If we take out France and Finland...

[A.F.F.]

.. was it Norway or Estonia winning last rally?

Isn't that kind depressing? Seriously, when I feel like this, I usually dig my rally dvds and watch few rounds from the 90's and early 2000.

[Francis44]

Wasn't it Belgium with Duval?!

[A.F.F.]

Might have been.

[Viking]

Wasn't it Belgium with Duval?!

Think so, 2283 days ago.....

[tfp]

Kinda sad really, doesnt feel like a world championship anymore :(
Saying that, it has been more a french rally championship in the most recent years!

[A.F.F.]

Of course, back in the good old days, teams offered more seats with special drivers. These days, they don't have the money ...

[tolis]

Indeed, it was Duval in Australia 2005!

[tfp]

Indeed, it was Duval in Australia 2005!

That was his one and only win though wasnt it? He did keep things interesting in Germany though!

[J.Lindstroem]

Wonder who te next one is? Personally i hope for Russia! :D

[Viking]

Correcting 2284 days (forgot time difference :D )

Hope Petter can erase this soon, Mexico?

[tfp]

Correcting 2284 days (forgot time difference :D )

Hope Petter can erase this soon, Mexico?

Doubt it, not unless Ford can stop their engine from starving of oxygen everytime they compete in hills that are more than 3 metres above sea level :D

[AndyRAC]

The sport needs more than Finns & the French to be considered a true World Championship. The sooner we see Belgians, Norwegians, Irish, Outer Mongolians the better....

[cali]

Belgium-Duval, Spain-Sordo, GreatBritain-Meeke, ...?
I think/hope it's going to change in the future with many young talented drivers now from various countries, to name only some: New-Zealand with Paddon, Belgium with Neuville, The Netherlands with Abbring or Weijs, Estonia with Tanak and Kaur, Great Britain with Breen, Norway with Mikkelsen, ... I'm sure that all drivers who are in a factory seat not (let's not count Mini with those) are there because of their talent, not nationality...
What concerns Estonia, than forget Kaur. We have Koitla and Plangi who have shown more talent and killer-attitude. For these guys, it's all about money (like for most of young guns). I like Kaur, but he doesn't have the raw speed. Good solid driver for any national championship.

[bt52b]

GreatBritain-Meeke, ...?
Great Britain with Breen :eek:

[janvanvurpa]

2284 days


It was less that that. A couple of years ago Travis Pastrana's own web site listed him as 2007 World Champion....

For about 20 hours.

Does that count?

[RAS007]

.. was it Norway or Estonia winning last rally?

Isn't that kind depressing? Seriously, when I feel like this, I usually dig my rally dvds and watch few rounds from the 90's and early 2000.

There are many, many aspects of the WRC over the last 7 years or so which make me dig out those DVDs.

[Wim_Impreza]

Belgium-Duval, Spain-Sordo, GreatBritain-Meeke, ...?
I think/hope it's going to change in the future with many young talented drivers now from various countries, to name only some: New-Zealand with Paddon, Belgium with Neuville, The Netherlands with Abbring or Weijs, Estonia with Tanak and Kaur, Great Britain with Breen, Norway with Mikkelsen, ... I'm sure that all drivers who are in a factory seat not (let's not count Mini with those) are there because of their talent, not nationality...

Meeke and Breen are both Irish.

If you take out France and Finland, than it is Spain with Daniel Sordo in Monte-Carlo 2012 that won and Norway with Mads Østberg in the Wales Rally GB 2011 and the Rally Sweden 2012.

The last real victory in a WRC event for a not-Finnish and not-French driver is indeed François Duval in the Rally Australia 2005, but Duval (almost) only speaks French...

[AndyRAC]

Meeke is from Dungannon, Northern Ireland. Breen is from the Irish Republic......

[Wim_Impreza]

I know, but Dungannon lays in a district from Ulster and Ulster is in Ireland...

[kevin19]

I have serious year 2000 nostalgia right now, think I'm getting old...

[darkstar]

haha, thats a great topic :) never noticed that really...i hope some day a german driver will win a wrc event ;)

[Mirek]

Correcting 2284 days (forgot time difference :D )

I never noticed that but it's really depressing...

[EuroTroll]

I never noticed that but it's really depressing...

I don't find it particularly depressing. Finland has always produced great rally drivers and then there's the phenomenon that is Loeb. That pretty much explains it.

What I find more depressing is that noone but Loeb has won the championship for 8 years...

[Mintexmemory]

I know, but Dungannon lays in a district from Ulster and Ulster is in Ireland...

Geopolitical seminar #1
a)The collection of islands comprising Great Britain, Ireland, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, Anglesey, the Isle of Wight, The Hebrides, the Shetlands and the Scillies are collectively known as the British Isles
b)The country which comprises England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and all the above mentioned islands is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and its citizens have the nationality 'British' written on their official documents (despite what they call themselves when supporting Rugby or Soccer teams).
c) Non- republican citizens of Northern Ireland call themselves 'Ulstermen' not Irish and vice versa
d) Hence Kris Meeke is British and an Ulsterman while Eddie Irvine is British and Irish
e) A citizen of the Irish Republic (Eire) is only ever Irish
So:
Meeke is British
Breen is Irish
Matthew Wilson is a Norvern Monkey (The greatest division is between North and South England because those jokers up North got all the forests for rallying!!! - among other things)
Here endeth the the lesson, not that I expect someone from an artificially created buffer zone between France and Germany to understand ;-)

[EightGear]

And I'm not from Holland but still Dutch. Try and work that one out. ;)

[Mintexmemory]

And I'm not from Holland but still Dutch. Try and work that one out. ;)

In this cold weather I thought you were all Friesian ;-)

[EightGear]

In this cold weather I thought you were all Friesian ;-)

Haha! True, the 'elfstedentocht' news dominated the whole country last week.

On topic: Didn't realise it, but it is quite remarkable. But F1 had a bloke who made shoes for a living winning everthing too not so long ago!

[Karukera]

Looking at the facts, it's about the first two WRC nations in terms of wins and championships, Finland being a tad ahead.
And also a bit related to the best WRC Manufacturer of the last twelve years : PSA, an almost fully one family/nation owned company.

[Wim_Impreza]

Geopolitical seminar #1
a)The collection of islands comprising Great Britain, Ireland, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, Anglesey, the Isle of Wight, The Hebrides, the Shetlands and the Scillies are collectively known as the British Isles
b)The country which comprises England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and all the above mentioned islands is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and its citizens have the nationality 'British' written on their official documents (despite what they call themselves when supporting Rugby or Soccer teams).
c) Non- republican citizens of Northern Ireland call themselves 'Ulstermen' not Irish and vice versa
d) Hence Kris Meeke is British and an Ulsterman while Eddie Irvine is British and Irish
e) A citizen of the Irish Republic (Eire) is only ever Irish
So:
Meeke is British
Breen is Irish
Matthew Wilson is a Norvern Monkey (The greatest division is between North and South England because those jokers up North got all the forests for rallying!!! - among other things)
Here endeth the the lesson, not that I expect someone from an artificially created buffer zone between France and Germany to understand ;-)

Thanks for this lesson, but it is still very difficult to understand.

[Mintexmemory]

Sorry for the mistake about Breen... Great-Britain and Ireland, a bit difficult to understand with all those regions, thanks for your explanation, Mintexmemory.
As an Englishman no apology necessary. You will find that many Ulstermen will be rooting for Breen even though he is from a country that only recently dropped its claim to re-unification under the rule of the Republic. Nationality is a very real issue between the people of Ulster and Eire that not many Welsh, English and Scots even understand.

[Mintexmemory]

Haha! True, the 'elfstedentocht' news dominated the whole country last week.

On topic: Didn't realise it, but it is quite remarkable. But F1 had a bloke who made shoes for a living winning everthing too not so long ago!

a) That is one mad skating race that makes rallying sane
b) Re: F1 domination by a Shoe maker, many Brits thought that was a load of old cobblers. (Seek out an expert in London rhyming slang if you need explanation)

[Plan9]

The sport needs more than Finns & the French to be considered a true World Championship. The sooner we see Belgians, Norwegians, Irish, Outer Mongolians the better....

Maybe we would have seen more of the above if the GFC hadn't wrecked the party. If the celtic tiger was still strong maybe Meeke could have bought a seat....

[Plan9]

Geopolitical seminar #1
a)The collection of islands comprising Great Britain, Ireland, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, Anglesey, the Isle of Wight, The Hebrides, the Shetlands and the Scillies are collectively known as the British Isles
b)The country which comprises England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and all the above mentioned islands is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and its citizens have the nationality 'British' written on their official documents (despite what they call themselves when supporting Rugby or Soccer teams).
c) Non- republican citizens of Northern Ireland call themselves 'Ulstermen' not Irish and vice versa
d) Hence Kris Meeke is British and an Ulsterman while Eddie Irvine is British and Irish
e) A citizen of the Irish Republic (Eire) is only ever Irish
So:
Meeke is British
Breen is Irish
Matthew Wilson is a Norvern Monkey (The greatest division is between North and South England because those jokers up North got all the forests for rallying!!! - among other things)
Here endeth the the lesson, not that I expect someone from an artificially created buffer zone between France and Germany to understand ;-)

How is Irvine British and Irish??

[sollitt]

How is Irvine British and Irish??Perhaps he has both mother and father.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

http://www.ecgassociation.eu/Portals/0/Documentation/Regional%20Group/UK%20&%20Ireland/20090819224826!British_Isles_-_UK_&_Ireland.png

[Mintexmemory]

How is Irvine British and Irish?? Because he is a British Citizen who is an Irish Nationalist (pro-unification) He describes himself as Irish and as such is in the minority in Ulster where 70% of the population identify themselves as 'British'. SO he is not an Ulsterman (i.e a member of the largely protestant majority). However, as a citizen of GB and NI who hasn't renounced his citizenship he is British. A large number of people have dual Irish/ British nationality (e.g. UK born children of Eire citizens)

[N.O.T]

Perhaps he has both mother and father.

Looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooL

[Plan9]

Because he is a British Citizen who is an Irish Nationalist (pro-unification) He describes himself as Irish and as such is in the minority in Ulster where 70% of the population identify themselves as 'British'. SO he is not an Ulsterman (i.e a member of the largely protestant majority). However, as a citizen of GB and NI who hasn't renounced his citizenship he is British. A large number of people have dual Irish/ British nationality (e.g. UK born children of Eire citizens)

Thank you for clearing that up for me. I recall (I may be wrong) he had the British anthem played on the rare occasion he was on the podium. I hope he didn't mind that too much?

[Karukera]

The map posted needed a slight correction in the rear. Done. :D


http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/flintwood/Scotlandandtherest.jpg

[EuroTroll]

Has Scotland then cast off the imperialist yoke? :p :

[Mintexmemory]

Has Scotland then cast off the imperialist yoke? :p :

Partly, they have their own 'Scottish Parliament' but they still have the begging bowl out to English taxpayers.
Dr Johnson's quote still holds good; 'The finest prospect a Scotchman may behold is the highway heading south to England.'
(Retires to bunker to await Scottish outrage)

[AndyRAC]

Ah, but Dr Johnson forgot to put the word sausage in his first dictionary..... ;)

[Karukera]

Retires to bunker to await Scottish outrage

You're giving up the fight too easily, not funny. :)

[Mintexmemory]

You're giving up the fight too easily, not funny. :)

Of course, I've seen those blue painted buggers in 'Braveheart' with their claymores. :eek: (and the mass mooning!!)

[J4MIE]

We will see what happens in a couple of years Mintex......

[Sulland]

Geopolitical seminar #1
a)The collection of islands comprising Great Britain, Ireland, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, Anglesey, the Isle of Wight, The Hebrides, the Shetlands and the Scillies are collectively known as the British Isles
b)The country which comprises England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and all the above mentioned islands is the United Kingdom of Great Britain a
nd Northern Ireland and its citizens have the nationality 'British' written on their official documents (despite what they call themselves when supporting Rugby or Soccer teams).
c) Non- republican citizens of Northern Ireland call themselves 'Ulstermen' not Irish and vice versa
d) Hence Kris Meeke is British and an Ulsterman while Eddie Irvine is British and Irish
e) A citizen of the Irish Republic (Eire) is only ever Irish
So:
Meeke is British
Breen is Irish
Matthew Wilson is a Norvern Monkey (The greatest division is between North and South England because those jokers up North got all the forests for rallying!!! - among other things)
Here endeth the the lesson, not that I expect someone from an artificially created buffer zone between France and Germany to understand ;-)

All good.

Do anyone of these groups consider themselves being european ?

[Prisoner Monkeys]

.. was it Norway or Estonia winning last rally?

Isn't that kind depressing? Seriously, when I feel like this, I usually dig my rally dvds and watch few rounds from the 90's and early 2000.
How is that depressing? So countries outside the traditional rallying nations are producing competitive drivers - who is that at all a bad thing?

[Hartusvuori]

How is that depressing? So countries outside the traditional rallying nations are producing competitive drivers - who is that at all a bad thing?

Can't speark for anyone else, but I'm quite certain he meant it is depressing because there has been winners from only two countries for more than half a decade already.

[AndyRAC]

Hardly the sign of a World Sport, is it??

[Hartusvuori]

Hardly the sign of a World Sport, is it??

And that is why it is depressing. But it's different laws to (world) rallying compared to many other sports.

[A.F.F.]

How is that depressing? So countries outside the traditional rallying nations are producing competitive drivers - who is that at all a bad thing?

Hartusvuori answered already but I find it depressing that there aren't more winning drivers around from different countries.

[oyunbozan]

galli was close to win, he dissapeared :( i think petter will be the next non-finnish/french winner. but he is a scandanivian so.. it goes in a similar way.
i think, it all depends on how your national rally federation is "feeding" the sport. FFSA is way better than any federation as i know.

[MrJan]

The map posted needed a slight correction in the rear. Done. :D


http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/flintwood/Scotlandandtherest.jpg

Get rid of all the blue bits and it looks much better. No Scotland and no Plymouth/Cornwall...you can even get rid of parts of Wales for good measure :D

[A FONDO]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FFRoYhTJQQ

[Plan9]

Sordo was close in France last year... With the problems at Mini/Prodrive I'm afraid we can forget about that also...

I wouldn't write them off just yet. The tarmac setting of the JCW is the one thing that they have got right!

[Mintexmemory]

All good.

Do anyone of these groups consider themselves being european ?
The Irish considered themselves european while the development grants were making them all very rich, now that the cash has run off the view is 'you'se can all feck off and take yer Polish / Romanian / Czech etc. migrant labour with you'
The Scots Nationalists consider themselves european as they will be in the queue for any possible development grants and in any case they've been back stabbing the English (usually in cahoots with the French) for about 600 years
As for NI, Wales and England the majority of the population voted to be in / stay in the EC but no individual will ever admit to having voted that way.
A great deal of British Comedy revolves around being 'different' to europeans. No doubt some of my countrymen may contradict me, but there is no general answer to what is the view that Britons have of themselves as europeans.

[EuroTroll]

The Irish considered themselves european while the development grants were making them all very rich, now that the cash has run off the view is 'you'se can all feck off and take yer Polish / Romanian / Czech etc. migrant labour with you'
The Scots Nationalists consider themselves european as they will be in the queue for any possible development grants and in any case they've been back stabbing the English (usually in cahoots with the French) for about 600 years
As for NI, Wales and England the majority of the population voted to be in / stay in the EC but no individual will ever admit to having voted that way.
A great deal of British Comedy revolves around being 'different' to europeans. No doubt some of my countrymen may contradict me, but there is no general answer to what is the view that Britons have of themselves as europeans.

It's quite interesting how being European mainly associates with the European Union on the British Isles. Whether you're pro or contra the EU. I mean, you're not Asian, are you. Nor American. You're obviously European.

[Mintexmemory]

It's quite interesting how being European mainly associates with the European Union on the British Isles. Whether you're pro or contra the EU. I mean, you're not Asian, are you. Nor American. You're obviously European.

Indeed, geographically there is no argument, but that doesn't mean we have to like it :p : . The question I answered was 'what do we consider ourselves to be'.
Some people have argued that after our involvement in 'the war on terror' we are actually the 51st state in waiting - God forbid!
So, European we definitely are but very few Brits ever define themselves as such!