BMW quit F1

[jens]

Too much bashing in this thread. When BMW was improving consistently in 2007-2008, those bashers were nowhere to be found, but now, when the team has finally faced a negative situation or even solution, the army has suddenly jumped into the limelight...

[Cooper_S]

Oooh... I think they where always there in the background... Williams fans mostly amd maybe a few old mini car owners as well.

[Knock-on]

Oooh... I think they where always there in the background... Williams fans mostly amd maybe a few old mini car owners as well.

Oh come on Cooper. Apart from a couple of members that like to villify teams and call members "haters", I think that most of us are happy to see a wide and varied grid of teams. Some we may support more than others as some drivers we support over others.

Just like we are horrified and saddened when a driver gets injured, as in the recent Massa incident, so we are saddened when a team disappears.

Nobody is against BMW but a few people are frustrated, like me, that BMW seem to have an option to pass on the team to new owners that isn't happening.

I'm an eternal optimist and hope a solution is found when we will see the team competing again in whatever guise :)

[truefan72]

Oh come on Cooper. Apart from a couple of members that like to villify teams and call members "haters", I think that most of us are happy to see a wide and varied grid of teams. Some we may support more than others as some drivers we support over others.

Just like we are horrified and saddened when a driver gets injured, as in the recent Massa incident, so we are saddened when a team disappears.

Nobody is against BMW but a few people are frustrated, like me, that BMW seem to have an option to pass on the team to new owners that isn't happening.

I'm an eternal optimist and hope a solution is found when we will see the team competing again in whatever guise :)


well said

[Roamy]

Oh come on Cooper. Apart from a couple of members that like to villify teams and call members "haters", I think that most of us are happy to see a wide and varied grid of teams. Some we may support more than others as some drivers we support over others.

Just like we are horrified and saddened when a driver gets injured, as in the recent Massa incident, so we are saddened when a team disappears.

Nobody is against BMW but a few people are frustrated, like me, that BMW seem to have an option to pass on the team to new owners that isn't happening.

I'm an eternal optimist and hope a solution is found when we will see the team competing again in whatever guise :)

Gee you wouldn't be pointing a finger at me would you???

Oh go ahead but I don't really hate the team just the principal.

[Cooper_S]

so how could thsid be?

from wikipedia after searching Sebastien vettel

"Vettel became BMW Sauber's third driver at the 2006 Turkish Grand Prix, when former incumbent Robert Kubica was called up to replace Jacques Villeneuve for the 2006 Hungarian Grand Prix.

Vettel impressed on his testing debut by setting fastest time in second Friday Free Practice before the race.[7] The young German also impressed on his second testing session in the 2006 Italian Grand Prix, setting the fastest time in both Friday practice sessions, a race weekend in which all the BMW cars were quick, with his predecessor Robert Kubica finishing on the podium in the race.

He was confirmed as BMW's test driver for 2007,[8] and also competed in the World Series by Renault Championship, where he had his first win at the Nürburgring. He was leading the championship when he was called up to F1 permanently, and his seat was taken by Michael Ammermüller.[9]

[edit] Formula One
Vettel made his Formula One debut at the 2007 United States Grand Prix, driving for BMW Sauber.

[edit] 2007: BMW Sauber

Following the serious crash of regular BMW driver Robert Kubica at the Canadian Grand Prix, Vettel substituted for him at the US Grand Prix and started in seventh position on the grid,[10] finishing in eighth position, thanks to Nico Rosberg's late retirement, to take his first F1 World Championship point and became the youngest driver ever to score a point in Formula One (at the age of 19 years and 349 days), a record previously held by Jenson Button – who was 20 years and 67 days old when he finished sixth at the 2000 Brazilian Grand Prix.[11]

[edit] 2007-2008: Toro Rosso

[edit] 2007

On July 31, 2007, BMW released Vettel to join Red Bull's Scuderia Toro Rosso team, replacing Scott Speed as race driver as of the Hungarian Grand Prix.[12] He earned approximately $165, 000 for finishing the season with Toro Rosso.[13] Before the race, it was also announced that Vettel would drive for STR in 2008.[14] His team-mate would be Sébastien Bourdais.[

so if you know so much about formula 1 why did you say red bull only loaned vettel for indy if he was a third driver for bmw as far back as 2006?

why does it say "On July 31, 2007, BMW released Vettel to join Red Bull's Scuderia Toro Rosso" ? how do you release a professional who doesnt have a contract with you?

and still f1 encyclopedia theres more points in my post than only vettel.

Sorry for the late reply...

First off, anyone who would employ wikipedia as a source of their 'facts' has IMO already lost the argument... however that aside.

I said correctly Vettel was is and was always under contract to Red Bull... even while driving for BMW. He was not loaned soely for the Indy race, he was loaned to BMW as 3rd driver... he raced because Kubica was injured and as 3rd driver that was his job... The release form his BMW contract was required because BMW still had a contract with Red Bull for Vettel to be 3rd Driver which had not yet expired... Red Bull (and Vettel) could have been made to wait until that contract expired but given it was great chance for Vettel (whom BMW admired) and Red Bull ultimately owned his contract, there was little to be gained in not releasing Vettel.

I am sorry if that is not made explicit in the wikipedia account... but then that is often the case with that unreliable site

[Knock-on]

Gee you wouldn't be pointing a finger at me would you???

Oh go ahead but I don't really hate the team just the principal.

Not at all Uncs.

You're an abraisive old redneck but like me, have oil running through your veins rather than bile ;)

[ratonmacias]

Sorry for the late reply...

First off, anyone who would employ wikipedia as a source of their 'facts' has IMO already lost the argument... however that aside.

I said correctly Vettel was is and was always under contract to Red Bull... even while driving for BMW. He was not loaned soely for the Indy race, he was loaned to BMW as 3rd driver... he raced because Kubica was injured and as 3rd driver that was his job... The release form his BMW contract was required because BMW still had a contract with Red Bull for Vettel to be 3rd Driver which had not yet expired... Red Bull (and Vettel) could have been made to wait until that contract expired but given it was great chance for Vettel (whom BMW admired) and Red Bull ultimately owned his contract, there was little to be gained in not releasing Vettel.

I am sorry if that is not made explicit in the wikipedia account... but then that is often the case with that unreliable site


So vettel was never going to drive seriously for bmw right? because he had a valid contract with red bull and then red bull subcontracted vettel to bmw?

so whats the point of grooming a young driver and letting him drive and test on your teams expense when you already know the team that has signed him will take him whenever he starts driving well?

i posted a few pages back many management blunders i think thiessen commited and the only one that caused an outrage was this vettel issue where thiessen was dumb as he paid for vettels grooming without anything to gain.

[Cooper_S]

The same can be said of all team who employ a 3rd driver... it was a fluke accident that gave Vettel a race seat... there is no indication that he would have been given a drive for 2008 (had Red Bull released him of course)

Now it is very clear that you have no ability to grasp this frankly simple arrangement, and so I can take it (again) that you actually are devoid of F1 knowledge and there is no further merit in responding to you.

Why not try the Chit Chat section you should find your level easy.

[Roamy]

Question and I don't know the answer
Was Vettel from the BMW driving series or stable

If yes the Thiessen is a idiot clear and simple
If no then good going Red Bull.

[Cooper_S]

Pre F1... Sebastian was to Red Bull as Hamilton was to McLaren, he was signed and supported by Red Bull at a young age and sponsored throughout his junior career... Yes Vettel raced in the Formula BMW this is fact.. and so did Nico Rosberg (who raced as a Finn not a German) and Nico Hulkenberg... they however where Williams backed.

The observant amongst you will notice that Vettel's helmet is not like other drivers who use national colours or are inspired buy other drivers passed... it is the Red Bull colours and logo... this is the helmet he wore in the BMW and during the USAGP in 2007.

[Roamy]

Thanks Cooper

So all is correct - Vettel should be with Red Bull and Kudos to Red Bull

[Cooper_S]

Indeed... and Kudos to Vettel for going Red Bull over BMW,

Although, had Vettel and Kubica been driving for the now defunct BMW.Sauber team and both now available to sign, that would have caused quite a stir in the driver market...

[ratonmacias]

The same can be said of all team who employ a 3rd driver... it was a fluke accident that gave Vettel a race seat... there is no indication that he would have been given a drive for 2008 (had Red Bull released him of course)

Now it is very clear that you have no ability to grasp this frankly simple arrangement, and so I can take it (again) that you actually are devoid of F1 knowledge and there is no further merit in responding to you.

Why not try the Chit Chat section you should find your level easy.

thanks for being so patronizing. but you imply that all the 3rd drivers have deals with other teams and not with the team they are being 3rd drivers. which i beg to differ.

what i dont grasp is why groom a driver that you wont be able to definitely sign because he has a long term contract? if he is a bad driver it affects your team if he turns out good the owner of the contractual rights will claim him back so why bother?

shouldnt thiessen look for a third driver that could be a long term prospect and build him up?

[Roamy]

thiessen is not the sharpest knife in the drawer

[ratonmacias]

or the brightest crayon in the pack but...

many people here love him.

in my view he is the guy every company has that cant stand cooler guys working with him so he brings down the whole division to his "level".

[truefan72]

or the brightest crayon in the pack but...

many people here love him.

in my view he is the guy every company has that cant stand cooler guys working with him so he brings down the whole division to his "level".

lol seen and worked with a few of those in my past corporate career

[ioan]

This thread looks more and more like a chapter from Dilbert! ;)

[truefan72]

just another example of thiessen's mishandling management.

So BMW have filed a request for a grid spot for 2010. It seems dear old Thiessen did not provisionally secure a grid spot for 2010 in his bungled haste to announce their exit from the sport. This of course is quite necessary for any prospective buyers out there as they wouldn't buy a tea with no guarantees of a grid spot in 2010. This kind of oversight and poor thinking was even questioned by the BBC guys yesterday, and speaks volumes for the lack of thiessens management acumen of an F1 team. quite embarrassing really.

i just wish sauber could find some investors or minority partner and buy BMW pronto. I'm sure that with him as team owner, the FIA would have litel qualms about reinstating their grid spot for 2010 and seek no further action with other hopefuls.

either way I hope to see that team on the grid next year as they are highly competitive when they get their act together. wish I had 350mil lying around

[ioan]

just another example of thiessen's mishandling management.

So BMW have filed a request for a grid spot for 2010. It seems dear old Thiessen did not provisionally secure a grid spot for 2010 in his bungled haste to announce their exit from the sport.

Theissen to the left Theissen to the right and some more rubbish from you.
FYI it wasn't Theissen who decided any of the above, it was the BMW board of directors.

Running your mouth is very easy when you have no info, eh?!

[Dave B]

just another example of thiessen's mishandling management.


FYI it wasn't Theissen who decided any of the above, it was the BMW board of directors.

Running your mouth is very easy when you have no info, eh?!
Ioan's right (for once :p ) : Theissen was as surprised as anybody about the board decision. Whatever else you may think of him, he was in no way responsible for this pullout.