How will the Icelandic volcano affect F1?

[Dave B]

No flights back into the UK and much of Europe for at least another day, and even then a massive backlog. The teams all have personnel and equipment on another continent, and normally would use 6 Boeing 747s to bring them home.

It's a massive problem for the likes of Virgin who will need the three week gap to fit new fuel tanks with all the work that entails; it's also a pain for anyone who needs to make modifications to move their mirrors to comply with the FIA's instructions in time for Spain.

It's possible to fly into southern Europe then drive or get a train north, but it's still a logistical nightmare.

There's a good article on Autosport here:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/83000

[ioan]

It's possible to fly into southern Europe then drive or get a train north, but it's still a logistical nightmare.

What's the big deal about? It will take a day longer to get them with trucks from Spain or Italy to home, that's all.

[Dave B]

The big deal is trying to get several hundred people onto flights and trains which will already be rammed.

[Roamy]

TAD will make some electronic goggles that eat ash and MS will finally win a race. :)

[ioan]

The big deal is trying to get several hundred people onto flights and trains which will already be rammed.

They can rent or even buy cars or bussed for the people once they are in southern Europe. And they all have the needed trucks to move equipment around Europe.

It is slightly more challenging than just flying home, but life isn't always about honey and everyone will do just fine.

[ioan]

TAD will make some electronic goggles that eat ash and MS will finally win a race. :)

Same broken record. :laugh:

[steveaki13]

Although its a problem, I think 3 weeks should be enough time to get every sorted. Maybe mean the teams won't be able to upgrade the cars as much but needs must.

[UltimateDanGTR]

hang on, Richard Branson own's Virgin Atlantic, and Tony Fernandes owns AirAsia-surely they could pull some strings within their own companies and arrange flights to southern europe, if it is still possible to fly into southern spain they could get there and then drive up either home or to barcelona.

there is a solution here gentlemen, and it concerns a couple of team owners.

[Dave B]

There's talk that the freight might be flown directly to Spain and not return to the teams' bases at all.

[Dave B]

@MikeGascoyne Good news is that the boss owns an airline
:p

[Dr. Krogshöj]

Some teams are talking about booking tickets for the Trans-Siberian railway, according to Autosport... :)

[SGWilko]

I hear Berie wants to build a track on the Volcano.

[ioan]

There's talk that the freight might be flown directly to Spain and not return to the teams' bases at all.

That would be a mistake given that they have 3 weeks at disposal and they would only lose 1 day compared to the ideal situation.

[ioan]

I hear Berie wants to build a track on the Volcano.

:D

[Mark]

There's talk that the freight might be flown directly to Spain and not return to the teams' bases at all.

That's the solution, of course. Spain's airports currently remain completely open. Since FOM have their own aircraft, they can fly them anywhere they please, so it would be no big deal to make sure they stay well south of the ash cloud.

As for the teams based in the UK. Then even if the cars are flown into Barcelona, they still have plenty of time to send a transporter down to meet them, bring them back to the UK to work on and then truck them back down to Barcelona. For most of us that would be a very expensive proposition, but not for an F1 team!

Even I'm considering driving to Barcelona to get a flight!

[CNR]

it will depend on how long it is active and blowing ash for

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/sport/sportresults/MotoGP/2010/April/apr1910-japanese-motogp-october-date-confirmed/?R=EPI-123519

The Japanese MotoGP race, scheduled to take place this Sunday (April 25) has been postponed until October 3 because of on-going European travel chaos caused by an Icelandic volcano.

[Wasted Talent]

Sorry, misunderstood - I thought "Icelandic Volcano" were another team trying to enter F1 in 2011

WT

[ioan]

Most of the European airspace has been opened for flights again. All this story about teams having troubles returning to base was just a storm in a tea cup.

[Sonic]

Most of the European airspace has been opened for flights again. All this story about teams having troubles returning to base was just a storm in a tea cup.

Where did you hear that? Last I heard (about an hour ago) UK airspace which was planned for partial reopening at 1pm was being put on hold due to an increase in ash being blown pur way following the most active phase a couple of days ago.

[OutRun]

The volcanic ash has a tendency to affect the weather. We might end up seeing more rain and cooler temperatures for a few years.

[Ari]

hang on, Richard Branson own's Virgin Atlantic, and Tony Fernandes owns AirAsia-surely they could pull some strings within their own companies and arrange flights to southern europe, if it is still possible to fly into southern spain they could get there and then drive up either home or to barcelona.

there is a solution here gentlemen, and it concerns a couple of team owners.

Spot on! :)

I'm sure Branson alone would be willing to pull some strings and earn a brownie point with Bernie. Easy done!

[markabilly]

Bernie has made it official. Nothing to worry about.
But if there are any problems, not too worry as any fans who bought tickets to any race that is cancelled due to ash issues, will recieve no refunds, but something even better, free tickets to your choice of premium seats at this year's USA grand prix or next year's China race.....

[call_me_andrew]

I don't see why they can't just fly to North Africa (Morocco or Algeria perhaps) and take a ship across the Mediterranen Sea.

[Roamy]

rome was open today

[Easy Drifter]

There is a twofold problem.
Although there are airports open in Spain, Southern Italy and Scandanavia are there any airlines that fly to those places from China?
You probably can get to one of those airports with several switches but with schedules it could take a couple of days.
Doing rerouting to airports other than those an airline normally flies to can be a major problem. Countries and airlines have to have landing rights agreements to start with.
I do gather Spain is basically adopting an open air policy but just how many flights can their airports accomodate? Any airport can only handle so many flights an hour. Some are not set up for customs and immigration.
Next is availability of planes. There are hundreds if not thousands of planes stranded at airports that they cannot get out of. The cargo planes F1 rely on are stuck in Europe.
An Air Canada pilot was on air here talking about re routing trans Atlantic flights to the southern route from the standard northern route for North American trans Atlantic flights. The distance is quite a bit further and some planes that do the northern route cannot carry enough fuel for the southern route. Remember there has to a fairly large margin of excess fuel in case of landing delay or diversion because of weather.
Even North American Airlines have many planes stranded in Europe and often those planes also do domestic runs.
Can you imagine what would happen if just one plane that somehow got into the ash cloud were to crash? Even without that the cost of repairing the damage to engines and windshields and even the skins of the planes would be huge and leave planes grounded for weeks.
I wouldn't be surprised to see some airline companies go under from this.

[Roamy]

barcelona is open Delta is about 1 hr from landing

[Mark]

barcelona is open Delta is about 1 hr from landing

Barcelona has been open throughout I believe.
It's a massive airport and F1 was scheduled to go there anyway, so I don't see what the problem is.

[wmcot]

I hear Berie wants to build a track on the Volcano.

I hear Tilke on his way there now to see if the still hot lava can be moulded into a track surface. Of course, if the volcano is still active at the time of the Icelandic GP, drivers will have a bit more to complain about when being forced off the track! ;)

[CNR]

Stranded Virgin faces development problems
http://en.espnf1.com/virgin/motorsport/story/15061.html

The package, at an estimated development cost of £1 million, was due to debut in Barcelona in three weeks. But F1's hundreds of kilos of freight - including the two race cars driven by Lucas di Grassi and Timo Glock in Shanghai - are currently waiting at Shanghai airport while Formula One Management's six 747 jets are stranded in Europe.

[Mark]

As I understand it, you can fly above the height of the ash cloud without any problems. The difficulty is of course, take off and landing.

Now in China there is no ash cloud, and Spain there is no ash cloud. Then there's no issue? Of course the aircraft currently being on the ground inside the clouds limits is a problem!

[Mysterious Rock]

Stranded Virgin faces development problems
http://en.espnf1.com/virgin/motorsport/story/15061.html


It makes sence now the planes are not even in China!! thats why its an issue!

[Easy Drifter]

From what we have been getting the cloud is from about 20,000 feet to 35,000 feet. Commerciaal airloners normally fly about 26,000 feet to 32,000 feet.
Lower uses too much fuel. I do not know how much higher they can normally fly. I think, but do not know, that 35,000 is just about the max and may be too high for some.

[Easy Drifter]

Being curious I just checked on max ceilings and the 747 is 40,000 feet and the airbus A340 is 39,000. Didn't give specs fully loaded just the absolute max ceiling. So I would expect about 35 to 37 thousand would be it loaded.

[Sonic]

From what we have been getting the cloud is from about 20,000 feet to 35,000 feet. Commerciaal airloners normally fly about 26,000 feet to 32,000 feet.
Lower uses too much fuel. I do not know how much higher they can normally fly. I think, but do not know, that 35,000 is just about the max and may be too high for some.

According to some chap from NATS (National air traffic service) on the radio a few minutes ago, UK airspace is open as long as you fly above 20,000 ft (which apparently is where the cloud has settled in this part of the world).

I'm seeing fairly regular trails overhead now of planes flying above that limit. Most of our airports are still closed though.

[Sonic]

Flightradar24.com

If you are interested :)

[SGWilko]

The last time this Volcano and it's neighbour erupted, wasn't it the catalyst for the French revolution?

Won't happen again though, the French will get all pshyched up for it.....


....then go on strike.

;)

[ioan]

Where did you hear that? Last I heard (about an hour ago) UK airspace which was planned for partial reopening at 1pm was being put on hold due to an increase in ash being blown pur way following the most active phase a couple of days ago.

UK isn't most of Europe, you know?! :p :

[ioan]

The last time this Volcano and it's neighbour erupted, wasn't it the catalyst for the French revolution?

Won't happen again though, the French will get all pshyched up for it.....


....then go on strike.

;)

:laugh: :up:

[Easy Drifter]

The French Unions have to go on strike!
It is totally unfair to them that something other than them shut down air traffic! :p :

[Mark in Oshawa]

The French Unions have to go on strike!
It is totally unfair to them that something other than them shut down air traffic! :p :

Now c'mon, be serious. We all know that the Unions in France will go on strike against the airlines WHEN the volcano stops. They want all the media attention they can get!

[ioan]

Now c'mon, be serious. We all know that the Unions in France will go on strike against the airlines WHEN the volcano stops. They want all the media attention they can get!

If it helps, the French rail road workers were on strike last week and also yesterday. :D

[Mark in Oshawa]

If it helps, the French rail road workers were on strike last week and also yesterday. :D

Why does this not surprise me? No one can fly, so naturally cripple the nation's rail system at this point in time!

[wmcot]

UK isn't most of Europe, you know?! :p :

Don't tell THEM that!!! :)

[ioan]

Why does this not surprise me? No one can fly, so naturally cripple the nation's rail system at this point in time!

:D
I live 10 years there and every time on the road to the railway station I was making alternative plans in case they are on strike.

On the opposite side in 6 years I never saw the Austrian railway workers on strike and the past week they supplemented their train numbers in order to take over the huge number of people left stranded because of the airport closures.

[ioan]

Don't tell THEM that!!! :)

Oups, to late! :D