idea why it is not forbidden because it can not be realistically enfoced.

[EstWRC]

Stewards can't let this go. It's appalling behaviour.

Not a good fit for the ' FIA action for road safety' .....

we will see, 400€ fine i guess

[masa90]

Oh wow. This won't look good for Ogier or the sport. Even if there is a team member there to sort it out, can't see how this turn out good for them.

[Mirek]

Stage red-flagged. Sounds like a big crash...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

So again. It is allowed in the city driving because it is not overtaking per law in Croatia. In a city traffic on multi-lane roads it is totally common that vehicles in different lanes pass each other in whatever order. I'm quite sure it is like that in major British cities as well.

An example. You have a left lane leading left or straight. Right lane leads only straight. Now a vehicle in the left lane is taking left turn and another vehicles behind it slow down. You come by the right lane with other cars in front and behind you. Will you now slow down not to overtake the slowly moving left lane? Of course not because you would simply block the traffic.

OVERtaking is fine anywhere including city centres, but any UNDERtaking is not allowed in the UK unless the lane you are in is turning off the main road.

[flat_right]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aqIYYeexqs

Here is one more video. Police clearly indicates that you can't drive further but Ogier still drives away.

[Lead]

Stage red-flagged. Sounds like a big crash...
For Gryazin?

[KKS]

Ugh so usual for him
U can't destroy all other times without crash on a next stage... typical

[PLuto]

For Gryazin?

Yes - https://rally-base.com/2021/croatia-rally-2021/

[PLuto]

It looks like that crew is ok, only car was blocking the road.

[mknight]

About Ogier. Wonder why there is nobody in the right lane in the first place when Ogier and the other cars are seemingly stopped? Is that lane only for turning off and/or buses straight or something?

About driving from police. One guy(Vojtech) once had police chase him and then stand on his bonnet at start of next stage in CZ.

[EstWRC]

so will history repeat itself and Evans loses his lead again on last stage or can he write another and new chapter this time?

dont get the long pause now before PS stage

[EstWRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ezzw8OyWYAEQCPk?format=jpg&name=900x900

[Mirek]

About driving from police. One guy(Vojtech) once had police chase him and then stand on his bonnet at start of next stage in CZ.

Yes but that was about 15 years ago...

[meh]

dont get the long pause now before PS stage

Probably some extra buffer for potential delays during day and regrouping WRC2 before WRC or something like that. Annoying indeed.

[dimviii]

https://scontent-bru2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/178435510_310658080421080_2722340805416003737_n.jp g?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=BOsegWFdEmQAX_fWHRn&_nc_ht=scontent-bru2-1.xx&oh=19c8f629aeeaddda22c1c2d3919528fb&oe=60AB98B0

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EzzwO-EXMAIhpfa?format=jpg&name=large

[petrolhead49]

Yes but that was about 15 years ago...

Heard stories like that also, but then there was no social media. Croatian spectators seem to have phones as extensions to their hands...


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[dimviii]

lol

https://www.zupimages.net/up/21/16/5pg2.jpg

[mknight]

Yes but that was about 15 years ago...

Point was that when two or more stubborn people meet anything can happen.

Sure Ogier should listen to the police. On the other it's not like there was any danger of "running" to evade responsibility (avoid being identified). Certainly not with what seems like a Toyota team member there. How did he get there anyway? They stood there for long time or he was nearby?

[wwbroe]

Point was that when two or more stubborn people meet anything can happen.

Sure Ogier should listen to the police. On the other it's not like there was any danger of "running" to evade responsibility (avoid being identified). Certainly not with what seems like a Toyota team member there. How did he get there anyway? They stood there for long time or he was nearby?

Ogier will get away with it, probably only a fine like usual.:D

[Humber]

Not if the police arrest Ogier and take him to a police station for questioning before the power stage.

The usual over-riding imperative after any vehicle accident is to stop and ascertain injury to any other person involved. Render assistance &/or summon help etc.

[wwbroe]

Are they going to restart the stage or all competitors will receive notional time?

[rallyfiend]

Probably a fine, but this should be it. There is rally ongoing and there is already team member (Jarmo Lehtinen) taking care of things. And in general... Mirek is totally right: overtaking on right lane is forbidden only on motorways, not in cities. Same applies in almost every European country.

'Team Member' is not a legal construct!

That's like you being involved in an accident and allowed to leave, 'but don't worry, my mum will be here soon!'

[mknight]

Not if the police arrest Ogier and take him to a police station for questioning before the power stage.

I am sure there are lot of phonecalls going around from the organizers. Certainly they don't want this Rally Croatia to be the last and remembered by this and "no spectators". (Besids optics the spectators raise doubt about their ability to control them when it's allowed).

[wwbroe]

Stage seems to be cancelled now?

[Tom K]

It's free run for all.

[Pršljen]

I am sure there are lot of phonecalls going around from the organizers. Certainly they don't want this Rally Croatia to be the last and remembered by this and "no spectators". (Besids optics the spectators raise doubt about their ability to control them when it's allowed).

What are you talking about? What is wrong with the organization? Is their fault that Ogier acts like a child? And how would you control the spectators? Bear in mind that this is not some remote forest in northern Finland, it's backyard of the capital and area with more than million inhabitants.

[Mirek]

What are you talking about? What is wrong with the organization? Is their fault that Ogier acts like a child? And how would you control the spectators? Bear in mind that this is not some remote forest in northern Finland, it's backyard of the capital and area with more than million inhabitants.

I dare to say that the crowd control seems to be generally good. I didnd't see any suicidal spectators along the stages like often elsewhere (maybe few individuals but no dangerous crowds). Sure it's strange to call it "no spectator" rally and than even issue beer tents to the stages but in the end I just feel a little jelous that you can go there and spectate the WRC in your country :)

[bomber21]

I think that the sport gained new fans from Croatia and this is a great thing for the sport we all love.
And I agree, fans are generally behaving well.

[Eli]

I dare to say that the crowd control seems to be generally good. I didn't see any suicidal spectators along the stages like often elsewhere (maybe few individuals but no dangerous crowds). Sure it's strange to call it "no spectator" rally and than even issue beer tents to the stages but in the end I just feel a little jealous that you can go there and spectate the WRC in your country :)

A bit off topic here ,Hopefully Barum Rally will return this year (to the ERC) and while on the subject, I'd love to see it on the WRC calendar.

[Pršljen]

I dare to say that the crowd control seems to be generally good. I didnd't see any suicidal spectators along the stages like often elsewhere (maybe few individuals but no dangerous crowds). Sure it's strange to call it "no spectator" rally and than even issue beer tents to the stages but in the end I just feel a little jelous that you can go there and spectate the WRC in your country :)

Well, I'm far away from Zagreb now and that's why I'm super sensitive of possibility of bad organization and loss of slot in the 2022 calendar when I'll be able to come :)

An epic battle awaits us on the PS. Lot of points to be decided, maybe Tanak will go flat out to damage Toyota's result, maybe Toyota will have some strategy of securing the 1-2.

[Mirek]

On a fun note... the incident of Ogier and the policeman is a principle example of why the WRC shall not be held in USA :D

[rage82]

On Ogier, that BMW seemed to come fast and from nowhere and in the UK we woukd call that illegal 'undertaking'.And there was probably a bus lane( because there was a bus stop) and you shouldn't be driving in the bus lane.

Sent from my Redmi Note 5 using Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

Well, I'm far away from Zagreb now and that's why I'm super sensitive of possibility of bad organization and loss of slot in the 2022 calendar when I'll be able to come :)

An epic battle awaits us on the PS. Lot of points to be decided, maybe Tanak will go flat out to damage Toyota's result, maybe Toyota will have some strategy of securing the 1-2.

i would be surprised if Ott gets any points at all

[TypeR]

Of course. And BMW wasn't speeding, that was wide multilane avenue, not some small two way road.


On a fun note... the incident of Ogier and the policeman is a principle example of why the WRC shall not be held in USA :D

In the States - he would have been pushed off the road with shot tyres, pulled out of the car, tazed and sent to prison :D losing 25p would be the least problem :D

[Mirek]

And there was probably a bus lane( because there was a bus stop) and you shouldn't be driving in the bus lane.

There are no bus-lane signs on the road, moreover it was on Sunday. At least here in Prague majority of bus-lanes are free to use on Sunday.

[Pršljen]

And there was probably a bus lane( because there was a bus stop) and you shouldn't be driving in the bus lane.

Sent from my Redmi Note 5 using Tapatalk

That's not bus lane even though the bus stop is there. BMW was driving correctly.

[wwbroe]

I understand that some people want to defend Ogier but the accident was clearly his mistake.

[mknight]

What are you talking about? What is wrong with the organization? Is their fault that Ogier acts like a child? And how would you control the spectators? Bear in mind that this is not some remote forest in northern Finland, it's backyard of the capital and area with more than million inhabitants.

The optics if police somehow affects the result with uncessary action (for example putting Ogier in jail just before the PS). Will in the end affect how the rally is viewed.

There have been lots of rallies run with close to no spectators visible. ERC rally Roma or Monza last year had like 1/100th the amount og people.

The countries obviously set the rules themselves. But then there is the contrast between rules and actual situation. How will crowd control work if the rally is "open" and you get 2-3 times more people than now? Maybe perfectly..maybe not.

[focus206]

Incredible behavior by Ogier. If this was done by random WRC3 driver, he'd probably get DQ for causing an accident & disobeying police, and then his license revoked. But it's Ogier, he might just get a slap on the back of one hand.

[Pršljen]

The optics if police somehow affects the result with uncessary action (for example putting Ogier in jail just before the PS). Will in the end affect how the rally is viewed.

There have been lots of rallies run with close to no spectators visible. ERC rally Roma or Monza last year had like 1/100th the amount og people.

The countries obviously set the rules themselves. But then there is the contrast between rules and actual situation. How will crowd control work if the rally is "open" and you get 2-3 times more people than now? Maybe perfectly..maybe not.

Well, we don't know why Ogier left and why police wanted him to stop. Of course it will not affect Ogier's rally but we'll see what they'll do afterwards. Laws and rules are laws and rules.

As I mentioned, COVIS restrictions in Croatia are very liberal and people are very sensitive about lockdowns and any kind of movement restrictions. I don't see way of stopping them from spectating.

If FIA finds it problematic for the rally's future than they are shooting in their own foot. WRC just grew immensely in Croatia and people enjoy it - and then you give the rally a thumbs down because they do, only because it was against the spectating rules?

Hopefully it won't happen.

[Mirek]

Another big moment of Gryazin from SS15: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctGRtBQ9cHg

[rage82]

That's not bus lane even though the bus stop is there. BMW was driving correctly.Ok, it was just a guess.

Sent from my Redmi Note 5 using Tapatalk

[mknight]

Well, we don't know why Ogier left and why police wanted him to stop. Of course it will not affect Ogier's rally but we'll see what they'll do afterwards. Laws and rules are laws and rules.


When police stops someone a lot is left for them to decide. From nothing over writing a fine and goodbye up to arrest and drive to hospital for drug/alkohol blood test. Sure you can can complain at the court afterwards but there and then they have a lot of options which are all up to them.

Obviously here we don't know much. Except that Ogier waited for the police to arrive, that there was likely another team member that stayed and that there was video evidence.

[meh]

Actually it's a weird situation - like police was not sure what they are doing. If Ogier was not allowed to go, then in some other countries he could not go anywhere. And if he was not allowed to go and caused some danger to the policeman, it could be a completely different story.

[Mirek]

Obviously here we don't know much. Except that Ogier waited for the police to arrive, that there was likely another team member that stayed and that there was video evidence.

I think that the man looked like Jarmo Lehtinen.

[Francis44]

What is all the fuss about?! These incidents happen and Im sure Toyota is more than keen on paying the damages to the BMW owner. It has happened before in Portugal for example and at the time the owner was given a brand new pick up truck. Why was the police there? Were they looking for a payout?!

[Rallyper]

Let´s leave the Ogier issue.

Now concentrate on PS. Please.

[Mirek]

What is all the fuss about?! These incidents happen and Im sure Toyota is more than keen on paying the damages to the BMW owner. It has happened before in Portugal for example and at the time the owner was given a brand new pick up truck. Why was the police there? Were they looking for a payout?!

Well...
1) Becuse it goes in viral in a matter of minutes and there is a thing called FIA action to road safety you know...
2) Because police needs respect to have any meaning of existence and incidents like this make them looking like clowns
3) Because it's normal to call police to an accident, I would certainly call a police myself too had a WRC car crashed in mine
4) Because had it happened in France Ogier would never dare to drive on the policeman like here because they are f*cking serious there.

[Francis44]

Well...
1) Becuse it goes in viral in a matter of minutes and there is a thing called FIA action to road safety you know...
2) Because police needs respect to have any meaning of existence and incidents like this make them looking like clowns
3) Because it's normal to call police to an accident, I would certainly call a police myself too had a WRC car crashed in mine
4) Because had it happened in France Ogier would never dare to drive on the policeman like here because they are f*cking serious there.

Amazing because elsewhere in Europe for a minor crash in which one of the involved as clearly taken responsability I would sure be waiting 1 hour minimum for the police to show up 😅 .

[Got Mail]

I think that the man looked like Jarmo Lehtinen.

It was Jarmo. 100%

[Mirek]

Amazing because elsewhere in Europe for a minor crash in which one of the involved as clearly taken responsability I would sure be waiting 1 hour minimum for the police to show up �� .

That's only your presumption. You don't know what was happening there and if Ogier admitted it was his fault. You simply can not know.

[Francis44]

That's only your presumption. You don't know what was happening there and if Ogier admitted it was his fault. You simply can not know.

So what was he supposed to do? Wait for all to agree on what exactly happened and DNF? Stupid for Ogier to crash like that and stupid of the policeman to try and stop the car like that.

[Mirek]

So what was he supposed to do? Wait for all to agree on what exactly happened and DNF? Stupid for Ogier to crash like that and stupid of the policeman to try and stop the car like that.

No idea what you are trying to prove here.

[Francis44]

No idea what you are trying to prove here.

Prove? Nothing. Just stating that a minor incident, which might be 100% solved right now, is getting way too much traction from Ogier haters, as per usual.

[Sulland]

Ok PS time!

seemed like the drivers liked the stage when driving it for the first time today.

Lets hope all make it to the chess flag!

[Mirek]

Prove? Nothing. Just stating that a minor incident, which might be 100% solved right now, is getting way too much traction from Ogier haters, as per usual.

Driving on a policeman is not a minor accident.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/toyota-praises-ogier-for-professional-drive-after-croatia-accident/6452477

[Jarek Z]

Ogier's accident is now all over the Polish media websites, especially the ones that never write about rallying:

https://www.sport.pl/moto/7,64997,27016577,pan-w-bmw-chcial-byc-lepszy-od-mistrza-kuriozalny-final-rajdu.html#s=BoxOpImg10

https://motoryzacja.interia.pl/rajdy-i-wyscigi/news-kuriozalna-sytuacja-na-rajdzie-chorwacji-mistrz-swiata-chcia,nId,5191873#iwa_source=worthsee

[Francis44]

Driving on a policeman is not a minor accident.

I beg to differ since clearly not one of the police involved were keen to get on a car and chase the "criminal". But anyway, back to the rally.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Huge crowds at the PS.

[Mirek]

Mikkelsen 10 seconds faster than in the first run! Wow

Great stage btw!

[dimviii]

Fourmaux crash
https://youtu.be/UnHk_UPn9LY

[Got Mail]

Andreas pushing like hell in that one.

He had a few glances at the TWATER screen after that big landing...

[Sulland]

Quite a lot of movement in the car Mikkelsen said just after the finish line. So probably a lot of dirt.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0HBIlXIAIDY8O?format=jpg&name=medium

[SubaruNorway]

Quite a lot of movement in the car Mikkelsen said just after the finish line. So probably a lot of dirt.

Tyres going off he said

[drive]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0HBIlXIAIDY8O?format=jpg&name=medium

Loads of photo cameras 0,1sek till destruction.... :)

[Mainie]

Generally nice to see some fans, but what really annoys me is that zero distancing and no masks at all. Guys, Croatia is also pretty much struck by the pandemic and tolerating that behaviour is not okay in current times. We all sacrifice a lot and hope that we get back to normal, also in sports, ASAP

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Not bad Suninen. At least he showed the Fiesta Rally2 is competitive.

[EstWRC]

nice job Teemu, i feared a lot worse results before the start

[meh]

Mikkelsen had propoer run, 3.5sec faster then Loubet in 1st split.

[Mirek]

Mikkelsen had propoer run, 3.5sec faster then Loubet in 1st split.

This is also a "Fabia stage" if you can call one like that.

[EstWRC]

Breen finally faster

[flat_right]

This is also a "Fabia stage" if you can call one like that.

But maybe it is about the tires? Mikkelsen could save them all the day for this stage (same like Tänak). So now he could push and tires were there for him.

[dimviii]

Generally nice to see some fans, but what really annoys me is that zero distancing and no masks at all. Guys, Croatia is also pretty much struck by the pandemic and tolerating that behaviour is not okay in current times. We all sacrifice a lot and hope that we get back to normal, also in sports, ASAP

lol

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0RuwbXoAAvmqP?format=jpg&name=large

https://twitter.com/paddocknews/status/1386284662776078336

[Mirek]

But maybe it is about the tires? Mikkelsen could save them all the day for this stage (same like Tänak). So now he could push and tires were there for him.

He's fastest Rally2 driver over the 3rd leg, so no. Also in the first run of this stage he was 6th overall among WRC cars.

[Sulland]

Not bad Suninen. At least he showed the Fiesta Rally2 is competitive.

On asphalt the Mk2 has been all along. But on gravel it is still not on par with the Skoda ot Polo
The C3 Rally2 is now on par with the others on all surfaces I think.

Hyundai need to get the new car approved, then we will hopefully have a 4 way battle in Rally2.

[mknight]

Mikkelsen also said he prbly didn't have the best tires, so likely some softs on the car.

[steve.mandzij]

Rally mercifully over for Craig. Unfortunate result for him on his favorite surface.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk

[Mirek]

Gus nearly crashed into the static camera :D

[EstWRC]

Greensmith nearly taking camera man off

[SubaruNorway]

Gus nearly crashed into the static camera :D

It was only static after he scared the cameraman away....

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Top top WRC debut by Fourmaux. Bravo !

[wwbroe]

Tanak slower as Breen on first split

[Rallyper]

Fourmaux, very good performance.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Tanak behind Breen on split !

[meh]

Probably first time when Tänak is out of top3 without some huge problem. We don't know ofcourse, maybe there is some.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Just not comfortable in the car. No issues.

[mknight]

2nd time in a row Breen "steals" points from teammates. Manu pointsnfor PS are imo the reason Adamo allows that.

[EstWRC]

2nd time in a row Breen "steals" points from teammates. Manu pointsnfor PS are imo the reason Adamo allows that.

didnt get this also. Ott would have brought the same points

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Win gone for Neuville.

[Pršljen]

Big mistake by Neuville.

[Mirek]

Neuville overshot a junction...

[EstWRC]

small but costly mistake

[mknight]

didnt get this also. Ott would have brought the same points

You never know that before stage start any kind of issue can happen.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Ogier really on it.

[Sulland]

Why do the all live crew appologize when crews are human in their language when frustrated at stage ends?
it is not their responsibility !

[EstWRC]

Evans loses again?

[Mirek]

Ogier had a pretty hot moment there.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Evans has lost it , wow !! :(

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Incredible finale !

[Mirek]

Still lucky with that off in the last corner!

[Pršljen]

What a finish!!!

[Sulland]

Too bad, wanted this one for Evans!

[Mirek]

Awesome power stage and a great rally!

[EstWRC]

i wouldnt be 100% sure about his win yet...

[ipe]

Incredible rally. Thanks Croatia!

[Got Mail]

i wouldnt be 100% sure about his win yet...

Indeed. I should imagine Evans will be the winner by this evening.

[dimviii]

nevertheless an amazing finale!

[wwbroe]

Great rally indeed, should remain in WRC

[mknight]

I really doubt they will change the results.

[denkimi]

Great drive from the top 3. Ogier once again showing why he's the champion.

A shame hyundai messed up yesterday.

[EstWRC]

3rd win for Ogier from 4 last rallies, and all of those on tarmac.

Like i said before the rally, Ogier + Toyota the best combo at the moment on tarmac

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Amazing rally and showing why I prefer tarmac rallying.

[MikeD]

Fourmaux !!! what a debut. It will be interesting to see what happens with hin in the next events. He's the new kid on the block!

[TypeR]

3rd win for Ogier from 4 last rallies, and all of those on tarmac.

Like i said before the rally, Ogier + Toyota the best combo at the moment on tarmac

with every event and win the chance of Ogier retiring after this year decreases :D

[Rallyper]

Organizer did a good job. Nice rally. Should be in calendar every year. Maybe mixed with Spain.

[mknight]

Fourmaux !!! what a debut. It will be interesting to see what happens with hin in the next events. He's the new kid on the block!

IMO as I said yesterday they really need to let him drive a lot of gravel, whatever the car.

[EstWRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0dK46XIAIo-7o?format=jpg&name=900x900
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0dK47XEAAb40a?format=jpg&name=900x900

[RudiH]

Great stages, fast and technical enough, asset for WRC

[bomber21]

Great rally until the last corner!!

[focus206]

i wouldnt be 100% sure about his win yet...

I would, it's Ogier. I'd be surprised if they did anything about the results.

A really nice rally, I hope it won't be the last time Croatia is in WRC. Shame for Hyundai's tyre choice, maybe we could have had an actual 3 way battle in the power stage. Ogier got 3 punctures (or so he says they were 3...), caused a road accident, disobeyed police and still managed to win, wow.

[Sulland]

Fourmaux !!! what a debut. It will be interesting to see what happens with hin in the next events. He's the new kid on the block!

Why is there always a new french driver getting to the top?
What is it that the french does to find the talents, is it the FFSA programs only?

Anyway, Formaux was impressive, and Greensmith must get tired of being beaten!
But all in all A step forward for the Fiesta WRC!

[Pršljen]

Rally director says that Ogier invited the guy whose car he destroyed on a dinner tonight. He is a rally fan and is delighted that he met Ogier like that :D

Seems like everything is fine.

[EstWRC]

Rally director says that Ogier invited the guy whose car he destroyed on a dinner tonight. He is a rally fan and is delighted that he met Ogier like that :D

Seems like everything is fine.

even better!

i would give 5 extra points for this move to Ogier!

[Francis44]

Rally director says that Ogier invited the guy whose car he destroyed on a dinner tonight. He is a rally fan and is delighted that he met Ogier like that :D

Seems like everything is fine.

Nice indeed.

[TypeR]

a comment left to Ogier accident YT video:

Rally organizer: "It turned out a bit awkward that Ogier was running away from the cops and it’s clear to me that this could be interpreted from the video that was posted. No, a Toyota representative, who came immediately, is in coordination with the control of the entire rally organization and police together, made a deal to let Ogier go. I guess this cop didn't hear that so it turned out like Ogier was running away from him. There was no need for him to be detained, although the police have the right to exclude the vehicle from traffic, and at the same time from the rally if it is determined that it is unsafe to drive. His door was cracked, but he could continue the traffic so they let him go. The police took his data and the data of the driver of the other car, and they will have another conversation with Ogier later in the afternoon. If they find that he is really guilty, the other driver will pay damages as is done in every other car accident. All cars must have and have car insurance like you and me, fulfilling the European report and the procedures is the most normal"

[Pršljen]

Also, Croatian media reports that Ogier DID have police approval for leaving the place of car accident. That policeman who tried to stop him wasn't aware of that. They agreed to take action on Ogier after the rally.

[denkimi]

Why is there always a new french driver getting to the top?
What is it that the french does to find the talents, is it the FFSA programs only?

Anyway, Formaux was impressive, and Greensmith must get tired of being beaten!
But all in all A step forward for the Fiesta WRC!
because the FFSA actually looks for talent instead of rich kids.

the RACB in belgium did the same once and found neuville. unfortunately they haven't tried it again since then.

[ferrial]

Nothing new, but Tänak said to Estonian media after the Croatian rally, that he is not comfortable driving Hyundai on tarmac (indicated that only Neuville is comfortable with the car, other drivers not) and Hyundai isn't 100% comfortable on gravel either. Tänak hoped that they will find a solution, especially for tarmac rallies.

[mknight]

Yeah that makes him the 3rd in line, also now joined by Breen.

[Eli]

Yeah that makes him the 3rd in line, also now joined by Breen.

Well at least Breen was the fastest of the Hyundai's on the power stage if that's any consolation. In any case, Hyundai still have work to do for the next Tarmac rounds. Hopefully now that all crews have the experience on dry tarmac with those Pirellis, we'll have an (even more) intriguing battles on the 3 remaining tarmac rounds. I'm sure Adamo will hit back (just as they did last time out) when we come back to the gravel section of the season starting with Portugal.

On a different note, what a debut for Adrien Fourmaux. He's really impressed and hopefully he'll get some eyes looking at him more closely from now on around the service park, it's a refreshing change of pace to see a new rally driver on the scene doing so well from the off, sure it was a tarmac event but that doesn't guarantee anything, as we saw time and again in this championship. Hopefully his next WRC event with a WRC car isn't too far off.

As for Croatia, what a debut for an event and that's before considering the 3rd closest finish ever in the championship, it's always nice to see a new event, especially a Tarmac one. It was really enjoyable to watch (when WRC+ was working properly), hopefully we get to see the event again next year and I sincerely hope that after this year the FIA and Promoter will be compelled to add new events every once an a while without waiting for a pandemic to happen. Looks really good in the championship, bring on Portugal!

[TypeR]

I think that there isn't so much to do anymore with this gen Hyundai (for other than Neuville to suit it).. especially on tarmac. I'm sure that both Loeb and Tänak have tried a lot of things to make it work as they want, but no real success..

Evans has lost quite many wins due to mistakes or bad luck

-touching bridge on PS, Argentina 2017, lost victory
-puncture on PS, Corsica 2019, lost victory
-offroad in Monza 2020, lost possible WDC
-touching bank on PS, Croatia 2021, lost victory

[EstWRC]

Nothing new, but Tänak said to Estonian media after the Croatian rally, that he is not comfortable driving Hyundai on tarmac (indicated that only Neuville is comfortable with the car, other drivers not) and Hyundai isn't 100% comfortable on gravel either. Tänak hoped that they will find a solution, especially for tarmac rallies.

you mean the delfi one?

Q: Can you say something about the performance on gravel of Hyundai?

A: No, i cant say/dont know. We have to drive the first rally through and then we will see. At the end of last year on gravel it was so and so, it has been 6 months since the last the gravel rally so its hard to say something.

[flat_right]

Nothing new, but Tänak said to Estonian media after the Croatian rally, that he is not comfortable driving Hyundai on tarmac (indicated that only Neuville is comfortable with the car, other drivers not) and Hyundai isn't 100% comfortable on gravel either. Tänak hoped that they will find a solution, especially for tarmac rallies.

I wonder why no reporter didn't ask him that what is the reason why he doesn't feel comfortable to push. Is it high speed corners, is it breaking, is it overall grip... Didn't hear from Estonian media (not surprise though, because the reporter is amazingly bad) and also from All Live crew that question.

I'm still positive that they will find something. Ott is known for finding something that will help him. Next tarmac rallies are in the end of the year and there is time.

About carvel rallies then although it is not perfect there also, then I think he is more comfortable there. Road position in Portugal and Sardegna should help him also.

[TypeR]

you mean the delfi one?

Q: Can you say something about the performance on gravel of Hyundai?

A: No, i cant say/dont know. We have to drive the first rally through and then we will see. At the end of last year on gravel it was so and so, it has been 6 months since the last the gravel rally so its hard to say something.

so still the same as in Monte, where he said that he hasn't been on pace for over a year.. With all the resources and knowhow it's sad though. 1.5 years gone by and no really big improvements..

[EstWRC]

pointless to ask him about those things, he wont answer anyway

[mknight]

I think that there isn't so much to do anymore with this gen Hyundai (for other than Neuville to suit it).. especially on tarmac. I'm sure that both Loeb and Tänak have tried a lot of things to make it work as they want, but no real success..


Nah since they started to do something about it instead og telling drivers to adapt (so from mid2019-ish), they have improved a lot on tarmac. But Toyota isn't standing still and waiting for them. (Unlike MSport)

[EstWRC]

so still the same as in Monte, where he said that he hasn't been on pace for over a year.. With all the resources and knowhow it's sad though. 1.5 years gone by and no really big improvements..

short memory?

he was very much on the pace just 2 months ago on Arctic Rally, on Monte wont the first 2 stages and was 3rd after Friday. Has won a stage or stages on every rally so far this season, scroll down to the bottom https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/

it was just a one bad rally and now suddenly everything is lost. i would wait couple of more rallies to make conclusions.

[denkimi]

Makes you wonder how good neuville must be when you see his pace in a car that all others think is crap. 😛

[Sulland]

Incredible rally. Thanks Croatia!

Very often we see the best and most exiting rallies coming from the newcomers, where no one has notes from the last years.

So maybe we need more new venues?

[meh]

More fuel to the fire - seems (and I'm surprised) that no one picked it up. Julian said (don't remember exactly when) on All-Live that he saw Markko Märtin (previous WRC driver, doing "manager" job for Tänak) visiting "other teams".

[mknight]

Question is how burned the bridges are at Toyota and how much faith they have in MSport next year.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Ingrassia :cool:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ez0-OGiXoAQDcZ9?format=jpg&name=medium

[cali]

short memory?

he was very much on the pace just 2 months ago on Arctic Rally, on Monte wont the first 2 stages and was 3rd after Friday. Has won a stage or stages on every rally so far this season, scroll down to the bottom https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/

it was just a one bad rally and now suddenly everything is lost. i would wait couple of more rallies to make conclusions.Well the solution for Arctic was really simple or even quite mind boggling. They had to get rid of the rear bumper to lose weight on the rear to not collect snow and ice.

For tarmac you just can't do that. I'm no expert but what I see is it's related to the rear of the car as it likes to understeer a lot and if a driver can overcome understeer it oversteers quite badly.

Now the trend for Tänak has been to risk it with tyres. He starts every rally with 1 spare and gambles with tyre selection. It helped in Arctic due to the road position but in Croatia the road position was against back starters.

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

[denkimi]

Question is how burned the bridges are at Toyota and how much faith they have in MSport next year.
If ogier actually retires it will be hard for toyota to find someone better than him. So i don't see a reason why they should not hire him.

But from the other side, why would he go to toyota if he left them in the first place, while knowing they had the best car. He must have been pretty pissed.

[EstWRC]

Makes you wonder how good neuville must be when you see his pace in a car that all others think is crap. ��

i really hope he goes to Toyota for next year. i have wanted for years to see how he does in other teams. well in reality i would have liked to see in the current Toyota car, next year will be a new one


Question is how burned the bridges are at Toyota and how much faith they have in MSport next year.

i think it also depends a lot how he feels in which direction the new Hyundai car will go.

[mknight]

If ogier actually retires it will be hard for toyota to find someone better than him. So i don't see a reason why they should not hire him.



Their long term bet is obviously that Rovanpera is ready to fight for championship. Question is if they risk it already for next year. I also think the Japanese bosses might oppose Tanaks coming back.

[steve.mandzij]

It's a shame for Tänak's career that he decided to leave Toyota. I think it's proving to have been a big mistake.

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[TypeR]

short memory?

he was very much on the pace just 2 months ago on Arctic Rally, on Monte wont the first 2 stages and was 3rd after Friday. Has won a stage or stages on every rally so far this season, scroll down to the bottom https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/

it was just a one bad rally and now suddenly everything is lost. i would wait couple of more rallies to make conclusions.
Yes, Monte SS1-2 were good, but after that not his ,,Toyota times'' pace + trying to make it better/risking with 1 spare.

Arctic or Sweden are so fast, special and one-off events that they can't really be compared to typical tarmac or gravel events.. + Tänak has had good starting pos in Sweden and now Arctic also.

No stage wins in Monza and not many in Rally Estonia either. Not saying everything is suddenly lost, but Hyundai seems to be difficult to drive comfortably, knowing he could win stages/rallies more easily.

[krissucool]

Well the solution for Arctic was really simple or even quite mind boggling. They had to get rid of the rear bumper to lose weight on the rear to not collect snow and ice.

For tarmac you just can't do that. I'm no expert but what I see is it's related to the rear of the car as it likes to understeer a lot and if a driver can overcome understeer it oversteers quite badly.

Now the trend for Tänak has been to risk it with tyres. He starts every rally with 1 spare and gambles with tyre selection. It helped in Arctic due to the road position but in Croatia the road position was against back starters.

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Yeah exactly, I think the quote in Monte Carlo really says it all on how he feels about the car.
Yes, he has been fast at certain rallies and has won 2 rallies but he has not been on his massively dominating pace once as he was in Toyota on most rallies for better part of 2 years.

Also heard from people close to his team that he has not been satisfied with the Hyundai car from the start and does not rate the team too much.

To his credit, he has been remarkably calm and reserved about criticizing the team and the car during rallies where he is off pace. Takes kind of "it is what it is" approach to interviews mostly.

A big turnaround from the Toyota times when at times he was very critical if things were not suiting him and had issues with the car. Not sure if it is a new and improved Ott or it is just that he knows there is not too much that can be done with this car anyway.

In any case, would be massively surprised if he stayed with Hyundai for next year.

[denkimi]

Their long term bet is obviously that Rovanpera is ready to fight for championship. Question is if they risk it already for next year. I also think the Japanese bosses might oppose Tanaks coming back.
I'm not sure rovanpera will ever be ready to fight for the championship. So far it has looked promising, but we have many such drivers in the past. He has yet to win a rally after all, the final step is the smallest but the hardest.

But then again, neuville's first win came only in his 3th full wrc season. Tanak's in his 4th. We'll see how things evolve.