BTCC Snetterton

[Allyc85]

At long, long last the BTCC returns after its long summer break! :D :D

Will the Fords dominate or will they crack under the pressure, and will Honda regret not going to the test the other week. Should be a great days racing tomorrow!

FP1 times are in and Plato leads the way, though the field is fairly tightly packed at this early stage.

1. Jason Plato Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 12.658secs
2. Tom Chilton Team Aon Ford Focus ST 1min 12.786secs
3. Rob Collard West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 12.803secs
4. Andrew Jordan Pirtek Racing Vauxhall Vectra 1min 12.829secs
5. Steven Kane Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 12.880secs
6. Mat Jackson Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 12.895secs
7. Matt Neal Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 13.064secs
8. Gordon Shedden Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 13.152secs
9. Tom Onslow-Cole Team Aon Ford Focus ST 1min 13.159secs
10. Paul O'Neill sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 13.174secs

11. James Nash Triple Eight Vauxhall Vectra 1min 13.209secs
12. Alex MacDowall Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 13.289secs
13. Dave Pinkney Pinkney Motorsport Vauxhall Vectra 1min 13.576secs
14. Tom Boardman Special Tuning (UK) SEAT Leon 1min 13.582secs
15. Andy Neate West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 13.762secs
16. John George sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 14.380secs
17. Martin Johnson Boulevard Team Racing Vauxhall Astra 1min 14.591secs
18. Lea Wood Central Group Racing Honda Integra 1min 14.914secs
19. Shaun Hollamby AmD Milltek Racing Volkswagen Golf 1min 15.065secs
20. Martin Depper Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 15.112secs
21. Arthur Forster Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 15.229secs

[Eurotech]

Shaun Hollamby ahead of the two Forster BMWs AGAIN The AMD Milltek guys have done a great job on that car over the break, surely a points finish isn't too far away now?

[Allyc85]

Yea they have done great work on that car and now seem right on the pace. Just hope they have got the reliability sorted as well :)

FP2 times..

1. Jason Plato Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 11.983secs
2. James Nash Triple Eight Vauxhall Vectra 1min 12.071secs
3. Alex MacDowall Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 12.097secs
4. Rob Collard West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 12.344secs
5. Andrew Jordan Pirtek Racing Vauxhall Vectra 1min 12.430secs
6. Tom Onslow-Cole Team Aon Ford Focus ST 1min 12.449secs
7. Steven Kane Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 12.613secs
8. Paul O'Neill sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 12.703secs
9. Mat Jackson Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 12.717secs
10. Matt Neal Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 12.942secs

11. Tom Chilton Team Aon Ford Focus ST 1min 13.035secs
12. Tom Boardman Special Tuning (UK) SEAT Leon 1min 13.088secs
13. Gordon Shedden Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 13.182secs
14. Andy Neate West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 13.414secs
15. Dave Pinkney Pinkney Motorsport Vauxhall Vectra 1min 13.419secs
16. John George sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 13.554secs
17. Lea Wood Central Group Racing Honda Integra 1min 13.581secs
18. Shaun Hollamby AmD Milltek Racing Volkswagen Golf 1min 14.011secs
19. Martin Johnson Boulevard Team Racing Vauxhall Astra 1min 14.156secs
20. Martin Depper Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 14.699secs
21. Arthur Forster Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 14.913secs

Plato fastest again with the highest Ford being in 6th place, I wonder if they are sand bagging a bit ahead of qualy ;)

[Alfa Fan]

No Rob Collard for qualifying it seems.

[Allyc85]

Chilton fastest but has received a black and white flag so im guessing hes blocked someone on a fast lap?

[Alfa Fan]

Another AON ride height fail.

[Alfa Fan]

And again. What a joke.

[VkmSpouge]

Well done to Alex MacDowall taking his first pole position. He always seems to qualify well but doesn't seem to capitalise during the races, maybe tomorrow will be different.
Arena Motorsport shooting themselves in the foot wil Tom Onslow-Cole failing that ride height check.
Anyone know what the problem was with Martin Johnson's car?

[Allyc85]

Great pole position from MacDowall, hes been massively impressive this year and you can barely tell that hes a rookie!

Really cant believe that TOC's car managed to fail the ride height test twice, that is shocking. I expect theres going to be a few stern words this evening in the de-brief as to how theyve let that happen. Stil should be fun watching him blast down the straights trying to make up positions :D

1. Alex MacDowall Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 19.332secs
2. Jason Plato Silverline Chevrolet Chevrolet Cruze 1min 19.426secs
3. Tom Chilton Team Aon Ford Focus ST 1min 19.675secs
4. Mat Jackson Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 20.094secs
5. Gordon Shedden Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 20.206secs
6. Andrew Jordan Pirtek Racing Vauxhall Vectra 1min 20.487secs
7. Matt Neal Team Honda Honda Civic 1min 20.613secs
8. Paul O'Neill sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 20.688secs
9. James Nash Triple Eight Vauxhall Vectra 1min 20.695secs
10. Tom Boardman Special Tuning (UK) SEAT Leon 1min 20.752secs

11. Steven Kane Airwaves BMW BMW 320si 1min 20.827secs
12. Rob Collard West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 21.303secs
13. Lea Wood Central Group Racing Honda Integra 1min 21.350secs
14. Dave Pinkney Pinkney Motorsport Vauxhall Vectra 1min 22.278secs
15. Andy Neate West Surrey Racing BMW 320si 1min 22.357secs
16. John George sunshine.co.uk with Tech-Speed Honda Integra 1min 22.358secs
17. Shaun Hollamby AmD Milltek Racing Volkswagen Golf 1min 22.963secs
18. Martin Depper Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 23.598secs
19. Arthur Forster Forster Motorsport BMW 320si 1min 23.656secs
20. Martin Johnson Boulevard Team Racing Vauxhall Astra 1min 40.092secs
21. Tom Onslow-Cole Team Aon Ford Focus ST No times

[Eurotech]

Aon seem to have screwed up big time somewhere, not only did TOC fail the ride height, but they didn't even manage to get Chilton on pole at a circuit that should suit the Ford Focus perfectly. Remind anyone of SEAT a few years back?

[RMLCruzeing82]

Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CHEVY 1st 2nd for the start of race one. stunning run buy the boys in blue

[PDS]

Mat Jackson!

The only BMW in the top ten...

[AndySpeed]

Mat Jackson!

The only BMW in the top ten...

Rob Collard was the only BMW driver in the top ten for Croft and Brands Hatch...

I wonder why Motorbase always struggle so much in qualifying and practice. It's been a common occurrence for the last couple of years.

[trebor901]

Team AON are a disgrace to this sport, 10mph faster through speed traps is just obscene in touring cars. Had huge respect how they developed that car at the end of last year but now ive lost all of it seeing how unfair their advantage is

[VkmSpouge]

Race 1 Result:
1 Jason Plato
2 Mat Jackson
3 Tom Chilton
4 Gordon Shedden
5 James Nash
6 Tom Onslow-Cole
7 Steven Kane
8 Tom Boardman
9 Andrew Jordan
10 Rob Collard
11 Paul o'Neill
12 John George
13 Andy Neate
14 Lea Wood
15 Martin Depper
16 Shaun Hollamby
17 Arthur Forster
DNF Matt Neal
DNF Alex MacDowall
DNF Martin Johnson
DNF Dave Pinkney

I feel sorry for Alex MacDowall not really getting a chance to show what he could do. Jason Plato looking very good out front in the race. Mat Jackson threatened him early on but could not sustain the challenge.
Nice to see the Forster BMWs and Hollamby's Golf getting a bit of TV time in their little battle of last place.
The Fords clearly have far too much of a straight line advantage. Their overall lap time is matching that of the other lead teams but I think that means they should several tenths off the front running pace if the rules were working.


Team AON are a disgrace to this sport, 10mph faster through speed traps is just obscene in touring cars. Had huge respect how they developed that car at the end of last year but now ive lost all of it seeing how unfair their advantage is

Team Aon are clearly not a disgrace to the sport. They are merely taking advantage of the rules in the same way any team would do in their situation. The problem is not the team but the rules aren't really working. It is far too quick in a straight line just like the SEAT Leon diesel was.

[trebor901]

but not even the TDI was that much quicker in a straight line

[Eurotech]

I agree with Trebor, when we had the SEAT TDi's at least they were slow enough in a straight line to allow other cars to defend a bit, Those Fords can get a medium exit from Sear and they can still drive past anything thats in their way. Absolute joke. I thought ToCA said that they would adjust the Turbo restrictors to equalize the performance.

[trebor901]

and Nash produces the same accident as last year, stupid little rich kid

[Eurotech]

Watch out Jason, they're coming for you!!!!!!!! :D

[VkmSpouge]

Race 2 Result:
1 Jason Plato
2 Tom Chilton
3 Tom Onslow-Cole
4 Steven Kane
5 Mat Jackson
6 Andrew Jordan
7 Rob Collard
8 Gordon Shedden
9 Matt Neal
10 James Nash
11 Dave Pinkney
12 Martin Johnson
13 Andy Neate
14 Lea Wood
15 Shaun Hollamby
16 Martin Depper
DNF Alex MacDowall
DNF Arthur Forster
DNF Tom Boardman
DNF John George
DNF Paul o'Neill

Feel sorry for the two Tech-Speed cars getting caught up in Nash-Boardman accident.
Jason Plato getting another 17 points and was completely unchallenged. I feel so sorry for Alex MacDowall, today has been very bad for him.
Once the two Fords got into 2nd and 3rd the racing was effectively over at the front.
Again it is good to see some of the backmarkers getting a bit of TV time :)

EDIT: Top 10 reversed. James Nash starts from pole. A good draw for the Team Dynamics Hondas.

[trebor901]

i dont think Nash will be starting on pole as i think he'll get a penalty for causing the Boardman crash

[RMLCruzeing82]

i dont think Nash will be starting on pole as i think he'll get a penalty for causing the Boardman crash

once again nash could of messed up a good end of his weekend

[Sarah]

Good work for getting Tom, John & Owy back out there.


Nash is in the field.....

[trebor901]

Mat Jackson once again driving like a prat

[VkmSpouge]

Race 3 Result:
1 Gordon Shedden
2 Rob Collard
3 Matt Neal
4 Tom Chilton
5 Jason Plato
6 Steven Kane
7 Mat Jackson
8 Paul o'Neill
9 Dave Pinkney
10 Andy Neate
11 Tom Boardman
12 John George
13 Alex MacDowall
14 Arthur Forster
15 Shaun Hollamby
16 Tom Onslow-Cole
DNF Lea Wood
DNF Martin Depper
DNF James Nash
DNS Andrew Jordan
DNS Martin Johnson

Gordon Shedden putting forward his championship challenging credentials with an easy win after James Nash blew it on lap two.
A good drive from the rear by Paul o'Neill coming up to claim 8th place. I feel sorry for Lea Wood, he'll eventually score points.

[Eurotech]

Mat Jackson once again driving like a prat
I have to disagree with you there, Onslow Cole was trying to muscle him out and he had nowhere to go

[52Paddy]

Decent racing today. Not the best we've seen this season though. What an absolute waste of a pole position for Nash. On the contrary, Shedden did a stellar job. The Airwaves cars were a little off form in comparison to previous rounds. Drivers of the weekend have to be Boardman, George and O'Neill for getting out in race 3, particularly O'Neill for getting right through the field to finish 8th. :up:

[Captain VXR]

"I'm as good as anyone"
Errrrrrrrrrrrrr Crunch
Maybe he meant cabbage harvesting? :p

[#1JamesThompsonFan]

Typical rich kid comment

[52Paddy]

Harvey was saying that Nash's comment showed he had a lot of confidence and that was the attitude you needed if you wanted to win. However, he did eat his words when Nash went off, saying that he was immature in saying so perhaps. It's good he did go off. He needed a wake-up call and a drag back to reality.

[Wasted Talent]

The moaning about the Fords is getting boring....looks like they won't be allowed to win the championship as if they get near the front the boost gets limited.

I didn't see Plato or Neal compalining that the BMWs couldn't keep up with them down the back straight even with a tow.....

WT

[AndySpeed]

The moaning about the Fords is getting boring....looks like they won't be allowed to win the championship as if they get near the front the boost gets limited.

I didn't see Plato or Neal compalining that the BMWs couldn't keep up with them down the back straight even with a tow.....

WT

People tend not to like different - you could say that the BMW's engines are the same, but just not tuned as well hence being slower. Whereas the Ford's are completely different types of engine.

[I am evil Homer]

Funny how Plato had no issue with a diesel engine which has totally different properties to a petrol motor. And it's not like the Ford's are running away with the title either.

[Allyc85]

Good days racing I thought. While there wasnt a huge amount of passing there was plenty of tight battles which i dont mind, its when they get spread out that I get bored!

Well done to Plato. It really does seem like they have that Chevvy sorted now and on the twistier tracks it could be very hard to beat!

Was great to see Jackson up there fighting after a much improved qualy. I didnt think much of the TOC incident, it just looked like 2 drivers that both really didnt want to give up one little bit.


Funny how Plato had no issue with a diesel engine which has totally different properties to a petrol motor. And it's not like the Ford's are running away with the title either.

Exactly, he also forgets how the Chevvy last year was way quicker than anything else. Just watch the onboard video of the Adam incident at Brands and its ridiculous how much he pulls away on the straight and thats in a car thats not over weight and has some engine braking. I can see why people are complaining about the speed but they need to look at the other details aswell!

[BDunnell]

Harvey was saying that Nash's comment showed he had a lot of confidence and that was the attitude you needed if you wanted to win. However, he did eat his words when Nash went off, saying that he was immature in saying so perhaps. It's good he did go off. He needed a wake-up call and a drag back to reality.

The trouble is, you need something to back up such a statement. There is no factual evidence as yet for Nash being 'as good as anyone', despite the fact that I still feel his exclusion from victory at Snetterton last year was unfair.

[BDunnell]

Exactly, he also forgets how the Chevvy last year was way quicker than anything else. Just watch the onboard video of the Adam incident at Brands and its ridiculous how much he pulls away on the straight and thats in a car thats not over weight and has some engine braking. I can see why people are complaining about the speed but they need to look at the other details aswell!

Not 'ridiculous', I'd say. After all, the Lacetti's engine was a two-litre petrol much like everything else on the grid, except stronger down the straights. There is nothing new, sadly, in touring car racing seeing 'unfair' performance advantages — look at the straight-line speed of Andy Rouse's RS500s compared to everything else in the late '80s! The difference now is that the range of engines used isn't as uniform, in that there are NGTC engines competing alongside other types of engine. Equalisation is always going to be difficult. The sooner the BTCC can adopt a single technical formula the better.

[Wasted Talent]

But the regs were there at the start of the year for other teams to run turbos and for various reasons didn't.

As Homer says the Fords aren't running away with the championship, and it just looks like they can't win as if they win a couple of races then the restrictor will be reduced in size again

WT

[Eurotech]

I agree that everyone is whining about the Fords, but when you have a car that can just pull straight past every other car in the field, it kind of takes away the racing element and makes everything look like a dual carridgeway....

[52Paddy]

but when you have a car that can just pull straight past every other car in the field, it kind of takes away the racing element and makes everything look like a dual carridgeway....

Firstly, I don't think it takes away the racing element. It just means that there is more competition at the top. Secondly, if someone builds a car to what the regulations are, and happens to create a solid racing machine that is capable of blitzing the field, then more power to them. It is up to the other teams to get their work cut out and improve their car accordingly. The only thing I will say is that it is unfortunate on people with very little money (ala Paul O'Neill, Tom Boardman etc) who are quick drivers at heart. But, it's not supposed to be easy in the world's best touring car series either.

[Jason Plato]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Whilst I understand and appreciate that people who contribute to this forum have their favoured drivers and teams, views and comments should be based on facts and not as is the case with a few posters, on biased, uneducated opinions.

So, to enlighten everybody on the true FACTS.......

1. The LPG Focus was allowed to run a turbo charger as a method to EQUALISE the losses in engine performance that came as a result of running the alternative fuel LPG. (LPG has a lower calorific value than Petrol)

2. The regulations for the LPG Ford where published to the other teams only six days prior to the first event.

3. If you look back in excess of ten years in the history of the BTCC, you will find that the difference in engine performance between the front running cars is in the order of 1mph maximum at startline speed traps. The ethos of the BTCC is that the cars are evenly matched.
Just for a minute, picture this ridiculous scenario -How would the racing be if someone was allowed to race in the BTCC with a 600bhp Citroen 2CV? No one would be able to get past it, it would be too fast on the straights and slow in the corners. Ring any bells?

4. There has been similarities drawn between the LPG Focus and the Diesel SEAT which have no factual foundation. To illustrate:

• The SEAT in 2008 had a Diesel engine and therefore has massively different and undesirable power delivery characteristics compared to a turbo charged LPG engine.
• The SEAT Diesel engine was considerable heavier than the LPG Focus and therefore the car had an undesirable and unchangeable forward weight distribution.
• Engine braking is a small consideration on a diesel engine, this is due to the very low maximum engine revs it operates at (4000rpm compared to 7000rpm on the LPG Focus and 8500rpm on a petrol engine)
• Engine braking contributes absolutely nothing in the braking area with regards to retardation, the only effect engine braking has is when the throttle is modulated in corners at high engine revs, the car will experience a small pitch change and the resultant balance change can sometimes assist the driver if he has not got the set-up correct.
• The SEAT Diesel was on average only 2mph faster at the startline speed traps at Snetterton in 2008 compared to the other BTCC front running cars and not as is the case with the LPG Focus some 5+mph even after the fitment of a 36mm restrictor.
• The regulations for FIA S2000 Deisel cars where in existence years before SEAT entered the BTCC and therefore other teams and manufacturers had the opportunity to build cars to these regulations.

5. All the teams and drivers I have spoken to have absolutely no objection to the LPG Focus being regulated to run with exactly the same torque and power as the leading non LPG car.


I trust the above FACTS will give the fans of the BTCC an insight into why we have an unhappy pit lane at present. Hopefully TOCA, who I have absolute trust in and respect for, will make the correct regulation changes to restrict the huge engine performance advantage the LPG Focus has over every other competitor in the BTCC.

Oh, and before I forget, one last point, the Deisel SEAT is banned in the BTCC because it has an unfair advantage in engine performance.

Look forward to seeing some of you at Silverstone in a couple of weeks.

Kind regards,

JP

[52Paddy]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Whilst I understand and appreciate that people who contribute to this forum have their favoured drivers and teams, views and comments should be based on facts and not as is the case with a few posters, on biased, uneducated opinions.

So, to enlighten everybody on the true FACTS.......

---------------------------------------------------------

Kind regards,

JP

Not to sound at all like a lick-ass but that has certainly cleared a lot of the grey area up for me. Thanks Jason :)

[Spyder]

As a spectator I pay to watch racing. If I was interested in drag racing (which I am not) I would go to Santa Pod. After seeing the Fords out-drag the other cars up the straights I looked at my diary to see which tracks I will not bother with for the rest of the season.

[wedge]

As a neutral I honestly don't see what the problem is.

Have Team Aon haven't dominated all all year winning left, right and centre?

The championship table doesn't lie - FACT.

I don't see why TOCA should step in just so Plato can have an easier path to the championship.

[mattie007]

I think Snetterton made the problem look worse than it actually is.
Like has been said before, the Fords aren't running away with it and there disadvantage is they dont corner quickly.
Good to see JP highlighting some interesting facts though.

[BDunnell]

Good to see JP highlighting some interesting facts though.

I agree, a very interesting post, and as I said before I feel strongly that comparisons with cars in recent previous seasons, like the Lacetti in 2009 or the TDi SEAT before that, are irrelevant. However, I would make two points. Firstly, no-one is suggesting that it was impossible for any team other than Team Aon to come up with such a powerplant configuration. Secondly, I am a bit confused about something, and can't at this moment be bothered to examine the technical regs. Surely there is an upper bhp limit for a BTCC car?

[Eurotech]

I just think we should get rid of LPG in the BTCC, trying to make motorsport eco friendly is a bit piontless IMO and if I wanted to watch some people driving around economically, I'd just watch Turkish Taxi drivers after they've noticed the price of fuel atm....

Just keep the championship as 2 litre petrol units and then we can aviod all of this.