Lars Vilks gets the muslim free speech treatment

[Eki]

And the point of this is what? To prove that democracy works?


It proves it doesn't work. They imported voters from abroad who in turn voted an imported President into power. It's a clever way to do an invasion. If enough Americans emigrated to Iraq and got the voting right, they could vote George W Bush for the President of Iraq. Furthermore, many Israelis have a dual citizenship, for example Israeli and the US citizenships. They can vote both in Israel and in the US, and improve the odds that the US remains on the Israeli side.

[Eki]

Of course, the rest of the Arabic states kicked them OUT, once the nation state of Israel was formed. Where else do you expect them to go?
How about the US? They seem to love them. And Russia, Poland, the US, etc. didn't kick them out, they left on their own initiative. And Jews from the Arabic countries are a small fraction of all Jews in Israel.

[Rani]

How about the US? They seem to love them. And Russia, Poland, the US, etc. didn't kick them out, they left on their own initiative. And Jews from the Arabic countries are a small fraction of all Jews in Israel.
A lot of countries gave jews up to the nazis for slaughter (Finland did as well). Why should I trust those countries with my life if I know that at the moment of truth I won't be defended?
No thanks I'll stay here and help all jews who want to come settle in.


Resurrecting dead languages is artificial like Dr Frankenstein resurrecting his monster.

I don't think there's any more reason to resurrect Hebrew than to resurrect Old English/Anglo-Saxon.

I understand from this that you think taking land controlled by other nations for very long periods of time and then changing their name artificial. Correct?
I also understand you think using a language which is not commonplace in an official manner "artificial like Dr Frankenstein resurrecting his monster".

[Daniel]

Not wanting to sound anti-semitic but you need to look at why the Jews were singled out by Hitler for that treatment. Nothing ever justifies what happened of course but that's a moot point when millions are dead.

On a similar not 9/11 and 7/7 can't be justified but the reasons for those attacks are clear as day.

[Rollo]

And Jews from the Arabic countries are a small fraction of all Jews in Israel.

Almost two thirds is a "small fraction"? What then is a big fraction?


3,136,436 people, or about 61% of Israel's Jewish population.


And Russia, Poland, the US, etc. didn't kick them out, they left on their own initiative.

Of course, Dachau, Belsen and Babi Yar were holiday fun camps, weren't they? Kristallnacht was a nightclub?


you need to look at why the Jews were singled out by Hitler for that treatment.

Untermensch - yeah, totally justified.

[Daniel]

I never said it was justified at all ffs.

[Easy Drifter]

Dual citizenship is quite common in many countries. There are thousands of Cdns. with dual citizenships from many countries.
I actually hold dual citizenship although I consider myself Cdn. and have no interest in living in the other country. I haven't even been their since 75 and that was a racing business trip.

[Eki]

Dual citizenship is quite common in many countries. There are thousands of Cdns. with dual citizenships from many countries.

Could be, but many of them don't even vote in their country of residence, let alone in the other country. I've read that Israelis of American origin are very motivated to vote and do vote both in Israel and in the US. The US aids Israel both economically and militarily, so living in Israel and voting in the US is like granting aid to yourself. Anyway, the countries are irrelevant. I think it's wrong that some can vote in two countries and some can not. I think that when you take a new citizenship, you should lose your old. It used to be like that in Finland. When a Finn took a citizenship of another country, he/she lost his/her Finnish citizenship. Recently also Finland has offered a possibility of a dual citizenship and even an opportunity for former Finns to get back their citizenship.

[Bob Riebe]

It is amazing how a thread about muslims attacking journalists and artists has turned into a Israel has no right to exist.

Hatred for the Jews, is so great, muslims can murder whom ever they choose but by some asinine logic, it always gets back to Jew bashing.

[Camelopard]

One of the advantages of israeli/australian dual nationality is that it makes it much easier for mossad to commit murder.......

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/24/2907598.htm

[Tazio]

I never said it was justified at all ffs.
In fact you said "nothing ever justifies (it)" I understand your point exactly,
especially in regard to 9/11.
None are as blind as those who will not see.
BTW I condemn the attacks of 9/11, and 7/7.

[Rani]

I understand from this that you think taking land controlled by other nations for very long periods of time and then changing its name artificial. Correct?
I also understand you think using a language which is not commonplace in an official manner "artificial like Dr Frankenstein resurrecting his monster".

Eki, does your answer to this go simething like this:
"yes, but only if the land is Israel and the language is hebrew"?

[Eki]

One of the advantages of israeli/australian dual nationality is that it makes it much easier for mossad to commit murder.......

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/24/2907598.htm

This was funny:


Deputy Opposition Leader Julie Bishop says the Government has over-reacted.
"There is no actual proof that the Israeli government was involved - there is an assumption," she said.

There wasn't actual proof that there were Hezbollah fighters in the base of international military observer base in Lebanon, but it didn't stop Israel from hitting it and killing four international military observers. There also wasn't actual proof that there were Hamas fighters in the maternity clinic in Gaza built by the Finnish Lutheran Church, but it didn't stop Israel from destroying it. There also isn't actual proof that Iran and North Korea are developing nuclear weapons, but it doesn't stop other countries from putting sanctions on them.

[Eki]

Eki, does your answer to this go simething like this:
"yes, but only if the land is Israel and the language is hebrew"?
No, but you just said that Hebrew is the only language that has been resurrected. I said that even Vatican could give up Latin, which is another dead language, for all I care. I also said there is no need for example to resurrect Old English/Anglo-Saxon.

And what becomes to old names, I don't for example think that there's a need to resurrect the Scottish Independence or return it to the Romans and call Scotland Caledonia.

[Rani]

No, but you just said that Hebrew is the only language that has been resurrected. I said that even Vatican could give up Latin, which is another dead language, for all I care. I also said there is no need for example to resurrect Old English/Anglo-Saxon.

And what becomes to old names, I don't for example think that there's a need to resurrect the Scottish Independence or return it to the Romans and call Scotland Caledonia.
By the same logic, Finland should still be a part of Sweden or Russia (like it was until 1917), doesn't it ?

Your ancestors should have never started using finnish then and should have stuck to using swedish as the formal language. Finnish in the russian times was only used in somewhat rustic circumstances.

If you are a serious person of deeds and not a talker, you should go with your ideology and opinions. I expect you insist on speaking swedish and demand your government to strip Finland of its independance, since no nation which hasn't already received independance deserves a country in modern times. How is Finland different from Israel in that respect.

BTW Israel was ressurected as a jewish country with roots that go back thousands of years, while Finland was only conceived as a finnish country in 1917.

[Easy Drifter]

I guess the fact that North Korea has test detonated nuclear weapons is not proof they are developing them.

[Eki]

By the same logic, Finland should still be a part of Sweden or Russia (like it was until 1917), doesn't it ?
If Scotland should still be a part of the Roman Empire and called Caledonia. If we go back to biblical times, there should probably be different tribes (Germanic, Baltic, Finnic and Saami) in the area of current Finland and no nation state.


Your ancestors should have never started using finnish then and should have stuck to using swedish as the formal language. Finnish in the russian times was only used in somewhat rustic circumstances.

If you are a serious person of deeds and not a talker, you should go with your ideology and opinions. I expect you insist on speaking swedish and demand your government to strip Finland of its independance, since no nation which hasn't already received independance deserves a country in modern times. How is Finland different from Israel in that respect.

According to the Finnish constitution, Swedish is still a National Language of Finland, just like Finnish. Every Finnish speaker are required to study Swedish at school and every civil servant must have at least basic skills in Swedish. Is Arabic a National Language of Israel or are Israeli civil servants required to speak some Arabic?

http://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/kaannokset/1999/en19990731.pdf


Section 17 - Right to one's language and culture

The national languages of Finland are Finnish and Swedish.
The right of everyone to use his or her own language, either Finnish or Swedish, before courts of law and other authorities, and to receive official documents in that language, shall be guaranteed by an Act. The public
authorities shall provide for the cultural and societal needs of the Finnish-speaking and Swedish-speaking populations of the country on an equal basis.
The Sami, as an indigenous people, as well as the Roma and other groups, have the right to maintain and develop their own language and culture. Provisions on the right of the Sami to use the Sami language before the
authorities are laid down by an Act. The rights of persons using sign language and of persons in need of interpretation or translation aid owing to disability shall be guaranteed by an Act.




BTW Israel was ressurected as a jewish country with roots that go back thousands of years, while Finland was only conceived as a finnish country in 1917.
We never used Bible or past wrong-doings of others to excuse our existence.

[Eki]

I guess the fact that North Korea has test detonated nuclear weapons is not proof they are developing them.
If they have, and it wasn't just an equivalent amount of TNT, it only proves they have been developing them, not that they still are. The alleged nuclear detonation was only detected by seismographs outside North Korea. Or maybe they blew up the only nuclear weapon they have ever developed.

[harsha]

I have not seen another religion in the world cause so many problems...Islam is more trouble than it's worth....a religion that rewards people with virgins if they commit murder in the name of is not worth following imo...but too many stupid people around

[Rani]

If Scotland should still be a part of the Roman Empire and called Caledonia. If we go back to biblical times, there should probably be different tribes (Germanic, Baltic, Finnic and Saami) in the area of current Finland and no nation state.

I see. So now you are putting a time limit on claims to land. Because Finland is relatively new than it's ok but for nations that are older its not. I thought you were against discrimination or was that except for when it's based on age?

As usual you're starting to twist your philosophy as dictated by your prejudiced opinions...




We never used Bible or past wrong-doings of others to excuse our existence.
That's only because there aren't many idiots who question your existence as there are who question Israel's. Only a matter of chance.

BTW I never said jews deserve a country because the bible said so or because of WW2. We deserve it because we lived here, plain and simple. Proof for this goes way beyond the bible.

[Eki]

I see. So now you are putting a time limit on claims to land. Because Finland is relatively new than it's ok but for nations that are older its not.
Finland is 30 years older than Israel.

[Rani]

Finland is 30 years older than Israel.
Eki,
'NATION' and 'COUNTRY' are not the same word.

[harsha]

ever try banging your head against a brick wall people :)

[Eki]

I have not seen another religion in the world cause so many problems...
They haven't created the problems alone. It takes two to tango.

[harsha]

9-11 / 7-7 / 26-11 and untold terrorist attacks were started by ???????

[Eki]

9-11 / 7-7 / 26-11 and untold terrorist attacks were started by ???????
What happened before them?????? What motivated them?????? And don't give me that usual crap about virgins, paradise and spreading Islam.

Churchill had a clue, but Americans made their best to silence him:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill


In January 2005, Churchill's work attracted publicity because of the widespread circulation of a 2001 essay, "On the Justice of Roosting Chickens". In the essay, he claimed that the September 11, 2001 attacks were a natural and unavoidable consequence of what he views as unlawful US policy, and he referred to the "technocratic corps" working in the World Trade Center as "little Eichmanns".[1]

[harsha]

What happened before them?????? What motivated them?????? And don't give me that usual crap about virgins, paradise and spreading Islam.

what motivated the terrorists who attacked Mumbai?...you seem to know the inside mind about how a Muslim radical terrorist works , so please enlighten me as to why they feel the need to take lives of innocent people?

[Rani]

Is Arabic a National Language of Israel .
Yes.



Finland is 30 years older than Israel.
Last time I checked 'Nation' and 'Country' weren't the same word.

If this isn't the case anymore I take all I posted back. Were the definitions changed lately?

[Eki]

Yes.


Last time I checked 'Nation' and 'Country' weren't the same word.

If this isn't the case anymore I take all I posted back. Were the definitions changed lately?
Ask Chuck. He says Palestine doesn't have the right to exist, because it has never been a country.

[Bob Riebe]

Ask Chuck. He says Palestine doesn't have the right to exist, because it has never been a country.
Tell them to take back Jordan. http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/icons/tongue-anim.gif

[chuck34]

Ask Chuck. He says Palestine doesn't have the right to exist, because it has never been a country.

No Eki, as usual you completely miss the point, and don't understand what I've said.

[Rani]

Tell them to take back Jordan. http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/icons/tongue-anim.gif
Funny you should say that. Listen to what the head of the jordanian senate said today:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3894726,00.html



In a ceremony commemorating Jordan's independence day, Taher al-Masri, head of the country's senate, spoke of the "state of two united banks", London-based al-Quds al-Arabi reported on Wednesday.

This is a rare and surprising statement, which may be interpreted as granting legitimization to the viewpoint that the Palestinian residents of the West Bank are part of the Hashemite Kingdom.


Speaking before an audience of some 1,000 people, including the royal family and Kind Abdullah II, al-Masri spoke of "the two united banks, with the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan emerging on both banks of the holy river."

[Camelopard]

........... too many stupid people around

IMO this applies to all religions....... too many people can't think for themselves and need a crutch.

[Eki]

what motivated the terrorists who attacked Mumbai?...you seem to know the inside mind about how a Muslim radical terrorist works , so please enlighten me as to why they feel the need to take lives of innocent people?
I thought the Mumbai attacks were motivated by the dispute that Pakistan and India have over Jammu and Kashmir.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jammu_and_Kashmir#Politics_and_government

[Eki]

He has no problem with dictators, thugs and villians, because he wastes no time condemning THEIR actions while going to great length's to attacking leaders of Western states because they are not of his political stripe.

Public blatant dictators, thugs and villians have enough people condemning them. You don't need me. Instead I like to raise questions about the covert, maybe smaller, dictators, thugs and villians that usually go unnoticed by many.

[Eki]

A lot of countries gave jews up to the nazis for slaughter (Finland did as well).
You can say that as many times as you like, but it doesn't make my conscious guilty. I wasn't even born back then. We shouldn't be judged by the sins of our ancestors and neither should we inherit their land if we or they left it.

[Easy Drifter]

Eki do you support Churchill's theories and feel it is right to kill thousands of innocent people just because some Islamists believed the US Govt.policy was illegal?
The only acceptable answers to the question are yes or no.

Note I am not agreeing the US policy was wrong.

[Rollo]

neither should we inherit their land if we or they left it.

What happens if someone gives you land back again?

[anthonyvop]

Instead I like to raise questions about the covert, maybe smaller, dictators, thugs and villians that usually go unnoticed by many.
Like the Current government of Finland?

[Daniel]

Like the Current government of Finland?
Explain why Finland is such a hotbed of all things unholy? When I was there I didn't see anything untoward.

[Rollo]

Must be all of that Pony Trekking and Camping, or just Watching TV.

[anthonyvop]

Explain why Finland is such a hotbed of all things unholy? When I was there I didn't see anything untoward.


Finland has seriously restricted speech.

[harsha]

I thought the Mumbai attacks were motivated by the dispute that Pakistan and India have over Jammu and Kashmir.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jammu_and_Kashmir#Politics_and_government
seeing that you quote Wiki so much...btw Wiki - Eki ??? coincidence???

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lashkar-e-Toiba

"Their professed goal is not limited to challenging India's sovereignty over Jammu and Kashmir. They aims include establishing an Islamic state in South Asia and uniting all Muslim-majority regions in countries that surround Pakistan to raise jihad against all non-Muslim communities"

"Their professed goal is not limited to challenging India's sovereignty over Jammu and Kashmir. They aims include establishing an Islamic state in South Asia and uniting all Muslim-majority regions in countries that surround Pakistan to raise jihad against all non-Muslim communities"

[Eki]

What happens if someone gives you land back again?
You don't have to take it back. If Russia gave Karelia back to Finland, I'd say it is a bad idea to take it back. Either we'd have to relocate the Russians living there currently, which would be morally wrong if they don't want to leave or we should bring its people and infrastructure to the standards of those in Finland, which would be very expensive and would be morally wrong towards those who don't want to become Finnish citizens or residents of Finland. Maybe some sort of compromise between the two options could be possible to solve the moral problems, but it would still be expensive.

[Rollo]

You don't have to take it back.

After having faced genocide and persecution? Sorry, but you have just invoked the Chewbacca Defence.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/08/0330chewbacca.jpg

[Eki]

After having faced genocide and persecution? Sorry, but you have just invoked the Chewbacca Defence.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/08/0330chewbacca.jpg
You make it sound that they moved to a ready made paradise without any objections and worries. Reading this makes me think it would have been easier for them to stay in the postwar Germany:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel#Independence_and_first_years


After 1945, Britain found itself in fierce conflict with the Jewish community, as the Haganah joined Irgun and Lehi in armed struggle against British rule.[65] At the same time, thousands of Jewish refugees from Europe sought shelter in Palestine and were turned away or rounded up and placed in detention camps by the British. In 1947, the British government withdrew from the Mandate of Palestine, stating it was unable to arrive at a solution acceptable to both Arabs and Jews.[66] The newly created United Nations approved the Partition Plan for Palestine (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181) on November 29, 1947, which sought to divide the country into two states—one Arab and one Jewish. Jerusalem was to be designated an international city—a corpus separatum—administered by the UN.[67]
The Jewish community accepted the plan,[68] but the Arab League and Arab Higher Committee rejected it.[69] On December 1, 1947, the Arab Higher Committee proclaimed a three-day strike, and Arab bands began attacking Jewish targets.[70] Jews were initially on the defensive as civil war broke out, but they gradually moved onto the offensive.[71] The Palestinian Arab economy collapsed and 250,000 Palestinian-Arabs fled or were expelled.[72]


David Ben-Gurion proclaiming Israeli independence on May 14, 1948, below a portrait of Theodor Herzl
On May 14, 1948, the day before the expiration of the British Mandate, the Jewish Agency proclaimed independence, naming the country Israel.[73] The following day, the armies of five Arab countries—Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Iraq—attacked Israel, launching the 1948 Arab–Israeli War;[74] Saudi Arabia sent a military contingent to operate under Egyptian command; Yemen declared war but did not take military action.[75] After a year of fighting, a ceasefire was declared and temporary borders, known as the Green Line, were established.[76] Jordan annexed what became known as the West Bank and East Jerusalem, and Egypt took control of the Gaza Strip. Meanwhile, Israel was accepted as a member of the United Nations by majority vote on May 11, 1949.[77] According to UN estimates, 711,000 Arabs, or about 80% of the initial Arab population of the area that became Israel, were expelled or fled the country during the conflict.[78] The fate of these Palestinian refugees remains a major point of contention in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.[79][80]
In the early years of the state, the Labor Zionist movement led by Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion dominated Israeli politics.[81][82] These years were marked by an influx of Holocaust survivors and Jews from Arab lands, many of whom faced persecution in their original countries.[83] Consequently, the population of Israel rose from 800,000 to two million between 1948 and 1958.[84] Most arrived as refugees with no possessions and were housed in temporary camps known as ma'abarot; by 1952, over 200,000 immigrants were living in these tent cities.[85] The need to solve the crisis led Ben-Gurion to sign a reparations agreement with West Germany that triggered mass protests by Jews angered at the idea of Israel accepting financial compensation from Germany for the Holocaust.[86]
In the 1950s, Israel was frequently attacked by Palestinian fedayeen, mainly from the Egyptian-occupied Gaza Strip.[87] In 1956, Israel joined a secret alliance with Great Britain and France aimed at regaining control of the Suez Canal, which the Egyptians had nationalized (see the Suez Crisis). Israel captured the Sinai Peninsula but was pressured to withdraw by the United States and the Soviet Union in return for guarantees of Israeli shipping rights in the Red Sea and the Canal.[88][89]
In the early 1960s, Israel captured Nazi war criminal Adolf Eichmann, an architect of the Final Solution, in Argentina and brought him to trial.[90] The trial had a major impact on public awareness of the Holocaust,[91] and Eichmann remains the only person ever to be executed by order of an Israeli court.[92]

[Easy Drifter]

Eki you haven't answered my question, post 285.

[Eki]

Eki you haven't answered my question, post 285.

Eki do you support Churchill's theories and feel it is right to kill thousands of innocent people just because some Islamists believed the US Govt.policy was illegal?
The only acceptable answers to the question are yes or no.

Note I am not agreeing the US policy was wrong.
No, I don't feel it's right to kill, but I understand that it might make some people to kill. I also don't feel that the US should have the right to do everything they do around the world just because they can and no one can stop them.

Yes, I do think Churchill understood the reasons why 9/11 attacks happened (they did happen regardless if they were right or wrong).

[markabilly]

it has become increasingly appearant that wki-eki is not a finn....he is a troll from an english speaking nation....just look at his writing and obviously spends too much time watching american TV

[Eki]

it has become increasingly appearant that wki-eki is not a finn....he is a troll from an english speaking nation....just look at his writing and obviously spends too much time watching american TV
Finnish TV is full of American programs and news about the US.

[Tazio]

Here is a time line leading up to the rather lengthy quote by Eki from wiki.
I saw a show on "The History Chanel" a long time ago, about how a Jewish unit of the British Military made a complete copy of themselves and were responsible for a large part of the relocation at (or near) the end of WW2 against the orders of the Brits as they feared a conflict with the natives. I believe it was lead by "Old One Eye" but I could be wrong on that one. I'll look for a link!
This story to be continued!

3000BC -- Canaanites inhabit Palestine

1125BC -- Israelites conquer the Canaanites

1050BC -- Philistines conquer Israelites.

1000BC -- Under King David, Israelites conquer Philistines and establish the nation of Israel. After his son, King Solomon dies, Israel becomes divided: the north becoming Israel and the south becoming Judah.

722BC -- Israel falls to Assyria

586BC -- Babylon captures Judah -- This defeat resulted in the destruction of Jerusalem and the exile of most of the Jews to Babylon -- the so-called Babylonian captivity.

539BC -- Under Cyrus the Great, the Persians conquered Babylonia. The Jews were allowed to return to Judaea, a district in Palestine.

333BC -- Alexander the Great captures Palestine. His successors -- the Egyptian Ptolemies and the Syrian Seleucids -- tried without success to force Greek culture and religion on the people.

141-63BC -- The Jews revolted and established an independent state. This lasted until Pompey the Great conquered Palestine for Rome and made it a province of the Roman Empire ruled by Jewish kings. Rome ruled Palestine for about 700 years.

638AD -- Palestine is invaded by Muslim Arab armies that capture Jerusalem. Thus begins 1300 years of Muslim presence in what becomes known as Filastin.

1517 -- The Mamelukes are defeated by the Ottomans, who rule Palestine for the next four hundred years -- until the winter of 1917-18.

1880s -- With the rise of anti-Semitism in Europe, Jews begin to migrate to Palestine.

1917-18 -- The British takes Palestine from the Ottomans at the end of World War I.

1917 -- Britain creates Balfour Declaration that outlines conditions to create a "national home" for Jews in Palestine. With this declaration, Britain hoped to gain the support of the Jews for the Allied cause in World War I.

July 24 1922 -- The declaration was incorporated into the League of Nations mandate for Palestine. It outlines the terms under which Britain was given responsibility for temporary administration of the country. The mandate lasted from 1922-1948.

1935 -- Over 60,000 Jews come into Palestine.

1936 -- Because of a fear of Jewish domination, an Arab revolt broke out. This continues on and off until 1939.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/662005/posts

[Tazio]

Finnish TV is full of American programs and news about the US.I may have the wrong country in mind, but don't you have like a huge naked party,
complete with parade and other revelry to welcome in spring.
Or is that Norway?
Can't be too much wrong with a country that promotes something like that IMO!
We are a little too puritanical to embrace something that fun! :p

[Eki]

I may have the wrong country in mind, but don't you have like a huge naked party,
complete with parade and other revelry to welcome in spring.
Or is that Norway?
Can't be too much wrong with a country that promotes something like that IMO!
We are a little too puritanical to embrace something that fun! :p
No, we usually don't have huge naked parties. There's a party on 1st of May to welcome spring, but most people have their clothes on in public places even then.

On 1st of May, university freshmen are dipped in cold water for example, but not much nudity:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0e/20070501_022.JPG/800px-20070501_022.JPG

[Tazio]

No, we usually don't have huge naked parties. There's a party on 1st of May to welcome spring, but most people have their clothes on in public places even then.

That is disappointing :(

[Rollo]

You make it sound that they moved to a ready made paradise without any objections and worries.

When? I don't believe I asserted that - If I did... LINK PLEASE :D

Also, contained within that lovely wiki document you posted contains, the flaw to your theory in post #27.

[Eki]

When? I don't believe I asserted that - If I did... LINK PLEASE :D

Also, contained within that lovely wiki document you posted contains, the flaw to your theory in post #27.
You said they were given their land back. To me it seems that they weren't given, but they TOOK it back using armed forced, or terrorism as some might say:


After 1945, Britain found itself in fierce conflict with the Jewish community, as the Haganah joined Irgun and Lehi in armed struggle against British rule.[65] At the same time, thousands of Jewish refugees from Europe sought shelter in Palestine and were turned away or rounded up and placed in detention camps by the British. In 1947, the British government withdrew from the Mandate of Palestine, stating it was unable to arrive at a solution acceptable to both Arabs and Jews.

[Rollo]

And the very next line from your post is:
The newly created United Nations approved the Partition Plan for Palestine (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181)
Here that is:
http://www.undemocracy.com/A-RES-181%28II%29.pdf

Thank you and Checkmate.

Not only given the land, but with the full force of the UN no less, and in agreement with the Balfour Declaration in 1917, and the British Mandate for Palestine:
by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people,

[Mark in Oshawa]

And the very next line from your post is:
The newly created United Nations approved the Partition Plan for Palestine (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181)
Here that is:
http://www.undemocracy.com/A-RES-181%28II%29.pdf

Thank you and Checkmate.

Not only given the land, but with the full force of the UN no less, and in agreement with the Balfour Declaration in 1917, and the British Mandate for Palestine:
by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people,
As I said on another thread, don't let the law, facts and the history of the UN's resolutions get in the way of a good Eki Rant. I suspect a hijack of thread onto another tack is coming from the pugnacious but rather wandering mind of Eki, every dictator's favourite useful troll...

[markabilly]

it has become increasingly appearant that wki-eki is not a finn....he is a troll from an english speaking nation....just look at his writing and obviously spends too much time watching american TV


Finnish TV is full of American programs and news about the US.
Bingo...just blew your cover, troll....tell us all how is the job at taco bell going

[Eki]

And the very next line from your post is:
The newly created United Nations approved the Partition Plan for Palestine (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181)
Here that is:
http://www.undemocracy.com/A-RES-181%28II%29.pdf

Thank you and Checkmate.

Not only given the land, but with the full force of the UN no less, and in agreement with the Balfour Declaration in 1917, and the British Mandate for Palestine:
by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people,
I'm sure the Palestinians have not fired enough rockets and thrown enough rocks, because the UN has not given their land back. The UN showed that terrorism works when it gave Israel to the Jews.

[Rollo]

I'm sure the Palestinians have not fired enough rockets and thrown enough rocks, because the UN has not given their land back. The UN showed that terrorism works when it gave Israel to the Jews.

When was it ever theirs, pray tell?

Before 1923? No, it was owned by the Ottoman Empire
Between 1923 and 1948? No, it was owned by Britain as the British Mandate
After 1948? No, it was owned by Israel
Between 1948 and 1967? No, the West Bank was owned by Jordan
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/91/UKrecognizesIsraelJordan.pdf

Where then is the claim? After 1967 by the PLO who was a defined terrorist organisation which even Jordan denounced?

When?

[Easy Drifter]

The problem with your statement is that it was not the Pals land even if you claim it was.
Of course you, as usual, put down the UN when they did or do something you disagree with but always quote them when you agree with them.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Eki keeps trying to prove Jews never were in Israel, or the first people to make a home there....sort of like being a Holocaust denier in a sense isn't it?

[Eki]

The problem with your statement is that it was not the Pals land even if you claim it was.
Of course you, as usual, put down the UN when they did or do something you disagree with but always quote them when you agree with them.
Of course, they aren't always right, but are sometimes right.

Disclaimer: "Right" here means what is right in my opinion, others may disagree.

[markabilly]

Eki keeps trying to prove Jews never were in Israel, or the first people to make a home there....sort of like being a Holocaust denier in a sense isn't it?
SORT OF????

:rotflmao:


ekiwiki is a holier than thou troll from an english speaking country who hates jews :rolleyes:

[markabilly]

back to the point

okay for ignorant folks here you go....

Quran 9:111 (which is the only promised path to heaven--suicide to carry out pedo prophet's wishes for destruction of non-beleivers....




and some more, least there be any doubt, in the mind on "non-beleivers" and hypocrites.....
Qur'an (4:74) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#004.074) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward."

Qur'an (3:151) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/003.qmt.html#003.151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".

Qur'an (2:191-193) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/002.qmt.html#002.191) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]...and fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah."

Qur'an (4:89) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#004.089) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

and there is this that condemns peaceful moslems who are not busy blowing themselves up....

Qur'an (4:95) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#004.095) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"

or more to the point:

Qur'an (5:33) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/005.qmt.html#005.033) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"



Qur'an (8:12) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.012) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Qur'an (8:39) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.039) - "And fight with them until there is no more persecution and religion should be only for Allah"


Qur'an (8:57) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.057) - "If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember."

Qur'an (8:59-60) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.0059) - "And let not those who disbelieve suppose that they can outstrip (Allah's Purpose). Lo! they cannot escape. Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy."

Qur'an (9:5) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.005) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush


Qur'an (9:38-39) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.038) - "O ye who believe! what is the matter with you, that, when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling heavily to the earth? Do ye prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the Hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place."
Qur'an (66:9) (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/066.qmt.html#066.009) - "O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end."


and other religous source with as much authority as the koran:

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power." Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim

Finally, the words of Muhammad, pedo prophet of Islam--no doubt aimed right at airsiterhead....


Tabari 9:69 "Killing Unbelievers is a small matter to us"



Not even Hitler got that carried away in Mein Kampf-

Koersch was a hypocrite, failing to follow the four gospels---and under the koran and the prophet, so are "peaceful moslems" who unless they go forth (and kill, baby kill) they will be replaced by others and suffer greatly--9.38-9.39

of course the real question is just how does Eki get the cream into those tacos?

same as the pedo prophet and his followers, no doubt