Rally Italia-Sardegna 2012 18-21 October 2012

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Hanaaaa Mikko!!!!!! :D



Yes.

[dimviii]

What is ''hana''? :D

[stefanvv]

SS7] So, in the words of Mikko Hirvonen "they are dropping like flies". :D

Much like Portugal (including the order), hmmmmmm....

[Mirek]

What is ''hana''? :D

Czech girl name :D

[Mintexmemory]

So can Mikko afford to keep losing 7 secs to Novikov over a 14km stage *whistles innocently*

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Much like Portugal (including the order), hmmmmmm....



Maybe Citroen is this time legal.

[uranium]

Just hope that Mikko clutch is ok ;)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

PetterSolbergWRC ‏@Petter_Solberg (https://twitter.com/Petter_Solberg)

Nice to be back on some proper tires.. 2nd fastest on SS6 for #ChrisPatterson (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ChrisPatterson&src=hash) and I at #RallyItaly (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23RallyItaly&src=hash). Still sitting 2nd behind Mikko.


Unfortunately the drama has spread to Chris and I at #RallyItaly (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23RallyItaly&src=hash). We're stopped on SS7 with a steering problem...... #gutted (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23gutted&src=hash).

[dimviii]

see how close Petter passed from rolled Neuville!!!
World Rally Championship - Video - Browse All - Rally Italy: Friday Midday Wrap (http://www.wrc.com/video/browse-all/video-rally-italy-friday-midday-wrap/?vid=2698)

[stefanvv]

see how close Petter passed from rolled Neuville!!!
World Rally Championship - Video - Browse All - Rally Italy: Friday Midday Wrap (http://www.wrc.com/video/browse-all/video-rally-italy-friday-midday-wrap/?vid=2698)

Neuville is lucky he is not telegraph post

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

What is ''hana''? :D

It is tap, like a watertap. It can be allso gas tap, gas is finnish word KAASU.

But HANAA is cheering word what you can use when you want cheer exampel motorsport driver. HANAA means, GO GO, push hard, max attack, keep pushing etc...

[janvanvurpa]

You can basically hand petter the win and he will throw it away. I have always been a fan of petter but its not bad luck that's plaguing him.

You know in Sweden there are countless silly stories about Norwegians, and of course the Norskie in the stories ALWAYS does something just unimaginably dumb. Many times that thing he doing is like SEVERELY missing the point----like the mechanic who was asked to stand behind and confirm if the blinkers were working who said "Yepp---it's working---not working---working---not working--working-not working"

Wonder if that was a story about Petter?

I am beginning to think that there's something wrong "upstairs" with Petter---good driver, not toooooooooooooo bright. :bigcry: :arrows:

[mousti]

If Ogier wins he gets the best result ever for a Skoda in WRC :D they never got a win with the Octavia WRC or Fabia WRC :p

[Mintexmemory]

Thierry Neuville quote about his accident
“I was not concentrating enough, didn’t hear a pace note, and we went off,” said Neuville. “The car was on the side, but we managed to continue although I have hurt my right hand because it was not easy [getting the car on its wheels] with just two persons.”

Shouldn't he have followed that by saying
"I'd like to apologise to Nicolas for being publicly critical of him in France; at least his error didn't put us ot of the rally"
Karma is a wonderful thing!!

[stefanvv]

Thierry Neuville quote about his accident
“I was not concentrating enough, didn’t hear a pace note, and we went off,” said Neuville. “The car was on the side, but we managed to continue although I have hurt my right hand because it was not easy [getting the car on its wheels] with just two persons.”

Shouldn't he have followed that by saying
"I'd like to apologise to Nicolas for being publicly critical of him in France; at least his error didn't put us ot of the rally"
Karma is a wonderful thing!!

I think he's grown enough for a short time. Admitting your own mistakes is not easy. Just have not forget to repeat them next time.

[dimviii]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/284168_407259259343624_1068423371_n.jpg

[spiderem]

What a rally! After half the stages, 3 main drivers out, 1 stage win for a S2000, loads of drama... We haven't seen this much action for a while!
Come on Mikko for the win and Ogier for a podium - why not!

[dimviii]

ahahahahahaha!!! from Colins twitter :D

Wouldn't surprise me if Mr Wilson wasn't sitting in a darkened hotel room right now slowly tearing his hair out! Oh dear!

[Rokomawh]

Wonder if that was a story about Petter? I am beginning to think that there's something wrong "upstairs" with Petter---good driver, not toooooooooooooo bright. :bigcry: :arrows: Well guys, let's keep it decent and on the road, shall we? As far as I now, every country ( or city, or willage for that matter) have some equivalent of dumb neighbours. Is it not true? Don't know what Petter's problem is today, but hereally don't deserve to be "dumbed" like this!

[userwave]

Petter may have written his own retirement letter with his performance on this and the last few rallies.
His time is over IMO


You know in Sweden there are countless silly stories about Norwegians, and of course the Norskie in the stories ALWAYS does something just unimaginably dumb. Many times that thing he doing is like SEVERELY missing the point----like the mechanic who was asked to stand behind and confirm if the blinkers were working who said "Yepp---it's working---not working---working---not working--working-not working"

Wonder if that was a story about Petter?

I am beginning to think that there's something wrong "upstairs" with Petter---good driver, not toooooooooooooo bright. :bigcry: :arrows:

[Mintexmemory]

What a rally! After half the stages, 3 main drivers out, 1 stage win for a S2000, loads of drama... We haven't seen this much action for a while!
Come on Mikko for the win and Ogier for a podium - why not!

If only Matthew Wilson had started this event the 5 / 6 / 7 year plan would finally have come to fruition (or maybe he would have gone off too)

[dimviii]

Loeb not to rejoin tomorow

[Langdale Forest]

What made the S2000 & Gp N cars so fast on stage 5?

[stefanvv]

What made the S2000 & Gp N cars so fast on stage 5?

Black & round Michelin hard compound tyres.

I'm steeling that from Mr. Kankunen.

[spiderem]

Anybody can suggest some good apps for iPhone 5 to follow wrc, other than irally? Cheers.

[userwave]

Anybody can suggest some good apps for iPhone 5 to follow wrc, other than irally? Cheers.

Twitter !

[Juha_Koo]

What made the S2000 & Gp N cars so fast on stage 5?

Very bad tyre wear of WRC cars and the subsequent poor grip.

[dimviii]

where is Jafrys photos? :bigcry:

[Coach 2]

You know in Sweden there are countless silly stories about Norwegians, and of course the Norskie in the stories ALWAYS does something just unimaginably dumb. Many times that thing he doing is like SEVERELY missing the point----like the mechanic who was asked to stand behind and confirm if the blinkers were working who said "Yepp---it's working---not working---working---not working--working-not working"

Wonder if that was a story about Petter?

I am beginning to think that there's something wrong "upstairs" with Petter---good driver, not toooooooooooooo bright. :bigcry: :arrows:

I would like to disagree with you, Janvan, but it's hard to be a PS fan these days, very very veeeeeery hard.

[dimviii]

Lets see if Ostbergs diff will manage this long stage

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Would be funny if something happened to Mikko and then there was a 1-2 for M-Sport after Ford deciding to pull out ! :D

[dimviii]

“If I have not-such a good first day in my rally car for the second day I never shower! I don’t know why, but it gives me this wildman feeling,” said Mikkelsen. “If I have some time to catch up on the second day, I say to myself ‘okay, I need to be a wildman tomorrow’ and not showering is part of being wild.

World Rally Championship - News - Mikkelsen: not washing makes me faster (http://www.wrc.com/news/mikkelsen-not-washing-makes-me-faster/?fid=17713)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

JML interview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koYGg3OIHDs

[dimviii]

if my calculate are right, Ostberg will loose his position from Ogier if he has the same pace as previous stage,

[dimviii]

if my calculate are right, Ostberg will loose his position from Ogier if he has the same pace as previous stage,

at 4th split he is much better,fingers crossed!

[stefanvv]

at 4th split he is much better,fingers crossed!

If he make it, Ford is strong car :)

[Mintexmemory]

Ogier still flying!!

[dimviii]

[SS8] Sebastien Ogier (Skoda S2000) 18:56.6 "Its a very good day for us. I drive perfect like usual… I am happy...............


much better interviews than Atkinson

[Rallyper]

Östberg only FWD.

[stefanvv]

What would you think of someone telling you before the rally that at the end of 2nd day, Ogier will be 4th with stage win, Mikkelsen 6th :D

[dimviii]

Neuville will start at Saturday

[Mirek]

[SS8] Sebastien Ogier (Skoda S2000) 18:56.6 "Its a very good day for us. I drive perfect like usual… I am happy...............

There are things about this guy I don't like and it's not his skills...

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

dimviii rules! He is ours eyes and ears. So much info,pictures and videos. Thx.

[TyPat107]

Why us Loeb not restarting?

[stefanvv]

There are things about this guy I don't like and it's not his skills...

He has some more things to learn from his mentor & idol.

[uranium]

Why us Loeb not restarting?

Has tired already ;) Fed up with rally ;)

[Koceens]

I think he wants to quit already. :)

[dimviii]

dimviii rules! He is ours eyes and ears. So much info,pictures and videos. Thx.

hana Mikko!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!​ :D

[dimviii]

dimviii rules! He is ours eyes and ears. So much info,pictures and videos. Thx.

hana Mikko!!!!!!!!!! :D

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

hana Mikko!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!​ :D

yes yes yes....hana mikko hana! :p

[dimviii]

Why us Loeb not restarting?

Bored imho.

[stefanvv]

Why us Loeb not restarting?

There is circuit racing coming in weekend :confused:

[dimviii]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/530801_4180126779152_1652025625_n.jpg

[Karukera]

dimviii rules! He is ours eyes and ears. So much info,pictures and videos. Thx.

Most of the material he brings in here comes from threads of : WRC, IRC, ERC - Forum-Rallye (http://www.forum-rallye.com/index.php?/forum/6-wrc-irc-erc/)

That said, kudos to the guys doing the job and to Dim for sharing the news :up: .

[dimviii]

Most of the material he brings in here comes from threads of : WRC, IRC, ERC - Forum-Rallye (http://www.forum-rallye.com/index.php?/forum/6-wrc-irc-erc/)

That said, kudos to the guys doing the job and to Dim for sharing the news :up: .

yes very good site!!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Jari-Matti Latvala ‏@JariMattiWRC (https://twitter.com/JariMattiWRC) - ''Probably the low point of the year...'

Now thats BAD !!! :(

[dimviii]

Rally Italia Sardegna 2012 - WRC - Mistrovstv svta (http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1097)

[dimviii]

Solbergs off

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=kVUCYaD_fkI

[Jafry]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_c823b1ace8.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_8f546cdcd3.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_751b771b2c.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_f8ce898760.jpg



More photos from DAY2 HERE (http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1097)

[COD]

Petter still 10th. WTF, the championship really is just a joke

[rallye-vid]

Solbergs off


A magic kerbstone edge. YAY :vader:

I'm happy i wan't at home today i didn't follow the rally live. Saved me a lot of gray hairs :cool:

[pettersolberg29]

Says a lot that all the reccomended videos down the side are of various other Solberg crashes! There has never been a harder driver to support - the Solberg Army may be big but they will all have heart issues one day!

[tolis]

Nice photo by Greg Roslon

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/400363_436974323026669_1581553904_n.jpg

[Hartusvuori]

Hirvonen in the footsteps of his early mentor: On one of the stages a rock hit hard to the bottom of the car, exactly where co-driver Lehtinen is sitting. The hit let loose the fire extinguisher which hit Lehtonen's knee severly. There's said to be a hole size of fist in the bottom of the car.

Kivi teloi Hirvosen kartturia – "lattiaan nyrkinkokoinen reikä" - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - Ralli - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2012/10/1639267/kivi-teloi-hirvosen-kartturia---lattiaan-nyrkinkokoinen-reika)

[stefanvv]

Hirvonen in the footsteps of his early mentor: On one of the stages a rock hit hard to the bottom of the car, exactly where co-driver Lehtinen is sitting. The hit let loose the fire extinguisher which hit Lehtonen's knee severly. There's said to be a hole size of fist in the bottom of the car.

Kivi teloi Hirvosen kartturia – "lattiaan nyrkinkokoinen reikä" - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - Ralli - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2012/10/1639267/kivi-teloi-hirvosen-kartturia---lattiaan-nyrkinkokoinen-reika)

After this day I might change my opinion that Acropolis is the hardest Rally...

[tolis]

http://sphotos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/253107_436978039692964_1271668909_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/10250_436976479693120_1613200202_n.jpg

[rallye-sport]

Friday update -> Photos Rallye de Sardaigne 2012 (http://www.rallye-sport.fr/photos-rallye-de-sardaigne-2012/)

http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/mg_6967.jpg


http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_5152.jpg


http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_7933.jpg




http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_5503.jpg

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

Says a lot that all the reccomended videos down the side are of various other Solberg crashes! There has never been a harder driver to support - the Solberg Army may be big but they will all have heart issues one day!

Noticed that, too.....all in 2012...sigh.....

[Rallyper]

There are things about this guy I don't like and it's not his skills...

So he will be the new Loeb for some guys on this forum...?

[pettersolberg29]

So he will be the new Loeb for some guys on this forum...?

Surely no-one who is serious though thinks Loeb isn't a 'nice' guy, for want of a better word? He's always respectful and fair from what I've known. And if he is ever a bit arrogant then he's got every right to be. Ogier rubs people up the wrong way because he's yet to prove himself over a long career and therefore his arrogance is misplaced. He's got a lot of titles to wins to keep up to his own standards!

[stefanvv]

So he will be the new Loeb for some guys on this forum...?

What could people possibly not like about Loeb... except he leaves no room for competition...

[janvanvurpa]

I would like to disagree with you, Janvan, but it's hard to be a PS fan these days, very very veeeeeery hard.
Joooooo men.....the funny thing is when he was in the Blue Sub-a-rat, and he was acting "Hollywood" the driving I cannot comment, he won VM after all, but it was like somebody said about this strange moron Romney over here: "when he smiles its from chin to nose---it doesn't go up to his eyes". It was a pose. A posture, ya know? And I've been around too much motorsport men who are good and serious (when its needed) and who maybe aren't the smartest guys but they're good and passionate and genuine, and poseurs annoy me...so i wasn't a fan..

When he put together his private deal and continued on in WRC when he didn't get a factory ride, then I saw what he was made from, good solid stuff, and I know what that takes: serious burning focus and passion.. Then I become a fan, even if he is a Norrman...

But these constant throwing away the car---modern cars seem so delicate---if he can't figure out he has one minute on the next guy, 2 minutes on the 2 after that, 3 minutes on the next guys, OK he's a bit crazy, I understand crazy real well (trust me!!)...he has---it is rumored, experienced TEAM behind him just a phone call away, the can call the co-driver on stage and say "Give that thick-headed Norskie a slap on the head, HARD, and remind him he's safe. 1 minute to next guy, so SAFE!"

Nope.....

I know how this must knäcka his spirit, it can make a guy to to drink...

Pobre Petter.

[Viking]

Please, can i have a go... :)

http://sphotos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/66382_501605283192063_1332776479_n.jpg

[Sulland]

You know in Sweden there are countless silly stories about Norwegians, and of course the Norskie in the stories ALWAYS does something just unimaginably dumb. Many times that thing he doing is like SEVERELY missing the point----like the mechanic who was asked to stand behind and confirm if the blinkers were working who said "Yepp---it's working---not working---working---not working--working-not working"

Wonder if that was a story about Petter?

I am beginning to think that there's something wrong "upstairs" with Petter---good driver, not toooooooooooooo bright. :bigcry: :arrows:


As most neighbouring countries, these jokes are going both ways. On ous side of the border, the Swedes are the Brainees !
Guess that other neigbours have same humourous relationship!

Feel Petter was more crazy before, and had an extra gear if he had to. He was also much better in psychological operations towards the other drivers. But after a couple of wins all might come back!

[COD]

Ogiers fastes stage time makes me wanna laugh to all those (including the WRC drivers) who were so against making S2000 the top WRC class, because the cars "are so slow". :laugh:

[stefanvv]

It is so good to have 2 teams - World Rally Championship - News - Wilson praises M-Sport young guns (http://www.wrc.com/news/wilson-praises-m-sport-young-guns/?fid=17721)

[SubaruNorway]

Ogiers fastes stage time makes me wanna laugh to all those (including the WRC drivers) who were so against making S2000 the top WRC class, because the cars "are so slow". :laugh:

They are by far the same to watch on stages, wrc is way ahead especially on fast jumps. Ogier is even bored driving it he's said several times.

[janvanvurpa]

As most neighbouring countries, these jokes are going both ways. On ous side of the border, the Swedes are the Brainees !
Guess that other neigbours have same humourous relationship!

Feel Petter was more crazy before, and had an extra gear if he had to. He was also much better in psychological operations towards the other drivers. But after a couple of wins all might come back!

You know this city where i live now, when I came in 1968 there was still a big deal between Swedes and Norwegians, and many people still said their names correctly, Johansson as it should be or Jonsson.

When i travel from Riksgräsen out to narvik then down the whole length of Norway, I just change the names and flag from the jokes the old fishemen tell here----works both ways on both sides of the border. Really, who needs borders?

Whatever is up with Petter, I hope he gets a grip, he's killing his future.

[COD]

They are by far the same to watch on stages, wrc is way ahead especially on fast jumps. Ogier is even bored driving it he's said several times.

Performance difference is far less than when they moved from Gr. B to Gr. A. If all where on S2000, show would be better. More slides and more sound.
But FIA idiots opted for silent and boring turbo engines and worst of all, big wings that make sideways driving pointless.
So you like this nose first driving in stead of sideways action?

[Juha_Koo]

More slides and more sound.

So you like this nose first driving in stead of sideways action?

Funny that you talk about sideways action and S2000... No torque to handle long slides, modern WRCs have more "sideways action" than S2000, please wake up... :rolleyes: What is this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=UUYVUHo0pJ-lXklIfuMrJ8wA&v=hjScLXMYM4Q&feature=player_detailpage#t=207s)?

[hanjob11]

Hello,

pictures of today are online at rally3.de (http://www.rally3.de)


http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/freitag__2112/album_3_2128/sardinien12_wp8kh_006_20121019_1373997734.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/freitag__2112/album_1_2126/sardinien12_wp4kh_010_20121019_1474706751.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/freitag__2112/album_2_2127/sardinien12_rsfrkh_028_20121019_1118705340.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/freitag__2112/album_3_2128/sardinien12_wp8kh_063_20121019_1217163704.jpg

Karsten

[stefanvv]

Sideways actions. OK lets get back 30 years before the Quattro era :D

[stefanvv]

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/freitag__2112/album_2_2127/sardinien12_rsfrkh_004_20121019_1283053986.jpg

[satnav]

Performance difference is far less than when they moved from Gr. B to Gr. A. If all where on S2000, show would be better. More slides and more sound.
But FIA idiots opted for silent and boring turbo engines and worst of all, big wings that make sideways driving pointless.
So you like this nose first driving in stead of sideways action?

Don't know how you get that conclusion , Wales this year was super if only more folk could have seen it.

[janvanvurpa]

Funny that you talk about sideways action and S2000... No torque to handle long slides, modern WRCs have more "sideways action" than S2000, please wake up... :rolleyes: What is this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=UUYVUHo0pJ-lXklIfuMrJ8wA&v=hjScLXMYM4Q&feature=player_detailpage#t=207s)?

Torque can be made in the motor and with a turbo, or shorter final drive ratio.
I see a lot of good acc. and sideways action in F-cup cars which we know have less torque than the 34,000 euro S2000 motors. But ya know, a Corolla goes pretty good when it has a 5,3 final drive....or Escortiin with 5,1

Just saying.. :cheese: ....don't pound me :arrows:
EDIT:
And what was that?

Must be a mistake!
(funny but when the 1,6 liter rule was annmounced, there was much discussion about will the be slower or faster---and I wrote the 33mm restrictor won't hurt 1,6 as much as 34mm hurt the 2,0 motor, and the 1,6 will be able to rev much higher, and if it revs higher they could just gear axle ratio shorter, and car will go same----I was right! (I build rally motors...) What I didn't think was how the little cars would be sideways more.. They are, its good to watch----the 3-5 cars when everybody doesn't crash.... :rotate:

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaK0g3RUvxA

[dimviii]

Saturday start list
Rally FICr (http://rally.ficr.it/tab_startinglist.asp?p_Anno=2012&p_Codice=2&p_Manifestazione=3&p_Gara=1&p_Tappa=3&p_Giornata=3)

[Allyc85]

Motors TV back to their poor coverage, the editor/producer should be ashamed of the programe! First half of the show the sound is 1 or 2 seconds out then the second half is nearly in black and white! Do they not check it?!

[EightGear]

http://www.imgdumper.nl/uploads6/5081d4fed8c33/5081d4fec9a07-2012-10-20_00-06-31-1.jpg

[bt52b]

Without Loeb rally can still be beautiful.... :D

But the others are not as fast :(

[spiderem]

I'm sorry but Solberg is a bit of a joke nowadays... Even if you give him the win he will fall climbing on the top of the podium. Maybe he should do Bollywood Solberg, dancing and singing, rather than an old Hollywood wanna be. I think it's time for him to move on and realise he won't win or be world champion anymore.
Sorry for PS fan club all over the world.

[mousti]

The whole Ford WRT is getting a bit pathetic and then u can a bit understand why Ford is leaving.

[rallye-vid]

Sad but true

[Rallyper]

OK, but this has to be said anyway:

Petter wasn´t leading the rally. He was in a matter of fact chasing Mikko, wasn´t he? So he couldn´t just relax and wait for Mikko doing mistake, could he?

I know Petter is always cutting like no one else, but we´ve also seen many other top drivers retire becuase of cutting, in this rally!

So before knocking out Mr Solberg, just take one more thought. I do really think that he´s done too many retirements this year. But this one wasn´t particular, but one too much, maybe...

[pettersolberg29]

I'm sorry but Solberg is a bit of a joke nowadays... Even if you give him the win he will fall climbing on the top of the podium. Maybe he should do Bollywood Solberg, dancing and singing, rather than an old Hollywood wanna be. I think it's time for him to move on and realise he won't win or be world champion anymore.
Sorry for PS fan club all over the world.

I agree in part - it seems his mentality simply isn't right for winning anymore, though who knows if one lucky win may start a brief '2nd career'? However, he's still among the top 5 rally drivers in the world so he still deserves a factory seat in my opinion, maybe just be told to be a steady 2nd driver and get 3rd/4th every round without pushing too hard. People who say he should retire (I'm not saying you do!) are comparing him to the Loebs and ogiers of this world - compare him to the Prokops and Atkinsons and he's still one hell of a driver, massively entertaining to watch and listen to, and a key part of the sport still.

[stefanvv]

OK, but this has to be said anyway:

Petter wasn´t leading the rally. He was in a matter of fact chasing Mikko, wasn´t he? So he couldn´t just relax and wait for Mikko doing mistake, could he?

I know Petter is always cutting like no one else, but we´ve also seen many other top drivers retire becuase of cutting, in this rally!

So before knocking out Mr Solberg, just take one more thought. I do really think that he´s done too many retirements this year. But this one wasn´t particular, but one too much, maybe...

Latvala was even in worse position today while crashed. But all that thanks to "brilliant" Ford tactics yesterday ;)

[Astro83]

Okey guys, I agree that Petter now days is a bit "to hot" and he can absolutly back off a bit sometimes... That what a pro do to get good points and more BUT look at the video!

That was a stupid thing, I think that it could have happend to any one there... But okey in that position IF you want a second position then you drive in the middle of the road but 23 sec is not sooo much when they have two days left, so I can understand that he was trying to get time of Mikko and then he cut the corner a little bit to much, probebly miss that stone in recce...

Petter has a great deal of bad luck and I think hr will be dangerus when it turns and he get a win!

If he get a factory seat for next year.... And the sport needs that, so I really hope so!

Im glad for Mikko, he also need this win! If he dont do a stupid misstake now but a dobt it! :)

[spiderem]

I totally agree with THE win that might get his luck back, and his confidence... But I guess we all have been waiting 3 years now for this to come.
I think my post was more about frustration of his potential not being well exploited due to his mentality...

[Mintexmemory]

So does Novikov get some 'tweaks' to go after Mikko or does Malc (the master of strategy) tell him to settle for 2nd?

[kober]

Petter has a great deal of bad luck and I think hr will be dangerus when it turns and he get a win!
If he get a factory seat for next year.... And the sport needs that, so I really hope so!Are there any factory seats still available? As far as I know Citroen's and VW's are already taken, and these are the only factory teams that will compete next year. Either way, I don't think that Solberg's a winner any more. When was the last time he had a problem-free rally, without accidents or bizzarre tire/road position choices?
Admittedly, I have a life-time membership in Solberg's fan club, but in my opinion he should join Loeb, and start to enjoy his post-WRC years rather sooner than later.

[kober]

Hopefully Ostberg's problems with differential are solvable, and he can make it to the podium on Sunday. It would be a great feat to finish the year in the third spot in the championship, ahead of Ford's both factory drivers. When was the last time a driver beat all of brand's factory drivers, driving the same car? (I'm not saying that Ostberg's Fiesta is exactly the same spec as Solberg and Latvala's).

[Mintexmemory]

Hopefully Ostberg's problems with differential are solvable, and he can make it to the podium on Sunday. It would be a great feat to finish the year in the third spot in the championship, ahead of Ford's both factory drivers. When was the last time a driver beat all of brand's factory drivers, driving the same car? (I'm not saying that Ostberg's Fiesta is exactly the same spec as Solberg and Latvala's).Cant see Mads making the podium in this rally unlaess it is gifted. It is incredibly hard to push here and. His best strategy is to keep it in one piece to see what happens. I can see bo Fords and Neuvill getting back to the top 10. Realistically getting 4th back from Ogier will still be an achievement.

[Tom206wrc]

SS9 is on ;)

[eib1]

Karl Kruuda at the end of SS8

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A5mVYM-CEAEB2KF.jpg

[Mirek]

They are by far the same to watch on stages, wrc is way ahead especially on fast jumps. Ogier is even bored driving it he's said several times.

For spectators I would say that S2000 are even nicer than WRC on asphalt (except slow hairpins) but on gravel WRC are largely more entertaining.


Funny that you talk about sideways action and S2000... No torque to handle long slides, modern WRCs have more "sideways action" than S2000, please wake up... :rolleyes: What is this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=UUYVUHo0pJ-lXklIfuMrJ8wA&v=hjScLXMYM4Q&feature=player_detailpage#t=207s)?

He probably meant those quick changes of direction where You have to throw S2000 from little slide to another little slide to make it turn. No big sideways action is possible with S2000 but especially on fast asphalt sections they are (for me) way more entertaining than WRC cars.

[uranium]

Latvala was even in worse position today while crashed. But all that thanks to "brilliant" Ford tactics yesterday ;)
What do you mean by
"brilliant" Ford tactics ? What did I miss? Thanks

[dimviii]

So does Novikov get some 'tweaks' to go after Mikko or does Malc (the master of strategy) tell him to settle for 2nd?

At yesterday night press conference he said he will keep 2nd position.

[Negaiss]

I bet on Novikov trying to win, do fast stage times but crashing out no matter what he says on press conference!

[Viking]

Okey guys, I agree that Petter now days is a bit "to hot" and he can absolutly back off a bit sometimes... That what a pro do to get good points and more BUT look at the video!

That was a stupid thing, I think that it could have happend to any one there... But okey in that position IF you want a second position then you drive in the middle of the road but 23 sec is not sooo much when they have two days left, so I can understand that he was trying to get time of Mikko and then he cut the corner a little bit to much, probebly miss that stone in recce...

Petter has a great deal of bad luck and I think hr will be dangerus when it turns and he get a win!

If he get a factory seat for next year.... And the sport needs that, so I really hope so!

Im glad for Mikko, he also need this win! If he dont do a stupid misstake now but a dobt it! :)

Ironi is that Petter says he wasn't pushing and that he would not had hit the rock if he was...

World Rally Championship - News - Sardinia exit shocks Solberg (http://www.wrc.com/news/sardinia-exit-shocks-solberg/?fid=17725)

[Langdale Forest]

Why is Nombre so slow?

[dimviii]

Neuville,Latvala on softs,Mads on hards

[Viking]

Østberg only one pushing? boring...

[dimviii]

[SS9] Ott Tanak (Ford) 17:44.8 - Has a warning on the dash telling them that the alternator temperature is high "It was okay, no dramas."

[SS9] Evgeny Novikov (Ford) 18:01.1 - No problems, just a safe drive through the opening stage.

[Wim_Impreza]

Neuville,Latvala on softs,Mads on hards

Neuville said yesterday that he won't be driving again this weekend and now he is there... Strange.

[dimviii]

Neuville said yesterday that he won't be driving again this weekend and now he is there... Strange.
i read that they were waiting the doctors to give him the ok,about his hands

[noel157]

He's only got 3 wee blisters on his fingers, doesn't look that bad:

https://o.twimg.com/1/proxy.jpg?t=FQQVBBhNaHR0cDovL2Rpc3RpbGxlcnlpbWFnZT EwLmluc3RhZ3JhbS5jb20vZGI2ZTlkMGExOWQ5MTFlMmIzYWYy MjAwMGExZmI4NTZfNy5qcGcUAhYAEgA&s=r-RhvawpwS-JLpcZQEnrrzfYP3-iKzdCnZt-ETJFn2A

[Mintexmemory]

What do you mean by ? What did I miss? Thanks

Just a sense of irony ;) the OP was being sarcastic! I err I think!

[Mihai]

Why is Nombre so slow?

You mean in Sardinia or anywhere else this year? I suspect Slow is his middle name. He is yet to finish higher than 17th this year.

[Astro83]

Kober:

What I know....Citroen only has Mikko just about now?? If we not include Loebs few rallyes next year... It says that Sordo might be on his way back but I read that Citroen also might be intrested in Petter...

;) ;) ;)

I think that the second driver behaind Mikko will be Neuville or Sordo. I hope Sordo stays with Mini but Sordo is the best man for Citroen anyway...

I think that Petter has a chance in Mini if Sordo is going for Citroen but otherwise he's only chance is with M-Sport if they belive in him anymore but Petter is still very very fast and he will stay in WRC I think for 2013.

[Astro83]

Nobre, the green slow pig..... :)

He is like K Block, fun to have in WRC, but they would not be there if all was up to the best drivers of the world.

Now days it's all about who have most money and not who is the best driver... If you know what I mean... ;)

[rallyfiend]

Nobre, the green slow pig..... :)

He is like K Block, fun to have in WRC, but they would not be there if all was up to the best drivers of the world.

Now days it's all about who have most money and not who is the best driver... If you know what I mean... ;)

Even if it was all up to the best drivers in the world. Nobre would still likely be there. He's a customer. That car only exists because he is there.

Even if there were 8 or 10 factory seats, he would still be there.

[Langdale Forest]

Why isn't Ogier registered for the SWRC this year?

[SubaruNorway]

Why isn't Ogier registered for the SWRC this year? They would have testing limitations if he was.

[tolis]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/46223_446369578753517_2104202150_n.jpg

[stefanvv]

Just a sense of irony ;) the OP was being sarcastic! I err I think!

Yes, it is just irony, that's why the quotes :)

[Tom206wrc]

SS11 running ;)

[rallye-vid]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4doHMwc4yCU

[vkangas]

He's only got 3 wee blisters on his fingers, doesn't look that bad:

https://o.twimg.com/1/proxy.jpg?t=FQQVBBhNaHR0cDovL2Rpc3RpbGxlcnlpbWFnZT EwLmluc3RhZ3JhbS5jb20vZGI2ZTlkMGExOWQ5MTFlMmIzYWYy MjAwMGExZmI4NTZfNy5qcGcUAhYAEgA&s=r-RhvawpwS-JLpcZQEnrrzfYP3-iKzdCnZt-ETJFn2A
Not looking so bad and is not dangerous but man driving is going to be pain with those...

[Mintexmemory]

JML and Petter clearly under orders to bring the cars back in1 piece

[stefanvv]

JML and Petter clearly under orders to bring the cars back in1 piece

Especially the second one I think. M-Sport shouldn't blame their drivers for mistakes for which sometimes the team holds the responsibility.

[Rallyper]

At the same time I understand it´s nice to go home to family etz, I believe that Loeb should have stayed and restarted today. His manner isn´t polite, I would say, in all respect...

[dimviii]

At the same time I understand it´s nice to go home to family etz, I believe that Loeb should have stayed and restarted today. His manner isn´t polite, I would say, in all respect...

agree.

[rallye-vid]

He is driving some other "vehicle" today

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A5pVjQPCAAAWOAI.jpg:large

[Tom206wrc]

SS12 running...

GO MIKKO :bounce:

[Mintexmemory]

Think. It's safe to say Seb Loeb won't be in Italy next year. Fans would still have wanted to see him on today's stages

[dimviii]

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.. .........

[noel157]

What happen Prokop? Accident? Thought he was trying save his last WRC car.

[stefanvv]

PROKOP M. / HRŮZA Z. (st. č. 21) Was of the road.
[SS12] Martin Prokop (Ford) 17:57.0 "Out of the road in one place, I hit a tree, but we get back okay. It was more than a spin, bigger moment than a spin."

[noel157]

Thanks Stefan.

[Iskald]

Ok, so Hirvonen is just staying on the road today, but Mads Østberg certainly impresses with three stage wins out of four. So far today he has been 42 seconds quicker than rally leader Hirvonen. Just academic of course, but still very good. He has been fired up today, young Østberg, and regaining 4th place was no problem whatsoever.

[cali]

Hirvonen don't need to push as he has good margin to the rest. Just to be clear. But Mads seems to be very sympathetic person and a driver.

[stefanvv]

World Rally Championship - News - Playing chicken with Chris Atkinson (http://www.wrc.com/news/playing-chicken-with-chris-atkinson/?fid=17735)

"...If it’s really true that you are what you eat, you’ll find Atko wandering round the service park this evening, laying eggs and going “cluck”." :D

[Tom206wrc]

Last stage of the day about to start :cool:

[Rallyper]

I think between the lines you can hear on the quotes that Petter want to stay at M-sport. Hope he and Mads will form the team at M-sport next year.

[rallye-vid]

Solberg said the "stone" wasn't there on the recce

http://i46.tinypic.com/2uqc7kj.jpg

Dear Petter, please check your eyes

[WRC1]

amazing time by ogier on last stage!! 6th fastest and he took back p5 from atko!! cant wait to see ogier in the real machine ;)

[janvanvurpa]

Not looking so bad and is not dangerous but man driving is going to be pain with those...

A man who is concentrating on the road good enough at that level would never even notice---until later..

I have had countless dozens broken fingers, toes, nose, teeth and never noticed till later--friends broke femurs, and drove themselves to hospital because they thought something was "wrong".

Concentration is transcendent.

Like "aum", dude.

[TMorel]

I dont get this "disrespect" some of you think Loeb is showing, as can be seen in Julian Porters photo, Seb took a motorbike & some friends and joined the fans on stage watching the action. That's hardly sticking two fingers up to the sport.

[cali]

Solberg said the "stone" wasn't there on the recce

http://i46.tinypic.com/2uqc7kj.jpg

Dear Petter, please check your eyes
Once it was the mysterious bear who rolled massive rock to Solberg's way and now this!! :eek: Oh man that's some serious sabotage again
Ofcourse the fact that Solberg has massive-cutting driving style has nothing to do with this ...

[Juha_Koo]

WRC onboards are so crap nowdays... NOS did helluva better job.

Is it really so difficult? Previous years we had all (major) offs etc. situations uploaded to wrc.com during the same day, nowdays that ain't happening. Also, NOS had good onboard camera system, nowdays you can never know will the onboard have intercom audio or not - mostly it's so, that the crew-facing camera has the audio, but the "real" camera pointing forward only has ambient sound. Many whined about NOS camera angles, but I liked them 80% of the time (excluding bumper angle and C4 inboard angle). Nowdays it's *always* the A-pillar angle, so tired... Last year, we had stuff this great: Rally Mexico 2011 - SS04 - Mikko Hirvonen - onboard - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwVCytZ-i2w)

No "proper" footage of Loeb's nor Latvala's offs, just face camera. Plus, you can't see full stage onboards basically ever these days. NOS used to fulfill fan requests in Youtube. It was so great. Nowdays nothing. Such a shame.

[bluuford]

Think. It's safe to say Seb Loeb won't be in Italy next year. Fans would still have wanted to see him on today's stages

Well.. Citroen can save some budget (no need to run two cars), resultwise, it was impossible for him to collect any points, being nearly first on the road sweeping all kind of s**t it is impossible to shine on Powerstage as well and friends need their time as well :-)

Hmm.. seems that Ogier is in killer "Monte" mode. Hopefully he and Atko are both going to finish tomorrow..

about Solberg.. 5 retirements in 12 rallies.. I gues that he is not in Citroen shopping list anymore. Too bad.

And this is interesting one:
[SS14] Luca Pedersoli (Citroen) 11:07.2 "It was a tough day for us, We look forward to tomorrow. It will be a great result for us to take 10th position and 1 point for WRC. We have improved step by step."

Does he knows that he is in 11th posistion?:-P Please someone tell this guy that he has to make up nearly 9 minutes in 16 km?

[dimviii]

I dont get this "disrespect" some of you think Loeb is showing, as can be seen in Julian Porters photo, Seb took a motorbike & some friends and joined the fans on stage watching the action. That's hardly sticking two fingers up to the sport.

mate is not ''disrespect'', just plenty of his fans waiting to see him for last time in Sardignia.Can understant that he is tired or bored but..

[janvanvurpa]

Once it was the mysterious bear who rolled massive rock to Solberg's way and now this!! :eek: Oh man that's some serious sabotage again
Ofcourse the fact that Solberg has massive-cutting driving style has nothing to do with this ...


Bears like living in nice quiet woods, it's understandable they would be angry at all the noise a rally car makes especially all the bang-bang, Petter should have been happy it didn't invade the service area and eat him..

Whiner.

[Viking]

Solberg said the "stone" wasn't there on the recce

http://i46.tinypic.com/2uqc7kj.jpg

Dear Petter, please check your eyes

What i heard him say was that the stone was not in his notes after recce, and on your pic i think he has already hit it.
But i agree, he should not make this tight cuts when not pushing. Also i think the car should had hold up better to the impact.

[bluuford]

And this is interesting one:
[SS14] Luca Pedersoli (Citroen) 11:07.2 "It was a tough day for us, We look forward to tomorrow. It will be a great result for us to take 10th position and 1 point for WRC. We have improved step by step."

Does he knows that he is in 11th posistion?:-P Please someone tell this guy that he has to make up nearly 9 minutes in 16 km?

uups.. I need to eat my words now.. Kruuda has retired :-(

[rallye-sport]

Saturday update -> Photos Rallye de Sardaigne 2012 (http://www.rallye-sport.fr/photos-rallye-de-sardaigne-2012/)


http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_5606.jpg



http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/mg_7082.jpg



http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_5883.jpg





http://www.rallye-sport.fr/wp-content/gallery/sardaigne-2012/img_8030.jpg

[Jafry]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_a51e391fb4.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_a2b8a18b40.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_ff3623938f.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_cec44a7ca2.jpg



More photos from Saturday HERE (http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1097)

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fO0ZYf2r280

[hanjob11]

Photos are online at rally3.de (http://www.rally3.de)


http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/samstag_2113/album_1_2134/sardinien12_wp12kh_022_20121020_1436104188.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/samstag_2113/album_2_2135/sardinien12_spsakh_066_20121020_1434012124.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/samstag_2113/album_3_2136/sardinien12_wp13kh_023_20121020_2023160499.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/samstag_2113/album_1_2134/sardinien12_wp12kh_067_20121020_2010819159.jpg

Karsten

[danon]

Thе chopper became more interesting than the rally cars themselves nowadays :D

[stefanvv]

The really interesting one was that of "Canal +" in France :s mokin:

[dimviii]

http://www.rally.it/forum/attachments/wrc-world-rally-championship-24/13225d1350760749-59414_362931327130207_586085802_n.jpeghttp://www.rally.it/forum/attachments/wrc-world-rally-championship-24/13215d1350740224-5043_427699997289667_635516347_n.jpeghttp://www.rally.it/forum/attachments/wrc-world-rally-championship-24/13218d1350740243-75613_476390185716409_445841769_n.jpeg

[kirungi okwogera]

Motors TV back to their poor coverage, the editor/producer should be ashamed of the programe! First half of the show the sound is 1 or 2 seconds out then the second half is nearly in black and white! Do they not check it?!
When you see stuff like that there is always the same answer - money. Nobody who knows what they are doing puts out stuff like that unless they are out of time with too few people working on a show because there isn't enough money going into it. I was going to say "let's hope Red Bull does better" but I don't think we need to, judging from how they do their other shows they definitely will!

[kirungi okwogera]

http://www.rally.it/forum/attachments/wrc-world-rally-championship-24/13218d1350740243-75613_476390185716409_445841769_n.jpeg

Hmm... but he could have been sweating in a rally car, sweeping gravel with no chance of winning! What would you choose?

[spiderem]

So it looks like second place for novikov. Any news on his plans for next year?
Also is geraudet back alongside him?

[darkstar]

now i´m exited, will ogier stay 5th?

edit: wow, ogier 1,4 seconds quicker!

[Negaiss]

Loebs off outside view - from 1:40 WRC 2012 Italy Day 2 Highlights - Part 1/2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKH27wvTdqg)

[dimviii]

[SS15] Chris Atkinson (Mini) 6:31.3 "He (Ogier) is doing a good time. We are on fairly worn tyres, we were only 2 or 3 seconds behind Petter (Solberg), I can't do a lot more."

[Iskald]

Can Mads Østberg make it six out of eight? He has beaten all three in front of him with more than a minute since being 4.46 behind the lead on friday evening. Of course Hirvonen, Novik and Tanak have been in podium salvaging mode, but still...!

[Barreis]

Boring rally, only fight is Ogier/Atkinson.

[Racing Ka]

TV stream available?

[rallyfiend]

TV stream available?

No TV to stream for this event.

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcrjF25Z_yo

[dimviii]

Atko bad 2nd split..

[arko5]

Ostberg also...

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Mikko wins! Good job Citroen and Hirvonen, thank you Finland and France!

[Mirek]

Ostberg also...

Puncture, what about Atko?

[dimviii]

Puncture, what about Atko?

No interview for Atko after power stage? :(

[spiderem]

well done Mikko. good confidence boost for next year.
Congrats to novikov and tanak too...

[Mirek]

How long did it take to have lower class car in top 5?

[dimviii]

Congrats to Mikko for the win,and to Ogier for a perfect rally.
Pitty that the rally was finished very early.I d like to see Mikko fighting with Ford boys,would show us a lot of his potential for next year.

[stefanvv]

Strong Rally for Novikov

[dimviii]

WRC Team MINI Portugal’s Chris Atkinson’s efforts to snatch fifth from Sebastien Ogier failed when he lost more than a minute although the precise cause is currently unclear.
Mads Ostberg’s bid for Power Stage glory ended when he picked up a puncture striking a stone in his Adapta Fiesta.

[SubaruNorway]

Should be good fun watching the fight for third in the championship in Spain :) Mads now has 137 points, Latvala 133 and Petter 122.

[stefanvv]

Should be good fun watching the fight for third in the championship in Spain :) Mads now has 137 points, Latvala 133 and Petter 122.

IF something doesn't happen to Latvala, he should take it. But that's a big IF.

[Karukera]

'S gilt Hirvonen ! :beer:

Welcome Ott Tänak to the WRC podiums club. Well done Novikov and Ogier.

And glad to see FRM back to action :D

[tolis]

PWRC standings after Sardegna:

Guerra 84
Kosciuszko 73
Gorban 73
Fuchs 72
Ligato 70
Aksa 62

Next round is Catalunya!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Glad for Mikko to get a win after playing second-fiddle to Loeb all year. Pity it wasnt with all the other top guys finishing but then he didnt make their mistakes...

Also pleased for the 2 M-Sport drivers & Mads who all did a great job and did their future prospects no harm at all.

[A.F.F.]

What a rally... hurray .... :dozey:

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

just awesome rally.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Does Atkinson get the points that Ogier would get as he's not classified or does no one get Ogiers points?

[rage82]

Does Atkinson get the points that Ogier would get as he's not classified or does no one get Ogiers points?
Ogier will get points for his fifth place in the overall classification. He will not get points for SWRC as he's not registered for that championship

[GigiGalliNo1]

Just normal drivers? Cool

[Hartusvuori]

Ogier will get points for his fifth place in the overall classification. He will not get points for SWRC as he's not registered for that championship

And Sardegna was not a round of SWRC either.

So, we got four different winners this season too like last year - though, I need to remind myself time to time that Mads is WRC winner as well. Mikko was doing what he does the best, keeping his steady pace, not 100% but less and as all competition folded before Friday dusk, nothing more was needed. Hooray.

This rally's result is much similar to Portugal's when the second league picks the fruits the big boys have dropped. Not that I wouldn't be happy about Novikov's return to podium nor Tänak's introduction to podium, in all fairness this result much've given them both a confidence boost which outcome we - the fans - might get to enjoy in future rallies. By the average age, this must've been the youngest WRC podium ever (Mikko 32, Tänak 25, Novikov 22).

The biggest disappointment to me was of course Latvala who in his unbelievable, sadly charasteristic style managed to ruin the event for himself before it properly even started. He made the wrong choice after QS about running order, realised that, mangled himself in a mental lock which he was unable to open before the crucial mistake came. This all he admitted in an interview. Swap to VW is coming at 11th hour since this road is at its end, I think. He is the fastest, and always my favourite, but please Jari-Matti, don't draw yourself in a corner anymore.

[dimviii]

stones for podium :D
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A5u83ojCMAEOYhQ.jpg

[Jafry]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_68076ae845.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_8482943612.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_dca212e0ac.jpg



http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_3458671568.jpg



More photos from last day and podium HERE (http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_3458671568.jpg)

[Sladden]

I agree in part - it seems his mentality simply isn't right for winning anymore, though who knows if one lucky win may start a brief '2nd career'? However, he's still among the top 5 rally drivers in the world so he still deserves a factory seat in my opinion, maybe just be told to be a steady 2nd driver and get 3rd/4th every round without pushing too hard. People who say he should retire (I'm not saying you do!) are comparing him to the Loebs and ogiers of this world - compare him to the Prokops and Atkinsons and he's still one hell of a driver, massively entertaining to watch and listen to, and a key part of the sport still.
I wrote this post 17th dec 2011 and im not surprised how accurate I was...you could feel this.

"This is the first time since 2005 that Petter will be in a factory team and car capable of winning. Does he still have "it"? Can he recreate the magic feeling that he had with Subaru in the early 2000s?
I wish for this...but somehow I doubt it.

Been a bit too many demoralizing years without wins ect...that affect conofidence and that affect pace. And he is not quite a young and crazy driver anymore.
But to see him for maybe the last season in WRC in a proper factory outing is something I really look forward to. And I HOPE he win another rally!"

Petter should not be counted out yet but after a good start this season turned sour! Not good at all...

[Lousada]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1097/1097_rally_italia_sardegna_2012_8482943612.jpg



~40 people on the photo and more than half has a device in front of their face. Is there anybody left who goes to rallys just to watch?

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pIVMn9AA8Sg

[rallye-vid]

I was making rally videos years ago and realized that i see the rally first when i'm at home.... but hey, when you can't see the rally live you need the ppl with the devices in the front of their faces ;)

[hanjob11]

Hello,

photos of today online at rally3.de (http://www.rally3.de)

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/sonntag_2114/album_1_2141/sardinien12_wp15kh_38_20121021_2098477490.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/sonntag_2114/album_1_2141/sardinien12_wp15kh_35_20121021_1901941131.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/sonntag_2114/album_2_2142/sardinien12_sekh_079_20121021_1966008318.jpg

http://www.rally3.de/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/2012_1660/rallye_sardinien_2108/sonntag_2114/album_2_2142/sardinien12_sekh_025_20121021_1533518563.jpg

Karsten

[Mintexmemory]

Well couldn't have been better for me, my Forward Charm fantasy predictions of Fuchs and M-Sport (team) have catapulted me into 1st spot for the first time this season. As for the Pickems, I suspect it will be won with less than 15 points!

[Mirek]

... but hey, when you can't see the rally live you need the ppl with the devices in the front of their faces ;)

Nowadays You have hundreds of professional photos and plenty of good videos from every village event. There is no reason to make some crappy photos by phone. Besides that looking into cameras doesn't help spectator safety at all.

[steffforno]

Loeb Crash video spectator Loeb crash WRC Rally Italia Sardegna 2012 ps 3 Monte Lerno - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z57JkJwt9dk)
Neville goes straight Rally Italia Sardegna 2012 - Neuville goes straight - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw85la_9et0&feature=plcp)
Novikov goes straight Rally Italia Sardegna 2012 - Novikov goes straight - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-9bAXQ1_Uw&feature=plcp)
Atko mini crash Rally d'Italia | Sardegna 2012 | PS7 Tergu-Osilo | Christopher ATKINSON - Stephane PREVOT |OUT| - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKQ3BzDVLYQ)

[Langdale Forest]

This WRC.com story is wrong.

World Rally Championship - News - Features - From the archives: French exchange (http://www.wrc.com/news/features/from-the-archives-french-exchange/?fid=17770)

It says that Carlos Sainz was the last non-French driver to win in a Citroen, but Duval won in Australia 2005.

[Mirek]

What was the reason for Kruuda's retirement? I saw on photos he was driving some stage with crashed co-driver's door. Was it that?

[GustavK]

His car was too damaged. They weren't allowed to continue. Really shame about that, would've been good to see two estonians on point scoring places.

[Hartusvuori]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/297144_426814530700373_76463980_n.jpg

From ME3 Rally Team's Facebook.

[stefanvv]

From ME3 Rally Team's Facebook.

The dragon there just had too much fire :D But seriously I regret for Kruuda, such fast pace - almost as much as VW Fabias.

[A.F.F.]

Just a fleshwound....

[jliivak]

This picture should be from friday, but if I understood correctly, they damaged also the roll cage on saturday, when they had the impact with passenger side door and that was the cause of retirement.

[Mirek]

That's slightly visible here

http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/it/tc67.jpg

[Mintexmemory]

Just a fleshwound....
So is the WRC equivalent of Monty Python's Black Knight, KK sitting with all wheels gone, revving the hell out of the engine asking spectators for a push?

[A.F.F.]

So is the WRC equivalent of Monty Python's Black Knight, KK sitting with all wheels gone, revving the hell out of the engine asking spectators for a push?

Nope, he'll block the road and yells none shall pass!!!


I'm sorry, this was the only entertainment I found from this rally.

[dimviii]

excellent video as always...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wv85mNVxiXM

[dimviii]

nice post tommeke!! WHat difference between Ogier Mikkelsen at their driving style?

[MartijnS]

Thanks for posting Joost his video dimviii!
My photos are online too, excellent rally for us too, first time in Sardegna! Also did 12 stages.
Lots of people around indeed!

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/Dettori%201.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/Latvala%202.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/Tanak%2011.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/Novikov%208.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/Neuville%202.jpg

More at our Facebook page (http://facebook.com/rallymedia) or our Website (http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/rallysardegna/rallysardegna.html) !

[noel157]

nice post tommeke!! WHat difference between Ogier Mikkelsen at their driving style?

Me too.

[dimviii]

thanks tommeke very good explanation,something like this i ve understant from various videos about these duo.

[dimviii]

Thanks for posting Joost his video dimviii!


you are welcome MartijnS! thanks for yours excellent work!proffesional level,and top spots at every rally.

[stefanvv]

Ogier is amazing, just perfect! It looks so brutal, sideways far before the corner (but less oversteer in exit) etc, but unlike Mikkelsen he always seems to know exactly where he ends up, we've seen places on a technical part (SS Castelsardo) where he was much wider than the others (in the first of 2 corners), being in the bushes already almost hitting rocks with the side of the car, on other tricky places like for example a fast right one (4th gear) with some narrow bridge just after the corner, he was exactly on the edge of the bridge after the corner. Always on the limit but it's very rare to see him making a mistake. He's driving perfect lines, perhaps the best lines of all drivers (S2000 is a perfect school for that, as having the perfect exit out of the corner is probably even more important than with WRC).

He didn't made single mistake this year (except the brutal crash on Monte) and has been always on top of S2000 classification. I think VW atmosphere is doing good to him.

[mousti]

And I'm following the oppinion also on Mikkelsen, he never got really a rival at IRC and still is not sure to be a champion till the last event in Cyprus, and still don't have a tarmac win! That's saying quite alot...

[pettersolberg29]

And I'm following the oppinion also on Mikkelsen, he never got really a rival at IRC and still is not sure to be a champion till the last event in Cyprus, and still don't have a tarmac win! That's saying quite alot...

Yeh but his pace on the WRC rounds has matched and sometimes even exceeded Ogier's pace. The boy's a serious talent, that's for sure.

[pino]

I'm sorry, this was the only entertainment I found from this rally.

You are getting older and older :p

[Motorsportfun]

Ok, I tell you also "my" Rally d'Italia Sardegna 2012!

Just an awesome event, I drove some stages through the weekend and I have to say I didn't expect such a great crowd over the route... lots of spectators (never seen something like this before in Sardinia!), great stages: Tergu-Osilo, used for many years by Pirelli to develop their tyres for WRC and IRC (but used also by Mitsubishi/Peugeot/Subaru to develop their WRCars), confirmed its reputation of a very difficult stage! So fascinating the stage in Monti di Alà, near the windfarms, stunning scenery and - of course, so fashion podium finish in glamourous Porto Cervo, close to the James Bond's "The spy who loved me" set! And finally, good live-coverage from Italian "Rai Sport 2" network.

Really hope to see again the Italian WRC round in Sardinia, it's absolutely an added-value for the series.

And a "hello" to the Medias I driven to the end of Tergu stage from around Sassary city-center with "my" VW. :D

[A.F.F.]

No I'm not. Who can honestly this was a good rally?

[Mirek]

No I'm not. Who can honestly this was a good rally?

What was wrong with it?

[HaCo]

From what I've seen from video footage the stages looked really nice: narrow, hot, in villages on gravel, ... something different, not boring!!! :D

[A.F.F.]

What was wrong with it?

How about everything? It revealed the levels of differencies once again. After Loeb, Latvala and Solberg retired, there were lonely drivers cruising to finish without any competition. I should have written in the previous post... except the ones who followed live.

But still, it's kinda depressing that next year we have Ogier and Latvala fighting for win IF VW allows them fight. Then we have Hirvonen driving solid to third. Then we have Ostberg and Solberg and then comes the rest of them. This is of course only in those rallies Loeb won't participate. :mark:

[A.F.F.]

Don't predict too early... Ostberg is improving a lot last time, on gravel and asphalt as well. Novikov is becoming faster and more consistent all the time. Then we have Neuville and Tanak as 2 youngsters who did quite well in their first complete WRC season. What is Mikkelsen going to do with a third VW? In Sardinia Hirvonen was matching Loeb's pace before Loeb made a mistake... ;) I don't believe Hirvonen will just "cruise to third", just as I don't believe VW will beat everyone from the start.

I truly hope you're right. Especially Hirvonen's part. But I'll my words the day I see Hirvonen truly fighting as I'm afraid those days long gone. I'm afraid he'll most comfortable with driving without risk and taking the secure points in the situation where two faster drivers are potential to block each others away. Can't see the fire in his eyes after that NORF crash anymore :(

[Bartolbia84]

The staff at the Rally Italia Sardegna thank all the fans who in a spirit of sacrifice and passion have been following the race. A special thanks to those who have dedicated some of their time to work with the organization. Thanks again to all who are likely to be personally in the defense and promotion of the race

[Mirek]

Someone obviously forgot to tell Ogier that the S2000 don't fly :D

http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/it/dsc_2203.jpg

[MikeD]

How about everything? It revealed the levels of differencies once again. After Loeb, Latvala and Solberg retired, there were lonely drivers cruising to finish without any competition. I should have written in the previous post... except the ones who followed live.

I follow you to some extend but I have never liked this rally. For me the Italian round should be in Sanremo.


But still, it's kinda depressing that next year we have Ogier and Latvala fighting for win IF VW allows them fight. Then we have Hirvonen driving solid to third. Then we have Ostberg and Solberg and then comes the rest of them. This is of course only in those rallies Loeb won't participate. :mark:

I see next year completely different. I think it will be the consistent and rock solid Citroën-Hirvonen combo, against the fast but furious Ogier-VW combo. Ogier will be faster but I have a feeling that VW can't compete with Citroën's reliability. It should be interesting as it's Hirvonen's last chance before Citroën pull the plug on the WRC before entering the WTCC in 2014.

I don't see why JML should be in the fight. There is no evidence in the last 5 years that he is able to fight at the top. He has way too many crashes and is too inconsistent in his speed.

JML's CV as a factory driver

2008 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(64 points behind Loeb and 45 points behind team-mate Hirvonen)

2009 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(52 points behind Loeb and 51 points behind team-mate Hirvonen)

2010 - Ford factory team: 2nd in the championship
(105 points behind Loeb but only 2 points in front of new boy Ogier)

2011 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(50 points behind Loeb but and 42 points behind team-mate Hirvonen and 24 points behind Ogier)

2012 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(110 points behind Loeb and 4 points behind Østberg and only 10 points in front of P.Solberg despite selected lead driver for the team)


Does that sound like a future champion? ... not in my book

[dimviii]

another point about 2013 is if vw will manage the proper way their team, about tactics,about the dogfight among their driver line up,about the tyres,about the weather predictions etc.
Ok Latvala and Solberg had plenty of offs,rocks inside the road etc but all these happened hunting Loeb and not Mikko.I am not expecting same ammounts of offs for 2013 for Jari at least.Of course as a number 2 or with logical aproach and not hunting Ogier all the year.Will vw manager give number 1 & 2? till now they say that there will not be number 1...
Another point is which rallies will enter the Master.The way he will placed at a rallies, may give or take points from Mikko or other drivers...ie 1st Loeb 2nd Ogier 3rd Mikko in this rally, Ogier will not take maximum difference points from Mikko,if Loeb win
ie points for 1st 25 for 2nd 18 and 3rd 15.
About Ogier....definetely maybe the best of the rest but....out of wrc rallies for a year,last rallies with ds3 not fast and out of road,we have to remember all these.Ok with fabia won everything bar the Monte,but with not so good competition except Mikkelsen.
Is way different competing with Paddon Mikkelsen, and way different competing with Loeb Mikko Jari Petter.Also don t forget the pressure as number 1(maybe) at a new unproven car.
Another point is polos reliability.Tests are way different from rallies.
So many variables that is difficult at moment to predict a winner imho.But if i had to pick a driver,will be Mikko.

[A.F.F.]

I follow you to some extend but I have never liked this rally. For me the Italian round should be in Sanremo.



I see next year completely different. I think it will be the consistent and rock solid Citroën-Hirvonen combo, against the fast but furious Ogier-VW combo. Ogier will be faster but I have a feeling that VW can't compete with Citroën's reliability. It should be interesting as it's Hirvonen's last chance before Citroën pull the plug on the WRC before entering the WTCC in 2014.

I don't see why JML should be in the fight. There is no evidence in the last 5 years that he is able to fight at the top. He has way too many crashes and is too inconsistent in his speed.

JML's CV as a factory driver

2008 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(64 points behind Loeb and 45 points behind team-mate Hirvonen)

2009 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(52 points behind Loeb and 51 points behind team-mate Hirvonen)

2010 - Ford factory team: 2nd in the championship
(105 points behind Loeb but only 2 points in front of new boy Ogier)

2011 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(50 points behind Loeb but and 42 points behind team-mate Hirvonen and 24 points behind Ogier)

2012 - Ford factory team: 4th in the championship
(110 points behind Loeb and 4 points behind Østberg and only 10 points in front of P.Solberg despite selected lead driver for the team)


Does that sound like a future champion? ... not in my book

Actually I meant rallywise, not championshipwise (<-- can I say it like that? ). Anyway, I agree, Mikko has a great chance of getting the title next year. He is very good at getting points. Should VW be unreliable, Citroen isn't and he'll get the points. Should either one, Ogier or Latvala crash, Hirvonen won't and he'll get the points. BUT, if one have to win a rally with pure speed right now, he'll lose either one of VW duo. Because he simply won't push that 100% anymore. That's why he calculate and choose that tactic which made Burns a champion too. To gather as much points from every rally without a fear of crashing. And personally, I think it's very sad :down:

What comes to Latvala and Ogier... Is there a thread already ? If not, soon there will be :)

[MikeD]

Actually I meant rallywise, not championshipwise (<-- can I say it like that? ). Anyway, I agree, Mikko has a great chance of getting the title next year. He is very good at getting points. Should VW be unreliable, Citroen isn't and he'll get the points. Should either one, Ogier or Latvala crash, Hirvonen won't and he'll get the points. BUT, if one have to win a rally with pure speed right now, he'll lose either one of VW duo. Because he simply won't push that 100% anymore. That's why he calculate and choose that tactic which made Burns a champion too. To gather as much points from every rally without a fear of crashing. And personally, I think it's very sad :down:

What comes to Latvala and Ogier... Is there a thread already ? If not, soon there will be :)

I understand and agree 90%. We have over the years seen some drivers/riders in WRC, F1 and MotoGP, when it clearly weren't the best that won (Nicky Hayden and Kenny Roberts spring to mind in MotoGP. Jenson Button in F1 together with Villeneuve and you mention Richard Burns). But after all it's not about being fastest or most consistent .... it's about a combo of both to get the most points ... even though some of us don't like the end result.

Maybe it's because I have to defend Hirvonen now that he's driving for "my" team, that I see him differently :D Have you tried that ... switching "horses" when your "horse" switches team?

[MikeD]

Another point is which rallies will enter the Master.

I honestly only expect to see him in Monte Carlo and Rally de France. Maybe also ADAC Germany to see if he can extend his winning record there, but otherwise I think he will focus solely on preparing for the WTCC.

[A.F.F.]

I understand and agree 90%. We have over the years seen some drivers/riders in WRC, F1 and MotoGP, when it clearly weren't the best that won (Nicky Hayden and Kenny Roberts spring to mind in MotoGP. Jenson Button in F1 together with Villeneuve and you mention Richard Burns). But after all it's not about being fastest or most consistent .... it's about a combo of both to get the most points ... even though some of us don't like the end result.

Maybe it's because I have to defend Hirvonen now that he's driving for "my" team, that I see him differently :D Have you tried that ... switching "horses" when your "horse" switches team?

He is a Finn. It shouldn't matter what team he drives in :D

[dimviii]

I honestly only expect to see him in Monte Carlo and Rally de France. Maybe also ADAC Germany to see if he can extend his winning record there, but otherwise I think he will focus solely on preparing for the WTCC.
All depents from what Citroen will ''give'' him.Definetely part of agreement between wtcc (also run by Loeb racing team?????)and Loeb part time rallies for 2013.We dont know all the paragraphs of the agreement ie if we need ''help'' at last rallies will you help us for manufacturers title?

[MikeD]

All depents from what Citroen will ''give'' him.Definetely part of agreement between wtcc (also run by Loeb racing team?????)and Loeb part time rallies for 2013.We dont know all the paragraphs of the agreement ie if we need ''help'' at last rallies will you help us for manufacturers title?

We know that Citroën won't enter WTCC before 2014, but you might be right that if he's needed to help with the Manufacturer title he will properly get the call from Matton, but honestly Citroën has won that title 8 times so they how to win that one, and I don't see VW winning that in their first attempt.

[wrc1600]

I honestly only expect to see him in Monte Carlo and Rally de France. Maybe also ADAC Germany to see if he can extend his winning record there, but otherwise I think he will focus solely on preparing for the WTCC.

Apparently Sweden as well.

[noel157]

Me.

[Mintexmemory]

I understand and agree 90%. We have over the years seen some drivers/riders in WRC, F1 and MotoGP, when it clearly weren't the best that won (Nicky Hayden and Kenny Roberts spring to mind in MotoGP. Jenson Button in F1 together with Villeneuve and you mention Richard Burns). But after all it's not about being fastest or most consistent .... it's about a combo of both to get the most points ... even though some of us don't like the end result.

Maybe it's because I have to defend Hirvonen now that he's driving for "my" team, that I see him differently :D Have you tried that ... switching "horses" when your "horse" switches team?
You undermine your argument / credibility when you talk about Button as an example of the best not winning. Who won more GPs the year he was champ? That is the only objective measure. Total domination to start the season which evened out, doesn't qualify as undeservedness! Over the season he was the best. The Brawn could only win because his driving style suited it perfectly. I'm no great Button fan but I'm old enough to remember Hulme's WDC in 67 when Jim Clark was the 'real' champion. Now that was undeserved!

[MikeD]

Apparently Sweden as well.

Have you confirmation of that because when Loeb was interviewed about this, Sweden definately wasn't mentioned. He was asked if he was to do 4-5 events and he said less was more likely and since he has only won two snow rallies I doubt he will do that event. If Citroën signs Østberg over Sordo I am pretty sure that Citroën is happy with the Hirvonen/Østberg kombo as their "snow pair" for Sweden :D

[MikeD]

You undermine your argument / credibility when you talk about Button as an example of the best not winning. Who won more GPs the year he was champ? That is the only objective measure. Total domination to start the season which evened out, doesn't qualify as undeservedness! Over the season he was the best. The Brawn could only win because his driving style suited it perfectly. I'm no great Button fan but I'm old enough to remember Hulme's WDC in 67 when Jim Clark was the 'real' champion. Now that was undeserved!

I won't go into an F1 discussion here, but if you think Button is worthy of being an F1 champion, then fine by me. I personally don't think anything before of after that double-diffuser championship proved anything other than him being other than a mid-field driver.

[cercle]

Back from a great rally of Sardegna! We seen 15 from the 16 stages, we only missed one stage on Friday thanks to a spectator that was blocking the road :-(
Great scennery, good weather, nice rally,...
This was my 3th time in Sardegna and it was the first time there was so many people. Is there a reason for that? The entry list was the previous years better than this year...
I hope this rally will be again on the calender next year!

[steffforno]

Back from a great rally of Sardegna! We seen 15 from the 16 stages, we only missed one stage on Friday thanks to a spectator that was blocking the road :-(
Great scennery, good weather, nice rally,...
This was my 3th time in Sardegna and it was the first time there was so many people. Is there a reason for that? The entry list was the previous years better than this year...
I hope this rally will be again on the calender next year!

Hi cercle!!! What's up? How Was the rally??? What place did you see?

[dimviii]

Have you confirmation of that because when Loeb was interviewed about this, Sweden definately wasn't mentioned. He was asked if he was to do 4-5 events and he said less was more likely and since he has only won two snow rallies I doubt he will do that event. If Citroën signs Østberg over Sordo I am pretty sure that Citroën is happy with the Hirvonen/Østberg kombo as their "snow pair" for Sweden :D

imho they will choose Sordo.At snow they have Mikko who is pretty fast,at asphalt is the problem with Mikko.
If Loeb-Citroen before Monte dont confirm which/how many rallies will participate,definetely is a tactics play to see the polo performance and accordingly to choose the rallies.

[SubaruNorway]

Back from a great rally of Sardegna! We seen 15 from the 16 stages, we only missed one stage on Friday thanks to a spectator that was blocking the road :-(

How on earth did you manage to see that many stages?

[Pascal 07]

My pictures :

http://imageshack.us/a/img255/3168/20102012mtp9559.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/255/20102012mtp9559.jpg/)

http://imageshack.us/a/img842/3507/18102012mtp9372.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/842/18102012mtp9372.jpg/)

http://imageshack.us/a/img210/2637/18102012mtp9267.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/210/18102012mtp9267.jpg/)

http://imageshack.us/a/img6/1482/18102012dsc2042.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/6/18102012dsc2042.jpg/)