How things have changed

[MAX_THRUST]

Just dawned on me its 20 years since Mansell raced in Indy Car (CART) as it was once known. I had watched the odd race prior to this as my dad used to record it on terestrial tele back in the late 80's(don't know what channel it was on but it was always on late).

Then the series started to really take off and grow. Well that's how it seemed to me in the 90's. 95 to 2000 were the best years for the series I felt, even with the IRL rivalry that was going on.

Then 10 years ago I went to see Champ Car at Brands Hatch. The series was dying on its feet then, it felt, after the two previous years of watching the race at Rockingham in the UK. Fernandez, Penske and Rahal cleared off to the IRL and I think this was when the series was saved from bankruptcy. The series struggled on for a few more years after this.

Then the merger happened and we were all excited to have everyone back in one series. Most of the original IRL teams disappeared from the series. Lots of the old CART teams had folded and left the series or motorsport in general.

I guess all forms of motorsport have gone through their changes since then with teams coming and going, going through ups and downs and having to change to get things right to be able to survive this current economical climate.

But how I miss the old days of CART 95 - 2002. I wish the series could be as strong as it was back then. I still have all my old VHS tapes of the races from 95 - 2005, and every now and then I get one out and watch it. I find it hard to believe the series that was beginning to threatened Bernie Eccestone and F1, imploded in such fashion. 4 manufactures, 5 chasis builders and two tyre companies competing in the fastest series on earth.

Gutted, one day I might get over this....Let the bitching begin now as to who's fault it was, as I am sure a lot of you will want to post your arguments, to whose responsible.

[Anubis]

Not limited to Indycar. I feel the same way about the BTCC. I used to watch it religiously back when BBC would have highlights on Grandstand - Steve Soper, Andy Rouse, Murray doing the commentary - happy days. Now ITV have full live coverage of it and I seldom bother watching. Sometimes less is actually more.

[heliocastroneves#3]

Well, following American Open Wheel Racing was always fine for me, especially after the split. I was able to watch two different American Open Wheel Series and they both were awesome. Sadly for CART, I decided to stop following it after the Fontana race in 2001. This means since 2002, I only watched the IRL and it was already an awesome series back in then. There were awesome on track battles, three-wide racing regularly and than I haven't mentioned Sam Hornish Jr. yet. He was kicking everyone's ass, ALSO both Team Penske drivers. Even when he had a tough season in 2003 because he had a Chevrolet engine and Toyota and Honda were way better, he still managed to be in contention for the championship at the season finale in Texas and ultimately he would finish 5th in points with 3 wins. That was in my opinion, his best season when it comes to recovering from bad luck because of course it wasn't as good as 2001, 2002 and 2006 were for him. Than he left the IRL after 2007 and I decided to fully support his team mate, Hélio Castroneves. I liked the merge but I didn't like the fact that they ran two different races in one weekend, of course I'm talking about the Motegi-Long Beach weekend. I had the wish that they would all have ran in Motegi. They shouldn't have counted the Long Beach race for the championship as well, since in that race they ran with Champ Cars and not with IRL vehicles. I also found it a stupid decision to add Surfers Paradise to the schedule as a non championship event. They should have made that the penultimate race of the season and than have postponed the Chicagoland race to late October as the seasons' finale. Since 2010 there are more road/street courses than ovals on the schedule and I didn't like that at first but later I changed my opinion that a balanced schedule is better. Although in my opinion, the 2012 schedule wasn't having a balance between road/street courses and ovals at all. Although I won't complain about road/street courses, since I like those races well. It's just not the same as oval racing IMHO. I'm glad that Champ Car is gone, I liked CART for a long time but Champ Car was a joke of a rival series for the IRL, it's absolutely no wonder why Bourdais won 4 straight championships, as only 3 or 4 other drivers had talent as well and for the rest it were all talentless guts driving in that series. After all: I'm happy where the IRL is today, the merger has made the series better.

What I miss much more is the old F1 with Michael Schumacher and Mika Hakkinen battling for the championship, racing around circuits without run-off areas and the superb fast HockenheimRing. Other things which I miss in F1 are teams such as Jordan, Prost, BAR, Benetton and Jaguar. Definitely loved how Frentzen battled with McLaren and Ferrari in his Jordan back in '99!

[FIAT1]

Well, following American Open Wheel Racing was always fine for me, especially after the split. I was able to watch two different American Open Wheel Series and they both were awesome. Sadly for CART, I decided to stop following it after the Fontana race in 2001. This means since 2002, I only watched the IRL and it was already an awesome series back in then. There were awesome on track battles, three-wide racing regularly and than I haven't mentioned Sam Hornish Jr. yet. He was kicking everyone's ass, ALSO both Team Penske drivers. Even when he had a tough season in 2003 because he had a Chevrolet engine and Toyota and Honda were way better, he still managed to be in contention for the championship at the season finale in Texas and ultimately he would finish 5th in points with 3 wins. That was in my opinion, his best season when it comes to recovering from bad luck because of course it wasn't as good as 2001, 2002 and 2006 were for him. Than he left the IRL after 2007 and I decided to fully support his team mate, Hélio Castroneves. I liked the merge but I didn't like the fact that they ran two different races in one weekend, of course I'm talking about the Motegi-Long Beach weekend. I had the wish that they would all have ran in Motegi. They shouldn't have counted the Long Beach race for the championship as well, since in that race they ran with Champ Cars and not with IRL vehicles. I also found it a stupid decision to add Surfers Paradise to the schedule as a non championship event. They should have made that the penultimate race of the season and than have postponed the Chicagoland race to late October as the seasons' finale. Since 2010 there are more road/street courses than ovals on the schedule and I didn't like that at first but later I changed my opinion that a balanced schedule is better. Although in my opinion, the 2012 schedule wasn't having a balance between road/street courses and ovals at all. Although I won't complain about road/street courses, since I like those races well. It's just not the same as oval racing IMHO. I'm glad that Champ Car is gone, I liked CART for a long time but Champ Car was a joke of a rival series for the IRL, it's absolutely no wonder why Bourdais won 4 straight championships, as only 3 or 4 other drivers had talent as well and for the rest it were all talentless guts driving in that series. After all: I'm happy where the IRL is today, the merger has made the series better.

What I miss much more is the old F1 with Michael Schumacher and Mika Hakkinen battling for the championship, racing around circuits without run-off areas and the superb fast HockenheimRing. Other things which I miss in F1 are teams such as Jordan, Prost, BAR, Benetton and Jaguar. Definitely loved how Frentzen battled with McLaren and Ferrari in his Jordan back in '99!

Your opinion,same old bs, you are completely wrong ....and a point of your post is....???

[FIAT1]

How things have changed, sure and beating a dead horse is not gonna change anything.

[spiritone]

Haven't posted here in ages. Got tiresome arguing with the irl's who used to think the tony vision was going to be a success. So much for that idea. I, like max, miss the the champ car days when open wheel racing in north america was king. Unfortunately i doubt we will ever get to that level again. For posters like fiat1, your right, nothing is going to change, open wheel racing has sunk to being a minor league series and the people that run it now haven't got a clue. Greed has won.

[Mark]

Just the same as a country which tears itself apart with civil war, there's nothing left for the "winners".

[SoCalPVguy]

No much more boring than oval racing, especially on the small bull ring 7/8 mile tracks... reminds me of the old board track races in the 1920's -- only so many squirrels going around the cage.

[EagleEye]

Just dawned on me its 20 years since Mansell raced in Indy Car (CART) as it was once known. I had watched the odd race prior to this as my dad used to record it on terestrial tele back in the late 80's(don't know what channel it was on but it was always on late).

Then the series started to really take off and grow. Well that's how it seemed to me in the 90's. 95 to 2000 were the best years for the series I felt, even with the IRL rivalry that was going on.

Then 10 years ago I went to see Champ Car at Brands Hatch. The series was dying on its feet then, it felt, after the two previous years of watching the race at Rockingham in the UK. Fernandez, Penske and Rahal cleared off to the IRL and I think this was when the series was saved from bankruptcy. The series struggled on for a few more years after this.

Then the merger happened and we were all excited to have everyone back in one series. Most of the original IRL teams disappeared from the series. Lots of the old CART teams had folded and left the series or motorsport in general.

I guess all forms of motorsport have gone through their changes since then with teams coming and going, going through ups and downs and having to change to get things right to be able to survive this current economical climate.

But how I miss the old days of CART 95 - 2002. I wish the series could be as strong as it was back then. I still have all my old VHS tapes of the races from 95 - 2005, and every now and then I get one out and watch it. I find it hard to believe the series that was beginning to threatened Bernie Eccestone and F1, imploded in such fashion. 4 manufactures, 5 chasis builders and two tyre companies competing in the fastest series on earth.

Gutted, one day I might get over this....Let the bitching begin now as to who's fault it was, as I am sure a lot of you will want to post your arguments, to whose responsible.

Spot on mate, spot on. I'd even go back as far as 85, 86, 87 or so but certainly hit the peak when Nigel came over.

[slorydn1]

I have to agree with Max on this one.

I was one of those who grew up an Indy car fan from the midwest. I even was lucky enough to be at the Indy 500 the year that Danny Sullivan pulled off the "Spin and Win" (I was a teenager at the time, and sadly I don't remember exactly what year that was, 1986 maybe?).

I moved to the southeast (NC) in 1991, and I had already started to take up an interest in NASCAR just prior to that. I still watched (when I could) more open wheel at the time. Then I became one of the statistics that got caught up in all the noise during the split. I was a Penske fan through and through and I just couldn't get up for an Indy 500 that didn't have the top teams in it. And it was next to impossible to get a CART race on any of the TV channels I had available to me here at the time. SO here I was, in the middle of NASCAR country and all of a sudden what had been only a small interest became a full fledged passion.

Man, those were the days when Mansell was here in the States. He could flat out wheel a race car, that is definintely for sure. I still wonder to this day how many WDC's he could have won had he stayed with Williams when he was at the peak of his career, especially with Senna's passing in 94 and the Schu just getting up to speed.

[DexDexter]

Man, those were the days when Mansell was here in the States. He could flat out wheel a race car, that is definintely for sure. I still wonder to this day how many WDC's he could have won had he stayed with Williams when he was at the peak of his career, especially with Senna's passing in 94 and the Schu just getting up to speed.

No offense but in 1992, (at 39) Mansell was not at the peak of his career, rather towards the end. In 86 he, as a much younger man, nearly won the title in Adelaide but his tyre exploded and Prost went on to win it.

[Chris R]

No offense but in 1992, (at 39) Mansell was not at the peak of his career, rather towards the end. In 86 he, as a much younger man, nearly won the title in Adelaide but his tyre exploded and Prost went on to win it.


Mansell was very good - but his results are commensurate with his talent and temperament. Problem is, he was never quite as good as he thought and that cost him more wins/opportunities to win than anything....