Baltimore moves closer to holding street race

[MDS]

The Baltimore Sun reports that the city is getting closer to committing to hosting a street race. Basically its in the city's hands right now as Terry Angstadt wrote a letter asking the city to get on board. Apparently most of the construction costs will come from private funds, but the city is still going to have to kick in some support, even if it is only in-kind donations like offering up city workers to help build the course.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/bal-sp.streetracing07aug07,0,5536253.story

[Placid]

I hope is a 2+ mile course.

[Chamoo]

I hope is a 2+ mile course.

I hope it doesn't happen. Cleveland is waiting. Loudon is waiting. Milwaukee is trying to come back. Pocono could be done if we really wanted.

We don't need a bunch more street circuits. Just need some more real race courses. We have enough temporary tracks and there are plenty of options in the North-east. We don't need to fill the schedule with a bunch of temporary circuits that fill the schedule so that we excluse these real permanent circuits.

[nigelred5]

IIRC, there are approx 23 million people within a 100 mile radius of Washington DC and over 30 if you extend that out to 150............... That's a big market to plunk a race in the middle of. One that is also built around tourism, one with several thousand hotel rooms smack in the middle of the proposed track and 100's of resturaunts and attractions within a 1/2 mile of the proposed course.

I would be very happy with a race in Baltimore AND Loudon, but the two are hardly serving the same markets. Baltimore is not in the North-East. Loudon drew houseflys the last time the IRL was there, which I suspect is why a stadium course in Foxboro was even on the radar. As much as I would love to see another race on one of my favorite short tracks, I'll not hold my breath.

This year's attendance aside, Milwaukee has had constant problems with attendance over the last 15 years and is essentially already served by races in Chicago and Iowa. Cleveland is too close to Mid Ohio IMHO, so I'll say, pick one. Joe Mattioli has said point blank he would never host another Indycar race, ever and it's entirely too bumpy for Indycars. He's spent a fortune on making pocono great for the fans, he needs to finally redo the track.

I'm seeing a trend in that The series wants to try new markets, not beat down old dead horses racing left for a reason. I also wouldn't minimize the influence Comcast(Versus) may play in a Baltimore Race. They have been the major cable provider in this area for over 40 years and have their hands very deep in the sports entertainment market in the Baltimore Washington and philadelphia areas. I'd call it a Home race for Comcast and Versus.

[NickFalzone]

I agree that Comcast/Versus is a reason for the Baltimore race. My thing with it is, I'd love for another race to be nearby that I can drive to, but do we really want another street race? If it replaces a street or road race, OK. But if it comes at the expense of an oval... I don't like it. I dont remember what the overall road/oval mix was in the height of CART, but the IRL is getting close to it if not surpassing it with these goals of Maryland and Gillette Stadium courses. Temporary street circuits should be a small portion of the IRL schedule, at most 1/4 of the races and even that is too much IMO.

[nigelred5]

I wonder how the proposed Champcar race in Philly would have gone if comcast had been on board with Versus at the time. It had tons of opposition from the fine arts people, but that could have been a sweet race down Ben Franklin Parkway

I don't exactly care for the layout proposed, but construction has pretty much dictated the pits have to be in the stadium lots, so it skews the track west from the Inner Harbor. I'd much rather see it shifted east towards little italy

[MDS]

One of the reasons why street races are gaining favor over ovals is because it solves a lot of marketing problems. You can't go after sponsors with a pitch that is essentially "We race on a lot of the same tracks NASCAR does, but with much smaller crowds and a fraction of their TV rating."

I'm sure what the IRL is being told that in order to attract sponsors you must offer something different and no one else in America is doing street racing. It's an entirely unique way to reach markets like Baltimore that aren't being reached by major auto racing. Whether you like it or not it gives the IRL a unique selling point. By expanding street races they can reach markets NASCAR can't while offering a unique product that looks great in print ads and television. While it might not be the best racing. Although St Pete and Toronto were both compelling this year, its a solution to the problem presented by racing in front of a third-sold ovals in NASCAR markets.

I think the long term solution is a combination approach. Find cities that work for street races, like Toronto and Long Beach and add new ovals as the come available and partner with SMI, because ISC is not going to help the ICS grow. I think there is going to have to be more ovals built on the Iowa model for the ICS to have success on ovals. Smaller tracks with moderate investments that want to build events in underserved markets over the long term.

[PA Rick]

Does anyone know if Cleveland would be willing to host another race? I still contend it's the best place to watch a race, and the best place to be after the race.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I can see why they want the market. I can see why Baltimore would want a race since it is something the area doesn't have, BUT unless the street course they come up with is different from the one I saw in the Balitmore paper when I was down there a month or so ago, I cant see this track working.

Street courses laid out around stadia and exhibition grounds for the most part are the way to go if you are going to take this route, since you need room for stands and the paddock. That said, The track I saw didn't do much for me, and with all those sharp 90's, I just keep thinking point and squirt. Toronto has lots a lot its character with corner 11 being changed a few years back but it has character a plenty compared to this track.

I think the world is tired of street races in cities all trying to make a splash.

As for them going back to Loudon, a HUGE difference would be SMI would be the co-promotor, and they dislike failing at anything. If they think the IRL there can work, then they I think have to be take seriously. This Gillette Stadium street course sounds like a pipe dream to me, and while Baltimore may happen (and I hope they prove me wrong), I just know I am tired of street circuits that don't work.

With all the great circuits and ovals in North America, comprimise laden street courses are a dangerous game. Toronto worked because the market was starved for big league racing back in 86. Now the novelty has worn off and I wonder whether the race has lost it's cachet or is the IRL? Long Beach is a hit and party and wonderful, but beyond that, there are few street races on the IRL calender or CART calender that really had much staying power. St. Pete's appears to be, and I hope it sticks, but I think it has the cachet of not being a boring layout.

Street races are to be like fine wine, rare, and used with caution.

[Chamoo]

I think alot of the talk about the proposed event around Gillette Stadium has to do with the potential of Gillette being the title sponsor the IRL is looking for.

Rumors came out that Menard's and Gillette were the two top options for the title sponsorship. Gillette Stadium and the Patriots are partially owned by the Gillette family I believe, which might explain why the IRL is trying to please them by racing at their stadium.

[MDS]

I think alot of the talk about the proposed event around Gillette Stadium has to do with the potential of Gillette being the title sponsor the IRL is looking for.

Rumors came out that Menard's and Gillette were the two top options for the title sponsorship. Gillette Stadium and the Patriots are partially owned by the Gillette family I believe, which might explain why the IRL is trying to please them by racing at their stadium.

Actually no Gillette the company is a wholly-owned division of Proctor and Gamble, they own the naming rights to the stadium, which is owned by Robert Kraft who also owns the Patriots.

P&G basically allows their brands to operate as their own companies and Gillette were to come into the IRL it would be the best possible title sponsor for the ICS at this point. If they deal works well for Gillette it might generate enough interest inside P&G to bring in some of their other brands, which include Old Spice, Gain, Tide, Tag body spray, Ivory, Head & Shoulders, Dawn, Febreeze, Mr. Clean, Pringles, and Vicks. So you can see where one deal could realistically lead to two or three more down the road if some of their product heads saw the value and wanted to get involved in sponsorship.

So yeah, if I had a choice between Gillette and Menards, even if the pay was equal I'd go with Gillette. I hope this deal gets done.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I hope it does too MDS, but it still doesn't change the fact racing around a football stadium pales compared to racing on a real race track.

Gillette has to understand what is best for the sport aesthetically, and while a good street course is worth having, most haven't been worth having....

[MDS]

And I get that Mark, but if there is one thing the IRL is hurting from it is a lack of household brands involved in sponsorship. If Gillette were to come on board it could be a massive signal to other companies, and fans, that the IRL has credibility again (or for the first time ever depending on how you look at it). I would be willing to give them whatever they want to get on board, and if that means a race around the stadium they brand near their corporate headquarters instead of a good oval Like NHMS I'd say, "Yes sir, is there anything else we can provide."

Also, P&G ownes As The World Turns, so if I had some hot young guy like Mario Moraes, Ryan Hunter Reay, Nelson Phillipe, Rafa Matos, or someone who could act, except for Mike Conway, (Who should never been shown without a full-face helmet and could get them on the show essentially playing themselves as a love interest that would be another way P&G could help cross promote the series.

[nigelred5]

The proposed Baltimore track really isn't "around" the stadiums. ACtually, the track they showed actually never enters the parking lots at the stadium complex. While it doesn't quite come across on street maps or even the aerial views, there actually CAN be quite a few nice high speed bends, switchback corners and interseting corners in additon to some significant elevation changes, it's just they would need to commit to a much longer track, probably close to three miles long actually to incorporate them and be able to utilize the parking lots in the Camden yards complex for pits and a paddock. Light street would be the only other divided street where a pit could be incorporated, but that would then be difficult to get the track down there on a decent sized street, and that gets into a nursing home and residential area I'm sure they want to avoid.

[call_me_andrew]

I wonder how the proposed Champcar race in Philly would have gone if comcast had been on board with Versus at the time. It had tons of opposition from the fine arts people, but that could have been a sweet race down Ben Franklin Parkway

I don't exactly care for the layout proposed, but construction has pretty much dictated the pits have to be in the stadium lots, so it skews the track west from the Inner Harbor. I'd much rather see it shifted east towards little italy

Upon further consideration, Fairmount Park would have been better than the Ben Franklin Parkway.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m315/mustang6172/phillytrack4.jpg

I don't know how they can put the pits next to Camden Yards during baseball season. And that area is just one big grid iron anyway so be prepared for all 90-degree turns.

[nigelred5]

The pits are shown in the service Road along Russell Street adjacent to the player's/personnel parking lot on the south side of Oriole Park. THe maps I've seen show entering pit lane just after they come off of Camden
Street on the north side of Oriole Park. The proposed course uses both sides of Russell Street down just south of the MLK Blvd Overpass to a Hairpin. I'd actually rather see some sort of use of the lots under the MLK overpass and then come back out onto Russel Street instead of just a Hairpin but the access to the lots is pretty tight and restricted to only a couple entrances.
Yes, the majority of it will be 90's but the intersection of Russell/Eutaw and Pratt Streets as well as Pratt and Light streets are not 90's and the turn around Harborplace onto Light street COULD be 150 mph+ corner if they were running it down prat street further.

I still wich the proposal would push the track up to include Lombard which is very wide and has a nice series of very high speed corners and a great hill. to climb or descend but I realize it creates a lot of severe access and transportation problems with the federal Courthouse and a downtown fire house.

[nigelred5]

Upon further consideration, Fairmount Park would have been better than the Ben Franklin Parkway.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m315/mustang6172/phillytrack4.jpg

I don't know how they can put the pits next to Camden Yards during baseball season. And that area is just one big grid iron anyway so be prepared for all 90-degree turns.


I agree Fairmount Park ould have been a good option for a track, but the existing roads are fairly narrow. It was one that I actually supported as a semi-permanent venue that a city like Philadelphia should entertain as a multi-use facility for not only auto racing, but a permanent venue for cycling, foot races, concerts, etc. While it could provide a good race track, it would be a nightmare to get any sort of a crown in there for a race, there are minimal facilities for supporting anything close to a race crowd, and Philadelphia doesn't exactly have a track record of shelling out tons of cash for such a project. How long did it take to replace the Vet??

[nigelred5]

According to WBAL, the city has given the group a two year authorization to enter into formal negotiations to reach an agreement with the IRL to hold the race. The interview also showed the state's sports promotion agency and the downtown partnership are supporting the negotiations as well. Im sure money will eventually be an issue but it's moving forward for now.

[Lee Roy]

As a Maryland taxpayer, I'm holding my wallet tightly.

I think I'll fire off a letter to my State Representatives and fill them in on past failures.

[nigelred5]

As a victim of state finances, I mean a state employee in a 100% federally funded agency the state has essentially stolen money from, I've suffered withheld reimbursements for personal expenses, a loss of 5 days salary, and no pay raise in 4 years.

Those failures have been due to poor venues, the split, crappy courses, failure of a series, shady businessmen, and construction.
Were you against the football match last month that was publicly subsidized that brought an estimated $15-$20 million to the Baltimore tourism industry for a 1 day event?

Give it a chance and lets see what public investment is actually necessary.

And yes, I'm on my break, typing this on my Ipod, not federally owned computers. ;)

[Lee Roy]

Should I assume you are not a Baltimore resident? Unless funding is requested from the State, as opposed to the City, why would you care?



The interview also showed the state's sports promotion agency and the downtown partnership are supporting the negotiations as well.

I'll just suggest to my State Representatives that they contact the managment at the Dover and Richmond race tracks, as well as the owners of the now defunct Nazareth speedway, and ask them how much support "Indy Car" racing has in the Mid-Atlantic region before they allow taxpayer funding to be spent on this.

The record is there for them to see.

Also, maybe have them contact Denver, Detroit, Las Vegas, San Jose, Houston, Washington DC and a few other places that have probably slipped my mind now and suggest they ask how their street races are doing now.

[nigelred5]

I'll just suggest to my State Representatives that they contact the managment at the Dover and Richmond race tracks, as well as the owners of the now defunct Nazareth speedway, and ask them how much support "Indy Car" racing has in the Mid-Atlantic region before they allow taxpayer funding to be spent on this.

The record is there for them to see.

Also, maybe have them contact Denver, Detroit, Las Vegas, San Jose, Houston, Washington DC and a few other places that have probably slipped my mind now and suggest they ask how their street races are doing now.

They have to have the support of the state to use the State owned Stadium complex in any way. Their support can simply be in the form of approval of a request for use.

Your middle Atlantic examples, ALL ovals. Apples to oranges and tainted by the split in most cases.

Dover was a joke and ages ago. Ask Dover's management about Long Beach. Do you dispute that event's sucess? How long did they own the race? The Indycars had no business what so ever being on Dover Downs in the first place and that was what, the first or second year of the original formation of the IRL? Dover's management was also less than forthoming about real impact of their race track when an oval was proposed in Baltimore. They did everything they could to shoot that project down.

Nazareth is defunct because ISC shut it down because it was competetion to their preferred races. If the events were so poorly attended, why did ISC insist on ZERO racing use of the property by potential buyers? To protect their markets. Race attendance for the IRL events were so poor because It was strongly a traditional CART venue in Andretti's hometown while he was on the other side of the split. Even locals didn't attend. Honda accounted for the majority of the few people that did attend I knew absolutely no one that attended the IRL event when they tried to race there. The race eventually failed simply because ISC provided zero support for the event after the split and shut the track down. Pikes Peak originally suffered a similar fate but NASCAR finally ot the picture noone wanted them there. It was also hardly in downtown Denver less than 1/2 mile off of I-95, and directly linked to two rail lines.

Washington DC had very good attendance for a parking lot sportscar race at a staduim. One in the middle of a residential neighborhood with NOTHING anywhere near the track and only "failed" because the promoter "failed" to grease a certain politician's pockets and because it was less than 100 feet in some places from single family homes.

Richmond is a great track but again, an entirely different type of event at a fairgrounds track too small for these cars, and is fairly far away from any attractions or amenities. A great one and MY personal favorite for NASCAR I will add. but it is three hours south of Baltimore and in the heart of Nascar country. Not a quick ride for anyone north of Baltimore for an event that doesn't finish up until 10PM or so on a saturday night.


Denver "failed" when their sponsors went tango uniform.The crowd was good and the race was good. The series foolishly switched the race weekend to clash with a well established traditional event in Denver.

Houston didn't fail, The series that held the race merged/was taken over by the IRL. Crowds and support were good and they actually have a promoter that WANTS the race back.

EVERYTHING in Detroit has failed and the roads on Belle Isle were always to narrow for most of the course. How in the world they justified construction of a new stadium in Detroit escapes me.

Vancouver was only lost to construction for the Olympics which made construction of the race course nigh impossible. Ther WAS a possibility of the race returning until CART went TU. Crowds were never a problem.

San Jose had so many things wrong with it I was GLAD it failed. IT was Horrible from the day it was proposed. Best thing that happened at that race was a fist fight beween two Canadiansd
The LasVegas street race had a shaky promoter from the start, was a champcar event in their last season and was in a part of town few people want to go to for anything other than quarter slots and watered down drinks. If Las Vegas attendance for the IRL was so bad, why did/does SMI actually want them back?

I suggest that Oval racing on inappropriate tracks in this area were the problem, not a lack of fans. You aren't going to out-NASCAR NASCAR in this area as the IRL tried to do for years.

They are proposing an event in many ways much more in tune with the type of street festival event peope in this area actually expect in Baltimore.
How about they talk to StPete, Long Beach, Cleveland, Houston, Vancouver and Toronto, hell even Monaco, that all have had successful races in venues much more comparable to an event in Baltimore than any of the tracks you cite. What they can learn from ANY of the events is to have realistic expectations.

[nigelred5]

It'll be interesting if it's proposed on Labor Day weekend. Usually street races depend heavily on the local racing organizations, almost always SCCA in the states, to provide the "feet on the ground" to pull it off. The local SCCA group already has their flagship event, the double MARRS, on that weekend at Summit Point. It's the biggest event of the year for them. I don't see them giving it up.

I agree, that's a major problem that someone with your local experience should keep them aware of. I'm not sure that Labor Day weekend would be a good slot either but they have to schedule around the Ravens so ther eis a pretty tight window to erect and tear down the course.

IMHO, the Orioles crowds are far less of a problem to schedule around since they will continue to suck for the foreseeable future. Even though it directly affects Oriole Park, you could probably still hold a game saturday night unless it were the Sox or the Yankees and not terribly affect access to the stadium. Anytime earlier in the summer would be a mistake due to the heat and later really runs into problems with the Raven's games that dominate the area on game weekends. They would probably have to look at least a 3 week away game schedule and I'm not sure how well that will go over with the Ravens as they like to have at least a first or second week home game. I suppose the proposed course really doesn't show a whole lot around Raven's stadium itself.

[MDS]

The Baltimore Business Journal has more details. Honestly it all seems pretty plausible, they're finding private investors, they're keeping city financial backing reasonable, and really other than the Ravens what does Baltimore have going for it? I think the Oriols still play there, but they haven't been relevant in decades, they're kinda like the Kansas City Royals, but with a dumber name.

The 130,000 attendance figure is clearly cumulative number, but it could draw a paid race day crowd of 20,000 to 35,000 and that's not bad for the city.

http://www.bizjournals.com/baltimore/stories/2009/08/17/daily6.html

[Lee Roy]

They have to have the support of the state to use the State owned Stadium complex in any way. Their support can simply be in the form of approval of a request for use.

Your middle Atlantic examples, ALL ovals. Apples to oranges and tainted by the split in most cases.

Dover was a joke and ages ago. Ask Dover's management about Long Beach. Do you dispute that event's sucess? How long did they own the race? The Indycars had no business what so ever being on Dover Downs in the first place and that was what, the first or second year of the original formation of the IRL? Dover's management was also less than forthoming about real impact of their race track when an oval was proposed in Baltimore. They did everything they could to shoot that project down.

Nazareth is defunct because ISC shut it down because it was competetion to their preferred races. If the events were so poorly attended, why did ISC insist on ZERO racing use of the property by potential buyers? To protect their markets. Race attendance for the IRL events were so poor because It was strongly a traditional CART venue in Andretti's hometown while he was on the other side of the split. Even locals didn't attend. Honda accounted for the majority of the few people that did attend I knew absolutely no one that attended the IRL event when they tried to race there. The race eventually failed simply because ISC provided zero support for the event after the split and shut the track down. Pikes Peak originally suffered a similar fate but NASCAR finally ot the picture noone wanted them there. It was also hardly in downtown Denver less than 1/2 mile off of I-95, and directly linked to two rail lines.

Washington DC had very good attendance for a parking lot sportscar race at a staduim. One in the middle of a residential neighborhood with NOTHING anywhere near the track and only "failed" because the promoter "failed" to grease a certain politician's pockets and because it was less than 100 feet in some places from single family homes.

Richmond is a great track but again, an entirely different type of event at a fairgrounds track too small for these cars, and is fairly far away from any attractions or amenities. A great one and MY personal favorite for NASCAR I will add. but it is three hours south of Baltimore and in the heart of Nascar country. Not a quick ride for anyone north of Baltimore for an event that doesn't finish up until 10PM or so on a saturday night.


Denver "failed" when their sponsors went tango uniform.The crowd was good and the race was good. The series foolishly switched the race weekend to clash with a well established traditional event in Denver.

Houston didn't fail, The series that held the race merged/was taken over by the IRL. Crowds and support were good and they actually have a promoter that WANTS the race back.

EVERYTHING in Detroit has failed and the roads on Belle Isle were always to narrow for most of the course. How in the world they justified construction of a new stadium in Detroit escapes me.

Vancouver was only lost to construction for the Olympics which made construction of the race course nigh impossible. Ther WAS a possibility of the race returning until CART went TU. Crowds were never a problem.

San Jose had so many things wrong with it I was GLAD it failed. IT was Horrible from the day it was proposed. Best thing that happened at that race was a fist fight beween two Canadiansd
The LasVegas street race had a shaky promoter from the start, was a champcar event in their last season and was in a part of town few people want to go to for anything other than quarter slots and watered down drinks. If Las Vegas attendance for the IRL was so bad, why did/does SMI actually want them back?

I suggest that Oval racing on inappropriate tracks in this area were the problem, not a lack of fans. You aren't going to out-NASCAR NASCAR in this area as the IRL tried to do for years.

They are proposing an event in many ways much more in tune with the type of street festival event peope in this area actually expect in Baltimore.
How about they talk to StPete, Long Beach, Cleveland, Houston, Vancouver and Toronto, hell even Monaco, that all have had successful races in venues much more comparable to an event in Baltimore than any of the tracks you cite. What they can learn from ANY of the events is to have realistic expectations.

Tons of excuses for all the failures. But with the exception of the DC race (which I attended and enjoyed) the one constant throughout the list of failures is "Indy Cars", whether they be IRL or CART or Champ Car. I imagine it won't be long before we add Baltimore to the long list, if it does come to pass.

If you can't draw fans to a race track, particularly tracks that are near major urban centers like Richmond, Dover and Nazareth, then you ought not to be marketing a spectator-supported form of racing. Face it, the IRL get's lower TV ratings than a Shamwow infomercial. It has no future.

I predict another failure, and another group of taxpayers fleeced.

[MDS]

Tons of excuses for all the failures. But with the exception of the DC race (which I attended and enjoyed) the one constant throughout the list of failures is "Indy Cars", whether they be IRL or CART or Champ Car. I imagine it won't be long before we add Baltimore to the long list, if it does come to pass.

If you can't draw fans to a race track, particularly tracks that are near major urban centers like Richmond, Dover and Nazareth, then you ought not to be marketing a spectator-supported form of racing. Face it, the IRL get's lower TV ratings than a Shamwow infomercial. It has no future.

I predict another failure, and another group of taxpayers fleeced.

Seriously how many oval races have worked long term in the IRL's history? I count two three, the rest only get crowds because of mass ticket giveaways or "Season ticket packages."

The IRL has a history of failure, and if they only do what's historically successful they'll have a schedule of Long Beach, Texas, Indy, Iowa, because those are the only events that seem to be successful.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I find it funny that the oval loving guy that is Lee Roy can come over here and rip the IRL for wanting another street race. I would think he should be happy, since he has been very straight up in saying he thinks the IRL is doomed anyhow. That's great, then let Baltimore be a nail in the coffin or not.

I personally tho will agree with some of the detractors of street racing for this one reason: I don't think street races make for great TV. They CAN if the course is well designed and the visuals have some charsima to the casual viewer but I will say that I have supported Toronto in person for years, and have always liked watching St. Pete's, Long Beach and Surfer's on TV. The problem I have to admit that most street races have lousy passing areas, and this version of the IRL doesn't seem to be able to race on road/street races like the old CART did. A spec racer IndyCar works against the series at all of these venues, and I think for that reason before we go to Baltimore, we better fix the car. Or Lee Roy will be right..the IRL is dead meat.

Texas draws well, Indy is Indy, Milwaukee had a crap promoter but drew well, the New Hampshire people WANT a race; Kansas and Chicago may do ok once the gun to NASCAR fans for them to take IRL tickets is removed, so we will have an acid test of the oval fans resolve. All during the split, IRL fans told me they felt alienated. Tony George said Indy Car fans wanted ovals. Well they do....but the problem is they may want NASCAR on them.

If this series is going to survive, it cannot, it MUST not race at tracks that wont show the cars in their best light, and it must NOT lean towards all ovals, or all street courses or all road courses. It was a mix that drove the CART of the late 80's into the top OW series outside of f1 and rivaling NASCAR. Somehow, we need to get this version of the IRL to hit on that formula and stick with it. I don't see Baltimore as part of that but I guess we wont know if we don't let them try.

[nigelred5]

Is the new car still on track for 2011? If cars can't draft and pass pass on those long runs down Pratt, Russell and Light streets into hairpins and hard turns, Then I don't have an answer for roadcourse racing anywhere. That shot down Pratt should be at least half mile long itself on a very wide street with some pretty hard braking at the end.

I think the entire Inner Harbor comes across very well on TV. It always has in tv shots during any of the sporting events held in Baltimore. Sure beats the hell out of the parking lot around Reliant stadium in South Houston.
The Constellation, World Trade Center, Harborplace, the National Aquarium, The Powerplant Complex, downtown Baltimore's Skyline, Oriole Park, The Bromo Seltzer Tower and Federal Hill will all make a fantastic backdrop on TV, which is exactly what a city with a very large tourism and convention industry counts on. Use Google Earth or maps and take a look at all the pin drops along the proposed course.

[nigelred5]

I hope is a 2+ mile course.

2.4m as proposed and I could give you a better one that would be about 3.