Permanent driver numbers for 2019 & beyond

[KiwiWRCfan]

What number do we expect each driver to select as their permanent number ?
What significance does the number have to the driver ?

[deephouse]

Who cares it's only a number. Nobody is remembered by number except Rossi.

[Sulland]

Who cares it's only a number. Nobody is remembered by number except Rossi.

And why is that?

[Sub_Skoda]

Ogier: 1 :D

[Franky]

Who cares it's only a number. Nobody is remembered by number except Rossi.

To be honest, I can't even remember the numbers F1 drivers have been using. Even if I remember the numbers, it's a mess who it was exactly. Maybe if you learn the numbers by heart and revise them every now and then, you might remember them.

I personally find this change pointless. I understand it is for marketing purposes. But isn't the point to sell more and you sell more if there are changes to the product or not?

[dnb]

Anybody know the full rules here? Is it only for factory drivers, all World Rally Cars or who? Do you get a permanent number even when you participate 1 event? Which driver gets to choose first, second etc. What's the interval, 2-99?

[CWJ]

Acc. to that change from September its for priority 1 drivers. World champion #1 the other can apply for free choice. As Prokop Bertelli Block did ...

[BigWorm]

Who gets to pick first? Championship order?

[N.O.T]

wow... i think during off season the forum should be locked in order for some people to contain their retardation and stop making stupid worthless dog threads...

[pantealex]

9 L o e b

[AnttiL]

From Sporting Regulations


P1 drivers may request a specific number provided that the application is endorsed by the FIA and the
Promoter. Number 1 may only be chosen by the World Champion driver of the previous season. Requested
numbers may not be greater than 99.

[pantealex]

From Sporting Regulations

so they don´t have to choose but they can.

[KiwiWRCfan]

Thierry Neuville has requested #11
Would be nice to see Seb Loeb use #9

[able1]

i bet noone takes number 69 ... at least not willingly

[kirungi okwogera]

i bet noone takes number 69 ... at least not willingly

you must think drivers are much more mature than I think... 69 is funny it's the sex number guys

[Norm75]

i bet noone takes number 69 ... at least not willingly


In the world of MotoGP (and WSBK), number 69 was used by ex world champion Nicky Hayden.
Nicky was killed whilst cycle training a couple of years ago.
I'm not sure if the number was retired in motorcycle racing as a mark of respect, but maybe it can be used in other series (maybe in respect for Nicky rather than any sexual connotation)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Personal numbers seem important in other motorsports, like Rossi 46 & Block 43.

More for image and marketing than anything else.

[mArvAlcao17]

In the world of MotoGP (and WSBK), number 69 was used by ex world champion Nicky Hayden.
Nicky was killed whilst cycle training a couple of years ago.
I'm not sure if the number was retired in motorcycle racing as a mark of respect, but maybe it can be used in other series (maybe in respect for Nicky rather than any sexual connotation)

Or - as Hayden's dad joked - as the 69 still could be read properly when it's upside down!

[KiwiWRCfan]

33 for Eflyn Evans https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwidYc5XcAAoyHH.jpg

[EstWRC]

Awesome livery again from M-Sport!

[AnttiL]

3 for Suninen

https://twitter.com/TeemuSuninenRac/status/1083287416121765888

[cali]

Great livery!

[Andre Oliveira]

https://scontent.fopo3-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/49211276_2481328968563182_6694126492718202880_n.jp g?_nc_cat=106&_nc_ht=scontent.fopo3-1.fna&oh=3fafa955179f6d663a1b3024b12262c6&oe=5CD5031B

[Andre Oliveira]

Latvala should be 10
Meeke must be 5 or 6

https://scontent.fopo3-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/50282431_2480562891973123_8125897636621320192_n.jp g?_nc_cat=110&_nc_ht=scontent.fopo3-1.fna&oh=4a597c8c2fbec2f09884ac846b1b335d&oe=5CC747EF

[Andre Oliveira]

8 to Tänak

Ogier can picked 2 and use 1 as champion.

[er88]

Meeke will maybe be 5 for his number of wins?

[Tarmop]

Loeb probably 9.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

33 for Eflyn Evans https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwidYc5XcAAoyHH.jpg

33 represents his initials EE.

[Andre Oliveira]

Loeb is >20... check entry list (only WRC unknown): https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/52398-rallye-automobile-de-monte-carlo-2019/

[PLuto]

I must say that I am against this permanent numbers. Especially, if they are higher for WRC drivers than for others...

[Andre Oliveira]

I am with you this time. Stupid rule. We use it in Portugal by 2 years :(

[deephouse]

Why all bother too much with this useless numbers. I don't even notice them because it's not important at all. Drivers are pretty much recognized by the roof tops and side mirrors.

[pantealex]

Why all bother too much with this useless numbers. I don't even notice them because it's not important at all. Drivers are pretty much recognized by the roof tops and side mirrors.

NO

Numbers are much easier to remember. Every team uses different color codes. Big number in roof and side windows is much easier way.

[Essaj]

If you don't like them, don't.
There is seriously nothing to lose from this.
It's quite a pointless, yes. But maybe it can help with marketing etc.

[Andre Oliveira]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwtGT6RWoAEwrDy?format=jpg&name=medium

[Rally Power]

After hearing drivers silly answers about their numbers choices it’s hard to find a valid reason for having this new rule. The WRC is not a circuit racing series with a limited and permanent number of drivers; it’s an open sport which allows new crews to get in at any new event and local amateurs to run alongside the series pros; that’s why we have seeded entry lists according to drivers status. The current rule already allowed P drivers to keep their numbers through the season, the new one will just add unnecessary confusion.

Once for all, the FIA should care about preserving each series nature instead of forcing rules changes just because they seem popular or easy to implement.

[Andre Oliveira]

Complete

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwtdTHvWkAU0Ax8?format=jpg&name=medium

[PLuto]

After hearing drivers silly answers about their numbers choices it’s hard to find a valid reason for having this new rule. The WRC is not a circuit racing series with a limited and permanent number of drivers; it’s an open sport which allows new crews to get in at any new event and local amateurs to run alongside the series pros; that’s why we have seeded entry lists according to drivers status. The current rule already allowed P drivers to keep their numbers through the season, the new one will just add unnecessary confusion.

Once for all, the FIA should care about preserving each series nature instead of forcing rules changes just because they seem popular or easy to implement.

I completely agree with your words...

[dodge33cymru]

After hearing drivers silly answers about their numbers choices it’s hard to find a valid reason for having this new rule. The WRC is not a circuit racing series with a limited and permanent number of drivers; it’s an open sport which allows new crews to get in at any new event and local amateurs to run alongside the series pros; that’s why we have seeded entry lists according to drivers status. The current rule already allowed P drivers to keep their numbers through the season, the new one will just add unnecessary confusion.

Once for all, the FIA should care about preserving each series nature instead of forcing rules changes just because they seem popular or easy to implement.Agree with this, but then I'm in favour of numbers by seeding for all events and that's just not going to happen.

Part of the NASCAR and now F1 reasoning for this was also branding (colours, fonts) of numbers; are WRC going to forgo the standardised sponsored number plates this year too?

At the end of the day, it's a small irritant to see Evans in the midst of the R5s on the entry list and Mikkelsen amongst the R2s, but it's not the biggest problem around!

[EstWRC]

i agree too with Power and PLuto. i would have preferred it the old way or, if they wanted to change it so much then they should have made a rule that say the must use the number they finished in the championship.

Ogier nr.1, Neuville nr.2, Tänak nr.3 and etc.

[Andre Oliveira]

I prefer square big white numbers with 1 to who won the rally last edition and then by championship standings eheh

[pantealex]

F1 has 20 permanent numbers in each event, I hope we will same in WRC some day :)
(remember that only WRC17-19 drivers have permanent numbers)

[Franky]

F1 has 20 permanent numbers in each event, I hope we will same in WRC some day :)
(remember that only WRC17-19 drivers have permanent numbers)

Except F1 only has about 20 guys on track during the whole event.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I wish the national flags for the drivers in the side-window were bigger - much quicker & easier to identify.

[Duvel]

I wish the national flags for the drivers in the side-window were bigger - much quicker & easier to identify.

For me thats ok, i like the smal details between the cars( like the roof air intake on a i20).
When standing on stages i sometimes find it amusing to here some "experts" calling the wrong drivers..

[Rally Power]

Except F1 only has about 20 guys on track during the whole event.

Exactly; besides, if these personal numbers thing is that important marketing wise (honestly I doubt it), we could accept having WRC1 manus drivers chossing numbers from 1 to 20 but allowing them to choose higher numbers is like pretending the rest of the field (WRC2, JWRC, National crews) isn’t important and could be dispensible. Maybe that’s what the promoter really thinks and wishes for the WRC…

[Tarmop]

I believe it is quite important for drivers fan gear, people can buy rather costly accessories for years, rather than a season and many consider buying now, as it is a onetime investment. Other than that, i personally couldn`t care less about the numbers, the last thing i look at when searching who is at the wheel.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I wish the national flags for the drivers in the side-window were bigger - much quicker & easier to identify.

Thinking about this more, I realised that all the WRC drivers have a co-driver of the same nationality. So they could just have one larger national flag next to their names instead of two small ones...

[CWJ]

Well if the idea of permanent driver numbers is wrong, I wonder why so many cars in random cities wear a 46 near the rear screen ...

[PLuto]

Well if the idea of permanent driver numbers is wrong, I wonder why so many cars in random cities wear a 46 near the rear screen ...

Circuit and rallysport is different story. On circuit races, you have cars/bikes together in one group on the circuit, they needs to have big numbers to be seen and spectators are recognizing that competitors via this big numbers or design of the bike/car. Rallysport is different story - when you are as spectator on the stage, you usually see only one car in one moment. So you have more time to concentrate to him, to look into entry list (which is usually seeded by starting numbers). As a fan, when you look at entry list, you are usually looking on the top because it is usual that with the smallest numbers are usually the fastest drivers.

[tommeke_B]

I also liked how rallying was different in having their seeding earned by the championship standings from the year before, in some national championships the first numbers are determined by the current championship standings. I think a top number should be earned by strong performances, not chosen. Also it's a bit ridiculous in WRC that there are so many "gaps" between the numbers. In a "normal" rally, number 50 should be +- the 49th car (excluding n°13) at the start of the event.

[Tarmop]

Thinking about this more, I realised that all the WRC drivers have a co-driver of the same nationality. So they could just have one larger national flag next to their names instead of two small ones...

Nationality and license are two different things, Loeb-Elena being the best example...Tidemand-Floene etc.

[CWJ]

Circuit and rallysport is different story.

You described the past. But this is a try for the future....

What you wrote is only valid for Monte Day 1... not to forget JWRC numbers and Bertelli 37 and national startes up from 100 and ...

[PLuto]

You described the past. But this is a try for the future....

What you wrote is only valid for Monte Day 1... not to forget JWRC numbers and Bertelli 37 and national startes up from 100 and ...

No, it is not valid only for Monte Day 1. They have starting numbers for whole event ;) Nobody takes care JWRC, they are somewhere down in the field. Same with national field. I am talking mainly about top drivers. Everybody arounds rallysport expects that driver with smaller number is better/faster. And it is also better for sponsors who are used to know the drivers with smaller drivers because they are top. For example I remember how "surprised" was Norbert Herczig last year, when he, as multi-national champion, received number 24 for Azores...

[CWJ]

Everybody around rallysport should know: running order shoes potential and speed, not car number

[Franky]

Everybody around rallysport should know: running order shoes potential and speed, not car number

Then why does the fastest guy not start first on the second and third leg?

[Morte66]

Well, I like this idea.

Often I watch a pure sound video on youtube, and I don't know who is in the car except occasionally when there is a lingering shot on the side and I can read the names. Otherwise, it's "one of the Hyundais" or whatever. If the numbers stayed consistent enough for a casual internet rally fan like me to learn them, that would help.

All we need now is a rule that every car will have a large, clearly visible number on the front so we can see it whilst they are approaching the camera at the start of the (typical) clip.

[CWJ]

No, it is not valid only for Monte Day 1. They have starting numbers for whole event ;) Nobody takes care JWRC, they are somewhere down in the field. Same with national field. I am talking mainly about top drivers. Everybody arounds rallysport expects that driver with smaller number is better/faster. And it is also better for sponsors who are used to know the drivers with smaller drivers because they are top. For example I remember how "surprised" was Norbert Herczig last year, when he, as multi-national champion, received number 24 for Azores...

Pluto, 80% of "fans" just have to review their cameras, GoPros or Smartphones... ;)

The true one with startinglist and pencil will know where to do the mark.

Btw: Herzig was 16th after day 1 ;) ... 9 places behind Bernardo Sousa with #31

[NaBUru38]

I love that FIA is pushing for personal numbers in more championships. it helps to establish a strong brand.

Until 2018, part-time drivers would use different numbers each race. Hey, Grönholm was champion in 2000 with two different numbers. it was a chaos.

[Allez Andruet]

I love that FIA is pushing for personal numbers in more championships. it helps to establish a strong brand.

Or then one could say just as boldly that having permanent team numbers helps to establish a strong brand.

[Myrvold]

it was a chaos.

No it wasn't.

[PLuto]

No it wasn't.

I agree, now it is a bigger chaos...

[PLuto]

It is quite funny that everyone who has chosen higher than usual number failed in Monte. Also Loeb, who has 19, was not on his usual pace...

[TypeR]

It is quite funny that everyone who has chosen higher than usual number failed in Monte. Also Loeb, who has 19, was not on his usual pace...

except Neuville

[PLuto]

except Neuville

11 is ok number, between top crews. 33 or 89 is nonsense...

[dodge33cymru]

11 is ok number, between top crews. 33 or 89 is nonsense...

There were a lot of understandably very confused French people around me last weekend perplexed by the order on day 1 not tallying up with their print out of the entry. Still, nice to make the sport more accessible though hey.

[AnttiL]

44 Greensmith
69 Hänninen

[AnttiL]

i bet noone takes number 69 ... at least not willingly

Hänninen :D

[Allez Andruet]

69 Hänninen

Why Juho, why?

[Andre Oliveira]

Stupid rules, stupid choices

[Franky]

Why Juho, why?

Don't think dirty

[AnttiL]

#42 Breen


I’ll be competing with the #42, a number I’ve raced with since my first year in karting in 1998, and that has always been very lucky. Let’s hope it remains that way!”

[pantealex]

Will Jouni Virtanen get permanent number ?
If yes, I hope he takes #2 ;)

[dnb]

Whats Ogier's number (other than 1)

[pantealex]

Whats Ogier's number (other than 1)

Never been mentioned anywhere, I believe.

Takamoto Katsuta will get his own now also.

[Allez Andruet]

Whats Ogier's number (other than 1)

We'll never find out.

[Andre Oliveira]

Paddon's number?

[pantealex]

Paddon's number?

20 would be perfect (Hyundai i20)

[AnttiL]

18 Virtanen
20 Paddon

[KiwiWRCfan]

20 would be perfect (Hyundai i20)

Hayden was #20 when he won Argentina 2016.
Hayden's birthday is on April 20th.
Hayden's autobiography is being released on August 20th

[Franky]

Hayden's autobiography is being released on August 20th

Isn't he a bit young for an autobiography? I know it all about financially maximising the situation, but still

[dnb]

Isn't he a bit young for an autobiography? I know it all about financially maximising the situation, but still

maybe he thought he is not gonna get more popular?

[pantealex]

#2 Mads Østberg

[pantealex]

So after 1st year:
2 Mads Østberg
3 Teemu Suninen
4 Esapekka Lappi
5 Kris Meeke
6 Daniel Sordo Castillo
7 Pontus Tidemand
8 Ott Tänak
10 Jari-Matti Latvala
11 Thierry Neuville
17 Takamoto Katsuta
18 Jouni Virtanen
19 Sebastien Loeb
20 Hayden Paddon
33 Elfyn Evans
37 Lorenzo Bertelli
42 Craig Breen
44 Fergus Greensmith
68 Marcus Grönholm
69 Juho Ville Matias Hänninen
89 Andreas Mikkelsen
92 Janne Tuohino

?? Sebastien Ogier (I have a feeling that he took #9, that´s why Loeb didn´t get/took it)

edit.forgot 1 name

[KiwiWRCfan]

Has number 2 ever been used previously by a driver who is not nominated for manufacturers points ?

[AnttiL]

Has number 2 ever been used previously by a driver who is not nominated for manufacturers points ?

http://juwra.com/ivory_coast_1992_entries.html

I believe this is the last time? Patrick Tauziac, Ivory Coast 1992. The rally was only for drivers championship.

[Allez Andruet]

Even in championship rallies for makes (pre-1995), it was rare for a privateer to start with a number < 5. Vatanen in Finland 1994 (3) is one example, but there are not that many.

[AnttiL]

Even in championship rallies for makes (pre-1995), it was rare for a privateer to start with a number < 5. Vatanen in Finland 1994 (3) is one example, but there are not that many.

Vatanen 1982 Finland, #1

[stefanvv]

#2 Mads Østberg

It took some time a driver to pick #2.

[Allez Andruet]

Vatanen 1982 Finland, #1

And Röhrl in San Remo the year before.

[pantealex]

Vatanen 1982 Finland, #1

At that time last years rally winner got #1 but still it was rare for privateer

[EstWRC]

Whats Ogier's number (other than 1)


We'll never find out.

We will!

Any guess?

[AnttiL]

50 --> 5eb 0gier
53 --> 53B Ogier
13 --> Birthday of Andrea and Tim
12 --> His number in 2009
42 would be his JWRC number from 2008 but Craig Breen already picked that

[Allez Andruet]

We'll never find out.


We will!

http://giphygifs.s3.amazonaws.com/media/9Y5BbDSkSTiY8/giphy.gif

[spiderem]

50 --> 5eb 0gier
53 --> 53B Ogier
13 --> Birthday of Andrea and Tim
12 --> His number in 2009
42 would be his JWRC number from 2008 but Craig Breen already picked that

6 --> Number of championship but Sordo has it

Are the numbers fixed for multiple years?

[AnttiL]

6 --> Number of championship but Sordo has it

Are the numbers fixed for multiple years?

I think they are. 8 was also his number at VW in 2013, the last time it wasn't 1. But that's Tänak's number...

[pantealex]

Any guess?

#9

(Loeb couldn´t take it because it was reserved for Ogier)

[pantealex]

so Toyota has 2 drivers without numbers, I´m still guessing

#9 Ogier

#13 Rovanperä (his Volvo has licence plate "KAL-13")

[AnttiL]

I could see Kalle taking something crazy like 99

[able1]

Ogiers number .... 16 taken?
Loeb has 19 (if i recall correctly)

[pantealex]

What number do we expect each driver to select as their permanent number ?
What significance does the number have to the driver ?

Only now some people noticed that WRC rule says:
"Seasonally allocated competition numbers"
so numbers can change from 2019 to 2020

I´m not expecting many changes.

[PLuto]

I should cancel this stupid rule.

[Norm75]

I should cancel this stupid rule.

Really, is your real name Yves!

[Andre Oliveira]

17 Ogier
69 Rovanperä
18 Katsuta

8 Ott (don’t pick the 1)
9 Loeb (changed from 19)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

17 Ogier
69 Rovanperä
18 Katsuta

8 Ott (don’t pick the 1)
9 Loeb (changed from 19)

Any significance to these number choices ?

[mknight]

I see Kalle plans for every situation. Now we can easily read his number even when upside down.

[TypeR]

Loeb posted on Instagram
#9 @officialwrc 2020

[dodge33cymru]

I should cancel this stupid rule.

Someone definitely should do. I'm more disappointed that there's no #1 car this year.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Surprised Tanak and especially Hyundai dont want the #1 on their car. I thought they'd love taking it off Ogier after all the years he's had it...

[TypeR]

Surprised Tanak and especially Hyundai dont want the #1 on their car. I thought they'd love taking it off Ogier after all the years he's had it...

Hopefully he will change his mind.. Would be awesome to see him driving #1 car..

[er88]

What is Tanak playing at..., run with #1 on your door while you can!

[able1]

Im not surprised at all ... number 8 is his lucky number....

[Allez Andruet]

Let's just get rid of these permanent numbers, ok? The single most annoying thing in rallying.

[Andre Oliveira]

Agree. Stupid rule.

[mknight]

I guess the idea was that spectators (tv/online especially) would immediatelly know what driver it is.

Problem is that the numbers are only from side/rear which you often see only in a split second or often not at all on dusty gravel.

However the teams actually fixed this themselves with putting the flags on the roof wents/different mirrors.

[Andre Oliveira]

Rally is not circuit. We don’t need differenciate them like that. Bring back good old big white square numbers.

[rallyfiend]

Im not surprised at all ... number 8 is his lucky number....

I'm surprised Hyundai didn't make him take number 1.

They've certainly paid for it.....

[SubaruNorway]

I guess the idea was that spectators (tv/online especially) would immediatelly know what driver it is.

Problem is that the numbers are only from side/rear which you often see only in a split second or often not at all on dusty gravel.

However the teams actually fixed this themselves with putting the flags on the roof wents/different mirrors.

Nearly impossible to tell the Toyota's apart sometimes by those tiny stripes on the mirror, i have to skip frames to see what car it is on the video, even missed a really good clip of Tänak on the Finland video because i thought it was one of the other Toyot's i already had in it :rolleyes:
The numbers help a bit, It's easy to remember Evans being 33, Mikkelsen 89

[m-ast]

Rally is not circuit. We don’t need differenciate them like that. Bring back good old big white square numbers.

In spectator point of view that should be the best thing but I think we will never get them back because sponsors go first as the actual format of numbers uses so many less space for the number.

Even in local championships here they have changed the rules to have the wrc-style numbers.

At least we still have them in historic events...

[Andre Oliveira]

If WRC changed back to bigger ones, other champs go too.

[mknight]

Nearly impossible to tell the Toyota's apart sometimes by those tiny stripes on the mirror, i have to skip frames to see what car it is on the video, even missed a really good clip of Tänak on the Finland video because i thought it was one of the other Toyot's i already had in it :rolleyes:
The numbers help a bit, It's easy to remember Evans being 33, Mikkelsen 89

Yes Toyota is the only one still being hard to tell. Hopefully they will see the benefit at some point as well.

[able1]

I'm surprised Hyundai didn't make him take number 1.

They've certainly paid for it.....

he wasnt champ when contract was signed.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

2003 Catalunya seems to be the last WRC event with the big clear numbers:

http://rallye-info.com/images/photos/general/2003catalunya/petter_3.jpg

Then from 2003 Rally GB it was the small number with the rally name:

https://www.wrcwings.tech/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Petter-RAC03-by-SWRT.jpg

[Allez Andruet]

I'm surprised Hyundai didn't make him take number 1.

Then again, as it was Adamo who had to seize Tänak from Toyota, it would have been a pretty silly move to risk everything just to make him take that number '1'.

[AnttiL]

For me the numbering system or whatever number anyone has isn't really important let alone an issue.

[cali]

For me the numbering system or whatever number anyone has isn't really important let alone an issue.Exactly my thought, rallying has more issues than some silly numbering system. Could not care less.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[Andre Oliveira]

4 Lappi
44 Greensmith

[AnttiL]

#7 Loubet

https://twitter.com/PL_Loubet/status/1294343665666662400

[KiwiWRCfan]

#7 Loubet
#7 was previously used by Pontus Tidemand in 2019

[AnttiL]

#96 Veiby

[Steve Boyd]

#96 Veiby

Like 69 - looks just the same when you park it on the roof! :)

[Eli]

Wait so does this (Ogier winning the title) we'll get to see that No. 1 on that car again next year?

[EstWRC]

yep if he wants

[Andre Oliveira]

Please FIA, stop that stupid rule.

Back to numbers by merit... and big white square in doors.

[AnttiL]

#2 Oliver Solberg
#12 Janne Tuohino

[rp]

#14 Nil Solans

[Eli]

Please FIA, stop that stupid rule.

Back to numbers by merit... and big white square in doors.

No chance they'll stop it in time for next season in the next WMSC meeting on Friday, right?

[Eli]

I guess someone over at dirtfish heard us lol: https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/why-i-felt-disappointed-by-the-monte-carlo-entry/

[cali]

Someone or many of them from DF are lurking on this forum so not a big surprise

[PLuto]

I completely agree with Luke. I never understand why they implemented this stupid rule and I was always against it...

[ictus]

I completely agree with Luke. I never understand why they implemented this stupid rule and I was always against it...

Marketing and brand creation reasons,
Why do you think Block had permanent 43, or Pastrana 199? And many others from Nascar or Supercross

[PLuto]

Marketing and brand creation reasons,
Why do you think Block had permanent 43, or Pastrana 199? And many others from Nascar or Supercross

I understand that it was marketing purpose. But rallying is different world than circuits. Also community is different. Block was using 43 everywhere, not only in rallysport. It was part of his marketing. Same like for example Valentino Rossi. But I dont think anyone else in WRC has marketing based on the starting number. In rallysport always the best drivers were with small numbers, on the top of entry list. It is quite strange if you look at the entry list and it is not starting with 1-2-3-4-5, but with 69-8-11-33. It is not logical for fans of rallysport and not logical for "normal" people. If they go to watch the stages and they see car 33, they would like to look into entry list and find, who is it (driver, codriver, car). As the numbers are not in numerical order, they need to look through and try to find it. And one thing which was logical for all - fans and also casual - number 1 was always reserved for current champion. Now it looks like there is no champion from previous year. Or it looks like he is not proud of being champion...

[AnttiL]

All numbering systems have their flaws.

Traditionally the door number was the same as the running order, but the order is changed on overnight rest halts anyway, and in today's WRC the starting order is based on the current points score.
In 1995 the team numbers were introduced, but then a team possibly had an extra car, so the team cars were for example 1, 2, and 11. Also there was no separation between the team numbers and the rest numbered normally. Like now you have always WRC2 starting at 20 etc.

I personally don't care that much.

[AnttiL]

But I dont think anyone else in WRC has marketing based on the starting number.

It's still a quite new thing so strong brands haven't been built yet. But Kalle has some KR69 merch at least.


If they go to watch the stages and they see car 33, they would like to look into entry list and find, who is it (driver, codriver, car). As the numbers are not in numerical order, they need to look through and try to find it. .

Like I said, the running order gets shuffled anyway on long rallies. Or then the entry list is printed (or listed in ewrc-results) according to the actual starting order at the start of the rally so it's easy to follow the list regardless of the actual numbers

[PLuto]

Like I said, the running order gets shuffled anyway on long rallies. Or then the entry list is printed (or listed in ewrc-results) according to the actual starting order at the start of the rally so it's easy to follow the list regardless of the actual numbers

Yes, starting order is shuffled. But if you are at the stage and car 33 is going around you, no matter what is the starting order, if you look into the entry list, it is easier to find who is starting with number 33 if he is listed between 32 and 34 instead of between 11 and 18...

[WRCStan]

It is not logical for fans of rallysport and not logical for "normal" people. If they go to watch the stages and they see car 33, they would like to look into entry list and find, who is it (driver, codriver, car). As the numbers are not in numerical order, they need to look through and try to find it.

We're only talking about Rally1 of WRC, you seriously think normal people are still thumbing through the program to see who came past?

[Andre Oliveira]

I think the same of Pluto and Luke.

[cali]

WRC has bigger issues than door numbers and I personally prefer that new personalised system but don't really care if it is changed because it doesn't add or ruin my experience in any case.

[wyler]

Yes, starting order is shuffled. But if you are at the stage and car 33 is going around you, no matter what is the starting order, if you look into the entry list, it is easier to find who is starting with number 33 if he is listed between 32 and 34 instead of between 11 and 18...

soon people will google "rally car 69" more than checking entry list, especially passers-by, bystanders at ceremonial start in town, sss and tv.

[PLuto]

soon people will google "rally car 69" more than checking entry list, especially passers-by, bystanders at ceremonial start in town, sss and tv.

If you will google "rally car 69" or the most known brand "rally car 43", what will you find?

[seb_sh]

I liked the 2002 version the best: each team had 3 numbers resered for the cars nominated to score manufacturers points that made it very clear who the main crews were. That being said, numbers are less and less important, they are less prominent on the car, not sure how easy they are to see when the car flys past, if the drivers can build a brand with the fixed numbers fine by me.

EDIT: to clarify in 2002 the numbers were 3 in sequence, unlike previous years, so Peugeot had 1-2-3, Ford had 4-5-6 and so on.

[wyler]

If you will google "rally car 69" or the most known brand "rally car 43", what will you find?

atm: not that much with 69, ken block with 43. it will grow fast.
main socials has already 1000+ contents each with #kr69, #tn11, #ee33 (even #gg44 has nearly 800)
pr wise has more potential than changing every year or every race...

[WRCStan]

soon people will google "rally car 69" more than checking entry list, especially passers-by, bystanders at ceremonial start in town, sss and tv.

That would suggest there's something wrong with the current hack where you can read Kalle Rovanpera's name next to the number on the side of the car and say; oh look honey, it's Kalle Rovanpera, no need to look it up.

Sorry chaps, it's OK to feel nostalgic or whatever it is your going through but this argument is utter nonsense.

Even without names and roof vent flags visible, you see a photo of #69 from the recent era you know it's Rovenpera. Who wants to have to be a detective to find out?

[PLuto]

It is nice when they try to follow the permanent numbers also out of WRC. If you look to entry list (https://app-cdn.sportity.com/0d89df83-b0de-4194-bc15-e2712e7b9d89/01458e49-67fc-408c-b29e-0d13dd11082d_Muudetud%20vo%CC%83istlejate%20nimeki ri%20OR2023_V2kj.pdf) to Otepää Talveralli, biggest star on the first sight is Jourdan Serderidis with number 1 :)