2013 IndyCar Series Schedule

[DanicaFan]

Here is the schedule for next year for the Indycar Series. There are a couple double-headers in the schedule this year. Again, Im not impressed. Too many road/streets compared to ovals...http://diecastcrazy.com/community/images/smilies/sad.gif

2013 IZOD INDYCAR SERIES SCHEDULE
March 24--St. Petersburg, Fla. (street course)
April 7--Barber Motorsports Park, Birmingham, Ala. (road course)
April 21--Long Beach, Calif. (street course)
May 5--Sao Paulo, Brazil (street course)
May 26--Indianapolis 500 (oval)
June 1-2--Detroit doubleheader (street course)
June 8--Texas Motor Speedway (oval)
June 15--Milwaukee (oval)
June 22--Iowa Speedway (oval)
July 7--Pocono (Pa.) Raceway (oval)
July 13-14--Toronto doubleheader (street course)
Aug. 4--Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course (road course)
Aug. 24-25--Sonoma Raceway (road course)
Sept. 1--Baltimore (street race)
Oct. 6--Houston doubleheader (street race)
Oct. 12--Fontana, Calif. (oval)

[DanicaFan]

What's sad is this double-header is just a gimmick because they couldnt get any other venues it doesnt appear or in my opinion try for. This way they can say they have 19 races, not 16. He really needed to push for more ovals for this schedule.

[DanicaFan]

It should read the Houston venue is a double header, not Sonoma. I wish I could edit regardless of time.

[FormerFF]

I'm not sharing your oval enthusiasm. Attendance for most of them other than Indy have either been poor or declining. Even Texas, which used to be the second biggest crowd of the year, is down from what it was.

Hope I can get to Barber again. That's spring break for us and my wife wants to go to the beach.

[Phoenixent]

AR1 reports that Indycar has a triple crown event with the addition of Pocono 400 to the Indy 500 and California 500....WTH is AR1 smoking when a true Triple Crown is three 500 mile races and not two 500 mile races and a 400 mile event. The schedule is okay but I really wish they would have added a Mexico race and maybe Michigan...

[garyshell]

It should read the Houston venue is a double header, not Sonoma. I wish I could edit regardless of time.

I took care of it.

Gary

[anthonyvop]

AR1 reports that Indycar has a triple crown event with the addition of Pocono 400 to the Indy 500 and California 500....WTH is AR1 smoking when a true Triple Crown is three 500 mile races and not two 500 mile races and a 400 mile event. The schedule is okay but I really wish they would have added a Mexico race and maybe Michigan...

Well whatever AR1 is smoking it was good sh*t because Mark was right.

[Chris R]

It is a bit BS that Pocono is most likely to be a 400 - but then again, three real superspeedways is a good start and $1,000,000 to win the "triple crown" is a good gimmick... I am hoping that if they only do 400 this year that they find they can easily fit in a 500 mile race next year..... If they can't, I say they run 500 miles and condense it into a 2 hour prime-time broadcast....

I will reserve judgement on they doubleheaders - seems like a long-shot - but maybe it is a good idea - the proof will be in the proverbial pudding.....

Overall it is not earth-shattering, but nothing to be ashamed of, I cannot say I was expecting anything wildly different.....

[philipbain]

He really needed to push for more ovals for this schedule.

I think the balance of venues is good, with a few ovals in there to present diversity and the return of Pocono is fantastic, Mario Andretti always said Pocono was a much bigger challenge than Indy in a single seater so it should really sort the men from the boys! One criticism I would have is that the schedule is quite heavy on street tracks with only 3 road courses, the fact that they don't go to Road America is a crime and it needs sorting! As for the double headers, I quite like the idea, it's been done forever in motorcycle racing and it gives fans attending for the whole weekend more action so i'm in favour, though if it'll work on TV i'm not so sure.

[00steven]

Pretty solid really, they did a real good job on the t.v. side of things...

[Starter]

I'll withhold comment on the doubleheaders until we see how they play out.

[SoCalPVguy]

Sept. 1--Baltimore (street race)
Oct. 6--Houston doubleheader (street race)


Giant 5-week gap kills series fan interest and momentum. At least 1 but better yet 2 more races need to be added in September. This is the start of football season... Why is it no track is begging for an ICS race ? Is it exorbitant sanction fees ? Just like this year when the 6-week "china gap" killed interest in ICS. Notgood.com

[heliocastroneves#3]

They did a good job with adding Pocono Raceway, of course we do need a lot more ovals but this is a good start. Even the 2012 schedule wasn't bad at all, so I can't be unhappy about this one either. Having some double headers, once again a 500-miler as the season finale and four ovals in a row is great. Maybe the Pocono race will still become a 500-miler, keep in mind that the original distance for this seasons' Auto Club Speedway event was also 400 miles..

[djparky]

I don't mind the idea of double headers- GP2, GP3 and Renault World Series have 2 races per weekend- but dear lord why Detroit? one race there is more than enough per year. I was rather hoping that the ovals would have the double headers. Overall aside from the lack of Road America it's a decent mix of ovals, road and street courses

[SoCalPVguy]

They did a good job with adding Pocono Raceway, of course we do need a lot more ovals but this is a good start. Even the 2012 schedule wasn't bad at all, so I can't be unhappy about this one either. Having some double headers, once again a 500-miler as the season finale and four ovals in a row is great. Maybe the Pocono race will still become a 500-miler, keep in mind that the original distance for this seasons' Auto Club Speedway event was also 400 miles..

Despite being the absolute worst track on the circuit - bumpy, narrow, no passing zones... it IS the HOME of Roger Penske and GM (Chevy) I am only surprised Detroit didn't get a TRIPLE header.

[00steven]

Sept. 1--Baltimore (street race)
Oct. 6--Houston doubleheader (street race)


Giant 5-week gap kills series fan interest and momentum. At least 1 but better yet 2 more races need to be added in September. This is the start of football season... Why is it no track is begging for an ICS race ? Is it exorbitant sanction fees ? Just like this year when the 6-week "china gap" killed interest in ICS. Notgood.com

F1 does it.

[truefan72]

They should add one more event on May 25 which would be the Indy road coarse using the former F1 configuration
Or if it is too distracting from the sunday race, then they should still add it 2nd week in September.
Then there will be a nice 20 race schedule and that track will be put to good use.

[truefan72]

They did a good job with adding Pocono Raceway, of course we do need a lot more ovals but this is a good start. Even the 2012 schedule wasn't bad at all, so I can't be unhappy about this one either. Having some double headers, once again a 500-miler as the season finale and four ovals in a row is great. Maybe the Pocono race will still become a 500-miler, keep in mind that the original distance for this seasons' Auto Club Speedway event was also 400 miles..

less ovals and more traditional tracks is the way of the future IMO.
I hate the ovals. Keep the triple crown if you wish, but that's it.

no Laguna Seca?
No Watkins Glen?
No Austin COTA?
no Montreal?

I would even add the alternate German track of Hockenheim or Nurburgring, whichever one F1 is not using that year, as well as Silverstone.

What's with all these unbearable street courses

I think ICS is missing a huge opportunity.
The only way they will get back to the glory days of 80's and 90's is with a series that matches F1 in both its nature and courses.
If they added more real tracks both domestic and abroad, they would see their domestic and global interest from both drivers and fans increase dramatically.

[truefan72]

Here is my dream ICS Schedule


2013 IZOD INDYCAR SERIES SCHEDULE
March 24--Long Beach, Calif. (street course)
April 7--Barber Motorsports Park, Birmingham, Ala. (road course)
April 21--Austin, Texas (track course)
May 5--Sao Paulo, Brazil (track course)
May 12--Indianapolis (track course)
May 26--Indianapolis 500 (oval)
June 2--Detroit (street course)
June 8--Texas Motor Speedway (oval)
June 15--Watkins Glen, NY (track Course)
June 22--Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course (road course)
July 7--Pocono (Pa.) Raceway (oval)
July 14--Toronto, Canada (street course)
Aug. 4--Montreal, Canada (track course)
Aug. 18--Sonoma Raceway (track course)
Sept 1--Baltimore (street course)
Sept. 22--Silverstone, UK (track race)
Sept. 29 Hockenheim, GER (track course)
Oct. 12-13--Houston doubleheader (street race)
Oct. 27--Fontana, Calif. (oval)

20 races

[Phoenixent]

Well whatever AR1 is smoking it was good sh*t because Mark was right.

You missed the point of what I was saying.... It's not a true Triple Crown as it's a 100 miles shy of the mark. The Triple Crown of which their is only one winner to date is three 500 mile events hence a Triple Crown and not three Super Speedways. But it is a good start to get some heritage back as even Roger Penske worked hard to get this elusive award and was not able to get it but Jim Hall has one with driver Al Unser Sr in 1978.

[Mark Pedersen]

Here is my dream ICS Schedule


2013 IZOD INDYCAR SERIES SCHEDULE
March 24--Long Beach, Calif. (street course)
April 7--Barber Motorsports Park, Birmingham, Ala. (road course)
April 21--Austin, Texas (track course)
May 5--Sao Paulo, Brazil (track course)
May 12--Indianapolis (track course)
May 26--Indianapolis 500 (oval)
June 2--Detroit (street course)
June 8--Texas Motor Speedway (oval)
June 15--Watkins Glen, NY (track Course)
June 22--Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course (road course)
July 7--Pocono (Pa.) Raceway (oval)
July 14--Toronto, Canada (street course)
Aug. 4--Montreal, Canada (track course)
Aug. 18--Sonoma Raceway (track course)
Sept 1--Baltimore (street course)
Sept. 22--Silverstone, UK (track race)
Sept. 29 Hockenheim, GER (track course)
Oct. 12-13--Houston doubleheader (street race)
Oct. 27--Fontana, Calif. (oval)

20 races

not a bad schedule - but my thoughts/additions would be the following:

I would NOT run the indy road course - that place is special and no indycar should ever run the road course (in my opinion)

I would however alternate (year about) between the old indy course at Brands Hatch - London and the Rockingham UK tri oval. (alternating year about keeps the product fresh with the fans)

I would go back to the Gold Coast and/or a race in Asia for post season one off race - they will need a big pay day to make it work but it would be great to keep the mechanics in the teams working over the off season. (if not the gold coast, another Australian flyaway race).

How about starting the season late Feb/very early march in Phoenix on the oval?

one more thought - a double header in Cleveland - Friday NIGHT on the 'roval' (under lights) and Sunday on the road corse

the regular season needs to finish on an oval - fontana was a good race so happy with that

[DanicaFan]

I took care of it.

Gary


Thanks.

[heliocastroneves#3]

@truefan72:

Terrible schedule, way too much road/street courses... Not where the current IndyCar Series has been build on, this series wasn't made to ultimately get the same traditions as CART/Champ Car had... The only tradition the current IndyCar Series has is the Indy 500 and if the ex-Champ Car/CART fans don't like it.... Well, they should get over it and look to the future instead of the past.. IndyCar should not come even close to F1 because IndyCar is so much better in terms of racing.

[wedge]

I don't mind the idea of double headers- GP2, GP3 and Renault World Series have 2 races per weekend- but dear lord why Detroit? one race there is more than enough per year. I was rather hoping that the ovals would have the double headers. Overall aside from the lack of Road America it's a decent mix of ovals, road and street courses

They're feeder/lower categories and Indycar is supposed to be the pinnacle of AOWR with Grand Prix style distances.

Saying that I'm open minded because Indycar desperately needs exposure to break a dint into NASCAR.

[garyshell]

You missed the point of what I was saying.... It's not a true Triple Crown as it's a 100 miles shy of the mark. The Triple Crown of which their is only one winner to date is three 500 mile events hence a Triple Crown and not three Super Speedways. But it is a good start to get some heritage back as even Roger Penske worked hard to get this elusive award and was not able to get it but Jim Hall has one with driver Al Unser Sr in 1978.

I'm not sure why a triple crown MUST be three 500 mile races? Where is that written in stone?

Gary

[Chris R]

I think a good Indycar "triple Crown" SHOULD have 3 500 mile races on super speedways. But as Phoenix said - at least this is a start in the right direction - I would hope they find it practical to make Pocono a 500 miler soon enough....

[FIAT1]

@truefan72:

Terrible schedule, way too much road/street courses... Not where the current IndyCar Series has been build on, this series wasn't made to ultimately get the same traditions as CART/Champ Car had... The only tradition the current IndyCar Series has is the Indy 500 and if the ex-Champ Car/CART fans don't like it.... Well, they should get over it and look to the future instead of the past.. IndyCar should not come even close to F1 because IndyCar is so much better in terms of racing.

Why is so hard for you to apprehend the fact that it was PPG Indycar world series before the damage, and Indycar of today? Why in every conversation you post same bs about cart f1 etc. Why can't you understand that oval tracks serve only as massive billboard for aluminum factorys to display their product, when it comes to open wheel now days. Why is hard for you to stop blaming Cart fans and let it go your self. Why is hard for you to understand that steak lover don't like burger that much, even if you put cheese on it. We all traying to hang around and hope for the best and if they gonna stick to spec cars I'm afraid it's over. I will respectfully tell you, please don't compare this shadow of it's former self series to old Indycar/cart days and never use it in the same sentence with F1. Why? Makes you look foolish, misinformed and misguided.

[Mark Pedersen]

@truefan72:

Terrible schedule, way too much road/street courses... Not where the current IndyCar Series has been build on, this series wasn't made to ultimately get the same traditions as CART/Champ Car had... The only tradition the current IndyCar Series has is the Indy 500 and if the ex-Champ Car/CART fans don't like it.... Well, they should get over it and look to the future instead of the past.. IndyCar should not come even close to F1 because IndyCar is so much better in terms of racing.

here is my problem with your opinion - no one shows up to Non-indy ovals so if you have a schedule full of ovals, indycar will go broke (actually that already happened). In my opinion the schedule 40% oval, 30% road course and 30% street course.

one further thought - Indycar needs to get back to Mexico for a race (like CART used to.)

the 'post season' should go to any international destination that has lots of money...if the price is right - race on anything they want you to race on.

well thats one mans opinion anyway...

[GRW1983]

A quick update, Randy Bernard has said that the schedule will be 19 races this year with no late additions. Providence "ran out of time", but is in the frame for 2014, nor will we be going to New Orleans or Kentucky until 2014 at the earliest. Quebec, Michigan, Phoenix, Road America & Austin are other 2014 possibilities.

[truefan72]

Why is so hard for you to apprehend the fact that it was PPG Indycar world series before the damage, and Indycar of today? Why in every conversation you post same bs about cart f1 etc. Why can't you understand that oval tracks serve only as massive billboard for aluminum factorys to display their product, when it comes to open wheel now days. Why is hard for you to stop blaming Cart fans and let it go your self. Why is hard for you to understand that steak lover don't like burger that much, even if you put cheese on it. We all traying to hang around and hope for the best and if they gonna stick to spec cars I'm afraid it's over. I will respectfully tell you, please don't compare this shadow of it's former self series to old Indycar/cart days and never use it in the same sentence with F1. Why? Makes you look foolish, misinformed and misguided.

thanks
you displayed more calm than I would

I remember the glory days of the Cart series and my weekends were filled to the brim with watching F1 and IndyCart, much to the shagrin of my GF now wife.
This current series is a shell of what it used to be. spec cars and too many ovals have ruined the sport completely. There used to be a time when F1 really feared the influence of Cart, and often had clauses forbidding teams and drivers from cross series relationships. There were even times when drivers would gladly switch series for a better pay day and glory. Now even ousted F1 rejects would rather do nothing than drive in this series.
Nothing would please me more than a return of relevance of IndyCar and I think they can do it, but the powers to be are going down the wrong path.

[truefan72]

here is my problem with your opinion - no one shows up to Non-indy ovals so if you have a schedule full of ovals, indycar will go broke (actually that already happened). In my opinion the schedule 40% oval, 30% road course and 30% street course.

one further thought - Indycar needs to get back to Mexico for a race (like CART used to.)

the 'post season' should go to any international destination that has lots of money...if the price is right - race on anything they want you to race on.

well thats one mans opinion anyway...

Abu Dhabi would probably love to host a race.

[truefan72]

A quick update, Randy Bernard has said that the schedule will be 19 races this year with no late additions. Providence "ran out of time", but is in the frame for 2014, nor will we be going to New Orleans or Kentucky until 2014 at the earliest. Quebec, Michigan, Phoenix, Road America & Austin are other 2014 possibilities.

It is utterly pathetic that they could not figure out that including COTA should have been essential for their 2013 calendar.
How on earth would they not even consider it. Morons

[garyshell]

Why is so hard for you to apprehend the fact that it was PPG Indycar world series before the damage, and Indycar of today? Why in every conversation you post same bs about cart f1 etc. Why can't you understand that oval tracks serve only as massive billboard for aluminum factorys to display their product, when it comes to open wheel now days. Why is hard for you to stop blaming Cart fans and let it go your self. Why is hard for you to understand that steak lover don't like burger that much, even if you put cheese on it. We all traying to hang around and hope for the best and if they gonna stick to spec cars I'm afraid it's over. I will respectfully tell you, please don't compare this shadow of it's former self series to old Indycar/cart days and never use it in the same sentence with F1. Why? Makes you look foolish, misinformed and misguided.

There are an awful lot of personal pronouns in this reply. Remember folks, attack the post not the poster. 'Nuff said.

Gary

[FIAT1]

There are an awful lot of personal pronouns in this reply. Remember folks, attack the post not the poster. 'Nuff said.

Gary

Posting here is never my intention to get personal with anyone and I don't see it that way, but if my statement with respect to other poster is translated with that frame of thinking,I do apologize.

[Phoenixent]

I'm not sure why a triple crown MUST be three 500 mile races? Where is that written in stone?

Gary

Gary it's not a triple crown. It's the Triple Crown and it was always three 500 mile race from 1971 to 1989. None of that champcar BS of three Canadian races is a triple crown. It is the most difficult title to win as 500 milers are the hardest races to complete let alone win. That is why the Triple Crown was and still is the most sought after award in Indycar history next to the Borg Warner. But it is so elusive that there is one one winner compared to 90+ images on the Borg Warner.

[nigelred5]

The REAL Triple Crown is three races of different lengths and three very different race tracks. 1m1/4, 1m 3/16, 1m1/2. It's managed to survive since 1931. I think a revived triple crown can manage a year until they can work out a tv slot that will allow 500 miles at Pocono in 2014.

My question is what happens when we can finally get MIS back on the schedule for a 500 miler? Who gets de-throned?

[garyshell]

Posting here is never my intention to get personal with anyone and I don't see it that way, but if my statement with respect to other poster is translated with that frame of thinking,I do apologize.

No apology needed. I was just pointing out that removing the word "you" from your reply would have made it about the ideas you were questoning. As it was worded it was TECHNICALLY questioning the poster not the posters ideas. I was not trying to specifically call you out on this, just saw an opportunity to set a tone for such discussion. I want to see some true debate on topics here and one way to foster that without people getting angry with each other is to make the discussions about IDEAS.

Gary

[Phoenixent]

The REAL Triple Crown is three races of different lengths and three very different race tracks. 1m1/4, 1m 3/16, 1m1/2. It's managed to survive since 1931. I think a revived triple crown can manage a year until they can work out a tv slot that will allow 500 miles at Pocono in 2014.

My question is what happens when we can finally get MIS back on the schedule for a 500 miler? Who gets de-throned?

Horse racing is a little different and if we use that analogy we should have the drivers race again on some dirt tracks which I would not have a problem with. But the Triple Crown in Indycar Racing has always been three 500 mile races.

[Swarley]

I'm not huge on the idea of having 6 oval races. My personal preference would probably be about 4. I'm very disappointed that COTA and Road America aren't on the schedule.

[GRW1983]

Overall, I'm quite happy with the 2013 schedule, although I think there's room for 1 or 2 additional races this year if Randy Bernard can get a late deal together with Providence in August & Kentucky perhaps, in September. I'm prepared to give the double-headers a go as it's something new and I'm glad that standing starts are being implemented as well. It's nice to hear that Beaux Barfield is willing to try them elsewhere if things go well at the likes of Detroit & Toronto. Looking at the 2013 schedule date-wise, there is room for expansion towards 2014 and I think IndyCar should go for 22 race weekends with 25 races (keeping the 3 double-headers) next year. It sounds a lot I know, but RB did say in the past that 22 races was his target. So here's how my future schedule would look:

Start the season 4 weeke earlier in late-February with the New Orleans road course (a new market for IndyCar) as the season opener, then shift Brazil to early-March as race 2, then St.Pete, Barber & Long beach as normal. Phoenix could then return as the pre-Indy race in early-May, then Indy, Detroit(double-header), Texas, Milwaukee, Iowa, Pocono & Toronto (double-header) in their usual slots. Then have a street race in Quebec (replacing Edmonton) in late-July, then off to Mid-Ohio in early-August. Providence and/or Road America would follow, although I doubt both could be added as it would make August look too crowded, then Sonoma & Baltimore. Then, with the gaps in September, I'd add Michigan and Kentucky to increase the oval count (although Austin could get a late-September date as it would be close to Houston's date), then the Houston double-header followed by Fontana, as the season-finale.

If you could have all of those races, it would be 24 race weekends with 27 races, but I know I'm dreaming about that. In my opinion, both Austin & Road America SHOULD be on the schedule, but whether they actually happen is another matter. I'll just have to hope for now.

[NY2IA]

Is there a way to find out if Indycar tried to add other tracks to the schedule, but could not work out the details? I know a number of posters asked about Road America. Was Road American approached? If so, what happened? I'd be interested in hearing what is involved with securing tracks to Indycar's schedule. Thanks.

[bugeyedgomer]

Is there a way to find out if Indycar tried to add other tracks to the schedule, but could not work out the details? I know a number of posters asked about Road America. Was Road American approached? If so, what happened? I'd be interested in hearing what is involved with securing tracks to Indycar's schedule. Thanks.

Road America would seem a slam dunk based on the clamoring between drivers and fans alike to return. But, as track president George Bruggenthies says, there has to be something IndyCar can bring to the table beyond the desire to scarf a double brat at the St. John's stand in the infield.

“We're very open to it, but it's out of my hands,” he explained. “My understanding is that Michael Andretti has got an exclusive Wisconsin deal here (with Milwaukee). Until he's happy, there's only gonna be one IndyCar race in Wisconsin. There's nothing I can do about that.

“I've talked to Mr. [Randy] Bernard several times in face-to-face meetings. You've got team owners running the series. I don't know what their future is. Everyone's gotta pay the bills. But he [Andretti] wasn't paying hardly anything for his sanctioning fee this year. I don't know how that goes.”

While Bruggenthies denied specifics of what a sports car sanctioning fee is by comparison, he did note IndyCar's number.

“For sports cars, it is confidential, but it is much lower,” he said. “But with the IndyCar sanctioning fee, I don't have a contract with them so I can tell you what they're asking. They're asking $2 or $2.2 (million) – and I'm thinking, ‘You guys are crazy! You don't have a TV package worth much, and you don't bring anything along that brings revenue – hospitality or a partner.' It does not make sense.”

Bruggenthies wants the IndyCar Series to race as the Sunday headliner on a doubleheader weekend with the American Le Mans Series.

"What's hurting the IndyCar Series is the fee, and there's really no sharing and benefits to the promoter," Bruggenthies said. "Most big series you have some other benefits, whether it's TV revenue, hospitality, sponsorship sharing. Those things don't exist in IndyCar racing anymore."

[GRW1983]

Road America would seem a slam dunk based on the clamoring between drivers and fans alike to return. But, as track president George Bruggenthies says, there has to be something IndyCar can bring to the table beyond the desire to scarf a double brat at the St. John's stand in the infield.

“We're very open to it, but it's out of my hands,” he explained. “My understanding is that Michael Andretti has got an exclusive Wisconsin deal here (with Milwaukee). Until he's happy, there's only gonna be one IndyCar race in Wisconsin. There's nothing I can do about that.

“I've talked to Mr. [Randy] Bernard several times in face-to-face meetings. You've got team owners running the series. I don't know what their future is. Everyone's gotta pay the bills. But he [Andretti] wasn't paying hardly anything for his sanctioning fee this year. I don't know how that goes.”

While Bruggenthies denied specifics of what a sports car sanctioning fee is by comparison, he did note IndyCar's number.

“For sports cars, it is confidential, but it is much lower,” he said. “But with the IndyCar sanctioning fee, I don't have a contract with them so I can tell you what they're asking. They're asking $2 or $2.2 (million) – and I'm thinking, ‘You guys are crazy! You don't have a TV package worth much, and you don't bring anything along that brings revenue – hospitality or a partner.' It does not make sense.”

Bruggenthies wants the IndyCar Series to race as the Sunday headliner on a doubleheader weekend with the American Le Mans Series.

"What's hurting the IndyCar Series is the fee, and there's really no sharing and benefits to the promoter," Bruggenthies said. "Most big series you have some other benefits, whether it's TV revenue, hospitality, sponsorship sharing. Those things don't exist in IndyCar racing anymore."

Some good points there. Would it make any difference to the sanctioning fee if there were more races on the schedule, therefore Indycar wouldn't have to charge so much? 16 venues at present, but upping to 22 would surely help lower some sanctioning fees.

[bugeyedgomer]

Some good points there. Would it make any difference to the sanctioning fee if there were more races on the schedule, therefore Indycar wouldn't have to charge so much? 16 venues at present, but upping to 22 would surely help lower some sanctioning fees.

some old sales joke about making it up in volume applies here

[truefan72]

Road America would seem a slam dunk based on the clamoring between drivers and fans alike to return. But, as track president George Bruggenthies says, there has to be something IndyCar can bring to the table beyond the desire to scarf a double brat at the St. John's stand in the infield.

“We're very open to it, but it's out of my hands,” he explained. “My understanding is that Michael Andretti has got an exclusive Wisconsin deal here (with Milwaukee). Until he's happy, there's only gonna be one IndyCar race in Wisconsin. There's nothing I can do about that.

“I've talked to Mr. [Randy] Bernard several times in face-to-face meetings. You've got team owners running the series. I don't know what their future is. Everyone's gotta pay the bills. But he [Andretti] wasn't paying hardly anything for his sanctioning fee this year. I don't know how that goes.”

While Bruggenthies denied specifics of what a sports car sanctioning fee is by comparison, he did note IndyCar's number.

“For sports cars, it is confidential, but it is much lower,” he said. “But with the IndyCar sanctioning fee, I don't have a contract with them so I can tell you what they're asking. They're asking $2 or $2.2 (million) – and I'm thinking, ‘You guys are crazy! You don't have a TV package worth much, and you don't bring anything along that brings revenue – hospitality or a partner.' It does not make sense.”

Bruggenthies wants the IndyCar Series to race as the Sunday headliner on a doubleheader weekend with the American Le Mans Series.

"What's hurting the IndyCar Series is the fee, and there's really no sharing and benefits to the promoter," Bruggenthies said. "Most big series you have some other benefits, whether it's TV revenue, hospitality, sponsorship sharing. Those things don't exist in IndyCar racing anymore."


This is very telling and sad at the same time
the state if affairs at IndyCar are in shambles

[Starter]

This is very telling and sad at the same time
the state if affairs at IndyCar are in shambles
I love all the doom and gloom when the on track racing is the best it's been in the 2000's. If it ever gets back to like in was in 85 to 95 you all are going to be committing suicide from the horror of it all.

[mike15]

Detroit is a looser of a race both in racing and attendance.
Bring back the MIS 500 and Cleveland. Cleveland attendance was on the rise do to better promotion and ticket packages.
With great promotion and lower ticket prices the MIS 500 could renew interest and make a come back.

[anthonyvop]

I love all the doom and gloom when the on track racing is the best it's been in the 2000's. If it ever gets back to like in was in 85 to 95 you all are going to be committing suicide from the horror of it all.

Has it been the best? Talent wise across the board we are looking at the weakest since I can remember driving an underpowered, spec racer. The F2000 season was more exciting

[anthonyvop]

Detroit is a looser of a race both in racing and attendance.
Bring back the MIS 500 and Cleveland. Cleveland attendance was on the rise do to better promotion and ticket packages.
With great promotion and lower ticket prices the MIS 500 could renew interest and make a come back.

The series that we have today or in any of its forms has never raced in Cleveland(It was a Champ Car race) so how could attendance be on the rise?

Also every Oval race has seen declining or stagnant attendance but one so what makes you think that adding another Oval race would help?

[garyshell]

Has it been the best? Talent wise across the board we are looking at the weakest since I can remember driving an underpowered, spec racer. The F2000 season was more exciting

I think you are forgetting the likes of the racing dentist and others early in the IRL's formataion. But I understand, I'd like to forget that era too.

Gary

[Jacob]

The REAL Triple Crown is three races of different lengths and three very different race tracks. 1m1/4, 1m 3/16, 1m1/2. It's managed to survive since 1931.

Actually the REAL triple crown has been going since the 1850s, with a 1 mile race, a 1.5 mile race and a 1.75 mile race, at Newmarket, Epsom and Doncaster respectively. As usual, you yanks nicked it ha ha!

[NaBUru38]

Rather than a Triple Crown, I'd prefer a Grand Slam that represents all types of circuits: Long Beach, Indianapolis, a 500km race at Road America or Watkins Glen, and another oval like Pocono, Kentucky, Las Vegas or Fontana before football begins.

[anthonyvop]

Does anyone really think that having a triple crown(In any form) will actually cure IndyCar's ills? Or alleviate a symptom?

[Chris R]

Does anyone really think that having a triple crown(In any form) will actually cure IndyCar's ills? Or alleviate a symptom?

I don't, but I do not think it can hurt and it is much more likely a small part of the solution than part of the problem.... I think what is more important than the "Triple Crown" itself is that Indycar will now be back on 3 proper super-speedways instead of just 1....

But sort of changing the demographics of society and turning back the clock on the advancement of media technology, reducing the overall availability of entertainment options, and restricting some "sin" industry in such a way that auto-racing is the most viable form of advertisement available to them - I don't think anything will cure Indycar's ills. The sooner we fans and the powers that be adjust to the new paradigm the better - the sport is going to be a niche sport, the money will not be the same as it once was, it will be funded more by a combo of ticket sales an wealthy individuals who enjoy the sport and do not mind spending $$ on it....

[anthonyvop]

I don't, but I do not think it can hurt and it is much more likely a small part of the solution than part of the problem.... I think what is more important than the "Triple Crown" itself is that Indycar will now be back on 3 proper super-speedways instead of just 1....

But sort of changing the demographics of society and turning back the clock on the advancement of media technology, reducing the overall availability of entertainment options, and restricting some "sin" industry in such a way that auto-racing is the most viable form of advertisement available to them - I don't think anything will cure Indycar's ills. The sooner we fans and the powers that be adjust to the new paradigm the better - the sport is going to be a niche sport, the money will not be the same as it once was, it will be funded more by a combo of ticket sales an wealthy individuals who enjoy the sport and do not mind spending $$ on it....

Again I ask.

Will a triple crown that adds more Oval races cure any Indycar Ills?

[heliocastroneves#3]

Again I ask.

Will a triple crown that adds more Oval races cure any Indycar Ills?
Yes, of course it will. We already have enough road/streets and not enough ovals, so adding a triple crown with more ovals to the schedule will definitely be better. Don't forget the series was build on ovals and lost a lot of those tracks during the last couple of years. It's great to see them going to back to them slowly and to see the series having 3 Superspeedways on the schedule again, the last time we had 3 Superspeedways was back in '05... That's a long time!

[Don Capps]

Again I ask.

Will a triple crown that adds more Oval races cure any Indycar Ills?

The likelihood is rather on the order of slim to none that the proposed Triple Crown will do much, if anything, to help cure any of the ills afflicting IndyCar at the moment.

It would be nice to think that the doom and gloom is unwarrented and simply the usual moaning and groaning that often emanates from the Internet fora crowd. As easy a target as Tony George is for most of those ills, he had enablers on his end and there were those on the other end whose actions made George's eventual Phyrric victory rather more likely if not necessarily inevitable.

From about the time that the board tracks faded from the scene, roughly the 1927/28 season, until about the middle of the Sixties, the AAA National Championship and the USAC National Championship Trail were pretty much very minor events in the overall US sports scene and not much better when it came to the automobile racing scene -- such as it was at times. Consider also that it was really during the Twenties that the IMS and its Memorial Day race truly became not merely an automobile race, but A Major US Sporting Event. In essence, the Indianapolis race sucked all the oxygen from the US racing scene. That Eddie Rickenbacker (formerly Rickenbacher) was president of both the IMS and the AAA Contest Board from late 1927 until late 1945 ensured that it was the IMS that truly was at the center of the US racing scene. The consequence, unintended or otherwise given the work of Pop Meyers, was the 1994 declaration by Tony George of the creation of the Indy Racing League, an enterprise centered on the IMS and a number of events that mainly existed to provided supporting events or as a feeder series to the annual Memorial Day event.

To break the Indianapolis paradigm seems to be something that even Jim Phelps and the Impossible Mission Force would fail to do. That said, about the closest that the IMS paradigm came to being mitigated was with CART by the time that the IRL was created. Note the word "closest." I would suggest that even had the IRL/CART cow chip tossing feud not occurred that any notion that CART could have outgunned NASCAR is very wishful thinking.

That USAC, CART, IRL, Champcar, and IndyCar have all been their own worse enemies should not bode well for the future. I think that IndyCar will manage to survive for, maybe, another three to five years, but after that....

[garyshell]

I don't, but I do not think it can hurt and it is much more likely a small part of the solution than part of the problem....


Again I ask.

Will a triple crown that adds more Oval races cure any Indycar Ills?

Asked and answered.

Gary

[Mark in Oshawa]

@truefan72:

Terrible schedule, way too much road/street courses... Not where the current IndyCar Series has been build on, this series wasn't made to ultimately get the same traditions as CART/Champ Car had... The only tradition the current IndyCar Series has is the Indy 500 and if the ex-Champ Car/CART fans don't like it.... Well, they should get over it and look to the future instead of the past.. IndyCar should not come even close to F1 because IndyCar is so much better in terms of racing.

Well I dont recall a small crowd at Long Beach, or Baltimore or Toronto, but I have seen more empty seats than I can think of at every oval outside of Indy...and I love oval racing, but it you cant sell what people aint buying.