Disreputable?

[Tixy54]

Is Jason Plato's continual Whinging wearing everybody down? Is it bringing the British Touring Car Championship into disrepute?

My opinion? I think he has lost all credibility as far as the BTCC is concerned. I will be one of the first to say, I think that he is a very talented driver, however, moan, moan, moan to the public via visual media and it becomes like wallpaper, too much of it and you don't notice how nice the pattern is.

Perhaps it's time to stop racing and continue his carrer in TV (not Transvestite).

:(

[F1boat]

It was so awful, that I was thinking isn't it staged, kind of like in wrestling, with JP taking the mantle of villain. Scary outburst.

[rwdvectra]

I think we should all fund a ngtc for plato next season just to shut him up!!

[Mark]

It's creating interest isn't it :p

[MrJan]

Perhaps it's time to stop racing and continue his carrer in TV (not Transvestite).

:(

WTF? Why? What decent reason have you got for him to stop racing? Drivers that speak out are good for the sport, better than drones that just spout the corporate nonsense and bore us all to death.

I didn't see much of the racing this weekend (only caught the 3rd race due to being hungover and dying) but again the turbos had a clear advantage. If someone promised me that my car would be equal (which is effectively what TOCA said) and then it wasn't, I'd be bloody annoyed and make some noise about it.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

The way Matt Neal drove past Plato in race 2 was ridiculous.

[F1boat]

It's creating interest isn't it :p

Sure :D

[Shirl]

Instead of continually moaning about it, why doesn't he just get himself a nice little turbo and get on with it!!

[Allyc85]

Instead of continually moaning about it, why doesn't he just get himself a nice little turbo and get on with it!!

Do you seriously think its that easy?

Theres no way Chevvy are going to use the TOCA engine and im pretty sure they have been busy developing the 1.6T engine for them to dominate the WTCC ;)

[inimitablestoo]

Is it bringing the British Touring Car Championship into disrepute?
Exactly the phrase that sprang to mind when watching yesterday. Well, that and "Is he on drugs?" after the rather disorientated way he answered Louise's questions.

Does anyone remember when the BTCC used to be about motor racing?

[Eurotech]

To be fair to him, Matt Neal just drove past him in a straight line twice in that race, When have we ever seen that in Touring Cars before? (barring LPG Focuses) It does become a bit of a joke when you have one of the best drivers (Matt Neal) not needing to put any effort into to passing people anymore cos he can just drive straight past like they're on a motorway. That is was brings the BTCC into disrepute, not Jason's outburst. I admit it was badly timed for him but its good to see someone that cares so much about the sport he's involved in.

And I'm fed up with Matt Neal now constantly saying "The Chevys are gonna be hard to beat here". No they aren't, you have the fastest car on the grid by far, stop boy cow pooing and start concentrating on your driving mate.

[Kjr]

To be fair to him, Matt Neal just drove past him in a straight line twice in that race, When have we ever seen that in Touring Cars before? (barring LPG Focuses) It does become a bit of a joke when you have one of the best drivers (Matt Neal) not needing to put any effort into to passing people anymore cos he can just drive straight past like they're on a motorway.

Some people have a short memory. How about Plato in the TDi Leons around 4 years ago? Plato had the luxury of breezing past other cars at will back then. Pulling away on the straights was the norm and nobody could pass them in a straight line.

Plato, just stop embarrassing yourself and the sport, keep your mouth shut and just get on with racing.

[Alfa Fan]

Some data for everyone:

2008

Round 1 Brands Hatch Indy

Qualifying (ave of top 2 cars)

SEAT Turbo 102.8 / 126.2
Vauxhall NA 100.9 / 123.4
BMW NA 101.4 / 124.8
Honda NA 100.4 / 123.4

Round 3 Donington Park

Qualifying (ave top 2 cars)

SEAT Turbo 125.5 / 91.9
Vauxhall NA 124.4 / 91.0
BMW NA 124.8 / 89.4
Honda NA 123.8 / 90.4

Round 6 Snetterton

Qualifying (ave top 2 cars)

SEAT Turbo 140.8 / 115.5
Vauxhall NA 139.0 / 112.3
BMW NA 136.9 / 113.4
Honda NA 137.7 / 113.3

2010 (LPG year)

Round 1 Thruxton

Qualifying (ave top 2 cars)

Chevy NA 125.8 / 98.0
Ford LPG 124.7 / 100.0
Honda NA 124.0 / 97.6
Vauxhall NA 124.2 / 96.2

Round 6 Snetterton

Race 1 (ave top 2 cars)

Chevy NA 136.4 / 114.0
Ford LPG 141.9 / 119.0
Honda NA 135.7 / 112.8
Vauxhall NA 137.4 / 114.1

Round 10 Brands Indy

Qualifying (ave top 2 cars)

Chevy NA 98.7 / 122.4
Ford LPG 100.9 / 124.6
Honda NA 99.6 / 121.0
Vauxhall NA 99.0 / 121.8

And finally:

2011

Round 1 Brands Hatch Indy

Qualifying

Honda T 107.4 / 129.8
Ford T 105.8 / 128.9
Vauxhall T 104.1 / 127.3
Chevy NA 102.2 / 123.9
BMW NA 101.5 / 125.0

Round 2 Donington Park

Qualifying

Honda T 135.0 / 128.7 / 111.1
Ford T 135.0 / 128.6 / 111.3
Vauxhall T 131.6 / 128.4 / 110.4
Chevy NA 129.2 / 123.7 / 106.3
BMW NA 130.0 / 124.3 / 105.3

Round 3 Thruxton

Qualifying

Honda T 132.9 / 103.9
Ford T 134.3 / 103.8
Vauxhall T 133.2 / 102.3
Chevy NA 129.4 / 101.2
BMW NA 128.5 / 100.8

Round 4 Oulton Park

Qualifying

Honda T 120.0 / 104.9 / 112.3
Ford T 121.7 / 107.3 / 113.3
Vauxhall T 119.4 / 105.0 / 110.8
Chevy NA 118.5 / 103.8 / 109.4
BMW NA 118.1 / 103.2 / 110.1

[Eurotech]

Some people have a short memory. How about Plato in the TDi Leons around 4 years ago? Plato had the luxury of breezing past other cars at will back then. Pulling away on the straights was the norm and nobody could pass them in a straight line.

Plato, just stop embarrassing yourself and the sport, keep your mouth shut and just get on with racing.

Plato never drove past anyone in a straight line in a TDI, it just allowed him to defend his position better and more importantly (How many times do we have to say this before it sinks into your heads???) TOCA never promised parity between the Diesel and Petrol cars like they did between the S2000 and NGTC cars.

[F1boat]

Eurotech, from the latest interview with Plato, I think that he sees the parity as having a car as fast as Neal's "Civic", which in my opinion is not right and can't be right. In the last race, Chevrolet were already as quick or better than the Vauxhalls and the Fords. Any further penalties for the turbo cars will be very unfair, as BMW is also catching. And if you single Honda, this is simply wrong. They built the best car and deserve to explore this advantage.

[inimitablestoo]

Fine, but in the same programme we heard from Willem Toet - a man who does some racing himself, albeit in hillclimbing, so knows a thing or two about the mechanics of competition driving - who was far more eloquent on the problems faced by the non-turbo teams. There are ways and means of doing this, and if I were Alan Gow I'd be tempted to give the turbos an extra performance break after Plato's hissy fit.

For all their supposed advantage, the Hondas didn't seem to be able to do anything about a Ford Focus and a Vauxhall Vectra that are no longer being made in that third race - the only dry one of the day, so the only one we can really use to prove anything. At least they weren't clumsily driving into BMWs like a novice anyway.

Bottom line: yes, TOCA promised equality. But why were RML stupid enough to believe it could be achieved?

[Dave B]

Eurotech, from the latest interview with Plato, I think that he sees the parity as having a car as fast as Neal's "Civic", which in my opinion is not right and can't be right. In the last race, Chevrolet were already as quick or better than the Vauxhalls and the Fords. Any further penalties for the turbo cars will be very unfair, as BMW is also catching. And if you single Honda, this is simply wrong. They built the best car and deserve to explore this advantage.

And this is the problem with equivalency formulae: Honda might simply be doing a fantastic job on merit, they might have a good but not spectacular car which is being handed an advantage. We simply can never know.

There should only be two options - everybody runs the same spec equipment and we have a fair fight; or different equipment is allowed but competes in a seperate class. To promise or expect parity is never going to work.

[F1boat]

Dave, I agree with you, but to see Honda dominating the Fords utterly, it most likely means that their car is outstanding. For me, TOCA should say to Plato - shut up. Like the FIA said to RBR and Ferrari in F1 two years ago - I mean the DDD scandal.

[Eurotech]

Eurotech, from the latest interview with Plato, I think that he sees the parity as having a car as fast as Neal's "Civic", which in my opinion is not right and can't be right. In the last race, Chevrolet were already as quick or better than the Vauxhalls and the Fords. Any further penalties for the turbo cars will be very unfair, as BMW is also catching. And if you single Honda, this is simply wrong. They built the best car and deserve to explore this advantage.

Actually TOCA said that the fastest Turbo car would be just as fast as the fastest N/A car... This means TOCA said themselves that they would make sure that the fastest turbo (Honda) would be no quicker than the fastest S2000 (Chevrolet). This hasn't happened. When it comes to the point that the Hondas don't need to make any effort to get a good exit from the corner because they know they can breeze past everything in front kind of dulls the racing down. That is, until they decide to take eachother out.

[F1boat]

In that case, TOCA has said an incredibly stupid thing. What if the Honda is simply a better car than the Cruze? They are gonna penalize it for that? Ridiculous.
I personally hope for no more changes in the rules. Seeing the performance of Nash for example, the turbos were harmed more than enough. Besides, Oulton Park was a wet weekend...

[Wasted Talent]

The way Matt Neal drove past Plato in race 2 was ridiculous.

x2

WT

[Wasted Talent]

Disagreed with Jason Plato is the past and no doubt will again in future, but on this topic he is 100% right. As he says in a seperate topic IF there hadn't been a promise of equality he wouldn't have a gripe, but there was....FACT.

To see the Honda just pull alongside and past out of the hairpin was like watching the days when production cars had a class within the BTCC.

WT

[Allyc85]

I see in MN that Mr Plato maybe facing a charge of bringing the BTCC into disrepute with his live TV rant, whihc could land him with a fine or a points penalty.

[F1boat]

A reprimand will be fine, but please no points penalties... it's so artificial.

[RMLCruzeing82]

The way Matt Neal drove past Plato in race 2 was ridiculous.

yes it was. if TOCA cant see that then there blind

[RMLCruzeing82]

I see in MN that Mr Plato maybe facing a charge of bringing the BTCC into disrepute with his live TV rant, whihc could land him with a fine or a points penalty.

if he gets any penalty for speaking out, i can seriously see Plato walking away from the BTCC at the end of this season

[Captain VXR]

Freedom of speech is essential - if drivers have concerns they should be able to air them

[tisme]

The way Matt Neal drove past Plato in race 2 was ridiculous.

Nope! Seen it done many times before in the BTCC..

[Kjr]

yes it was. if TOCA cant see that then there blind

I refer you to lap 5 of race 1. Matt Neal on wets vs Plato on wets. Plato accelerated out of the hairpin and stayed with Matt Neal all the way UP the hill then passed him easily into the braking area. It's swings and roundabouts eh, Plato faster in race 1, but not in race 2. Perhaps TOCA can watch lap 5 of race 1 and then observe Plato pull away from Neal for the rest of the race...

[Andrew Webster]

To be fair to him, Matt Neal just drove past him in a straight line twice in that race, When have we ever seen that in Touring Cars before? (barring LPG Focuses) It does become a bit of a joke when you have one of the best drivers (Matt Neal) not needing to put any effort into to passing people anymore cos he can just drive straight past like they're on a motorway. That is was brings the BTCC into disrepute, not Jason's outburst. I admit it was badly timed for him but its good to see someone that cares so much about the sport he's involved in.

And I'm fed up with Matt Neal now constantly saying "The Chevys are gonna be hard to beat here". No they aren't, you have the fastest car on the grid by far, stop boy cow pooing and start concentrating on your driving mate.

??

You have never seen overtaking before? And "like they're on a motorway" come on!

Why is it that its only Plato that has a problem with being overtaken? Neil didnt "drive round" it was fairly obvious that the whole thing was engineered by Plato to look worse than it was and it looked to me like he backed off slightly. Since datalogs aren't made public we will never know.

[AndySpeed]

Andrew Webster - when you comment on something other than Jason Plato I may take you seriously. Until then you appear to have joined just to partake in some Plato bashing.

[Andrew Webster]

Andrew Webster - when you comment on something other than Jason Plato I may take you seriously. Until then you appear to have joined just to partake in some Plato bashing.

Not at all, just offering an opinion :) I just think that the situation is being manipulated to Platos gain and fear for the other teams that are currently slower than him.

The weather is rather miserable today...

[RMLCruzeing82]

I refer you to lap 5 of race 1. Matt Neal on wets vs Plato on wets. Plato accelerated out of the hairpin and stayed with Matt Neal all the way UP the hill then passed him easily into the braking area. It's swings and roundabouts eh, Plato faster in race 1, but not in race 2. Perhaps TOCA can watch lap 5 of race 1 and then observe Plato pull away from Neal for the rest of the race...

you will find MN was on full wets and JP was on slicks on the front and wets on the back. the track then started to dry out making it harder for Neal. Thats why JP kept up with MN and then past him and so did 5 or 6 other drivers not just JP

[inimitablestoo]

If we do get a repeat performance from Jason this weekend at Croft, can everyone behind him please indulge in a spot of Vic 'n' Bob-style handbags? (Not the best clip, but sort of the idea: ) YouTube - ‪handbags‬‏ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-PIckHrZ0o)

[Andrew Webster]

Now this made me laugh a tthe bottom of the page:

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[BDunnell]

Bottom line: yes, TOCA promised equality. But why were RML stupid enough to believe it could be achieved?

Again, why just single out RML? The same could be said for WSR. And even then it's not a question of them being stupid enough to believe in the possibility of parity. It was promised; it should happen. I don't like it, but that's what was promised.

[F1boat]

Now this made me laugh a tthe bottom of the page:

"Visitors found this page by searching for: jason plato rant, jason plato, plato moan, whats jason plato moaning about, jason plato rants after win, Jason Plato bringing BTCC into disrepute, jason plato whinging, jason platos outburst, jason plato moan, moaning jason plato, Plato outburst BTCC, JASON PLATO MOANING ABOUT TOURING CARS, plato outburst"

I may quit watching now. This is not a sport. Just a one-man show.

[inimitablestoo]

Again, why just single out RML? The same could be said for WSR.
Fair point, but one team (and driver) are being far more vocal about it than the others.

[BDunnell]

Fair point, but one team (and driver) are being far more vocal about it than the others.

Doesn't alter the situation, though — and shouldn't have the slightest bearing on what's done about it.

[inimitablestoo]

In theory, no. Seems to be working though...

I guess my main problem with this is that Jason's complaints, although they have some validity certainly, are pretty much identical to the complaints he made last year - when, on the basis of the rules (and no such pre-season promises from TOCA) they had no such issues.

Subliminal bit for Alan Gow: Veeeee. Eeeeighhhttt. You know it makes sense ;)

[Tixy54]

Originally posted by RMLCruzing;

"if he gets any penalty for speaking out, i can seriously see Plato walking away from the BTCC at the end of this season"

Maybe we have come to that time. Look back to the days of John Cleland, Steve Soper etc. They've retired and the sport (and the moaning) goes on.