Ferrari threaten to leave Formula 1......again

[CaptainRaiden]

This is getting old: Montezemolo (http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/271026/montezemolo-s-ultimatum-formula-1-must-change/)


Montezemolo’s ultimatum: Formula 1 must change

Luca di Montezemolo has warned Formula 1’s rule makers that the World Championship must alter its image in order to sustain a position atop the motorsport ladder. In particular, the Italian has highlighted technical regulations, a lack of in-season testing for young drivers and an introduction of third cars. Furthermore, he again states that Ferrari will leave the sport if its demands are not met.

In-season testing has been outlawed since the start of 2009 on the basis of lowering costs, although Montezemolo is sure that this will generate an ultimately negative effect as up and coming drivers are denied opportunities to test F1 vehicles.

“Formula 1 is still our life, but without Ferrari there is no Formula 1 - just as, without Formula 1, Ferrari would be different,” company President Montezemolo says via an article on the Ferrari website. “We can be very patient but there are precise conditions for us to continue with our work. We race not just for the publicity it brings us but, above all, to carry out advanced research aimed at all aspects of our road cars - the engine, chassis, mechanical components, electronics, materials and aerodynamics - to such an extent that the technology transfer from track to road has grown exponentially over the past twenty years.

“What is not so good is that 90 percent of performance is now based exclusively on aerodynamics and another negative is that ours is the only sport where no testing is allowed. We are building cars - not helicopters, rockets or planes. Sure, we must not go back to the excesses of a few years ago, but neither should we be in a position where we can’t provide opportunities for the youngsters we are bringing in through the Ferrari Driver Academy.”

Montezemolo also reiterates that third cars for the top teams would be healthier for the sport than competing against a number of smaller, uncompetitive outfits.

“Finally, there’s the issue of the third car which, mark my words, we support not so much for our own interests but more for those of the sport in general,” he continued. “We believe the interest of the fans, media and sponsors could increase if there is a bigger number of competitive cars on-track rather than cars that are two or three seconds off the pace, being lapped after just a few laps.

“As an example, remember in 1961 Giancarlo Baghetti won the French Grand Prix at Reims with a privately entered Ferrari; there you are, it would be nice one day in the future to see one of our cars running in American colours, or Chinese, or maybe those of Abu Dhabi.

“We will support our views as we see fit, in the best way possible, but let’s be clear: for those who agree, that is fine, but otherwise they will just have to accept it is our position. If Formula 1 still wants Ferrari, it must change and go back to being at the cutting edge of research, while always keeping an eye on costs. We are not in Formula 1 as sponsors, we are constructors.”

Ferrari last threatened to pull out of F1 as the row between teams and governing body the FIA – including the chance of a breakaway series – rumbled on in 2009.

[The Black Knight]

Hopefully he will leave and then we won't have to listen to his **** anymore. As I said in another thread, Ferrari needs F1 more than F1 needs Ferrari. If Ferrari left F1, F1 will still be the pinnacle of motorsport.

[ArrowsFA1]

It is getting old but Ferrari are no different to any other team. They want to protect their interests, however Luca's oft repeated claim that "without Ferrari there is no Formula 1" is posturing and nothing more.

[AndyL]

"without Ferrari there is no Formula 1"

Perhaps if Luca is so concerned about the interests of the sport as a whole, he could suggest how to rectify this over-dependence on a single team.

[Rollo]

Are you Lancia in disguise?

[SGWilko]

Call his bluff, and suggest he runs along now and plays with the politicians and leaves F1 for good.....

[SGWilko]

Are you Lancia in disguise?

Do we have a forummer bythe name of 'Rusty'? :p

[Knock-on]

Perhaps Luca wants preferential treatment for Ferrari again.

[kfzmeister]

Aside from all the Luca/ Ferrari bashing, i see good points in his argument.

He talks of more testing for the drivers and young guns, a third car for the teams (more competition towards the front, rather than too much traffic from the backmarkers), less aerodynamics controlling the show, more innovation (and trying to keep costs down), etc.,...

How is this bad? Perhaps it's time for some good arguments about why or why not!!

[inimitablestoo]

Third cars? No thanks. Only if the grid shrinks below about 16 cars - and even then, I'd give first refusal to the smaller teams. Not for any competitive reasons, just to wind Luca up :D

[BDunnell]

Aside from all the Luca/ Ferrari bashing, i see good points in his argument.

He talks of more testing for the drivers and young guns, a third car for the teams (more competition towards the front, rather than too much traffic from the backmarkers), less aerodynamics controlling the show, more innovation (and trying to keep costs down), etc.,...

How is this bad? Perhaps it's time for some good arguments about why or why not!!

While I agree with the criticism of certain aspects of his posturing, I agree very much with you.

[Dr. Krogshöj]

I'll believe this threat when they build an actual IndyCar to show they're serious about leaving F1.

Or maybe not even then.

[SGWilko]

Aside from all the Luca/ Ferrari bashing, i see good points in his argument.

He talks of more testing for the drivers and young guns, a third car for the teams (more competition towards the front, rather than too much traffic from the backmarkers), less aerodynamics controlling the show, more innovation (and trying to keep costs down), etc.,...

How is this bad? Perhaps it's time for some good arguments about why or why not!!

When did Ferrari last run a rookie in F1? The testing excuse is a charade to enable them to play catchup.

3 car teams will kill the minnows!

No thanks.

[ShiftingGears]

While I agree with the criticism of certain aspects of his posturing, I agree very much with you.

Indeed.

[Nikki Katz]

I'm not in favour of three car teams, it's hard enough for the smaller teams to score points as it is (not just the new low budget teams, we really have to include Williams here now).

I agree with lifting the testing restriction, as long as costs don't get out of control. Before the ban Ferrari tested all the time, even while other teams were restricted. I don't see how that's fair.

But to threaten to quit over this???? F1 would survive fine without Ferrari (except perhaps in Italy). Ferrari without F1 on the other hand...

I would love for Ferrari to leave F1 and join the IRL. I think they could add a lot to the series.

[Mr. Mister]

I think Ferrari should look at hiring some new drivers. I think their current drivers aren't too good. I'd look at the USAC drivers like Bryan Clauson, Levi Jones, or Jason Leffler.

Mario Andretti came from USAC. I think these paved ovals really teach you car control. I'd watch out. One team's going to do it one day and the entire sport will be more exciting when we have a real American hero beating Sébastien Bourdais in his Red Bull. Man, that guy doesn't know how to lose...but he'll have to learn if Ferrari take on a USAC guy!

[CNR]

I think Ferrari should look at hiring some new drivers. I think their current drivers aren't too good. I'd look at the USAC drivers like Bryan Clauson, Levi Jones, or Jason Leffler.

Mario Andretti came from USAC. I think these paved ovals really teach you car control. I'd watch out. One team's going to do it one day and the entire sport will be more exciting when we have a real American hero beating Sébastien Bourdais in his Red Bull. Man, that guy doesn't know how to lose...but he'll have to learn if Ferrari take on a USAC guy!
you have it "Sébastien Bourdais" and look how he was droped from toro rosso

He is one of the most successful drivers in the history of the Champ Car World Series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champ_Car) having won four successive championships from 2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Champ_Car_season) to 2007 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Champ_Car_season).
He drove in Formula One (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_One) for theToro Rosso (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toro_Rosso) team during the 2008, and start of 2009 season, but was unable to translate his past successes to that competition.

you have it "Sébastien Bourdais" and look how he was droped from toro rosso

Let me tell ya a little bit about this ole racin' business. Toro Rossi did not want Bourdais to succeed in F1, and let me tell ya why. Co-owners Red Bull and Valentino Rossi know how important the IRL is due to the successful partnership with Eddie Cheever. They wanted F1 to be Bourdais' stepping stone into the grand pastures of the IRL.

[Koz]

3 cars at Ferrari:

Massa, Alonso is faster than you!

Massa, Rossi is faster than you!

Rossi, Alonso is faster than you!

Massa, ruin Hamilton's race!

Rossi, ruin Vetel's race... (While being lapped)

Alonso: I give up!

[DexDexter]

I think Ferrari should look at hiring some new drivers. I think their current drivers aren't too good. I'd look at the USAC drivers like Bryan Clauson, Levi Jones, or Jason Leffler.

Mario Andretti came from USAC. I think these paved ovals really teach you car control. I'd watch out. One team's going to do it one day and the entire sport will be more exciting when we have a real American hero beating Sébastien Bourdais in his Red Bull. Man, that guy doesn't know how to lose...but he'll have to learn if Ferrari take on a USAC guy!

I'd rather hire Emerson Fittipaldi, I mean the guy was awesome in 1974. Jackie Stewart could be another candidate, those two experienced drivers would surely lift Ferrari to new heights.

[jens]

I'll believe this threat when they build an actual IndyCar to show they're serious about leaving F1.

Or maybe not even then.

Mm, like Ferrari build around 1986? Although they never raced that car at Indy AFAIK.

[Dave B]

You've got to admire Ferrari's persistance with their 3-car idea, and at least they seem to have ended their disturbing love affair with Rossi. 3-car teams is a big no-no for me: it would hurt the midfield and back-of-grid teams to have the entire top ten pretty much decided before a race.

More testing isn't such a bad idea but we can't go back to the days of teams pounding their own private tracks for weeks at a time. I'd like to see some Monday test days after a Grand Prix. The equipment would already be there so costs would be minimal, and by holding the test after a race you avoid a "Borecalona" situation where the teams have familiarised themselves with a circuit to the extent that the race becomes predictable.

[schmenke]

... I'd like to see some Monday test days after a Grand Prix. ...

What's the point of testing on a circuit that was just competed on? I think an additional test day on the Thursday prior to the next event would make more sense.

[Knock-on]

I think testing is about car development and not tuning a car for a specific circuit. Testing on Monday will allow reference of new parts against data acquired over a whole weekend.

[I am evil Homer]

Deja vu all over again. I'd actually respect Ferrari more if they had the balls to walk away but they don't.

[Dave B]

What's the point of testing on a circuit that was just competed on? I think an additional test day on the Thursday prior to the next event would make more sense.

Testing prior to the event would just focus on setups for that race, and no team would squander the time evaluating young drivers. A session after the race means the teams can concentrate on more generic testing, or give an opportunity to new faces.

[ArrowsFA1]

Deja vu all over again. I'd actually respect Ferrari more if they had the balls to walk away but they don't.

Indeed, which only goes to show that Ferrari need to be in F1. It's an empty threat. At least Enzo had the bottle to withdraw his team. and it always makes be chuckle that he did so at the first world championship event in 1950, which makes Ferrari's "continuous history in F1" rather hollow :p

[MAX_THRUST]

Its the same every year when they don't win either championship. You win some loose some, you can't win then all, unless your in a redbull.....
That's almost poetic.

[Jag_Warrior]

Aside from all the Luca/ Ferrari bashing, i see good points in his argument.

He talks of more testing for the drivers and young guns, a third car for the teams (more competition towards the front, rather than too much traffic from the backmarkers), less aerodynamics controlling the show, more innovation (and trying to keep costs down), etc.,...

How is this bad? Perhaps it's time for some good arguments about why or why not!!

I agree that he has some legitimate concerns. But Ferrari has a history of threatening to "go home to mother" whenever they don't get their way. And that's the part that people have grown tired of. Ferrari has always had a sweetheart deal with F1 - so they should make the best of whatever advantage that gives them. The pressure Luca is feeling probably results more from them not being able to build a winning car lately than anything F1 or the FIA has done. If Ferrari was winning, would Montezemolo be barking now? I don't believe so. My advice to him: fix what is broken in your own garage and let the FIA take care of the rules in F1.

[ioan]

The actual bunch of red muppets would not be a loss, au contraire.

[TheFamousEccles]

Seriously, it was only the other day I was remarking to a Mate that we hadn't heard Luca's familiar "our rules or bat+ball=home" empty threats for a while.

While I agree with some points (as do others here - we seem a reasonable lot), this now familiar Ferarri bleat is tiresome.

Go on Luca, I dare you, in fact I double dare you!

(There now, when he reads this he will be seriously questioning his manhood, by crikey!)

[BDunnell]

The actual bunch of red muppets would not be a loss, au contraire.

I am convinced that, in the space of three years, the person who really was ioan has been killed and an imposter has taken his place. Either that or we have witnessed here the results of the world's first successful mind transplant.

[airshifter]

Ferrari are really keeping it up with this moaning and crying.

Let them go, F1 will get along just fine without them. If they need F1 for street car development, they are only going to screw themselves. (Not that I think for a second they need F1 for street car development!)

[kfzmeister]

I agree that he has some legitimate concerns. But Ferrari has a history of threatening to "go home to mother" whenever they don't get their way. And that's the part that people have grown tired of. Ferrari has always had a sweetheart deal with F1 - so they should make the best of whatever advantage that gives them. The pressure Luca is feeling probably results more from them not being able to build a winning car lately than anything F1 or the FIA has done. If Ferrari was winning, would Montezemolo be barking now? I don't believe so. My advice to him: fix what is broken in your own garage and let the FIA take care of the rules in F1.

The spin-doctors are at work again. His comments were not meant to deliver an ultimatum. The words "leave" or "ultimatum" were never used during his speech.
It is an opportunity to voice some concerns with the concorde agreement coming up. Most teams are on the same page with Luca.

[CNR]

a bit like

At the weekend, Nico Rosberg said suggestions he could switch from Mercedes to be Fernando Alonso’s 2012 teammate, and that he recently visited Maranello, were “nonsense”.

[Jag_Warrior]

The spin-doctors are at work again. His comments were not meant to deliver an ultimatum. The words "leave" or "ultimatum" were never used during his speech.
It is an opportunity to voice some concerns with the concorde agreement coming up. Most teams are on the same page with Luca.

Spin doctors? Are these not his words?


If Formula 1 still wants Ferrari, [then] it must change and go back to being at the cutting edge of research, while always keeping an eye on costs. We are not in Formula 1 as sponsors, we are constructors.

Many moons ago (back when dinosaurs roamed the earth), I took Basic computing. And one of the first things we learned was conditional statement construction... you know: if/then.

I'm not trying to paint the guy into a corner. But the only spin would be to suggest that he didn't say what he clearly said, or (even more interesting) that what he said wasn't what he meant. Luca is dipping his toe into Italian politics, so the latter is very possible, I suppose.

[F1boat]

I think that the current rules are anti-Ferrari, because they can't use their budget and they can't test, so I can see why he is unhappy. I disagree with his idea of three cars, however. About leaving, once F1 becomes too restricted to the image which Ferrari is chasing they will IMO begin a sportscar effort and may re-brand the F1 team as FIAT or something... won't be cool. Some balance must be found... IMO the rules are made to be good for the new teams and I don't think that this is right...

[DexDexter]

I think that the current rules are anti-Ferrari, because they can't use their budget and they can't test, so I can see why he is unhappy. I disagree with his idea of three cars, however. About leaving, once F1 becomes too restricted to the image which Ferrari is chasing they will IMO begin a sportscar effort and may re-brand the F1 team as FIAT or something... won't be cool. Some balance must be found... IMO the rules are made to be good for the new teams and I don't think that this is right...

I disagree, it's not about budgets etc., It's about Montezemolo & co dismantling the great organisation put in place by Jean Todt, Ross Brawn and co. The weird thing is nobody is blaming the drivers like in 2009 despite the fact that the situation is the same as then. Why isn't Alonso criticized for not winning?

[The Black Knight]

I think that the current rules are anti-Ferrari, because they can't use their budget and they can't test, so I can see why he is unhappy. I disagree with his idea of three cars, however. About leaving, once F1 becomes too restricted to the image which Ferrari is chasing they will IMO begin a sportscar effort and may re-brand the F1 team as FIAT or something... won't be cool. Some balance must be found... IMO the rules are made to be good for the new teams and I don't think that this is right...

The rules are the rules and are the same for everyone. If Ferrari can't produce a winning car on their massive budget then that is because they simply aren't good enough. Ferrari's biggest issue is that they have been spoiled for years and now because some of their liberties have been taken away, and rightly so, they aren't happy about it. Ferrari have the knowledge and technical ability to beat anyone. The most experienced and successful of any team on the grid. They of all teams should be able to adapt to the rules but they can't because they were too used to throwing money at a car and trying out a million solutions to find the best one, opposed to doing what smaller teams had to do all along which is survive on a limited budget whilst being extremely innovative. The limited testing is hurting them now because they don't know how to work within any limitations.

I agree to a return to in season testing but while the rules are the same for everyone, then with Ferrari's experience and history, if they can't adapt to the rules then they don't deserve to be at the top and they certainly don't have anything to complain about.

[Knock-on]

I think that the current rules are anti-Ferrari,

Ferrari are p*ssed that the rules are equal for a change. After decades of favouring Ferrari, the playing field is level.

Perhaps Luca is trying to get their advantage back ;)

[ShiftingGears]

What's the point of testing on a circuit that was just competed on?

For the same reason why F1 teams test on circuits that F1 never races at.

[Garry Walker]

I disagree, it's not about budgets etc., It's about Montezemolo & co dismantling the great organisation put in place by Jean Todt, Ross Brawn and co. The weird thing is nobody is blaming the drivers like in 2009 despite the fact that the situation is the same as then. Why isn't Alonso criticized for not winning?

Because he is the magic alonso, he develops the car and the team. He is super. StupidKimi couldnt develope the car, but SuperAlonso will make the car at once the fastest on the grid like he did in 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011...wait...


As for Ferrari and luca, the faster they leave F1 the better.

[ioan]

I disagree, it's not about budgets etc., It's about Montezemolo & co dismantling the great organisation put in place by Jean Todt, Ross Brawn and co. The weird thing is nobody is blaming the drivers like in 2009 despite the fact that the situation is the same as then. Why isn't Alonso criticized for not winning?

:up: Cheers to that!
Ferrari has become an organization built around the arrogance and ego of one person, and no I am not talking about Alonso.

[i_max2k2]

Both of the points above, letting Schumacher go, and then Kimi before his contract for Alonso.