Nice guys finsish 2nd.

[EagleEye]

Ed Carptenter drove the race of his life in Kentucky, only to come up on the short end at the checker. While most in the crowd were behind his efforts, his fellow drivers offered the biggest compliments. Ed raced hard, and he raced clean and hopefully the team will enter a new age of being competitive.

The team’s previous high, a 2nd place with RHR earlier this year, was the highlight to what has been at times a confusing team. Just last week the team languished at the rear of the field in Edmonton, which provided more fuel to the fire that the team made a mistake of letting RHR go, instead of ED. But on this night, maybe with his job on the line, Ed stepped up big-time.

Usually, the driver who never puts a wheel wrong and whose pit crew performed flawlessly guarantee a win. Not this time.

Ryan Briscoe, who has been a bridesmaid five times this year, almost stuffed his car into the wall twice, came through with a brilliant drive. Watching these two nice guys race for the win while being chased by hard-luck driver of the year Tony Kanaan showed that nice guys do not have to win to be admired. TK had a car that was a handful, yet he kept it off the walls, and other cars to finish a well earned, and long over due third.

Everyone had great things to say about their fellow drivers, as there was plenty of give an take, just the kind of pre-race advice given to in the pre-race drivers meeting. The sole exception was the soon to be departing Danica Patrick, who raised the ire of several drivers with her blocking tactics. “Next time, I’m not backing off and they will be peeling her off the wall” said one irate charger who had tried to be patient while passing Patrick. Another driver would not comment, but offered he was “on the way over to talk to her.”

Power, Rahal and Moraes also had drives worthy of better results, but the lack of yellows and number of cars still running at the finish prevented what might have been a four wide rush to the finish.

With very little practice, and with threatening skies that produced a few rain drops during driver’s introductions, it seemed that God himself wanted to watch the race.

For the first time in a long time, oval racing was fun again.

[NickFalzone]

Everyone had great things to say about their fellow drivers, as there was plenty of give an take, just the kind of pre-race advice given to in the pre-race drivers meeting. The sole exception was the soon to be departing Danica Patrick, who raised the ire of several drivers with her blocking tactics. “Next time, I’m not backing off and they will be peeling her off the wall” said one irate charger who had tried to be patient while passing Patrick. Another driver would not comment, but offered he was “on the way over to talk to her.”


What else is new.

[TURN3]

What else is new.

I'd be interested to know who the 2 drivers were. As I commented during the race, the worst 1 of about 5 or 6 that the cameras caught was on Dario. I'd bet good money he was one of the 2 referenced commentors. I wouldn't be surprised if the other was Dixon. By process of elimination, Helio, Ed, & Ryan were never back there. That leaves maybe Moraes early on, Kanaan, Rahal, Power, and the 2 Ganassi guys. If a deal with Ganassi is imminent (NASCAR or otherwise), I'd be not pissing off those 2.

[grungex]

:up: Nice OP.

[NickFalzone]

My guess is Rahal on the first comment, and Dario or Dixon on the 2nd. It does seem like most oval races this season have ended with one driver or another being pissed about her blocking with a slower car.

[grungex]

Hey, she's the fifth best driver in the league, they should know better than to try to pass her.

[garyshell]

Hey, she's the fifth best driver in the league, they should know better than to try to pass her.


Despite your continuing to mis-characterize the original quote, no one ever said she was "fifth best driver in the league". What was said was "fifth best driver in points".

Gary

[grungex]

Oh really? I think you are the one mis-characterizing the quote.


Maybe it's because at this point in the season, and based on results so far, she is the 5th best driver in the series?

[garyshell]

Maybe it's because at this point in the season, and based on results so far, she is the 5th best driver in the series? Or do facts interfere with bashing her?


Despite your continuing to mis-characterize the original quote, no one ever said she was "fifth best driver in the league". What was said was "fifth best driver in points".

Gary


Oh really? I think you are the one mis-characterizing the quote.


Please explain the difference between: "based on results so far, she is the 5th best driver in the series" and what I said: "fifth best driver in points".

And then go on to tell me how you were not mis-charactrizing it with: "fifth best driver in the league"???

Which one of us was closer to what starter REALLY said?

Gary

[grungex]

Well, gee, he actually said what I quoted, so I'd say you're the one desperately trying to spin it.

[garyshell]

I think it's me you're quoting and what I said was "based on results" she was fifth best. Which was accurate. And yes Gary, I know that points and results are the same. You are correct even if the words aren't the same.


I shouldn't have put quotes around "fifth best driver in the points" because I was paraphrasing you. Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa.

Gary

[garyshell]

Well, gee, he actually said what I quoted, so I'd say you're the one desperately trying to spin it.


Oh please. He said no such thing and you know it. Sure if you want to strip off the first part of the sentence he did. But that's parsing things for YOUR spin.

I repeat my question. What is the difference in what I wrote and the the original UNPARSED sentence as written by starter? Just so we can be clear here is the REAL quote not your shortened version. The underline is NOT my emphasis it is starter's.


Maybe it's because at this point in the season, and based on results so far, she is the 5th best driver in the series?

Gary

[drewdawg727]

I can guarantee Andretti was one of those comments, she cut him off twice in the first 3rd.

[Mad_Hatter]

I agree a good run by Ed Saturday. He's always a well spoken interview also.


Yeah drew, that peeling her off the wall comment sounds like it has Marco written all over it.

[SarahFan]

The sole exception was the soon to be departing Danica Patrick, who raised the ire of several drivers with her blocking tactics. .

EE...

can you give an idea when the announcement will be made?

[grungex]

Oh please. He said no such thing and you know it. Sure if you want to strip off the first part of the sentence he did. But that's parsing things for YOUR spin.

I repeat my question. What is the difference in what I wrote and the the original UNPARSED sentence as written by starter? Just so we can be clear here is the REAL quote not your shortened version. The underline is NOT my emphasis it is starter's.



Gary

Stripping off the first part of his sentence makes no substantive difference, because it is merely supportive to his assertion that she is the fifth best driver in the series. It's simple English, really, and you are trying to parse it in a way that changes his original conclusion. The basis for the argument in the other thread was that her results make her fifth best -- you really can't have it both ways, but you seem to be attempting just that.


Which part of "based on results" didn't do it for you? The only thing a racing driver can be judged on, over time, is results. No matter what anyone else may think there are 18 drivers in the series who have not done as well this year. That's not opinion or wishfull thinking, that is a fact. Spin all you want to but you can't change it. Danica, bless her little heart, is a competent race driver. Not championship material, at least in my opinion, but competent.

[TURN3]

I can guarantee Andretti was one of those comments, she cut him off twice in the first 3rd.

She did hammer Marco pretty good early on but with his handling issues, he wasn't in contention for the majority of the race. By that point his steam wasn't probably burning quite as hot. But wouldn't surprise me.


Yeah drew, that peeling her off the wall comment sounds like it has Marco written all over it.

Believe it or not, I'm going to bet this one came from Dario. He's usually pretty soft spoken but when warranted, he's going to put a little spice into it. I think Dario is one of the most respected drivers in the series and when he has a little zing to his comments it goes a long way.


My guess is Rahal on the first comment, and Dario or Dixon on the 2nd. It does seem like most oval races this season have ended with one driver or another being pissed about her blocking with a slower car.

Rahal is in the mix. Has to be between him, Dixon, and Franchitti.

EE...anyway you can reveal who these comments came from?

[TURN3]

With respect to the fifth best driver in the series, I did not take any emphasis on the "based on results" part when originally quoted. Fact is, she is fifth in points but even measuring her as the fifth best driver in the series based or results/points is a stretch. Any statement that she is the fifth best driver in the series is going to get criticed because it is so profoundly ridiculous. Points only say so much, and in her case it means she isn't close enough to competitive to be mixing it up, so she brings the car home safe. Remember NASCAR overhauled their entire system because a driver won the points not having won a race all year. Point is, just don't try to spin a Monet' into a Picasso. (I have no idea if those are spelled correctly and I'm not taking time to check).

[mileman]

Point is, just don't try to spin a Monet' into a Picasso. (I have no idea if those are spelled correctly and I'm not taking time to check).

Did you mean - you can't turn an apple into an orange? lol It's too bad that your "vast" knowledge of racing doesn't convert to art.

What I thought was going to be a thread about the nice job that Ed did Saturday - has quickly become a discussion of Danica's performance. Amazing! I'm so surprised!!

Now if you can just find a way to convert the "What's it (the IRL) worth?" and the "Humpy Wheeler's Indy 500" threads...

It should be easy...

[NickFalzone]

EE...

can you give an idea when the announcement will be made?

I wouldn't expect it much earlier than Homestead, even if she's already signed on the dotted line with SH or EGR. Andretti will probably know sooner than that though.

[NickFalzone]

Eagle Eye knows, but I think he's going to keep it quiet for the sake of his sources not going on the record. Suffice to say, these are folks that have had "the conversation" before, I believe at Milwaukee. She's pretty stubborn. I believe in NASCAR this sort of "fair play" amongst drivers is even more important, she's not going to be well liked if this is her game over there.

[beachgirl]

Did you mean - you can't turn an apple into an orange? lol It's too bad that your "vast" knowledge of racing doesn't convert to art.

What I thought was going to be a thread about the nice job that Ed did Saturday - has quickly become a discussion of Danica's performance. Amazing! I'm so surprised!!

Now if you can just find a way to convert the "What's it (the IRL) worth?" and the "Humpy Wheeler's Indy 500" threads...

It should be easy...

They ALL turn into a Danica thread, one way or the other.

If she does go to NASCAR, which frankly I am very doubtful and would be extremely surprised, she will be being peeled off the wall in very short order. Again, and again, and again.....until she either learns, or is let go.

[garyshell]

Stripping off the first part of his sentence makes no substantive difference, because it is merely supportive to his assertion that she is the fifth best driver in the series. It's simple English, really, and you are trying to parse it in a way that changes his original conclusion.

No substantive difference? You must be kidding. At least you got one thing right, it is simple English. The first phrase is not a supportive phrase, it is a conditional phrase. It sets the conditons or scope for the second one. Starter has even come on here to clarify that fact. But you seem to want to ignore that.

Whatever.

Gary

[TURN3]

Did you mean - you can't turn an apple into an orange? lol It's too bad that your "vast" knowledge of racing doesn't convert to art.

What I thought was going to be a thread about the nice job that Ed did Saturday - has quickly become a discussion of Danica's performance. Amazing! I'm so surprised!!

Now if you can just find a way to convert the "What's it (the IRL) worth?" and the "Humpy Wheeler's Indy 500" threads...

It should be easy...

Maybe you should read the first post of the thread. I merely commented on who the commentors were. Why would you quote my post as if to imply I'm the one turning this into a Danica bashing thread? Seems you have a real problem with it. So why do you continue to contribute to the very problem you're complaining of? I was on topic per the first post, maybe others weren't I don't know. But don't even single me out when you're further off topic than you're accusing me of being...that is pretty hypocritical.

Further, who ever proclaimed my "vast" knowledge of anything? While I'm impressed you seem to know it were artists I was making an analogy to, where is the missing link you think is between said vast knowledge and lack thereof with respect to art?

Go ahead and post me a private message if you can figure out a way to make sense of yourself. No sense in cluttering Ed's column up any further.

[champcarray]

I thought Ed drove a surprisingly good race. His post-race interview wasn't great, but it wasn't as bad as Tony's...

[grungex]

No substantive difference? You must be kidding. At least you got one thing right, it is simple English. The first phrase is not a supportive phrase, it is a conditional phrase. It sets the conditons or scope for the second one. Starter has even come on here to clarify that fact. But you seem to want to ignore that.

Whatever.

Gary

He has? I don't see him supporting your meager attempt at differentiation, whereas I offered another quote from him in the same thread that strongly reinforces my point. Just give it up.

In any event, I am left with the logical conclusion that you are of the opinion that Danica in no way deserves to be referred to as the fifth best driver in the series. A point on which we are in complete agreement.

[garyshell]

I think it's me you're quoting and what I said was "based on results" she was fifth best. Which was accurate. And yes Gary, I know that points and results are the same. You are correct even if the words aren't the same.


He has? I don't see him supporting your meager attempt at differentiation, whereas I offered another quote from him in the same thread that strongly reinforces my point. Just give it up.

In any event, I am left with the logical conclusion that you are of the opinion that Danica in no way deserves to be referred to as the fifth best driver in the series. A point on which we are in complete agreement.


If you didn't see starter supporting my differentiation you missed message number 9 in this thread (quoted above).

But just to put a close to this, we do have common ground on my thinking clearly she is not in the top five, when it comes to ability. Only when it comes to points.

Gary

[grungex]

Then why did you get your shorts in such a wad when I referred to her as the fifth best driver in the series?

Come to think of it, your original attack on my post is utter BS anyway -- where was my "continuing to mis-characterize the original quote" in the first place? Until you made this statement, that is.

[jackmart]

I bet marco is one. I didn't see any huge blocking by her but if that is the case they need to start calling penalties before someone ends up in the wall because of it.

I really wish we could know who those quotes are from.

[beachgirl]

Danica will never, ever be actually penalized for blocking. Ever. Warnings out the kazoo maybe, but no penalties. You cannot be mean to the Face Of The IRL. She might pack up her marbles and go home.

[garyshell]

Then why did you get your shorts in such a wad when I referred to her as the fifth best driver in the series?

Come to think of it, your original attack on my post is utter BS anyway -- where was my "continuing to mis-characterize the original quote" in the first place? Until you made this statement, that is.

Mea culpa! You are right. I went back over to the original thread and it was turn3 who was all over starter's case about the "fifth best driver". Initially, when I made the mis-characterize remark, I should have gone back to the ORIGINAL thread and re read things. But I didn't. That was a stupid mistake on my part. When you made the "fifth best driver" comment in this thread I assumed it was a continuation of the discussions in the other thread. It wasn't. I apologize.

Gary

[grungex]

No worries...

[garyshell]

No worries...


Thanks, but I really do feel bad about it. It was a REALLY stupid move on my part.

Gary

[grungex]

Hey, you had the good grace to apologize where few would. That makes you tops in my book... :up:

Now I feel bad for being snippy about it! :)

[garyshell]

Hey, you had the good grace to apologize where few would. That makes you tops in my book... :up:

Now I feel bad for being snippy about it! :)


Don't! We're good.

Gary

[TURN3]

Where do I come in with all of this? :D

[grungex]

It's all your fault! :D