Lights in the daytime

[D-Type]

When driving in daytime (In Britain) and it's very dull, raining or foggy I generally put dipped lights on, as do many other drivers. The Highway code recommends this, but you still see situations where 95% of drivers have lights on but the other 5% seem to be totally oblivious to the fact that all the cars they can see have their lights on.

Someone told me that in some countries this is mandatory in winter (say November-February) - is this the case? I know that Volvos have their sidelights wired to come on with the ignition so presumably this is a Swedish requirement.

The military seem to use their lights the year round (I think this originated with the US Army or the Wermacht) . I was wondering if any countries require everyone to drive with lights on all year round?

[schmenke]

"Daytime running lights" are mandatory in Canada. All vehicles sold in Canada must be so equipped. Headlights switch on automatically when the car is put in gear.

[Mintexmemory]

Dual carriageway and higher level roads in Italy require lights in all conditions IIRC

[Firstgear]

"Daytime running lights" are mandatory in Canada. All vehicles sold in Canada must be so equipped. Headlights switch on automatically when the car is put in gear.
This only applies to cars sold after ???? (I don't know which year). So it's not law that ALL cars have their lights on, as older cars would be exempt.

[Gregor-y]

My Subaru would turn on the headlights when the car was started but it wasn't too hard to track down the relay and unplug it. I don't like automated systems as I see a lot of cars at night with their 'daytime running lights' on up front and no lights at the back. Subarus also are nice in that the lights turn off when the ignition is off so you can't drain the battery if you leave the headlights on. There's a switch that will let you do it if you must...

Every military convoy I've ever seen drives with their lights on and I've seen a few two lane highways out west where lights are required because the environment is so desolate you may not notice an oncoming car through the heat waves. And I guess in case one of you is on the wrong side of the road for some reason.

[Starter]

Some states in the US have requirements that headlights be on when the windshield wipers are on. It's not required in all states or necessarily enforced in the states which do have it. There is no requirement here for constant lights.

[Dave B]

A brief snapshot of anecdotal evidence: on Monday afternoon I drove from Kent to Teesside (SE to NE england, about 300 miles) in pretty crappy conditions and I'd say that around 98% of cars were lit for the conditions. Of the 2% who weren't about half had no lights on whatsoever, the other half were lit up like Blackpool illuminations with fog lights and full beam.

[schmenke]

This only applies to cars sold after ???? (I don't know which year). So it's not law that ALL cars have their lights on, as older cars would be exempt.

True, but I think the year is sometime in the late 1980s (I can't be bothered to google) so a car would have to be over 20 years old to be exempt.

[Rollo]

Some local government areas within NSW require you to keep your lights on.

http://i945.photobucket.com/albums/ad297/rollo75/daytimelights.jpg
The City of Blue Mountains Council posts signs on the highway telling you to put your lights on in the daytime, but the City of Lithgow to the west and the City of Penrith to the east of it do not.
It's weird because the road laws are administered by the state of NSW. You won't be fined by the state of NSW and so you don't lose any points from your licence but you will be fined by the local council in question.

[J4MIE]

The only time in my life I was stopped by police (who were standing at the side of the road) was in the Czech Republic and it was because I didn't have my lights on - the hire car I had was Austrian so guess the rules are different there. It was sunny and 35C so I hadn't thought to put them on.

Personally I tend to try to drive with my headlights on at all times anyway. But the amount of people that I see driving in the dark with sidelights on or with one light not working is ridiculous :\

[Mark]

Yep. Thick fog and silver coloured cars with no lights. Or at best their parking lights. Crazy.

[BleAivano]

Yep. Thick fog and silver coloured cars with no lights. Or at best their parking lights. Crazy.

this reminds me of the song "I samma bil" by Bo Kaspers Orkester

[Daniel]

Yep. Thick fog and silver coloured cars with no lights. Or at best their parking lights. Crazy.
The clue is in their name. PARKING LIGHTS!

[Knock-on]

I was driving through Latvia and Lithuania in a Truck and was flashed when I forgot to put my lights on in the morning so I guess they have a similar Law.

My bike in the UK is hard wired. There is no option for turning the dipped beam off and it's bloody bright. Cars keep flashing me when I pass them because the dipped beam looks like a full beam to them but there's nothing I can do. It's the EU's fault and it's worse when I'm loaded or POB.

[Daniel]

Car flashing you means they can see you = good thing.

[SGWilko]

I was driving through Latvia and Lithuania in a Truck and was flashed when I forgot to put my lights on in the morning so I guess they have a similar Law.

My bike in the UK is hard wired. There is no option for turning the dipped beam off and it's bloody bright. Cars keep flashing me when I pass them because the dipped beam looks like a full beam to them but there's nothing I can do. It's the EU's fault and it's worse when I'm loaded or POB.

The amount of bike riders I pull up next to at traffic lights in the day on my commute to work with their blue full beam light on - on the dash - is worrying. I've chastised a couple for it - generally because they have blinded me when following me, but generally I've come to the conclusion they are too thick to care.........

[Knock-on]

Trust me fella, with new bikes, they are probably dipped but anyone driving around on Full is a idiot. I find that unless I'm on a Duel or Motorway, I get better visibility on dipped.

Mind you, it's better than in Brasil. Here you get cars, Taxi's, Trucks and Busses driving around without any lights at night. The only way I managed to not step out in front of a bus this evening was because the destination board at the front was lit.

[Bagwan]

Here's a rant for ya .

Whomever had the idea that blue lights were better with which to see , needs a good smack .

If you need proof , go to the airport , where seeing is an essential part of living .

Lights on the ground denoting runways are always a blue , likely mercury vapour .
Lights on the plane are yellow , likely sodium vapour .

The main reason for this is that we are able to see a blue wavelength from a greater distance , so it makes sense to have those on the ground , showing the runway .
The yellow wavelengths work far better at illuminating our environment , simply because there are more tones of yellow in our world to reflect it , and this is how we illuminate things . The colour must be reflected by the light which shines on it .

So , those with those blue lights have two issues .
They spent money to get better lights with which to see , and don't .
And , they blind oncoming traffic .

They are simply a stupid idea that they have made most people believe is a good one .
Outlaw them , and give the inventer a good smack .

[Gregor-y]

That's why I don't like most HID light systems, and tend to look for bulbs with a yellow tint though some people go a bit overboard and try to imagine they're in France 20 (oh God more like 30) years ago.

[Starter]

That's why I don't like most HID light systems, and tend to look for bulbs with a yellow tint though some people go a bit overboard and try to imagine they're in France 20 (oh God more like 30) years ago.
I beg to differ. I have HIDs on both of my cars and love them. Much better visibility and range. The low beams have cut offs of course to not blind on coming drivers. They absolutely beat the heck out of standard headlights. Even halogens don't provide the depth of illumination for 60 MPH+ driving, which we have a lot of on US highways and interstates. Drivers do need to be courteous and dim lights when they would effect other drivers, but most do. It's the ones without HIDs who drive around with high beams on because they can't see squat otherwise.

[Bagwan]

I beg to differ. I have HIDs on both of my cars and love them. Much better visibility and range. The low beams have cut offs of course to not blind on coming drivers. They absolutely beat the heck out of standard headlights. Even halogens don't provide the depth of illumination for 60 MPH+ driving, which we have a lot of on US highways and interstates. Drivers do need to be courteous and dim lights when they would effect other drivers, but most do. It's the ones without HIDs who drive around with high beams on because they can't see squat otherwise.

Beg all you want , starter , but it's simple physics .

Those headlights you have , by necessity , must be far brighter than the equivalent amber beam , because the things you wish to light aren't blue , generally .
If we lived in a blue world , those lights would be perfect , as they could be easily dim enough to not blind oncoming traffic , yet the things in that world would reflect the blue colour .
As it is , though , in our world here , we don't have enough blue for your lights to reflect , and hence , they need to be extremely bright , to show you what's ahead at 60 mph .

Courteous drivers who do dim on approach are certainly appreciated by those staring into the beams , but they must also realize that even dimmed they are far brighter than regular sealed beam or halogen .
Eyes facing them will take longer to adjust back , and will tire faster , so you're , even on the dimmed setting , creating tired and semi-blind drivers to face head-on .

Those who forget to turn them down will blind oncoming traffic almost completely , and will almost undoubtedly bring on a flash from the other guy , blinding them .

Sorry man , but they are one of my pet peeves , because they hurt my eyes , and they don't help anyone , in reality .

I believe they are dangerous , and , (sorry) foolish .

En este video se explican algunas de las estrategias y capacidades distintivas que usan los equipos de rally para conseguir sus objetivos, como por ejemplo: la potencia del motor, la tracción de las ruedas, la experiencia de los pilotos, los conocimientos y rapidez del equipo de mecanicos, etc.
También explica la importacia de factores como el entorno a la hora de competir.

depen del coches no? o el telefon tmbe seria valid?

puc jo tmb?

[Gregor-y]

Not to mention a very bright light ahead shrinks the pupil so it can't see detail at the fringes as well. You're literally looking through a roll of toilet paper with very bright lights. Look and usefulness are two different things. Plus HIDs still blind oncoming traffic both in their 'legal' state and when affected by dirt, poor alignment, lack of maintenance, etc. And that's before we look at glare in snow and fog.

[Starter]

Sorry. I've used conventional headlights, halogen (slightly better), specialty lights - cibie & marchal replacement lights (much better than the halogens - still got two sets in the basement) and now the HIDs. I'll keep the HIDs thank you.

[schmenke]

Enlightening thread.

[Bagwan]

Sorry. I've used conventional headlights, halogen (slightly better), specialty lights - cibie & marchal replacement lights (much better than the halogens - still got two sets in the basement) and now the HIDs. I'll keep the HIDs thank you.

Is that "sorry" for hurting our eyes ?

And , don't they hurt yours coming at you ?
Just wondering a little if my poor attempt at explaining the physics of it was understandable .

[Bagwan]

Enlightening thread.

Brilliant comment , bright boy . Hee hee .

[Starter]

Is that "sorry" for hurting our eyes ?
Not sorry at all. I'd rather hurt you eyes than hurt me by hitting that deer.


And , don't they hurt yours coming at you ?
Just wondering a little if my poor attempt at explaining the physics of it was understandable .
Sure it was understandable, but I don't agree with your premise. They also don't hurt my eyes and I've never heard anyone else say they hurt theirs.

[Big Ben]

In Romania it's nothing but a scam. The main purpose of having lights on in daytime mandatory is to fine drivers. Using them in low visibility conditions was already mandatory so the difference is that now you have to use them in the sunniest of days.... major improvement :rolleyes: . It's also easy to forget about them if you have an older car that doesn't go nuts if you leave them on. In Hungary it's the same situation.

[Knock-on]

Brilliant comment , bright boy . Hee hee .

I'd have said it's more illuminating.

[D-Type]

Dipping your lights is a whole issue in itself.

90-odd years ago when I rode a scooter, hardly any oncoming motorists bothered to dip (possibly because they didn't see me). My usual response was to put my puny headlight on full and drive straight at them holding my left hand in front of my eyes to show I was being dazzled. Then at the last minute I'd swerve away. Quite what I'd have done if he'd swerved the same way I don't know.

I once had a car where the dip was set low and the main high so I had a choice of driving on dipped lights and seeing nothing or driving on main beams and dazzling people - I was even stopped by an irate lorry driver I was following who was being dazzled via his mirrors.

I never know what to do on a dual carriage way or motorway if there's light traffic going my way and a lot coming the other way. You either drive blind or dazzle the oncoming drivers. I compromise and turn them on full when on right handers and on dip on left handers.

The next whinge is the bloke who puts his rear fog lights on when it's foggy and forgets to turn them off when he goes out the next day and the fog has cleared dazzling me. My latest car won't let me do this as turning the lights off automatically turns the fog lights to 'off'

etc, etc

[janneppi]

Dipping your lights is a whole issue in itself.



I once had a car where the dip was set low and the main high so I had a choice of driving on dipped lights and seeing nothing or driving on main beams and dazzling people - I was even stopped by an irate lorry driver I was following who was being dazzled via his mirrors.



I had to replace the head light units in my previous car and adjusted the lights according to the manual, 30 minutes of playing with a screwdriver was worth it. In the next MOT the light's were dead center of the scale where they should be. I might have to do a similar check on the current car too. I hate when someone's light point too high and don't want to be a cause for someone else's irritation. :)

[Knock-on]

On a slightly different topic, I was registering a newly built car at VOSA when we found one of the headlight lens's was actually upside down. Everything else had passed but when we got to the light test, the high been was pointing completely the wrong direction. After 4 hours of examination I couldn't believe it so convinced him to sod off for a cuppa and got the angle grinder out to carve 3 new notches and mount it upside down in the housing and swapped the wires over.

Worked :D

[Jag_Warrior]

GM and certain associated brands (Subaru, for instance) have had daytime running lights (DRLs) as standard equipment on their U.S. vehicles for years. And since I've always driven with my low beams on during the day, I find that feature to be very convenient on my Subie. Even when it's bright & sunny outside, cars and bikes with the lights on are much more noticeable. And as someone who really doesn't like it when someone pulls out in front of me when I'm 50 yards away, anything that lessens the chance of that happening is more than OK by me.

As someone above mentioned differing U.S. state laws about when you are supposed to have your headlights on... my state has a law where you're supposed to have your headlights on whenever your wipers are on (or when it's past dusk dark). But a lot of people don't bother. I can almost forgive that, because they've probably forgotten. But the ones who turn their parking lights on when it's snowing, sleeting or raining, they make me shake my head. They're idiots. It's just too bad the troopers seldom bother stopping them and passing out moving violation tickets.

[Daniel]

I beg to differ. I have HIDs on both of my cars and love them. Much better visibility and range. The low beams have cut offs of course to not blind on coming drivers. They absolutely beat the heck out of standard headlights. Even halogens don't provide the depth of illumination for 60 MPH+ driving, which we have a lot of on US highways and interstates. Drivers do need to be courteous and dim lights when they would effect other drivers, but most do. It's the ones without HIDs who drive around with high beams on because they can't see squat otherwise.

HID's may work in the states, but in the UK they're a nuisance. Roads aren't smooth enough and the self levelling systems simply can't react fast enough to keep the lights pointing down.

[Bagwan]

Not sorry at all. I'd rather hurt you eyes than hurt me by hitting that deer.


Sure it was understandable, but I don't agree with your premise. They also don't hurt my eyes and I've never heard anyone else say they hurt theirs.

If you understand , then you'll get that the deer you're trying to avoid has no blue in it's colouring , so the amber beam will illuminate it far more effectively .

Oh well .
I hope you see all those deer , and I hope you don't fall afoul of those who can't see driving towards you .

[Mark]

Range Rover was following me on a country lane last night. Inches from my bumper even though I had traffic in front of me and blinding me the entire time with his blueish lights.

After we got on the motorway I beeped at him as I overtook; he then tailgated me most of the way home!

[janneppi]

Did you empty your windshield washer tank in that trip?

[Mark]

As it happens yes but not for that reason!

[Bagwan]

I was just talking with a buddy of mine yesterday , and he had a lot to say about the blue lights coming at him .
He owns a cab company , and all his drivers have the same opinion .
They all hate those blue lights .

He runs halogens in all his cars .

Since I explained the physics of it , he now knows why he hates them .
Earlier in the day , he said he got out of his car at a stop light to tell the guy behind in the SUV , that he was being completely blinded by his headlights .

I just thought I'd throw this in , as Starter hadn't heard of anyone else hating them .
These particular professional drivers all say they hurt thier eyes .

[Dave B]

Why HID headlights bother older drivers (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1771460/)

It's an old person problem :p

[Bagwan]

Why HID headlights bother older drivers (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1771460/)

It's an old person problem :p

Good article , Dave .

I thought I'd mention , though , that the problem is worse for old folk , but still a problem for younger ones .

It's worse for old folk , so it's really bad for those driving towards old folk , as they are the one's more likely to be less capable drivers to begin with .
Since there are usually more of them than deer on the road , I think it's maybe a little smarter , unless you live in the bush , to go halogen .