WRC-Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012

[HarriK]

Breen crash from another angle:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BUqJziExtU

[HarriK]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/582147_4015603761421_889964602_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/488325_4015608921550_748439941_n.jpg

They unscrew trunk hood before rolling car back to road?

[garais22]

Some photos (http://www.go4speed.lv/lv/photo/autosports-pasaule/445-somijas-wrc-rallijs/) from Finland!

[Co-FIN]

I think Lappi will be in top3 @ swrc in this event. And i´m sure he will do even some fastest ss-times. I think he has possibility to go forward and his future is well planned. He doesnt rush to wrc and goes step-by-step. He is managed by EvenRally (Same as Mikkelsen) EVEN Rally (http://www.evenrally.com/)

I think i was pretty right predicting his rally :P

Some info about, E-P
GP Week : Issue 164, Page 1 (http://mag.gpweek.com/#folio=15)

[N.O.T]

very nice pictures... great selection of places.

[Mirek]

There are things You can't explain to the outer world...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oo8WxLjD_4

[stefanvv]

In some previous years Ouninpohja videos saw some jump length scoring, was this year such thing, who is the winner?

[N.O.T]

Thanks N.O.T.! It was an amazing event. We did the shakedown/qualifying on thursday, 2 stages on thursday, 5 stages on friday (Urria and 2x Mokkipera - Lankamaa) and 5 stages on saturday (Surkee - Leustu - Surkee - 2x Ouninpohja). Thursday was rather calm, friday and saturday were quite crowded. It's nice to see how many people are interested in the rally and how the whole region is busy with it. The event itself is quite strict (on stage as parking as well), but with such an amount of people there is no choice if you want to avoid chaos and cancelled stages... No need to tell about the stages, we searched for faster corners and also found some corner/jump combinations, amazing to see how precise they can drive at such high speed... Thanks again to Juha_Koo and Hartusvuori!

This is what i like in people... the search for the good spot... taking risks by imagining the line and the speed of the drivers at that spot and when the result is like the pictures above the satisfaction is guaranteed... some times you lose of course but with experience you minimize the error.

I just hate going to an event and following the official guides blindly where you end up in boring places... I prefer not to go to an event than doing that.

Again great job with the pictures.

[Hartusvuori]

In some previous years Ouninpohja videos saw some jump length scoring, was this year such thing, who is the winner?

The metre marks were all set, but because of the obvious ongoing war between Vauhdin Maailma magazine and the rally organiser, they were removed. I don't know who's the winner.

[janvanvurpa]

Breen crash from another angle:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BUqJziExtU

Well at least they cleared the little creek. That is never fun to have to step out of the car and go splooosh up to your knees in stinky mud.

[janvanvurpa]

The metre marks were all set, but because of the obvious ongoing war between Vauhdin Maailma magazine and the rally organiser, they were removed. I don't know who's the winner.

ongoing war? Scandle?!! Gossip?!!! Details...details.. Trouble in Ralli Paradis?

[OldF]

Tuulilasi was this year official spectator guide. What I liked about the Tuulilasi spectator guide was that the description of the spectator viewing sites was explained with the same accuracy in both Finnish and English, which is of course good for foreign spectators. Only thing I missed was comments about the stages from drivers.

This year Vauhdin Maailma’s spectator guide was crap. Description of viewing places but no closing time of the stages and no parking instructions and what services there was. Also heard in the radio that the VM spectator guide included viewing points that was not allowed.

[stefanvv]

This is what i like in people... the search for the good spot... taking risks by imagining the line and the speed of the drivers at that spot and when the result is like the pictures above the satisfaction is guaranteed... some times you lose of course but with experience you minimize the error.

I just hate going to an event and following the official guides blindly where you end up in boring places... I prefer not to go to an event than doing that.

Again great job with the pictures.

I would add also spots in corners with water splashes. Such pictures are just incredible.

[MTA]

Our pictures are online at ...::: Rallyfoto.se :::... (http://www.rallyfoto.se)
Click "Besökta Tävlingar"
A wonderful rally as usual!

[A FONDO]

BLoody flash why everybodu uses it :dozey:

[Ville]

Tuulilasi was this year official spectator guide. What I liked about the Tuulilasi spectator guide was that the description of the spectator viewing sites was explained with the same accuracy in both Finnish and English, which is of course good for foreign spectators. Only thing I missed was comments about the stages from drivers.

This year Vauhdin Maailma’s spectator guide was crap. Description of viewing places but no closing time of the stages and no parking instructions and what services there was. Also heard in the radio that the VM spectator guide included viewing points that was not allowed.

Terrible marketing from Tuulilasi. This was the first time I heard Tuulilasi had something to do with NORF. My eye did not catch any Tuulilasi guide at the stores or magazine stands, but the VM was showing everywhere.

You are right about the parking and services in VM, but on the other hand, the maps were a lot better than earlier, and also driver comments were good.

[rp]

You are right about the parking and services in VM, but on the other hand, the maps were a lot better than earlier, and also driver comments were good.

Surely there would have been parking and other information in VM, but AKK Motorsport did not allowed them that info, because the official was Tuulilasi. What a mess. If there was money issue (what else it can be...) and Tuulilasi was willing to pay more than VM it was very stupid decision from AKK (not a big surprise nowadays) to stop the co-operation with VM. It had been the official guide since 1970´s or something...

[AMSS]

Citroënin salainen ase Jyväskylässä paljastui! - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - Ralli - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2012/08/1592219/citronin-salainen-ase-jyvaskylassa-paljastui)

There it is by Citroen themselves, in short Citroen engineers have developed for some time now something completely new in the suspension which they finally desided to use and homologate now as the advantage was clear!
If you don`t believe what I said than maybe at least when it comes from Citroen themselves you believe!
And for the last time if you have to homologate it`s alot more than just a setup thing!

[HarriK]

Did the Mikko has also this new "setup"...maybe not...

[AMSS]

Did the Mikko has also this new "setup"...maybe not...

Yes, both works cars did!

[mousti]

JM Video 's review of finland!

Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 [HD] by JM - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryMXDtIo-aU)

[stefanvv]

Citroënin salainen ase Jyväskylässä paljastui! - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - Ralli - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2012/08/1592219/citronin-salainen-ase-jyvaskylassa-paljastui)

There it is by Citroen themselves, in short Citroen engineers have developed for some time now something completely new in the suspension which they finally desided to use and homologate now as the advantage was clear!
If you don`t believe what I said than maybe at least when it comes from Citroen themselves you believe!
And for the last time if you have to homologate it`s alot more than just a setup thing!

May be they are preparing seriously for Paris-Dakar?!?

[Juha_Koo]

Take a look at videos where Citroens are shown, especially observe the front wheel suspension...

[janvanvurpa]

Take a look at videos where Citroens are shown, especially observe the front wheel suspension...

This is one of the most annoying thing about the "personality driven" way WRC rally is covered and looked at... show us a clear photo of whatever the big giant secret is. Wheels off in service, close up.. Details, photo of parts, not speculation about super secret something we can't say--

[Bill_]

My perspective of this great rally:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw" target="_blank">
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw)

[SubaruNorway]

My video from Rally Finland. I didn't do that many stages this time and tried to enjoy my vacation more and just didn't bother with Ouninpohja because of the traffic. But i got some nice jumps and Mökkipera and Leustu, I've been to the Leustu jump twice before when it was ran in the other direction. Hope you like it :)
Motorsportfilmer.net (http://motorsportfilmer.net/2012/wrc-r8-rally-finland-2012)


http://www.raceinfo.no/temp/tn_Skjermbilde%202012-08-07%20kl.%2000.29.41.jpg

[Juha_Koo]

This is one of the most annoying thing about the "personality driven" way WRC rally is covered and looked at... show us a clear photo of whatever the big giant secret is. Wheels off in service, close up.. Details, photo of parts, not speculation about super secret something we can't say--

And where did I say anything about secrets? There is none. Close ups from service park are basically useless because cameras can't penetrate metals or act like magnifying glasses.

Just look how the front suspension is working in driving videos/photos. I can't explain it in words but it looks different than before and than in other cars. Outward travel looks "weird" and vertical movement is more dynamic than ever.

[Allyc85]

My perspective of this great rally:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw" target="_blank">
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE8KZtKFVdw)

What a great first post! Welcome to the site :)

[OldF]

Terrible marketing from Tuulilasi. This was the first time I heard Tuulilasi had something to do with NORF. My eye did not catch any Tuulilasi guide at the stores or magazine stands, but the VM was showing everywhere.

You are right about the parking and services in VM, but on the other hand, the maps were a lot better than earlier, and also driver comments were good.

I don’t remember where I heard that Tuulilasi will be the official spectator guide. I think It must have been NORF’s web page or www.ralli.net (http://www.ralli.net/). I have ordered Vauhdin Maailma and when I saw the spectator guide I said to my friend that we must by Tuulilasi.

[tolis]

What a great first post! Welcome to the site :)
Actually it's not Bill's first post! He just changed nickname! Great job Bill! Hope I'll be able to follow the next time! ;)

[Bill_]

What a great first post! Welcome to the site :)

Thank you! As a matter of fact, I found some very usefyll info in here before setting off for the rally!

[fuse]

Great photos all ! My photos look to miss some of the sharpness and colors.

My contribution to Breen-Nagle crash:
serie of 30 photos (http://ice.1g.fi/kuvat/Moottoriurheilu/Neste_Oil_Rally_2012/EE1_2327.JPG) (sorry about watermark)

[dimviii]

Citroënin salainen ase Jyväskylässä paljastui! - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - Ralli - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/2012/08/1592219/citronin-salainen-ase-jyvaskylassa-paljastui)

There it is by Citroen themselves, in short Citroen engineers have developed for some time now something completely new in the suspension which they finally desided to use and homologate now as the advantage was clear!
If you don`t believe what I said than maybe at least when it comes from Citroen themselves you believe!
And for the last time if you have to homologate it`s alot more than just a setup thing!

it is not that i dont believe you but maybe Finn media want to create a myth about the secret star treck suspension invented 3 days before the rally,because Finns lost fair and square inside their country,but the truth is not like this.

Read this.
For Loriaux, connoisseur of the middle years, the handling qualities of Loeb is not the sole reason for his outrageous domination this weekend. "I think Citroën has improved a bit the car" , has assumed the Belgian . And just because he sees the team has completely reversed the rafters of his shock mount. "Until then, the gas cylinder was placed at the top, now it's down, says Xavier Sunday Mestelan-Pinon, technical manager at Citroen , in L'Equipe. We did not invent anything, because our opponents are using this technology for a long time but we had never explored this avenue.

Rallye - WRC - Finlande - Loeb, trop fort pour eux (http://www.lequipe.fr/Rallye/Actualites/Loeb-trop-fort-pour-eux/303817)


the secret citroen weapon in ds3 suspension was something fiestas and focus used for years.

[N.O.T]

The pain is too big... they are starting to run out of depression medicine and they start to invent things to cover the incompetence of the drivers for the last 10 years... the days that their managers destroyed other peoples careers (Loix, Scandola ects) to push their youngsters are over so now they try to invent start trek stuff... it is both sad and amusing in a way.

Lets just hope their panic doesn't affect the career of some finish drivers who actually prefer to drive than creating connections with teams and managers.

[stefanvv]

because Finns lost fair and square inside their country.

So did Hirvonen also.

[N.O.T]

So did Hirvonen also.

the super secret stuff are only given to Loeb 3 minutes before the start of the stage...

[rp]

The pain is too big... they are starting to run out of depression medicine and they start to invent things to cover the incompetence of the drivers for the last 10 years... the days that their managers destroyed other peoples careers (Loix, Scandola ects) to push their youngsters are over so now they try to invent start trek stuff... it is both sad and amusing in a way.

Lets just hope their panic doesn't affect the career of some finish drivers who actually prefer to drive than creating connections with teams and managers.

Maybe Timo Jouhki has been involved somehow (at least against Grönholm in Finland and some comments also against Hänninen), but I doubt that Loix´s and Scandola´s career has destroyed because of that.

Mäkinen was fast during his Mitsubishi days and it is true that Loix was very good when driving the Corolla WRC. Of course it helped Mäkinen a lot when Lasse Lampi was a test driver at Mitsubishi, but it is not their fault if the car was not suitable for Loix.. I do not know about Scandola, but maybe Markku Alen´s effect at Fiat was so strong that it helped of course his son´s career, but it is too much to say that Scanola´s career was destroyed. If Fiat would have been entered the WRC with the World Rally Car they surely had taken italian driver if someone would have been at the same level as other drivers...

Do not worry! There is still coming fast drivers from Finland and they really prefer to drive (Lappi, Nikara, Pajunen). Maybe Hirvonen and Latvala will never achieve the WRC titles, but there has never been such a dominant driver like Loebinen...

[dimviii]

photos by Greg Roslon
http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/fin/dsc_2281.jpg
http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/fin/mchammer.jpghttp://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/fin/dsc_2090.jpg

eWRC.cz - Fotogalerie Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 Greg Roslon (http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=3494&fotograf=100)

[tolis]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s480x480/315476_519740294706521_256436625_n.jpg

[tfp]

the secret citroen weapon in ds3 suspension was something fiestas and focus used for years.

Hahaha! :rotflmao:

The Citroen team starts using Ford suspension and suddenly they start winning almost every SS in NORF :D

So thats where they have been going wrong :p

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

I like how in the post race presser, Loeb comments on beating the two Fin drivers next to him; Mikko is all like:
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7sc90Zkp91rrhz69.gif
While you know Jari is inside all like:
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lpzx2xXVd71qhdftx.gif

[HarriK]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s480x480/315476_519740294706521_256436625_n.jpg

ABS-box or something dropped in top of the turbo and whole electricity wires at engine room burned. 3hours work and car was alive again.

[AMSS]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!

[janvanvurpa]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!


Such a shame you feel that way. This forum badly needs people who have touched the cars and can answer to the "fans" who are always saying "so and so is all washed up, finished! They're sooooooooooooooooooo slow" when they are 1/10 of 1% different, and those who say The ____________car is SOOOOOOOoooooooooOOOOOO much faster because.. blah blah"

Don't go.

[Rallyper]

AMSS// It´s people like you that makes this forum. It´s not for not that I found this forum years ago on a link on Bosses website.

So don´t mind the kids. Be grown and continue to tribute this forum in the future!

[AP-Racing]

http://data21.gallery.ru/albums/gallery/251890-be09e-58076442-m750x740-u7379c.jpg

[Mirek]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!

Thank You for compliment which I don't deserve but please don't leave. Use ignore list instead to get rid of comments You don't want to read and take it easy.

[Hartusvuori]

As this thread is already starting to show signs of paranoia, it feels unnecessary to go back on how I experienced the event. But I still do:

What've been already said by many other spectators, Loeb & Hirvonen ran cleaner in corners and jumps, and that made the difference during the rally I think. The fast places we were at at the beginning of the rally (SS3 Mynnilä and SS4 Urria) the difference didn't show, I was only aware of it through hearing stage times. But on some twistier parts (Mökkiperä, Surkee, even Lankamaa's fast flowing left some 700m before the finish) it was open to a naked eye that Citroens were doing better. Hirvonen should've attacked more however, but when you're against Mr. Loeb, it's not happening if Mr. Loeb doesn't want it to happen. Also notable that out of the 6,1s Mikko lost, 3,4s came from the two SSS. I think Loeb's victory was the closest finish ever in the history of Rally Finland.

Latvala was disarmed through the rally. His comments on Friday morning sounded like his comments on Saturday morning the last year and I think he would've hoped to find that miracle set-up change and neck&shoulders massage at the next service - but he didn't. Third is still decent enough: At our place in Ouninpohja 1 (10,0 km - left, over crest jump, right) he jumped too far and it wasn't too far that he would've ended high speed into big trees.

Other notable drivers:
- Neuville. If someone finds time, it'd be interesting to compare his times (or time loss per km) on Ogier's times in 2009. They were kind of in same situation. Neuville had his problems, but he did very well.
- Lappi and Nikara. Both delivered. Enough said.
- Lindroos. A Loeb-like rally for him in 2WD class. Delivered.
- Evans, Dubert, Chardonnet. Hope to see them again.
- Block and Nobre. It is true that if you only look at the split times from your computer, you wonder why they're there, but rallying is so much more than just being the fastest - or just following it at home. Block was clearly having a mature approach and was always nice to watch. It would've been interesting to compare his times against Wilson jr. - I'd guess he wouldn't have lost too much even against more experienced Finland goer like Wilson is. Nobre of course isn't nothing special on stages, but I've never heard anyone being so heartfelt and excited at the end of the stage interviews. Tourist yes, but a polite one. He doesn't bother anyone by his driving.

It looked as if there were less spectators this year. Lots of foreign spectators too to create the atmosphere since it feels like Finns supporting their own in positive way is harder and harder every year. We did 10 stages with my friend and had a loose enough schedule not to stuck in any particular traffic jam. My friend did the QS too and his car's trip meter had around 1250 km when we finished - and we were based in Jämsä, pretty much the rally center. Lahti-leg alone was 500 km. Not so much walking this year, roughly 25 kms, but we compensated on that by driving bikes to Ouninpohja the same 25 kms (my bike was from the year Carlos Sainz won, it hardly had breaks and if Marcus said "three (gears) is enough" for Ouninpohja, I didn't think the same about only one gear). I'm also very happy about our choices of places, did some classics too like Urria's Mikko's jump and Palsankylä's big jump.

It was also very nice to meet in person with Tom. Also met one other Belgian guy (if you read this, send me PM), some newbie Dutch fans and also a group of French jump-crazy spectators. On Mynnilä stage we advised them to go to Palsankylä jump, and as we left the stage, we ran into them at the jump and I rarely see so happy face as they had.

Here's my friend's set of photos from the places we visited: rallyphotos.kuvat.fi (http://rallyphotos.kuvat.fi/kuvat/NORF2012/)

http://rallyphotos.kuvat.fi/kuvat/NORF2012/IMG_5215.JPG?img=img1280&hash=d1d4d

[Hartusvuori]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!

To me it seems that "the pain is too big" for other than Finns. It sounds like an old broken record.

What you explained about the changes in Citroen appeared to me as news, not as excuses.

And I'd like to add too, don't leave for this.

[stefanvv]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!

I think in this forum has lot of kind of people (like any other though), some are interested apart from the events themselves, also in the technical & driving stuff, others just use opportunities to bark against one or other because you see Loeb is so freaking great, other are just sick dogs and might wonder what are they doing trying to compete against him, blah, blah, blah, better change their profession and we must watch only Loeb.

So the first group always welcomes such technical information of car development, because racing besides for fans amusement is vital for manufacturers to develop technologies for future road cars, and that is what interests common drivers as well.

[AMSS]

Ok took my Prozac dose and calmed down... :) I`ll stay around but I will most definately learn how to use the ignore button.
And thank you all guys who got me to stay, it`s for you this forum is worth being in!!

[OldF]

Ok took my Prozac dose and calmed down... :) I`ll stay around but I will most definately learn how to use the ignore button.
And thank you all guys who got me to stay, it`s for you this forum is worth being in!!

Great news.

As stefanvv said “some are interested apart from the events themselves, also in the technical & driving stuff” and I’m one of those and to get some technical information we need guys like you and Mirek etc.

Imo the conversation where better first years after I signed up (9/2007). If you mean www.ralli.net (http://www.ralli.net/), I haven’t either post there many times. Once a year I visit that site more frequently is when the thread “NORF route and spectator places” starts. The other forum (Ralli - Keskusteluforum (http://www.f1-forum.fi/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=11)) is imo better.

And then I would have a question for you or some other that now about engines. How big is the advantage for direct injection engine (power & torque) compared to a non-DI engine (little oft topic in NORF thread but…..)?

[janvanvurpa]

http://data21.gallery.ru/albums/gallery/251890-be09e-58076442-m750x740-u7379c.jpg

Is that Citroen's new secret secret suspension? Rubber bottom link which stretches instead of breaking? That's brilliant!

[stefanvv]

Is that Citroen's new secret secret suspension? Rubber bottom link which stretches instead of breaking? That's brilliant!

:D That btw rises the question - how strong this suspension is? May be it really is "star trek 3" kind suspension, Lunar & Mars rovers have this options for big rocks.

[janvanvurpa]

Ok took my Prozac dose and calmed down... :) I`ll stay around but I will most definately learn how to use the ignore button.
And thank you all guys who got me to stay, it`s for you this forum is worth being in!!

How do you spell "pro-sak'' på finska? K-o-r-s-k............ :crazy: Oi då!


Let me ask something direct since you have worked in this business at high level.
Because the way Homologation works, every team knows a huge amount of data on everything, EVERYTHING... Not just simple paska like bore and stroke in the motor, but connecting rod length, valve sizes and the valve angle, crank weight, size etc, port area and shape, every tooth count in the box and diffs, tons of stuff printed and of course they study the other cars...

All this kiddie talk about various single secret nonsense makes me crazy, but what I wonder is I don't know what to call it except maybe ''the culture of the team'' multiplied by National culture. I worked in motorsport just a step between National Champignonskit and VM in another sport and spent 2 season in France and after I had pounded my head on the ground enough, then 10 years later did a series of long interviews with Ford at Boreham right when the 4x4 Sierras were in testing..

My lasting impression of those 2 seasons in France is how well the Frenchies I know worked together.. Not frantic panic last minute thrashing, but long and steady, and a lot of cooperation between everybody. Way less ''territorial'' or ''this is my turf'' than I see local where I am...
And I saw it in the 'real world'' culture in general in France..definately something there, I did spend 2 full season and spoke the language, worked next to these guys.

I did also work and later have lots of motorsport contacts and visits in UK, and the 'atmosphere' was much much different...way more stratification between people, kinda more hierarchical....ya know Owners, Engineers, peon mechanics, etc..
That was impression (not a value judgement).

When we think the differences really are 0,0002%, I wonder how much they general team 'cooperative feeling' makes a tiny differency getting everything right...Maybe a difference of 0,0001%?

Your thoughts?

[Juha_Koo]

Dubert in ditch on SS5 Jukojärvi:

http://juhake.kapsi.fi/motorsport/norf12/IMG_3233.jpg

[janvanvurpa]

:D That btw rises the question - how strong this suspension is? May be it really is "star trek 3" kind suspension, Lunar & Mars rovers have this options for big rocks.


Maybe better than Star Trek, it is Finland and so maybe its ''Star Wreck'' suspension....

I assume you are familiar with the Epic Great Finnish Film ''Star Wreck--In the Pirkinning''?
Star Wreck: In the Pirkinning :: Parody's final frontier! (http://www.starwreck.com/)
If not, you should be, it explains a lot about that crazy country...

[janvanvurpa]

Dubert in ditch on SS5 Jukojärvi:

http://juhake.kapsi.fi/motorsport/norf12/IMG_3233.jpg

Why do you guys make such nasty ditches everywhere?

[dimviii]

Ok, first of all I never even tried to have this as a reason for the Finns bad results, I as many others in Finland KNOW Loeb is the best and that's it.

Secondly I worked as a mechanic with 2 works teams until 2004, and still have lots of collegues there. Also my primary work still is all about motorsport so I work with several suppliers to the WRC factories still!
So I think I at least have a slightly better knowledge about things than the average Joe.
Anyhow in the beginning when I joined this forum it seemed to have a good conversation going on(compared to the Finnish ones where I never post anything) and there still are members here that I can clealry see have some knowledge of things, like Mirek for example.
But I am tired of kids trying to teach their Fathers how to F_ _ _ so this will be my final thread here.
Have fun and keep on guessing whatever you want!

about who are you talking mate?

[Mirek]

Why do you guys make such nasty ditches everywhere?

That's no ditch! Propers ditches are in Ypres :D

[bluuford]

Why do you guys make such nasty ditches everywhere?

Yes, this is not ditch. It is small depression where drunk people tend to sleep when they get tired. You know, no risk of rolling away from your "bed" ;-)

[MJW]

How do you spell "pro-sak'' på finska? K-o-r-s-k............ :crazy: Oi då!

but what I wonder is I don't know what to call it except maybe ''the culture of the team'' multiplied by National culture. I worked in motorsport just a step between National Champignonskit and VM in another sport and spent 2 season in France and after I had pounded my head on the ground enough, then 10 years later did a series of long interviews with Ford at Boreham right when the 4x4 Sierras were in testing..

My lasting impression of those 2 seasons in France is how well the Frenchies I know worked together.. Not frantic panic last minute thrashing, but long and steady, and a lot of cooperation between everybody. Way less ''territorial'' or ''this is my turf'' than I see local where I am...
And I saw it in the 'real world'' culture in general in France..definately something there, I did spend 2 full season and spoke the language, worked next to these guys.

I did also work and later have lots of motorsport contacts and visits in UK, and the 'atmosphere' was much much different...way more stratification between people, kinda more hierarchical....ya know Owners, Engineers, peon mechanics, etc..
That was impression (not a value judgement).

When we think the differences really are 0,0002%, I wonder how much they general team 'cooperative feeling' makes a tiny differency getting everything right...Maybe a difference of 0,0001%?

Your thoughts?
Having been very slightly exposed to the French way of doing WRC and the two British teams I agree with your perception.

[janvanvurpa]

Yes, this is not ditch. It is small depression where drunk people tend to sleep when they get tired. You know, no risk of rolling away from your "bed" ;-)

I hate that when it happens!

[jaripk]

Few photos from fridays stages Urria, Mökkiperä and Mökkiperä 2
http://kaitainen.net/gallery.php?id=186&lang=en

[stefanvv]

Having been very slightly exposed to the French way of doing WRC and the two British teams I agree with your perception.

So French are like bees in a hive, English like wasp nest. What should we expect from the Germans? Last WRC team there was Toyota if I'm not mistaken.

[MJW]

So French are like bees in a hive, English like wasp nest. What should we expect from the Germans? Last WRC team there was Toyota if I'm not mistaken.
Toyota was a United Nations, Swedes, Finns, French, Brits, Belgians' and Germans. A fantastic team, much missed.

[Mirek]

Toyota was a United Nations, Swedes, Finns, French, Brits, Belgians' and Germans. A fantastic team, much missed.

I would add one more as it's an interesting man (I admit don't know him personally). Czech Josef Juračka was working in TTE in 1990-1995. He is now owner of Juka Motorsport - team which has been running Škoda Deutschland cars for ten years (now Wiegand in IRC). His team was also cooperating in building S2000 cars for Škoda Motorsport customers. Also capable of major rebuilds of all Škoda WRC cars.

[MJW]

I would add one more as it's an interesting man (I admit don't know him personally). Czech Josef Juračka was working in TTE in 1990-1995. He is now owner of Juka Motorsport - team which has been running Škoda Deutschland cars for ten years (now Wiegand in IRC). His team was also cooperating in building S2000 cars for Škoda Motorsport customers. Also capable of major rebuilds of all Škoda WRC cars.
That's correct, sorry I forgot.

[sollitt]

Toyota was a United Nations, Swedes, Finns, French, Brits, Belgians' and Germans. A fantastic team, much missed. I believe there was also a New Zealander in the squad. I don't know his name but recall buying a house in Christchurch (1992) from a lady whose son was a member of the team. She was most proud.

[Mirek]

That's correct, sorry I forgot.

No need to apologize ;) You can't remember every single person through the history of the team, can You? :) He just came to my mind when You wrote about TTE as an interesting mix of nationalities.

[MJW]

And T.T.E had an Australian Team Doctor, used to commute from WA to every wrc event.

[tfp]

I would add one more as it's an interesting man (I admit don't know him personally). Czech Josef Juračka was working in TTE in 1990-1995. He is now owner of Juka Motorsport - team which has been running Škoda Deutschland cars for ten years (now Wiegand in IRC). His team was also cooperating in building S2000 cars for Škoda Motorsport customers. Also capable of major rebuilds of all Škoda WRC cars.

Wonder if he had anything to do with the design of the illegal turbo restrictor? Must be nice to be labelled a genius from Mosley!

[Rallyper]

Anyway - this is still NORF thread...

Me and my son Simon was in Finland for 11th time in 13 years.

Very good rally this year. As always. Strange though, Jyväskylä didn´t have camping places for tenters. We had to find our own place outside the center of J-Ä. At the shore of Taulumäki we finally found a place to put our tent although it was quite near some industri buildings and near a thoroughfare for exercising people running almost around the clock...

We did 8 stages and got to talk to Ken Block after his off on Leustu. We also saw Mads on his very BIG moment at Leustu just before Saakoski.

We met friendly people we ever met before, nice finnish people on stages and after reading this forum I reccon we were at same place as Hartusvuori on Urria...

Even met Morten, Katie J at Ford, Per Carlsson, Camelopard and his lovely wife Erica, Mads and Jonas at recce on Mynnilä, Kai T and many more people.

I got my very need of Finland and will with love come back next year to the most beloved rally in the WRC. Having said that during listening to Jorma Kääriäinen on Spotify....

[jiipee64]

>>Having said that during listening to Jorma Kääriäinen on Spotify....

Auts! That must hurt!!

[Sladden]

To me it seems that "the pain is too big" for other than Finns. It sounds like an old broken record.

What you explained about the changes in Citroen appeared to me as news, not as excuses.

And I'd like to add too, don't leave for this.
I think anyone with their eyes open could see a change from previous rallies this season. Citroen found an edge speed wise....seems like new suspension part could be part of the reason!

Citroen took 16 stage wins compared to Ford 3.

[Markko]

Here are our pictures if you are interested to see some: We hope you like them.

Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 | Tango Team (http://www.tangoteam.com/?q=gallery&g2_itemId=15076)

BR, Tango Team Motorsport

[dimviii]

for which reason are these wooden poles next to the road? aren t they dangerous in a possible off?
http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/fin/NORF12_4336_120804_Ouninpohja.jpg

[bluuford]

This is similar in Estonia and in Finland. Those are traditional fences for old farm properties. They are usually more for cosmetic purposes than for defending purposes. Construction wise they are very light wooden poles and usually not even able to go through the car window.

[Allyc85]

Sorry if I have missed it, but is there any onboard of Mikkos record run through Ouninpohja?

[Hartusvuori]

Sorry if I have missed it, but is there any onboard of Mikkos record run through Ouninpohja?

It was not a record run. Mikko's time on Ouninpohja 2 was indeed 1,2 seconds faster that Petter's time in 2004, but in 2004 the stage was 230 metres longer.

[janvanvurpa]

for which reason are these wooden poles next to the road? aren t they dangerous in a possible off?
http://www.ewrc.cz/images/2012/wrc/fin/NORF12_4336_120804_Ouninpohja.jpg


Some people say the fences are for keeping all the moosies in the woods and off the road. There are lots of moosies in Finland
But some say its to help the farmers who had a bit too much to drink to stay out of the woods and find their way home...they can be blind drunk and if they wander off the road they hit the fence then they can feel their way home.
Or somebody's home anyway... :crazy:

Shirley, I could not comment on which is more true.. :D

[CWJ]

http://rallyphotos.kuvat.fi/kuvat/NORF2012/IMG_5215.JPG?img=img1280&hash=d1d4d


The jump was good, but far too many people out there. I was wondering about the Jarko Nikara VIP zone at the top close left side, fencing stupid 10m deep with only a few people inside agains thousends of slave to authority fans in 5-6 rows outside struggling with the marshals and helicopter before first loop. Even Mrs. & Loeb events...

[Allyc85]

It was not a record run. Mikko's time on Ouninpohja 2 was indeed 1,2 seconds faster that Petter's time in 2004, but in 2004 the stage was 230 metres longer.

Ah I see, I had been mislead by the media!

Still any footage? :D

[tfp]

It was not a record run. Mikko's time on Ouninpohja 2 was indeed 1,2 seconds faster that Petter's time in 2004, but in 2004 the stage was 230 metres longer.

I dont think he beat Petters average speed either...

[Hartusvuori]

I dont think he beat Petters average speed either...

Mikko's average on Ouni 2 was 129,5 km/h against Petter's 130,3 km/h.

Here's Juha Salo's incar from Ouninpohja 1: NesteOilRallyFinland2012, ss17 Ouninpohja1, Juha Salo, Proton S2000 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6jfqmBOtm0&feature=youtu.be)

[uranium]

I dont think he beat Petters average speed either...

Don't forget Mikko now is running on 1.6t, but Petter run on 2.0t

[Hartusvuori]

Don't forget Mikko now is running on 1.6t, but Petter run on 2.0t

I think eight years in between made a greater difference, development on both the cars and the road.

[HarriK]

Are in-car films in this year free to uploading to net?
Just wondering because so many of these are online now. I didn't see any mentions in norf regulations although...

[N.O.T]

where are they ?

I have only found the Uninpojha stage from alistair fischer... nothing more but clips apart from that.

[HarriK]

Juha Salo Proton (Ouninpohja):
NesteOilRallyFinland2012, ss17 Ouninpohja1, Juha Salo, Proton S2000 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6jfqmBOtm0)

Brendan Reeves (Ouninpohja)
Ouninpohja Stage Rally Finland 2012 Brendan Reeves WRC Academy - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jY28l5ZuQEE)
Yazeed In-car:
Yazeed Racing in Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 (OnBoard) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcA7fHCaids)

Veikkanen Civic (Jukojärvi)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-RrKuWMhMg

Duplessis (Mökkiperä)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yx5J8xgKm8

Fischer (Ouninpohja)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcMiKW4oCsg (https://ieonline.microsoft.com/#ieslice)

[Xsara Fan]

http://data21.gallery.ru/albums/gallery/251890-be09e-58076442-m750x740-u7379c.jpg

Video: WRC Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012. Chris Atkinson`s out - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12Vkl9J7RzE)

[Franky]

Video: WRC Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012. Chris Atkinson`s out - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12Vkl9J7RzE)

Did he even hit sth in that turn? He seems to be on the line.

[stefanvv]

Did he even hit sth in that turn? He seems to be on the line.

Reminds me some of Ford offs earlier this year. There is a stone in the corner in which he hit hard as his tyre was in the ditch.

[AMSS]

World Rally Championship - News - Revealed: Citroen's Finnish secret weapon (http://www.wrc.com/news/revealed-citroens-finnish-secret-weapon/?fid=17214)

OK, now it is clearer, basically Citroen has made what Reiger started and all others copied since, turned the damper upside down. The primary benefit from this is less friction, due to separate tubes, one tube for the piston, and one for guidance of the strut. The other benefit is improved durability(but this has never been an issue for Citroen before..)
So actually the Greeks here were right, Citroen just now are using same technics as Ford has for years. Just shows how good everything else is on that car!

[stefanvv]

World Rally Championship - News - Revealed: Citroen's Finnish secret weapon (http://www.wrc.com/news/revealed-citroens-finnish-secret-weapon/?fid=17214)

OK, now it is clearer, basically Citroen has made what Reiger started and all others copied since, turned the damper upside down. The primary benefit from this is less friction, due to separate tubes, one tube for the piston, and one for guidance of the strut. The other benefit is improved durability(but this has never been an issue for Citroen before..)
So actually the Greeks here were right, Citroen just now are using same technics as Ford has for years. Just shows how good everything else is on that car!

"There is no smoke without fire".

Hirvonen - engineer, that's new on me. Looks like he can tell one secret or another...

[janvanvurpa]

World Rally Championship - News - Revealed: Citroen's Finnish secret weapon (http://www.wrc.com/news/revealed-citroens-finnish-secret-weapon/?fid=17214)

OK, now it is clearer, basically Citroen has made what Reiger started and all others copied since, turned the damper upside down. The primary benefit from this is less friction, due to separate tubes, one tube for the piston, and one for guidance of the strut. The other benefit is improved durability(but this has never been an issue for Citroen before..)
So actually the Greeks here were right, Citroen just now are using same technics as Ford has for years. Just shows how good everything else is on that car!

Jössös, the description in the link is so lame. The airheads writing the crap at WRC.com are too lazy or ignorant to ask anything, take any photos, or understand how on current ''inverted'' there are already ''2 tubes" ---the upper tube guides the piston, and the lower tube guides the upper..---how odd cause this morning I have to order material for another 40 lower tubes, 3.04m...
(sigh)

[tfp]

Don't forget Mikko now is running on 1.6t, but Petter run on 2.0t

True, and if I remember right Petter set that time using Pirelli's. There are a lot of variables over the years. Its a shame it couldnt have used the same length stage as Petter. That way it could be an outright test of speed.

You never know, one there maybe a competition with cars just built for Ouhninpohja, like pikes peak :p :
Or maybe not :s mokin:

[dimviii]

eWRC.cz - Fotogalerie Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 Marcin Rybak (http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=3494&fotograf=105)

[Mirek]

Amazing camera angle in this onboard of Alistair Fisher from Ouninpohja:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcMiKW4oCsg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcMiKW4oCsg

[Susiraja]

I finally managed to update my blog. Behind the link you can find some thoughts and pictures of our adventure in "Jyskälä".

Rally Co-driver: WRC, Neste Oil Rally Finland 1-4th of August (http://finnishcodriver.blogspot.fi/2012/08/wrc-neste-oil-rally-finland-1-4th-of.html)

[Hartusvuori]

You never know, one there maybe a competition with cars just built for Ouhninpohja, like pikes peak :p :
Or maybe not :s mokin:

The story goes that in 1985 when Hannu Mikkola landed the previous record time for Ouninpohja in Quattro E2, the team changed Audi's back wing to a bigger one just made for Ouninpohja. This enchanced downforce and the faster Mikkola went, the better the grip was. I don't know if there is photos to go with the story but that is at least how Mikkola tells it.

[stefanvv]

The story goes that in 1985 when Hannu Mikkola landed the previous record time for Ouninpohja in Quattro E2, the team changed Audi's back wing to a bigger one just made for Ouninpohja. This enchanced downforce and the faster Mikkola went, the better the grip was. I don't know if there is photos to go with the story but that is at least how Mikkola tells it.

AUDI team also have boosted the engine there, if I'm not mistaken.

[tfp]

The story goes that in 1985 when Hannu Mikkola landed the previous record time for Ouninpohja in Quattro E2, the team changed Audi's back wing to a bigger one just made for Ouninpohja. This enchanced downforce and the faster Mikkola went, the better the grip was. I don't know if there is photos to go with the story but that is at least how Mikkola tells it.

This is why it is called the Finnish GP :)

I love to hear about things that hapenned in the past like this, especially if it involves the group B era :)

[WRCfan]

Haha!

Rally streakers: Crazy Finns react to Craig Breen´s accident in Ouninpohja - WRC Rally Finland 2012 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doqPcfFb2Oc)

[N.O.T]

Haha!

Rally streakers: Crazy Finns react to Craig Breen´s accident in Ouninpohja - WRC Rally Finland 2012 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doqPcfFb2Oc)

nice to see that there are low lifes in developed countries as well... i thought we were the only priviledged nation to have them in abundance.

Of course it is too much to ask from sub-human species to understand that the guy who had that huge accident had another one a few weeks back which cost the life of his 24 year old co-driver.....

[stefanvv]

nice to see that there are low lifes in developed countries as well... i thought we were the only priviledged nation to have them in abundance.

Of course it is too much to ask from sub-human species to understand that the guy who had that huge accident had another one a few weeks back which cost the life of his 24 year old co-driver.....

Figure it out. May be when the alcohol had vaporized from their heads, probably could understand that stupidity (even in general)... or may be not.

[N.O.T]

Figure it out. May be when the alcohol had vaporized from their heads, probably could understand that stupidity (even in general)... or may be not.

the fact that they actually drink that much shows that they are full retards when they do not drink as well...

One of the reasons i am hesitant to visit Finland is exactly this kind of garbage behavior... clapping and cheering when they see accidents is beyond me. And it is a real pity to see such behavior from a nation that i hugely respect on how they do things in general, not only rallying.

[dimviii]

the fact that they actually drink that much shows that they are full retards when they do not drink as well...

One of the reasons i am hesitant to visit Finland is exactly this kind of garbage behavior... clapping and cheering when they see accidents is beyond me. And it is a real pity to see such behavior from a nation that i hugely respect on how they do things in general, not only rallying.

for me it is not something that will make me hesitant for visiting,but trully i can t find a reason to cheer and clap for an accident.I saw this behaviour and at other countries too.

[SubaruNorway]

Just go to the right places and you won't be bothered about it, can't actually remember to have seen any overly drunk people on the stages this year.

[Miika]

Mikko in Ouninpohja:
2012 WRC Neste Oil Rally Finland Mikko Hirvonen Long Onboard - Dailymotion-Video (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xsqohf_2012-wrc-neste-oil-rally-finland-mikko-hirvonen-long-onboard_auto)

[Juha_Koo]

Mikko in Ouninpohja:
2012 WRC Neste Oil Rally Finland Mikko Hirvonen Long Onboard - Dailymotion-Video (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xsqohf_2012-wrc-neste-oil-rally-finland-mikko-hirvonen-long-onboard_auto)

Awww sh*te, intercom audio is missing... Otherwise nice.

[DreamDjalal]

nice video you can see that Mikko takes riskes in some parts of the stage

[Gregor-y]

And here I thought they were clapping to see the team get out of the car unhurt.

[Tomi]

And here I thought they were clapping to see the team get out of the car unhurt.

That was offcourse the case too.

[Ucci]

Unbelivable stuff, what an immense grip, Mikko knows every bend & overcrest of the stage by his mind, with this speed he must be 110% sure....only the words of co-pilot are not enough. It is bloody fast, congrats to Mikko & Jarmo.

[Coach 2]

Completely right UCCI, and he is still only 0.6 and 1.1 in front of Solberg and Loeb. It also shows how difficult it is for new drivers to establish themselves in the top. Factory drivers have driven most of the stages several times more, test more miles, no worries about becoming a factory driver (perhaps to remain one), etc. etc.
What I mean to illustrate, we must be humble and understanding when we choose to criticize the b-drivers in the WRC. It is not easy to establish themselves among the top 5

[Hartusvuori]

Molly Taylor - Rally Finland 2012 Mökkiperä - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1zf-eJCcBk&feature=youtu.be&hd=1)

[HarriK]

João Silva - WRC Academy @ Neste Oil Rally Finland 2012 - SS9 Mökkiperä 2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2otkCI5-zA)

[tolis]

In this channel you can watch a lot of footage from NORF, including the live stage coverage: https://www.youtube.com/user/alexander1ukr/videos

[A.F.F.]

Never in dozens of NORFs I've visited I have seen spectators cheering and clapping for a chrash !!! Always I've seen spectators cheering and clapping for seeing the crew is ok !!! Plus the reaction for helping the crew after a chrash is close to zero seconds.

I really hope folks wouldn't judge any of the incidents they see based on youtube clips only :mark:

[Xsara Fan]

Video from ALM RUSSIA Team:

Neste Oil Rally Finland: Cars (http://www.almrally.ru/news-command/info/8810/)

Neste Oil Rally Finland: Girls (http://www.almrally.ru/novikov-news/info/8802/)

[Salist]

Our video from WRC NESTE OIL Rally Finland 2012:

http://drc.racing.hu/photo/2012/tanak1024.jpg

WRC 2012 - NESTE OIL Rally Finland - AVCHD - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W-mPw-g910)

[stefanvv]

Our video from WRC NESTE OIL Rally Finland 2012

nice slides :bounce:

[keng]

Hi guys,

Just registered myself to this forum. I'm planning for a trip to NORF '13 with couple other friends. Now I'll just need some time to go thru this 57 pages to help me with the trip planning. I hope i'm at the right topic discussion.

[Hartusvuori]

Hi guys,

Just registered myself to this forum. I'm planning for a trip to NORF '13 with couple other friends. Now I'll just need some time to go thru this 57 pages to help me with the trip planning. I hope i'm at the right topic discussion.

You are right on the spot. And don't hesitate to ask. But for 2013 you'll have to wait a bit for I think nothing much is decided for next year's event. Except it'll be on gravel, fast and jumpy.

[keng]

I'm doing a preliminary plan using this year's schedule to see what I can come up with. I read somewhere in this topic that the location (in a large scale) wouldn't differ much from 1 year to another. E.g. Leg 1 usually held around Lahti, Leg 2 & 3 nearer to the rally HQ.

Ok, so that was from the spectator movement point of view. I'm also planning for the lodging stuff & I hope I can ask that here as well. We're thinking of renting a summer cabin or probably a motorhome. A summer cabin is something that most article says the Finnish go to during the summer which we're quite keen of trying while the latter might be a bit difficult to find parking spot or even camping ground for its size. Maneuvering thru the traffic to the famous SS is a concern too.

[Rallyper]

As Juha says nothing ´s decided yet. It can as well be Lahti second leg, but if I remember right we should count on Lahti on year more (They had a three year deal with Lahti).
But count on Jyväskylä of course. You´ll have to be at HQ at least a couple of times just to feel the rallyatmosphere.
One other option is tenting... We have done so the last 5-6yrs and it´s so nice being out on stage the night before, having some beers among the finnish fellows...But one sad thing about tenting is that there´s no way of finding tentingplace in the city of Jyväskylä. (We had to find tenting place in secret behind som fences of an industrial part near centre of J)

[Hartusvuori]

Lahti deal was for two years and it's now done - unless they make a new deal. So that we'll have to wait and see. I hope they'll drop those southern stages or if they'll have to go there, be it more stages. This year it was a tiring joke.

I'd go for a cabin near Jyväskylä (Jämsä, Muurame, Korpilahti, Petäjävesi, Vaajakoski, etc.). Depending on your approach to spectating the event, mobile home isn't that agile. If you plan seeing just two runs of one stage, then yes, but otherwise I'd go for normal rental car. With summer cabin by a lake you'd get also what's best in Finnish summer.

[keng]

I'd go for a cabin near Jyväskylä (Jämsä, Muurame, Korpilahti, Petäjävesi, Vaajakoski, etc.). Depending on your approach to spectating the event, mobile home isn't that agile. If you plan seeing just two runs of one stage, then yes, but otherwise I'd go for normal rental car. With summer cabin by a lake you'd get also what's best in Finnish summer.

Yup, renting a cabin is definitely in our to-do list, just not sure if its the 'better' choice since neither of us has been there before. We plan to spectate more stages, at more spots within a stage too, if possible.

Just curious, is there designated carpark near the stages or we can just park it along the road as long as they don't obstruct the traffic? Coz here in Malaysia, spectator do it the latter way.


One other option is tenting... We have done so the last 5-6yrs and it´s so nice being out on stage the night before, having some beers among the finnish fellows...But one sad thing about tenting is that there´s no way of finding tentingplace in the city of Jyväskylä. (We had to find tenting place in secret behind som fences of an industrial part near centre of J)

Yes! Having beers togetther with other Finiish fellows is part of our plan too! haha.

[Franky]

The Finns have a pretty well organized parking, either on a field or on the road side.

[Hartusvuori]

The Finns have a pretty well organized parking, either on a field or on the road side.

Yes, well-organised but compared to many, pricey as well (even €3 for roadside, €5 for field, then again, it's only once a year). You can see all official parks from the spectators guide. If you keep local rally radio tuned while driving between stages, you get update information if some parks get full or jammed. If you choose to enter the stage from other access road (which aren't blocked), there could be just self-formed roadside park or unofficial field park. But in most cases, you must pay.

On cabin vs. mobile home, I really don't see what you'd loose with a well-located cabin - or cottage, as they're more often referred to. As soon as you know your dates/flights, reserve the cottage. First come, first served, there are many to choose from and many different qualities. At best you get a house-equipped nice cottage along the rally route for some 100 euros a day. At worst, well something more stripped down... You can see some contacts from the rally website I think, they should be able to help you.

[vkangas]

I also recommend renting a cottage by a lake with own shore. It's not even expensive when you are this early. Easy place to start: Lomarengas is Finlands biggest cottage dealer: Lomarengas - Finland's most comprehensive selection of holiday cottages (http://www.lomarengas.fi/cottages)

They are renting thousands of cottages. Part of them are owned by companies and many are summer cottages of ordinary families who like to rent them out when they are not using them.

[keng]

Great! Thanks for all the inputs. That'll give me a good direction for planning. So where do you guys usually choose to stay during the rally week? Nearer Jyvaskyala town?

[Rallyper]

For sure as I mentioned, being in Jyväskylä on wednesday and thursday afternoons (if there´s not QS at that time) is a must. If the schedule permitts, you should be there at all evenings during the rally...

But having a cottage outside Jyväskylä or near a stage could mean you´re not possible to get to HQ every day. Thats why having your home in a tent is kind of better (if the weather is good) because you´ll be more mobile...

[keng]

Thanks a lot, I appreciate all the valueable input. Now with this good headstart, I should be able to get a good deal.

On the other note, does anyone here compete in Rally Finland themself? I wonder what's the price like, that is if they pick our entry out of the hundreds.

[dimviii]

nice video to compare jumps

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBRl1vAxAeo