2010 Versus TV-ratings are up

[Lousada]

Versus averaged 518,000 viewers (0.3 U.S. rating) for last Saturday night's Izod IndyCar Series Firestone 550k at Texas Motor Speedway from 8:42-11:04pm ET, marking the net's most-viewed race telecast since it began airing IndyCar races last season.
http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/article/139903

If you look closely at the little schedule you see where they got the gains. Texas started 1.5 hours earlier than last year. Also the two lowest rated races were shifted to ABC and replaced with brandnew events, which always score higher.
Still, let's hope this trend continues because they sure need this positive reporting.

[anthonyvop]

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/article/139903

If you look closely at the little schedule you see where they got the gains. Texas started 1.5 hours earlier than last year. Also the two lowest rated races were shifted to ABC and replaced with brandnew events, which always score higher.
Still, let's hope this trend continues because they sure need this positive reporting.


When harping about a 0.3 is positive reporting then you know you are in trouble.

[00steven]

Hopefully they can keep it up so indycar can eventually rise back to the specticle it once was.

[Scotty G.]

I would be flat embarrassed to be the one writing about a .3 rating and 500,000 people total watching, being something that "is the best" of anything.

That is pathetic, no matter how you spin it.

[MDS]

Actually its not that bad. The ICS needed to show improvement, and they haven't seen the average that would really help, 1.0 on Versus and 2.0 on ABC, but they're getting better, an a half-million constant fans, of which 60 percent or so are in the coveted 18-40 age bracket, so its not bad.

By way of comparison the 2009 MLS playoffs on ESPN drew a .2 average with an average of 225,000 viewers. The WNBA 2009 playoffs averaged .3 and a .1 for its regular season, has almost no male viewers takes loses of at least $12 million a year which is covered by the NBA.

The NHL saw its best ratings since the 70s, in part helped by two storied franchises in finals and a stunning performance at the Olympics. More people watched the final game than the Indy 500 and the playoff average was a more than respectable 3.6 average. Since the NHL is on Versus it should help raise that channel's profile and by extension help the IRL

The juggernaut that is NASCAR kept chugging on Sunday with Neilson fast nationals showing a 3.3 ratings for 5.4 million viewers and won the day on basic cable in total viewers and adults 18-54.

The ICS is probably breaking even and is collecting more sponsors. Now that they've stopped the bleeding they can focus on building, so yeah, Rome wasn't built in a day and all that.

Given how badly the MLS and the WNBA are doing on ESPN the fact that the ICS can pull in a 500,000 on much more obscure network is a pretty good sign. Long term maybe Versus is the answer, but short term the answer is to get out of that deal somehow and get as many races on broadcast and more established cable networks as possible.

[NickFalzone]

A .3 and 500k rating is certainly nothing to crow about. That being said, it is in the same range as the races that previously were on ESPN and ESPN2. It also is quite a bit better than the last IRL night race at Kentucky, which got ratings that barely registered. If VS can get the series to around a .5ish and 800k viewer rating, that will be considered a financially viable number for sponsors. Right now, they're still in the doldrums of barely getting by.

[SarahFan]

A .3 is flat out F'en horrible

any and all attempts to paint it as anything but is pathetic

[call_me_andrew]

The ICS is probably breaking even and is collecting more sponsors. Now that they've stopped the bleeding they can focus on building, so yeah, Rome wasn't built in a day and all that.

And what are you basing this on?

[MDS]

And what are you basing this on?

The Apex, Izod and Sunoco deals in combination with the other sponsors that have come on board in the last two years like Holmatro combined with the cuts they've made have to put the league at least close to breaking even, if not better.

[anthonyvop]

The Apex, Izod and Sunoco deals in combination with the other sponsors that have come on board in the last two years like Holmatro combined with the cuts they've made have to put the league at least close to breaking even, if not better.

Holmatro is seriously reassessing their Indy Car sponsorship after the Texas debacle.

Apex is for the Brazilian race and drivers. Izod got a sweet deal...so sweet that they won't even sponsor their driver anymore this year. Don't know the details of the Sunoco deal.

The preeminent team in Indy Car has 2 cars without sponsors. Many others are either without major sponsorship or under sponsored. A large percentage of the grid is there because of ride buyers.

Their be all that ends all, signature event had 1000's of empty seats and lower TV numbers.

[F1boat]

Hopefully the series will continue to improve.

[SarahFan]

Hopefully the series will continue to improve.

I'll second that

[SarahFan]

Rtg (H-holds) Ntwk Race [2009 rtg]

0.4 (411,000) VS Sao Paulo [n/a]
0.6 (???,???) ABC St. Pete rainout show [VS 0.3]
0.4 (310,000) VS Barber [n/a]
0.5 (490,000) VS Long Beach [VS 0.5]
0.7 (???,???) ABC Kansas [VS .15]
3.6 (???,???) ABC Indy 500 [ABC 4.0]
0.3 (518,000) VS Texas [VS .36]

Just so Im clear.....this years texas rating was the lowest rated Versus race this season.... not to mention that it was lower than long beach last year as well as lower than than the texas race last year...

yet it was the most watched race ever on Versus...

color me a little skeptical

[Lousada]

Rtg (H-holds) Ntwk Race [2009 rtg]

0.4 (411,000) VS Sao Paulo [n/a]
0.6 (???,???) ABC St. Pete rainout show [VS 0.3]
0.4 (310,000) VS Barber [n/a]
0.5 (490,000) VS Long Beach [VS 0.5]
0.7 (???,???) ABC Kansas [VS .15]
3.6 (???,???) ABC Indy 500 [ABC 4.0]
0.3 (518,000) VS Texas [VS .36]

Just so Im clear.....this years texas rating was the lowest rated Versus race this season.... not to mention that it was lower than long beach last year as well as lower than than the texas race last year...

yet it was the most watched race ever on Versus...

color me a little skeptical

You're mixing up viewers and households. The ratings are calculated on the household number. What they are publishing is the amount of viewers. You can have more than one viewer per household. So it could well be that the Texas rating is not the highest rating but still had the most viewers.

[SarahFan]

You're mixing up viewers and households. The ratings are calculated on the household number. What they are publishing is the amount of viewers. You can have more than one viewer per household. So it could well be that the Texas rating is not the highest rating but still had the most viewers.


I understand.......

this isnt rocket science.......or Indy Qualifying..



like I said........lowest rated so far year this year, not to mention lower than LB as well as texas last year.... yet more viewers?...

well the same logic about more than one viewer applies to those broadcasts as well.....

color me skeptical...........you? believe what you want

[Lousada]

So in summary it should look a little like this:
VS Sao Paulo - 411 (n/a)
ABC St. Pete - n/a (233)
VS Barber - 310 (n/a)
VS Long Beach - 490 (478)
ABC Kansas - 0.7 (222)
ABC Indy - 3.6 (4.0)
(Milwaukee - n/a (0.6))
VS Texas - 518 (467)

[Lousada]

I understand.......

this isnt rocket science.......or Indy Qualifying..



like I said........lowest rated so far year this year, not to mention lower than LB as well as texas last year.... yet more viewers?...

well the same logic about more than one viewer applies to those broadcasts as well.....

color me skeptical...........you? believe what you want

Were do you get that? Long Beach last year could never ever be a .5 with 478.000 viewers. Nor could St.Pete be a .3 with 233.000 viewers. Where did you get these rating numbers from? I trust the Sports Business Journal enough that the numbers in this article are correct.

[SarahFan]

Official ICS 2009 TV ratings thread
I thought I would try to keep track of the ratings for the broadcasts this year. If you see the official rating after a race, please post it in this thread and I will update this first post. Without further ado:

Rtg (H-holds) Ntwk Race

0.3 (233,000) VS St. Pete
0.5 (388,864) VS Long Beach
.15 (171,000) VS Kansas
4.0 (???,???) ABC Indy 500
0.7 (852,000) ABC Milwaukee
.36 (467,000) VS Texas
0.8 (???,???) ABC Iowa
.22 (248,000) VS Richmond
.87 (???,???) ABC Watkins Glen
1.0 (770,000) ABC Toronto
.24 (279,000) VS Edmonton
.14 (165,000) VS Kentucky
0.2 (233,000) VS Mid-Ohio
.25 (281,000) VS Sonoma
.24 (271,000) VS Chicagoland
.14 (165,000) VS Motegi
.15 (171,000) VS Homestead-Miami

.24 = avg rating on Versus (12 races)
1.5 = avg rating on ABC with Indy (5 races)
0.8 = avg rating on ABC without Indy (4 races)

Season recap by SportsBusiness Journal:


^there was a fairly extensive thread at another forum....hotly debated last season season

in the end the these were the accepted #'s...

are you suggesting they are incorrect?

[SarahFan]

Were do you get that? Long Beach last year could never ever be a .5 with 478.000 viewers. Nor could St.Pete be a .3 with 233.000 viewers. Where did you get these rating numbers from? I trust the Sports Business Journal enough that the numbers in this article are correct.


then were this years #'s for Brazil, barber and LB also incorrect?

[Lousada]

Rtg (H-holds) Ntwk Race

0.3 (233,000) VS St. Pete
0.5 (388,864) VS Long Beach
1.0 (770,000) ABC Toronto

^there was a fairly extensive thread at another forum....hotly debated last season season

in the end the these were the accepted #'s...

are you suggesting they are incorrect?

These three numbers are overnights and not finals!

[Lousada]

then were this years #'s for Brazil, barber and LB also incorrect?

They never published the ratings for Brazil, Barber and Long Beach as far as I remember. Only the viewerships. It's keyboard jockeys like us that calculated ratings from the published numbers.
If you want continuity in your schedule you need to set Texas at a .45 rating.

[SarahFan]

They never published the ratings for Brazil, Barber and Long Beach as far as I remember. Only the viewerships. It's keyboard jockeys like us that calculated ratings from the published numbers.
If you want continuity in your schedule you need to set Texas at a .45 rating.


why would I set Texas at .45 when the sportjournal that you just said is trustworthy put it at .3?

[SarahFan]

These three numbers are overnights and not finals!

i dont think so

[Lousada]

why would I set Texas at .45 when the sportjournal that you just said is trustworthy put it at .3?

Because you insist on calculating ratings from viewership instead of households. The .3 is the household rating (the real rating!). The .45 is the viewership rating.

[SarahFan]

Because you insist on calculating ratings from viewership instead of households. The .3 is the household rating (the real rating!). The .45 is the viewership rating.

2 ratings?


now there is 2 ratings?

[Lousada]

i dont think so

I think so. The Toronto number is definately an overnight, you can look that back.
Overnights are calculated over about 77 million homes. .5% of 77 million is 385, or roughly that Long Beach number. While .3% of 77 million is 233 or the St.Pete number. If you reset those numbers to finals, Texas '10 becomes the highest rated Versus race again.

[Lousada]

2 ratings?


now there is 2 ratings?

According to you!

[SarahFan]

According to you!

Me?

your the one who changed a published .3 to a .45




I'm simply saying that I find it a little skeptical that a published .3 ratings on VS, which is lower than the previos three races this season, not to mention LB 2009 as well as the same race (texas) as last year produced the the most watched INDYcar race on VS...


from where i sit one of three things is incorrect

A. the 2010 texas rating
B. the 2010 texas Viewer #
C. all the previos #'s from 13 races broadcast on Vs

[SarahFan]

or then there is

D: the author has all the #'s correct, but mistakenly compared the viewer # to the previos household #'s and ran with the incorrect assumption it was the most watched race on Vs

[chuck34]

There was a deal like this last year, Texas if I remember right. The ratings number was something like .36, but if you looked at the households it should have been a .63. Or the other way around (can't remember, I've slept since then). Anyway, I think I'd trust the households number more than the mythical "share" but that's just me.

[chuck34]

Just went back and looked at your numbers Ken/Sarah. It was Texas. It had a .36 share, but more households than the .5 LB. Something "funny". I'll stick with looking at households.

[SarahFan]

Just went back and looked at your numbers Ken/Sarah. It was Texas. It had a .36 share, but more households than the .5 LB. Something "funny". I'll stick with looking at households.

interesting...

becuase I tend to trust the neilson rating....and figure authors/posters/bloggers/etc get the conversion between hoseholds and viewers etc wrong/confused....



for me if neilson says texas is a .3...... and LB was a .5.......Id suggest LB outperformed texas..... the rest is just spin, statistics and Bull****

[EagleEye]

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/article/139903

If you look closely at the little schedule you see where they got the gains. Texas started 1.5 hours earlier than last year. Also the two lowest rated races were shifted to ABC and replaced with brandnew events, which always score higher.
Still, let's hope this trend continues because they sure need this positive reporting.

This does not matter since the biggest race of the year records the lowest ratings ever, down from last year. There were some interesting (read panic) meetings the past few weeks and Izod is not at all pleased. They had expected an increase, of a point or more. That did not happen, and spin mode is in play.

And that folks, is bad news.

[SarahFan]

This does not matter since the biggest race of the year records the lowest ratings ever, down from last year. There were some interesting (read panic) meetings the past few weeks and Izod is not at all pleased. They had expected an increase, of a point or more. That did not happen, and spin mode is in play.

And that folks, is bad news.

there was a lot of talk/smoke about key metrics when the Izod deal was inked.....

I would think a increase in the i500 rating was at the top of the list

[NaBUru38]

Household numbers are easy to count: one per television. Viewership numbers are trickier but are the ones which matter, because they measures how many people watch.

[The instant classic]

This does not matter since the biggest race of the year records the lowest ratings ever, down from last year. There were some interesting (read panic) meetings the past few weeks and Izod is not at all pleased. They had expected an increase, of a point or more. That did not happen, and spin mode is in play.

And that folks, is bad news.

do you think IZOD would leave indycar if they are not pleased at all? or stick around and hope for the best?

[anthonyvop]

do you think IZOD would leave indycar if they are not pleased at all? or stick around and hope for the best?


If they believe it ain't working and they have a Legal out they are gone. Those are big "if"s though.

It all comes down to if they can sell more alligators because of the deal.

[Jag_Warrior]

This does not matter since the biggest race of the year records the lowest ratings ever, down from last year. There were some interesting (read panic) meetings the past few weeks and Izod is not at all pleased. They had expected an increase, of a point or more. That did not happen, and spin mode is in play.

And that folks, is bad news.

This!^

We have to remember that this is the Indy Racing League, not the Texas Racing League or the Barber Motorsports Park Racing League. So with Indy's ratings over the past decade still trending down like Enron's final 12 month stock chart, and with the Indy 500 now getting a TV rating that's just a tad higher than what Long Beach used to get, THAT is the issue that the league is going to have to deal with.

This new fellow at the IRL seems like he has the spirit to get things done. The question is whether or not he can figure out WHAT to do - and if he'll get the support and resources necessary to be effective. It seems that someone at the IRL or IMS would study how the Kentucky Derby completely turned itself around when its situation was very similar to what the IRL is now facing - and maybe hire some of the people who helped get that done! The Derby was recording lower TV viewership year after year, and then they found ways to appeal to (non-hardcore) fans again. It took awhile, but they're now seeing much higher ratings. Did I read that this year's ratings were a record for the Derby? So in the same month that Indy got a record low, the Kentucky Derby got a record high? Somebody can check the numbers, but I thought that's what I read.

The Super Bowl is not seeing near record low TV ratings... neither is the Daytona 500 or the World Series. I don't watch basketball, but I doubt the NBA finals are going to see near record low ratings either. It's nice that the Versus numbers are up, though it seems the devil is in the details with them too. But if they really are up, then that's good. But still, marquee events should not be touching new lows every year, if the overall sport is to ever grow. The IRL is just going to have to admit that it's not the economy, sun spots, BP oil, or anything else. I don't know what it is (or how to fix it). But since it's not affecting other sports in the same way/to the same degree, it is something unique about the IRL that's causing this continued drop off in viewership and interest every year. There's something about the current state of open wheel racing that is still causing people to change the channel... even for the Indy 500.

[anthonyvop]

It seems that someone at the IRL or IMS would study how the Kentucky Derby completely turned itself around when its situation was very similar to what the IRL is now facing - and maybe hire some of the people who helped get that done! The Derby was recording lower TV viewership year after year, and then they found ways to appeal to (non-hardcore) fans again. It took awhile, but they're now seeing much higher ratings. Did I read that this year's ratings were a record for the Derby? So in the same month that Indy got a record low, the Kentucky Derby got a record high? Somebody can check the numbers, but I thought that's what I read.

I am tired of the Kentucky Derby Comparison.
Yes the Derby's ratings have been climbing as of late (Thanks Barbaro) but it has not equated to a growth in Horse racing. In fact parimutuels have been dying out across the land.

The growth in the Derby is a product of shrewd marketing of things that are unique to the event. Alcohol, fashion and gambling. Alcohol in that it is considered a Cocktail party that is "cool" to attend. Fashion in the hats and the label outfits the women at the cocktail wear. Gambling is self explanatory.
The media salivation over Barbaro also brought huge attention to the event. And people like Horses.

Indy has none of those. Aside from the cars and a few drivers Indy has Parades, Tenderloins and Jim Nabors. That is about as cool as a Jr. High-School Dungeons and Dragons club.

[call_me_andrew]

Why is this the first I'm hearing about tenderloins?

[Jag_Warrior]

I am tired of the Kentucky Derby Comparison.
Yes the Derby's ratings have been climbing as of late (Thanks Barbaro) but it has not equated to a growth in Horse racing. In fact parimutuels have been dying out across the land.

The growth in the Derby is a product of shrewd marketing of things that are unique to the event. Alcohol, fashion and gambling. Alcohol in that it is considered a Cocktail party that is "cool" to attend. Fashion in the hats and the label outfits the women at the cocktail wear. Gambling is self explanatory.
The media salivation over Barbaro also brought huge attention to the event. And people like Horses.

Indy has none of those. Aside from the cars and a few drivers Indy has Parades, Tenderloins and Jim Nabors. That is about as cool as a Jr. High-School Dungeons and Dragons club.

You're missing the point. TV viewership for two marquee sporting events had been in decline for years. One has recovered VERY well, draws excellent ratings again and has its mojo back... and one has fallen even further. I would say it does have to do with shrewd marketing on the part of the Triple Crown handlers - and great job by them (proof being in the pudding). Maybe the IRL should try some shrewd marketing (for a change). I would also say that it has to do with personifying (basically) beasts of burden, and telling the "human side" of their story. Whether it was Smarty Jones (my personal favorite from the past few years) or the ill fated Barbaro, people actually identify with the horses (jockeys and owners) more than they do with anyone (besides The Danica) who races an Indy car. That's a very major problem, IMO. Mike Conway broke his back at Indy. Barbaro broke his leg during the Preakness. The American people (really people from all over the world) followed the plight of Barbaro. I doubt you could find five people walking down the street, in any place besides Indianapolis, who could even tell you who Mike Conway is, much less that he suffered leg and back injuries at Indy.

I like horses, but I don't love them. And I've never gotten into the whole horse racing thing (or gambling). But I've been watching the Kentucky Derby since I was a kid. I have an emotional attachment to the race. People used to have that same emotional attachment to Indy. It's getting back that emotional attachment (especially for the non-hardcore racing fans) that Indy and IMS better figure out before things get any worse.

[Lousada]

So what should Randy focus on, the 500 or the series?? Because what is good for the 500 does not have to be good for series. For example having Nascar drivers doing the double will do nothing for the series, perhaps even damage it's credibility.

I still think we will see a Le Mans situation in the near future. A support series that is completely off the radar, with the small teams. And one keystone event where all the big factory teams and guest drivers show up.

[SarahFan]

So what should Randy focus on, the 500 or the series?? .

Randy is the CEO of the Indycar series...not IMS

so i suggest there is your answer

[Jag_Warrior]

So what should Randy focus on, the 500 or the series?? Because what is good for the 500 does not have to be good for series. For example having Nascar drivers doing the double will do nothing for the series, perhaps even damage it's credibility.

I actually think having some (popular!) NASCAR drivers doing the double would help the Indy 500... and the overall series. It would be something of a gimmick move, but still, whatever works. And it would get us part of the way back to the way things used to be, with drivers from different series and disciplines taking part in the Indy 500. Everything possible that can be done, should be done, to get the taste and memory of 25/8 out of peoples' minds. I understand your point about not everything directed at the 500 would benefit the overall series (directly). But by bringing increased attention to Indy, I believe it's more likely that sponsors and fan eyeballs would follow the regualr season races after that.

I actually don't know what sort of power Bernard has as CEO of the IRL. But I'd agree with Ken, that his main focus has to be the overall health of the series. The IMS braintrust has to decide what to do with the Indy 500. And to be honest with you, I don't think the people running IMS right now could effectively sell snow cones on a 90 degree summer day to kids with pockets full of money. We've often discussed how NASCAR got to where it is. And while the IRL (and IMS) have a long way to go before they can even think about that kind of success (again), have they made any first steps to get a west coast or a New York public relations office open... or are they still in "cost containment mode"? I don't know. Outside of this board, I don't follow any IRL or IMS news. But it just seems to me that no one at IMS is ready to embrace what's been said for years: you can cut costs to the bone, but your product MUST retain a level of value that will satisfy existing customers and gain new customers. But I don't know what they should do now. Drop back and punt maybe. I don't know...



I still think we will see a Le Mans situation in the near future. A support series that is completely off the radar, with the small teams. And one keystone event where all the big factory teams and guest drivers show up.

I think we're all but there now... except that at Le Mans they actually do get manufacturer interest. Which is interesting, since the ACO makes the IRL look like sheer geniuses when it comes to rule and decision making. But imagine an Indy 500 where Audi, Peugeot, Porsche and GM/Chevrolet (not allowed to say "Chevy" anymore, I hear) were determined to be represented.

[chuck34]

interesting...

becuase I tend to trust the neilson rating....and figure authors/posters/bloggers/etc get the conversion between hoseholds and viewers etc wrong/confused....



for me if neilson says texas is a .3...... and LB was a .5.......Id suggest LB outperformed texas..... the rest is just spin, statistics and Bull****

I'm counting households Ken, not converting anything. Neilson is the one converting things. All I'm saying is that the number of households is up. That's gotta mean something. I'm sure you don't give a d@mn though. That doesn't fit with your doom and gloom story.

Sure I'd like the share numbers to be up, but I'm not expecting any miracles. It's a long road ahead.

[chuck34]

To drag the point out a bit, let's look at the households numbers a bit more.

Long Beach 09: 388,000 10: 490,000 an increase of 26%
Texas 09: 467,000 10: 518,000 an increase of 11%

Personally I don't give a damn about some "share" number based on how many people are watching TV in total or what-not (especially when were still talking about such low number as to be noise). If I were a sponsor, I'd be interested in the ACTUAL number of TV's turned on to the program. And since that appears to be growing (at least for those two races), then I'd be a bit cautiously optimistic about the future of the series.

[SarahFan]

09' neilsen released a .36
10' neilsen released a .30

the rest is just authors/bloggers/posters/imposters/posers interpretation

[SarahFan]

http://www.indycar.com/news/


*above is the link to the Indaycar.com news page.....if texas was indeed the most watched race ever on VS I would the folks running the show would want to make it known....

like Lousada attempting to portray a .3 as a .45 i suspect the SBJ folks simply got it wrong

[chuck34]

So are you saying that the number of households that have been reported are wrong?

My understanding is that the number of households watching are counted, then the share number is caluculated using some sort of formula based on total number of TVs on at that time, and the number of people who even get the channel, etc.

So even if the "share" is down the actual number of people watching the show could be up. If this is not the case then please explain, and I'll change my mind. But for now, I'll count the number of people watching a show, not the "shares"

[beachbum]

"Figures don't lie, but liars figure" - Mark Twain

Ratings mean something to marketing people, but they often look at the demographics as much as raw numbers. If you are selling Geritol, the raw ratings are meaningless if the numbers come from a kid's show. On the other hand, if your market is teenagers (particularly male), the ratings from the NOPI Nationals on Spike are really important. Since no one seems to have a clue what demographics are represented in the ratings, or what market various companies are trying to target, all of this discussion is pretty meaningless. The numbers are very low, so the audience for a specific demographic can't be large but we don't know if it is large enough for a particular advertiser.

An interesting view on ratings came from an analysis of NASCAR ratings

http://sportsmediawatch.blogspot.com/2010/06/slower-start-for-nascar-on-tnt.html

Ratings have been going down steadily every year, yet the Pocono race was #1 on cable in households, viewers and several key demographics, specifically men 18-49 - NASCAR's primary target group. The markets are getting more and more fragmented and the numbers have to be compared with the current competition for viewers, not what happened years ago.

[SarahFan]

I'm suggesting the sbj folks found a ratings # ...took it and did exactly what hundreds of forums memeber do.... Tweaked it, twisted it.... Played with it

And ultimately got it wrong

[Lousada]

To drag the point out a bit, let's look at the households numbers a bit more.

Long Beach 09: 388,000 10: 490,000 an increase of 26%
Texas 09: 467,000 10: 518,000 an increase of 11%

Personally I don't give a damn about some "share" number based on how many people are watching TV in total or what-not (especially when were still talking about such low number as to be noise). If I were a sponsor, I'd be interested in the ACTUAL number of TV's turned on to the program. And since that appears to be growing (at least for those two races), then I'd be a bit cautiously optimistic about the future of the series.

You're mixing up viewers with households and overnights with finals.

[chuck34]

You're mixing up viewers with households and overnights with finals.

So how many households tuned in to each race? I don't know how they get viewers, since I would think it's an imprecise art to devine how many people are watching each TV. That's why I would think that the number of households should be the most accurate number. But I could be wrong?

I was going off the households numbers that Ken provided on the first page of this thread. But I take it that he now disputes his own numbers?

[SarahFan]

Pay attention chuck...

Go back and reread the htread ..

I was calling bs from the start

[anthonyvop]

We can debate which numbers are which to the end of time but the fact is.....




0.3 is a Horrible rating. Even if you double that rating it still is bad and will never attract serious sponsorship.

[downtowndeco]

You're right man. With the kind of ratings the IRL is getting they will never be able to start 18 cars outside of Indy, they'll be lucky to start 33 at Indy and there is no way, no how that they will ever be able to find a series sponsor.....



0.3 is a Horrible rating. Even if you double that rating it still is bad and will never attract serious sponsorship.

[anthonyvop]

You're right man. With the kind of ratings the IRL is getting they will never be able to start 18 cars outside of Indy, they'll be lucky to start 33 at Indy and there is no way, no how that they will ever be able to find a series sponsor.....

Hahahaha....Sarcasm..........so witty!

i don't know what I was thinking. Indy Cars is the most successful and profitable series on the planet. I hear the Ferrari and McLaren are both checking out Dallaras and soon we will see Hamilton vs. Alonso on the oval in Iowa

[downtowndeco]

Just keep peddling the doom brother, keep peddling....a couple guys here will always be right behind you cheering you on. : )


Hahahaha....Sarcasm..........so witty!

i don't know what I was thinking. Indy Cars is the most successful and profitable series on the planet. I hear the Ferrari and McLaren are both checking out Dallaras and soon we will see Hamilton vs. Alonso on the oval in Iowa

[chuck34]

Pay attention chuck...

Go back and reread the htread ..

I was calling bs from the start

You believe what you want to for everything to be right in you little doom and gloom world.

Now I remember why I steered clear of you ratings threads. I thought that maybe after a year you would be able to have a civil conversation about what's the real numbers etc. But I guess I was wrong. I won't make that mistake again.

[anthonyvop]

Just keep peddling the doom brother, keep peddling....a couple guys here will always be right behind you cheering you on. : )
Peddling doom? I have never done that.

I am expressing Facts.

[anthonyvop]

Sunday's F-1 race on Fox garnered a 0.9 rating.

That is higher than any Indy Car race this year expect the Indy 500!

So now you have a Series with No American Drivers, No American Teams and No American Race Beating the US's "Premier" formula car series.

Something has to be done......FAST!

[SarahFan]

You believe what you want to for everything to be right in you little doom and gloom world.

Now I remember why I steered clear of you ratings threads. I thought that maybe after a year you would be able to have a civil conversation about what's the real numbers etc. But I guess I was wrong. I won't make that mistake again.

come on chuck you took a second swipe at me a few posts back...and I'm the one whose not cival?

and your not smart enough to pay enough attention to the flow of a thread... who said what when etc...

your right.....dont join a discussion if your not going to pay attention

[chuck34]

come on chuck you took a second swipe at me a few posts back...and I'm the one whose not cival?

and your not smart enough to pay enough attention to the flow of a thread... who said what when etc...

your right.....dont join a discussion if your not going to pay attention

That's class. When did I take a swipe at you? Never ment to, if your little feelings got hurt then I'm sorry, or maybe not.

You really can't take anyone questioning anything you do or say can you? You MUST be right all the time. Even your posts can not be questioned. If someone doesn't quite understand EXACTLY what you are saying, then it MUST be THEIR fault because the great and all mighty Ken MUST be right 100% of the time.

Get over yourself. And don't expect any further response from me. I don't like to give attention to people as "classy" as you.

[anthonyvop]

come on chuck you took a second swipe at me a few posts back...and I'm the one whose not cival?

and your not smart enough to pay enough attention to the flow of a thread... who said what when etc...

your right.....dont join a discussion if your not going to pay attention


That's class. When did I take a swipe at you? Never ment to, if your little feelings got hurt then I'm sorry, or maybe not.

You really can't take anyone questioning anything you do or say can you? You MUST be right all the time. Even your posts can not be questioned. If someone doesn't quite understand EXACTLY what you are saying, then it MUST be THEIR fault because the great and all mighty Ken MUST be right 100% of the time.

Get over yourself. And don't expect any further response from me. I don't like to give attention to people as "classy" as you.

Ok Girls...Back on topic.




So. If somebody had told you 3 years ago that F1 would get better ratings on TV than a Indy Car race would you have believed him?

[SarahFan]

Ok Girls...Back on topic.




So. If somebody had told you 3 years ago that F1 would get better ratings on TV than a Indy Car race would you have believed him?

3 years ago.. Maybe

the day they signed with VS.... Ya I would have

[SarahFan]

Rtg (H-holds) Ntwk Race [2009 rtg]

0.4 (411,000) VS Sao Paulo [n/a]
0.6 (???,???) ABC St. Pete rainout show [VS 0.3]
0.4 (310,000) VS Barber [n/a]
0.5 (490,000) VS Long Beach [VS 0.5]
0.7 (???,???) ABC Kansas [VS .15]
3.6 (???,???) ABC Indy 500 [ABC 4.0]
0.3 (518,000) VS Texas [VS .36]

Just so Im clear.....this years texas rating was the lowest rated Versus race this season.... not to mention that it was lower than long beach last year as well as lower than than the texas race last year...

yet it was the most watched race ever on Versus...

color me a little skeptical

what part of the last line did you struggle with Chuck?

[e2mtt]

So. If somebody had told you 3 years ago that F1 would get better ratings on TV than a Indy Car race would you have believed him?

F1 is putting on a heck of a show this year.

[anthonyvop]

F1 is putting on a heck of a show this year.


They put on a heck of a show every year.

[anthonyvop]

Nope. Some years are real snoozers. This year is an exception. Last year also to a certain point because of the competitiveness of Jenson and Rubens.

To each their own.
If anything the later half of 2009 was more exciting than the first 1/2.

[PAcartfan]

Here's how I see the TV ratings improving:

1) Versus and NBC are now under the same tent. Rework the Versus contract to get some non- Indy marquee events on the big channel and schedule them when there's little other competition (like Fox's F1 coverage this past weekend).

2) Keep the Versus announcing booth (with the exception of BJ who I think stinks). Focus on the driver personality angle and start to build relationships with viewers about certain drivers like NASCAR has done.

3) Keep Versus in the fold and help the NHL build the profile by having Comcast advertise on their web site and bills they send home and their Shaq/Ben Stein commercials.

4) Work on getting away as much as possible from ABC/ESPN. Their coverage is horrible. Their announcing team in horrible (although I'd rather listen to Marty than Jerkins). Who on the planet earth wants to here anything out of Eddie Cheever's pie hole ever??? Who??? The ridiculous display at the beginning on the 500 coverage is unforgivable. That stupid, stupid drama about who is a threat to win- featuring Princess Loseagain- left me puking. The coverage of the Conway incident was some of the worst I've ever seen. If I wasn't a die hard, I would never watch this sport again based on the TV coverage that day (I was at the event and ABC in no way portrayed what was going on there).

[Scotty G.]

Sunday's F-1 race on Fox garnered a 0.9 rating.

That is higher than any Indy Car race this year expect the Indy 500!




Damn, what an accomplishment!!!

I mean, there are so many sports out there that can't beat Indy Car in the ratings. I am shocked that F1 could.

A .9 is still a terrible rating. Just shows how unpopular F1 is in America and how few formula car road racing fans there are. Which is why its so puzzling why Indy Car continues to try and make the formula car/road-street racing model work. Its obvious that it ain't gonna work, no matter what network its on, who is the CEO, who is the series sponsor, or what slam-bang marketing guy they hire. Its like selling ice cream in Siberia.

[e2mtt]

Damn, what an accomplishment!!!

I mean, there are so many sports out there that can't beat Indy Car in the ratings. I am shocked that F1 could.

A .9 is still a terrible rating. Just shows how unpopular F1 is in America and how few formula car road racing fans there are. Which is why its so puzzling why Indy Car continues to try and make the formula car/road-street racing model work. Its obvious that it ain't gonna work, no matter what network its on, who is the CEO, who is the series sponsor, or what slam-bang marketing guy they hire. Its like selling ice cream in Siberia.

So you suggest shutting Indycar down? Maybe making the Indy 500 a one-off race, a novelty, raise some money for charity?

[anthonyvop]

Damn, what an accomplishment!!!

I mean, there are so many sports out there that can't beat Indy Car in the ratings. I am shocked that F1 could.

A .9 is still a terrible rating. Just shows how unpopular F1 is in America and how few formula car road racing fans there are. Which is why its so puzzling why Indy Car continues to try and make the formula car/road-street racing model work. Its obvious that it ain't gonna work, no matter what network its on, who is the CEO, who is the series sponsor, or what slam-bang marketing guy they hire. Its like selling ice cream in Siberia.

I'll admit that a .9 is low but if they can pull up to a 1.3 I would orgasmic.

Ratings, when it comes to sponsors isn't just about total numbers.
A .9 for an F1 race is worth more to certain companies than a 3.5 for a NASCAR race.
Did you notice that one of the sponsors for the F1 telecast on Fox was Porsche? They understand that the average buying power of 1 typical F1 fan is equal to 3 typical NASCAR fans.
Look at the ALMS. Why do you think Porsche, BMW, Jaguar, Patron, Audi, various high-end watch brands..ect are involved there and not NASCAR?

One of the problems of Indy Car is they can't make up their minds which demo are they going after. They insist on being a combination road racing/Oval series. They believe they can return to the halcyon days of the 1980's where fans who were starved for any racing on TV would embrace the multi-format series.

Most agree that the oval business model has be rendered a private domain of NASCAR and the #'s don't lie.
Set aside the Indy 500 as that is a separate entity and has never been shown to have it success rub off on the other races of the series.
All of the other Oval events have dismal attendance and TV Numbers. The Road/Street course races aren't much better but if you are a potential sponsor which would you rather be a part of? An oval race with 30K fans and a .4 TV rating or a road course race with the same number of fans and TV rating but with typically twice the average buying power?

Indy Car had better get their a*s in gear. There is another series that will soon be exploding on the scene on a network that is much better than VS. I have seen the network plan and they have full backing.

[e2mtt]

I'll admit that a .9 is low but if they can pull up to a 1.3 I would orgasmic.

Ratings, when it comes to sponsors isn't just about total numbers.
A .9 for an F1 race is worth more to certain companies than a 3.5 for a NASCAR race.
Did you notice that one of the sponsors for the F1 telecast on Fox was Porsche? They understand that the average buying power of 1 typical F1 fan is equal to 3 typical NASCAR fans.
Look at the ALMS. Why do you think Porsche, BMW, Jaguar, Patron, Audi, various high-end watch brands..ect are involved there and not NASCAR?

One of the problems of Indy Car is they can't make up their minds which demo are they going after. They insist on being a combination road racing/Oval series. They believe they can return to the halcyon days of the 1980's where fans who were starved for any racing on TV would embrace the multi-format series.

Most agree that the oval business model has be rendered a private domain of NASCAR and the #'s don't lie.
Set aside the Indy 500 as that is a separate entity and has never been shown to have it success rub off on the other races of the series.
All of the other Oval events have dismal attendance and TV Numbers. The Road/Street course races aren't much better but if you are a potential sponsor which would you rather be a part of? An oval race with 30K fans and a .4 TV rating or a road course race with the same number of fans and TV rating but with typically twice the average buying power?

Good points. It gets even more interesting when you consider the demographic of the event attendance. A road course gets 30K of high-end consumers... a large percentage probably drive a lot of expensive sports cars & spend their money on luxury stuff. 100K in a street course & some like to complain about how they aren't real fans... no but its a bunch of people who may never go to a race at a track, but they like fast cars & and are willing to pay to see a street festival with race cars. Casual fans beat non-fans any day. What kind of demographic goes to Indycar oval races?

I don't watch many Indycar races on TV. Every time I do, I am blown away by how poorly they are televised. Too much time watching the leader drive around while ignoring action mid-pack. Way too much time showing & talking about "name" drivers, rather then drivers that are performing in the current race. Terrible understanding of pit, fuel, & tire strategies. Not nearly enough replays of on-track action, unless its a crash. Not nearly enough attention paid to timing & scoring.

One of my big peeves: too much camera zoom. In F1, a car rarely fills more then a 1/4 of the width of the screen. You can see more of the surrounding track & opponents, & you get a better feel for the handling & the driving lines. On Indycar TV, they tend to zoom in enough to make the car nearly fill the screen. You lose the sense of speed, it is harder to relate the car to the track, and it gives me a headache. It does make the sponsor logos bigger, but that doesn't matter much if the show isn't worth watching.


Indy Car had better get their a*s in gear. There is another series that will soon be exploding on the scene on a network that is much better than VS. I have seen the network plan and they have full backing.

What series would this be? I like being on the leading edge... PM me if you don't want to start a mess on the Indycar forum.

[beachbum]

This is some what off topic, but who watched the F1 from Montreal last weekend? That is how you telecast a race!!! Showing action well back into the pack. Good camera angles. Great commentary. The director did a wonderful job.They used the international feed, which is the same feed F1 uses every week. But it was an entertaining race (I watched). In the past, most F1 races were over at the start and the rest was a parade. But Montreal has always been different.

This year, the key seemed to be the tire degradation as both tire choices went off very quickly. With lap times all over the place, there was a lot of speed differential between cars. Maybe this is the key to good racing. Tires that go off significantly, making tire strategy and the ability to go fast and save tires very important. (even NASCAR figured that one out) The races are not parades and people actually want to watch.

[px400r]

They used the international feed, which is the same feed F1 uses every week. But it was an entertaining race (I watched). In the past, most F1 races were over at the start and the rest was a parade. But Montreal has always been different.

This year, the key seemed to be the tire degradation as both tire choices went off very quickly. With lap times all over the place, there was a lot of speed differential between cars. Maybe this is the key to good racing. Tires that go off significantly, making tire strategy and the ability to go fast and save tires very important. (even NASCAR figured that one out) The races are not parades and people actually want to watch.

The speed differential is the key- whether it's tires, engines, whatever. Different strategies as well (provided it's not about fuel economy).

[e2mtt]

This is some what off topic, but who watched the F1 from Montreal last weekend? That is how you telecast a race!!! Showing action well back into the pack. Good camera angles. Great commentary. The director did a wonderful job.

quite on-topic to the discussion and TV ratings & how to improve them.

YES! Not only was it a very good race, but the telecast was fantastic, for all the reasons you said.

[beachbum]

The speed differential is the key- whether it's tires, engines, whatever. Different strategies as well (provided it's not about fuel economy).But tires are about the only element with a varying speed differential during an event. With equal tires, a Lotus F1 is dreadfully slower than a Red Bull. But a Lotus with fresh tries is probably the equal with a Red Bull with tires that have gone off badly.

Everything else is fixed at the start of the event, especially now with no fuel controls. If my engine has more power than yours, that isn't going to change.

[Scotty G.]

So you suggest shutting Indycar down? Maybe making the Indy 500 a one-off race, a novelty, raise some money for charity?

At this point, it makes a hell of a lot more sense then continuing to stumble along going nowhere.

Blow it all up and start over from scratch.

[Lee Roy]

On Indycar TV, they tend to zoom in enough to make the car nearly fill the screen.

On Indy Car TV broadcasts, don't they zoom in on the car so the people watching on TV won't be able to see the grandstands and notice that they are usually pretty empty? The people watching on TV might wonder if it's worth watching a series that can't draw a decent crowd.

[Scotty G.]

1. One of the problems of Indy Car is they can't make up their minds which demo are they going after.

2. All of the other Oval events have dismal attendance and TV Numbers.


1. That's because they are ignorant. I guess they feel there all of these rabid formula car/road racing fans out there in America. The truth is they aren't out there. Never have been and never will be. America is a oval racing country. By a HUGE margin. Road racing is a European model of racing, that Americans don't watch, don't understand and don't give a damn about. Its like selling soccer in America. Never going to work. It works in other parts of the world. But not here. Just like road racing.

Since all of the owners are road racing/sports car bred, they want to make the series into something they grew up with. Ganassi and Penske both go along with what goes on in NASCAR, because they have no choice. They are outsiders there and understand they wield no power in NASCAR with the powers there. Plus if they want to play in America's #1 racing series, they have to go along with spec cars and almost all ovals. NASCAR understands America's preference for oval racing and understands there are far more fans out there that follow that genre. That's why they are successful and will continue to be successful.

Indy Car has the Indy 500 as their premier race. The rest of their schedule is a mis-match of bad street races, road races and ovals. Using road racing cars with international road racing drivers. They don't know what they want to be or who they could appeal to. Do we appeal to oval racing fans? With euro-centric cars and foreign drivers? Not happening. Do we appeal to road racing fans? With as many street races, that becomes harder to do too. So what do we do? We coin the generic phrase "diversity" and say that is what Indy Car is about. A "diverse" championship. That appeals to nobody in particular (fans and sponsors) and fewer and fewer American drivers give a crap about.

2. Texas gets more folks to show up then any other road/street festival does. Iowa's crowd on Sunday will be more then either Brazil or St. Pete. The truth is, these street parties aren't that well attended. They can flat out lie about their attendance, because its hard to tell where people are. But as Talkin Terry Angstadt so stupidly said, "We'd rather race in front of 20,000 folks in some city then race in front of 50,000 in a 100,000 seat stadium". That is the kind of ass-backward logic our leadership has. Plus its all about "atmosphere" and "scenery" at street races. As long as that is good and we can get our announcers to carry on for 2 hours about how "cool" the weekend has been and how "beautiful" and "festive" things are, then that will take people's minds off the fact that the racing (which is the business we are in) is lame and the majority of folks attending not likely to watch another one of your races the rest of the year.

[garyshell]

I guess they feel there all of these rabid formula car/road racing fans out there in America. The truth is they aren't out there. Never have been and never will be. America is a oval racing country. By a HUGE margin. Road racing is a European model of racing, that Americans don't watch, don't understand and don't give a damn about. Its like selling soccer in America. Never going to work.


Do you have any FACTS to back up your usual bluster? (No, of course not.) If your assertion were true, please explain the popularity and success of AOWR in the 80's and 90's.

Your measure of this "huge margin" could be feasible for two reasons only:

1. There are many more oval tracks in this country, because it is MUCH cheaper to build a local Friday night "bull ring" than a road course. More tracks = more events = more spectators, skewing the numbers.

2. The France Family juggernaut, their whispers in King George's ear, his (tunnel) Vision etc have grown a huge fan base.

But none of this shows if the fans truly like or dislike road racing. It only shows what they have an opportunity to see, no more, no less. If fans are spoon feed a constant diet of oval races, they watch oval races.

Gary

[SarahFan]

America is a oval racing country. By a HUGE margin. .

yet of the four races on VS so far this season ALL three twisties have had higher TV ratings than the oval at Texas....even with the 500 as its lead-in...

go figure

[anthonyvop]

1. That's because they are ignorant. I guess they feel there all of these rabid formula car/road racing fans out there in America. The truth is they aren't out there. Never have been and never will be. America is a oval racing country. By a HUGE margin. Road racing is a European model of racing, that Americans don't watch, don't understand and don't give a damn about. Its like selling soccer in America. Never going to work. It works in other parts of the world. But not here. Just like road racing.

Since all of the owners are road racing/sports car bred, they want to make the series into something they grew up with. Ganassi and Penske both go along with what goes on in NASCAR, because they have no choice. They are outsiders there and understand they wield no power in NASCAR with the powers there. Plus if they want to play in America's #1 racing series, they have to go along with spec cars and almost all ovals. NASCAR understands America's preference for oval racing and understands there are far more fans out there that follow that genre. That's why they are successful and will continue to be successful.

Indy Car has the Indy 500 as their premier race. The rest of their schedule is a mis-match of bad street races, road races and ovals. Using road racing cars with international road racing drivers. They don't know what they want to be or who they could appeal to. Do we appeal to oval racing fans? With euro-centric cars and foreign drivers? Not happening. Do we appeal to road racing fans? With as many street races, that becomes harder to do too. So what do we do? We coin the generic phrase "diversity" and say that is what Indy Car is about. A "diverse" championship. That appeals to nobody in particular (fans and sponsors) and fewer and fewer American drivers give a crap about.

2. Texas gets more folks to show up then any other road/street festival does. Iowa's crowd on Sunday will be more then either Brazil or St. Pete. The truth is, these street parties aren't that well attended. They can flat out lie about their attendance, because its hard to tell where people are. But as Talkin Terry Angstadt so stupidly said, "We'd rather race in front of 20,000 folks in some city then race in front of 50,000 in a 100,000 seat stadium". That is the kind of ass-backward logic our leadership has. Plus its all about "atmosphere" and "scenery" at street races. As long as that is good and we can get our announcers to carry on for 2 hours about how "cool" the weekend has been and how "beautiful" and "festive" things are, then that will take people's minds off the fact that the racing (which is the business we are in) is lame and the majority of folks attending not likely to watch another one of your races the rest of the year.

Scotty,

Either you don't understand or refuse to accept that not all markets are the same. Yes NASCAR gets more spectators and TV numbers and will probably continue to do so but that in no way means that all businesses are interested in it.
As I pointed out many companies have no use for NASCAR but covet the road racing fan.

The real funny thing is that the People who run NASCAR are spending $$$ on their own Road Racing Series as they know the value of the market. They even run 2 NASCAR races on Road Course.

But I guess you know more about the Business of Racing than they do.

[EagleEye]

Here's how I see the TV ratings improving:

1) Versus and NBC are now under the same tent. Rework the Versus contract to get some non- Indy marquee events on the big channel and schedule them when there's little other competition (like Fox's F1 coverage this past weekend).

2) Keep the Versus announcing booth (with the exception of BJ who I think stinks). Focus on the driver personality angle and start to build relationships with viewers about certain drivers like NASCAR has done.

3) Keep Versus in the fold and help the NHL build the profile by having Comcast advertise on their web site and bills they send home and their Shaq/Ben Stein commercials.

4) Work on getting away as much as possible from ABC/ESPN. Their coverage is horrible. Their announcing team in horrible (although I'd rather listen to Marty than Jerkins). Who on the planet earth wants to here anything out of Eddie Cheever's pie hole ever??? Who??? The ridiculous display at the beginning on the 500 coverage is unforgivable. That stupid, stupid drama about who is a threat to win- featuring Princess Loseagain- left me puking. The coverage of the Conway incident was some of the worst I've ever seen. If I wasn't a die hard, I would never watch this sport again based on the TV coverage that day (I was at the event and ABC in no way portrayed what was going on there).

The Indycar races, will not be on NBC unless they buy time. Period, and that is not going to happen any time soon.

As I have said in the past, the ratings are so low, it is a non discussion; NBC is not interested, unless they get paid to air races. The ratings needed to go up significantly, and that has not been the case. The ABC numbers are down right horrible. Izod, the best supporter the sport has had, is on the verge of making it one and done, since the ratings bump that was promised for the 500, did not occur.

[SarahFan]

Izod, the best supporter the sport has had, is on the verge of making it one and done, since the ratings bump that was promised for the 500, did not occur.

can you expand on that....

for example:....how much of that is fact vs. opinion

[anthonyvop]

can you expand on that....

for example:....how much of that is fact vs. opinion


That is the big rumor going around the paddock. It is just a rumor...but two things happening behind the scenes provide credence to the rumor.

#1 IZOD's refusal to continue it's sponsorship of their boy RHR.

#2 ICS talking to other companies about series title sponsorship. I know of 2 companies that have been contacted.
That can mean one of two things. The IZOD title deal is conditional until another big sponsor with a bigger checkbook comes along or that IZOD is out.

it goes without saying that major sponsorship deals comes with conditions attached such as TV ratings and sales. The question is how long is the deal before the conditions kick in. If the ICS signed a deal where a marked improvement was suppose to happen so soon into the sponsorship then somebody messed up big time or desperation was sinking in.

[Jag_Warrior]

The Indycar races, will not be on NBC unless they buy time. Period, and that is not going to happen any time soon.

As I have said in the past, the ratings are so low, it is a non discussion; NBC is not interested, unless they get paid to air races. The ratings needed to go up significantly, and that has not been the case. The ABC numbers are down right horrible. Izod, the best supporter the sport has had, is on the verge of making it one and done, since the ratings bump that was promised for the 500, did not occur.

I'm not sure why there is this assumption that Comcast is going to force NBC to air IRL races once the takeover is complete. I mean, is there a Comcast sponsored IRL car or team out there right now? Is Comcast going to come to Ryan Hunter-Reay or Graham Rahal's rescue... making sure they have rides for the rest of the year? Back in CART's final days, and throughout the (short) life of CCWS, I know we as fans wanted to believe there would be a white knight that would ride in and save the day. Not for money or profit, but just to do something valiant. Never happened. It was never going to happen. That's just not how things work. Just today, Comcast got most of the NBC affiliates onboard. Comcast has agreed NOT to shift certain (popular) sports programming to cable, but instead will leave it on free over-air. Can you imagine how they'd react if Comcast tried to force sports programming on them which gets sub 1 ratings, and whose marquee event has been falling in the ratings for 15 years???!!!

Comcast is in this deal to make money, not to find ways to prop up the IRL and lose money (or make enemies of its affiliates).

[Hoop-98]

Anthony, just a thought. Take a pic of a Stagger Gauge, and make it your Avatar. Roam from forum to forum until someone asks you hey, what's your avatar?

Hang out and enjoy your new friends.

:)

[anthonyvop]

Anthony, just a thought. Take a pic of a Stagger Gauge, and make it your Avatar. Roam from forum to forum until someone asks you hey, what's your avatar?

Hang out and enjoy your new friends.

:)


http://www.bakerprecision.com/images/50840.jpg

So where are my new friends?

[e2mtt]

Hey anthonyvop what's this well funded new race series coming up?

[Hoop-98]

http://www.bakerprecision.com/images/50840.jpg

So where are my new friends?

I think you need to journey into the land of no ovals, no Indy, .....
I'm not much of a soccer fan, but i see no reason to go to Soccer Forums and illuminate them to that fact...

rh

[PAcartfan]

I'm not sure why there is this assumption that Comcast is going to force NBC to air IRL races once the takeover is complete. I mean, is there a Comcast sponsored IRL car or team out there right now? Is Comcast going to come to Ryan Hunter-Reay or Graham Rahal's rescue... making sure they have rides for the rest of the year? Back in CART's final days, and throughout the (short) life of CCWS, I know we as fans wanted to believe there would be a white knight that would ride in and save the day. Not for money or profit, but just to do something valiant. Never happened. It was never going to happen. That's just not how things work. Just today, Comcast got most of the NBC affiliates onboard. Comcast has agreed NOT to shift certain (popular) sports programming to cable, but instead will leave it on free over-air. Can you imagine how they'd react if Comcast tried to force sports programming on them which gets sub 1 ratings, and whose marquee event has been falling in the ratings for 15 years???!!!

Comcast is in this deal to make money, not to find ways to prop up the IRL and lose money (or make enemies of its affiliates).

Points well taken, however doesn't Comcast benefit financially if it's programming- specifically sports programming- becomes more popular, thus attracting more advertising dollars? Moving a race or two to NBC- perhaps even into a special Friday night prime time slot or something creative like that- could ultimately benefit everyone in the long run. I say Friday night because it's a relative graveyard for ratings on original scripted programming. Putting a live sporting event on perhaps could generate the same- if not better ad dollar- than an block of repeats sometime during the summer. The event would certainly do better than the 0.-whatever's that a Sunday race gets on Versus.

[Jag_Warrior]

Points well taken, however doesn't Comcast benefit financially if it's programming- specifically sports programming- becomes more popular, thus attracting more advertising dollars? Moving a race or two to NBC- perhaps even into a special Friday night prime time slot or something creative like that- could ultimately benefit everyone in the long run. I say Friday night because it's a relative graveyard for ratings on original scripted programming. Putting a live sporting event on perhaps could generate the same- if not better ad dollar- than an block of repeats sometime during the summer. The event would certainly do better than the 0.-whatever's that a Sunday race gets on Versus.

Believe me, I wasn't taking a swipe at your post or your point of view. But when the IRL was looking for a new broadcast partner, ABC came out and said that the only race that they made money on was Indy (and that was back when Indy's ratings were about 30% higher than they are now). The broadcast networks make money either by selling time (ALMS, NHRA, CCWS, etc.) or by luring sponsors with high ratings (Lost, Dancing with the Idiots, etc.).

What you're suggesting would be good for the IRL (just as similar suggestions would have been good for CART or CCWS). But given the state of the current and past ratings, I just don't see it happening. Doesn't mean it won't. I just think that outside of a time buy, the IRL doesn't have enough sponsors that would buy commercials (or could attract enough eyeballs to bring in outside sponsors) to make it economically viable or realistic from the standpoint of the affiliates. But who knows?

[anthonyvop]

Hey anthonyvop what's this well funded new race series coming up?

You would be surprised.

[e2mtt]

You would be surprised. When will it start? What kind of cars? Where will it be televised... what should I search for on the web?

(I'm not being sarcastic or ironic, I'm genuinely curious. PM me if you want.)

[EagleEye]

can you expand on that....

for example:....how much of that is fact vs. opinion

The worst case scenario for the ratings, was if there was rain and the race delayed or postponed. No one predicted that ratings would go down, and a bump of 30% or more was and seemed a reasonable target.

When that did not happen and the ratings came out (and were the worst, ever) there was an unscheduled meeting between Izod and Indycar. Any planes for RHR were dropped, and discussions turned to how to move forward, if at all, in 2011.

Izod, and Indycar officials fully expected an increase, not a decrease in ratings from the series premier event. This decrease hurt in more ways than most of you know. In addition to Izod, you might just start to notice more rumors about teams loosing sponsorship $$. The thinking was that things culd not get any worse...the reality is that it did get worse, and how low will it go. Izod will not ride on a loosing horse....

IF Izod comes back, then I would vote for RB for President of the US (Though given the dunce now in office, I would vote for a fig...). What I hear is they should be back in 2011 but the series is bracing and preparing for the worse. If they can keep them onboard for 2012, and pick up some engine mfgrs, that would be good. If not, look for re-worked Dallara's for a few more years.

How many cars were at the first race? How many cars were at the last race? How many will be at the next race? Is the trend going up, or down?

Also, does anyone else notice the new venues being added and how Champcar did the same? Adding new venues is a quick way to add a few million to the series bottom line, but does little in the way of getting money to the teams. Champcar added several new venues here and abroad, before going away. Desperate times.

TV Ratings = Sponsors = $$ = Teams = Cars = Drivers

If the first part of this goes down, the rest go down too.

[e2mtt]

ouch

[Wilf]

That is the big rumor going around the paddock. It is just a rumor...but two things happening behind the scenes provide credence to the rumor.

#1 IZOD's refusal to continue it's sponsorship of their boy RHR.

#2 ICS talking to other companies about series title sponsorship. I know of 2 companies that have been contacted.
That can mean one of two things. The IZOD title deal is conditional until another big sponsor with a bigger checkbook comes along or that IZOD is out.

it goes without saying that major sponsorship deals comes with conditions attached such as TV ratings and sales. The question is how long is the deal before the conditions kick in. If the ICS signed a deal where a marked improvement was suppose to happen so soon into the sponsorship then somebody messed up big time or desperation was sinking in.

There's another rumor running around SI.com on June 23:
"Izod is in the first year of a six-year contract and is intent on making celebrities chic again at IndyCar events. During race week in Indy, the clothing company held a series of parties with stars ranging from NFL Hall of Famers Anthony Munoz and Paul Krause to Hollywood types such as Mark Wahlberg, Adrian Grenier and the Kardashian sisters.


And Kelly insists his company is around for the long haul."


But then again, it's just a rumor.
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/racing/wires/06/24/3010.ap.car.irl.marketing.strategy.adv26.1231/#ixzz0rpMtJZcc

[SarahFan]

There's another rumor running around SI.com on June 23:
"Izod is in the first year of a six-year contract and is intent on making celebrities chic again at IndyCar events. During race week in Indy, the clothing company held a series of parties with stars ranging from NFL Hall of Famers Anthony Munoz and Paul Krause to Hollywood types such as Mark Wahlberg, Adrian Grenier and the Kardashian sisters.


And Kelly insists his company is around for the long haul."


But then again, it's just a rumor.
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/racing/wires/06/24/3010.ap.car.irl.marketing.strategy.adv26.1231/#ixzz0rpMtJZcc

toyota insisted they were in for the long haul right up until they PAID to not be involved......

just sayin

[Mark in Oshawa]

Hey...IZOD is there...until they say they are not. Til then, take them at their word.....