trickydicky
9th April 2013, 13:45
Hello,
I am a long term rally fan, but in recent years my interest in the sport has waned somewhat over the last few years to the point where I have lost touch with the rules in some cases. Could someone explain to me, or provide a link to an explanation of, the 'R' classes, 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 I think? I understand Groups 1-5, A, N and B, and WRC but since the original WRC's were done away with I've been out of date.
Also, I would like to see what other members would ideally like to see in regulations for rally cars. For me, I would like to see a set of rules for cars that cover all rallies that are national championship level up. Having cars that compete in the WRC, but not in the ERC and aren't allowed on British Rally Championship events is all wrong to me. I know the FIA and event organisers wanted the 'WRC' to be an exclusive little television revenue funded club, above other levels of rallying and an F1 competitor, but that hasn't worked. Rallying's best days were when WRC regular's used to rock up at rounds of national championships in equal equipment to the regulars, and when locals could have a crack at their round of the world championship on equal terms. For this to be the case the cars have to be road cars in origin, otherwise everyone is priced out by the works teams. When a rally car costs circa £250,000, the same as a very top end supercar, things have gone wrong, to my eyes at least. Also, for any racing car, rally cars included, to be spectacular they have to have more power than they have grip/the chassis can handle. For a purpose built, 4wd rally car to have more power than grip it would need Formula 1 levels of power for tarmac rally's. This is obviously impractical, expensive and dangerous. To that end then it is another reason for rally cars to be modified road cars, and for four wheel drive to be banned. If you limit the power to safe levels then a 4wd car with all its gizmo's will be dull, and with a muffled turbo engine, quiet.
I would have a 'Rally Car' class of modified 2wd road cars. I would have thought banning 4wd immediately opens up a whole host of manufacturers, after all, everyone has a sporty version in their range somewhere, just about. I would allow modifications to the engine, such as the kind of turbo or fuel injection used, or EMS or whatever, manifolds and exhaust layouts and that kind of thing, basic tuning to add 100hp or so. Modifications to the suspension points and layout and bigger breaks. I would allow body work modifications up to a point to allow for housing of bigger breaks, and cooling of breaks, engine and occupants. Plastic windows and bodywork too. I'm no expert on this kind of thing but I'd be aiming at a kind of Group 4, Group N, Group A kit car type scenario but without the huge spiralling costs that caught up with kit cars. I don't even know if that is possible though. For gearboxes I would allow a semi auto box should you have one in the range, or a bought in 'dog box'. I would not allow specialist, in house built gearboxes, as they would be very expensive to design and develop. Engines I would limit to 3000cc, or 2000cc with a turbo charger. I wouldn't want to restrict turbo engines, so turbo size or something might have to be limited, but I wouldn't want turbo engines to spiral out of control. Anyhow, with a bit of luck, power would be limited by having just two driven wheels and the need to not destroy your tyres. Then, in my minds eye, you would have BMW 130s, Porsche Caymans, Renault RS Meganes and Clios, VW Sciroccos, Alfa Romeo Giulietta Cloverleafs and that kind of thing on rally stages, and maybe Ford could oblige with an RS that fit the rules! I would set a suitable production requirement to prevent crazy homologation specials, but I don't know what that would be?!
I would then have a 'Production Car' class of cars that are road cars with their interior took out, a roll cage and a fire extinguisher put in, and the suspension beefed up a tad, so you are basically buying a road car, as a cheap way of going rallying. These cars may have to have been produced in greater numbers than the higher class. I would have classes within the classes relating to engine size, like the old N1-4, A5-8 system.
I know it seems heretical to ban 4wd but it is common sense to me. And anyone who thinks 2wd is dull needs to watch some old stuff on Youtube, or even kit cars from the 90's, or the Finnish F-Cup! Any car driven enthusiastically by a good driver is entertaining! I think having production derived cars also brings back rallying to what it actually is supposed to be, and brings back a bit of fan interest. Watching some loon in a car that is similar to the one you have just parked tear along a slimy, greasy or icy road at speed grabs you more than watching someone go over a rocky, gravel road in a car designed to go over a rocky gravel road. The ride height and suspension travel on modern WRC cars looks horrific and removes the challenge, or the idea of it. The latest WRC cars look like them 'Buggies' Jean-Louis Schlesser used to do the Dakar in. Plus, it might bring back the kind of scenario where a strong car can compete with a really quick car on a rough gravel event, because it cop the punishment a bit better. Especially if they had a couple of longer rally's, but that's a seperate discussion.
Just my thoughts, what are yours? Feel free to mock me for being a) way out of date and b) not knowing much about car mechanics
I am a long term rally fan, but in recent years my interest in the sport has waned somewhat over the last few years to the point where I have lost touch with the rules in some cases. Could someone explain to me, or provide a link to an explanation of, the 'R' classes, 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 I think? I understand Groups 1-5, A, N and B, and WRC but since the original WRC's were done away with I've been out of date.
Also, I would like to see what other members would ideally like to see in regulations for rally cars. For me, I would like to see a set of rules for cars that cover all rallies that are national championship level up. Having cars that compete in the WRC, but not in the ERC and aren't allowed on British Rally Championship events is all wrong to me. I know the FIA and event organisers wanted the 'WRC' to be an exclusive little television revenue funded club, above other levels of rallying and an F1 competitor, but that hasn't worked. Rallying's best days were when WRC regular's used to rock up at rounds of national championships in equal equipment to the regulars, and when locals could have a crack at their round of the world championship on equal terms. For this to be the case the cars have to be road cars in origin, otherwise everyone is priced out by the works teams. When a rally car costs circa £250,000, the same as a very top end supercar, things have gone wrong, to my eyes at least. Also, for any racing car, rally cars included, to be spectacular they have to have more power than they have grip/the chassis can handle. For a purpose built, 4wd rally car to have more power than grip it would need Formula 1 levels of power for tarmac rally's. This is obviously impractical, expensive and dangerous. To that end then it is another reason for rally cars to be modified road cars, and for four wheel drive to be banned. If you limit the power to safe levels then a 4wd car with all its gizmo's will be dull, and with a muffled turbo engine, quiet.
I would have a 'Rally Car' class of modified 2wd road cars. I would have thought banning 4wd immediately opens up a whole host of manufacturers, after all, everyone has a sporty version in their range somewhere, just about. I would allow modifications to the engine, such as the kind of turbo or fuel injection used, or EMS or whatever, manifolds and exhaust layouts and that kind of thing, basic tuning to add 100hp or so. Modifications to the suspension points and layout and bigger breaks. I would allow body work modifications up to a point to allow for housing of bigger breaks, and cooling of breaks, engine and occupants. Plastic windows and bodywork too. I'm no expert on this kind of thing but I'd be aiming at a kind of Group 4, Group N, Group A kit car type scenario but without the huge spiralling costs that caught up with kit cars. I don't even know if that is possible though. For gearboxes I would allow a semi auto box should you have one in the range, or a bought in 'dog box'. I would not allow specialist, in house built gearboxes, as they would be very expensive to design and develop. Engines I would limit to 3000cc, or 2000cc with a turbo charger. I wouldn't want to restrict turbo engines, so turbo size or something might have to be limited, but I wouldn't want turbo engines to spiral out of control. Anyhow, with a bit of luck, power would be limited by having just two driven wheels and the need to not destroy your tyres. Then, in my minds eye, you would have BMW 130s, Porsche Caymans, Renault RS Meganes and Clios, VW Sciroccos, Alfa Romeo Giulietta Cloverleafs and that kind of thing on rally stages, and maybe Ford could oblige with an RS that fit the rules! I would set a suitable production requirement to prevent crazy homologation specials, but I don't know what that would be?!
I would then have a 'Production Car' class of cars that are road cars with their interior took out, a roll cage and a fire extinguisher put in, and the suspension beefed up a tad, so you are basically buying a road car, as a cheap way of going rallying. These cars may have to have been produced in greater numbers than the higher class. I would have classes within the classes relating to engine size, like the old N1-4, A5-8 system.
I know it seems heretical to ban 4wd but it is common sense to me. And anyone who thinks 2wd is dull needs to watch some old stuff on Youtube, or even kit cars from the 90's, or the Finnish F-Cup! Any car driven enthusiastically by a good driver is entertaining! I think having production derived cars also brings back rallying to what it actually is supposed to be, and brings back a bit of fan interest. Watching some loon in a car that is similar to the one you have just parked tear along a slimy, greasy or icy road at speed grabs you more than watching someone go over a rocky, gravel road in a car designed to go over a rocky gravel road. The ride height and suspension travel on modern WRC cars looks horrific and removes the challenge, or the idea of it. The latest WRC cars look like them 'Buggies' Jean-Louis Schlesser used to do the Dakar in. Plus, it might bring back the kind of scenario where a strong car can compete with a really quick car on a rough gravel event, because it cop the punishment a bit better. Especially if they had a couple of longer rally's, but that's a seperate discussion.
Just my thoughts, what are yours? Feel free to mock me for being a) way out of date and b) not knowing much about car mechanics