Wrc2 / wrc3 - 2020

[KKS]

Wut? You looking on some other rally?:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/leg/60140-rally-sweden-2020/?leg=2&ct=1018

This is actually his first time driving competitively on these stages. If you compare him with Rovanpera at similar point in his career (start of 2018 season) the results are very similar. (Rovanpera had one more 4WD season at that point though)
Kalle had 2 seasons in R5 in Latvia (with 2 snow rallys per season) and 2 seasons in WRC2 = 4 seasons in R5 car
Oliver has only 1 season with PoloR5 last year in Latvia and 1Monte rally this year.
So uncomparable in terms of experiences.

[doubled1978]

2nd WRC rally in 2020 and Oliver Solberg still didn't show why he is Škoda works driver except because of surname

Have you actually looked at the results? The kid has very little experience and today was 2nd fastest R5 car across the 4 stages, when all these guys are pushing like crazy. They said clearly that they had made set up changes after Friday.
I’m not here to make apologies for any driver, but this comment is plainly ridiculous.

[the sniper]

2nd WRC rally in 2020 and Oliver Solberg still didn't show why he is Škoda works driver except because of surname

And he's 5 seconds ahead of the guy who was a works Skoda driver for 4 years...

[er88]

You have Ostberg crowing about his " lead" when he's been beaten by 2 other R5/R2s or whatever the fuck the FIA have decided to call them today.

I can't take Ostberg seriously when he's gloating about a win, that isn't actually a win. Surely he's not kidding himself. He was beaten by Huttunen and Lindholm, great drive by those two.

Happy for Jari even more so that he's done it with uncertainty surrounding his future/ season plans, while smashing the "Hyundai" drivers who have lined Tanak and Martin's pockets....

[Jarek Z]

I can't take Ostberg seriously when he's gloating about a win, that isn't actually a win. Surely he's not kidding himself. He was beaten by Huttunen and Lindholm, great drive by those two.

Happy for Jari even more so that he's done it with uncertainty surrounding his future/ season plans, while smashing the "Hyundai" drivers who have lined Tanak and Martin's pockets....

Yes! Congratulations to Jari Huttunen on his fantastic victory! I haven't verified it, but I read somewhere that it was the first ever win for Hyundai R5 in WRC.

[dimviii]

https://twitter.com/Kajto_pl/status/1231564368321622019

[Jarek Z]

Kajto announced his rally programme for this year. He is going to compete in 7 WRC-3 rounds, starting with Rally Mexico (12-15 March 2020). The LOTOS Rally team crew will drive a Skoda Fabia R5 evo, run by Spanish company RaceSeven.

Details and photos of new livery:
http://kajto.pl/en/news/full-wrc-3-campaign-for-kajetanowicz-begins-with-rally-mexico-in-a-new-car/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Yes! Congratulations to Jari Huttunen on his fantastic victory! I haven't verified it, but I read somewhere that it was the first ever win for Hyundai R5 in WRC.

And even better, he did it in an old-spec not-upgraded i20 R5 !

[Fast Eddie WRC]

OC Veiby said recently that he doesnt worry about fighting guys in WRC3 as his focus is points for the WRC2 Championship.

So kind of saying he could beat them but doesnt need to.

Hmmm.

[Jarek Z]

OC Veiby said recently that he doesnt worry about fighting guys in WRC3 as his focus is points for the WRC2 Championship.

So kind of saying he could beat them but doesnt need to.

So why didn't he beat them last year?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_World_Rally_Championship-2#Results_and_standings

[RS]

OC Veiby said recently that he doesnt worry about fighting guys in WRC3 as his focus is points for the WRC2 Championship.

So kind of saying he could beat them but doesnt need to.

Hmmm.

Strategically that’s perfectly sensible, which again shows how stupid this WRC2/3 setup is.

[AnttiL]

Again, the reference was to Absolute Rally podcast, why is Eddie always hiding that source? Someone could start listening to them for mentioning here.

It's interesting what Veiby says: it seems to be the team's target to get the WRC2 title. Usually the R5 drivers say they don't follow the separate WRC2/3 series standings and just want to be the fastest R5 driver to show the team bosses.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Again, the reference was to Absolute Rally podcast, why is Eddie always hiding that source? Someone could start listening to them for mentioning here.

.

If it matters so much I'll let you be the AR source in future.

[Mirek]

If it matters so much I'll let you be the AR source in future.

It's fair and polite to mention the source.

[denkimi]

So why didn't he beat them last year?

The same reason he tries to avoid real competition this year. He is just not good enough.

He is kinda stuck in the middle, he is too fast for the norwegian championship, but too slow for wrc2/3. Perhaps he should try erc or other national championships, that might be more his level.

[pantealex]

23 Drivers have scored WRC3 point(s) 2020

How many of those is driving with Ford Fiesta ?
(Bonus point if you can name best Fiesta driver)

[PLuto]

23 Drivers have scored WRC3 point(s) 2020

How many of those is driving with Ford Fiesta ?
(Bonus point if you can name best Fiesta driver)

How many of that WRC3 drivers did more than one race?

[pantealex]

How many of that WRC3 drivers did more than one race?

1 O.Solberg :)

[dimviii]

Oliver testing
https://www.ewrc-results.com/video/32568-test-oliver-solberg-skoda-fabia-rally2-evo-3072020-mkarlov/

[the sniper]

It'll be nice to see a Fiesta back in the Red Bull livery (presumably), with Jan Solans in WRC3: https://twitter.com/RubnPerez/status/1298201655868108801

[pantealex]

It'll be nice to see a Fiesta back in the Red Bull livery (presumably), with Jan Solans in WRC3: https://twitter.com/RubnPerez/status/1298201655868108801

weird but interesting driver and car choice from RB

Monster is having Oliver Solberg and Polo, faster driver with faster car.

[the sniper]

weird but interesting driver and car choice from RB

I wondered whether there was a link between a prize for winning JWRC and WRC Promoter/Red Bull support?

[mousti]

Probably Redbull Spain.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn ONEPLUS A6013 met Tapatalk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Chris Ingram has confirmed he is still looking to enter WRC3 and favours continuing with the support of Toksport with a Fabia R5.

[pantealex]

Chris Ingram has confirmed he is still looking to enter WRC3 and favours continuing with the support of Toksport with a Fabia R5.

R5 or Rally2 EVO ?
old is cheaper to rent but new is quicker car

[AnttiL]

Toksport seems to run Evo2 models in WRC2

[PLuto]

R5 or Rally2 EVO ?
old is cheaper to rent but new is quicker car

It is not so big difference in terms of speed...

[pantealex]

Toksport seems to run Evo2 models in WRC2

They have both models just like many other teams, BRR Printsport TGS etc

That´s why I was asking...

[pantealex]

It is not so big difference in terms of speed...

maybe, maybe not

several drivers switched from FabiaR5 to PoloR5 to Fabia 2EVO ...

I know Pietarinen and Tempestini have been very fast with older R5 recently ...

so maybe, maybe not :)

[AnttiL]

They have both models just like many other teams, BRR Printsport TGS etc

That´s why I was asking...

And I said they seem to be running their Evo2 models in WRC2

[Sulland]

What are the differences btw the old and evo?
Are there upgrades that are not working for every driver?

Is the Polo more stable and easier to drive than the Fabia?

[PLuto]

What are the differences btw the old and evo?
Are there upgrades that are not working for every driver?

Is the Polo more stable and easier to drive than the Fabia?

If we are talking about Skoda, there are differences between old and evo model. You can see that drivers who switched during the season without proper test were slower with evo than with older car. It is different, especially in terms of steering, you need to change your driving style. And lot of other things...

[pantealex]

What are the differences btw the old and evo?
Are there upgrades that are not working for every driver?



75-80% of parts are different, most of those don´t effect to speed.
all 5-doors are different, bumbers, lights...

Chassis is same so wheelbase and other dimensions are same.

[TWRC]

What are the differences btw the old and evo?
Are there upgrades that are not working for every driver?

Is the Polo more stable and easier to drive than the Fabia?

If I remember well, when Gryazin tested the "old" Fabia and the Evo back-to-back, he specifically mentioned that the front suspension is different, and it is better, but you might have to change your approach to get all the benefits out of it.

As far as the Polo goes, it has a longer wheelbase, so on faster stages it should be more stable. But I think they are pretty equal, and it's the nuances that decide which is better for the given stage.

[dimviii]

https://twitter.com/MadsOstberg/status/1300401472094515201

https://twitter.com/MadsOstberg/status/1300368846746980352

[Sulland]

Something wrong with Veibys car in Estland?
He is loosing a lot!

[SubaruNorway]

Hit a hay bale, put a hole in the radiator, fixed it and had a broken roll bar

[Jarek Z]

WRC3 drivers are faster than WRC2 in this rally. Solberg and Kaur are faster than Ostberg after Staturday stages.
https://www.ewrc-results.com/results/61497-rally-estonia-2020/?s=293833&ct=1018

[Sulland]

All Rally2 cars need to be in one class. Østberg cruises into victory in WRC2, it is more important to bring thore point home, than to fight for being best Rally2 car overall. Not logical for the normal spectator!

[AnttiL]

All Rally2 cars in WRC2 and then a privateer cup on the side would be nice.

[the sniper]

All Rally2 cars in WRC2 and then a privateer cup on the side would be nice.

That's always been my preference.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Solberg wins WRC3 in Estonia ahead of the WRC2 crews...

[PLuto]

Solberg wins WRC3 in Estonia ahead of the WRC2 crews...

He showed also in Liepaja that currently he is the fastest driver on fast gravel stages with R5. No matter in which championship/class...

[Jarek Z]

Solberg wins WRC3 in Estonia ahead of the WRC2 crews...

Yes. Also some other WRC3 drivers were very fast. Huttunen and Kaur were faster than Fourmaux and Tidemand. This time WRC3 defeats WRC2 ;)
https://rally-base.com/2020/rally-estonia-2020/?ssId=5920&cupId=209&ssGroupId=1

[Rally Power]

All Rally2 cars in WRC2 and then a privateer cup on the side would be nice.

I’ve been saying that since day 1 of this stupid WRC2 split but I doubt Matton will change anything as he’s a big fan (probably the only one) of the current format…

[RS]

The other stupid thing with this split is that WRC2 crews get priority road order and thus get shown on the tv instead of WRC3 crews, even when they're slower.

[AnttiL]

The other stupid thing with this split is that WRC2 crews get priority road order and thus get shown on the tv instead of WRC3 crews, even when they're slower.

I think there's a simple explanation: money.

First of all, once again the onboard camera kits, which cost close to 100k euros and there's only 15 of them available to share between the WRC and WRC2 cars. You cannot know in advance who's going to be the fastest driver during the weekend or start changing the cameras from car to another during the event.

In addition, obviously WRC2 drivers pay a higher entry fee for both the season and single rally, so it's justified for their sponsors to get more TV exposure in return (even though even they are not really getting anything)

[Jarek Z]

It'll be nice to see a Fiesta back in the Red Bull livery (presumably), with Jan Solans in WRC3: https://twitter.com/RubnPerez/status/1298201655868108801

I don't see any Red Bull stickers on Solans' car:
https://rallypl.com/video/video-wrc-rally-estonia-2020-j-solans-close-call-ss9/

[dimviii]

eWRC-results
@eWRCresults

This weekend started 229
Top with upwards arrow above
R5 cars on 23 events in 13 countries. New record, so far 223 in week 24/2019. 115x #Škoda, 32x #Ford, 29x #Citroen, 25x #VW, 15x #Hyundai, remaining others.

[the sniper]

I don't see any Red Bull stickers on Solans' car:
https://rallypl.com/video/video-wrc-rally-estonia-2020-j-solans-close-call-ss9/

Thanks, I meant to look. Shame, just a personal pocket money deal then, like various guys (and girls) have had over the years.

[RS]

I think there's a simple explanation: money.

First of all, once again the onboard camera kits, which cost close to 100k euros and there's only 15 of them available to share between the WRC and WRC2 cars. You cannot know in advance who's going to be the fastest driver during the weekend or start changing the cameras from car to another during the event.

In addition, obviously WRC2 drivers pay a higher entry fee for both the season and single rally, so it's justified for their sponsors to get more TV exposure in return (even though even they are not really getting anything)

Lots of truth there, but onboards are not really essential if there is good helicopter footage and some stage side cameras too.

[Jarek Z]

In Turkey Nasser Al-Attiyah had an accident already on SS 1. Marco Bulacia is fastest of all WRC2 and WRC3 cars.

[Jarek Z]

Thanks, I meant to look. Shame, just a personal pocket money deal then, like various guys (and girls) have had over the years.

There is a Red Bull car competing in Rally Turkey, however it is not Solans but Turkish driver Yagiz Avci:

https://img.redbull.com/images/c_crop,x_0,y_0,h_3712,w_5568/c_fill,w_1500,h_1000/q_auto,f_auto/redbullcom/2020/9/17/ab4st0ms2owfldhp9d4y/yagiz-avci

https://img.redbull.com/images/c_crop,x_0,y_0,h_3712,w_5568/c_fill,w_1500,h_1000/q_auto,f_auto/redbullcom/2020/9/17/kr13lzwqxyrvcifetttu/yagiz-avci

[MartijnS]

In Turkey Nasser Al-Attiyah had an accident already on SS 1. Marco Bulacia is fastest of all WRC2 and WRC3 cars.

Just to make sure, maybe you know it haha.
It’s the cousin of Dakar Nasser.

Dakar Nasser is in France with a Polo R5.

[Jarek Z]

Just to make sure, maybe you know it haha.
It’s the cousin of Dakar Nasser.

Dakar Nasser is in France with a Polo R5.

Wow! Thanks for the information. I had no idea that there were two Nassers! And they even share the same co-driver Giovanni Bernacchini! :D

[Jarek Z]

Eyvind Brynildsen is out of the rally after suffering a puncture on SS5 and having no spare tyres left. The number of WRC2 crews in the event is down to 2.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EiRJfYPWkAALLvQ?format=jpg&name=small

[SubaruNorway]

Look at his insta story, bolts are snapped. The wheel is lying there...

[Jarek Z]

Thanks for the correction. It never came to my mind to follow Brynildsen's insta stories :D

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Chris Ingram @ChrisIngramGB

In my opinion WRC2 needs a new name and a WRC1 level prize with whoever is manufacturer world champions funded by the FIA. I hope WRC3 is scrapped next year as it's utterly pointless when they have beaten WRC2 drivers on most events.

[Sulland]

Chris Ingram @ChrisIngramGB

In my opinion WRC2 needs a new name and a WRC1 level prize with whoever is manufacturer world champions funded by the FIA. I hope WRC3 is scrapped next year as it's utterly pointless when they have beaten WRC2 drivers on most events.

Is'nt the names there already? Rally1, Rally2 and so on. Same as in formula sport. F1 car and F1 champion!
I thought that was FIAs plan, but might be wrong.
Makes sense though? Simple and plain also for non petrolheads.

[PLuto]

Is'nt the names there already? Rally1, Rally2 and so on. Same as in formula sport. F1 car and F1 champion!
I thought that was FIAs plan, but might be wrong.
Makes sense though? Simple and plain also for non petrolheads.

It doesnt make sense. With all the constant changes with names of categories, classes and cars, now are lost not only "not-rally-fans", but also rally fans and people involved in competition (crews, organisers)...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

With the current number system, WRC3 appears inferior to WRC2 even though it's driver's usually finisher higher overall.

[RS]

Great job by Kajto in Turkey. He really seems to have gelled with his team/car this year, after being surprisingly fast in Estonia too.

Anyone work out who’s paying Pontus? Is it Skoda?.. they seem to retweet him a lot.

[RS]

It doesnt make sense. With all the constant changes with names of categories, classes and cars, now are lost not only "not-rally-fans", but also rally fans and people involved in competition (crews, organisers)...

Guilty as charged. I now only know what WRC cars and R5s are.. sorry ‘Rally 2s’

It would have been better if they had avoided the R names altogether and started afresh as they were already used. Is an R4 and a ‘Rally 4’ the same thing? I have no idea.

[Jarek Z]

With the current number system, WRC3 appears inferior to WRC2 even though it's driver's usually finisher higher overall.

Exactly. First in Estonia and now also in Turkey WRC3 crews are better than WRC2. Kajto was much faster than Tidemand, Fourmaux and Brynildsen throughout the whole event.

[Jarek Z]

Great job by Kajto in Turkey. He really seems to have gelled with his team/car this year, after being surprisingly fast in Estonia too.

Yes, a great return after his big crash in Estonia. Kajto considers this to be his best result ever. Not only is he first in WRC3, but also 7th overall. Congratulations!
https://rallypl.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/rajd_turcji_2020__dramaty_w_czolowce_kajetanowicz_ awansuje_1-scaled.jpg

But it's the young Marco Bulacia who leads WRC3 standings now.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Anyone work out who’s paying Pontus? Is it Skoda?.. they seem to retweet him a lot.

Even more confusion - Tidemand in WRC2 in a Toksport car. How are they a factory team ?

[Rallyper]

You can´t compare WRC2 and WRC3 regarding who´s fastest. PT had to rely on a result for WRC2. If he should look at how fast they drive in WRC3 he´d be stupid, if anything goes wrong.

Such are the rules, which you have to play with. Too much money and else to just skip tactics.

However I don´t like this state (WRC2/WRC3)

[PLuto]

You can´t compare WRC2 and WRC3 regarding who´s fastest. PT had to rely on a result for WRC2. If he should look at how fast they drive in WRC3 he´d be stupid, if anything goes wrong.

Such are the rules, which you have to play with. Too much money and else to just skip tactics.

However I don´t like this state (WRC2/WRC3)

There is question why he is starting in the events this year and what will be good for his future. He wants to win WRC2 or show that he is fast driver?

[AnttiL]

To me it feels like Tidemand is again with a very limited budget, driving very carefully (like last year with the Fiesta WRC) because there's no margin for crashes.

[AnttiL]

Even more confusion - Tidemand in WRC2 in a Toksport car. How are they a factory team ?

For this year WRC2 was changed from last year's WRC2Pro so that private teams can also enter.

[dimviii]

There is question why he is starting in the events this year and what will be good for his future. He wants to win WRC2 or show that he is fast driver?
Pluto hit the nail.
@Per if he wants to just have fun,and what he loves is ok.
But if he wants to make the next step,nobody will impressed because he won a class,when a same car with same tyres was faster.

[Rallyper]

There is question why he is starting in the events this year and what will be good for his future. He wants to win WRC2 or show that he is fast driver?

First there was a quote about Kajto being faster than PT. My answer was: there are two classes. WRC2 and WRC3. PT want to win WRC2.

Secondly, PT has no future but to drive in WRC2/3. Budget and speed are the two negativs for him. So, he want to show he can win WRC2.

[AnttiL]

WRC2 and WRC3 are series. RC2 is a class and Rally2 (previously R5) the type of car used in both.

The team bosses know how to read results and see who's the fastest RC2 car, no matter the series.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I guess WRC2 & WRC3 is about giving more teams and drivers the chance to say they won their Class or a Championship. This is what their sponsor's want to hear.

[AnttiL]

I guess WRC2 & WRC3 is about giving more teams and drivers the chance to say they won their Class or a Championship. This is what their sponsor's want to hear.

WRC2 entry fees are also higher, so it means more money coming in.

[pantealex]

Even more confusion - Tidemand in WRC2 in a Toksport car. How are they a factory team ?

Red Grey (ex MarkkoMärtinMotorsport) is not factory team either

MSport isn´t full factory team

and in my mind Østberg is also not factory driver, PH-Sport is not factory team

Why you think Skoda should use factory team ???

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Red Grey (ex MarkkoMärtinMotorsport) is not factory team either

MSport isn´t full factory team

and in my mind Østberg is also not factory driver, PH-Sport is not factory team

Why you think Skoda should use factory team ???

Ones you mention are 'factory-blessed'...

[AnttiL]

In 2019 we had Skoda (factory), M-Sport (as factory as in WRC) and Citroen (run by PH-Sport but supported by factory)

[Jarek Z]

In 2019 we had Skoda (factory), M-Sport (as factory as in WRC) and Citroen (run by PH-Sport but supported by factory)

And this year? Only 'blessed' ones? ;)
http://slavicstyle.com/romanian-orthodox-priest-blessing-rally-cars/

[the sniper]

MSport isn´t full factory team

Funny one though, they are literally a 'factory team'. They are the team of the factory that make the rally cars! Though their own team isn't even fully funded by the factory... And the factory isn't fully funded by the Manufacturer, if you take that to mean Ford!

[Jarek Z]

"Small" problems for Bulacia
https://www.ewrc-results.com/media/60433-rally-italia-sardegna-2020/3101/

and Brynildsen
https://www.ewrc-results.com/media/60433-rally-italia-sardegna-2020/3100/

in the first loop of Rally Sardegna. Solberg leads.

[Jarek Z]

So Huttunen won his second WRC3 round this year. Kajto was second and Bulacia third. This time it was relatively easy to collect some points, because even the drivers who crashed out on the second leg (Solberg, Ciamin) managed to do it.
Huttunen and Kajto were faster than all WRC2 crews again.


If my maths is right it is still Bulacia who leads the championship:
1 Bulacia - 70 pts
2 Huttunen - 68
3 Kajto - 55
4 Solberg - 43
5 Ciamin - 28

[AnttiL]

Bulacia has one more rally than Huttunen

[AnttiL]

https://www.rallit.fi/jari-huttunen-kuuli-positiivisen-huhun-heti-voittokisansa-jalkeen/

Huttunen will likely two the both remaining rallies :)

[Jarek Z]

Huttunen will likely two the both remaining rallies :)

Good luck to him, but... according to this info:
https://www.wrc.com/en/championship/support-championships/wrc-3/
competitors count best six scores from seven rounds.

And according to the standings:
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc3/
Huttunen cannot complete 6 rallies, Bulacia still can.

[Jarek Z]

WRC3 summary of the second leg:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOpHGHLrHDw

[AnttiL]

Good luck to him, but... according to this info:
https://www.wrc.com/en/championship/support-championships/wrc-3/
competitors count best six scores from seven rounds.

And according to the standings:
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc3/
Huttunen cannot complete 6 rallies, Bulacia still can.

Yeah, but has there been any information whether Bulacia's season is continuing?

[PLuto]

Yeah, but has there been any information whether Bulacia's season is continuing?

I think everywhere where it will be possible...

[Jarek Z]

Yeah, but has there been any information whether Bulacia's season is continuing?

I don't know of any.

[pantealex]

Good luck to him, but... according to this info:
https://www.wrc.com/en/championship/support-championships/wrc-3/
competitors count best six scores from seven rounds.

And according to the standings:
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc3/
Huttunen cannot complete 6 rallies, Bulacia still can.

So that means both can count all remaining rallies.

Bulacia has only 2p lead and I´m pretty sure that Huttunen is faster wet tarmac driver...

but also other drivers still have full championship chance. (Kajto is only 15p down etc)

[Tom K]

The sporting regulations have been changed. In WRC 3 they will count only 4 best results out of 5 events. Bulacia should continue.

[rp]

Yes, Bulacia is planning to compete at Monza and that should be his 5th event...


The sporting regulation was changed. In WRC 3 they will count only 4 best results out of 5 events. Bulacia should continue.

[AnttiL]

Bulacia has finished 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th. That means that if he finishes 4th or lower in Monza that will not increase his total score since the lowest result is omitted. However, if he finishes third he will only exchange the fourth place to third and get three points more. In the situation that he would win Monza, he would get only 13 points more, since that's the difference between first and fourth place point scores. Thus if Huttunen is on the podium in Ypres (or Monza), Bulacia has no chance to get more points than him.

Kajto and Oliver both have four starts, including one retirement, so anything they score in either of the remaining rallies will be added to their score, but they can participate in only one rally.

EDIT: Oliver does not even have a theoretical chance at the title anymore, he can only get level with Huttunen at his current score.

[Jarek Z]

So the situation has changed completely and now it is Huttunen who is in the best position. I didn't know about the modification of sporting regulations. Thanks for the update.

[pantealex]

So the situation has changed completely and now it is Huttunen who is in the best position. I didn't know about the modification of sporting regulations. Thanks for the update.

But Bulacia is still leading ...

[AnttiL]

But Bulacia is still leading ...

Yeah, it’s even still possible that no more rallies are driven

[Jarek Z]

Yes, Bulacia is still leading, but Huttunen's budget seems endless, so I assumed, that there is no way that he doesn't score those missing 2 or 3 points in the last two rallies.

[AnttiL]

Huttunen's budget seems endless

LOL wat

The guy has done only three WRC3 rallies in an old spec car supported by a small Polish team.

[Mirek]

LOL wat

The guy has done only three WRC3 rallies in an old spec car supported by a small Polish team.

It's Kowax Team of Martin Vlček from Czechia ;)

[Jarek Z]

LOL wat

The guy has done only three WRC3 rallies in an old spec car supported by a small Polish team.

What? In very difficult times of pandemic and lockdowns he competed in as many as 9 rallies and that's probably not all. Show me another driver in WRC3 with such budget (apart from Solberg of course) :)
https://www.ewrc-results.com/profile/26709-jari-huttunen/

[AnttiL]

The Polish championship rallies are short, under 10 stages, all three of them are most likely worth one WRC3 event.

Rally di Alba and Louna-Eesti Ralli were driven under Hyundai Motorsport for whatever reason.

That leaves Rally Bohemia, which is an ERC length event, again shorter than a WRC rally. And anyway Rally Estonia was shorter than WRC events normally.

So basically we could sum that he's done worth of 5 WRC3 events.

[tommeke_B]

What? In very difficult times of pandemic and lockdowns he competed in as many as 9 rallies and that's probably not all. Show me another driver in WRC3 with such budget (apart from Solberg of course) :)
https://www.ewrc-results.com/profile/26709-jari-huttunen/
Not competing for the WRC3 title, but someone with such budget is Grégoire Munster. Did 10 events so far this year. If everything goes to plan, Ypres will be his 13th event.

[Mirek]

What? In very difficult times of pandemic and lockdowns he competed in as many as 9 rallies and that's probably not all. Show me another driver in WRC3 with such budget (apart from Solberg of course) :)
https://www.ewrc-results.com/profile/26709-jari-huttunen/

You shall not ignore that it's often not him but interest of Hyundai Poland and Vlček alone what drives the decisions where to start. It's not like Huttunen would be simply renting the car from them. See that even in WRC he has large KoWax banners on the car. KoWax is a brand of Svarmetal company making welding equipment and materials and is owned by Vlček.

[Jarek Z]

So basically we could sum that he's done worth of 5 WRC3 events.

... which is the biggest number among all top drivers in WRC3.

[AnttiL]

... which is the biggest number among all top drivers in WRC3.

Yeah but you need to also count how many non-WRC3 events the WRC3 drivers have done. Like Bulacia has driven in Italy and Oliver does ERC. Will Kajto do Rajd Barborka again in a WRC car?

[AnttiL]

BTW Huttunen was interviewed in Helsingin Sanomat, the biggest newspaper in Finland

https://www.hs.fi/urheilu/art-2000006671456.html

He says that the Kowax team was looking for a driver and Hyundai adviced them to get Huttunen. Huttunen says the team is good, they have a lot of enthusiasm for rallying and they listen to him. He says the 2018 season failed because the car wasn't developed at all during the year. He has no idea about his next season, saying "you can only hope".

He also talks about his side hobby business, converting old buses into RV's.

[Jarek Z]

Yeah but you need to also count how many non-WRC3 events the WRC3 drivers have done.

It doesn't change anything. Huttunen still wins.

[Jarek Z]

Will Kajto do Rajd Barborka again in a WRC car?

At the moment nobody knows if this rally will go on this year.

[Mirek]

... which is the biggest number among all top drivers in WRC3.

I really don't see why you even start with that and what is your goal in such discussion. That's plain weird.

[Jarek Z]

I really don't see why you even start with that and what is your goal in such discussion. That's plain weird.

Let me explain it to you. On a previous page (link: https://www.motorsportforums.com/showthread.php?40421-Wrc2-wrc3-2020/page36) me and some other forum members were wondering who has the biggest chance to win WRC3. I said it is Jari Huttunen, because he seems to have a big budget at his disposal. Other forum members didn't agree with me, so I tried to explain my point of view.

It is called a discussion (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/discussion). During a discussion it is allowed to have various opinions. It is not weird. It is what intelligent people do.

[tommeke_B]

You cannot tell budget from watching a list on eWRC. There's a lot more going on behind the scenes. I remember last year Gryazin tested 3 or 4 days before Tour de Corse. He can probably spend all his time available only on his rally career. Many others have a couple of runs on the monday test (if lucky) and shakedown runs, and have to work in between those events. Both entered one rally with an R5 car... ;)

IF Huttunen would have a big budget at his disposal, I don't think he would be driving an old spec car, and I don't think he'd need a fulltime job besides rallying. Huttunen is just taking the opportunities he's getting. The team from Vlcek made a deal for some Polish and a Czech event, he does it. Adamo invited him for Rally di Alba, he did it. Apart from that, he's just doing WRC3 with an old spec R5 car.

Emil Bergkvist has been doing WRC2 with the support of J-Motorsport/Serderidis, but in the mean time he had to work a fulltime job to make money to live, and he didn't have the testing facilities other teams are getting, and he was in an older/less competitive car than the competition. I think Huttunen could be in a similar situation right now, despite having done a few more events in Poland.

[Mirek]

The main thing is that Huttunen won two and was second in his three starts and simply put he has the highest chances to win the title because he has been clearly the best so far.

I would understand some similar budget talk about Solberg but not about Huttunen. That makes no sense even if Solberg was the only reason.

[AnttiL]

Huttunen has now yet another start in Rally Due Valli this week. Apparently it's again with Hyundai Motorsport, so probably they have him testing some new parts...

[Rally Power]

IF Huttunen would have a big budget at his disposal, I don't think he would be driving an old spec car, (...)


Are you sure that Huttunen is still running on a '19 spec i20?

[TypeR]

Are you sure that Huttunen is still running on a '19 spec i20?
New spec i20 R5s start from chassis #78..
Huttunen has driven three different cars this year:
#26A - new shell of chassis
#66
#69A - new shell of chassis

Don't know how many updates these cars have..

[Rally Power]

New spec i20 R5s start from chassis #78..
Huttunen has driven three different cars this year:
#26A - new shell of chassis
#66
#69A - new shell of chassis

Don't know how many updates these cars have..

2020 specs can also be available as a kit and fitted on older chassis (that’s what most top national crews have done).
https://motorsport.hyundai.com/performance-boosts-for-i20-r5/

[Jarek Z]

Emil Bergkvist has been doing WRC2 with the support of J-Motorsport/Serderidis, but in the mean time he had to work a fulltime job to make money to live, and he didn't have the testing facilities other teams are getting, and he was in an older/less competitive car than the competition. I think Huttunen could be in a similar situation right now, despite having done a few more events in Poland.

You are right. But such is probably the case for 80% of drivers competing in WRC3. Most private drivers have to work to survive. It has always been like that. Describing Huttunen as some poor boy on a low budget, when he has been doing 10 rallies all over Europe each year is a little strange to say the least ;)

[Hartusvuori]

You are right. But such is probably the case for 80% of drivers competing in WRC3. Most private drivers have to work to survive. It has always been like that. Describing Huttunen as some poor boy on a low budget, when he has been doing 10 rallies all over Europe each year is a little strange to say the least ;)

Jarek, give us some other proof on Huttunen's wealth other than the list of his starts. For example, do you know what he do for living other than rallying?

[AnttiL]

2020 specs can also be available as a kit and fitted on older chassis (that’s what most top national crews have done).
https://motorsport.hyundai.com/performance-boosts-for-i20-r5/

I remember hearing he got to use the new spec car in Rally di Alba and Louna-Eesti Ralli, but went back to the old spec Kowax car for Rally Estonia. Of course I can't know if they've fitted the update kit afterwards.

[Jarek Z]

Jarek, give us some other proof on Huttunen's wealth other than the list of his starts. For example, do you know what he do for living other than rallying?

No, I don't know what he does for a living and I don't care about his "wealth". Why should I be interested in it? He is a very good driver and I wish him good luck.

[Jarek Z]

Huttunen has now yet another start in Rally Due Valli this week. Apparently it's again with Hyundai Motorsport, so probably they have him testing some new parts...

Rally Due Valli is the 6th round of Italian championship so the entry list is quite good. If you can't find Huttunen - he is "hidden" as an Austrian driver in a a German team (no. 21) :)
https://www.rallyduevalli.it/?ddownload=7452

[Fast Eddie WRC]

2023 start confirmed for hybrid for WRC2/3:

https://www.wrc.com/en/news/season-2020/wrc-2/wrc-support-series-to-follow-hybrid-route-in-2023/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Confusion reigns over WRC2 scoring rules:

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/citroen-and-wrc2-rivals-in-dispute-over-scoring-rules/

[wwbroe]

Confusion reigns over WRC2 scoring rules:

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/citroen-and-wrc2-rivals-in-dispute-over-scoring-rules/

What i heard today is that Tidemand is allready comfirmed as championship winner in WRC2:confused:

[Jarek Z]

What i heard today is that Tidemand is allready comfirmed as championship winner in WRC2:confused:

Does that mean that Ypres and Monza are canceled?
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc2/

[the sniper]

One more joke from the comedy of errors that is WRC2(née Pro)...

[wwbroe]

Does that mean that Ypres and Monza are canceled?
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc2/

No, even if Ypres and Monza will take place, Tidemand is allready champion.

[TheFlyingTuga]

No, even if Ypres and Monza will take place, Tidemand is allready champion.

How, a 25 points score for Mads would put him with 112 points ahead of Tideman!

[wwbroe]

How, a 25 points score for Mads would put him with 112 points ahead of Tideman!

Apparently there is a bug in the rules, that's why Tidemand is already declared champion. They didn't announce it yet because nobody would understand. The results of Ypres and/or Monza will not be taken into account.:(

[AnttiL]

Could it come from starting one rally outside Europe, which still exists in the rules? All other teams started Mexico except Citroen...

[m-ast]

One more joke from the comedy of errors that is WRC2(née Pro)...

Crazy, I hope it makes FIA think a little and merge WRC2/3 for next season with a privateer cup inside if they want but the main title should be with all R5 cars in competition

[Rally Power]

Crazy, I hope it makes FIA think a little and merge WRC2/3 for next season with a privateer cup inside if they want but the main title should be with all R5 cars in competition

Amen.

[Sulland]

Crazy, I hope it makes FIA think a little and merge WRC2/3 for next season with a privateer cup inside if they want but the main title should be with all R5 cars in competition

Yes, but then based on points from the full Rally2 field.

[djip]

Crazy, I hope it makes FIA think a little and merge WRC2/3 for next season with a privateer cup inside if they want but the main title should be with all R5 cars in competition

Isn't the main resaon for WRC2 Pro was / is to get hefty entry fees from Manus ?

[AnttiL]

Yes, but then based on points from the full Rally2 field.

I think there should still be options for entering for WRC2 points and not entering for points, with a correlation to entry fees. Besides, I haven't seen any occasions this year where someone is not nominated for any points but is making top 5 times. In the past this was an issue, sometimes also related to well-backed drivers who had already done their maximum number of WRC2 events in a year (some drivers also tactically skipped Monte from their points)

[AnttiL]

Isn't the main resaon for WRC2 Pro was / is to get hefty entry fees from Manus ?

Yes. I think the perfect solution would be

- One single WRC2 series
- Manufacturers can enter the series and nominate their drivers to collect manufacturer points for them
- Any non-manufacturer-nominated driver is a "privateer", and can collect points in a privateer cup.
- (Like mentioned in my previous post, also possible to enter a rally with cheaper entry fee, without nominating for any points)

[Sulland]

Entry fees for teams below Rally1 should be kept at a minimum, to boost entry numbers.
Not a big deal for FIA anyway I guess.

[Jarek Z]

Another rally for Jari Huttunen. This time it's Lausitz Rallye in Germany:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/62098-int-admv-lausitz-rallye-2020/

[Mirek]

Another rally for Jari Huttunen. This time it's Lausitz Rallye in Germany:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/62098-int-admv-lausitz-rallye-2020/

Insted of canceled events.

[Jarek Z]

Kajto has published an onboard video from his heavy crash on the last stage of Rally Estonia (plus shots from his win in Turkey and second place in Sardegna):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcAAUEtIkgE

[AnttiL]

WRC 2
It’s a two-way Scandinavian fight here between 2017 champion Pontus Tidemand and co-driver Patrik Barth from Sweden, and Norwegians Mads Østberg / Torstein Eriksen.

Tidemand is 18 points clear, but a driver only counts his best five scores. He already has five, so if the Skoda Fabia pilot scores in Monza, he must discard his lowest score of 15 to add to his total.

Østberg has scored in only four rounds so can keep whatever he bags in Italy.

To aid Tidemand, Toksport has entered Jan Kopecký, and the Czech champion’s presence could be crucial. If he places himself between Tidemand and Østberg in the Monza result, it will severely dent the Citroën C3 driver’s chances.

A Tidemand win, second for Kopecký and third for Østberg means the title goes back to Tidemand. If Østberg wins, the title is his.

The teams’ championship has already been won by Toksport.

WRC 3
This is a little easier…….

Marco Bulacia is two points ahead of Jari Huttunen, with Kajetan Kajetanowicz 15 points off the lead. Nobody else can win the title.

Drivers count their best four scores from their first five nominated events. Bulacia must drop 12 points if he scores highly, while both Huttunen and Kajetanowicz can keep all they gain (Kajetanowicz will drop a zero score).

The odds are, therefore, in favour of Huttunen, who would take the crown if he finishes first or second. If Bulacia wins the rally and Huttunen comes home third, then it gets incredibly complicated. And we mean incredibly……

The co-drivers’ title will be fought out between leader Mikko Lukka (Huttunen), Maciej Sczepaniak (Kajetanowicz) and Marcelo Der Ohannesian (Bulacia), who has only partnered the Bolivian for part of the season.

https://www.wrc.com/en/news/season-2020/wrc/wrc-numbers-game--title-permutations/

[mknight]

IMO the much more likely situation that Toksport had in mind is that Kopecky wins denying Østberg 25 points and then Tidemand and Østberg end close to each other. But if Østberg ends 2nd and Tidemand 3th I believe Østberg wins due to more 2nd places.

[Jarek Z]

WRC 3 - ACI Rally Monza 2020: Friday Highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRFk4yvH7eY

WRC 2 - ACI Rally Monza 2020: Friday Highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiS_v58ZWo8

[m-ast]

Does Gryazin have broken up with Hyundai? He is entered next week in a regional rallye here in Spain with a Polo R5.

[pantealex]

Little statistic:
2020 had
8 different WRC2 drivers
51 different WRC3 drivers started (32 only 1 rally)

[Jarek Z]

The guy has done only three WRC3 rallies in an old spec car supported by a small team.

Despite the reportedly small budget, an old spec car and a small team it is Jari Huttunen who wins this year's WRC3. Congratulations!

Final results of Rally Monza 2020 in WRC3 category:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/results/66881-aci-rally-monza-2020/?s=303929&sct=1681

Final standings of WRC3:
1. Huttunen - 83
2. Bulacia - 78
3. Kajetanowicz - 65
4. Solberg - 61
5. Lindholm - 30

More details at:
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc3/

[Jarek Z]

Monza was another rally where top WRC3 drivers were faster than all WRC2 crews:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/results/66881-aci-rally-monza-2020/?s=303929&ct=1018

[Jarek Z]

No, even if Ypres and Monza will take place, Tidemand is allready champion.

I guess Mads Ostberg has a different opinion :D


IMO the much more likely situation that Toksport had in mind is that Kopecky wins denying Østberg 25 points and then Tidemand and Østberg end close to each other. But if Østberg ends 2nd and Tidemand 3th I believe Østberg wins due to more 2nd places.

Apparently this tactic didn't work, because it is Mads Ostberg who wins the Italian round and the whole WRC2 category. Congratulations!

WRC2 standings:
https://www.wrc.com/en/results-standings/championship-standings/wrc2/