Who to replace Latvala in Argentina?

[Kielder]

If today there isn't any official communicate, it will be Sordo testing the car at Cumbria on the two following days. Today I believe he and Del Barrio are doing everything related to the official clothes, helmets, seats, etc.
The support of Ford Spain was basic for the deal.

[Kielder]

Well, there'll be no more speculations. Some sources say that they're already testing today. Now, thanks Xsara Fan for your information, we can say Sordo is the first who has driven three WRC 1.6 (let's hope the fourth next year :D ).
It's strange that Prodrive says that they asked M-Sport to give donations to various nominated charities instead taking any fee (The end is near!).

[Gard]

Right you back on topic:
Satans hora den djavla engesman Vill-icke-sson har forfarande inte ringt.....Vituuuun!!!!

As Per can affirm, I politely mentioned that I curiously have still not received the call to pack for Argentina..

More snooze at 0800

Sure, very polite.

[A FONDO]

The support of Ford Spain was basic for the deal.
I knew there is something hidden, Malcolm can't be so generous :D even if his son doesnt spend his money anymore :D


It's strange that Prodrive says that they asked M-Sport to give donations to various nominated charities instead taking any fee (The end is near!).It would be strange if they were random charities. Nominated means money laundering and nothing else.

[Iskald]

It's just one thing to do, Young Østberg. Just trash the spaniard!

[Kielder]

Please Dani, something different this time... :p :

[noel157]

From Prodrive facebook account

The Ford World Rally Team is confirming this morning that Dani Sordo will replace the injured Jari-Matti Latvala in the Fiesta WRC at the next round of the World Rally Championship in Argentina next week. Latvala was forced to withdraw after breaking his left collarbone in a cross-country ski-ing accident while training in northern Finland last week. We have given permission for Dani to compete in the Ford in order to help M-Sport out of this difficult situation and to give fans the chance to see Dani in action once more. It will of course give Dani more valuable competitive driving time as he prepares for his IRC round in Corsica next month in the Drive-Pro MINI S2000 and then the Prodrive WRC Team’s next event in New Zealand in June. Carlos del Barrio was originally due to co-drive Eliseo Salazar in Argentina in his debut in the MINI WRC; Marc Marti will now take his place (subject to FIA approval). Dani Sordo said: “I am really excited about going to Argentina. When you are a rally driver all you want to do is to compete, so I am really happy that Prodrive has given me the chance to drive the Ford. I was second the last time I competed in Argentina, but as I will be learning a new car, it will be difficult to repeat this.” Ford World Rally Team director Malcolm Wilson said: “We’re fortunate to have a driver of Dani’s calibre to join us. His experience at Rally Argentina was a key factor in the decision, having started the rally five times and finishing second in 2009. The agreement is for one rally only, and I would like to thank the management of Dani’s current team [Prodrive], who were extremely gracious in helping us in such challenging circumstances.” Dani and Carlos will join regular pairing Petter Solberg and Chris Patterson for the four-day Rally Argentina, which will be based in Carlos Paz on 26 - 29 April. As we did not wish to profit from Ford’s misfortune, Prodrive is not taking any fee for Dani and Carlos, but we have proposed that M Sport makes significant donations to various nominated charities.





Strange that Wilson refers to Prodrive as " Dani’s current team"? It should be just "Prodrive" or "Dani's team". And "significant" donation to "nominated" charities and Ford Spain's role? There's more to this situation than meets the eye.

[J4MIE]

It will be interesting to see how it goes.

[Tomi]

Some guys are learning very slowly. Or can not learn. It is not so unique in WRC, but very expensive to run them for nothing for many years :)

Check Latvala's 'tarmac-history', he is doing full-seasons from 2004(2005?)

Just of curiosity how much have you spended??

[bretddog]

I think there were a couple of gravel rallies in 2009, one of them was Australia, where Sordo showed a good step forward on gravel, setting competitive times to Loeb. At that point I expected to see him repeat it, but that failed to materialize. I'll not speculate much why, but I note that Ogier was also showing impressive speed at that time. Sordo later seemed to go a little bit backwards, and it didn't seem logical. Though it may also be simply mental, from seeing he was challanged from within the team. Whatever the reason, I believe there is more speed to come from Sordo, at least in the fast gravel rallies.

[dimviii]

if in 97km he lost 25 secs, than teorically in 340km would lose about 90 seconds. In my country, 90 seconds is the same as 1m30s. In my country and using our unit measures, 1m30s is closest of 1m14s (Solberg) than 2m41s (Novikov). Pure maths. But as i said, this is in my country, and here we are a litle but confused with the presence of the Troika from de FMI/UE :D

Now you measure Dani with Petter,while we were talking the speed about Dani vs Loeb and Citroen sabotage at Danis car. Petter is not the benchmark.Loeb is the benchmark and as you can see you strugle to find a non tarmac event that he was faster.




Yes, that's why he never won a snow rally, right? :D
Loeb has 68? wins Which is the percentage wins in snow instead of tarmac,gravel he participated?If you search you will see that is not a snow expert.




Without "setup sabotage" he was not as good as Loeb, but was close. With "setup sabotage" he was far from Loeb. It's simple!.
Ok now without sabotage he will win Loeb.Fiesta is prooven fast car at gravel at least.





Yes i can. They were not driving a works Citroen.

But Dani was.....your theory collapsed.

[dimviii]

Some guys are learning very slowly. Or can not learn. It is not so unique in WRC, but very expensive to run them for nothing for many years :)

Check Latvala's 'tarmac-history', he is doing full-seasons from 2004(2005?)

The basic problem with the WRC: too many 'gravel-boys' in work's cars, for long-long years without progress on tarmac, while the main threat is a complex guy, who is fast on every surface.

Here is the time to forget these gravel-only-drivers :)

very right post!
Also we saw Ogier in a one off good asphalt pace,and at the next one again slow and setups problems.Same as Latvalas pace at asphalt/gravel at last rallies at last year.
What i want to say is that is not enough 1 or 2 rallies to make conclusions,specially for drivers that they had a bad past about speed,exits from roads etc.

[JAM]

Now you measure Dani with Petter,while we were talking the speed about Dani vs Loeb and Citroen sabotage at Danis car. Petter is not the benchmark.Loeb is the benchmark and as you can see you strugle to find a non tarmac event that he was faster.


I'm measuring Sordo in this rally with a driver that ends the rally in front. If i want to measure a teorically position at the ende of the rally, that must be with a driver that ends the rally.

But let me explain you (one more explanation...) that i was measuring the "not so good driver" wich you say that Sordo is with the rest of the field, using a second level car in a kind of surface that was not tarmac (where you recognize he is fast).

So, trying to explain you more clearly: a "Not so good driver", in a surface where he is not so fast, with a second level car, ends near the best drivers, with the best cars on a surface where they are rally fast. This means a lot.

Let's end the discussion with two things:

If you want lessons about stopping foreigners perfomance at a french team with french drivers, you must read the whole story about Pedro Lamy and Le Mans 2011. One curiosity: Olivier Quesnel was the team manager.

If, in Argentina, Sordo will be as fast as Petter Solberg (Petter knows very well the fiesta and Sordo not), there's another evidence that something wrong with the spaniard situation at Citroen. Let's wait.

[RobertS]

Snow is different from tarmac...

Do not overestimate the importance of snow. Usually only 1 event in the calendar(2 in 2007 and 5 tarmac). While we have 3-5 tarmac rallyes in every year.

And one of the best performers in Sweden is Carlos Sainz! :)

[dimviii]

I'm measuring Sordo in this rally with a driver that ends the rally in front. If i want to measure a teorically position at the ende of the rally, that must be with a driver that ends the rally..
that drivers that end the rally is NOT THE TOP. Our discussion was the Loeb vs Sordo.


But let me explain you (one more explanation...) that i was measuring the "not so good driver" wich you say that Sordo is with the rest of the field, using a second level car in a kind of surface that was not tarmac (where you recognize he is fast). .
Novikov was 5 sec behind......theory collapsed again.


So, trying to explain you more clearly: a "Not so good driver", in a surface where he is not so fast, with a second level car, ends near the best drivers, with the best cars on a surface where they are rally fast. This means a lot..
Novikov....and Ostberg in front of him....



If you want lessons about stopping foreigners perfomance at a french team with french drivers, you must read the whole story about Pedro Lamy and Le Mans 2011. One curiosity: Olivier Quesnel was the team manager..
Wasn t faster the French guy?You really waiting to support the spanish guy that was some minutes behind at first day at 90% of the rallies for 4 years?When Dani had the ''best'' xsara and the ''best'' c4 was way behind in speed from Fords.You forgot it?


If, in Argentina, Sordo will be as fast as Petter Solberg (Petter knows very well the fiesta and Sordo not), there's another evidence that something wrong with the spaniard situation at Citroen. Let's wait.
Again your benchmark is Petter who is way slower from Loeb.Now you will be ok if he is equal with Petter?lololololololol Didn t we talked about Loeb vs Sordo?
Sordo will drive 3 days the Fiesta before Argentina.No sabotage because the team is not Citroen sport,so no excuses please before the rally.

[RobertS]

Just of curiosity how much have you spended??
No question, if somebody spend 8 years in WRC - like JML - and he can reach the tarmac-podium once only in his 8th year - this is a kind of disaster. Time & Money for nothing...
There are some serious problems with the learning. Mikko is nearly the same...

If there is something boring in the WRC that is not Loeb's dominance but the Finnish disaster on tarmac(except Mr.Makinen).

[Adler]

If, in Argentina, Sordo will be as fast as Petter Solberg (Petter knows very well the fiesta and Sordo not), there's another evidence that something wrong with the spaniard situation at Citroen. Let's wait.

Sorry, i really doubt that will happen, but all the best for Dani, for sure he would deserve a worksseat for a whole season again!

[MartijnS]

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/533340_431222980224561_157932864220242_1786778_152 4935103_n.jpg

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/522880_431224516891074_157932864220242_1786785_187 5901471_n.jpg

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/581549_431225776890948_157932864220242_1786794_685 712753_n.jpg

Photos posted by Ford on Facebook.

[N.O.T]

If, in Argentina, Sordo will be as fast as Petter Solberg (Petter knows very well the fiesta and Sordo not), there's another evidence that something wrong with the spaniard situation at Citroen. Let's wait.

LOL....

Why ? is Solberg as fast as Loeb ?

[JAM]

that drivers that end the rally is NOT THE TOP. Our discussion was the Loeb vs Sordo.
Novikov was 5 sec behind......theory collapsed again.
Novikov....and Ostberg in front of him....


Excuse me, but you are a litle bit slower in terms of understanding things, no? I'm talking about basic things, not very complex things. I tried to end the discussion, but...

What's your point of comparing directly Loeb with a top car and Sordo with a second level car? What would you expect? The driver of the worst car be faster than the best one driving the best car?
How can you say that Novikov was in front or would end in front? What a hell of calculations you made to write that Sordo teorically would end at 2 minutes behind the winner (or Loeb?!?). If in 7km lose 25 secs, then in 380km will lose X. The X is easy to calculate.

With Lamy's situation and facts, you didn't learned (or undesrtood) nothing. So, is a waste of time trying to explain something.

Form me, now the discussion is over, with the idea in mind that at Citroen happened some intriging things until 2010.

[JAM]

LOL....

Why ? is Solberg as fast as Loeb ?

Depends. Was the privateer DS3 as good as the Loeb's DS3 in 2011?

Is the Fiesta as good as the DS3?

If you ask me if is Solberg as solid driving as Loeb, i answer NO. But in terms of speed don't have answer

[N.O.T]

Depends. Was the privateer DS3 as good as the Loeb's DS3 in 2011?

Is the Fiesta as good as the DS3?

If you ask me if is Solberg as solid driving as Loeb, i answer NO. But in terms of speed don't have answer

You are right...

Who is faster Wilson Jr ?? or Loeb ??

[dimviii]

Excuse me, but you are a litle bit slower in terms of understanding things, no? I'm talking about basic things, not very complex things. I tried to end the discussion, but...

What's your point of comparing directly Loeb with a top car and Sordo with a second level car? What would you expect? The driver of the worst car be faster than the best one driving the best car?
How can you say that Novikov was in front or would end in front? What a hell of calculations you made to write that Sordo teorically would end at 2 minutes behind the winner (or Loeb?!?). If in 7km lose 25 secs, then in 380km will lose X. The X is easy to calculate.

With Lamy's situation and facts, you didn't learned (or undesrtood) nothing. So, is a waste of time trying to explain something.

Form me, now the discussion is over, with the idea in mind that at Citroen happened some intriging things until 2010.
Good night.I ll wake you up after Argentina .

[Francis44]

I dont think there is much difference between cars, Hirvonnen altough with not as many Km's with the Citroen isn't doing much better than last year pace wise.

Plus if the DS3 was so much better Novikov would run one this year no?!

[Kielder]

Prodrive has commented the photos on FB: "Good luck in Argentina Dani - another podium in the WRC would be great".
They should have added: "But please, don't win that you sink us (more than we are)". :D

[dimviii]

You are right...

Who is faster Wilson Jr ?? or Loeb ??

Wilson because before 3 years in a stage was faster.That he was slower at the rest 2.318 stages i dont care, as they cant serve my conspiracy theories.

[jcatanho]

I dont think there is much difference between cars, Hirvonnen altough with not as many Km's with the Citroen isn't doing much better than last year pace wise.

Plus if the DS3 was so much better Novikov would run one this year no?!

It also seems to me that the performance difference betwen Ford and Citroen has more to do with the pilots than with the cars.
If Ford is able to win in Finland and Sweden it's because of the drivers and not the car.
And if Citroën is so good in tarmac rallyes is because Loeb is the best tarmac driver and Sordo is also a tarmac specialist.
I am curious to see how will Hirvonen perform this year in France, Spain or Germany. If he will improve a lot than I must admit that the citroen is a better tarmac car!

[RobertS]

And if Citroën is so good in tarmac rallyes is because Loeb is the best tarmac driver and Sordo is also a tarmac specialist.
Can you remember for the comments of these results then ?

juwra.com**|**Rallies - Corsica 2004 final results (http://www.juwra.com/corsica_2004_results.html)

juwra.com**|**Rallies - Catalunya 2004 final results (http://www.juwra.com/catalunya_2004_results.html)

[rallyfiend]

I dont think there is much difference between cars, Hirvonnen altough with not as many Km's with the Citroen isn't doing much better than last year pace wise.

Plus if the DS3 was so much better Novikov would run one this year no?!

DS3 is apparently quite a lot more expensive than a Fiesta.

[Rallyper]

Please, could we get back to topics. Now!!!

I´m sick and tired of the discussion who´s fastest and in which car and etz...

[N.O.T]

Please, could we get back to topics. Now!!!

I´m sick and tired of the discussion who´s fastest and in which car and etz...

NEWSFLASH !!!!!!!!!

SORDO WILL REPLACE LATVALA !!!!! OMGODTZZZZ !!!

Now that the topic is closed as per title suggests....lets talk who is faster or why citroen favours Loeb...

[Rallyper]

NEWSFLASH !!!!!!!!!

SORDO WILL REPLACE LATVALA !!!!! OMGODTZZZZ !!!

Now that the topic is closed as per title suggests....lets talk who is faster or why citroen favours Loeb...

For sure. But in another topic. Not this one.

Btw - do we meet up in Loutraki or not (!)?

[tolis]

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/401651_438156916200831_155581457791713_87921337_19 67567654_n.jpg

[N.O.T]

For sure. But in another topic. Not this one.

Btw - do we meet up in Loutraki or not (!)?

check your pms :)

[noel157]

Did they find the race suits in the laundry from last year? Abu Dhabi World Rally Team? :)

[gravelman]

Did they find the race suits in the laundry from last year? Abu Dhabi World Rally Team? :) clearly eBay didn't get there first!!

[JAM]

I´m sick and tired of the discussion who´s fastest and in which car and etz...

You're sick and tired, but also wrong.

I only wanted show that Sordo had some issues at Citroen that limited their real speed, and tried to prove that. It's a pitty that some membres started with comparisons, and ignored the discussoin that really matters. For me, as said before, its over.

[JAM]

Did they find the race suits in the laundry from last year? Abu Dhabi World Rally Team? :)

They spent a lot of money paying royalties to David Richards that spent all the budget to Sordo campaign.

There's no funding for proper race suits, and there was no time to change these ones :D

[Barreis]

Sordo was good at Citroen but also lost some confidence when Ogier came to team and show his pace. Now confidence is back so he can show what he can do.

[6789]

Did they find the race suits in the laundry from last year? Abu Dhabi World Rally Team? :)

Get the blue Sharpie out Malcolm!

[jcatanho]

Can you remember for the comments of these results then ?

juwra.com**|**Rallies - Corsica 2004 final results (http://www.juwra.com/corsica_2004_results.html)

juwra.com**|**Rallies - Catalunya 2004 final results (http://www.juwra.com/catalunya_2004_results.html)

I believe I do not understand what do you mean.
I said that Citroen good result in tarmac are mainly due to the pilots expertise in tarmac and not because Citroen cars are better in tarmac. You selected two tarmac rallyes in which Citroen did not win. I believe it shows that a Citroen is not required to win tarmac rallyes! You just need any good car and a pilot that can be fast in tarmac.

[RobertS]

I believe I do not understand what do you mean.
Simply - my memory is a bit faded with those 2 tarmac wins of Markko Martin.
I hope somebody remember for the details...

[Back-N-Black]

Simply - my memory is a bit faded with those 2 tarmac wins of Markko Martin.
I hope somebody remember for the details...

Was that France and Spain in 2004 when Marrko was with Ford(From Wikipedia)? I would post the link but can't figure out how!