Conversion & Protection of DVD Collection

[steveaki13]

I have opened this thread for some advice from you wise lot. :cool:

I have a large collection of F1 DVDs (i.e races) that I have recorded and collected from others covering my time watching F1 and a few years before. Sad I know, but it was something I started as a 14 year old on VHS tapes and I then converted to recording them on DVD and transferred the VHS to DVD which are terrible quality to be honest. And just once you have got to 10+years when do you stop?

Now, these are all on DVD and I was reading something the other day that stated DVDs begin to erode after just 10 years and gradually get worse.

So with that in mind it got me thinking about how I should back up my collection for two reasons. One is to prevent losing all the collection in event of a fire or something similar (lets hope not or I would have more important things to worry about), but also because I would hate to get 20 years down the line and some of them become unwatchable.

So I could just start transferring them one by one to a new DVD, or more realistically transfer them of Hard Drive as a collection then when a DVD is damaged or degrading I can recopy it.

Anyway I would like some advise on what you have done or would do with a collection of DVDs in this situation as I am not great with computers.

I mean how would I transfer DVDs I recorded onto Computer? Where or what should I store them on? How easy is it to keep them and re copy from that location if needed?

So if any of you have any ideas or suggestions, please let me konw.

[ioan]

Indeed self made DVD's start to degrade (the chemical properties of the layer that registers the data start to degrade) after about 5-10 years depending on the quality of the DVD.
The only way to safeguard them is using a hard drive, or several if you want to keep several copies of them.
Depending on your level of paranoia you can go to great lengths in creating disaster recovery plans which can cost you a fortune! ;)

[Koz]

I have to say DVDs are quite unreliable. These days nothing is.
Hard drives suck, too.
5-10 years is pushing it in both cases, especially with external hard drives.

I'd say rip everything from your DVD collection and backup to some kind of cloud service like SipderOak?

I sometimes think, who will keep the memory of our existence, the ancients left us papyrus, stone tablets, books. In a 15-20 (if that) everything on current storage mediums will be pretty much inaccessible, everything that isn't online will be lost and forgotten forever. Sad thought. :(

[ioan]

I have to say DVDs are quite unreliable. These days nothing is.
Hard drives suck, too.
5-10 years is pushing it in both cases, especially with external hard drives.

I'd say rip everything from your DVD collection and backup to some kind of cloud service like SipderOak?

I sometimes think, who will keep the memory of our existence, the ancients left us papyrus, stone tablets, books. In a 15-20 (if that) everything on current storage mediums will be pretty much inaccessible, everything that isn't online will be lost and forgotten forever. Sad thought. :(

Hard drives are unreliable? Maybe if you run them 24/7, but if it is just for archiving then they are the best you can have.
Any cloud storage means your data is not directly accessible at any time, unless you live in a perfect world.

[Koz]

I mean how would I transfer DVDs I recorded onto Computer? Where or what should I store them on? How easy is it to keep them and re copy from that location if needed?

All you need is something to rip those DVDs. There are plenty of software for that, encode to the highest codec possible. Google "dvd ripper" or maybe someone here can suggest a good tool for you (I suggest HandBrake (http://handbrake.fr/)).

The process is VERY easy, but it's not the fastest thing in the world.
Keeping and moving them is also easy, just like any other file you might have on your computer. Most recent TVs (last year or two, and DVD players with USB of the last 4-odd years) that have USB will be able to play such files directly off a USB stick if you chose to copy them there).

You could make ISO coppies of your DVDs (exact clone of your DVD rather than converting as above, but that would just be a waste of space think 4.3gb).

[Koz]

Hard drives are unreliable? Maybe if you run them 24/7, but if it is just for archiving then they are the best you can have.
Any cloud storage means your data is not directly accessible at any time, unless you live in a perfect world.

Because you carry your ALL hard drives with you 24/7, right?
Where we are today, as long as we assume the cloud service will not be destroyed for whatever reason and have multiple levels of redundancies in place, it will be theoretically far safer than having hard drives with you in your home.

Hard drives have estimate lifetimes into the millions of hours, that's true. However, those are theoretical estimates, they could die today or 10 years from now - why do you think stuff like RAID exists?
You have to be realistic, mechanical failure is a matter of WHEN not a matter of IF.
Add to that the possibility of theft, fire, or even dropping it - and where are we?

A 500gb hdd costs next to nothing, so there's no reason not to go with them.
But if it is important enough, go with the cloud and pay for it, TOO.

[steveaki13]

I sometimes think, who will keep the memory of our existence, the ancients left us papyrus, stone tablets, books. In a 15-20 (if that) everything on current storage mediums will be pretty much inaccessible, everything that isn't online will be lost and forgotten forever. Sad thought. :(


Your right, we have the power to record everything now, but not in a way that may always be availiable in years to come

[steveaki13]

Thanks Guys. Some good Advice. I will look into it soon, because its going to be a long process whatever.

Anyone else feel free to add anything they have.

[Dave B]

I'll second the recommendation for Handbrake, it offers all manner of options for ripping DVDs. You'll need to find one which offers a compromise between reasonable file size and picture quality, but there's no point going overboard as you obviously can't exceed the quality of the original recordings.

It took a hell of a time, but I've now reduced shelf after shelf of fugly DVDs to one single 2TB drive the size of a VHS tape. Of course, that itself could always fail and I've lost everything, but that's a chance I'll take. Most of my irreplaceable family videos are backed up to the cloud, which also makes it easy to access them from my phone.

Once you've converted them, have a look at XBMC as a media player. We've got in running on a PC hooked up to the main telly, it plays pretty much any format you can chuck at it, and you can control it from most smartphones. I can stream HD video from my phone to a 50" screen, which is rather nice :D

[Dave B]

You could make ISO coppies of your DVDs (exact clone of your DVD rather than converting as above, but that would just be a waste of space think 4.3gb).
Absolutely no point, the video on DVDs is so compressed that it's a waste of space. I vary the quality according to the source: old sitcoms etc I've got down to <200MB per episode, F1 races or films to ~1GB. For most purposes that's more than acceptable, but obviously for certain favourites you might want to go higher quality. :)

[race aficionado]

If you use external drives to store your precious files I highly recommend RAID drives.
After loosing 2 drives in a week (4 years ago) and going through the tedious process of trying to recuperate the lost files, I promised myself that would never happen to me again.
Since then, I've purchased LaCie raid drives while also purchasing an extra replacement drive if one of the raid drives goes down. It gives me peace of mind- and specially in my line of work where I work with many files that are my client's precious video files.

[Mark]

Yep. In my job we wouldn't even contemplate having data on just one disk. Everything has mirrored drives at the very least.

[ioan]

Because you carry your ALL hard drives with you 24/7, right?
Where we are today, as long as we assume the cloud service will not be destroyed for whatever reason and have multiple levels of redundancies in place, it will be theoretically far safer than having hard drives with you in your home.

Hard drives have estimate lifetimes into the millions of hours, that's true. However, those are theoretical estimates, they could die today or 10 years from now - why do you think stuff like RAID exists?
You have to be realistic, mechanical failure is a matter of WHEN not a matter of IF.
Add to that the possibility of theft, fire, or even dropping it - and where are we?

A 500gb hdd costs next to nothing, so there's no reason not to go with them.
But if it is important enough, go with the cloud and pay for it, TOO.

RAID is used for HDD that run 24/7, not for your home storage that you access once a day.
Believe me I work with such things on a daily basis with companies that value data security and integrity more than anything else.
As for a mechanical failure being a matter of when rather then if, well isn't it with most of the things we use? The important part is choosing the product that gives you the best value for your money.
My old dell laptop runs about 6 hours a day during evenings, since 7 years and the HDD is still fine, and it is not a HDD designed for 24/7 usage.

And yes I lug around a 1 TB 2.5" hard drive with me all day long, I don't see any issue with that especially as I can access my data anytime anywhere, unlike relying on a mobile internet connection that might be there or not, fast or slow.

[ioan]

I'll second the recommendation for Handbrake, it offers all manner of options for ripping DVDs. You'll need to find one which offers a compromise between reasonable file size and picture quality, but there's no point going overboard as you obviously can't exceed the quality of the original recordings.

It took a hell of a time, but I've now reduced shelf after shelf of fugly DVDs to one single 2TB drive the size of a VHS tape. Of course, that itself could always fail and I've lost everything, but that's a chance I'll take. Most of my irreplaceable family videos are backed up to the cloud, which also makes it easy to access them from my phone.

Once you've converted them, have a look at XBMC as a media player. We've got in running on a PC hooked up to the main telly, it plays pretty much any format you can chuck at it, and you can control it from most smartphones. I can stream HD video from my phone to a 50" screen, which is rather nice :D

You can always recover your data from a failed hard drive, unless it was physically destroyed.

[race aficionado]

You can always recover your data from a failed hard drive, unless it was physically destroyed.

Oh you sure can - most of the times - and not 100% guaranteed - oh, and like in my case, for a hefty prize. There are commercial programs out there that can do the job and they take their time doing so, something I can't afford if I'm editing a project that can't be delayed because of said failed non raid hard drive.

Bottom line is that we do as we wish, the options are out there, we measure the consequences and make our choices.
Simple.

[Koz]

RAID is used for HDD that run 24/7, not for your home storage that you access once a day.
Believe me I work with such things on a daily basis with companies that value data security and integrity more than anything else.
As for a mechanical failure being a matter of when rather then if, well isn't it with most of the things we use? The important part is choosing the product that gives you the best value for your money.
My old dell laptop runs about 6 hours a day during evenings, since 7 years and the HDD is still fine, and it is not a HDD designed for 24/7 usage.

And yes I lug around a 1 TB 2.5" hard drive with me all day long, I don't see any issue with that especially as I can access my data anytime anywhere, unlike relying on a mobile internet connection that might be there or not, fast or slow.

Are you saying that home users shouldn't use any form of data redundancy because you have not had a failure in 7 years?
Are you also implying that you have no alternative backups?


To each his own, but in the end it comes down to priorities and trust, and the value for your data. I would have multiple redundancies in place for the things that I value, even if you wouldn't.

[SGWilko]

I've archived my DVD collection onto a Netgear ReadyNAS NV+ V2 raid enclosure. I have 4 3TB disks in a Flex Raid 2 configuration, giving me 8TB useable space.

A lot of my DVD's have a DTS soundtrack, so to keep that, I used MakeMKV to rip the DVD's into MKV files (about 5GB per DVD) and can enjoy the streamed movies over DLNA certified devices - including the DTS soundtrack!

I'd imagine that home produced DVD's ripped in this manner would take up less space, and you'd probably not need quite such high resolution so compression can be higher.

The other bonus with streaming NAS devices is that, if you have a fast enough internet upload speed, you can watch your movies when away from home.

[Dave B]

A lot of my DVD's have a DTS soundtrack, so to keep that, I used MakeMKV to rip the DVD's into MKV files (about 5GB per DVD) and can enjoy the streamed movies over DLNA certified devices - including the DTS soundtrack!

Why so big, if you don't mind me asking? A DVD only holds 4.7GB in the first place, and once you take out all the extras a movie rarely exceeds half of that. I found that most normal length films can be squeezed into MKV files or around 1GB with no noticeable loss of audio or video quality, or ~1.5GB with absolutely no perceptible difference to the original - and that includes preserving the audio.

[Dave B]

To each his own, but in the end it comes down to priorities and trust, and the value for your data. I would have multiple redundancies in place for the things that I value, even if you wouldn't.

It's like any insurance: a trade-off between cost and how much you value the material you stand to lose. I've got wedding and baby photos and videos backed up in two different buildings and with two separate cloud providers; I've also got thousands of TV episodes on a HDD with no backup whatsoever.

The most stupid thing I ever did (well, top 10) was when I was moving an AV system and I placed an external drive on a pile of boxes which happened to include my subwoofer - complete with its ridiculously powerful magnet. I salvaged well over half the content, which was a slow and painful process, and learned a valuable lesson.

[race aficionado]

Ouch!

[SGWilko]

Why so big, if you don't mind me asking? A DVD only holds 4.7GB in the first place, and once you take out all the extras a movie rarely exceeds half of that. I found that most normal length films can be squeezed into MKV files or around 1GB with no noticeable loss of audio or video quality, or ~1.5GB with absolutely no perceptible difference to the original - and that includes preserving the audio.

Generally, most of today's commercially produced DVD's are dual layer, so are about 8GB. I don't bother with compression so much as space is not an issue!

[race aficionado]

. . . as space is not an issue!

For me au contraire . . . . there is never enough space and there is always new drives to purchase.
In my case with all video now shot and edited on HD - you can imagine the space that is constantly occupied and needed.
Before I would store Beta tapes on my shelves, now it's loaded with drives of every size and color.


. . . . but I'm not complaining. I look forward to soon getting the new Thunderbolt drives. I'v seen them in action and they are fast!