Suggestions for the future for RBR MF Cup [Archive]

lcd

15th February 2011, 10:33

Listen crew:
Why not continuing the RBR MF Cup via RSRBR11 Career calendar?

The career calendar has an average of 4-5 rallies (short or longer) per week, covering almost all surfaces/lengths and It Is offline too, meaning everyone can do It whenever he can.We can vote which rally to do, and send saved results for each stage/overall to the organiser In this forum, In order to make the RBR MF Cup leaderboard seperately.

e.g. After a rally with 200 entries Is finished, we will make our own leaderboard showing only the Motorsport Forums drivers results.

That way the competition will be tighter and far more Interesting,
since after each stage Is complete you can see many more people's results. In addition, we will all here, keep on racing together.
Of course, we must everybody use RSRBR11 and get registered In Rallyesim site.

In other words, we will keep this forum as the base of the Series, and just use the RSRBR11 to do the rallies.

How do yo feel about It?
I'm willing to contibute In organising this In any way.

Bruce D

15th February 2011, 10:58

Well if people want to go this way they must let us know. I'm probably going to be out of competing now anyway. Personally I'm tired of having to do such massive downloads all the time just to run in the series. I think that is why it's dying here, because we run to the RSRBR system. I think we'll see Tannat's version growing but this version most people seem to be focused on online stuff now.

tannat

15th February 2011, 12:14

Your idea is fine with me, LCD.

Bruce-I feel your pain on the downloads. Keepins a static system would be nice...

I plan to continue the mod free as long as people participate..

MrMetro

15th February 2011, 14:40

How about using the Czech Plugin, I know its online, but I think I'm correct in saying that users can do their time anytime between the start and finish of a rally. It might attract more people, because they won't have to download massive updates and re-install everything.

Bruce D

15th February 2011, 15:35

Given that I have experience with this I would second this idea because I know it works well. But I think LCD is trying to say that RSRBR has the same offline feature, but it does have all the downloads.

tannat

15th February 2011, 15:56

You know- we don't HAVE to redownload everything.....

If we wish to stop the updates at a certain release-we could cut it there..

lcd

15th February 2011, 16:06

You know- we don't HAVE to redownload everything.....
If we wish to stop the updates at a certain release-we could cut it there..

Exactly! And we could always pick one of the rallies It doesn't Include latest BTB stages (or other updates),
so everyone can participate. There will always still be many cars or tracks to choose from. ;)

So, what do you think? It's more up to Bruce, If the MF Cup will go under this format or not.
And I think It would be wiser, this one to be the only one related to RBR around here ( No mods free or any other similar to RBR events)
So all entries gather under one Series.

tannat

15th February 2011, 16:18

And I think It would be wiser, this one to be the only one related to RBR around here ( No mods free or any other similar to RBR events)
So all entries gather under one Series.

The things is, LCD, is this turns our back on people like Neil J and Iron Rooster who don't have RSRBR (?) downloaded.

I don't think Mod free detracts from 'the other' championship.

Do you feel differently?

lcd

15th February 2011, 16:21

Here's an example:
Take a look at this week's available rallies:

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/226/image1yl.th.jpg (http://img835.imageshack.us/i/image1yl.jpg/)

We vote which rally to do but first, we check the roadbooks to make sure there no latest btb stages or stuff some may not have.

http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/973/image2obs.th.jpg (http://img375.imageshack.us/i/image2obs.jpg/)

We all have a whole week to do the rally! Save results via RSCenter and mail the files to the organiser here! Simple!

lcd

15th February 2011, 16:28

...I think that is why it's dying here, because we run to the RSRBR system.

Sorry but believe the opposite Bruce. The offline format Is dying. If we could compare the offline (play whenever available)
with the online nature of RSRBR (seeing many people's results on every single stage) that would be Ideal.
Ofcourse, that's my opinion-I may talk rubbish... :D

lcd

15th February 2011, 16:43

...I don't think Mod free detracts from 'the other' championship.

My suggestion requires a mass approval around here. Otherwise, we should leave things as they are.
So, no personal problem at all with Mod Free or MF Cup.

Personally, I'm Into RSRBR11 championships and I'm having a great time actually.
I love after each stage when I see the times of hundrends of drivers all over the world.
Plus I am 100% sure no one Is restarting a stage or hides a retirement, In order to win.

Please note, all RSRBR11 races are offline (you do them whenever you want)
The only real online races are the public sessions ones, but we're not talking about them at all (due to time defferences).
So no pressure there at all!

MrMetro

15th February 2011, 16:50

You've got to admit though, it is a pain in the backside having to download massive updates every couple of months. I wouldn't mind this if you just downloaded it and installed automatically, but you have to uninstall the game, reinstall all the car packs and so on. I have no doubt that RSRBR is probably quite a good mod, but I just can't be bothered with having to mess about with it every couple of months.

Who knows, I might be talking rubbish :)

tannat

15th February 2011, 18:05

LCD-are you cool with your suggestion running at the same time as a mod free championship?

I never meant it to be a competitor to the MF cup, only to offer those an opportunity to compete who did not have RSRBR access.

Believe me, I am as loopy over RSRBR11 championships as yourself...

lcd

15th February 2011, 18:28

If RSRBR mod Is the problem, I guess either MF Cup or my suggested format, really have no hope...

Believe me, I am as loopy over RSRBR11 championships as yourself...

I know. I've seen your name a couple times on RSRBR leadeboards. ;)

MrMetro

15th February 2011, 18:44

When we find a solution we all agree on, we should do a big re-launch of some sorts :D

tannat

15th February 2011, 18:46

If RSRBR mod Is the problem, I guess either MF Cup or my suggested format, really have no hope...

Clearly there is acceptance of the RSRBR mod-you can look at past fields of the MF Cup and see that..

However, there are a few for whom it does not work or can not work.

For me, I hate to say 'No' to those people and follow the path of RSRBR mod only. Granted-we are talking about just a few people...

I can't see why the two could not co-exist. They are two audiences-one overlapping and one non overlapping.

tannat

15th February 2011, 18:47

I know. I've seen your name a couple times on RSRBR leadeboards. ;)

:D

Bruce D

16th February 2011, 05:44

I think it's difficult for some to understand how frustrating RSRBR is. Look at the problems PS29 has had getting it to work, so he's missing half the MF Cup events, but can do all the Mod Free events, when time allows. For me personally I just don't have the ability to download the mods all the time. If they did patch updates on the carsets as well as the main program it wouldn't be so bad. To run a championship that is dependent on logging into the main server system means everyone has to be bang up to date with their downloads all the time. Maybe that doesn't sound like an issue for you LCD, but for me that is virtually impossible, when you consider that I have to deal with cap limits and download speeds of only 50kb/s on a good day, Rallyesim downloads average 25kb/s.

Given that most of our competitors have gone the online route, this proposal would probably be the way to go anyway. To be honest I was thinking it was maybe time to stop running the MF Cup myself, as a number of things in my life have changed lately (one of which looks like a very reduced or no internet access at home in the near future) and I can't give the series enough focus, it's just something to get out of the way every month. This is also one of the reasons why I don't compete much anymore.

I do believe the 2 championships can exist very easily together and they almost seem to have their own competitors. Maybe it does make more sense to have one online and one offline series.

NeverKnow

17th February 2011, 17:28

I think we shouldn't change the format half way through the season. There's still 4 rallies to go and I think we should wait till it's over and then decided which route to take. Maybe make a small survey to find out what people would prefer and why some have just disappeared.

Honestly I don't think it was keeping up to date to RSRBR that has resulted poor competitors number. We don't run BTB stages so actually there isn't reason keeping RSRBR always up to date. People just seemed lost interest and just dissappeared. Maybe towards the spring competitors number will go up again.

Also I don't think that running two championships will conflict each other. They are not overlapping in the calendar. Also the mod free championship allows people who can only use original version of RBR or who uses ps2 version of the game to have a little competition and compare times to other drivers.

lcd

17th February 2011, 17:50

...why some have just disappeared.

Don't bash me for this, but just a thought: maybe some people disappeared because they thought some of us are not honest, meaning we probably played a stage again and again until we achieve a great time, while they were racing based on the 'No restarting Is allowed' rule.
What do you think of that possibility? If we think over of a tighter results system, maybe the series get a greater reliability.

tannat

17th February 2011, 17:55

What do you think of that possibility? If we think over of a tighter results system, maybe the series get a greater reliability.

How could this be policed, LCD?

The opportunity to protest has always been there, but never used to my knowledge...

I think people have fallen by the wayside because they have fallen by...

Perhaps we could follow up with a few to find out why...

lcd

17th February 2011, 17:58

...The opportunity to protest has always been there, but never used to my knowledge...

Maybe walking away was a way of protesting...Don't know.Just a thought.
There must be something though some find annoying.Can't believe that suddenly, some people just didn't show up again,
at least without an explaination...

lcd

17th February 2011, 18:46

...It would be best though, those who stopped following the series,
to post what exactly they didn't like, unless they walked away due personal life reasons.

tannat

17th February 2011, 19:23

...It would be best though, those who stopped following the series,
to post what exactly they didn't like, unless they walked away due personal life reasons.

I agree.

I think Paddy has had internet issues. Where is Francis? ctbr said he would come back-but I've not seen him.

And the rest?

Bruce D

17th February 2011, 19:43

Going even further back than this where is Hoofhearted? I mean, he just disappeared from the forums full stop. And I can think of quite a few who were around in the beginning who have just disappeared. To my knowledge Bennizw is the only one who said he wouldn't do it unless we ran the Czech plugin.

For me personally it was a combination of getting bored with doing the same old stages while the same people creamed me, having better things to do with me time as a result, and personal issues reducing the amount of time I actually had to do all that in.

Macd

17th February 2011, 23:30

I would suggest a restriction on cars would be the best way to move forward. Since we're all using WRC cars perhaps changing to S2000, Group N or even S1600 would level it out again. I would suggest sending PM's to everyone who has competed at least once in the past. Then starting a discussion on how to move forward at the end of the season.

lcd

18th February 2011, 07:14

Going even further back than this where is Hoofhearted? ...And I can think of quite a few who were around in the beginning who have just disappeared...

Just to mention a few: Fred05,RedRover,Francis ( last season's champion),Paul,Raybak,Steve,Paddy... Not saying to follow the whole calendar, but If they raced at least 3-4 events during a season, It would be great. But they didn't. Sure something didn't like about the whole thing.

...I would suggest a restriction on cars would be the best way to move forward. Since we're all using WRC cars perhaps changing to S2000, Group N or even S1600 would level it out again.

Agreed.Even the real WRC changed Its format. New novelties like Powerstage, WRC Academy class, car restrictions...Maybe we should also leave behind the classic format and find some new stuff to present.

...I would suggest sending PM's to everyone who has competed at least once in the past.

I used to do that, before each rally In season1.Sending everyone something like a newsletter-reminder. Finally, I think bringing back some eye-candy stuff, would probably attract some new entries of those who just visit the Simulation section of these forums.As already said, let's wait to season's finale, and have a conversation about a list of things we could do, to make next season more Interesting.As far as I know, this little community here Is unique: must be the only one, racing an offline series In the world! Let's keep It that way.

edit: As Bruce said, It's a matter of time to get bored the default stages, so RSRBR mod Is the only way out.

MrMetro

18th February 2011, 11:54

Bruce D

18th February 2011, 12:16

MrMetro

18th February 2011, 12:30

perhaps then we should try a 2-wheel drive formula?

MrMetro

18th February 2011, 12:48

or something like LCD mentioned, something like the 'power stage', in which the top 3 are given bonus points

tannat

18th February 2011, 15:26

I like the power stage idea...

For that reason we could score EVERY stage as a power stage...

tannat

18th February 2011, 15:57

just posted about our championships on two forums.

Maybe we will see some action..

MrMetro

18th February 2011, 16:08

just posted about our championships on two forums.

Maybe we will see some action..

Nice, hopefully, we'll get some more people...

If anyone is wondering why I don't actually compete, its because I'm having issues with my wheel, and I'm trying to find a gamepad that is of reasonable cost...

lcd

18th February 2011, 16:43

My early thoughts regarding the new format Is:

A 6 stages rally, Including at least 1-2 long stages, while the 6th will be the Power Stage.
All rallies open for S2000/Production cars. Some events could also be open for the WRC Academy Class (FWD cars) too.
There could be a main leadeboard of the series and 1 for each class ( S-WRC, P-WRC and the WRC Academy )
We could also have (3-4 times during season) some rallies dedicated to the GroupB era, with Its own leaderboard.
Also, we could have some special awards, after each rally e.g. an award for the driver won the most stages,
another one for the one finished last In most of the stages and things like that, so to make the series more 'rewarding'!

Even If someone can't participate In all rounds, he could have a choice to pick up the Groub B or the WRC Academy events.
Let's say there will be 6 rallies for S-WRC/P-WRC while 4 of them Include WRC Academy class and 4 the GroupB class.
Total: 10 rallies with plenty of all class-action!

edit: Let's also leave behind the stereotype rallies like Australia rally, Corsica rally, Acropolis rally e.t.c.
and find some new rallies from other countries like Holland,Itally,Croatia,Norway, or elsewhere and combine
stages/surfaces from all available countries of RSRBR. The series will get some educational characteristics too! ;)

MrMetro

18th February 2011, 16:59

My early thoughts regarding the new format Is:

A 6 stages rally, Including at least 1-2 long stages, while the 6th will be the Power Stage.
All rallies open for S2000/Production cars. Some events could also be open for the WRC Academy Class (FWD cars) too.
There could be a main leadeboard of the series and 1 for each class ( S-WRC, P-WRC and the WRC Academy )
We could also have (3-4 times during season) some rallies dedicated to the GroupB era, with Its own leaderboard.
Also, we could have some special awards, after each rally e.g. an award for the driver won the most stages,
another one for the one finished last In most of the stages and things like that, so to make the series more 'rewarding'!

Even If someone can't participate In all rounds, he could have a choice to pick up the Groub B or the WRC Academy events.
Let's say there will be 6 rallies for S-WRC/P-WRC while 4 of them Include WRC Academy class and 4 the GroupB class.
Total: 10 rallies with plenty of all class-action!

edit: Let's also leave behind the stereotype rallies like Australia rally, Corsica rally, Acropolis rally e.t.c.
and find some new rallies from other countries like Holland,Itally,Croatia,Norwray, or elsewhere and combine
stages/surfaces from all available countries of RSRBR. The series will get some educational characteristics too! ;)

You have some very good ideas there :) I particularly like having new rally locations...

tannat

18th February 2011, 17:09

Sounds fine to me...

lcd

18th February 2011, 17:15

Needless to say that such a project will need all the help we get from all of us! This got to be a collective work.

tannat

18th February 2011, 19:16

Needless to say that such a project will need all the help we get from all of us! This got to be a collective work.

I'm here for you :D

MrMetro

19th February 2011, 13:33

But I did that with the SA Internet Rally Championship, it was S2000 only and the entries weren't any different and by the end of the season the pace of the front guys wasn't any different either. The results were pretty much the same.

But wasn't the SA championship mainly just gravel rallys? S2000 on snow and tarmac would be pretty cool IMO.

Bruce D

19th February 2011, 15:35

Fair point.

Macd

19th February 2011, 18:29

I like the idea of a two-wheel drive championship. Perhaps we could do a couple of events limited to a certain car to improve on competitiveness. We need to collate all these ideas and vote on them, the perhaps do a couple of trail events.

tannat

19th February 2011, 19:09

But wasn't the SA championship mainly just gravel rallys? S2000 on snow and tarmac would be pretty cool IMO.

In which case it could be called the MF RBR IRC :D

steve_spackman

20th February 2011, 03:45

Don't bash me for this, but just a thought: maybe some people disappeared because they thought some of us are not honest, meaning we probably played a stage again and again until we achieve a great time, while they were racing based on the 'No restarting Is allowed' rule.
What do you think of that possibility? If we think over of a tighter results system, maybe the series get a greater reliability.

I cant do the online RSRBR as it doesn't seem to work for me, so yeah i am missing out with the online rallies. Also RSRBR does take a good chunk of gig space from my computer along with other stuff i have on there. I can do the "offline" champs but even then RSRBR can be a right b#tch sometimes. I am sure a few other people share my reason and i know for sure this puts other people off from installing the add on..even the game

It has nothing to do with trusting people with restarts etc as we all pretty much have known one other on the forum for a fair few years...

Once i get my new computer i will install the game and mods and hopefully people here will be tearing up the stages....

steve_spackman

20th February 2011, 03:47

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 06:30

With hopefully the help of Tannat, I'm investigating putting the MF Cup events on RSRBR2011, as well as running the SAIRC and possibly a 2wd cup there, which should help boost entries, but then I'll run them from Facebook groups rather than from this forum, as I feel that would boost entries more easily.

lcd

22nd February 2011, 07:34

Sorry to repeat myself, but I believe there shouldn't be 2-3 separated championships like Bruce described above (MF Cup, SAiRC, 2WD etc)
but just one league, Including everything. Or at least some rounds to be open for 2WD, some for GroupB and the rest open for S-WRC/P-WRC.

A fb page of the whole thing Is a must do - A registration to his forum will be required though, as all the discussion Is done around here.

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 07:59

Well I'm willing to hand over the MF Cup to you LCD, I want to run the SAIRC according to how I want to run it, and I think Tannat should continue the Mod Free championship but I think restricting everything to the Motorsport Forums is not going to work. There is no real global reach on it, people won't find it so easily.

I believe running the MF Cup to your idea would definately revolutionise it.

lcd

22nd February 2011, 09:59

,,,but I think restricting everything to the Motorsport Forums is not going to work...

Do you Intent to move the SAiRC away from these forums, via fb only?

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 11:04

I'm not sure exactly where I'll base it, but fb will be involved and this forum won't necessarily be the base of the series, although it will be advertised here. Too many people can't or won't register with this forum, it's too restrictive.

MrMetro

22nd February 2011, 11:07

yeah, moving to Facebook is a good idea, I think we will get more entrys that way

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 11:11

I'm also planning on using this new RSRBR2011 system you talk about of both on and offline entries to do the results.

MrMetro

22nd February 2011, 11:15

I'm also planning on using this new RSRBR2011 system you talk about of both on and offline entries to do the results.

Although it has its negatives, it is likley I will get RSRBR 2011

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 11:19

IronRooster, I've added you and a couple of guys to the new Mod Free facebook page that I've set up for Tannat.

MrMetro

22nd February 2011, 11:23

IronRooster, I've added you and a couple of guys to the new Mod Free facebook page that I've set up for Tannat.

Indeed you have! I just seen a notification ;)

tannat

22nd February 2011, 16:30

i have to agree with bruce...

there will always be an audiencs for the mod free-I'll market it here only and as long as there is a full podium it will continue to run (current season is nearly over).

Bruce and lcd should be allowed their respective pursuits done their respective ways..

All smiles? :D

Bruce D

22nd February 2011, 19:12

Oh I'm cool with anything. Personally I believe LCD should take back the MF Cup and market it in the way he is saying, I believe it will work well and should be very interesting. There is definately place for the mod-free series, purely to take into account the console players and my series has it's place but more in the way I'm going to be handling it now.

Bruce D

1st March 2011, 11:26

I'm having 2nd thoughts about things. With the access to this forum changing, seeing how easy it is to set up stuff on the RSRBR rallies (thanks Tannat for connecting me), and getting hold of a nice new version of the rally scoring program, I'm keen to run the MF Cup again but as a online only system, running in different time zones to suit people.

I'll be doing an experiment during the last 3 rounds of the current MF Cup to see how the online interest is. Basically you'll be able to do online and offline events. LCD, I don't see how people can do an offline version of an event though?

tannat

1st March 2011, 11:52

Bruce D

1st March 2011, 12:46

lcd

1st March 2011, 13:28

...LCD, I don't see how people can do an offline version of an event though?

Easy. Set a rule, those racing the event offline, to do the rally one way out, without any Interruption, just like the online format.Believe me the results will be much more Interesting. That way, there will be no space for practicing the stages between each leg and very time consuming to start all over again, when you're almost towards the end of the rally.
What do you think? ;) Of course the RSRBR results system Is required...

edit: just make sure there won't be too many stages or many long ones, so It's more tempting to do the whole rally In about 20-30 min.

lcd

1st March 2011, 13:38

Another question, current I'm thinking of setting a rally every 6 hours over a 24 hour period. Which day of the week would be the best to do this and is 6 hours (i.e. 5 events in one day) enough or do you guys think it should be more.

I think 2 events would be fine. e.g. the first one on Wednesday night and the 2nd one on Sunday morning.
Days could change for each event, after a little discussion here...

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 12:33

Ok, we've got a power failure at work so I've thinking about a proposal for next season. Typing this on my mobile so I could misspell stuff, but here it is: 9 rounds (calendar to be discussed with Tannat to fit both series), you have to use a car from the category of that event. Each event will count for 1 category only, so 3 2wd, 3 group b and 3 s2000/n4. People can either do online or offline. Max 6 stages per event. Online will get 2 sessions to allow different timezones. Offline players will have a max time of 5min after finishing a stage to start the next stage, failing which there will be a 1min penalty for every minute late. Events could be combined surfaces. BTB stages can be used again. There wil
be a powerstage on the last stage of each rally with bonus points for top 3. Following championships will run: drivers, teams, rookie (for new drivers), stage (for stage results) and handicap. Each event will have a handicap result. This is based on your stage 1 time making up your handicap.

lcd

2nd March 2011, 13:14

To me, It looks like a perfect format. Nicely done Bruce! :up:
Just one thing:Can you explain the handicap feature with an example please?

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:19

Well it's quite complex but I'll try. It's something I had when I ran my Rally Championship 2000 league way back (Tannat will remember it). The idea is that the first stage sets the handicap of each driver, basically a percentage of the fastest stage time. So the stage winner will be on a factor of 1 (or 100%) and everyone else will have their handicap worked out from there. The handicap figure is the inverse of the percentage they were behind the winner of the stage. Then the last 5 stages are added together, and their totals are multiplied by the handicap factor, and if the fastest driver betters his performance over the rest he'll make up the difference and still win. So here is the example, we'll take 3 drivers:

So stage 1 ends with the following result:

1. Macd - 5:00
2. LCD - 5:15
3. Tannat - 5:17

Therefore the percentage of each person through the stage and inverse percentage is:
1. Macd - 1 = 1
2. LCD - 1.05 = 0.95238
3. Tannat - 1.0567 = 0.94634

Now over the rest of the rally the total times are:

1. Macd - 27:18
2. LCD - 27:59
3. Tannat - 28:14

Now Macd has a handicap of 1, so his total time stays on 27:18, LCD's total time becomes 26:39, and Tannat's becomes 26:43, so the new results reads 1. LCD, 2. Tannat, 3. Macd. What that means is that LCD performed better than the others relative to his first stage performance over the remaining stages. The idea is to give the guys at the back something to go for. They may not be able to match the exact stage times of the front guys but they can try to maintain the same or better performance relative to the front runner. Taking this example to explain that further, LCD's 1.05 percentage performance relative to Macd is 15sec on a 5min stage, on a 2min stage thats 6sec, on a 10min stage its 30sec.

tannat

2nd March 2011, 18:29

How long ago was that championship, Bruce?

SIGH_if only the archives were viewable again :(

I like the handicap idea-really big of you to take it on...

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:32

Lets take the recent Mod Free Australia Rally as a real example.

After Stage 1 the handicaps and inverses were:

1. NeverKnow - 1 = 1
2. BruceD - 1.0586 = 0.9464
3. PS29 - 1.0729 = 0.9320
4. LCD - 1.0793 = 0.9265
5. Tannat - 1.2464 = 0.8023

Now taking the rest of their stage times as a total and multiplying it by their handicap, we get the following result:

1. PS29 - 32:25.53
2. Tannat - 33:05.47
3. NeverKnow - 36:33.72
4. LCD - 37:08.12
5. BruceD - 37:33.06

So PS29 had a bad first stage but recovered to win easily. Tannat also had a bad first stage but showed that his pace was naturally quicker, NeverKnow is the constant and my pace dropped off relative to my start. But the point is Tannat had no chance in the main event due to losing over a minute on the first stage, but he wasn't far off the win in handicap.

lcd

2nd March 2011, 18:33

Ok Bruce, I got It, and I must say It's a brilliant Idea. ;)

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:35

How long ago was that championship, Bruce?

SIGH_if only the archives were viewable again :(

I like the handicap idea-really big of you to take it on...

Would you believe I actually still have some of the events on a DVD archive! I saw them a little while ago and thats where the idea of the handicap system came back to me. It's also where I came up with the idea of running events to different classes, if you remember my RC2000 league ran one event WRC cars, the next event F2 cars and then back to WRC cars etc. I remember that created a fascinating championship battle because one guy was good at WRC and the other guy was good at F2 so it kept the title wide open until the end.

pettersolberg29

2nd March 2011, 18:37

All this sounds very exciting, but I may need a lot of help setting up stuff if its online or using RSRBR! Whatever it is though, I want to be a part of it!

lcd

2nd March 2011, 18:37

What about the rally locations Bruce?
Will they follow the classic WRC-style calendar, or Is there something else on your mind?

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:39

Ok Bruce, I got It, and I must say It's a brilliant Idea. ;)

Oh good, cos I was buggered if I knew how else to explain it! :D

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:43

What about the rally locations Bruce?
Will they follow the classic WRC-style calendar, or Is there something else on your mind?

I don't actually know to be honest. I would want to avoid another Monte, nobody seemed to like that one. So any suggestions would be great. 9 rounds works nicely with my idea for the classes so maybe we could all come up with classic event names or something. It's always difficult to match exact conditions of an event (nowhere really matches 1000 Lakes Rally Finland properly in RBR for example). I'd like to get it that you did all three conditions in each class, so a snow rally, a tar rally and a gravel rally, or maybe even all 3 in one event.

Bruce D

2nd March 2011, 18:52

I like the handicap idea-really big of you to take it on...

It's actually not that complicated when you get Excel involved. I'm currently working on a new version of a rally scoring system. The new Rally Pro system gave me some ideas but unfortunately it's locked to 10 competitors so I can't use it and I'm disappointed by limitations in the usual Rally system so I decided to work on some stuff on Excel and see if I can't get what I'm looking for there instead. Hopefully I can debut it by the end of this season.

tannat

2nd March 2011, 19:26

For me Excel was cretaed by this guy -> :devil:

Good luck in your project :D

MrMetro

2nd March 2011, 20:29

You have some very good ideas Bruce :)

Bruce D

4th March 2011, 06:16

On thing I want to chance on the MF Cup with immediate effect is that the SuperRally will be the same as the Mod Free series, i.e. the slowest time plus 30sec.

tannat

4th March 2011, 16:15

On thing I want to chance on the MF Cup with immediate effect is that the SuperRally will be the same as the Mod Free series, i.e. the slowest time plus 30sec.

Yeah-the guy who came up with that idea is a sharp one :laugh: :p

lcd

4th March 2011, 16:42

...And why not, If there are more than one, following a super rally to compete for the 'super rally winner' award?

Bruce D

4th March 2011, 17:05

You'll need to explain how that will work. Normally it's only 1 person who takes a super rally per event so I'm not sure what "competition" part would be in it.

It's going to be hard to keep up with all these different awards I think.

BTW the new scoring program is going well. I'm in testing phase now, hit a problem which wasn't expect but I'll work around it. The handicap system is automatically calculated. At this rate I'll probably be able to debut the system on the next MF Cup event.

MrMetro

4th March 2011, 17:41

We need to make sure that the rules are kept simple and easy to understand.

Bruce D

5th March 2011, 09:37

Well is there anything here which you think is too complicated at this stage?

MrMetro

5th March 2011, 13:40

well not really, but I don't think we should have things like a super-rally competition, IMO, that would make things complicated.

lcd

19th March 2011, 17:32

Continuing the discussion from Catalunya's thread, over next season's brand name
let's have here the suggestions about how will, this championship of ours, be called, In RSRBR online boards:

My new suggestion, as Is MF Rally Masters:Finland,Norway,Kenya,Mexico,e.t.c.
( MF stands for MotorsportForums)

Really looking forward to your Ideas!

Bruce D

19th March 2011, 17:41

I like the Rally Masters, but I think leave out the MF, and also there is a limit to number of characters in the title of a rally so it has to be simple.

There is a likelihood that I would not call the rallies after any current or past events, rather just round numbers and I plan mixed surfaced events.

lcd

19th March 2011, 17:50

Agree with all the points you've made. ;)

So, my suggestion then will look a bit like this:
Rally Masters 1,2,3,4,e.t.c

Bruce D

19th March 2011, 18:33

Well don't forget each event would have more than 1 online session so more like Rally Masters R1 - 1 for example.

NeverKnow

20th March 2011, 07:37

For the mixed surface gravel/tar events I'd suggest that we use only one tire type. For example for every 2 or 3 gravel stages there is only one asphalt stage, using gravel tires on asphalt might keep things interesting. Just a thought...

Bruce D

20th March 2011, 12:05

Difficult to control for the offline people, not something you can see with the results html file, otherwise I would say lets do it, it's easy to do with the online people. BTW when I said mixed surfaces, I meant gravel, tarmac and snow on one event possibly.

lcd

21st March 2011, 08:30

...when I said mixed surfaces, I meant gravel, tarmac and snow on one event possibly.

So, no more Finland, GB, Monte Carlo e.t.c. rallies...just events Including different countries/all surfaces, right?

Bruce D

21st March 2011, 12:48

Well thats what I was thinking, cos when I do events with names like "monte" or "Finland" people expect certain things and I need to stick to the nature of that event, whereas this way is more open, plus don't forget you will be in a different car each time too.

The idea is to make it more of a challenge and make people work for their places.

lcd

21st March 2011, 15:53

It all sounds nice to me! ;)

Bruce D

14th April 2011, 06:57

Ok well I'll looked at this situation over the last 2 events and it seems to me to be completely illogical to continue this series. I had 3 regular entries, 4 if Macd had entered, and the online guys don't do the whole event, whether coming in late or crashing out early, so adding them is just really a glorified way of boosting the field. I spend more time doing the results for the events than I do actually driving the stages, so it makes no sense to continue a series that nobody is interested in. I don't believe that advertising the series in any way will make it more known, the Facebook page has now been running for nearly a year with regular updates but I'm the only one going on there, and we've only had stupid people join who thought they were real rallies, and one guy who posts videos but doesn't actually enter events. And there are lots of people on this forum who go "that all sounds great" and "cool, I'm entering next time" or words to that effect and they never arrive and we never hear from them any other time except to say they are interested.

NeverKnow

14th April 2011, 09:20

Bruce D

14th April 2011, 10:22

The thing is I've done online events with the Czech plugin and RSRBR and this whole "the event is now only" doesn't work for online. The Czech system was much better, the event ran from one date to another (you could set it to a week or 2 days, whatever you wanted) and people could download a offline file and play offline, but that file would contain the stage times of all the people that had been on so far. For those that would do it only the times would be there from different times of day or different days. During a stage you would get the split times which compared you to others and then at the end of the stage it would show you how you did, whether online or offline. It just worked better. It's a pity they want money before they let you set events otherwise I would use their system rather and we'd probably have more fun and more genuine competitors.

tannat

14th April 2011, 12:09

It is unfortunate but I have to agree with you regarding ending the series. Participation hasn't change for few events now and that huge amount of work required to sort out the times (especially with the online segment), it isn't worth it. With so few entries it slightly has lost it's appeal to me as well but as long there will be rallies, I will participate. Online drivers aren't the most reliable sort, of course there are those who are fast or at least see a event through and then are those who (as I have observed) jump from event to event. They mostly come in, do a stage or two, crash and discontinue current event and start some other event when able.

Maybe in the future peoples interest in MF Cup will come back and we can continue the series then.

Yeah Bruce-it is unrewarding to have such a decline in interest. Amazing how we can drop from where we were a year ago to now...

I may start the mod free championship after Easter (in May) so keep your eyes open on the forum for that. Would be great to have you participate/.

Thanks so much for all you have done for forum championships in the past :up:

Bruce D

14th April 2011, 12:32

MrMetro

14th April 2011, 14:33

I'm considering running a full TOCA 2 championship. I'll start planning it when you guys have confirmed what you are doing with the RBR championships, that way, I can avoid any date clashes.

tannat

14th April 2011, 19:55

I know, last year we were bouncing around 10 entries per event, now it's 3 entries per event. Strange that, even guys like Francis just disappeared.

If you run the mod-free championship, I will definately be there, and I'll try my hardest to do every event.

Francis is out there-I saw him on one of the pages for this weeks rallys on rallyesim.

He's just not here :(