Zee Germans could join zee auzzies??

[AJP]

http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/germans-to-join-v8-supercars-20100309-pvdm.html

I would actually love to see this.....

[Azumanga Davo]

Finally, some much needed diversity. Virtually ridiculous to have had it a two way series for so long. Good on those who are thinking about it.

[Ranger]

I will bet that although this is a good thing, Ford and Holden will whinge until foreign manufacturers are canned. Much like 1992.

[Rollo]

Ford and Holden, which are involved in V8 Supercar to promote locally built cars to an Australian audience, are unlikely to be as impressed.

I think that we've seen both Ford and Holden's attitude to motor racing time and time again in Australia. Holden think they own it, Ford are ambivalent and bugger everyone else.

[AJP]

I think this move if there is any substance to it, would finally put holden and ford in their place and more than likely, see them step up to the plate and really use this to boost car sales in australia to higher market...

you never know...in five years time they may well be making cars that can compete on the street against a merc or bmw in build quality and design...

ha ha...who am i kidding....

[Rollo]

Well the new Camaro has been released in Australia, and now that we've had the Camaro and the Commodore side by side we can see for ourselves that the build quality of the American product despite being built on the same Zeta platform as the Commodore is even worse than the Commodore Executive.

And yet GM had the gall to kill the Monaro?

[wedge]

I've just creamed my pants!

Yes, I know it's hi-tech-NASCAR-road-racing-series but I would love to see Lexus IS-F in the mix.

[AJP]

I've just creamed my pants!

Yes, I know it's hi-tech-NASCAR-road-racing-series but I would love to see Lexus IS-F in the mix.

how dare you say NASCAR .... ;)

The possibility of Merc, Audi, BMW, Lexus (or anyone else with a four door, rear wheel drive V8)...competing as V8 supercars, would quite frankly make this one of the best motorsports out there...a truely mouth watering proposition...

[ShiftingGears]

Most excellent. If Holden and Ford start protesting as if they own the series I hope that the newcomers put them in their place.

[cts1691]

More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

That's how they killed CanAm, Group C, the old DTM and lots of other series.

Good racing series rely on the teams, not the manufactures, F 1 and NASCAR are just finding out.

Manufactures can (and will) pull out any time and sponsor golf or tennis. Teams can't just pull out, racing is their income.

It's people like Ross Brawn, Peter Sauber, Joe (I mean Andrea) Nemechek or Tommy Baldwin that keep the series running when the manufactures pull out.

To say something positive: If more manufactures step into V8 Supercars rules, than at least use them for DTM too and get rid of the wimpy DTM cars.

[wedge]

I agree with you about the independents but


More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

That's how they killed CanAm, Group C, the old DTM and lots of other series.


Someone remind me how CanAm died.

Group C died because of the silly homologation 3.5l engine rule which meant Bernie could twist engine manufacturers into F1

DTM/ITC died because their was no checks on cost and was allowed to die.

NASCAR has been recently been keeping cost in check and have used prehistoric pushrod V8s.

AVESCO have standardised car components to keep costs down.

I don't mind cutting costs on principle but at what cost? homogenised spec-racing

[Rollo]

Manufactures can (and will) pull out any time and sponsor golf or tennis. Teams can't just pull out, racing is their income.

You may find this instructive:

With the global financial crisis taking hold and GM and Ford being total basket cases, it has been announced by both of them that RWD platforms have both been cancelled:

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleId=60193
http://www.caradvice.com.au/20794/gm-cancels-holden-global-rwd-platform/

It follows that without either the Commodore or the Falcon in existance, then there won't be Commodores or Falcons to build V8 Supercars from.

Pray tell, how do you run a series with no car at all?

[Rollo]

More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

The V8SA board meets on Monday 15th of March to discuss the so called "Car of the Future" for the 2012 regulations. It is expected that the 2012 cars will be built on a common purpose-built platform, and that new "manufacturers" would be allowed to submit entries without the need to produce a V8 engine of their own (because neither Ford or Holden currently do).

The new Car of the Future is expected to have even more common componentry than the current regulations prescribe, be anywhere from 50kg to 150kg (dropping the weight of the cars from 1350kg to either 1300kg or 1200kg), and is expected to cost $150,000 for a rolling chassis which is about $70,000 cheaper than the current cars.

At this stage, it is rumoured that there are three complete CoFs (though I've only seen a single unfinished chassis), and that Mark Skaife who led the technical team has already tested it. I'd expect either a prototype to be shown at Bathurst either this year or in 2011.

I can't show links at yet, but I expect that I'll be able to after the V8SA board has met and we have something more concrete after about Tuesday or Wednesday next week.

[Daniel]

It won't happen.

[Daniel]

More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

That's how they killed CanAm, Group C, the old DTM and lots of other series.

Good racing series rely on the teams, not the manufactures, F 1 and NASCAR are just finding out.

Manufactures can (and will) pull out any time and sponsor golf or tennis. Teams can't just pull out, racing is their income.

It's people like Ross Brawn, Peter Sauber, Joe (I mean Andrea) Nemechek or Tommy Baldwin that keep the series running when the manufactures pull out.

To say something positive: If more manufactures step into V8 Supercars rules, than at least use them for DTM too and get rid of the wimpy DTM cars.
Wimpy DTM cars? Are you serious?

[Rollo]

http://www.v8supercars.com.au/amg-+-888--%E2%80%9Ca-crock%E2%80%9D/tabid/70/newsid/9707/default.aspx
Triple Eight Racing Engineering’s Roland Dane has described reports that he has had talks with Mercedes-Benz or AMG as a “crock”.
“Not one single person has asked me if we have ever spoken with Mercedes-Benz about coming into V8 Supercars or going racing full stop.
“I’ve never, ever spoken to them (Mercedes-Benz) about it.”
- Roland Dane, 888 Motorsport

So now what?

[Azumanga Davo]

http://www.v8supercars.com.au/amg-+-888--%E2%80%9Ca-crock%E2%80%9D/tabid/70/newsid/9707/default.aspx
Triple Eight Racing Engineering’s Roland Dane has described reports that he has had talks with Mercedes-Benz or AMG as a “crock”.
“Not one single person has asked me if we have ever spoken with Mercedes-Benz about coming into V8 Supercars or going racing full stop.
“I’ve never, ever spoken to them (Mercedes-Benz) about it.”
- Roland Dane, 888 Motorsport

So now what?

Well, they just changed their allegiance to Holden. Probably not wise even contemplating a consultation with them concerning a new manufacturer link up.

One team does not a series make though. There will be someone interested in trying something new. ;)

[BDunnell]

More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

That's how they killed CanAm, Group C, the old DTM and lots of other series.

Bit simplistic, in my opinion. Yes, costs in the old DTM had soared. But turning it into an international FIA series, the ITC, was a huge mistake. The global interest in that form of racing just wasn't there. It was a very popular domestic series, but there its appeal all but ended.



To say something positive: If more manufactures step into V8 Supercars rules, than at least use them for DTM too and get rid of the wimpy DTM cars.

From that remark I can only assume you've never seen a DTM car.

[Rollo]

So much for anything being published in a hurry:

http://www.v8supercars.com.au/welcome-but-not-essential/tabid/70/newsid/9738/default.aspx
Cochrane revealed that the Car of the Future regulations will be announced at a special press conference to be held at Melbourne’s Crown Casino on the Monday after the Australian Grand Prix.

The Car of the Future (CoF) regulations have been designed to make it easier for manufacturers other than the traditional Ford and Holden to take part in the Championship.

Great, so now we have to wait even looooonger, for V8SA to tell us what's going on. What's a few more weeks after first telling us that it was going to be announced last October? It's like waiting for the NSW State Government to make an announcement.

[kmchow]

I thought there was also talk about the DTM merging their rules with Japan's Super GT? Or is MB trying to merge DTM/Super GT/V8 Supercar??

[ShiftingGears]

Gimmicky names for proposed race car platforms are all the rage.

[wedge]

Wimpy DTM cars? Are you serious?

DTM = glorified prototypes

[Daniel]

DTM = glorified prototypes
They're not glorified prototypes. The bodywork is basically the same in shape as the roadcars with the additition of wings, vents, openings etc etc. They're nothing like prototypes.

[racer69]

More manufactures = higher costs = less cars = less racing = less interest = less money = even less cars = even less racing = even less interest = bye-bye V8 Supercars.

We have less cars nowadays as it is, V8Supercars Australia have been actively trying to REDUCE the field to just 28 starters.... all in the interest of making the franchises worth more.

The fact that we have less meetings in Australia than ever before would not be helping the interest either.

[I am evil Homer]

They're not glorified prototypes. The bodywork is basically the same in shape as the roadcars with the additition of wings, vents, openings etc etc. They're nothing like prototypes.

Given the exotic materials underneath and the fact the bodywork wouldn't actually fit the road going version, there certainly not in any way, shape or form 'production' vehciles either.

Same 'shape' certainly, same cars? Not even close.

[Daniel]

http://www.canim.net/araba/images/audi_a4_dtm_155-1024.jpg

Nah they don't look ANYTHING like each other :rotflmao:

Ever heard of something called a silhouette race car?

[Rollo]

They're not glorified prototypes. The bodywork is basically the same in shape as the roadcars with the additition of wings, vents, openings etc etc. They're nothing like prototypes.

Wiki Magic:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Tourenwagen_Masters
The cars are supposed to be fast and spectacular, while still rather cheap to build and run. All DTM race cars have RWD and 4.0 L V8 engines which are air-restricted to 470 hp, no matter if similar layouts or engines are available in the road cars. Instead of the road car bodies, unrelated purpose-built chassis are used, which are closer to prototype racing.

Apart from the badge on the front, the cars in the DTM share zero components with those on the road. Their floorpan dimensions have remained static since 2000 and even the chassis they sit on, across cars are dimensionally identical.

In comparison, the V8 Supercars chassis are derived from the road car, though the VE Commodore has had chunks cut out of it. The truth is that V8Taxi racing shares more in common with the road cars than the DTM.

[Daniel]

Wiki Magic:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Tourenwagen_Masters
The cars are supposed to be fast and spectacular, while still rather cheap to build and run. All DTM race cars have RWD and 4.0 L V8 engines which are air-restricted to 470 hp, no matter if similar layouts or engines are available in the road cars. Instead of the road car bodies, unrelated purpose-built chassis are used, which are closer to prototype racing.

Apart from the badge on the front, the cars in the DTM share zero components with those on the road. Their floorpan dimensions have remained static since 2000 and even the chassis they sit on, across cars are dimensionally identical.

In comparison, the V8 Supercars chassis are derived from the road car, though the VE Commodore has had chunks cut out of it. The truth is that V8Taxi racing shares more in common with the road cars than the DTM.
Errr check wikipedia again. It now says that it's closer to banana racing. Wikipedia is a wonderful thing! No opinion in there at all is there?

[Mark in Oshawa]

I am not a big fan of the Germans going down under. The Aussie V8's are special and unique, and I look at what level of racing I see from there; and I wonder why BMW, Audi or MB might make it better? I dont think they will. Australian racing is the closet to NASCAR in the type of spectacle and culture, and I think the DTM is just a different breed altogether.

I would love to see a world series of Touring car if IF they do this, but I don't know how the logistics and economics could work. Have maybe 8 super events and have regional series that host them. Bathurst, Clipsal and Melbourne would be no brainers in the Australian Series...but not sure how it would all work.

I like the Aussie series as it is....simple as that. Don't need it DTM'ed...I think the DTM's are just not as much fun. You don't see the aggressive and close racing that happens down under as often in the DTM.

[Rollo]

Errr check wikipedia again. It now says that it's closer to banana racing. Wikipedia is a wonderful thing! No opinion in there at all is there?

How about the DTM's own website then?

http://www.dtm.com/reglement_t.php
The outer skin of the DTM racing cars, which get their brawny stance from aerodynamic bodywork, consists of high-strength but extremely lightweight carbon fibre – the universal material in professional racing. Composite materials are used in the area of safety as well. Safety structures similar to a Formula 1 monocoque and crash boxes made of carbon as well as approximately 28 metres of high-strength aircraft steel as a space frame ensure “workplace safety” for the drivers.

Nothing like opinion grounded in fact eh? I'd say that there was a word for that opinion... "accurate".

[racer69]

I am not a big fan of the Germans going down under. The Aussie V8's are special and unique, and I look at what level of racing I see from there; and I wonder why BMW, Audi or MB might make it better? I dont think they will. Australian racing is the closet to NASCAR in the type of spectacle and culture, and I think the DTM is just a different breed altogether.

I would love to see a world series of Touring car if IF they do this, but I don't know how the logistics and economics could work. Have maybe 8 super events and have regional series that host them. Bathurst, Clipsal and Melbourne would be no brainers in the Australian Series...but not sure how it would all work.

I like the Aussie series as it is....simple as that. Don't need it DTM'ed...I think the DTM's are just not as much fun. You don't see the aggressive and close racing that happens down under as often in the DTM.

From 1960 to 1992/93 our series was open to all comers, it was only from 1993 that other makes (who were tipping in big $$$) were turfed in favour of the Ford/Holden V8 formula, so really adding more makes is just going back to what we had. I personally think it is way overdue.

Australia was part of the WTCC in 1987, infact we were the only country to have two rounds (Bathurst and Calder)

[ShiftingGears]

I like the Aussie series as it is....simple as that. Don't need it DTM'ed...I think the DTM's are just not as much fun. You don't see the aggressive and close racing that happens down under as often in the DTM.

Unless the new technical regulations will be radically different, the only way I see V8 supercars becoming remotely like the DTM series is presence of German manufacturers.

[wedge]

Wiki Magic:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Tourenwagen_Masters
The cars are supposed to be fast and spectacular, while still rather cheap to build and run. All DTM race cars have RWD and 4.0 L V8 engines which are air-restricted to 470 hp, no matter if similar layouts or engines are available in the road cars. Instead of the road car bodies, unrelated purpose-built chassis are used, which are closer to prototype racing.

Apart from the badge on the front, the cars in the DTM share zero components with those on the road. Their floorpan dimensions have remained static since 2000 and even the chassis they sit on, across cars are dimensionally identical.

In comparison, the V8 Supercars chassis are derived from the road car, though the VE Commodore has had chunks cut out of it. The truth is that V8Taxi racing shares more in common with the road cars than the DTM.

The key point is that DTMs weigh over 1000kg (V8SC = 1350kg ??) and pretty much all the drivers say the cars are akin to single seaters.

[Daniel]

How about the DTM's own website then?

http://www.dtm.com/reglement_t.php
The outer skin of the DTM racing cars, which get their brawny stance from aerodynamic bodywork, consists of high-strength but extremely lightweight carbon fibre – the universal material in professional racing. Composite materials are used in the area of safety as well. Safety structures similar to a Formula 1 monocoque and crash boxes made of carbon as well as approximately 28 metres of high-strength aircraft steel as a space frame ensure “workplace safety” for the drivers.

Nothing like opinion grounded in fact eh? I'd say that there was a word for that opinion... "accurate".
Of course. But it's still not a prototype.

THIS is a prototype
http://www.niot.net/blog-images/23_Apr/audi-r15-tdi-arrives-early-ahead-of-race-debut.jpg

[wedge]

The majority of GT1 cars in the mid-late 1990s were really prototypes, based on Group C cars. They were GTs because of the stupid homologation rules.

[Rollo]

Of course. But it's still not a prototype.

THIS is a prototype


Under who's definition?

The OED defines a prototype as being the first or original pre-production example. The cars raced at Le Mans are in no way pre-production examples; therefore some other definition must be employed.

Care to give us one?

[Daniel]

Under who's definition?

The OED defines a prototype as being the first or original pre-production example. The cars raced at Le Mans are in no way pre-production examples; therefore some other definition must be employed.

Care to give us one?
Ergh Rollo, why do you always take definitions so seriously?

I dare you turn up @ La Sarthe in June and tell all the P1 and P2 guys that they're not running prototypes :laugh:

Now I take your point that the DTM cars aren't exactly production based but the DTM cars are probably more like GT1 cars than prototypes. I fear you've got NASCAR and DTM mixed up or something.

Here's a DTM car and its road going cousin just to refresh your memory :)
http://www.canim.net/araba/images/audi_a4_dtm_155-1024.jpg

[Daniel]

How about the DTM's own website then?

http://www.dtm.com/reglement_t.php
The outer skin of the DTM racing cars, which get their brawny stance from aerodynamic bodywork, consists of high-strength but extremely lightweight carbon fibre – the universal material in professional racing. Composite materials are used in the area of safety as well. Safety structures similar to a Formula 1 monocoque and crash boxes made of carbon as well as approximately 28 metres of high-strength aircraft steel as a space frame ensure “workplace safety” for the drivers.

Nothing like opinion grounded in fact eh? I'd say that there was a word for that opinion... "accurate".
Oh and I forgot to say that IIRC WRCars have a carbon fibre crash structure built into the door and they also have strong cages too. Are they now prototypes?

I never said that DTM cars are production based, anyone with half a braincell knows they're not. But they're not prototypes if we use the true motorsport definition.

[Rollo]

Now I take your point that the DTM cars aren't exactly production based but the DTM cars are probably more like GT1 cars than prototypes. I fear you've got NASCAR and DTM mixed up or something.

Actually a GT1 car is based off a production car, where as a DTM car is not. Undernearth the skin of a DTM car is a specifically produced frame which bears no resemblance to the road car at all. A GT1 car is one of which at least three examples have been produced for the road.

A DTM car from a construction point of view shares more with a NASCAR than a GT1 car. Once you remove that bodywork, you could in theory put another shell over the top, as you might do a slotcar; you can't do that with a GT1 car.


Ergh Rollo, why do you always take definitions so seriously?

Definitions lead to proof, proof leads to fact, fact leads to truth. Else you have the dark side... which leads to hate, hate leads to suffering... suffering leads to the fridge, which leads to creme caramels.

[Daniel]

Actually a GT1 car is based off a production car, where as a DTM car is not. Undernearth the skin of a DTM car is a specifically produced frame which bears no resemblance to the road car at all. A GT1 car is one of which at least three examples have been produced for the road.

A DTM car from a construction point of view shares more with a NASCAR than a GT1 car. Once you remove that bodywork, you could in theory put another shell over the top, as you might do a slotcar; you can't do that with a GT1 car.



Definitions lead to proof, proof leads to fact, fact leads to truth. Else you have the dark side... which leads to hate, hate leads to suffering... suffering leads to the fridge, which leads to creme caramels.
*sigh*

So because there are 3 Gt1 cars made for the road they're nothing like DTM cars even though they're both actually very similar in practice. I see.

[wedge]

DTM cars are probably more like GT1 cars than prototypes.

I've never seen a GT1 car with crazy aero aids before

[Daniel]

I've never seen a GT1 car with crazy aero aids before
Oh ffs are people being needlessly pedantic or what?!?!?!

Lets just agree that a GT1 car is like a GT1 car
A supertourer is like a supertourer
And that a DTM car is like a DTM car
And that an LMP isn't an LMP because it doesn't fit into the dictionary definition :rolleyes:

None of them share any similarities at all. I shall get out a dictionary and find some stupidly pedantic way of saying that the wheels on a DTM car are a different kind of round to the ones on a GT1 car.

Sorry I ever even posted in this nonsensical thread in the first place!

[Daniel]

I've vandalised the LMP page for a laugh :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Mans_Prototype#History



On the 18th of March LMP's were renamed to something else because Rollo from Motorsportforums.com pointed out that whilst the P in LMP stands for Prototype, the cars are not actually prototypes according to the dictionary reference. The ACO protested saying that they've been called prototypes for "f*ing ages" and that this is the accepted motorsport definition, but then gave up because it didn't want to listen to one of Rollo's nonsensical arguments. They also mandated that GT1 cars have winglets just to piss Wedge off.

I really do despair sometimes.

[wedge]

How mature of you

I really do despair sometimes

[Daniel]

How mature of you

I really do despair sometimes
How do you reply maturely to someone who simply doesn't want to recognise that GT1 cars and DTM cars are probably closer to each other than they are to a lot of other cars?

You don't! You throw your hands up in the air and say **** it and vandalise a wiki page to prove a point.

[Eurotech]

You don't! You throw your hands up in the air and say **** it and vandalise a wiki page to prove a point.
Its a shame Wikipedia keep changing their pages back to how they were, I like spamming them, who doesn't? - Yes I really am that mature :)

[Azumanga Davo]

Forget duelling pistols, Wikipedia is where the battle is won or lost. :D

[wedge]

How do you reply maturely to someone who simply doesn't want to recognise that GT1 cars and DTM cars are probably closer to each other than they are to a lot of other cars?

It's an interesting discussion but there's no need to cry and empty your pram just because others disagree with you.

[Daniel]

It's an interesting discussion but there's no need to cry and empty your pram just because others disagree with you.
I'm not crying :laugh: In fact that all makes me laugh.

[AJP]

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d119/ajesser/th_v8supercar_roadcar.jpg (http://s34.photobucket.com/albums/d119/ajesser/?action=view&current=v8supercar_roadcar.jpg)

Here is a comparison of the road going version and the race car...

If Mercedes, BMW etc decide to join up....I would think it would be more like this than DTM....I would hope that anyway...

[Rollo]

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d119/ajesser/th_v8supercar_roadcar.jpg (http://s34.photobucket.com/albums/d119/ajesser/?action=view&current=v8supercar_roadcar.jpg)

Here is a comparison of the road going version and the race car...


The road VE Commodore is too long and too wide for the regulations. So in order to pass homogation, special chassis have to built. Two strips are cut out of the car down the long axis; either side of the transmission tunnel, and a space between the B-Pillar and the C-Pillar is cut out, and then the roof is reprofiled.
The V8 Supercar Commodore, is shorter, narrower, and lower in height than the road going VE Commodore.

You can actually see the distortions, particularly behind the B-Pillar between the two cars.

[AJP]

The road VE Commodore is too long and too wide for the regulations. So in order to pass homogation, special chassis have to built. Two strips are cut out of the car down the long axis; either side of the transmission tunnel, and a space between the B-Pillar and the C-Pillar is cut out, and then the roof is reprofiled.
The V8 Supercar Commodore, is shorter, narrower, and lower in height than the road going VE Commodore.

You can actually see the distortions, particularly behind the B-Pillar between the two cars.

Knowing this, you can still clearly see that it is a holden commodore..

The differences between body work and chasis modifications of the DTM cars and V8 supercars is quite different.

[racer69]

Oh ffs are people being needlessly pedantic or what?!?!?!

Lets just agree that a GT1 car is like a GT1 car
A supertourer is like a supertourer
And that a DTM car is like a DTM car
And that an LMP isn't an LMP because it doesn't fit into the dictionary definition :rolleyes:

None of them share any similarities at all. I shall get out a dictionary and find some stupidly pedantic way of saying that the wheels on a DTM car are a different kind of round to the ones on a GT1 car.

Sorry I ever even posted in this nonsensical thread in the first place!

I think the point being made is that DTM cars aren't touring cars.... but then again neither are the V8Supercars really anymore.

More 'silouette' regs than anything

[Rollo]

The January 2010 edition of Top Gear magazine (UK) has a six or seven page spread on the Audi A4 DTM.

It's reproduced here and makes for an interesting read:
http://www.quattroworld.com/audi-motorsports/das-touring-meister-the-2010-audi-a4-dtm/
Despite the presence of four doors and what looks like a boot, this is pretty much a single-seater in drag.
...
In other words, this is a sophisticated racing car, arguably a lot closer to endurance prototypes than straight touring cars.


The differences between body work and chasis modifications of the DTM cars and V8 supercars is quite different.

The main difference being that to get a V8 Supercar you start off with a Commodore; and to get a DTM Audi A4, you don't start off with an A4 but a spaceframe.

[Daniel]

So it's like a prototype which isn't a prototype according to you?

[Eurotech]

No its like a V8 Supercar, stop trying to turn Motorsport into similies...

[Azumanga Davo]

Oh god, who cares what it is, let's just look forward to the announcement that's coming soon.

[Rollo]

http://www.carpoint.com.au/news/2010/motorsport-assurance-on-nz-v8-supercar-round-18730
"Mercedes-Benz has emphatically denied any interest in entering V8 Supercars when the category is thrown open to more manufacturers in 2012. Following a frenzy of speculation last week, the German giant's global motorsport boss ruled out a factory-backed V8 team under the Car of the Future rules"

Mercedes-Benz Motorsport spokesman Wolfgang Schattling added: 'We definitely will not be doing that.' "

http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/motorsport/expect-the-next-three-gps-to-be-dull-processions-too/2010/03/20/1268501564138.html
Speculation of the week is that Mercedes-Benz is to enter V8 Supercars and what has been exclusively a narrow tribal conflict between Holden and Ford.



Fellow prestige maker BMW has flatly denied that it is interested.

There it is. MB & BMW aren't and won't build a V8 Supercar. The question remains now, who sparked the rumours in the first place? And the answer to that can be found in the original article posted in this thread from the Sydney Morning Herald:
http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/germans-to-join-v8-supercars-20100309-pvdm.html
[b]The chairman of V8 Supercars, Tony Cochrane, confirmed the expansion talks this week.
"Some of the teams are already talking to potential new manufacturers," he said.

Mr Cochrane by any chance?

[Azumanga Davo]

http://www.carpoint.com.au/news/2010/motorsport-assurance-on-nz-v8-supercar-round-18730
"Mercedes-Benz has emphatically denied any interest in entering V8 Supercars when the category is thrown open to more manufacturers in 2012. Following a frenzy of speculation last week, the German giant's global motorsport boss ruled out a factory-backed V8 team under the Car of the Future rules"

Mercedes-Benz Motorsport spokesman Wolfgang Schattling added: 'We definitely will not be doing that.' "

http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/motorsport/expect-the-next-three-gps-to-be-dull-processions-too/2010/03/20/1268501564138.html
Speculation of the week is that Mercedes-Benz is to enter V8 Supercars and what has been exclusively a narrow tribal conflict between Holden and Ford.



Fellow prestige maker BMW has flatly denied that it is interested.

There it is. MB & BMW aren't and won't build a V8 Supercar. The question remains now, who sparked the rumours in the first place? And the answer to that can be found in the original article posted in this thread from the Sydney Morning Herald:
http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/germans-to-join-v8-supercars-20100309-pvdm.html
[b]The chairman of V8 Supercars, Tony Cochrane, confirmed the expansion talks this week.
"Some of the teams are already talking to potential new manufacturers," he said.

Mr Cochrane by any chance?

That Coch better ran. Oh that made no sense. But he bloody should. :D

[Rollo]

http://www.themotorreport.com.au/46057/ford-falcon-wagon-facing-the-axe-mondeo-wagon-and-territory-to-carry-the-load#comment_37927
FORD AUSTRALIA HAS announced today that it will discontinue the Falcon wagon this year, with the last wagon to roll off the line in June.

The news follows reports last year that Ford was considering the wagon's future, Ford Australia CEO Marin Burela confirming that a decision would be made by this past January.

How long do you give it before the Falcon is axed entirely? What the hell does V8 Supercars do then with only one make of car to choose from and no other willing participants at this stage?

The Falcon itself has been flagging in sales, having fallen from top spot to number 7 in the latest VFACTS survey. Ford already previously announced that there probably wouldn't be a replacement for it at the end of the model cycle.

What then?

[Rollo]

http://www.v8supercars.com.au/car-of-the-future-released/tabid/70/newsid/9848/default.aspx

The Car of the Future has supposedly been "released". Though in reality all they've suggested is a marketing drive, and the following announcements. The Car of the Future will have:

Control:
- floor plan
- roll cage
- rear suspension
- rear uprights
- wheels
- tyres
- E85 Fuel
- gearbox
- differential
- brakes
- cooling
- fuel delivery system
- electronics loom
- ECU

The weight drops from 1350kg to about 1200-1250kg, the fuel tank is to be moved forward of the rear axles, the rear wing surface is to be controlled between the mounts, and the V8Supercar must share the same "likeness" as the road car.

What's annoying about this is that there aren't as yet a set of technical regulations defining anything, and nor is there any statement as to what the "Engine Equalisation Program" is supposed to entail.

I would suggest that the most likely candidates for new manufacturers if they are going to surface are someone like Geely or Great Wall, or something.

[AJP]

From the info that Rollo has provided...and a big thanks for that,

I would not be very interested if these COF's are looking more to a DTM format. Where the car is only to resemble the road going version.

What I like about the V8 supercars is that although they are heavily modified, they still look very close to the road going version.

I certainly do not want to see a DTM/Nascar drop on body that only just resembles the road going version....

The racing is great because they cars are difficult to drive, adding extra performance by weight loss and chasis mods and flared gaurds with winglets every where....I mean come on!!!