Wrc Tour de Corse 2015

[rallyfun]

Everytime he has an excuse. Sorry, this could be rims fault, but what about him not destroying his car in previous rallyes? Maybe he could have had the budget to buy proper rims then. There are plenty of private drivers and teams that manage to reach the finish line in several rounds. He did never. Everytime it is something else fault: the brakes, the rims, the engine, the team, the bad luck. Or he is the most unlucky man in the world or he just have a problem himself that in 2 years he didn't manage to solve.

hey rally expert how many stages have you win in WRC or how many teams did you manage that you can judge pro driver? Show me any other driver who in his first season won the title and in following two seasons won 12 stages as a privater.Or I make it easier for you, compare him to Raikonen or Bertelli or any other driver with 3 years experience in rallies.

[focus206]

hey rally expert how many stages have you win in WRC or how many teams did you manage that you can judge pro driver? Show me any other driver who in his first season won the title and in following two seasons won 12 stages as a privater.Or I make it easier for you, compare him to Raikonen or Bertelli or any other driver with 3 years experience in rallies.

He doesn't need to be a WRC driver to judge Kubica's performance, discussion forums wouldn't exist otherwise. I think only blind fanboys deny the fact that Robert has a huge problem controlling his speed and crashes way too much, even more than Raikkonen, Block, Duval, Latvala or who else.

[peter_85]

I think only blind fanboys deny the fact that Robert has a huge problem controlling his speed and crashes way too much.
Did I missed something? Kubica crashed today?

[focus206]

Did I missed something? Kubica crashed today?

Even if he finishes this season without any crash, he crashes way too much.

[Mk2 RS2000]

Things happen for reasons, not excuses

[bowler]

I don't understand the bad feeling towards Kubica.
He is a privateer, paying to compete, and adding interest to the Rally. He can be very fast, and with that comes mistakes sometimes.
He has a background in F1, and after a major accident he decided he could compete in Rallies.
He can, and does, and does well.
Sometimes his budget (or lack of) lets him down.
He is a true competitor, competing for the passion of the sport.
All the best to him.

[danon]

Tour de Corse 2015, (WRC) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07eCYpo5m3c&feature=share

[peter_85]

Things happen for reasons
That's the way of thinking by people which see only black and white color. He crashed a lot, but you can't blame him for things he can't affect like rims failure in this case.

[Mk2 RS2000]

That's the way of thinking by people which see only black and white color. He crashed a lot, but you can't blame him for things he can't affect like rims failure in this case.

So why did the rims fail?

[tommeke_B]

That's the way of thinking by people which see only black and white color. He crashed a lot, but you can't blame him for things he can't affect like rims failure in this case.

I think we need to take a closer look at the onboard footage from the moments they broke and the last kilometers before that, before we can judge... ;) I don't believe anything breaks without a reason.

[peter_85]

I think we need to take a closer look at the onboard footage from the moments they broke and the last kilometers before that, before we can judge... ;)
I've seen it three times and didn't notice something which could cause any problems.

[denkimi]

So why did the rims fail?
and why did the rims of the other competitors didn't fail?
a rim doesn't break if you don't hit anything. not even if they're not new.

[dimviii]

Κubica incar from ss1 but its useless due to outside camera position.
https://youtu.be/NnO8PqHOy0o

[Mariusz]

I think we need to take a closer look at the onboard footage from the moments they broke and the last kilometers before that, before we can judge... ;) I don't believe anything breaks without a reason.
Please explain then what was the reason of fuel injection failure in VWs in Argentina. Did drivers do something wrong?

[stefanvv]

and why did the rims of the other competitors didn't fail?
a rim doesn't break if you don't hit anything. not even if they're not new.

Does a compression counts for a hit (not related to Kubica's problem, just a general question)

[tommeke_B]

Please explain then what was the reason of fuel injection failure in VWs in Argentina. Did drivers do something wrong?
I say everything breaks for a reason, not that the driver is always the reason. Sure there was something wrong that caused the injectors to fail, otherwise they would keep functioning well... Sure people at VW will have done a lot of research to prevent it in the future, and so far it hasn't happened again... Also for Kubica's breaking wheels there must be a reason, at some point the stress on the wheel must have been bigger than what the wheel can handle. For example in Ypres Neuville retired with broken wheel some years ago (2011). It was on the very first stage. He took some cut that everyone took, but in the exit he was hitting the edge of the tarmac (getting back on the road with the wheel) quite hard, which caused the wheel to break, several other drivers took the same line there but got away with it. Do you blame the wheel or the driver? Or make it simple and call it "bad luck"? ;)

[stefanvv]

Please explain then what was the reason of fuel injection failure in VWs in Argentina. Did drivers do something wrong?

I think they changed supplier after that

[jacko]

I don't understand the bad feeling towards Kubica.
He is a privateer, paying to compete, and adding interest to the Rally. He can be very fast, and with that comes mistakes sometimes.
He has a background in F1, and after a major accident he decided he could compete in Rallies.
He can, and does, and does well.
Sometimes his budget (or lack of) lets him down.
He is a true competitor, competing for the passion of the sport.
All the best to him.

Best words ever about Kubica. All is said :)

[Mk2 RS2000]

I don't understand the bad feeling towards Kubica.
He is a privateer, paying to compete, and adding interest to the Rally. He can be very fast, and with that comes mistakes sometimes.
He has a background in F1, and after a major accident he decided he could compete in Rallies.
He can, and does, and does well.
Sometimes his budget (or lack of) lets him down.
He is a true competitor, competing for the passion of the sport.
All the best to him.



We need a lot more passionate committed non works competitors like Kubica in our sport for it to progress into the future.

What we don't need is people making excuses for people such as him when they do not beat the works drivers. There is no disgrace in being the highest placed non-works competitor in any competition.

There is no disgrace in trying your absolute best to beat the works drivers either. To try and to fail is much better than to not try and then give up.

Kubica could never be accused of under achieving

[spark13]

Kubica could never be accused of under achieving

So what exactly has he achieved?
5 or 6 SS wins and a record of DNF in the season.
I think some other drivers could be much more successfull in this if they want to, or if the budget let them to.
Kris Meek would for example=)
Don't get me wrong I like Kubica but..... let's state the facts he is hottlapper, on a short distance, thats not a rally driver should be.

[stefanvv]

http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/october/volkswagen-fined/page/2859--12-12-.html

Ogier is not helping VW in these hard times, or it is Ingrassia?!?

[stefanvv]

Watching highlights now seems Kubica is right - rim just couldn't hold on (from what they showed)

[Simmi]

So what exactly has he achieved?
5 or 6 SS wins and a record of DNF in the season.
I think some other drivers could be much more successfull in this if they want to, or if the budget let them to.
Kris Meek would for example=)
Don't get me wrong I like Kubica but..... let's state the facts he is hottlapper, on a short distance, thats not a rally driver should be.

He isn't taking a car off someone more worthy though is he. So why is any of that relevant? He can spend his money (or his sponsors' money) wherever he wants - he chooses to do it in WRC. Same thing with Prokop who campaigns for years but never improves. It's his decision.

[spark13]

Yes he isn't.
I was referring to the statement of the many Kubica fans that RK is on the lerning curve and he will be equal to the top drivers when he will get the experience.
I think he won't,like for example Evgeny Novikov wasn't.
They are kind of similar for me for been both quick on a short distance but in the ditch for a long.
I think every driver in wrc could be flat out mode for win one stage and retire in the next one. That's not a big thing. Even Elfin Evans=)
But to compete on the regular basis needs something more than that.
Sorry for my "ingrish" I couldn't explain my thoughts better.

[stefanvv]

spark13, Your English is good enough to write Your location right....

[rallyfun]

He doesn't need to be a WRC driver to judge Kubica's performance, discussion forums wouldn't exist otherwise. I think only blind fanboys deny the fact that Robert has a huge problem controlling his speed and crashes way too much, even more than Raikkonen, Block, Duval, Latvala or who else.

He doesn't judge his performance but "analyzing" mistakes, failures, bad luck or whatever else from behind the screen of his computer. But the most important thing is he judges him equally with rally drivers with years of experience. It's not right is it? Even if you don't appreciate the progress, speed, stage wins on all surface etc. RK has achieved, you need to realize that he has less than three years of experience in rallies at all. Not mention about his limitation. It's funny how some trolls expect miracles and people from WRC (drivers, experts, team bosses) respect what RK has been doing. Paddon said in interview that it took him all his career to get that speed that RK already had when he joined WRC, and all he needs is experience that you can get over years. That sums up all discussion.

[rallyfun]

I think for Kubica is a good time to say goodbye to the sport...

No one cares what you think

[focus206]

He doesn't judge his performance but "analyzing" mistakes, failures, bad luck or whatever else from behind the screen of his computer. But the most important thing is he judges him equally with rally drivers with years of experience. It's not right is it? Even if you don't appreciate the progress, speed, stage wins on all surface etc. RK has achieved, you need to realize that he has less than three years of experience in rallies at all. Not mention about his limitation. It's funny how some trolls expect miracles and people from WRC (drivers, experts, team bosses) respect what RK has been doing. Paddon said in interview that it took him all his career to get that speed that RK already had when he joined WRC, and all he needs is experience that you can get over years. That sums up all discussion.

Well, we should wait AL14 to speak for himself, but I doubt he expects Kubica to be as fast as top WRC drivers. Kubica isn't a bad driver, absolutely, he's good. And he does have raw speed, otherwise no stage wins. What we're saying here is that he should have a different approach to his rallies, he can't go full attack from the beginning to the end, especially when he has - as you said - not much experience. What can he achieve like that? A WRC2 title against Al Kuwari, and that's it. So yes, he achieved that, but if he wants to achieve anything in the WRC like that, he's wasting his time (he can spends his money how he wants of course, but judging from interviews he's really not satisfied on how this year went, is he?)
What you call "miracles" that people here and trolls expect, it's actually first finish some rallies without major mistakes. The progress? I see no progress since last year. And unless he gets a really lucky rally, he won't progress.

[AL14]

hey rally expert how many stages have you win in WRC or how many teams did you manage that you can judge pro driver?

How many do you?

[AL14]

Well, we should wait AL14 to speak for himself, but I doubt he expects Kubica to be as fast as top WRC drivers. Kubica isn't a bad driver, absolutely, he's good. And he does have raw speed, otherwise no stage wins. What we're saying here is that he should have a different approach to his rallies, he can't go full attack from the beginning to the end, especially when he has - as you said - not much experience. What can he achieve like that? A WRC2 title against Al Kuwari, and that's it. So yes, he achieved that, but if he wants to achieve anything in the WRC like that, he's wasting his time (he can spends his money how he wants of course, but judging from interviews he's really not satisfied on how this year went, is he?)
What you call "miracles" that people here and trolls expect, it's actually first finish some rallies without major mistakes. The progress? I see no progress since last year. And unless he gets a really lucky rally, he won't progress.

Don't bother trying to explain them good sense. They wouldn't understand.

[itix]

Most people do agree with you... I don't understand how FIA and the promotor allow these kind of things, like a rally with only 9 stages... 2 are cancelled and now we end up with some kind of rally-sprint. The stages are longer, but for the fans (both at home and on stages) it's nicer to follow events that have more (shorter) stages...

I think that adding a short blast through a late evening stage today and some short stage in between these long stages really wouldn't have hurt. I like the fact that they try to do a rally with mainly long stages. It is a good idea and it is a good flirt with the past but seriously, a few shorties in between wouldn't have hurt!

[thuGG]

Well, we should wait AL14 to speak for himself, but I doubt he expects Kubica to be as fast as top WRC drivers. Kubica isn't a bad driver, absolutely, he's good. And he does have raw speed, otherwise no stage wins. What we're saying here is that he should have a different approach to his rallies, he can't go full attack from the beginning to the end, especially when he has - as you said - not much experience. What can he achieve like that? A WRC2 title against Al Kuwari, and that's it. So yes, he achieved that, but if he wants to achieve anything in the WRC like that, he's wasting his time (he can spends his money how he wants of course, but judging from interviews he's really not satisfied on how this year went, is he?)
What you call "miracles" that people here and trolls expect, it's actually first finish some rallies without major mistakes. The progress? I see no progress since last year. And unless he gets a really lucky rally, he won't progress.

The fact is, that this season he isn't always 100% pushing, the fact is that he makes way less mistakes that last year, but still that's not enough. Even when problems are not his cause, people blame him, because it's Kubica, he must have done something.
I think he will quit rallying after this season.

[danon]

http://s5.postimg.org/fm1kqajt3/123.jpg

[Mk2 RS2000]

So what exactly has he achieved?
5 or 6 SS wins and a record of DNF in the season.
I think some other drivers could be much more successfull in this if they want to, or if the budget let them to.
Kris Meek would for example=)
Don't get me wrong I like Kubica but..... let's state the facts he is hottlapper, on a short distance, thats not a rally driver should be.

Old Red Indian proverb. “Never criticize the speed of a fellow brave until you have run to the mountains in his moccasins”

[N.O.T]

Kubica should stay home next year and if possible for the rest of the year as well... he is nothing.

[itix]

From a neutral standpoint I prefer him to Prokop... and especially that Khaled dude who gets beaten by RC3 and RC2 cars... I mean come fucking on! I could probably do better with no experience.
Sure, Kubi is not someone that I would like to follow as a fan because it would be very frustrating seeing him in the ditch always. As a team boss I would probably be equally frustrated by him as I would be by having Meeke that everyone is vouching for but who is crashing about the same amount with more experience. However, I like the fact that occasionally, and especially on tarmac, there is someone taking the fight to the VW's and topping the stage times and often that has been Kubica, also on this rally.

Also you have to admit that the videos of him driving the stages are fun to watch. No grandma driving there.

[Toyoda]

Nothing wrong with Kubica in the wrc, more cars, more fun. Especially one that can snaffle best ss times.

[wrchirek]

Kubica should go to WTCC, and Loeb back to WRC. Win-win.

[dimviii]

Good morning guys!


Sun 07:31 - Weather
A cloudy start in Ajaccio, but it should be a decent, dry, day here. The current temperature of 19ºC is expected to hit 24ºC this afternoon. WRC TV crews report that SS7 is damp in places after light rain overnight.

[dimviii]

MICHELIN Motorsport ‏@michelin_sport

#tyre information: All #Michelin drivers with 4 Michelin Pilot Sport H ard + 2Soft except
VW: 4S+2H
Evans: 3H+3S

[satukata]

WRC+ livemaps not working today?

[wwbroe]

Back to usual Volkswagen dominance. Hope Evans can manage to stay in front of Mikkelsen.

[satukata]

WRC+ livemaps not working today?

[wwbroe]

What happened with Kremer on SS7?

[wwbroe]

WRC+ livemaps not working today?

I don't know, i cancelled my deal with them, because it never works well, allways some kind of problems.

[satukata]

What happened with Kremer on SS7?

offroad. :(

[thuGG]

Kubica should stay home next year and if possible for the rest of the year as well... he is nothing.

Thankfully he doesn't have that loser mentality that you poses.

[N.O.T]

Thankfully he doesn't have that loser mentality that you poses.

he has the mentality of an insane person though.. he does the same thing over and over again and he expects different result each time...

and in motorsport that is quite dangerous.

[satukata]

wrc+ livemaps not working?

i´m not sure is it my computer or wrc+ problem?

[thuGG]

he has the mentality of an insane person though.. he does the same thing over and over again and he expects different result each time...

and in motorsport that is quite dangerous.

I'm pretty sure he knows motorsport better that you ever could.

[N.O.T]

I'm pretty sure he knows motorsport better that you ever could.

he knows it form a different perspective though, and his results so far show he is not that good and a danger, and to be honest i do not care much what happens to him rather what implications will have to the sport.

[thuGG]

he knows it form a different perspective though, and his results so far show he is not that good and a danger, and to be honest i do not care much what happens to him rather what implications will have to the sport.

Oh stop this danger BS, tell me how many crashes there is throughout the season and how many Kubica contributed? I bet it would be small percentage, that's rallying many drivers crashes. And don't kid me, you'd be happy if Kubica killed himself, judging by your posts.

[EightGear]

Abbring off....

[stefanvv]

Abbring off the road, crew ok. Pity so close to a very good result

[wwbroe]

Abbring off....

That's not so good, he is continuing or off definitive?

[EightGear]

That's not so good, he is continuing or off definitive?
Retired, what a shame.

[bowler]

N.O.T you are out of line with such a comment.

[wwbroe]

Evans doens't look good on first splits, he is allready 10 sec slower as Mikkelsen

[EstWRC]

Tänak again sayin that he had no information from gravel crew, was a bit of angry. SOme dude here didnt believe me yesterday.

[wwbroe]

Very good pace by Sordo, faster trough then Ogier

[Mk2 RS2000]

N.O.T you are out of line with such a comment.

As much as I enjoy N.O.T's contributions I too consider that on this occasion he has crossed the line. I expect better of him.

[Arnold Triyudho Wardono]

he has the mentality of an insane person though.. he does the same thing over and over again and he expects different result each time...

and in motorsport that is quite dangerous.
Don't worry, he'll improve. And probably in your perspective, Poland has reserves (Katjo, Zawada).

@MK2 RS2000
He already had (bashing Bertelli's retirement due to illness, etc)..:p

[stefanvv]

Mikkelsen quite a flier. Might pass Evans

[satukata]

wrc+ livemaps not working?

[wwbroe]

Looks like Evans did better in last part of the stage, but i don't know if it will be enough to keep Mikkelsen behind?

[wwbroe]

Looks like he is still 9.6 sec in front of Andreas, so he should be able to keep second place in powerstage.

[Simmi]

Without that day one puncture Sordo's pace/consistency would have been enough to put him on the podium.

From a British perspective I really hope Evans can hold onto second place. I was hoping for more of a fight this morning but I think the writing has been on the wall really ever since Latvala got a sniff of victory.

After Evans I've been very impressed with Paddon again. He's setting some great times. You can see him learning and building at these events - not just throwing in fluke fastest times like a Tanak.

Citroen drivers have been disappointing. Is Lefebvre really doing enough with these opportunities?

Every rally I don't think Neuville's stock can drop any lower - and it keeps happening. He is driving like a guy who wants to get fired.

[wwbroe]

Without that day one puncture Sordo's pace/consistency would have been enough to put him on the podium.

From a British perspective I really hope Evans can hold onto second place. I was hoping for more of a fight this morning but I think the writing has been on the wall really ever since Latvala got a sniff of victory.

After Evans I've been very impressed with Paddon again. He's setting some great times. You can see him learning and building at these events - not just throwing in fluke fastest times like a Tanak.

Citroen drivers have been disappointing. Is Lefebvre really doing enough with these opportunities?

Every rally I don't think Neuville's stock can drop any lower - and it keeps happening. He is driving like a guy who wants to get fired.

Maybe that is the idea behind it, i mean to get fired?

[Simmi]

Maybe that is the idea behind it, i mean to get fired?

We keep hearing talk linking Neuville with a move away from Hyundai - but honestly unless he can go to VW (which aint happening) surely his best chance of a good result is with Hyundai.

I would have thought to see out the final year of his contract in the only brand new car out there gives him the best chance of success. Then after that everything is seemingly reset for 2017 and no one has a deal yet.

Literally his other options are privateer Ford (certain pay cut) and a Citroen team which may or may not even be around in 13 months time. Or take a year out to test full-time with Toyota - but his stock is not high enough to do that I don't think.

[thuGG]

Maybe that is the idea behind it, i mean to get fired?

It doesn't make sense to me. If he's doing that, he is harming his own team and it just looks bad to other teams. It also shows the lack of ambition to go as fast as he can and make the best out of the car. And he is cosnistently beaten by new teammate. There is nothing to gain from that approach, if he is doing that then he is stupid.

[jacko]

He doesn't judge his performance but "analyzing" mistakes, failures, bad luck or whatever else from behind the screen of his computer. But the most important thing is he judges him equally with rally drivers with years of experience. It's not right is it? Even if you don't appreciate the progress, speed, stage wins on all surface etc. RK has achieved, you need to realize that he has less than three years of experience in rallies at all. Not mention about his limitation. It's funny how some trolls expect miracles and people from WRC (drivers, experts, team bosses) respect what RK has been doing. Paddon said in interview that it took him all his career to get that speed that RK already had when he joined WRC, and all he needs is experience that you can get over years. That sums up all discussion.

Every word is again bingo, some people here just don't want to see it how good he is. Yes, maybe not a future worldchamp but he's a guy what bring's that extra to the WRC. Compare him only with Raikkonen and all is said. I'm judging him on basic of experience & budget and so far he's a lot more further than most other fast drivers, even Paddon acknowledge that. But even if that kind of drivers respect Kubica's performance, some people here just seem to be happy to be negative every time they can.

[jacko]

Kubica should stay home next year and if possible for the rest of the year as well... he is nothing.

You like this are you? In the end only a few drivers are really good in your opinion. But what can you ? You only bashing most of the drivers, negative in general, what a sad life do you have...

[Ounin]

We keep hearing talk linking Neuville with a move away from Hyundai - but honestly unless he can go to VW (which aint happening) surely his best chance of a good result is with Hyundai.

I would have thought to see out the final year of his contract in the only brand new car out there gives him the best chance of success. Then after that everything is seemingly reset for 2017 and no one has a deal yet.

Literally his other options are privateer Ford (certain pay cut) and a Citroen team which may or may not even be around in 13 months time. Or take a year out to test full-time with Toyota - but his stock is not high enough to do that I don't think.

I think you are right, from all the options Hyundai is the best I think. Enough budget and good set up team as well in the factory with engineers and designers. Questionmark; now is the potential of the new 2016 car. Only Neuville himself can find out by testing as much as possible.

[jacko]

Nothing wrong with Kubica in the wrc, more cars, more fun. Especially one that can snaffle best ss times.

Again, better Kubica kind of drivers than the kinds of Prokop or Al Qassimi. And even those drives i don't blame to be driving in the WRC. Why should you if you love this kind of sport :)

[jacko]

Neuville season is dramatic. He thought 2015 was the season in wich he could take the fight against VW but it didn't. Compare it to McLaren Honda in the F1, Alonso (and even Button i think also) had a lot of other mindsetting before the season. For Neuville, he will be hoping the next car is a bit better and maybe the gap will be a little closer. Citroën and Ford won't bring any major updates on the current car anymore so the best is to stay where he is. After 2016 a lot of contracts will end, then we would see some changes for sure.

[jacko]

Question: is there any news about M-Sport / Ford staying in the WRC after 2016 ??

[stefanvv]

Question: is there any news about M-Sport / Ford staying in the WRC after 2016 ??

Usually they aren't certain for the coming year. I think I read somewhere they'll test '17 car second half of the next year....

[Simmi]

Question: is there any news about M-Sport / Ford staying in the WRC after 2016 ??

While it does seem like they tend to work on a year-by-year basis, Malcolm Wilson has already talked about the 2017 car and how they don't expect to be testing before the back end of next year. So I'd say they have every intention of being there.

I really hope the new regulations might tempt Ford back - especially with this new 'Ford Performance' rebirth on the roadcar side. Although that does seem a bit America-centric.

[EstWRC]

Without that day one puncture Sordo's pace/consistency would have been enough to put him on the podium.

From a British perspective I really hope Evans can hold onto second place. I was hoping for more of a fight this morning but I think the writing has been on the wall really ever since Latvala got a sniff of victory.

After Evans I've been very impressed with Paddon again. He's setting some great times. You can see him learning and building at these events - not just throwing in fluke fastest times like a Tanak.

Yep, Paddon has been also impressive here, getting better and better with each day. i would also say the same about Mikkelsen, after Friday has he also been very good.

and about my man Tänak, you could see that he had been already given up after the shakedown. He has no confidence at all in these mixed conditions which is weird because in Monte this year he was very good. This is very weird rally, he himself is very cool and happy with the result but he is just nowhere and he hasnt made any progress at all since germany and it seems he doesnt even bother to try to go faster on some stage. He is having exactly the same case as Evans had in Australia, they dont know themselves why they are so slow.

[dimviii]

Question: is there any news about M-Sport / Ford staying in the WRC after 2016 ??

Msport is the only sure participant at wrc as long as Malcolm run this business.

[dimviii]

MICHELIN Motorsport ‏@michelin_sport

#tyres information: all #WRC Michelin drivers with 5 Pilot Sport H5 #wrc #tourdecorse

[Gregor-y]

All right, 0500 and coverage of the power stage is starting on TV. No commentary, just music and car sounds of the recap.

[rallyace]

Hmm... seems like Jon Desborough forgot to turn on his mic. ;)

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQdxzTkW8AAHVPU.jpg

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Hmm... seems like Jon Desborough forgot to turn on his mic. ;)

If only...

He ruins these live stages.

[tc10a]

Quite boring stage. For sure better and more spectacular stages on this picturesque island for TV.
Remember the IRC stage some years ago along the coastline...

[Simmi]

If only...

He ruins these live stages.

Yeah two cringe-worthy moments straight off the bat.

"Philippe Bugalski, remember him?"

And saying it's Abbring's first tarmac rally in a WRC car.

[Gregor-y]

If only...

He ruins these live stages.

No comments, no interviews, just raw footage and pacenotes. Maybe the channel I'm waching got the 'ultra basic' package.

[rallyace]

No comments, no interviews, just raw footage and pacenotes. Maybe the channel I'm waching got the 'ultra basic' package.

Absolutely. There's a new online streaming service called WRC Basic. :D

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Desborough talks over the on-boards and says the same thing every time as a car starts, " putting the power down into the tarmac".. so you never hear the car. :(

[GigiGalliNo1]

We keep hearing talk linking Neuville with a move away from Hyundai - but honestly unless he can go to VW (which aint happening) surely his best chance of a good result is with Hyundai.

I would have thought to see out the final year of his contract in the only brand new car out there gives him the best chance of success. Then after that everything is seemingly reset for 2017 and no one has a deal yet.

Literally his other options are privateer Ford (certain pay cut) and a Citroen team which may or may not even be around in 13 months time. Or take a year out to test full-time with Toyota - but his stock is not high enough to do that I don't think.

If you'd really like to know what the issue is with Neuville and Hyundai I have your answer. Straight from the cow.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Paddon camera, Meeke co-driver !

[wwbroe]

Ogier showing who the master is, almost a sec/km faster as Sordo

[stefanvv]

No one below 10 secs from Ogier so far. Is he competing with himself?

[car]

Go on then.... What is it?

[rallyace]

Yeah two cringe-worthy moments straight off the bat.

"Philippe Bugalski, remember him?"

And saying it's Abbring's first tarmac rally in a WRC car.

Couldn't agree more. Why not Mike Chen or Colin Clark? I also love every time Craig Breen or Luis Moya are colour commentators; and it puts a big smile on my face every time I hear Breen correct Desborough's "facts". :rolleyes:

[wwbroe]

Can Sordo pass in front of Ostberg?

[wwbroe]

Second split Sordo is 5,6 sec faster as Ostberg and he is only 4 sec behind overall.

[EstWRC]

Ott Tänak ‏@OttTanak 4m4 minutes ago

One of my worst WRC weekends, nothing seemed to work for us. For sure we will work hard and come back stronger for Spain, I promise that
0 retweets 0 favorites


lol, thank god it is over

[stefanvv]

"Remember Poland - Evans could be the winner"

[GigiGalliNo1]

I'd love JML to spin...

[Simmi]

Such bad TV coverage. Barely giving any time information from the end of the stage.

If you are going to design the entire final day around TV coverage you HAVE to do a better job than this!!!

[Gregor-y]

Hey, interviews. Go Evans!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Come on Elfyn !

[GigiGalliNo1]

Stage end interviews?

What else is wrong?

[stefanvv]

yeah Go Evans

[GigiGalliNo1]

Well done evans!!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Get in Elfyn, great job !!!

[RAS007]

Well done evans!!

Well done Elfyn. A terrific result.

[Gregor-y]

Come on, Jari, the nice man with the microphone is waiting.

[peter_85]

Kubica 2nd on PowerStage!

[Simmi]

Great work from Elfyn.

Kubica making a mockery of the TV power stage by taking second completely out of sight. Lefebvre could also take 10th off Tanak.

[stefanvv]

Well done Evans. Deserved result after friday's "walk in the park"

[Gregor-y]

Great work from Elfyn.

Kubica making a mockery of the TV power stage by taking second completely out of sight. Lefebvre could also take 10th off Tanak.

Seriously?! Coverage just ended and switched to an hour long commercial for a vaccum cleaner.

[Doon]

So Evans do ones good stage time (because of tricky conditions), and he takes 2nd? The result looks good, but don't be fooled into thinking he was on the pace. What a joke of a rally.

These were Evans's stage positions.....not very impressive really.

6th, 1st, 7th, 3rd, 6th, 10th, 9th.

[RAS007]

F
So Evans do ones good stage time (because of tricky conditions), and he takes 2nd? The result looks good, but don't be fooled into thinking he was on the pace. What a joke of a rally.

These were Evans's stage positions.....not very impressive really.

6th, 1st, 7th, 3rd, 6th, 10th, 9th.

That's what happens when you have a rally with only 7 stages. I still think he did a good job holding off Mikkelsen, but I don't think anyone seriously thinks Evans was on the pace; everybody knows that if there had been a few more stages, Evans would have started to slide down the leaderboard.

[stefanvv]

it's not just good stage time - it was excellent. btw these positions doesn't mean much whe 3-4 drivers are within few seconds. He had done enough to deserve his 2nd place

[Doon]

Exactly, it was a pathetic rally. Was really boring to follow with all the huge gaps. Glad I didn't spend money to go over there.

[Doon]

it's not just good stage time - it was excellent. btw these positions doesn't mean much whe 3-4 drivers are within few seconds. He had done enough to deserve his 2nd place

If the rally hadn't been cut short by 90 kms, he wouldn't have held off Mikkelsen or Meeke.

[stefanvv]

If the rally hadn't been cut short by 90 kms, he wouldn't have held off Mikkelsen or Meeke.

or.... he might just as well win it?

[car]

If you'd really like to know what the issue is with Neuville and Hyundai I have your answer. Straight from the cow.

OK< whats the reason?

[Doon]

or.... he might just as well win it?

No, no he wouldn't have. Definitely not. The fastest cars / drivers this weekend were yet again the 3 VW's, and for a couple of stages a few other drivers got lucky. These are facts :)

[dimviii]

congrats to Latvala for the win.
massively dissapointment from all the others except Ogier of course.His pace at power stage ridiculed everybody.
Lappi and Tidemand lost from Maurin?
didn t enjoyed the rally,very boring with these gaps.

[stefanvv]

No, no he wouldn't have. Definitely not. The fastest cars / drivers this weekend were yet again the 3 VW's, and for a couple of stages a few other drivers got lucky. These are facts :)

don't blame me for speaking hypothetically:D

[EstWRC]

So Evans do ones good stage time (because of tricky conditions), and he takes 2nd? The result looks good, but don't be fooled into thinking he was on the pace. What a joke of a rally.

These were Evans's stage positions.....not very impressive really.

6th, 1st, 7th, 3rd, 6th, 10th, 9th.

He lost 40 secs alone to Latvala today, Saturday 24 secs.

But great performance nevertheless.

[stefanvv]

Sun 13:13 - SS9: RGT Delecour
He wins the RGT class at the wheel of his 911. "Driving the Porsche here in Corsica is not easy. I'm so happy because I think we also won the championship."

Congratulations for him if he is!

[AL14]

As for Evans I do agree with you his pace was not worth a second place or even a podium but we should praise him for his pace on that stage in very very difficult conditions. Maybe if they wouldn't canceled the big stage in that condition he could have had more advantage. What I want to say is that sometimes rally is also driving in a mess like it was the stage where i gained so much time.
In normal condition it is clear he is nowhere.

[liposh]

So finally, how is the case with the points? Will the drivers receive full points or will they receive only half points? There were rumours here in this forum that with less than 75% kms run there are only half points. So I am confused :)

[Simmi]

Have some people on here never watched a rally before? You don't decide your end result by adding together what position you were in on each stage.

After all the stages the stopwatch had Elfyn in second - so, in a rally where everyone had equal conditions, how does he not deserve to finish second?

I want him to do well but I'm not some blinkered Evans apologist. I don't think he's impressed much at all during his WRC career and I have been critical of him - but I'll say what I said the other day - let's give credit where it's due.

You can't start adding on stages that didn't exist and you can't predict what would happen in them and brand that as 'fact'. There's no reason why Evans couldn't have put time into, or at least matched Latvala, in those horrendous conditions on Friday. But those stages never ran so we have what we have.

[stefanvv]

So finally, how is the case with the points? Will the drivers receive full points or will they receive only half points? There were rumours here in this forum that with less than 75% kms run there are only half points. So I am confused :)

On wrc+ showed Latvala with 160, so this should mean full points

[Quad]

this power stage tv coverage was complete joke

why they throwed out Neuville and Kubica and no Ogier also ? What a mess, and yet when Kubica came 2nd they showed poewr stage results without him. :confused:

[RAS007]

Sun 13:13 - SS9: RGT Delecour
He wins the RGT class at the wheel of his 911. "Driving the Porsche here in Corsica is not easy. I'm so happy because I think we also won the championship."

Congratulations for him if he is!

One of the best, Francois. Always been one of my favourites. Congrats to him on the RGT Cup.

[rallyace]

this power stage tv coverage was complete joke

why they throwed out Neuville and Kubica and no Ogier also ? What a mess, and yet when Kubica came 2nd they showed poewr stage results without him. :confused:

Ogier was there. He was the first car they broadcast. :)

Kubica and Neuville came after the broadcast ended. Desborough said that "they didn't have time to show more than a dozen cars" and also stated that the results shown at the end of the WRC+ feed were provisional and not necessarily final (Kubica finished 2nd after the broadcast had ended).

I do however agree with you that it was a shame that they couldn't feature all WRC drivers. The stage was reasonably "boring" as well considering the different options they had for the power stage, but okay, that's down to the organizers and not the crew at WRC+.

[Quad]

Ogier was there. He was the first car they broadcast. :)

Kubica and Neuville came after the broadcast ended. Desborough said that "they didn't have time to show more than a dozen cars" and also stated that the results shown at the end of the WRC+ feed were provisional and not necessarily final (Kubica finished 2nd after the broadcast had ended).

I do however agree with you that it was a shame that they couldn't feature all WRC drivers. The stage was reasonably "boring" as well considering the different options they had for the power stage, but okay, that's down to the organizers and not the crew at WRC+.

the thing is, that Kubica and Neuville were from morning first cars on the road, and they throwed them from their starting order to the end

[RS]

Lappi and Tidemand lost from Maurin?


That surprised me too but maybe Lappi was driving for the championship points.

[Quad]

Not to mention they throwed also Lefebvre instead of Ogier from the road order

[Simmi]

I suppose a one-hour (TV friendly broadcast), long-ish stage, plus a fairly decent entry of cars made it difficult to fit everything in. Very bad TV product though all in all. Rushed, not particularly entertaining. Lack of information from Desborough surrounding the key battle (Evans/Mikkelsen). Not sure how it really sells the sport to new fans tuning in before the football for instance.

[Negaiss]

Those, who say that Kubica should leave WRC and that Robert is not a WRC material, :
1. Have never driven a car;
2. Whatch only champinship standings instead of real action;
3. Are head of manufacturer team;
4. Are Prokop fans;
5. Have no soul.

[Quad]

Those, who say that Kubica should leave WRC and that Robert is not a WRC material, :
1. Have never driven a car;
2. Whatch only champinship standings instead of real action;
3. Are head of manufacturer team;
4. Are Prokop fans;
5. Have no soul.

Well , if not punctures yesterday he would have finished 2nd here. Seriously I watched onboards, he did not hit anything, the rim just cracked itself

[rallyace]

Well , if not punctures yesterday he would have finished 2nd here. Seriously I watched onboards, he did not hit anything, the rim just cracked itself

Maybe Ogier's fingerprints are all over that rim...? :p

http://i1124.photobucket.com/albums/l561/TheBoxBreaker/Kubica%20amp%20Ogier%20TDC_zpss2xqlxxw.png (http://s1124.photobucket.com/user/TheBoxBreaker/media/Kubica%20amp%20Ogier%20TDC_zpss2xqlxxw.png.html)

[dimviii]

That surprised me too but maybe Lappi was driving for the championship points.

so when driving for championship points a privateer can be faster than a works driver?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQeE4oxWUAA7Siy.png

[dimviii]

i quote this from Catalunya topic.Watch the points Latvala collects at 2nd half of the year,when everything is lost for him about championship.
exactly the sameas last years.This guy really needs to work his mendality.


WRC 2015 standings after Corsica (driver, manufacturers, stages winners) http://planetemarcus.com/saison-wrc/

[dimviii]

so when driving for championship points a privateer can be faster than a works driver?


Lappis interview

"Good points, which is fine, but I was fighting for the victory, which would be better for the championship. I was too slow. I have to admit that. Maurin was too fast for us. Happy to be here at the end. I have to be satisfied."

[EightGear]

Well at least Lappi didn't crash on tarmac this time.

[AL14]

i quote this from Catalunya topic.Watch the points Latvala collects at 2nd half of the year,when everything is lost for him about championship.
exactly the sameas last years.This guy really needs to work his mendality.

He's doing it since the end of 2013 with the mental expert. I have to admit I saw him more mature this year since Finland, he pushed when he could and should but did'nt do anything too much crazy when he was behind and in those cases settled for some honest second places. Afterall when Ogier is in his days no one can't do anything to beat him. Better let him win, take valuable points and attack in the next rally.

Here he was slower than Ogier, no one can deny it but for once in his life he has been more clever, taking SS3 carefully and avoiding punctures or problems. I'm curious to see the points of Latvala and Ogier from Finland to Galles.

[stefanvv]

i quote this from Catalunya topic.Watch the points Latvala collects at 2nd half of the year,when everything is lost for him about championship.
exactly the sameas last years.This guy really needs to work his mendality.

Tougher rallies at 1st half?!?

[maciotacio]

RK reaction after reading some posts here.
http://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/2615/1484/original.jpg

[dimviii]

He's doing it since the end of 2013 with the mental expert.

yes thats well known,but i dont see results.

[dimviii]

Tougher rallies at 1st half?!?

i dont think so.


borl video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOO18z02RD4

[AL14]

yes thats well known,but i dont see results.

Yes not too much different than previously. But as I said before I've seen some improvement since Finland. Let's see if it is something that will endure (don't know if this is the right word, hope you'll understand what I mean :) )

[dimviii]

Yes not too much different than previously. But as I said before I've seen some improvement since Finland. Let's see if it is something that will endure (don't know if this is the right word, hope you'll understand what I mean :) )

yes i understand,but every year after Finland his pace is good.Every year at 2nd half he dont crash,every year at 2nd half he settle for second if he sees that he can t much Ogier.
So nothing new if he keeps this good pace for the remaining rallies.
The problem is the 1st half of rallies.Thats what the mental expert haven t manage,in conjuction with Latvala.

[AL14]

yes i understand,but every year after Finland his pace is good.Every year at 2nd half he dont crash,every year at 2nd half he settle for second if he sees that he can t much Ogier.
So nothing new if he keeps this good pace for the remaining rallies.
The problem is the 1st half of rallies.Thats what the mental expert haven t manage,in conjuction with Latvala.

Agree the mental expert didn't manage to accomplish his mission but not that he is that better in the second part. This is valid for this season but if you compare points form first to second parts in other years you will not see too much difference. I also think his problems are not only in the mental side.

[N.O.T]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.

[tommeke_B]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.
I'm happy to have seen all these Finnish "failures" in WRC... In your opinion, who is the better alternative for Latvala?

[jacko]

Have some people on here never watched a rally before? You don't decide your end result by adding together what position you were in on each stage.

After all the stages the stopwatch had Elfyn in second - so, in a rally where everyone had equal conditions, how does he not deserve to finish second?

I want him to do well but I'm not some blinkered Evans apologist. I don't think he's impressed much at all during his WRC career and I have been critical of him - but I'll say what I said the other day - let's give credit where it's due.

You can't start adding on stages that didn't exist and you can't predict what would happen in them and brand that as 'fact'. There's no reason why Evans couldn't have put time into, or at least matched Latvala, in those horrendous conditions on Friday. But those stages never ran so we have what we have.

Adult reaction about his perfomance!

[jacko]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.

Another example of stupid comments by NOT. Even if he's right (he won't be a champ), Latvala is still the best next thing after Ogier.
And why such a comment after a fair win... NOT is boring in his comments and he knows it, that's why he screams louder and louder but without any good points, it's becoming more and more pathetic...

[RS]

Lappis interview

"Good points, which is fine, but I was fighting for the victory, which would be better for the championship. I was too slow. I have to admit that. Maurin was too fast for us. Happy to be here at the end. I have to be satisfied."

Surprised, but at least he didn't crash.

[janvanvurpa]

Have some people on here never watched a rally before? You don't decide your end result by adding together what position you were in on each stage.

After all the stages the stopwatch had Elfyn in second - so, in a rally where everyone had equal conditions, how does he not deserve to finish second?

I want him to do well but I'm not some blinkered Evans apologist. I don't think he's impressed much at all during his WRC career and I have been critical of him - but I'll say what I said the other day - let's give credit where it's due.

You can't start adding on stages that didn't exist and you can't predict what would happen in them and brand that as 'fact'. There's no reason why Evans couldn't have put time into, or at least matched Latvala, in those horrendous conditions on Friday. But those stages never ran so we have what we have.

Yeah.. I always say I don't have a big imagination so I have a hard time understanding when people say " Häcki Hälarna deserved this 3rd place!“ and the pitiful pools of piss who chose one driver and pour their shit from their mouth endlessly "he doesn't belong in WRC"

Everybody gets exactly what they earned.

Amazingly simple.


I always said about any competition "Don't worry, the results will take care of everything"
Doesn't matter who somebody is, doesn't matter the car--if its the best WRC car or a clubbie Clio----the results will take care of everything"

It is a RALLY after all..and that means it is fundamentally a different intention than any other type of car competition...to rally means to get together, to concentrate what is presumed is a lot of individuals/crews..

By these golem's "logic" if Kubica doesn't "deserve" or "belong in WRC" then why don't these whiner people complain and demand every driver behind Kubica on any SS drop out, and enter a monastery. because if he doesn't "belong in" then anybody behind him doesn't either..


But that is granting them the ability to think, and a familiarity with rudimentary logic, something they do NOT have.


Such a shame the format was so damaged by the SS losses..

I saw some link to older---1980s Tour de Corse---1100+ km SS.
That was a rally!

[COD]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.

I hardly ever agree with NOT, but this time I have to. The great manager has not produced since Tommi Mäkinen. What he has achieved, is to block other finnish talents route to WRC.

[AL14]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

http://jp7.r0tt.com/l_751f6260-dcb5-11e1-a456-293d9ea00007.jpg

[stefanvv]

Have some people on here never watched a rally before? You don't decide your end result by adding together what position you were in on each stage.

After all the stages the stopwatch had Elfyn in second - so, in a rally where everyone had equal conditions, how does he not deserve to finish second?

I want him to do well but I'm not some blinkered Evans apologist. I don't think he's impressed much at all during his WRC career and I have been critical of him - but I'll say what I said the other day - let's give credit where it's due.

You can't start adding on stages that didn't exist and you can't predict what would happen in them and brand that as 'fact'. There's no reason why Evans couldn't have put time into, or at least matched Latvala, in those horrendous conditions on Friday. But those stages never ran so we have what we have.

Completely agree with You. I'm not that over-hyped by his performance here either, but I have to admit that he achieved a lot on friday in these difficult conditions, something VW drivers just survived. That counts for something in my book. However he has lot of work to do more....

[macebig]

Can those cheaters and scammers quit soon enough?Bring us real rallying please...

[Quad]

What is happening with Kubica's car is total mystery for me and it seems for him too
He revealed he bought NEW engine from this rally, and it is already breaking down after 200km of driving....:confused:

[danon]

https://scontent-ams2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t31.0-8/12094822_10153717179859973_8764355461542355847_o.j pg

[rallyace]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.


I hardly ever agree with NOT, but this time I have to. The great manager has not produced since Tommi Mäkinen. What he has achieved, is to block other finnish talents route to WRC.

First of all, Jari-Matti Latvala is the best Finnish driver available to the WRC. Esapekka Lappi (as well as a few others in WRC2 or JWRC) aren't mature enough to earn a full-time seat with any of the current manufacturers. So who should replace him when there's no one to do so?

Being the world's second best driver and still being labeled a "loser" is astounding. If we were to apply such flawed (and much too simplified) logic to the rest of the WRC field, they are all losers. Surely, according to this logic, they must be, because Latvala is (and has been for a long time) second in the standings. Using this flawed logic, every rally is "Ogier vs. all the losers". What an appealing way to view the pinnacle of our beloved sport...

No one is "blocking" Finnish drivers from entering the WRC because of Latvala's presence herein. It might have quite the opposite effect, even; Latvala's presence is a boost to the remainder of the Finnish field. An example: If you were Capito, Matton, Wilson or Nandan, how much faith would you have in Finnish drivers in general if there wasn't even a Finnish driver in the Championship to begin with?

The following shouldn't be earth-shattering, revolutionary news, but I fear it might be: There's more to being a "winner" or a "loser" than mere stats and figures. Yes, Ogier is at the top of the standings. He's been there for a long time and he'll continue to be there for a long time. But mixed in with his plain arrogance, unsportsmanlike attitude and lack of maturity, is he really a winner? Or is he at least more a winner than the is a bad loser?

Then there's Jari-Matti, arguably the most professional and 'rally-minded' of all drivers in the WRC. He discussed tyre strategy with Hayden Paddon at Rally Sardegna when the talented but in-experienced Kiwi was running ahead of the field. He's the first to congratulate his teammates when they beat him. He'll always take time to answer any post-stage questions and sign autographs and he'll be polite, articulate and ooze rallying passion. He'll even enter Historic Rallies such as the ones of Finland and Estonia despite these not having a huge following - but he does it for the passion of the sport.

He's the type of driver every child with a passion for rallying should look up to and want to emulate, not only because of how he is on the special stages, but (perhaps more importantly) how he is outside of them.

As I mentioned, there's more to being a winner than the points total next to your name. And therefore it wouldn't be erroneous to consider Jari-Matti the biggest winner in the WRC.

[stefanvv]

There isn't French rising star either at the moment. Loeb & Ogier are phenomenon, but they have their time. Empty anti-Finns words, don't bother.

"O tempora o mores"

[N.O.T]

the battle for the first non-VW driver in the standings is really tight now.

[Robbo]

Rally ace. Great post. Jari-Matti just oozes passion for the sport. Take that over results. A person I would enjoy a meal with, can't say I have the same feeling for Sebastian.

[AL14]

Rally ace. Great post. Jari-Matti just oozes passion for the sport. Take that over results. A person I would enjoy a meal with, can't say I have the same feeling for Sebastian.

And he is also an example for never giving up, even when you have to face the best of the best and even after so many big disappontments that I'm sure would have hit very hard many other drivers. But he is still there and still believe in himself.

[Atob WRC]

Sure that our video from the 2003 edition, will be lovely to be reviewed.

Here I post our video! Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqgaCZlzE-Q

[COD]

Latvala and Hirvonen both got to the level they did, only because of time and miles in the car, not talent. Latvala has been in WRC car for over 10 years now, and still lacks consistancy. He has done lots of testing and many many rallies. If he cant win championship now, its never.

And about blocking talent, I didn't mean Latvala is doing that. His manager has done that to all but his drivers. Just failed to do that to Grönholm, but nearly manged that as well

[Toyoda]

Latvala and Hirvonen both got to the level they did, only because of time and miles in the car, not talent. Latvala has been in WRC car for over 10 years now, and still lacks consistancy. He has done lots of testing and many many rallies. If he cant win championship now, its never.

And about blocking talent, I didn't mean Latvala is doing that. His manager has done that to all but his drivers. Just failed to do that to Grönholm, but nearly manged that as well

What utta bollocks

Latvala is hugely talented and is clearly out front of the pack with the exception of the freakeshly fast and ice cool Ogier.

[Arnold Triyudho Wardono]

Latvala is just natural born loser... he can win events but not championships.

another failed project like Hirvonen brought to you by none other than the finish manager system.. producing failures since 2003.. ask your local manager for a brochure on our great services and products.
At least Mikko was the only driver who's able to forcing Seb. L to fighting down to the wire twice. :p

[dimviii]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDa7ISYFWYs

[danon]

^ Now I see why Abbring went off.

[AL14]

Kubica planning to leave WRC or to mix circuit with Rally next year. He's now seriously thinking to go "where I have more credit in the motorsport: circuit racing."

He says other things I didn't understand. Maybe some polish guy can help.

http://eurosport.onet.pl/motorowe/rajdy-samochodowe/robert-kubica-brakuje-mi-tu-czegos-co-ma-tor/mhgxvd

[dimviii]

^ Now I see why Abbring went off.

yes i noticed that too...

http://forum-rallye.com/uploads/monthly_10_2015/post-172-0-33218100-1443994802.jpg

[Mariusz]

Kubica planning to leave WRC or to mix circuit with Rally next year. He's now seriously thinking to go "where I have more credit in the motorsport: circuit racing."

He says other things I didn't understand. Maybe some polish guy can help.

http://eurosport.onet.pl/motorowe/rajdy-samochodowe/robert-kubica-brakuje-mi-tu-czegos-co-ma-tor/mhgxvd
Is Robert Kubica's patience running out? After the Rally of Corsica Polish driver admitted that he is seriously considering a return to racetracks. He stressed, however, that he did not have enough of rallies.
- If we want to rally at high level, everything has to be at high level - Kubica says when I ask about plans for the 2016 season. He is not bored with rallying, but currently they are more a source of frustration than satisfaction. - Today there is no possibility for us to fight for top positions - adds Polish WRC competitor.

Robert admits that he is seriously considering splitting time between racing in selected rallies and races. - Today this is the most feasible plan. I think I will go back to a place where I have a big credit which is professional track racing - admits Kubica.

Are you tired of the WRC? On that question Robert responds firmly. - No. I really like rallies, but I miss something that track has. So far, in rallies and especially in their current form, I'm not getting this. The full interview about next year plans of Robert Kubica in Monday's "Sport Review".

[Mirek]

I can see that Tidemand managed to have two accidents and a puncture on seven stages. Quite an event to forget...

[bowler]

First of all, Jari-Matti Latvala is the best Finnish driver available to the WRC. Esapekka Lappi (as well as a few others in WRC2 or JWRC) aren't mature enough to earn a full-time seat with any of the current manufacturers. So who should replace him when there's no one to do so?

Being the world's second best driver and still being labeled a "loser" is astounding. If we were to apply such flawed (and much too simplified) logic to the rest of the WRC field, they are all losers. Surely, according to this logic, they must be, because Latvala is (and has been for a long time) second in the standings. Using this flawed logic, every rally is "Ogier vs. all the losers". What an appealing way to view the pinnacle of our beloved sport...

No one is "blocking" Finnish drivers from entering the WRC because of Latvala's presence herein. It might have quite the opposite effect, even; Latvala's presence is a boost to the remainder of the Finnish field. An example: If you were Capito, Matton, Wilson or Nandan, how much faith would you have in Finnish drivers in general if there wasn't even a Finnish driver in the Championship to begin with?

The following shouldn't be earth-shattering, revolutionary news, but I fear it might be: There's more to being a "winner" or a "loser" than mere stats and figures. Yes, Ogier is at the top of the standings. He's been there for a long time and he'll continue to be there for a long time. But mixed in with his plain arrogance, unsportsmanlike attitude and lack of maturity, is he really a winner? Or is he at least more a winner than the is a bad loser?

Then there's Jari-Matti, arguably the most professional and 'rally-minded' of all drivers in the WRC. He discussed tyre strategy with Hayden Paddon at Rally Sardegna when the talented but in-experienced Kiwi was running ahead of the field. He's the first to congratulate his teammates when they beat him. He'll always take time to answer any post-stage questions and sign autographs and he'll be polite, articulate and ooze rallying passion. He'll even enter Historic Rallies such as the ones of Finland and Estonia despite these not having a huge following - but he does it for the passion of the sport.

He's the type of driver every child with a passion for rallying should look up to and want to emulate, not only because of how he is on the special stages, but (perhaps more importantly) how he is outside of them.

As I mentioned, there's more to being a winner than the points total next to your name. And therefore it wouldn't be erroneous to consider Jari-Matti the biggest winner in the WRC.

I agree. It is very easy to criticise, Very hard to build and grow as J-M has.

[itix]

Couldn't agree more. Why not Mike Chen or Colin Clark? I also love every time Craig Breen or Luis Moya are colour commentators; and it puts a big smile on my face every time I hear Breen correct Desborough's "facts". :rolleyes:

Can't they draft in Nicky Grist? I love hearing him talk and I think he has a passion for the sport that is difficult to match. Absolutely no one likes Desborough.


Have some people on here never watched a rally before? You don't decide your end result by adding together what position you were in on each stage.

After all the stages the stopwatch had Elfyn in second - so, in a rally where everyone had equal conditions, how does he not deserve to finish second?

I want him to do well but I'm not some blinkered Evans apologist. I don't think he's impressed much at all during his WRC career and I have been critical of him - but I'll say what I said the other day - let's give credit where it's due.

You can't start adding on stages that didn't exist and you can't predict what would happen in them and brand that as 'fact'. There's no reason why Evans couldn't have put time into, or at least matched Latvala, in those horrendous conditions on Friday. But those stages never ran so we have what we have.

I'm ususally also very critial of Evans, but this for me a pretty impressive performance. Couldn't have said it better myself. I'd still sack him if I was Wilson though. He only ever excels on tarmac and not even always there does he do a good enough job.


I can see that Tidemand managed to have two accidents and a puncture on seven stages. Quite an event to forget...

For sure... he even said so himself on his FB page.
https://www.facebook.com/PontusTidemand/posts/1164348846913196:0

[Rallyper]

I can see that Tidemand managed to have two accidents and a puncture on seven stages. Quite an event to forget...

For sure he´ll forget this one. Let´s hope we do to.

[jacko]

And about blocking talent, I didn't mean Latvala is doing that. His manager has done that to all but his drivers. Just failed to do that to Grönholm, but nearly manged that as well

What a totally crap you are talking about. It's on the same level as NOT and that's not a compliment.
You really think there's a godfather in Finland who's in charge who becomes a factory-driver?
I think the manufacturers are in charge and they pick up what they think it's best for the team. In the case of Latvala and even Hivonen they promised a very good curve on performances in the beginning of there career but in the end both meet a even better driver(s) to compete against. On the other hand i saw no better options the last few years, especially for Hirvonen because in the end he's still a good team-driver and good for many podiums. And Latvala is the best next driver after Ogier and yes with more than 10 years experience but if you don't judge that as talented you really don't know what you're talking about.
And sometimes it's possible the most talented driver isn't choosen, but in the end maybe even in Africa there's a driver living who can be better and faster than Ogier. In the end we never know, only can judge afterwards. And that's so easy...

[jacko]

_--_

[jacko]

Sure that our video from the 2003 edition, will be lovely to be reviewed.

Here I post our video! Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqgaCZlzE-Q

Thnx mate!

[liposh]

Guys, can you please stop arguing about Latvala, Kubica and Neuville? I would like to find useful info in this thread and it is one useful post in 5 pages full of crap.

Somebody please confirm me this: In WRC2 there are 6 best results from FIRST 7 rallies counted. There is no registration for rounds you want to score points to WRC2 but if you compete in eighth round you are not allowed to score points neither "stole" points from other competitors. Is it right? It would be Lappi´s case in Wales. He will be like ghost there. He (probably) will be there but he won´t be in WRC2 results.

[b3637853]

What do you guys think about Lefebvre performance? Because I don't understand the Citroen's hype about this guy. In Corsica he managed to set just one top10 time. Obviously he's learning the new car but isn't tarmac suppose to be his surface? Now Citroen confirms him in WRC for Catalunya so the must really belevie in him.

[Simmi]

What do you guys think about Lefebvre performance? Because I don't understand the Citroen's hype about this guy. In Corsica he managed to set just one top10 time. Obviously he's learning the new car but isn't tarmac suppose to be his surface? Now Citroen confirms him in WRC for Catalunya so the must really belevie in him.

I've said before he's not really impressed me. He's shown he can bring the car home, but with very few flashes of pace so far. I'm not sure what Matton is telling him to do each rally but I hope in Spain he will push more. Yves said in a WRC interview on Friday that Stephane was doing Catalunya with the help of his personal sponsors. So I guess Red Bull are helping to pay for this one? I did wonder whether we would see Al-Qassimi in Spain as it is normally on his programme.


BTW I am also interested in the answer to liposh's WRC2 points question. But I will ask it a little more nicely ;)

[PLuto]

Guys, can you please stop arguing about Latvala, Kubica and Neuville? I would like to find useful info in this thread and it is one useful post in 5 pages full of crap.

Somebody please confirm me this: In WRC2 there are 6 best results from FIRST 7 rallies counted. There is no registration for rounds you want to score points to WRC2 but if you compete in eighth round you are not allowed to score points neither "stole" points from other competitors. Is it right? It would be Lappi´s case in Wales. He will be like ghost there. He (probably) will be there but he won´t be in WRC2 results.

Yes, it is like you are writing. There are counted 6 best results from first 7 rallies, where you noticed on entry form, that you are part of WRC2. Example for this is Protasov - he was doing also some rallies with R5 car, but out of WRC2 classification as he noticed it on entry form.

[WUff1]

What do you guys think about Lefebvre performance? Because I don't understand the Citroen's hype about this guy. In Corsica he managed to set just one top10 time. Obviously he's learning the new car but isn't tarmac suppose to be his surface? Now Citroen confirms him in WRC for Catalunya so the must really belevie in him.

Well, he´s French and he´s Loeb´s kid. That´s why Citroen is favouring him. I´m not impressed by his performance, too.

[vino_93]

What do you guys think about Lefebvre performance? Because I don't understand the Citroen's hype about this guy. In Corsica he managed to set just one top10 time. Obviously he's learning the new car but isn't tarmac suppose to be his surface? Now Citroen confirms him in WRC for Catalunya so the must really belevie in him.

Lefevbre is a mistery for me. He was really impressive when he was driving 2WD, in France but in WRC / ERC too. But at the end of his last 2WD season, it seemed he lost something ... and then with 4WD, I never see him being really good. Except maybe Monte Carlo ...

I just think Citroën is pushing him not to do the same mistake they did with Ogier. They know it will be difficult to have him back ... so they need to find another great talent. And they want to be sure that Lefebvre is - or not - this one.
But we can't blame a manufacturer to give opportunities to young driver. We missed it during the late 00's.

[RS]

I don't know why anyone is expecting a lot from Lefebvre yet. He hardly has much 4wd experience let alone in a WRCar.

[vino_93]

When Corsica came back to WRC, I wasn't happy. I think other countries need rounds - but ok, FIA decided to go to 14 rallies.

And to be honest ... I find this Tour de Corse interesting. I mean, only long stages, that's driving. That's something different from other WRC rounds, a we need different events.

Of course, organizers need to learn from this year. That's not possible to see so many km cancelled. They should find a way to have a 2nd plan if it's not possible to do the stage. Maybe just doing a second time the last stage, by keeping the possibility to block the road longer than planned.

They need too to increase the global distance of the rally close to 400 km (or even more if FIA allows it), or to do the race on two days / two and half (half would be some night stages) days, to have longer days.

I hope they will learn ... because there's place in WRC for such kind of round, with loooong stages. Moreover here, where's the road are challenging, and there's so much corners and change of rythm.

[Simmi]

Interesting to see here the reason why Bertelli did not do the last stage. It wasn't a mechanical issue - he actually withdrew from the event in protest over the power stage road order.

https://twitter.com/fuckmatie37/status/651033706480697344?lang=en

Looking at it I don't think he was actually going to get on TV - it was just the fact he was swept aside for so-called higher profile entrants. I'd be miffed too, especially given they've paid their manufacturer entry fee. Maybe withdrawing from the rally is a bit extreme but they do have a point that the whole thing was a mess.

[GigiGalliNo1]

I do side with what happened and think the Promoters aren't doing a good job for any lower profile driver but at the end of the day would Bertelli have scored any points? Could be both, truthfully pull out of the rally because of promoter issue but also save the car for another rally.

[N.O.T]

did he call his mamma this time ??

[makinen_fan]

They have ran the Power stage with 3min gaps and there was not enough time to show all drivers, and they missed Kubica who eventually managed 2nd. They usually do it to fill the 1 hour slot, but I do not understand their choice this weekend.
I also share the opinion that Jon Desborough is a useless commentator.

[jacko]

When Corsica came back to WRC, I wasn't happy. I think other countries need rounds - but ok, FIA decided to go to 14 rallies.

And to be honest ... I find this Tour de Corse interesting. I mean, only long stages, that's driving. That's something different from other WRC rounds, a we need different events.

Of course, organizers need to learn from this year. That's not possible to see so many km cancelled. They should find a way to have a 2nd plan if it's not possible to do the stage. Maybe just doing a second time the last stage, by keeping the possibility to block the road longer than planned.

They need too to increase the global distance of the rally close to 400 km (or even more if FIA allows it), or to do the race on two days / two and half (half would be some night stages) days, to have longer days.

I hope they will learn ... because there's place in WRC for such kind of round, with loooong stages. Moreover here, where's the road are challenging, and there's so much corners and change of rythm.

Agree for the full 100%, Corsica and his long interesting stages is a welcome event in the WRC-calendar.

[makinen_fan]

I am not sure if this was shared here.

Tour of Corsica under fire after tough WRC return last weekend:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121161

[lewalcindor]

I am not sure if this was shared here.

Tour of Corsica under fire after tough WRC return last weekend:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121161

Ogier actually sounds reasonable here.

[Simmi]

I am not sure if this was shared here.

Tour of Corsica under fire after tough WRC return last weekend:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121161

We can all talk in hope about returning to the glory days of endurance events, but when teams start complaining about staying in different hotels then it shows you what we are up against.

I think everything about this event was a bit last-minute. I'm certainly glad I didn't travel over for it. It's definitely one I want to do in the future and I think with more planning it should hopefully be possible for it to improve a lot. Reports about the return only being six months away are slightly concerning as the organisers certainly seem like they could benefit from more time to get things in place.

[AL14]

Ogier actually sounds reasonable here.

Apart from the fact the people weren't there because of the format not because it is in an island. I was planning to go there but when I knew I could see only one pass I didn't.

Sardinia is an island and it is full of people.

[Simmi]

Apart from the fact the people weren't there because of the format not because it is in an island. I was planning to go there but when I knew I could see only one pass I didn't.

Sardinia is an island and it is full of people.

I think island access is certainly an issue. Let's not kid ourselves. Corsica isn't the easiest place to get to. The proximity of Alsace to so much of Europe means there are infinitely more possibilities for people to get there.. For instance if you go to Corsica, or even Sardinia, realistically you need to book accommodation. That is something a real rally fan is happy to do but for the casual fan there are no day trips. From what I've heard about Sardinia the spectator numbers are not that great?

[Franky]

Sardinia is an island and it is full of people.

Think Matton's last comment about comparison is true.

The event in Sardinia wasn't as popular as it is now, over a decade later. ;)

[AL14]

Yes actually you're not wrong Simmi. Also, Sardinia has 1.6 millions people while Corsica only 200.000 or 300.000. So it is easier to find the "casual" fan you talk about.
But regarding Matton's statement we have to say we're not going to Corsica for the first time, it has been a WRC event until 2008 and ERC french round was there until last year.
So ok, island access is an issue in Corsica but for sure with a different format we would have had more spectators.

[tommeke_B]

Well, I don't know what rally Matton has seen in 2010 but the crowds were huge already... Sardinia has earned it's place by being a very easy event for spectators to follow, the event attracts more international spectators every year. The region has a lot of accomodation facilities but they fill up faster and faster every year. Next year Sardinia should be on my personal calendar for the 6th time already. :) I don't see Corsica as a spectator-friendly event and doubt many people will travel from other countries to visit it... The stages already aren't very accessible and aren't really nice to watch (very few places with some overview, many corners but very few ones that stand out in terms of spectacle). On top of that they have the worst timing of the season... Also, for the calendar... Geographically doesn't Corsica have the same "problem" as Alsace had? That it's too close to other events ( Sardinia just South of it, Monte Carlo just North-West of it)...

[bluuford]

Well.. I thought it was big mistake to bring back Corsica to WRC. I like to visit this Island and I was considering going there during the rally.. I deleted my idea because it was extremely expensive! Planetickets, accomodation, everything It is a bit cheaper to go there by ferry but it takes time. World Championship should not take place in such a minor location. The only interesting enttrtainment from this rally was weather. Such things do not happen in Europe often and I got a lot of interesting experience with weather models and their peromance in extreme conditions. I thought that both stages (2 and 3 ) will be cancelled but somehow they were still able to run SS3 with one hour delay.. I can imagine the effor they did to run this stage.

[rayh_mx]

did he call his mamma this time ??

This time, his mum call him and said let the big boys play

[Mintexmemory]

No comparison between Sarde and Corse - This year in Sardinia was one of the best rallies for spectating ever. great stages and great accommodation. Perfect time of year and great route layout. 2017 again for me (3rd time) - Flights into Alghero were full all rally week, all you need to know!!

[RS]

Yes, it is like you are writing. There are counted 6 best results from first 7 rallies, where you noticed on entry form, that you are part of WRC2. Example for this is Protasov - he was doing also some rallies with R5 car, but out of WRC2 classification as he noticed it on entry form.

So it should be a straight fight between Lappi and Al-Attiyah in Spain?

[makinen_fan]

So it should be a straight fight between Lappi and Al-Attiyah in Spain?

Protasov also has a chance. He only registered for 5 events so far, Lappi and Nasser for 6

[Simmi]

So it should be a straight fight between Lappi and Al-Attiyah in Spain?

My maths is not great, but I think in theory there are some guys who still have two more chances to score points.

I would assume Protasov, Al-Kuwari, Ketomaa and Tidemand will all enter the final two rounds. Good scores from them should take it down to the wire, even if a few of them are outside shots.

http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc-2/results/championship/drivers/page/537-256---.html

[pantealex]

Protasov also has a chance. He only registered for 5 events so far, Lappi and Nasser for 6

Nasser 97p (6 races so far)
Lappi 88p -9 to Nasser (6)
Protasov 80p -17 (5)
Al-Kuwari 72p -25 (5)
Ketomaa 67p -30 (5)
Tidemand 61p -36 (5)

others have no change.

Nasser, Lappi and Protasov are the onlyones who can win it in Spain, if cap behind is over 25p after that! (cap to Nasser/Lappi does not matter)

[Mirek]

Let's see how much Kopecký can help Lappi for bigger point difference to Nasser.

[Simmi]

Let's see how much Kopecký can help Lappi for bigger point difference to Nasser.

Okay cool so I assume we can expect:
Spain - Kopecky/Tidemand
Wales - Lappi/Tidemand

[liposh]

Both Lappi and Tidemand confirmed they will be in Spain...but for sure there is possibility Lappi can compete out of classification (as Pluto said here above) But anyway Kopecky won´t be in Spain (which is idiotic, I know) IMHO Kopecky won´t be also in Wales.

[PLuto]

Pre-season plans counted with Kopecky on Catalunya.

[Mirek]

Both Lappi and Tidemand confirmed they will be in Spain...but for sure there is possibility Lappi can compete out of classification (as Pluto said here above) But anyway Kopecky won´t be in Spain (which is idiotic, I know) IMHO Kopecky won´t be also in Wales.

Why do you think he will not be there?

[liposh]

OK, it is premature to say Kopecky won´t be there but I really doubt about his start because of these reasons: I think Skoda will not use 3 cars on Rally Catalunya (it was great time to use them during Tour de Corse but they didn´t do it) I would use 3 cars in Spain, You would, Pluto would, but people from Skoda don´t think like us.


EDIT: At least it is passable which is great because Pontus has made his own WRC2 registration before Rally Sweden, so Skoda CAN use three cars all eligible to score points

[AL14]

If I understood well, I think it will be very very difficult for Lappi to be the WRC2 winner this year. He has 9 points gap to Nasser that means he cannot relies on himself winning his remaining round. Al Attyah will likely choose Wales as his last round, as Spain asphalt is not his favourite surface, and it will be enough a second place to be ahaed of Esapekka.
Protasov and even Ketomaa have more chances than Lappi at the moment, if one of them will win Spain then it will be enough for them to stay ahaed of Nasser in Wales.
Nice situation :)

[Mirek]

Yes, Lappi has wasted too many points by crashing. I still believe that if Kopecký did the whole championship he would take the title instead simply because he is able to finish every round on the podium.

[AL14]

Yes he could have been a serious contender for sure.
At the end I put my money on Nasser, which is a bit sad because it shows the level of the field but ok, let's be positive, crashes happen, especially if you are 23/24 years old and AlAttiyah is a good driver himself.

[EightGear]

Before the start of the WRC2 season I was really excited by the field, but in the end guys like Al-Attiyah, Protasov and Al-Kuwari (read: guys with $€€€€$$) end up on top. I guess it's down to their opportunity to go to places like Argentina and Australia, combined with an RRC car.

Personally I was hoping guys like Breen, Grondal (what happened to him!?), Parn, Lefebvre, Camilli, etc. would be capable of better results.

[Simmi]

In rounds where they both competed against each other Al-Attiyah has 47 points against 45 for Lappi.

So Nasser has done his part so far in that sense. Okay having the ability to target the long-haul events like Australia/Mexico etc will help with points - but you still have to finish. Lappi has scored the bulk of his points against stronger opposition but that is the nature of WRC2.

It will still be interesting to watch. I just wish they would hurry up and release the entry list for Spain.

[liposh]

I think Lappi´s ratio speed : crashes is good enough for 24year old. In fact he didn´t crash during this year. In Sardegna he fixed it and in Germany it was just parking at wrong place without damage :D I am quite happy, because his head is improving day by day. ...And Al Attiyah is good enough, wealthy and most of all CLEVER guy. So as Roman Kresta says very often : "It is like that. That´s life" :)

[Mirek]

It's now clear that all three Škoda drivers do Catalunya as part of WRC2. Nasser as well.

[manthey]

OK, it is premature to say Kopecky won´t be there but I really doubt about his start because of these reasons: I think Skoda will not use 3 cars on Rally Catalunya (it was great time to use them during Tour de Corse but they didn´t do it) I would use 3 cars in Spain, You would, Pluto would, but people from Skoda don´t think like us.


EDIT: At least it is passable which is great because Pontus has made his own WRC2 registration before Rally Sweden, so Skoda CAN use three cars all eligible to score points

sorry I didn't get the point and I don't know the wrc2's rules deeply, skoda could enter 3 cars but two of them are for works team (kopecky + lappi) and tiedeman would run only making points for himself? thanks

[RS]

Yes, Lappi has wasted too many points by crashing. I still believe that if Kopecký did the whole championship he would take the title instead simply because he is able to finish every round on the podium.

I agree.

Al-Attiyah would be a worthy champion too but i agree with others that WRC2 didn't quite turn out as good as the entry list looked at the beginning of the year. Maybe it would be better if not all rounds of WRC were WRC2 rounds, in order to concentrate the entry lists.

[WUff1]

I think Lappi and Tidemand in Skoda main team scoring WRC2 and Kopecky in Skoda 2 team?

[dimviii]

Solans with Gigi Galli style at hairpin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jylhzBaCzRQ&feature=youtu.be

[COD]

What a totally crap you are talking about. It's on the same level as NOT and that's not a compliment.
You really think there's a godfather in Finland who's in charge who becomes a factory-driver?
I think the manufacturers are in charge and they pick up what they think it's best for the team. In the case of Latvala and even Hivonen they promised a very good curve on performances in the beginning of there career but in the end both meet a even better driver(s) to compete against. On the other hand i saw no better options the last few years, especially for Hirvonen because in the end he's still a good team-driver and good for many podiums. And Latvala is the best next driver after Ogier and yes with more than 10 years experience but if you don't judge that as talented you really don't know what you're talking about.
And sometimes it's possible the most talented driver isn't choosen, but in the end maybe even in Africa there's a driver living who can be better and faster than Ogier. In the end we never know, only can judge afterwards. And that's so easy...

Say what you want, but I think my knowledge of Finnish rally seen is a bit better than yours...

[thuGG]

Kubica PS onboard (low quality):
https://www.facebook.com/kubicaonboard/videos/vb.1477655719172261/1629648440639654/?type=2&theater

[itix]

I think island access is certainly an issue. Let's not kid ourselves. Corsica isn't the easiest place to get to. The proximity of Alsace to so much of Europe means there are infinitely more possibilities for people to get there.. For instance if you go to Corsica, or even Sardinia, realistically you need to book accommodation. That is something a real rally fan is happy to do but for the casual fan there are no day trips. From what I've heard about Sardinia the spectator numbers are not that great?

If we are only going to rally in densely populated places that are easy to get to, all the rounds of the WRC should be held in NL or Belgium from now on.

The thing is, the roads and backdrop in corsica are loveley, and MC is not exactly an easy place to get to. Last year when I went to the stages from Northern italy I had to dodge collapsed road sides, flash floods on the narrow winding roads and there were long queues of cars. It was still lovely though but not exactly easy to get to.

I think corsica provides an unique challenge and the WRC is short of those :(

[janvanvurpa]

If we are only going to rally in densely populated places that are easy to get to, all the rounds of the WRC should be held in NL or Belgium from now on.

The thing is, the roads and backdrop in corsica are loveley, and MC is not exactly an easy place to get to. Last year when I went to the stages from Northern italy I had to dodge collapsed road sides, flash floods on the narrow winding roads and there were long queues of cars. It was still lovely though but not exactly easy to get to.

I think corsica provides an unique challenge and the WRC is short of those :(

Ok I vote België then rather than Nederland.... better beer, fritjes, Vlaamse is easier than that damn Randstad Hollandse, it's the land of my forefathers and if you take the time to look past the sometimes too many sweaters, more variety of friendly wimminz...

And how easy is it to get to Torsby i Varmland in middle of winter?
It's pure wilderness. They don't even speak Swedish there.:uhoh:

[AndyRAC]

If we are only going to rally in densely populated places that are easy to get to, all the rounds of the WRC should be held in NL or Belgium from now on.

The thing is, the roads and backdrop in corsica are loveley, and MC is not exactly an easy place to get to. Last year when I went to the stages from Northern italy I had to dodge collapsed road sides, flash floods on the narrow winding roads and there were long queues of cars. It was still lovely though but not exactly easy to get to.

I think corsica provides an unique challenge and the WRC is short of those :(

Excuses, excuses – they’re always complaining about something that is different. Service parks, hotels, islands, night stages, wind, rain, mud etc

Just what do they want? WorldRX??

If they want large crowds near large populations then most events have to go/ move. If they want important car markets then Finland/ Sweden, etc get dropped.

[itix]

Excuses, excuses – they’re always complaining about something that is different. Service parks, hotels, islands, night stages, wind, rain, mud etc

Just what do they want? WorldRX??

If they want large crowds near large populations then most events have to go/ move. If they want important car markets then Finland/ Sweden, etc get dropped.


Yeah and god forbid that happened. Both the WRC becoming RX and the two nations where rallying in it's modern format more or less was born being dropped. I also think this is excuses and BS.


Ok I vote België then rather than Nederland.... better beer, fritjes, Vlaamse is easier than that damn Randstad Hollandse, it's the land of my forefathers and if you take the time to look past the sometimes too many sweaters, more variety of friendly wimminz...

And how easy is it to get to Torsby i Varmland in middle of winter?
It's pure wilderness. They don't even speak Swedish there.:uhoh:

Nah, they speak Värmländska, which is charming as F :)
And Torsby is piss easy, we have the E45 running right next to it. The various stages are a bit more difficult, but only a bit. MC is much worse in my opinion!

[dimviii]

like this photo

http://forum-rallye.com/uploads/monthly_10_2015/post-105-0-77498200-1444207275.jpg

[Lundefaret]

like this photo

http://forum-rallye.com/uploads/monthly_10_2015/post-105-0-77498200-1444207275.jpg

Great! I didn't see the fire hydrant at first, but when I did it made my day! Thanks dimviii!

[makinen_fan]

A video of that tight hairpin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e99BJ4iSjlc&feature=youtu.be

[MK2 BDG]

So,,, any picture about ??

Had a good event,, Long stages were tough, both to note and drive, shame about the horrendous weather Thursday night

[dimviii]

A video of that tight hairpin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e99BJ4iSjlc&feature=youtu.be
unbelievable that there are so many drivers that can t take this hairpin....

[Simmi]

Definitely not a hairpin where you want to fail and then roll backwards... Yikes.

[sete]

my gallery from Corse
http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1398

[Lundefaret]

unbelievable that there are so many drivers that can t take this hairpin....

Its an EXTREMLY difficult hairpin.
- Its VERY narrow.
- Its steeply upwards, making it very difficult to judge the speed, because You need enough surplus of speed (energy) to get the back to come around when You pull the handbrake, but not so much speed that You over shoot.
- Its a big elevation change in the hairpin, at the apex.
- Its very high risk. Cock it up, You won't only loose time, but rolling backwards of that cliff edge will not be a fun experience.

So I have no problem understanding that several drivers have problems in this turn.

The important thing for these drivers, is to realize it, and go back home and practice it.
To practice this kind of hairpin, You can put cones up in an industrial area. A lot of places where there are wearhouses/storage buildings, where You have a truck ramp, there is often elevation changes that could replicate some of the difficulties in this turn, without the danger of rolling off a cliff edge if You dont succeed :)

Ogier: Dont make it all the way around, and uses the outside wall to crash the car in the right direction. This is actually probably one of the fastest ways to do the turn, and the only option when You miss in the entry as Ogier does, but off course with a very high risk.

Latvala is super smooth, and shows stunning car control. Both Ford guys are also very good trough this hairpin.

The Hyundai drivers uses the inner edge as a place to put the front wheel, so they can have the back end pivoting around it. Interesting, but risky in regards of punctures and suspension failures.

Extremly interesting corner that one could sit hours an analyze. But its friday evening, and my better half dont completely agree that thats the most romantic thing to do?!

[MK2 BDG]

Its was a bugger of a hairpin,, and at 14k into the stage, rear tyres well up to temp,,, I when the handbrake route :)

[Mirek]

Lundefaret, if You are interested there was very similar place on Barum rally this year. It was completely new and made a lot of problems to drivers. Many had to reverse and one even broke wheel. It's in this video, for example at 9:00 You can see Kopecký who took it probably fastest of all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=454&v=BWsrrF1SaIs

Funny thing is that there was a lot of criticism about the place from some drivers. Anyway the most common reply was something along "if drivers can't do such places it means there shall be more of them so that they can learn..."

[Lundefaret]

Lundefaret, if You are interested there was very similar place on Barum rally this year. It was completely new and made a lot of problems to drivers. Many had to reverse and one even broke wheel. It's in this video, for example at 9:00 You can see Kopecký who took it probably fastest of all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=454&v=BWsrrF1SaIs

Funny thing is that there was a lot of criticism about the place from some drivers. Anyway the most common reply was something along "if drivers can't do such places it means there shall be more of them so that they can learn..."

Very similar, and VERY difficult. Its actually not easier in the dry either, bevause You need a lot of speed (energy) to have enough momentum to get the back all the way around.

But I completely agree, the more there is of different technical obstacles, high speed or low speed, the better it is for the competition. And this is where the good ones really shine.

[danon]

Its an EXTREMLY difficult hairpin.
- Its VERY narrow.
- Its steeply upwards, making it very difficult to judge the speed, because You need enough surplus of speed (energy) to get the back to come around when You pull the handbrake, but not so much speed that You over shoot.
- Its a big elevation change in the hairpin, at the apex.
- Its very high risk. Cock it up, You won't only loose time, but rolling backwards of that cliff edge will not be a fun experience.

So I have no problem understanding that several drivers have problems in this turn.

The important thing for these drivers, is to realize it, and go back home and practice it.
To practice this kind of hairpin, You can put cones up in an industrial area. A lot of places where there are wearhouses/storage buildings, where You have a truck ramp, there is often elevation changes that could replicate some of the difficulties in this turn, without the danger of rolling off a cliff edge if You dont succeed :)

Ogier: Dont make it all the way around, and uses the outside wall to crash the car in the right direction. This is actually probably one of the fastest ways to do the turn, and the only option when You miss in the entry as Ogier does, but off course with a very high risk.

Latvala is super smooth, and shows stunning car control. Both Ford guys are also very good trough this hairpin.

The Hyundai drivers uses the inner edge as a place to put the front wheel, so they can have the back end pivoting around it. Interesting, but risky in regards of punctures and suspension failures.

Extremly interesting corner that one could sit hours an analyze. But its friday evening, and my better half dont completely agree that thats the most romantic thing to do?!

Precise dissection as always.

Here is another Tour de Corse example of a downhill hairpin - similar story, even funnier - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aZmX6eSdQJ8

[Lundefaret]

Its was a bugger of a hairpin,, and at 14k into the stage, rear tyres well up to temp,,, I when the handbrake route :)

Yes, and if You where in an R2 its even more difficult than in a 4WD, because You can't use the power on the rear wheel to keep braking loose the rear wheels, so You have to have more momentum in the hand brake turn to get it all the way around.
I practice a lot of these things in my test veichle (Polaris RZR 800 XP4), and in our 4 seater rally car (MINI Countryman Cooper S All4), and I am not sure how well i would fare in that Corsican one, with the cliff on the outside. Its scares the living crap out of me!
Sometimes its better to be the coach than the driver :)

I did the Monte Carlo Historique in 2007 as a codriver (Austin-Healey 3000, and we actually went on to win our class), and doing the night stages including the Col de Turini, with those huge drops, its just crazy scary. You know that You have time to write a whole letter on the way down before You crash to the ground.

[Lundefaret]

Precise dissection as always.

Here is another Tour de Corse example of a downhill hairpin - similar story, even funnier - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aZmX6eSdQJ8


Thanks!

Group B-s in hairpins - on tarmac, its like trying to fly acrobatics with a Lockheed Blackbird, its not ment to do it :)

Some different tactics here.
- The Metro guys most successful are the Metro guys who just drives it trough, helped by the smallest turning circle of the Group B-cars I think.
- Some of the other guys try to use an excess of speed to get the front down, and brake the rear loose, ready to put the power down if that would work. The problem is that at that exact moment You need the front to grip the most, to get the rear to get loose, the elevation change is at its most extreme, instead leading to the fronts loosing grip, and then understeer.

VERY difficult, in cars where a hand brake turn was impossible because of the diffs.

In 2003 or 2004 I got to test the Citroën Xsara WRC at Chatous de Lastours, (I try to mention this as often as possible because I think its so unbelievably cool, and I am so eternally grateful, that I still have to pinch my self), and there it was a tight hairpin. I had previously only done one single rally (in a small Opel Corsa GSI), but A LOT of fast road cars, and a Norwegian rally driver tipped me to just drive trough hairpins like that, because You really need to get things right to not loose time if You try a handbrake turn. The Xsara was just incredible to drive, just incredible, and so benign. You just needed to think what You wanted the car to do, You didn't even need to turn the steering wheel - at least thats how it felt. It was 21 rallybrivers, test drivers, and journalists from across Europe that got to test the car. I ended up second fastest, and a lot of that was to not screwing up in that hairpin.

So why is a hairpin so incredibly important? Well, opposite to what most believe, it is actually easier to both gain and loose time in slow corners. As You slow down, the stop watch speeds up. A career taken flat out in fifth or sixth, even if its long, will last for maybe under a second, or just a couple of seconds. A hairpin can last for five or six seconds, and more. And a mistake will often end up with You standing still, driving longer than You have to, or even having to back up, all the way while the car is traveling at an extremely slow speed, where every metre takes A LOT of time. And on top of that comes the alignment and the acceleration on the exit.
To gain or loose one second in one KM in the fast stuff, is a lot. But You can easily loose five seconds on a bad hairpin.

So it You dont have it "down" fully to do hand brake turns and the like, and if its possible, just drive trough it. And when You practice, practice with as low entry speed as possible, but still having enough speed (energy) to get the car to swing around its axis. This is the least risky way of doing it. And by risk, I mean risk of loosing time, both in the turn it self, but also in acceleration at the exit.

Here is the track i tested the Xsara: http://www.loisirs.fr/circuit-terre-chateau-de-lastours/photo.html And on a rally stage close by, I got to be passenger with Sebastien Loeb, the king him self, and it was just an incredible day I dont think I will ever forget. And I am still incredibly thankful to Marie-Pierre Rossi and Vigdis Dahsleide who where the two strong women that made the whole thing happen :)