Tony was correct

[harvick#1]

Jamie had the lead, David blew up, no caution.

once Jeff got the lead, Caution threw immediately

damn Nascar, never knows how to finish a ****in race. you waste three hours watchin a fantastic race and this BS happens

[dwboogityfan]

Am glad someone else noticed this. I feel sorry for McMurray as he could have won the race but for this debatable call.

[blakebeatty]

regardless of the caution, gordon was the fastest car on track, the class of the field, and deservedly the winner of the race.

when the caution flew for reutimann, the field was passed any oil that may have been on the track. it was no hazzard, they had the whole lap to throw the caution. there was nothing wrong with this call. in the final wreck, the crash was ongoing in the pack at the time of the caution.

if you cannot see the difference in the danger posed by the expiry of the 00 versus the danger posed in the ongoing final wreck at the time of the caution, then perhaps enjoy a few less beverages next time you watch a race.

must we always jump to conspiracy?

[SmokeFan20]

Jamie had the lead, David blew up, no caution.

once Jeff got the lead, Caution threw immediately

damn Nascar, never knows how to finish a ****in race. you waste three hours watchin a fantastic race and this BS happens

What BS that caution was! :mad:
Anybody that doesn't think NASCAR is "adjusting" races for their favorite team, Hendrick Motorsports, is deaf, dumb & blind.
And to top it all off, NASCAR kept waiving off the restart to run all the guys on the bubble out of fuel.
Bravo NASCAR. And you wonder why ratings & attendance is dropping.

[dont_be_jack]

I have to agree with what others have said: not all blown engines drop oil on the track. When you have that many cars in a pack, you need to wait for them to all pass before you can tell. They didn't play with the cautions just to give Hendrick a win. While I believe some cautions are bogus, not all are and I believe that they did the best thing in this situation.

[Hoss Ghoul]

You all would be complaining if they had thrown the caution too early(before determining wether the #00 was putting down oil) saying they had helped Gordon somehow...

Gordon was winning that race, I agree with blakebeatty. Gordon had the best car and put it in position to win, very nice job getting to the front with 10 to go.

Hell, if any of the calls were debatable today it was the decision not to throw the red flag. The ridiculous length of the cleanup combined with everyone's fuel issues should have made a red flag the obvious choice in that situation...I think NASCAR was trying to avoid having two restarts by letting it go into overtime.

[Erki]

I was also wondering, why no red flag. :confused:
The first caution was also way too long. Surely they could have picked that debris up in one lap too, not 4(?)?

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

everyone was passing the 00 without trouble, there was no need for a caution at that point. Gordon won end of, some people will away have a problem with that.

[jeffmr2]

I think in this instance its just too difficult to call whether nascar manipulated the race again or not so i'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.
Whats dissapointed me this weekend the most is the fact that other drivers didnt come out in support of Stewarts comments about bogus debris cautions.Its just so blatant thats whats happening,Stewart should never had to have made such a grovelling apology.

[gary_580]

Whats dissapointed me this weekend the most is the fact that other drivers didnt come out in support of Stewarts comments about bogus debris cautions.Its just so blatant thats whats happening,Stewart should never had to have made such a grovelling apology.

The others didnt come out in support because theyre scared. As Boris Said commented on the pre race show, NASCAR is run as a dictatorship, if you dont like it then you should go and race elesewhere. NASCAR dont listen, never have and never will

[ms0362]

Although I'm not a Stewart fan, I do agree with the idea that there are such things as "Nascar" yellows to close up the field. I've seen and been to way to many races not to know they exist. The fact that Nascar took insult with DW's simple solution of displaying the debris for each caution after the race shows they have something to hide. I also think it's a cheap shot everytime someone criticizes them they go on about how great a living that driver or ex-driver has made off the sport. I've said it again and again in different threads, Nascar has no consistancy with their calls. Nascar is like the kid on the block with the only football. You play by his rules or you don't get to play. First the fans drop off, then the sponsers/money. The the drivers find another yard to play in.

[BobbyC]

The fact that NASCAR took insult with DW's simple solution of displaying the debris for each caution after the race shows they have something to hide. I also think it's a cheap shot everytime someone criticizes them they go on about how great a living that driver or ex-driver has made off the sport.

Somehow, Darrell's words got to Barry Landis, Richie Zyontz, and Artie Kempner in their production meeting, and that showed Sunday. Debris cautions which were legitimate were shown with the debris being shown, similar to seeing legitimate NFL penalty calls.

Remember, up-and-coming NASCAR star Billy Wade lost his life to tire testing when inner liner testing was taking place. The key test was for the tire to run over debris.

[Sparky1329]

How hard is it for one of the many cameras at the track to follow the clean-up crew and show the dang debris? That one simple move could quiet the conspiracy theorists.

[blakebeatty]

How hard is it for one of the many cameras at the track to follow the clean-up crew and show the dang debris? That one simple move could quiet the conspiracy theorists.

well, based on talladega, that seems to be the new idea

[Sparky1329]

well, based on talladega, that seems to be the new idea

Then I guess it's actually possible.

There's a little blurb in the Indianapolis Star quoting Roger Penske and agreeing with Tony Stewart. I wonder if NASCAR will penalize Mr. Penske.

[e2mtt]

I love this quote in an editorial online:

Stewart not only “proved” that every caution has some ulterior motive – to keep Dale Earnhardt Jr. on the lead lap or trap Robby Gordon a lap down – he “verified” the existence of “Carolina (or Duke) refs”...

I tell you man, that is what NASCAR is doing. That and helping Hendricks every chance they get. :-D

Yesterday at Tallatega, they did good showing the debris and the cleanup each caution, until the final ones at the end of that race that screwed everything up.

[Haulin'AssAndTurnin Left]

I also think it's a cheap shot everytime someone criticizes them they go on about how great a living that driver or ex-driver has made off the sport


Your spot on there. Mike Helton is a prize prick and way out of line. Being an ex-driver DW is more qualified than most to give his opinions on issues. What Mike Helton doesnt realize is the fact that people liKe DW put NASCAR on the map not some pen pushing tit with the carisma of a hotdog.

No offence to hotdogs intended.

[gary_580]

How hard is it for one of the many cameras at the track to follow the clean-up crew and show the dang debris? That one simple move could quiet the conspiracy theorists.

1. Its not interesting tv viewing

2. The TV company are probably instructed not to

3. On some occasions they do, are these the only real debris cautions?

[Cindy_AL]

Im surprised there wasnt even more debris cautions. There was crap all over the track that I could see for myself.

[Dick Blom]

Jeff Gordon was bitching on his in-car radio about NASCAR not putting the race under red for the "oil" clean-up. As for the phony yellows, I agree they should be called "competition yellows", but even so, how many of us would still be interested in the finish if the leader was 14 laps ahead of 2nd place at the checkerd flag?

[harvick#1]

oh come on 14 laps, thats something like at Lemans, not Nascar

[e2mtt]

Jeff Gordon was bitching on his in-car radio about NASCAR not putting the race under red for the "oil" clean-up. As for the phony yellows, I agree they should be called "competition yellows", but even so, how many of us would still be interested in the finish if the leader was 14 laps ahead of 2nd place at the checkerd flag?

If someone was actually able to get 14 laps up on the field, that would be an amazing race. I would want to see it. In todays racing, that wouldn't happen often because most of the teams are very close. No reason to add "excitement" when the sport already has plenty of action & drama.

If you follow MotoGP, the last race (in Turkey) was a good example. Casey Stoner (Australian) checked out on the field and lead by 5+ seconds. This did not make a boring race, because there was an absolutely intense battle going on for 3rd thru 7th places, and this is what broadcast focused on as the laps wound down. Plus, there is the drama of whether the leader will falter, or the chance a wreck will cause a real caution.

[harvick#1]

If someone was actually able to get 14 laps up on the field, that would be an amazing race.

if an IRL car was fielded by Wheldon, then yes, he would lap the field in a few laps :p :

[Dick Blom]

I seem to recall one of the past announcers (Ned Jarrett or Benny Parsons) saying the won at Darlington and were 14 laps ahead of 2nd place at the checkered flag. My only point is that it ould be very exciting if the leader is the only one on the lead lap and it could certainly happen today on a 1/2 to 1 mile track with no yellows so the slower drivers have no chance to adjust the cars and there are just green flag pit stops.

[Cindy_AL]

Has anyone else noticed how Jr hasnt won at Dega since he dropped the "S" bomb in the winners circle??? :confused: Makes you wonder.....

[RaceFanStan]

DEI seems to have lost their big advantage at the plate tracks. :eek:

[e2mtt]

I seem to recall one of the past announcers (Ned Jarrett or Benny Parsons) saying the won at Darlington and were 14 laps ahead of 2nd place at the checkered flag. My only point is that it ould be very exciting if the leader is the only one on the lead lap and it could certainly happen today on a 1/2 to 1 mile track with no yellows so the slower drivers have no chance to adjust the cars and there are just green flag pit stops.

If you really need a caution, especially on a short track, a good driver can create one himself! (Just don't brag about it on the radio...)

[RaceFanStan]

cough cough (Dale Jr) cough cough http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g202/gr8link/orn/00.gif

[jslone]

Has anyone else noticed how Jr hasnt won at Dega since he dropped the "S" bomb in the winners circle??? :confused: Makes you wonder.....

So your saying more Hendrick favoritism babe?

[Hoss Ghoul]

I seem to recall one of the past announcers (Ned Jarrett or Benny Parsons) saying the won at Darlington and were 14 laps ahead of 2nd place at the checkered flag. My only point is that it ould be very exciting if the leader is the only one on the lead lap and it could certainly happen today on a 1/2 to 1 mile track with no yellows so the slower drivers have no chance to adjust the cars and there are just green flag pit stops.

The closest we've seen to that kind of dominance was when Jr. was in the process of lapping the field at RIR in the Busch race a few years back. He had all but 5 or 6 cars lapped and was 2/3 of the track ahead of 2nd place when a caution finally came out. Absolute domination.

I prefer fewer cars on the lead lap, so get rid of bogus cautions AND the BS lucky dog/free pass.

[e2mtt]

The closest we've seen to that kind of dominance was when Jr. was in the process of lapping the field at RIR in the Busch race a few years back. He had all but 5 or 6 cars lapped and was 2/3 of the track ahead of 2nd place when a caution finally came out. Absolute domination.

I prefer fewer cars on the lead lap, so get rid of bogus cautions AND the BS lucky dog/free pass.

Agreed.

There was also a night race at Bristol where Jr. was doing the same thing (in Cup about 3 years ago.) Great race!

[tstran17_88]

DEI seems to have lost their big advantage at the plate tracks. :eek: Yeah...ever since Mikey left. Weird, huh? :laugh:

[blakebeatty]

Has anyone else noticed how Jr hasnt won at Dega since he dropped the "S" bomb in the winners circle??? :confused: Makes you wonder.....

maybe, but did any one else noticed that DEI DOESN'T have a seven post shaker, or a pull down rig to set up their race cars, but the DO have a record label?

[Cindy_AL]

You must be referring to the new VP at DEI.