WRC Crash Trophy 2017

[AnttiL]

I thought it would be fun to count points for the worst WRC crashers. I decided to make a points system:

1: Out of the road with no damage
2: Out of the road with damage or a roll, no retirement
3: Crash that results in Rally2
5: Crash that results in retirement

A driver may collect many of these during an event, for example Ogier was off the road twice in Portugal, he gets 2 points. Meeke crashed to Rally2 and to retirement in Argentina, so that's 8 points.

I just hope I haven't forgotten any crashes from the list, let me know if I have.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xrWBd0ZSsGt23iIYqIJpv50rpSsXMe6PLJ-ZexnGR10/pubhtml

The current top (or bottom) 5 would be:

1. Kris Meeke 26
2. Juho Hänninen 16
3. Hayden Paddon 15
4. Stephane Lefevbvre 12
5. Elfyn Evans 8

[Tarmop]

I would have added point 4 or to point 3: out of the road with no damage but hoplesly stuck.:D
Good statistics to analyze at the end of the year.

Point 2 is difficult to remember, imo there have been more of those.

[AnttiL]

Point 2 is difficult to remember, imo there have been more of those.

I think I have all of those, but it's the hardest to collect the one point offs. Did Breen go out in Sweden slightly? Did Meeke have a slight off before his TV stage off? Did Ogier have two or three moments in Monte? I have to re-watch the highlight videos...

Also, I'm not counting spins. Nor moments where you stayed on the road but the car broke, like Breen in Argentina and Sardinia, or Østberg in Sardinia.

[Watson]

Good idea. We can do a manufacturer's trophy too :D

[Hartusvuori]

I think I have all of those, but it's the hardest to collect the one point offs. Did Breen go out in Sweden slightly? Did Meeke have a slight off before his TV stage off? Did Ogier have two or three moments in Monte? I have to re-watch the highlight videos...

Also, I'm not counting spins. Nor moments where you stayed on the road but the car broke, like Breen in Argentina and Sardinia, or Østberg in Sardinia.

Difficult exactly about the minor offs. If a car goes off the road, but keeps moving - well, is that really an off or just a hot moment. Sometimes you're lucky, sometimes not. Or if you cut too much - obvious driver error - break the car, but keep on the road...

Altogether, I'm following this :-)

[AnttiL]

Difficult exactly about the minor offs. If a car goes off the road, but keeps moving - well, is that really an off or just a hot moment. Sometimes you're lucky, sometimes not. Or if you cut too much - obvious driver error - break the car, but keep on the road...


Yeh. I'm not counting stuff like Neuville going a bit wide in Argentina, but counting Ogier's off to the field in Monte on the TV stage. I'd say the criteria is that the car goes off the road for 1 point. However, you can get a 2 point by breaking the car without leaving the road.

[Zeakiwi]

You might also have a WRC Rally Incident of the Year 'Plate' - represented by destroyed number plates joined together from crashed WRC cars, for the voted single most spectacular accident/ incident of the season.
The nominees for 2016 might have been Paddon - car fire Portugal, Bertelli - Rally Finland, Lefebvre - Germany.

2017 - Nominees - Meeke - the 2nd crash in Argentina. possibly Paddon - 2nd crash in Sardinia.

[Tarmop]

Bertellis 2016 RF car was rebuilt I think

[AnttiL]

2017 - Nominees - Meeke - the 2nd crash in Argentina. possibly Paddon - 2nd crash in Sardinia.

Has Meeke already destroyed two C3's? Is the Sardinia car rebuilt?

[itix]

I was bored so I double checked your math:

I don't count going off the road slightly and then getting back on again like an off. You have to have either caused cosmetic or light mechanical damage or come to a complete stop to be off. Running wide in a junction is not an off.

Counting only regulars not Bertelli etc.

_Event 1 MC_
Meeke crashed once and retired on road section = 8 points.
Neuville rally 2 from lead = 3 points
Hänninen crashed into a tree = 3 points
Lefebvre burnt the clutch after exit = 3 points
Ogier ditch = 1 point
Evans same = 1 point

_Event 2 Sweden_
Meeke twice off the road but without damage = 2 points
Hänninen tree again and rally 2 = 3 points
Neuville sss, rally 2 = 3 points
Breen snowbank = 1 point
Lefebvre snowbank = 1 point
Something happened to Evans here but can't figure out what.

_Event 3 Mexico_
Meeke off road on power stage = 1 point (maybe 2 if you count cosm. damage)
Ogier off and damaged a bumper = 2 points
Lefebvre rally 2 = 3 points


_Event 4 Corsica_
Hänninen crashed twice, retiring once = 8 points
Lefebvre rally 2 = 3 points
Evans rally 2 = 3 points
Tänak ditch = 1 point

_Event 5 Argentina_
Meeke rolled twice, retired 2nd time = 8 points
Paddon rolled but continued = 2 point
Sordo broke steering arm (but continued) = 2 point

_Event 6 portugal_
Meeke crashed but rally 2 = 3 points
Lefebvre rolled but continued = 2 points
Tänak broke a suspension arm on a bank = 2 points
Latvala rolled = 2 points
Lappi spun and touched a wall = 1 points

_Event 7 Italy_
Meeke crashed + retired again = 5 points
Paddon crashed twice, retiring once = 8 points
Evans crashed, was retired by team after last stage... = 3 points
Hänninen crashed and broke radiator, managed to keep on going = 2

_Event 8 Poland_
Tänak retired = 5 points
Ogier spun + damage = 2 points
Mikkelsen off two times = 2 points

That should be all... if I missed something, let me know

Meeke 27 points
Hänninen 16 points
Paddon 10 points
Lefebvre 12 points
Neuville 6 points
Evans 7 points (maybe more... missing one event)
Tänak 8 points
Ogier 5 points
Sordo 2 points
Latvala 2 points
Breen 1 Point
Lappi 1 point

[AnttiL]

_Event 5 Argentina_
Meeke rolled + retired = 5 points

He rolled twice. First into Rally2, then into retirement.

Evans in Sardinia is just 3 points, he didn't retire because of the crash.

But thanks for going through them, it's good to double check.

[noel157]

Pretty tasteless thread, especially considering Paddon's RMC, achieves nothing.
Suggest you find something better to do.

[AnttiL]

Pretty tasteless thread, especially considering Paddon's RMC, achieves nothing.
Suggest you find something better to do.

You're right, Paddon should be considered just withdrawn for Monte Carlo. Other than that, this should not be taken too seriously.

[itix]

Pretty tasteless thread, especially considering Paddon's RMC, achieves nothing.
Suggest you find something better to do.
Agree on Paddon(edited to suit), but disagree that the thread as such is useless. It paints a pretty clear picture of who looks after the equipment better. It is clear that some do it better than others.

[itix]

He rolled twice. First into Rally2, then into retirement.

Evans in Sardinia is just 3 points, he didn't retire because of the crash.

But thanks for going through them, it's good to double check.
Something happened to Evans in sweden. He dropped from 7th to 12th place in one stage and massive amounts of time but no explanation or comments.

Updated with Poland also.

[mknight]

Maybe add Sunninen with 2 points. Even though it's kind of pointless comparison if he only does few rounds.

[noel157]

You're right, Paddon should be considered just withdrawn for Monte Carlo. Other than that, this should not be taken too seriously.

You miss my point, by a considerable distance.

[itix]

Maybe add Sunninen with 2 points. Even though it's kind of pointless comparison if he only does few rounds.
I decided that only those regularly entered as manufacturer entries were allowed on the list or it would be too clattered.

[N.O.T]

Am i the only one who disagrees with this thread for low lives pathetic kids ??? counting the misfortunes of drivers for fun ???

are you stupid people ?

if a driver co-driver dies like Michael Park a few years ago or gets crippled for life like Kubica will you award extra points ???

[noel157]

Am i the only one who disagrees with this thread for low lives pathetic kids ??? counting the misfortunes of drivers for fun ???

are you stupid people ?

if a driver co-driver dies like Michael Park a few years ago or gets crippled for life like Kubica will you award extra points ???

That's the most sensible post you've made in 17 yrs, yes it is a stupid childish tabloid type of thread.

PS- see post #12.

[EstWRC]

no you are not the only one....when this thread was made i already wanted to write that i cant understand it but then i thought im the only one who thinks so.

[Norm75]

Must say, given the tragic circumstances of pretty much the first incident this season, I agree with the last two posts.

Not to mention the talent of any of the wrc drivers outweighs the ambition of probably everyone posting on this forum.

[sollitt]

.... It paints a pretty clear picture of who looks after the equipment better. It is clear that some do it better than others.Does nothing of the sort at all and, as others have mentioned, is both pointless and childish. Nutty kids on the loose again?

[steve.mandzij]

Am i the only one who disagrees with this thread for low lives pathetic kids ??? counting the misfortunes of drivers for fun ???

are you stupid people ?

if a driver co-driver dies like Michael Park a few years ago or gets crippled for life like Kubica will you award extra points ???
Well said N.O.T. never thought I'd say that.

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[Zeakiwi]

The FIA at its annual prize giving does have - personality of the year, action of the year and rookie of the year categories. Could there be WRC specific categories for the same titles? because F1 fans are likely to always out vote the wrc fans by total numbers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIA_Prize_Giving_Ceremony

and the Autosport awards - the 'moment of the year' was only awarded twice
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autosport_Awards

[AnttiL]

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to do this as offensive.

You can close/delete this thread if you think it's inappropriate for this forum, I'm not gonna post any updates here myself.

[Tarmop]

Well, let`s not count call them points and "winners". Statistically i can`t see anything wrong and unethical about it.

[AnttiL]

Well, let`s not count call them points and "winners" then . Statistically i can`t see anything wrong and unethical about it.

Yeah, should be negative points. I just wanted to see who's really the cleanest driver, like Dani Sordo hasn't made a single mistake this year but he doesn't get much credit for that.

Maybe we all should stop following and supporting a sport that is dangerous to both drivers and spectators?

[itix]

I really can't see why it would be unethical at all. It gives us a clear picture of who is better at keeping the car on the road. Of course nobody would award bonus points for a killed co-driver. Why would you even suggest that?

An off with damage is worse than an off without and a retirement is worse than rally 2.

I don't see any problem with a points system either.

Keeping the car intact is a very important aspect of rallying (which is why Meeke is second to last of the manufacturer entries in the championship despite winning a round).

[N.O.T]

how many points for killing a spectator ?? Paddon should have some extra points for that....

[itix]

how many points for killing a spectator ?? Paddon should have some extra points for that....
Who suggested that? (other than you, that is).

[Norm75]

itix/AnttiL I don't think anyone would believe that there is any malice or bad intention meant by this thread at all, it just seems to be in poor taste to some people. Even Dorna or someone publish a list of top crashers in MotoGP, but I can't say I agree with that either.

In any case
Agree on Paddon(edited to suit), but disagree that the thread as such is useless. It paints a pretty clear picture of who looks after the equipment better. It is clear that some do it better than others.
And also your (AnttiLs) post regarding Sordo.
It is, as you say, clear that some look after their equipment better than others. Do we need a thread on it, or do we agree that anyone with half a brain and eyes in their head can work out who crashes and who does not.
Also seems to be some confusion whether Evans went off in Sweden or not. Unless someone is prepared to trawl through all the footage, driver quotes, tweets and WRC text messages from every round so far it will be difficult to know who went off where and when.

[itix]

itix/AnttiL I don't think anyone would believe that there is any malice or bad intention meant by this thread at all, it just seems to be in poor taste to some people. Even Dorna or someone publish a list of top crashers in MotoGP, but I can't say I agree with that either.

In any case
And also your (AnttiLs) post regarding Sordo.
It is, as you say, clear that some look after their equipment better than others. Do we need a thread on it, or do we agree that anyone with half a brain and eyes in their head can work out who crashes and who does not.
Also seems to be some confusion whether Evans went off in Sweden or not. Unless someone is prepared to trawl through all the footage, driver quotes, tweets and WRC text messages from every round so far it will be difficult to know who went off where and when.
Certainly neither malice nor ill intent.

The data is there for anyone to read on a comprehensive rally database like ewrc-results.com for instance. Here it is just compiled in a simpler format (and with fixed "weights" to various degrees of not being able to stay on the road).

I've already agreed that the tragic Paddon incident should not be here.

[sonnybobiche]

Paddon's accident should not be removed. That car was destroyed. The fact that a spectator was killed in the process makes no difference.

[Tarmop]

That car wasn`t destroyed, it was pretty ok after the crash and has been in use by Hayden every single event. But i agree, what has been, has been and we can`t change that (and nobody is talking about the fatality and awarding points for it, just the off).

[noel157]

Paddon's accident should not be removed. That car was destroyed. The fact that a spectator was killed in the process makes no difference.

This is the kind of asinine statement that makes the basis of this thread so badly judged. You may not mean it but Paddon's accident becomes a statistic and the death of a person "makes no difference", might've made a bit of difference to his family and friends. That is what you said, no idea what you were thinking but read your post again and think about it. And even in the context of some stupid league table it's still an asinine statement.

[janvanvurpa]

Well said N.O.T. never thought I'd say that.

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Some random person must have typed that while he was unconscious or something...only way possible..No, there were no comments about dogs, sick or otherwise, no slurs about village drivers, no slagging anything--or everything Finnish.. all those sure signs it was a random post from a random person on a unattended laptop.

[GravelBen]

Paddon's accident should not be removed. That car was destroyed. The fact that a spectator was killed in the process makes no difference.

There was very little damage to the car, they said if it wasn't for the spectator death they would have tipped the car back on its wheels and carried on.

[seb_sh]

I don't think the topic should be removed in any case, nor Paddon's accident discounted. In the end it's a statistic of driver mistakes and their consequences on the competition and championship standings. ewrc has a finish % statistic, this is just a more detailed thing. Maybe not call it "fun" but interesting.

About the fatal accident: that is unfortunate and I don't think anyone meant any disrespect to that person or his family (except for NOT's comment about getting more points...). Motorsport is dangerous, people sometimes die, it doesn't mean you have to stop everything. The same people who are looking for and causing a disrespectful discussion are then complaining about it.

On topic: it's interesting Ogier is so close to Neuville, shows he's feeling pressure or is not yet used to the car?

[AnttiL]

Something happened to Evans in sweden. He dropped from 7th to 12th place in one stage and massive amounts of time but no explanation or comments.

Checked the highlights video, he went slightly to a snowbank and had a puncture, so that would be two points.