Kamui Kobayashi

[Koz]

His first race today. And I have to say he drove pretty well.

He did very well to hold Button up. Pity about his incident with Nakajima though.
Still his drive was better than most newbies this season.

So it could be him and Glock partnered up next year.

Any thoughts?

[harsha]

If Toyota do manage to stick in f1,Koba seems to be one of the drivers...dunno whether they will extend Timo's contract though...Someone like Heidfeld would be ideal for them

[drewdawg727]

Honestly, I wouldn't say Kobayashi was holding up Button much. Button tried a few times to pass but I think he realized that with the previous passes, his tires were prob going off so he wanted to take it easy. If anything, Kobayashi was losing ground to Buemi and the leaders in front of Buemi. He definitely was not turning my head in this race, IMO.

[Big Ben]

Honestly, I wouldn't say Kobayashi was holding up Button much. Button tried a few times to pass but I think he realized that with the previous passes, his tires were prob going off so he wanted to take it easy. If anything, Kobayashi was losing ground to Buemi and the leaders in front of Buemi. He definitely was not turning my head in this race, IMO.

Can anyone else have an opinion on whether he was turning your had or not?

With all the restrictions we have this year I think he did a pretty good job. He seemed to be very cool keeping Button behind him there for a while.

[christophulus]

...dunno whether they will extend Timo's contract though...

Toyota mentioned a couple of weeks back that they wouldn't retain Glock.. looks like he might be on his way to Renault now

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/79570

Kobayashi did a decent job and he'll be odds-on to stay with the team, partly because they'll have to pay him a lot less than Trulli.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

I'd say his 1st race was better than any of the other of this years new drivers first race.

[Sonic]

Thanks for starting this thread. Kobay drove amazingly well in his first GP proving the doubters wrong (naming no names but you know who you are ;) ). His fierce defensive drive was a thing of beauty (aside from the slightly clumsy Naka move) and he even showed he could overtake too later in the race. I've been singing his praises for a couple of years and I hope Japan are finally going to have a driver their passion deserves.

Looks like my FGP team is Nico and Kobay for next year.

[keysersoze]

My expectations were based off his GP2 results, so I was extremely surprised by his pace (and moxie). The Toyota has been quick lately but it looked as if he had 5,000km of testing under his belt.

[Ranger]

:up: The fire is there. I enjoyed that defensive driving.

But Trulli wasn't in the race after lap 1 and Kobayashi only finished 10th after his strong first half of the race. Hate to be a realist but IMO the car was probably capable of a lot more today.

IMO the jury is out.

[I am evil Homer]

There's potential there it seems but then Sato looked the same.

[harsha]

Toyota mentioned a couple of weeks back that they wouldn't retain Glock.. looks like he might be on his way to Renault now

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/79570

Kobayashi did a decent job and he'll be odds-on to stay with the team, partly because they'll have to pay him a lot less than Trulli.

glock to renault - that i doubt,I think Romain Grosjean deserves a fair shot...Glock could have a deal with STR though...I don't think Buemi and Alguersari show a lot of potential

[ioan]

Honestly, I wouldn't say Kobayashi was holding up Button much. Button tried a few times to pass but I think he realized that with the previous passes, his tires were prob going off so he wanted to take it easy. If anything, Kobayashi was losing ground to Buemi and the leaders in front of Buemi. He definitely was not turning my head in this race, IMO.

Yeah, that must be it, Button just didn't really try to overtake him and his whining over the radio was just to keep you entertained. LOL!

[ioan]

Honestly, I wouldn't say Kobayashi was holding up Button much. Button tried a few times to pass but I think he realized that with the previous passes, his tires were prob going off so he wanted to take it easy. If anything, Kobayashi was losing ground to Buemi and the leaders in front of Buemi. He definitely was not turning my head in this race, IMO.

Yeah, that must be it, Button just didn't really try to overtake him and his whining over the radio was just to keep you entertained. LOL!

Kobayashi drove a great race, but he bloated his copybook with that move against Nakajima. He definitely has great potential, like Nakajima showed in his first race, also in Brazil a couple of years ago.

[ioan]

glock to renault - that i doubt,I think Romain Grosjean deserves a fair shot.

Grosjean is a slow crashaholic.

[I am evil Homer]

You missed the critical point Ioan he is a slow french crashaholic ;) :D

[wedge]

He showed abit of inexperience with some agressive defensive moves, notably with Nakajima, but on the whole I think he showed his potential. I expect to see him on the grid next season. :)

Similar to Schumi/Hakkinen/Macau.

I don't think Koby did anything wrong. He had every right to block. From the rear onboard shot I thought it was quite obvious Naka left it a millisecond too late. He went right up to Koby's gearbox and veering for the inside but is was so obvious Koby was going to cover the inside so why didn't Naka choose to fake one way and try the outside?

[ioan]

You missed the critical point Ioan he is a slow french crashaholic ;) :D

Now that you mention it... ;)

[Wilderness]

Koba will be fine. He'll make a grate successor to MW as president of the GPDA.

[DexDexter]

I was very impressed overall with his performance and he kept Button behind him for quite a while. He showed abit of inexperience with some agressive defensive moves, notably with Nakajima, but on the whole I think he showed his potential. I expect to see him on the grid next season. :)

I think he did very well compared to Grosjean and Jaime who also have limited experience in an F1 car.

[wedge]

From the camera view facing up the straight it looked like Koby swerves under braking to defend the inside which gave Nakajima no time to react. I would just put it down to inexperience and a poor move on Kaka's part. Other than this I think Koby drove great on his debut. :)

It was on the middle of the straight, no where near the braking zone.

[jens]

Huh. Well, I have to say Kamui exceeded my expectations and managed to handle pressure extremely well with his defensive driving. But I continually have reservations about expecting him to become a major force in F1 in the future though. His GP2 seasons have been simply too hopeless and I can't believe he has turned into a great driver overnight.

He seems good in racing against other cars, but quite obviously lacked raw pace, especially in the second half of the race - probably something to do with lack of stamina to endure a full F1 GP. But other rookies - namely Grosjean and Alguersuari - were completely off-pace, so compared to them Kobayashi did well. But that's about it really and we even don't know, how good benchmarks those two might be in this respect.

[Jag_Warrior]

I thought Kobayashi did extremely well, considering this was his first race. So well, in fact, that I can imagine the guys in the Ferrari paddock probably wondered why their experienced reserves couldn't do as well as this raw rookie.

[Saint Devote]

The usual people wrap everything in anti-Button sentiment - so damn stupid.

Why didn't Jenson just DIVE through at first?
Because aside from that " side matter" of becoming world champion - he had no idea how the Jap would react in a tight situation.

Jenson had already locked up as Kobayashi swerved under braking and being extremely circumspect is good driving until a good opportunity is found and used to pass. This Jenson did.

New drivers, let alone veteran drivers that act like morons on the race track have frequently taken other drivers out of the race in a collision.

So those that are praising Kobayashi - wake the goddamn hell up! - one race indicates nothing [and I would list exampled but that would raise the ire of the moderator because it is motor racing history and considered off topic] and just ask Kazuki Nakajima what HE thinks of Kubayashi's swerving.

Now maybe in "normal" circumstances Jenson would say nothing, but the pressure winniing the world title and having a debuting driver being obstructive in the most vivid way as if he were racing in GP2 or F3, then calling the team on the radio and complaining is completely valid.

[airshifter]

The usual people wrap everything in anti-Button sentiment - so damn stupid.

Why didn't Jenson just DIVE through at first?
Because aside from that " side matter" of becoming world champion - he had no idea how the Jap would react in a tight situation.

Jenson had already locked up as Kobayashi swerved under braking and being extremely circumspect is good driving until a good opportunity is found and used to pass. This Jenson did.

New drivers, let alone veteran drivers that act like morons on the race track have frequently taken other drivers out of the race in a collision.

So those that are praising Kobayashi - wake the goddamn hell up! - one race indicates nothing [and I would list exampled but that would raise the ire of the moderator because it is motor racing history and considered off topic] and just ask Kazuki Nakajima what HE thinks of Kubayashi's swerving.

Now maybe in "normal" circumstances Jenson would say nothing, but the pressure winniing the world title and having a debuting driver being obstructive in the most vivid way as if he were racing in GP2 or F3, then calling the team on the radio and complaining is completely valid.

Whining is whining. Jenson couldn't make the pass stick, period. Even the commentators were saying that he needed to just get on with it and outdrive Kobayashi rather than complain on the radio.

Quit reducing yourself to thinking your opinion is the only one allowed and maybe you'll get over it. Until then, at least try to act like an adult and keep yourself from making blanket rants at everyone who doesn't agree. A lot of people on these forums have differing opinions, yet very few manage to reduce themselves to the level of cursing and ranting at everyone else.



For a first race, I thought he did very well. I think he did make a bad move with Nakajima, but to be honest it was no worse than what Webber did to Kimi. If he keeps driving with such intensity, he might be someone to watch.

[aryan]

Echoing the general sentiment here, I too thought Koba did very well.

Considering that he had never raced in F1 (his neck muscles probably took a beating in that anti-clock circuit, even experienced drivers suffer there).

Considering that he had not even drove an F1 car since Feb, and the car has had several modifications since

Considering that he had never raced in Brazil before and didn't know the track

He did very very well. I'm glad. Japan can be happy too. They seem to have a deserving F1 driver in the making.

[CaptainRaiden]

I think he did fantastic, and I was surprised on saturday itself. In his first ever qualifying session, he almost made it to Q3 and qualified better than Mr. champion Button driving a Brawn! Then in the race defended his position beautifully. No excuses there about weaving or blah blah. Button = In F1 for more than 10 years, 100 plus races. Kobayashi = First EVER F1 race!!

[CaptainRaiden]

There is one thing I don't understand. Why does Button's voice sound so distorted over the radio compared to all the other drivers? It almost sounds like he is crying.

[CaptainRaiden]

Who knows? To me he sounds more out of breath than crying, but as we know Button is very fit with his triathlon activity away from the track. Felipe also tends to sound panicked over his radio, so perhaps its due to the stresses on their bodies and how each individual handles it.. :)

Or maybe Brawn's radio equipment is crap. :p

Because Hamilton on the radio sounds like he's sitting in the commentary booth. :D

[SGWilko]

I think Kobayashi put in an impressive first drive. I can understand sides of the fence here.

He was a bit lary in the braking zone, but that is down to his apprenticeship in GP2 and general inexperience.

Button HAD to be careful, this was a rookie he had to pass, and he has the WDC at stake. He did the right thing - if he was wiped out he would look a right tit wouldn't he?

[Knock-on]

Or maybe Brawn's radio equipment is crap. :p

Because Hamilton on the radio sounds like he's sitting in the commentary booth. :D



It can be down to a number of factors.

Helmet design, equipment used, microphone type and placement (throat or helmet) and even type of voice pitch. Lower voices travel better than higher pitched voices.

[AndyL]

I'm abit surprised a few here class a single sentence made by Button as whining. He expressed that he thought Koby was blocking in the breaking zones, and as far as we know he mentioned this once over a muffled radio. Hardly whining, more frustration IMO, and lets not try to say that he is the only driver who gets frustrated over the radio. A few laps later he made his move and the rest is history. I've heard worst comments during a race from the likes of Trulli, Massa, Alonso and Hamilton to be honest, and even then I can relate. :)

One man's whine is another man's vinegar I guess.

I don't think Kamui did anything wrong, just defended hard. He showed some skillful driving, particularly to cut back inside after Button's first attempt at a pass when he ran too deep.
But on the other hand I can hardly blame Button for expressing his frustration, knowing that if he passed Kobayashi he would put himself in a position to win the championship.

I wonder why no-one has called Rubens on his comments over the radio, which were far more like whining than Button's.

[AndyL]

Or maybe Brawn's radio equipment is crap. :p

Because Hamilton on the radio sounds like he's sitting in the commentary booth. :D

You're right, McLaren's radio does sound very clear doesn't it. I guess McLaren have a bigger budget than Brawn :)

TBH I was quite glad the Brawn radio is a bit indistinct when he started singing at the end :eek:

[ioan]

I'm abit surprised a few here class a single sentence made by Button as whining.

Even one word can be classed like whining. Get over it, he was complaining and trying to have the race director help him out. That's called whining.

[ioan]

Who knows? To me he sounds more out of breath than crying, but as we know Button is very fit with his triathlon activity away from the track.

Than the logical result is that he was crying. Good, glad we settled that.

[wedge]

Calling Button a moaner/cry baby for not passing Koby is low and poor excuse to critcise Button.

It's all part and parcel of the emotions of winning/wanting to win.

Button ended up passing Koby so what is their to complain about?

[Knock-on]

I'm sorry wedge but Button has won the WDC and it needs to be devalued in some way... :p

It seems that the people that mention drivers whining on here are... how do I put this dispassionatly.... um.... whiners?

I mean for christs sake, we had some great driving from both drivers and yes, Kobi was moving around too much especially in the braking areas but both drivers did a great job. OK, I know Kobi eventually lost it but for a rookie, what a effort.

Can't we concentrate on the racing and stop the whining about whining?

[wedge]

I'm sorry wedge but Button has won the WDC and it needs to be devalued in some way... :p

Oh it is indeed devalued but the Koby incident smacks of sour grapes.

[gloomyDAY]

Well, that was fast.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/79960

[jens]

I have to admit that Kobayashi has clearly exceeded my expectations. But the mysterious question persist - if he is capable of good performances in F1, why on earth was he so hopeless in GP2? If Toyota wasn't in F1, no-one in hell would have given Kamui F1 chance. But then again based on his telemetry from F1 tests Toyota probably knew that Koba can be good and it could be worth giving him a chance.

There is quite a funny interview at Autosport.com, where he says that he was running out of money (hence no GP2 in the future) and if Toyota hadn't given him a chance, he would have gone back to Japan to make sushi. :p :

[ioan]

I have to admit that Kobayashi has clearly exceeded my expectations.

You weren't expecting him to beat Trulli?! :D :p :

[F1boat]

I have to admit that Kobayashi has clearly exceeded my expectations. But the mysterious question persist - if he is capable of good performances in F1, why on earth was he so hopeless in GP2?

Very puzzling, as he is GP2 Asia series champion.

[Garry Walker]

I have to admit that Kobayashi has clearly exceeded my expectations. But the mysterious question persist - if he is capable of good performances in F1, why on earth was he so hopeless in GP2?


Why was MS a joke in DTM, yet ruled in F1?
Why was Piquet such a great driver in GP2, yet a joke in F1?

[jens]

Why was MS a joke in DTM, yet ruled in F1?
Why was Piquet such a great driver in GP2, yet a joke in F1?

DTM is a completely different discipline to open-wheel racing, so that comparison is invalid. Former F1 drivers (Alesi, Häkkinen, Frentzen) haven't done really much in DTM anyway.

But if I'm going to expand my point, then so far GP2 results haven't "lied" too much about F1 performances. GP2 champions Rosberg, Hamilton, Glock have all established themselves in F1 in long-term. Hamilton was the most impressive champion and so he is in F1. Then we have a category of drivers, who were "good in GP2, but not champions" - Kovalainen, Speed, Piquet. All of them have shown some speed in F1, but not enough to impress significantly. I think Grosjean may fall into the same category. Nakajima (fifth in GP2) has been quite disappointing in F1.

So far it looks like only champions have been capable of cutting in F1 and those, who have been left behind, are not that impressive. But then comes somebody, who has been damn 16th (!!!) for two consecutive GP2 Main Series seasons, and impresses in F1! Looking at the record of other former GP2 drivers, he should be completely hopeless. This is what is puzzling.

Maybe Force India should give a seat to Karun Chandhok? Despite being nowhere in GP2, maybe he will be a real deal as well? :p :

[jens]

Very puzzling, as he is GP2 Asia series champion.

GP2 Asia Series has never had proper competition. Hülkenberg joined for a few GP2 Asia races in the 08/09 season and was beating Kobayashi and others immediately in these despite almost no experience in the cars. Now in 09/10 GP2 Asia series Valsecchi, who hasn't shown really anything so far, has taken a clear championship lead.

[BDunnell]

DTM is a completely different discipline to open-wheel racing, so that comparison is invalid. Former F1 drivers (Alesi, Häkkinen, Frentzen) haven't done really much in DTM anyway.

Agreed. There is a whole other thread on how some F1 drivers who got nowhere in F1 (Tarquini, Winkelhock) have adapted brilliantly to different types of touring car racing, while other far more successful F1 drivers (Mansell, Häkkinen) didn't.



So far it looks like only champions have been capable of cutting in F1 and those, who have been left behind, are not that impressive. But then comes somebody, who has been damn 16th (!!!) for two consecutive GP2 Main Series seasons, and impresses in F1! Looking at the record of other former GP2 drivers, he should be completely hopeless. This is what is puzzling.

I suppose the truth is that some drivers, for reasons that are all but impossible to define, find their true level in F1 and not in the lower formulae. I am trying to think of other similar examples, but am struggling. I know there are some.

[BeansBeansBeans]

I suppose the truth is that some drivers, for reasons that are all but impossible to define, find their true level in F1 and not in the lower formulae. I am trying to think of other similar examples, but am struggling. I know there are some.

Damon Hill's pre-F1 career was pretty patchy.

[Valve Bounce]

His first race today. And I have to say he drove pretty well.

He did very well to hold Button up. Pity about his incident with Nakajima though.
Still his drive was better than most newbies this season.

So it could be him and Glock partnered up next year.

Any thoughts?

Guy was way up in the points, and did better than many other more admired drivers. Well done!! :up:

[BDunnell]

Damon Hill's pre-F1 career was pretty patchy.

True, as was Nigel Mansell's.

[BeansBeansBeans]

Ultimately very few drivers get a shot at F1. When the chance comes, whatever obstacles get in the way (lack of testing, poor car...etc), it is up to the driver to get themselves noticed.

Kobayashi has done that, and who'd bet against him lining up on the grid next year?

[Valve Bounce]

Ultimately very few drivers get a shot at F1. When the chance comes, whatever obstacles get in the way (lack of testing, poor car...etc), it is up to the driver to get themselves noticed.

Kobayashi has done that, and who'd bet against him lining up on the grid next year?

I tell ya what!! I had to turn the volume down watching it on replay last night, and I could figure out who the hell this guy KOB was on the text at the bottom of the screen running high up in the points. I just wonder where he would have come on a two stopper.

[jens]

I suppose the truth is that some drivers, for reasons that are all but impossible to define, find their true level in F1 and not in the lower formulae. I am trying to think of other similar examples, but am struggling. I know there are some.

Or another explanation could be that Kobayashi is another case of a sensitive driver, who couldn't adapt to GP2 car well, but somehow this TF109 car suits his driving style well. F1 history has seen several drivers, who shine in one team, but struggle in another for whatever reason (whenever I think about such 'enigma', Capelli is the first one, who springs to my mind :p :) .

[Malbec]

But if I'm going to expand my point, then so far GP2 results haven't "lied" too much about F1 performances. GP2 champions Rosberg, Hamilton, Glock have all established themselves in F1 in long-term. Hamilton was the most impressive champion and so he is in F1. Then we have a category of drivers, who were "good in GP2, but not champions" - Kovalainen, Speed, Piquet. All of them have shown some speed in F1, but not enough to impress significantly. I think Grosjean may fall into the same category. Nakajima (fifth in GP2) has been quite disappointing in F1.

So far it looks like only champions have been capable of cutting in F1 and those, who have been left behind, are not that impressive. But then comes somebody, who has been damn 16th (!!!) for two consecutive GP2 Main Series seasons, and impresses in F1! Looking at the record of other former GP2 drivers, he should be completely hopeless. This is what is puzzling.

Look at what teams the champs you talk about drove for in GP2, IIRC Rosberg and Hamilton drove for ART which has always been a good team. Thats like going into F1 and getting a McLaren or Ferrari drive from the start. Kobayashi ended up at DAMS which is a so-so team. Of the drivers you name, perhaps Romain Grosjean is the biggest disappointment.

Whilst you may argue that GP2 is a spec series, preparation and set-up experience make a lot of difference which is why the best drivers try to get seats at particular teams where they know they have the best chance of shining.

As for Kobayashi I'm both happy and surprised at his performance but he has only had two races, he'll have to prove himself quick over an entire season assuming he gets a seat. He's yet to convince me.

[Ranger]

Look at what teams the champs you talk about drove for in GP2, IIRC Rosberg and Hamilton drove for ART which has always been a good team. Thats like going into F1 and getting a McLaren or Ferrari drive from the start. Kobayashi ended up at DAMS which is a so-so team. Of the drivers you name, perhaps Romain Grosjean is the biggest disappointment.

Kobayashi's performance in GP2 wouldn't be questioned if his team-mate didn't score twice as many points as him over two years.

That's the major anomaly given Kamui's two successful Grands Prix to date.

[gloomyDAY]

Toyota is going to bail soon, so Kamui will have to make sushi at his dad's restaurant.

[F1boat]

Kobayashi's performance in GP2 wouldn't be questioned if his team-mate didn't score twice as many points as him over two years.

That's the major anomaly given Kamui's two successful Grands Prix to date.

But he is a GP2Asia champion. It is likely that the team was unable to setup the car for him. I have no other explanation.

[millencolin]

someone better hire him... he may not be a world champion, but he has that 'INSANE' factor that has been missing since the days of Sato.

F1 needs drivers like Kamui, one that forces a move instead of waiting for it to happen.

[ShiftingGears]

He deserves a ride. Pity he won't get one as good as Toyota now.

[Sonic]

Kobayashi's performance in GP2 wouldn't be questioned if his team-mate didn't score twice as many points as him over two years.

That's the major anomaly given Kamui's two successful Grands Prix to date.

With regards to his team mate beating him in GP2. Kobay beat that same team mate to the GP2Asia championship. Its strange but the lower formulas are peppered with drivers who peak and dip without obvious reasons.