Donington

[Alfa Fan]

Dunno if anyone else here went today? First time I've been since it reopened. What a dump it is now :( Completely wrecked the viewing at the Old Hairpin, everything just looks a mess. Is it really going to be like that for the WTCC in just a couple of months?!

[BDunnell]

Well, we know who to blame, don't we?

[christophulus]

Have only been once about five years ago, and the spectator areas weren't much to write home about then. Glad to see it back in one piece though after those ham-fisted idiots had a go at turning it into an F1 track.

I'm surprised MSV haven't had a go at buying the track, they've done a good job at Oulton Park (and I assume their other tracks).

[Mark]

Same here. Last time I was there was for the Race of Champions event which was, I think, 2004? It was a bit of a dump then.

[Alfa Fan]

If you thought it was bad in 04 you should see it now! Donington going to MSV would be great. Oulton is great and i've heard nothing but praise for their work at their other circuits.

[Allyc85]

I wouldnt even begin to criticise after all of whats gone on over the last couple years, Id just be happy that the circuit is still here! They had to spend quite a bit fixing the actual track and then more on safety improvements so that they could hold the WSB and WTCC :)

[Alfa Fan]

Why? Why as paying (£30 today) customers should we not expect better? Still having the area by the Old Hairpin as a patch of mud instead of grass in inexcusable. As is the lack of infield parking now.

[BDunnell]

Why? Why as paying (£30 today) customers should we not expect better?

I agree. There is only so long that the excuse of the need to right the destruction wrought by the Gillett era will be valid.

[christophulus]

Why? Why as paying (£30 today) customers should we not expect better? Still having the area by the Old Hairpin as a patch of mud instead of grass in inexcusable. As is the lack of infield parking now.

I see what you mean, but it looked on course to completely shut down last year. It looks poor now but give it a year or two and see. The amount they've had to spend on just getting the track back open has probably emptied the bank.

Now they've got some big name events back at the track it should only improve from here?

[MrJan]

I'd imagine that they simply can't afford to do anything about the grass. You can either pay £30 for crap facilities or you can sit at home for free, while the racing goes on at some other track.

[BDunnell]

I see what you mean, but it looked on course to completely shut down last year. It looks poor now but give it a year or two and see. The amount they've had to spend on just getting the track back open has probably emptied the bank.

Now they've got some big name events back at the track it should only improve from here?

One would hope so. Shame the museum is doing so badly at present, too, with very low visitor numbers indeed.

[Allyc85]

Why? Why as paying (£30 today) customers should we not expect better? Still having the area by the Old Hairpin as a patch of mud instead of grass in inexcusable. As is the lack of infield parking now.

Well im sure they will be out picking the money tree in the morning ;)

[BDunnell]

I'd imagine that they simply can't afford to do anything about the grass. You can either pay £30 for crap facilities or you can sit at home for free, while the racing goes on at some other track.

In which case, surely the only alternative is for MSV, who have proved their abilities elsewhere, to step in.

[Alfa Fan]

Well im sure they will be out picking the money tree in the morning ;)

Crap facilities are only going to turn people away. I very much doubt I'll go back until its sorted out. Seriously, the amount of money needed to sort it out really is minimal, less than the ticket revenue today most likely.

A serious point though, there are a number of other circuits who'd like a BTCC date, and some who'd like to get a second meeting a season, Rockingham isn't a million miles away and the facilities there blow Donny away.

[MrJan]

Crap facilities are only going to turn people away. I very much doubt I'll go back until its sorted out. Seriously, the amount of money needed to sort it out really is minimal, less than the ticket revenue today most likely.

I doubt it's anywhere near as minimal as you think, and that £30 per person doesn't all go straight to the coffers, there will be a huge amount of overheads that need to be covered.

And the BTCC shouldn't all be about the facilities of the circuit, that's how we've got crap tracks like Bahrain in the F1 season and lose places like Spa (at least we did a while back). I'd far rather have a track like Donnington with a bit of mud than to face 2 trips a year to Rockingham, the epitome of a circuit without character.

Maybe the solution is for MSV to step in...but maybe they don't want to?

[BDunnell]

Maybe the solution is for MSV to step in...but maybe they don't want to?

Or maybe their advances have been resisted. (I don't know, by the way — just a thought.)

[Darlo]

Progress from last year was phenomenal! Given that less than a year ago we didn't even know whether the circuit was going to reopen I think how it was today is commendable.

The spectator banks have been reformed - albeit without the grass having had chance to grow back yet, but being able to be back on the inside of the Craner Curves again was a bonus.

In my opinion, the biggest thing that lets Donington Park down compared to the other tracks is the parking. Year on year,we pull into the car park to be waved on by hoards of halfwits in Hi Viz, making no difference whatsoever, and come home time they are nowhere to be seen and traffic chaos ensues!

All in all though - a very enjoyable day (even if Mr P had a bit of a mare - recovering well in Race 3)

[Iain]

MSV would do a very good job there. I'm no fan of Brands Hatch, but they've transformed it into a very pleasant place to visit. It's all about basic presentation. Lots of bins, more toilets, new signs, fresh paint.

Maybe the hi-vis jobsworths have pinched enough car stereos for the day and have disappeared home happy. Allegedly. We all know about Donington's notorious theft problem.... ;)

[BDunnell]

MSV would do a very good job there. I'm no fan of Brands Hatch, but they've transformed it into a very pleasant place to visit. It's all about basic presentation. Lots of bins, more toilets, new signs, fresh paint.

And that, in large part, is seemingly down to Jonathan Palmer's own attention to detail.

[Eurotech]

Donington has improved greatly from last season when the only place you could spectate from were the start/finish straight and redgate, it was nice to see some of it back again. It'll be sorted as soon as it can be I'm sure.

[MrJan]

Or maybe their advances have been resisted. (I don't know, by the way — just a thought.)

I did consider that option...but it didn't really help my argument :D :p :

[wedge]

Yes, Donny is a dump: the toilets are a stinking cesspit, it could do with some proper grandstands, car parks turn into a quagmire in the rain, parts of the infield gets flooded. But then that's the charm of going to the races, indeed any outdoor event like music festivals.

[BDunnell]

Yes, Donny is a dump: the toilets are a stinking cesspit, it could do with some proper grandstands, car parks turn into a quagmire in the rain, parts of the infield gets flooded. But then that's the charm of going to the races, indeed any outdoor event like music festivals.

I'm not sure that's good enough any more at a motor race. Why should us spectators tolerate a 'dump' with toilets that are 'stinking cesspits' in the 21st century?

[wedge]

I'm not sure that's good enough any more at a motor race. Why should us spectators tolerate a 'dump' with toilets that are 'stinking cesspits' in the 21st century?

I'm not saying it should be tolerated.

What I meant was that visiting race circuits they have its own charm and character. My nearest tracks are Rockingham and Silverstone and they're a sea of grandstands. Donny harks back to much simpler times.

[MrJan]

I'm not sure that's good enough any more at a motor race. Why should us spectators tolerate a 'dump' with toilets that are 'stinking cesspits' in the 21st century?

This is a picture of the away end at Exeter City:
http://www.freewebs.com/tims92/Exeter%20City/St%20James%20Park%2012.jpg

As you can see it's crap. I'm told (although thankfully haven't had to experience) that the toilets are really bad, one Luton fan commented "if you're not going to clean the urinals could you at least get a gardener in to remove the ivy growing on them. Never seen plant life sustained entirely on away fan piss before".

Despite this we seem to get a lot of positive comments from visiting fans who log onto the club forum, the Luton fan above also said this: " I don't know if any of you have ever been to the Ricoh Arena, Coventry but it is a depressing, soulless bowl miles from anywhere with seating miles from the pitch. St James Park on the other hand has charm and atmosphere and I felt I could almost reach out and touch the players."

That's not an uncommon opinion, it seems that many do actually like to see places that are a bit run down and have 'character' rather than large, uninviting new developments. I know that football stadiums is slightly different to race tracks but my point is that, if everything were a Tilke-drone-o-drome the world would be a poorer place. Some of my best racing memories have been in the run down places, like sat on a stack of wooden pallets on the inside of Tertre Rouge, or resting on the wooden fences at Castle Combe.

By all means spruce it up a bit, but sometimes we want a bit of a run down dump to enjoy.

[Alfa Fan]

How you think a football match which is attended by a couple of thousand for 2 hours on a Saturday afternoon is comparable I don't know??

[BDunnell]

I'm not saying it should be tolerated.

What I meant was that visiting race circuits they have its own charm and character. My nearest tracks are Rockingham and Silverstone and they're a sea of grandstands. Donny harks back to much simpler times.

Do we think that circuits were dumps 40 years ago? There is a difference between being a bit primitive, which, I completely agree, is often charming, and being a dump.

[MrJan]

How you think a football match which is attended by a couple of thousand for 2 hours on a Saturday afternoon is comparable I don't know??

Way to completely bypass the point of my post :up:

I wasn't comparing, just saying that occassionally people prefer to be somewhere with a degree of soul and history. I know that my visit to Le Mans in 2006 was far preferable to the fancier version I went to in 2010. Yes I had to walk through a pitch black tunnel (it was only the Classic so a bit more basic than the 24 Hours) and sit on pallets, but it was still nicer than the stark concrete version I returned to last year.

Besides which during a race day I doubt that I go to the toilet more than 2 or 3 times, the same can be said of an away game (usually on the way in and at half time when the pre-match pint catches up with me), so they actually are comparable.

Next you'll be complaining about the facilities on Epynt and how Port Talbot really need to sort it out and replace that angle iron on the lav door that's supposed to stop the sheep getting in... (that's irony, before you go off on one about how you only get about 50 people at Epynt)

Edit: BTW I haven't seen the new Donnington so I'm not actually commenting on it, merely saying that the rustic approach has some charm that quite a few people like to see.

[BDunnell]

Way to completely bypass the point of my post :up:

I wasn't comparing, just saying that occassionally people prefer to be somewhere with a degree of soul and history. I know that my visit to Le Mans in 2006 was far preferable to the fancier version I went to in 2010. Yes I had to walk through a pitch black tunnel (it was only the Classic so a bit more basic than the 24 Hours) and sit on pallets, but it was still nicer than the stark concrete version I returned to last year.

Besides which during a race day I doubt that I go to the toilet more than 2 or 3 times, the same can be said of an away game (usually on the way in and at half time when the pre-match pint catches up with me), so they actually are comparable.

Next you'll be complaining about the facilities on Epynt and how Port Talbot really need to sort it out and replace that angle iron on the lav door that's supposed to stop the sheep getting in... (that's irony, before you go off on one about how you only get about 50 people at Epynt)

Edit: BTW I haven't seen the new Donnington so I'm not actually commenting on it, merely saying that the rustic approach has some charm that quite a few people like to see.

Completely agree with all of that. But, even so, there is no need for such a venue to be a dump.

[AndySpeed]

Here's a thought - improve the facilities, get some higher net worth individuals or thereabouts to attend and you never know you might even get some bigger entrants and even more fans joining in. Easier said than done.

[Eurotech]

In fairness, the circuit has been through some rough times recently, I know it was never perfect at the best of times (anyone who camped there will agree) but it does definately have that great charm and atmosphere that you just don't get at Silverstone or Rockingham. Give it some time to recover from Gillett 'The worst a track can get' and I'm sure it'll eventually catch up. I'm still sad about the loss of the Dunlop Bridge, Craner Curves Spitfire and the Goddards Railway Coach (No idea what happened to that :L)

Tbh, one of my favourite circuits in the UK is actually Mallory Park cos it is so simple and has bags of character. I think we want Donington to become like maybe Oulton Park, still full of charm but brought slightly into the 21st century...

[Sarah]

Ah football terracing....takes me back to when i used to stand to watch football many, many years ago. I think that's just what a lot of this is though nostalgia. I care more about whether the toilets are clean, is there somewhere nice to sit and have a cup of tea that sort of thing.

[wedge]

Do we think that circuits were dumps 40 years ago? There is a difference between being a bit primitive, which, I completely agree, is often charming, and being a dump.

40 years ago there was no Dorna, FOA, Bernie Ecclestone/Herman Tilke and the 'build it and they will come' Tilkedromes.

[Wasted Talent]

In fairness, the circuit has been through some rough times recently, I know it was never perfect at the best of times (anyone who camped there will agree) but it does definately have that great charm and atmosphere that you just don't get at Silverstone or Rockingham. Give it some time to recover from Gillett 'The worst a track can get' and I'm sure it'll eventually catch up. I'm still sad about the loss of the Dunlop Bridge, Craner Curves Spitfire and the Goddards Railway Coach (No idea what happened to that :L)

Tbh, one of my favourite circuits in the UK is actually Mallory Park cos it is so simple and has bags of character. I think we want Donington to become like maybe Oulton Park, still full of charm but brought slightly into the 21st century...

Well if things go to plan I'll be attending the British circuit with the most character and charm on Monday........Cadwell Park....

WT

[Allyc85]

Well if things go to plan I'll be attending the British circuit with the most character and charm on Monday........Cadwell Park....

WT

Ah if only that place wasnt so far away :( Every year I watch the BSB bikes launching over the mountain wishing I was there.

[Wasted Talent]

Ah if only that place wasnt so far away :( Every year I watch the BSB bikes launching over the mountain wishing I was there.

True, but everywhere is a long way from East Devon!

It has to be worth at least one visit. It's the Historic Sports Car Club meeting this weekend which just adds to the nostalgic feel

WT